Electronic To Manual Fuel Pump Swap / Jeep Cherokee XJ 2.5 TD
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- Опубліковано 27 січ 2022
- I know, another engine video, but due to the electrical problems I have has since building this engine I thought this would be a big step in the right direction. I was going to put off this fuel pump swap until next winter, but given all the advice and comments I received from others who have done the job, I thought why not.
Swapping out the electronically controlled Bosch fuel pump with a Bosch mechanical VE pump has its advantages for a setup like mine. Tunability should be much simpler and the engine no longer needs a MAF, Number 1 Injector, Crank Position Sensor, Foot Pedal Sensor, Emissions Control Unit and most of the under the bonnet ECU. Most of this stuff us expensive and not really necessary for what I'm doing with my Jeep.
Thanks for watching
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GT2871R - www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2244125360...
425 OHV Engine Manual - pdfcoffee.com/jeep25tdmotorvm...
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Jeep Spec:
1999 Jeep Cherokee XJ 2.5TD RHD.
35x12.50r15 BFG KM3's with 15x8 3.75" backspacing (-19 offset).
Lift Front - RC 4.5" Coils and N2 Shocks (3" Coil Spacer).
Front Shock Bar Pin Eliminator.
Dana 30 High Pinion with Artec Industries Lower Control Arm Mounts with modified upper mount and modified Track Bar mount.
Front RC Control Arm Drop Bracket.
Ruff Stuff Short Arm Single Himes.
RC Extended Sway Bar Links.
Dana 30 Rock Crusher Diff Cover.
Ruff Stuff One Ton OTK Steering.
6" Lift Drop Pitman Arm.
Ruff Stuff Front and Center Frame Stiffeners.
Rear DIY Frame Stiffener and Rear Frame Tie in Kit.
6" x 2" Box Rocker replacement with Tube Slider.
Modified Factory Bumper with Side Sliders.
Rear Tow Hitch Tire Carrier that bolts into Rear Frame Tie in Kit.
Modified upper Shock Crossmember for Rear Shocks
Rear Axle Chrysler 8.25 29 Spline with modified High Clearance Shock Mounts.
Rear Shocks 6.5" Trailmasters.
Rear Leaf Springs 5.5" Rubicon Express
Rear RC Shackle Relocation Bracket.
Stainless Steel Braided Brake Lines front and back.
Warrior 9500lb Winch.
Front Bumper - www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Jeep-Chero... - Авто та транспорт
Mike, please, please keep making these type of videos. They are invaluable to me and others that are rebuilding or restoring 2.5TD XJ’s. Looking forward to your upcoming video where you plan to install a new intercooler.
+1 so helpful!
@@Winningpk3 Agreed. Cheers from Australia.
You're a damn professor. I know there'll be alot of folks watching this for years to come to work on their truck.
Don't be so down on your videos. I enjoyed your bushcraft videos but I also love to see car mods. I'm not as mechanically minded as yourself but it keeps me positive and motivated to do as much of my own work as I can. A little difficult as I live in mine but I do what I can and learn a bit more each time.
love these videos without them i would have sold my 2.5td long ago. Gives me confidence that i understand what can be done and how everything works on these. please keep it up!
Many slander the engine but the jeep 2.5td is a bit of a rare beast nowadays. Well worth keeping I think. Its a solid engine if maintained. Thanks for watching!
@@WorkshoptoWilderness I probably won't own a Jeep 2.5TD because I don't need or can't afford one atm but there are some Chrysler Voyager MK1 vans with this engine for dirt cheap around here and as I need a spacious workhorse I might get one, Didn't even watch yet and don't have this engine yet but thanks for the help already I guess 😂
Good video. About PCM (power control module) under bonnet is worth to remember is also part of alternator because voltage regulator is built in it. If PCM fail or is disconnected then you loosing battery charging because alternator is "empty" with no regulator in it thats why some people upgrade alternator with build in regulator. This way you have basically unstopable engine with manual pump and self contained charging system ;)
Ah nice that's some gold info right there! Didn't know that but its something worth knowing, maybe a future upgrade! Thanks for the information and for watching.
These are some of the best videos that I watch on UA-cam, I used to own a 2.5TD XJ and to be honest your videos make me think I should have kept it. Nevertheless they are interesting and watching someone else go through the highs and lows of car maintenance is comforting especially when working on your own pushes you to breaking point 😂! I'm glad this wasn't as much of a headache for you aswell lol.
Haha there are certainly some highs and lows. Bleeding fingers and shredded overalls. It certainly keeps me busy in these dark winter months. Its actually kept me very occupied and sane over the winter which is a contrast last year when the garage wasn't insulated and basically a -20c shed.
Thanks for watching and for the comment!
Don't know much about cars, but I enjoy watching these videos.
At first I truly disliked your motorhead content. But then I watched more of it. And then I got a 4x4. You’ve got the best wrenching videos, even though they’re not applicable in any way to my Nissan Frontier. Just enjoyable to watch.
Ah nice, glad you find them enjoyable to watch. Congrats on the Nissan Frontier, nice vehicle! Maybe when I start loading mine up some crossover with onboard gear might become applicable. Thanks for watching,
Your next video should be your debut music video. With a singing voice like that you should be center stage... at the end of a pier on a distant island 😉 love your bushcraft vids but really enjoying the jeep building too! Well done sir.
Good you had old wifey to help you for 5 minutes with this one! 😂 Max was pretty helpful too, sorting all your gravel into ice cream tubs👌 Not sure you would have succeeded without our input.
I don't own a Jeep, but it's fun to watch your build videos. Looking forward to more.
Mike this was a great video! Thanks for sharing. Your commentary/talking to yourself on this one was fantastic. Trying your best but not 100% confident. Is very relatable. Many of us working on our projects are learning as we go. This is what makes you and your channel so good. Because it’s real. You show what goes right and what goes wrong. I talk to myself all the time working on mine. Then when I put it back together. Realize that I just did that wrong. I sigh. Then make a cup of tea. Start all over again while singing I love my jeep over and over again for my own moral support lol. But then I realize Hey it never came this way from the factory. So of course it’s a bit of trial an error.
Looking forward to the next video! Cheers 🍻 from Calgary 🇨🇦
Haha its comforting for me to hear that i'm not the only one who sings "everything's going to be okay" when working on their jeep! I've just been out there pep talking myself while blindly feeding a throttle cable through the fire wall. This pump swap was a real big thing for me, i cant really believe I pulled it off as it all seemed like witchcraft when I watched others do it.
Appreciate the comment and thanks for watching!
Made it to the end .. totally get it , making the engine far less dependant on electronics is good for remote travel
Oh Mike, im just rewatching all your videos as i yave purchased recently 2001 xj 2.5td and have to tell you its a big projects and what youve done with yours is a big inspiration here. Im located in Scotland and i want this to be my ultimate camper just like yours but seems i have a lot to doto get there. Thank you for your detailed videos
Ah nice, congratulations on the 2.5td! I would say your a brave man but don't listen to the negative stuff. The bottom ends are bomb proof, provided you have oil pressure of course. The original heads are a bit prone to cracking and going porous. also the studs for the lifters can snap on them. Personally I would go with AMC if you replace the heads, and a good muli-layered metal gasket. That would basically future proof the thing. Also a really good HOAT coolant helps a lot with reducing conductivity in the coolant and keeping temps down.
If you need any advice just let me know, they are certainly a project but they can be very good engines if you want them to be.
Thanks for watching and happy 2024!
@@WorkshoptoWilderness
Hey Mike, thank you for your advice and helpful reply. I do actually have a question and maybe you could point me on to something. When I got the car, it was sitting for 3 years and injectors were knocking from all crap in the tank so dropped and cleaned tank and pump, replaced all filters and did full service and replaced 3x injectors only n1 with the wire stayed and got a new battery and exhaust. When I start the engine is really rattly and its shaking the whole car but when you go above 1500rpm seems to be fine.no EML or any other issues and engine and gearbox mounts are fine. If you'd think of something it would really help
Watch them all mate even though I don't no what your going on about 😂👍 🏴
As always thanks for taking the time to put this and all the other videos together. For me personally it's like the instructions I've been waiting for. I've been pondering on this for ages myself as parts become more scares. Considering my 4.0 will do 17mpg it's a all a really worthwhile investment. Plus for me I like the tinkering.
I'd love to see each build stage so another thumbs up for the intercooler fitting.
Appreciate you watching. Hopefully it proves to be a good swap. I guess its easier to rebuild an old pump like this than the electronic one if that day ever did come. Mechanical problems over electrical ones seem to work better with me. Im terrible with electronics
I like watching the guys who do the old merc swaps too. I learned how to advance the pump from watching these.
I'm going to start collecting the parts. The scorpio manifold is proving difficult even though I have the part number.
The rest shouldn't be too much of an issue.
In the meantime I'll be putting it back together having done the egr delete. I've left room to tap in an egt sensor.
I'm using some manifold studs that can be put in with an alan key socket. This means I can slot in the turbo/downpipe, put on the exhaust manifold (that's had a some bits shaved off to allow clearance) and then Intake. Reduces a degree of faffing.
It was suffering from a leaking valve cover gasket and some leaking boost pressure that was covering everything in that lovely black oil slick...I hate that!!
Congrats again on your perseverance and innovation with this. It will help just about every 2.5td xj owner in the future when something paps out that can't be replaced....although we may be priced out by extortionate diesel prices in an attempt to get everyone using electric vehicles....electric fitting kits are slowly becoming more popular. I'll be watching you do that in a decade 🤣
I too am not great with electronics...understanding wiring diagrams is hard 🤣
Looking forward to the next installment 👍
Thank you, thank you, thank you... I don't even own Cherokee, I just admire how ur just learning as you go. Maybe in another life, u were a mechanic 🤔
Another great step completed, and another step closer to getting out on the road and goofing off! I’ll join the ranks of those who like this kind of thing. I don’t have a Cherokee or that engine, but I still enjoy the semi-Jeep specific work as well.
That's the ultimate goal, reliable goof off haha. Its been in the garage for such a long time but soon it shall emerge like a noisy butterfly! Thanks for watching.
Man, love the videos! I know it's very niche but I find this detailed content entertaining. I really wish that Jeep sold the TD Cherokees in the US. I'm constantly replacing TPS and CPS sensors on my XJ. I would swap out my tired 4 litre for that setup in a heartbeat if I could!
Start digging through your local scrapyards for any TD Chrysler Voyagers. The Intake manifold he's using here is from one. If you can find a VM TD from a Voyager and you either have or can source an NV3550 or AX15 all you'd need is a clutch and an adapter plate (From a Euro 2.5TD XJ). Not an easy feat by any means but easier than a TDI swap and certainly not impossible!
I wish they offered the TD in the US. I think it would have gotten a lot more appreciation and aftermarket support. I actually have a contact in Taiwan who has a 100 of these engines, new with manual pumps in a shipping container. He wants 680USD a piece.
I cant guarantee his legitimacy just yet but hes sent me photos of some of the engines out of the crates, close ups of serial numbers and such. It all looks legit. Not sure what shipping would be on one of these but if enough people are interested, maybe I could setup some lind of live chat with him on UA-cam and get him to show the engines. He works for a construction company.
Anyway no bother if not. If he was US based then I think it would be all systems go. Thanks for watching and appreciate he comment.
@@WorkshoptoWilderness Hey just found your channel. Awesome stuff you're doing. Did you find out anything more about these engines in Taiwan?
@@AndrewMilsom96 yeah the guy still has them but he only sells them in bulk. I think ten units minimum. He sent me loads of photos of them. They look brand new with mechanical pumps on them. Probably the MK1 engine. I can give you his contact details if your interested?
@@WorkshoptoWilderness That would be good although I don't think I'll be able to find 10 people in New Zealand who want one. Might be a few people from the Aussie community though. Also, did you end up doing a video about the performance of the mechanical pump? Pretty interested in the idea since my IP is causing me issues.
Great video mate!! Love these!. Watch em all and definitely aren't boring in the slightest!!. Keep making them! 😄. Coming along!.
Enjoying your videos Mike. Like your attitude and approach to things.
It’s a diaphragm that pushes down on a boost pin that has a ramp cut in the side. You can buy (or grind the existing) pin with a steeper profile so you get more fuel quicker and adjust how the fuelling is upped with boost.
I enjoy your videos, great work doing this!Congratulations!
Hi Mike just watched your video. Absolutely brilliant . It made me laugh and I've learned some more stuff from you . I didn't even realise the ecu was still
Partially involved I never did unplug mine while the engine was running . But as you say all gauges and sender units can be sorted with pipe fittings and wires and it wouldn't be too much of a job to put on and old alternator with a built in regulator as we used to do on our old ford's when swapping over from dynamos many decades ago . Really really happy you've got her running as you want her to .
And it sounds as though lots of others are too . Well done .😁😁👍👍👍
Thanks Jed! Appreciate the inspiration. I didn't know about the alternator with a built in regulator. Sounds like another sound low tech upgrade for the jeep. It seems to be running great although I need to fit the new intercooler and test drive it. I got the throttle peddle sorted and managed to get full throttle by making it much longer. If you do decide to revisit the job then you can find the original throttle cable hole above the wiring loom grommet. Its a pre made factory hole with some tape over it. Gives you full throttle given the peddle length. I also ground a very small amount off the back of the foot pedal shaft (only 2mm). Gives the pedal a bit more downward travel. Anyway hopefully it continues the run well! Thanks again mate, your a legend,
Amazing video! If the 425 ohv didn't sound like a tractor now it sure does 👍
Very informative video as always thanks .
Great video Mike, I'm just about to do a similar job on a 300tdi auto disco 1. So this was a nice little insight into what to expect.
And yes I'd like to see the Intercooler and throttle cable videos.
Great Work! Your idea for the coolant lines using copper piping is pretty genius! I have a different engine in my RRC and the heater lines are a pain and so long. Using pipes like you did could work a treat !
Thanks! The idea was to help cooling. I cant imagine it does a lot but every little helps I guess. Thanks for watching.
Great Job Mike!
Great video as always bud. Make sure to show us everything you do.
I have installed propane injection to cover the lack of power over 2000 rpm common on 2,5 vm works Great 5 minute fix
Sounds awesome 👌 I've not had any experience with that. Is it a kit that you can install?
no kit just 8mm nyion pipe pushed into rubber turbo pipe gas bottle on passenger seat drive normally to 2000 rpm apply full throttle turn on gas until light diesel knock turn off when speed achieved do not apply more gas than necessary cuts power cost £1.50@@WorkshoptoWilderness
Great video mate I’m planning on putting a VW TDI Engine in a Cherokee XJ beginning of next year 👍🏻 keep up the good work
Wish I could bring to you my mind xj. I am going to upgrade the engine soon 🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧 much love
Good call on not trusting the witchcraft man…love the videos, thanks for the upload..:)
Mike, don’t put yourself down. Your videos are super interesting. I have just bought a 1997 phase 2 2.5 VM and would love to do what you have done. I’m interesting in buying one of your spare no 1 injectors as the lead on mine is very past it’s best and I can’t find one here in the UK. keep up the good work! Trev.
Thanks Trev! The injector will be on its way soon enough. Appreciate you watching mate!
@@WorkshoptoWilderness Thanks Mike. Received today. Excellent packaging! Top man. Looking forward to the next video. Trev.
I know you have your tongue in cheek but there are a lot more than 3 of us left, and the channel plenty healthy :) The content might not be to everyone's taste but many people enjoy watching Lindy or Tom Scott talk about all sorts of unusual things because the vids are well made, honest and presented by a genuine likeable person, and you're in that category, even if you don't wanna be heh
Anyway, I was really curious if the ECU would spit the dummy out but looks/sounds like everything is sweet and as you say you can fiddle/tune to you heart's content going forwards. Almost makes me want to look for a 70s/80s car (if any left that haven't rusted away are at a sensible price) to play with... a decent displacement, naturally aspirated, a carb (or even twins), no ECU or injection, something to tinker with on warmer weekends. Almost!
I hope you get it all up and running soon so you can get out and enjoy it. Very much looking forward to any future vids you make on redesigning/building the boot storage system, but anything you make in the meantime will be happily watched too, just so long as you enjoy making them :)
Thanks mate, appreciate that. I guess I'm use to getting stick for the jeep content from my last experience. Glad that people like it because I enjoy it, plus its just what I'm doing anyway so it flows pretty naturally for me with little effort.
I'm pretty happy it's all running with a wire. Sounds good to be fair and I guess I will know for sure when the new intercooler is in. Maybe it's worth finding yourself a project car just for fun and nice days. It's one of the reasons I do it, mainly as its bloody cold out. Anyway thanks again mate and fingers crossed the old thing doesn't drink like a fish after this 😉
To set those pumps is pretty easy, if you realise how those pumps work: there is an piston in it orientated on this main axis where the pump drive is. By rotating synchronised with crank obviously, as shown by the gearing and timing marks, the rotating piston position depends on momentaneous "crank angle". Combine that with an disk that has humps on you create an movement (actually "the start and end of pumping an bespoke fuel volume") that is rotation and axial movement in the same. So result is - if your piston number one is TDC as reference you have to turn the pump housing to simulate the rotation of the inner piston there in the pump ..and therefore you control how far the piston in his position would n the same time be moved in axial direction. The dial just indicates now he set reference of axial movement this piston would have to do on the hump disk and transport the fuel amount until the full "pump stroke" is reached.
Hope this description makes sense for your audience..
Time to send it!!!
congratulations :) in my xj I have an alfa engine already on a mechanical pump :)
congratulations I have recently bought a Jeep cherokee with your same engine, I want to make your same changes
Thats the way to go 👍🏻 I hate electronics, and love fully mechanical reliable diesels. Only thing i rather have is a inline bosch pump, that is the best
Great video as always. Just a thought use copper line on your oil pressure gauge and it will work better than he plastic line. You can mount the gauge inside like you wanted. Enjoy all of ypur videos and thank you for sharing your knowledge.
Thats a genius idea, like a brake line. The only problem I can see is when the engine starts it will shake and bend the copper line. Perhaps I can use an actual high pressure rubber brake like connected to the engine, then copper after that much like brakes themselves.
@@WorkshoptoWilderness we've always used copper line for our oil pressure gauges and never had any problem look into it but I think it would be fantastic and you're amazing XJ
Check into copper line for oil pressure gauge
I like it! This is awesome very glad you filmed this I really enjoy your videos.
Does this just make things more reliable with the manual pump less things to fail and is it more robust? It's nice that you can reduce the spare parts you carry, I'm always trying to consolidate my spares I carry a lot of spares which can get out of hand.
One thing I've done with my cherokee is worked really hard to make it easy to take apart and put back together everything has been simplified and it's very easy to maintain and repair. I see a lot of your modifications have the same thing in mind
Yeah its basically making the system much simpler and more mechanical. You kind of replacing 3 or 4 expensive sensors with a cable and boost line. Performance is also much more tweakable now. That's definitely what I have tried to do also with regards to making it simple to take apart, maintain and put it back together. Cuts down a lot of time and keeps the moral up! Thanks for watching
Just looking around and found your channel, as a confirmed Range rover classic nut I thought the engine looked familiar it's a VM as fitted to the RRC, I put 300k on my VM and would have rebuilt it but the cost was too high so it now has a 300tdi, A mate of mine used to have a diesel Jeep but that had a Renault engine fitted, you have a good engine there good luck.
Ah nice, basically the same engine. They have a bad reputation but it's a nice one if you update a few things. Thanks for watching and appreciate the comment
Thanks Mike. I have a leaky VE mechanical pump which I'm trying to remove to get refurbed. Spent 2hrs struggling with the crank pulley taper lastnight. Now struggling with the fuel pump mounting bolts. Knuckles bleeding.ha Will try the screwdriver tip and hope for the best. I did leave the coolant system intact though, removing just the charge cooler to get impact gun access to the crank nut.
Ah mate, I feel your pain. Hopefully the screw driver can crack the nut loose and it's easier after that. It's not the most fun of jobs but fingers crossed you can get it all apart and rebuilt. Where abouts is the pump leaking from?
@@WorkshoptoWilderness Hey Mike. Finally got my VE fuel pump off. Ended up cutting down a 13mm spanner to get to that nasty lower bolt. Wondering if I could ask you another question as i'm struggling to find the answer anywhere else. My PAS pump seems to be sucking in air and frothing the fluid when cold (only). Checked & sealed all the fluid connections to the reservoir with no luck so while i'm this deep i'd like to take it out and investigate. Seems like the engine mount & AC compressor need to be removed & decoupled. Any idea how to get the PAS pump off, or have you yet tackle that particular nasty? Thanks & keep the videos coming. :)
@@deckydonnelly5299 Ah good news, glad you got the pump off! I have taken the PAS out on my spare engine. Basically you just take the pully off and then tap the pump out from the front. Its pressed into a bearing and it just seems to tap out. The housing for the pump can remain attached to the engine. Perhaps it can be removed by taking off the housing also, but this I have not tried. I can take a look on the spare engine and double check.
@@WorkshoptoWilderness Ah nice one! That's what I suspected but couldn't confirm and didn't want to commit to removing all the extra stuff to find out I was wrong. Really appreciate the reply and hopefully I'll have some success with that too. :)
G'day Mike, I'm think'n a horse and pack mule at this point, lol, only jok'in mate, the cold would probably kill 'em, lol.
Seriously, your patience, or perhaps more correctly persistence, is really paying off.
Once again, your natural ability to explain concepts and the reasons why you are doing what you do, make for very interesting viewing, especially for those of us that are no experts, but have enough mechanical, and also electrical, "exposure" to follow along.
Very pleased to hear that others are contributing what they know, to not only help your, but also fellow DIYer's projects along.
Btw; apologies in advance, you've probably answered this question a kazillion times before; but any particular reason why you went down the "Jeep track", rather than another brand ?.
Cheers Duke.
Cheers Duke. I hope I can get it ready before the summer. Time goes by so fast. After all this body and engine work I'm looking forward to making the inside a bit more comfortable.
I went with the xj because it was cheap originally. I paid 2700 pounds for it and at the time I was living in the UK working as a bushcraft instructor. It was a cheap truck to haul my stuff to work.
I started using it to go offroad and then ended up down a rabbit hole of aftermarket parts and upgrades. I'm glad I discovered it all as its been and is enjoyable for me. Especially now I live here where we have access to Wilderness.
@@WorkshoptoWilderness Thanks for the reply Mike, fair enough mate, I thought maybe it was a more deliberate choice. I do like many Jeep designs, though an army mechanic mate told me once; that there is a LOT of nuances once you get under the hood and with warranty and such; but In fairness that was some years ago and the same could be said for any brand.
Btw; I still do refer to MCQ Bushcraft from time to time. Aint much you didn't cover, and cover well.
Cheers Duke.
PS. I originally called you "Pete" apologies mate, red faced "cut and paste" error, now corrected.
I want to know how is the baby?
Hes beautiful, really happy little chap and lots of fun. Hes two on the 6th of Feb. He seems to be enjoying our dancing sessions after work before bed.
great video watching you make me angry at myself for not doing enough with my XJ in the garage :(
Loved your video, used it to fix my own pump. Do you have any idea if yo can adjust the electric fuel pump in the ECU (fuel flow rate)?
I have a mechanical pump in my '96 and still have sensor in my 1st injector (which someone moved to the 3rd cylinder...) and this ECU.
Hi.
I have a 2.5td in my army truck. I like electronic so i would prefere tune the ecu to get more power but i have the manual fuel pump on mine. I have 115hp and the loaded truck is 3740kg. 4hp22 tranny.Tough swap with the 2.8 crd high pressure engine from jeep liberty. Canada.
Noe I see how you change that Nock censer.
Thanks mike for all your videos on this model I have one with pcm immobiser problems and have tried all over the place to get it repaired I have another one but I have found no one to even reprogram to my car so I’m doing this just wondering did u have to run a separate power supply to the pump in the fuel tank?
Thanks Alf
That sounds like a difficult problem! SO the vehicle starts briefly and then shuts off because of the immobiliser? Mine starts and then I can take the key out and it keeps running... Not sure why.
There must be a way of disabling the immobiliser. The trigger for whole mechanism to shut the car off must be linked to the stop solenoid on the back of the pump. All pumps have this to stop fuel flow and kill the engine. Mayne as a test you could disconnect the stop solenoid (one wire) and just run 12v to it from the battery, then start the vehicle. Its impossible for it to stop if the pump has fuel coming in, surly?
Research it first but it might be worth a try.
Now you dont need a chip in your key! I have been stranded 1 time with my xj 2.5td when it didnt register the chip(dont know why.... maybe a bad solder or something somewhere)
I didn't realise it would help with that. That's another good thing at least.
Hi, looking at doing the same conversion on my 99 XJ, was hoping you might know the exact part number/ Identification number for the pump I need to look for , seeing how methodical and particular you are with your work I thought you would know ?? There are loads of used pumps about so wanted to be certain I've got the right one BEFORE I start to dismantle everything.
All the best and good luck with the channel ... more more more please.
Kind regards
Damian.
Hi Damian,
The pump I am using is 0460404078.
Its a pretty good conversion to do and my jeep seems to be running much better with more power and very stable exhaust gas temps. One thing to note about this mod is that the cold start (timing advance) of the pump doesn't function like before. This pump has a electronically controlled advance timing solenoid under it (the white plug). Its a cold start aid really that just opens and closes, or pushes left to right. It twists the rotor in the pump about 5 degrees so you get that higher rpm when you start the engine.
I spoke to the VM guys about this as I wasn't sure of its exact function and was worried it would limit power if it wasn't working. Basically it doesn't limit any power but it does make cold starts a bit sluggish. I just light give it a bit of fuel and rev it a tad and its fine.
I think If it put the number one injector back in it would probably function again as this pulse sensor coupled with the cps seems to trigger the cold start system. I'm not sure though, this is juts information from my own experience, vm specialists and others.
Anyway other than this its all really nice and there is a lot of room for more power if you dare.
@@WorkshoptoWilderness Well that was kind of you to write me such detailed reply, Although I'm not entirely surprised knowing how thourogh you are. So thanks again for that, much appreciated that's helped me out no end ,now I can set about getting a decent pump .
Basically I bought a ' Garage find' of sorts, that's stood since 2009 when the original engine overheated and wrecked the rear head, Don't worry I'll try and keep this brief, anyway the fella had it to bits, did a gasket job..never had the heads checked for porosity or cracks..6 weeks later it boiled up ..again . He then bought a replacement engine from a 60k car and that's as far as it got, realising he'd bitten of more than he could chew/do as it were. I bought the whole lot as a project as bodily it's fantastic, no rust anywhere, rare Indeed in the UK as I'm sure you know. Trouble is....for some reason, and I wasn't made aware until driving 100 miles to collect it , he had sold the injectors!!! Why , I can only presume to recoup a few quid on the car. SO ... now I have everything to swap out the knackered motor and fit the new unit but.... I've got no injectors! and just as you mentioned those #1 ones with the sensor wire are a fortune new , and all Jeep/Crysler breakers I've phoned tell me 'You won't get any of those anywhere " ... so that's why I'm thinking 'pump conversion ' ... phew ..did I say I'd keep it brief 🤣🤣
hi there, witch standard injector did you put in? great video btw going to do it on mine
Just a spare I had off of the spare engine. Its like the other injectors without the wire
Thanks for your advice re injector no. 1 but can you tell me where the MAF sensor is? Thanks
The Maf is ontop of the pipe that comes out of the airbox. You may have a newer jeep with a MAP ontop of the intake manifold though
Thanks sir how to
Hey Mike. How's it.
Quite the inspiring video. Have watched it multiple times and taking notes. I am sick of my jeep going into limp mode and intend on doing this swap also.
Q1 does installing the manual pump remove the factory immobiliser?
Q2 what were the other models of vehicle these style of pumps can be found in?
I remember one being Chrysler Voyager
Cheers
Tom
Glad you found the video useful and cool to hear your considering a pump swap. Swapping in this pump bypasses the immobiliser. The engine ecu no longer has any control over the engine. The MAF sensor is removed and the crank position sensor has nothing to communicate too.
You can get the pump from the chrysler voyager, jeep ZJ 2.5td and Ford Scorpio. Its worth the work, much more power especially if you tune the pump and turbo.
Thanks Mike. Definitely sizing this job up. How did you get on with the stop switch? Can it be hooked up to the ignition switch or have you wired up a separate switch?
Cheers
@@tomcat1557 I wired that to the original wire for the original pump. It's the same function so it works with the ignition.
Hello, i am about to do this swap on my jeep as well as it has recently started holding back on power now and then and i can not figure out why. Anyway, in one video i think you mentioned that the rocker arm axle holder may come loose. I suspect that the strut which the oil dipstick tube is stuck on, can transfer vibrations from the generator bracket to the cyl 3 rocker mecanism and loosen it over time. So i have removed mine. Also, do you know if the popping sound come from the vaacum pump? Thanks for your videos!
Hey, I think you will be happy with the swap. Its taken me about a year of testing and running the setup to figure out exactly how I want my pump timing to be and boost control, but its running nice these days. When I initially set mine in this video the pump timing was too retarded so it had no power top end. I advanced it six months later, it dropped egt's by 200c but then I had no bottom end boost. I have dialed it back a bit now and its got some low end grunt and holds power up top under load.
The clicking from the vacuum is probabaly an indication of its failure I would think? Perhaps its okay but I would assume they don't click normally? I don't have the model with the vacuum on the generator.
That's a good move taking off the bar from the generator to the rocker axle housing.
Hey:)
My Jeep Cherokee xj diesel 2.5TD
ignition is turning on,
Could you please explain about fuse box next to battery if it's something to do with that?
Love from Berlin 👍😊
Do you mean your ignition isn't turning on? It could be something in the fuse box, the box has names on the lid of what the fuses cut. There is one for ignition from memory
@@WorkshoptoWilderness yes, i switched the relay but not working
I had same issue 2 months ago i switched the relay then turned on.
Should I change completely new relays?
Hi Mike, in this video I can ear the honk honk sound of a valve not working correctly, maybe an hydraulic tappet failure.
What do you think about?
This pump swap was about 2 years ago. Seems to be running great. I can't hear anything unusual day to day.
These types of videos give me motivation to get out and work on my vehicles, maybe take on something a bit more difficult, push my skill set out of my comfort zone.
On the nosy side of things, and feel free to ignore if it isn't something you want to offer, but you mention going to work occasionally. What are you doing for employment? Are you learning Swedish, or can you get by in English?
(the Japanese have a joke: If you call someone that speaks two languages 'bilingual', and you call someone that speaks three languages 'trilingual', what do you call someone that only speaks one language?
An American... :) Although I find Spanish speakers tend to avoid learning English )
That's good to hear, appreciate the comment and glad you like them. I have three jobs really. I live in a small town and work isnt easy to find so I started a business and I work for myself as a contractor doing a range of work. I'm currently working in a garage doing a full restoration on an old W108 Merc. I've been on it for two years and its hopefully finished in May. I also work as a graphic designer for two companies, one here in town and another in the UK. It pays okay although I get wacked on Tax. Another source of income is through UA-cam. It doesn't pay a lot but its enough to not ignore it, plus it helps fund the channel.
My wife works in the local school as an assistant teacher. Her Swedish is very good, mine is okay but it could be better. Working alone doesn't help progress my language well but after the Merc is finished I will go back to SFE and complete course D.
Most English people do not speak many languages either! haha.
@@WorkshoptoWilderness Thank you for the reply. I wish you, the Mrs, and Max, much success! From what I can see, you've earned it!
Ist it possible to adjust the dieselpump and turbo to make a little bit more power?
Not much more than I already have but then I'm a year on from this video. The pump is advanced as much as it could be without issue, it has a new fuel pin and about 21psi.
I also rebuilt the injectors for more power and regrared the diffs to 4.88. I'm pretty sure it's making over 150 hp and more but I have no dyno to check for real.
Can you do a fuel economy update with mechanical vs e pump?
Yeah absolutely. I intend to. I film the installation of the intercooler and piping next and then its driving time
If you swap the electric bosch pump with another electric one would you have to worry about timing issues cause if the injectors are electric shouldn't the ecu time it itself or am I wrong?
I could put the number one pulse sensor in and the mechanical pump would be timed automatically by the ecu because it has an advanced timing plunger. But I want the engine manually timed and slightly advanced for higher HP and better fuel economy.
Hi Mike, I'm working on my pump conversion and what have you done with the adjusting potentiometer on top of the pump? Do you use this and what have you done with those 3 wires? Thanks already.
I took the potentiometer off the pump and never used it. The wires that plugged into it don't get used. My advice one year later from doing this mod is to leave the advanced plunger (cold start) at the bottom unplugged.
If you plug it in it will constantly be engaged and it will not be stable. Its best to adjust the timing manually by rotating the pump with the engine at idle after installation.
@@WorkshoptoWilderness Thank you for the advise. I will only install the shut down wire. I will rotate the pump to 0.55 as in the manual, and see what will happen. Your video give me some good inspiration to bring back my cherokee alive :) Thanks for this!
@@onerijpkema That sounds like a good plan,
See how it runs after adjusted to 0.55 and it it knocks you can loosen the three nuts and turn it towards the engine until it sounds good. I'm sure you know this anyway, but it made a huge difference on mine. Hope it goes well and thanks for watching.
But sir full frist remove basis batter which frist remove
Strangely enough, my 1995 Cherokee has a manual pump, but a wired injector 1?
You can take that number 1 off and it will run fine. It talks to the cps and they engage advanced timing on the pump. you will notice an increase in rpm on startup when the car is in normal operation, if you pull that injector you loose that basically. Its not too much of a big deal as you can adjust the timing on the pump manually by twisting it but i've run mine for a long time now with no injector 1, cps, half an ecu and no MAF and its so much nicer to run.
You can take out the boost plunger in the pump and file it to allow for more fuel response from turbo boost and build up power much faster.
The only real issue after this is too much boost at too lower rpm = bent push rods. Or high egts at highway speeds in 5th climbing hills with a fully loaded jeep on hot days will push egts up above 600c which is not good. So you kind of need an egt gauge and boost gauge to tell you when to change down to 4th to drop the temps. It can keep making lots of power but the pistons will die i think.
I have same engine in my Jeep. How come yours doesn't splatter oil everywhere running without rocker cover on? Mine makes a right mess as soon as the oil pressure comes up . Does this mean my valve stem seals are gone?
I does spray oil, just not everywhere. I'm not sure if your valve stem seals are gone. Normally you would see a blue grey smoke from the exhaust if they were dead.
Can you give me the correct reference for the mechanical fuel pump ...and belongs to what car ?
hello from portugal
The pump I'm using is from a Jeep cherokee. It's better that you use one from a Chrysler Voyager. The pump number you will have to do some research on Google for.
where it is possible on the web you can find the manual pump ... the links are no longer valid
Its not that easy to find. You need to look on ebay and also online part breakers that list parts www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Fuel-Injection-Pump-0460404078-Jeep-Cherokee-2-5-Tdi-85kw-Reman-Pump-/363370879915?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&_trksid=p2349624.m46890.l6249&mkrid=710-127635-2958-0
Hi Mike, I watched the video of you switching out all the annoying sensors, vm is currently in limp mode and nothing really is changing anything!!! So I’d like to do what you have done, makes sense to me, would you mind telling me what pump it is and if possible where you got it from, 🙏🙏 I love the videos! They seem so calm when you’re out camping, it must be a lot of fun 👍🏼
www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Fuel-Injection-Pump-0460404078-Jeep-Cherokee-2-5-Tdi-85kw-Reman-Pump-/363370879915?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&_trksid=p2349624.m46890.l6249&mkrid=710-127635-2958-0 - this is the pump you want. They are getting hard to find complete. Rebuild kits are easy to find though. Once you swap this in its just the simple task of fitting a bar to the foot pedal and having a wire from it to this pump. You can tune the pump also for added fuel and more hp at lower rmps. Its a good way to go if you intend on keeping the old thing running.
@@WorkshoptoWilderness wow, thanks Mike !! The jeep literally is giving me sleepless nights! I just cannot bare it when something is not complete!
A bit ocd I guess, great for my customers though as a builder 😂 keep doing the videos though, I absolutely love your attention to detail, I tell my customers “it’s all about the details!!” Thanks again 👍🏼👍🏼
@@chrispascoewhite ah nice that's good for your customers then 🙂. Totally all about the details, I agree. Thanks for watching and hope the jeep reaches a sound night level soon
Mike I’m sorry to keep bothering you! My mechanic wants to know if the tapered pulley on the new pump is compatible with the pump that is existing on the Jeep , Mine is a 1997 2.5 Td vm diesel, he has never done one of these before and just wants to be sure that I buy the correct pump and, thank you so much for your help so far on this! I am hoping when this is done I can just play around with the fun mods
Hi Mike, just a quick one, I’m sure you’re super busy! I’m just struggling to find the gasket for the for the timing cover, I’ve had messages suggesting that mine doesn’t have a gasket but special silicone gasket?
My vin no. Is 1J4FJN8M1WL119110
Registration R379VLU
So sorry to ask
Hope all is well
Hi, can you tell me what key you use to remove injector. Thanke you!
I used a 28mm injector socket. You can use a standard 28mm socket but if you're removing the number 1 injector that has a cable then you will need an proper 28mm injector socket with the cutout in the side
@@WorkshoptoWilderness Thanke you!!!
Sorry, I feel like I'm pestering you now😬 I saw on your video that you have a couple of sensors? If mine has gone , can I purchase one from you?
I dont have any more for sale now. Sorry but they got snapped up a while ago.
Hi Mike, is there any way of bypassing the engine crank position sensor without doing all those changes? Simply just wanted to fix it without that expense. Regards
Probably not without some flashing of the pcm. My knowledge of flashing ecu's isn't brilliant. I have seen comments of others doing it, so I can be done
@@WorkshoptoWilderness thanks I will search for those comments. Regards
I will try and find them for you but they didn't really give any information of how they did it.
Mike I watched your video again and you mentioned with the actual setup the crank position sensor doesn’t cut the engine from working so you didn’t do anything with regards to the crank position sensor? If you remove it and disconnect it will have simply engine check light? What is the relation of the crank position sensor with the previous diesel pump? Trying to understand how all it works to round it. Regards
Originally if you disconnect the cps the engine won't start or has trouble starting from memory. Basically from my understanding its another falt detection sensor like the number one injector. They Basically detect engine timing and if one of them fails or they detect a pulse out of sink with each other they put the engine into a limp mode.
I dont understand the exact mechanism for limp mode but its somthing in the electronic fuel pump that cuts fuel to stop you destroying the engine.
Its basically like a management system with fault detection.
Some say that they can adjust engine timing, but personally I can't see how anything on that engine can override teeth on a spur gear. I mean sure they can probably cut fuel in the pump and limit certain things, but its all mechanical at heart and the electronic pump is still mechanical in its function.
In my case I left the cps connected but my ecu thinks my engine isn't running when it is because of the removal of the pump, number one injector and Maf.
this pump is from 1995 xj. not fully mechanical. pcm retards injection using timing solenoid, thus making the smoother run. 0.55mm injection may be too soon (i.e. maximum advance). The engine tends to rattle - same if you disconnect the connector. 0.55 is for cold start, for regular regime you need less, otherwise engine will rattle like hell.
The pump isn't totally mechanical, I know this, although I'm running it without the timing injector. It's set to a little lower than 0.55 at the moment and I've been using it for about six months since the pump installation.
The jeep has to work pretty hard as it's about 2.3 tons fully loaded with larger tires so it's been a good test to see how it's performing.
The engine runs very smoothly with no rattling, it pulls with a lot of power and exhaust gas temperatures seem very stable most of the time. Up hill on hit days with heavy loads can reach around 620c but I always back off long before then. It doesn't start particularly well sometimes though. I mean it starts every time but it's a bit sluggish almost like it's a cold day when it's not. I thought it might be a bad injector but I'm yet to check this.
I'm no expert so I really don't know the full implications of what I've done but I will probably put the number 1 injector back in and see if the advance timing works and see if thier is a difference. Thanks for the comment
@@WorkshoptoWilderness a little bit less than .55 was not enough in my case, I am surprised yours run smoothly. I had to skip one tooth to get to .40 and the engine does not run neither smooth nor strong, but at last does not rattle to death. The pump does not have cold start actuator, so at this advance it is pain in the ass to start when cold. I have no idea why you want yo use 1st injector sensor if there is no ecu. You need pump with cold start actuator. I.e. some mean to push timing piston to the right when starting the engine
To be honest it's running so well I will probably leave it alone. I don't really want to use the timing injector but was curious if it would cause any noticeable changes. I've bought four new injector nozzles so I will fit those and leave it alone.
It sounds like you have got yours running decent. I guess these things are all slightly different in some way and you have a different pump by the sounds of it. Maybe some Micron Molly would help. I use it in my engine, transmission and differentials and it just quietens down everything.
Can you do a demo on how to remove the no. 1 injector please
It will be a massive help, can't really see anything on line
Keep up the great work 👍
I dont have injector number 1 on my jeep anymore. I deleted it with a different fuel pump because its problematic. I can make a quick video for you though on removing it and testing it.
@@WorkshoptoWilderness really! Thanks,that will be amazing, look forward to that !!, There's so many things I want to do to it , could do with retirement, thanks again 👍
How do i get a mk1 pump for my 98 jeep cant find any
Ebay or car part online stores like Bparts and Euro parts. I think they are out there but just getting harder to find.
www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Fuel-Injection-Pump-0460404078-Jeep-Cherokee-2-5-Tdi-85kw-Reman-Pump-/363370879915?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&_trksid=p2349624.m46890.l6249&mkrid=710-127635-2958-0
@@WorkshoptoWilderness thanks mate love ur work and thanks for sharing with us ...LEGEND!!!
I want to see all you do with it, if you need photos of the factory accelerator pedal and throttle cable etc. let me know and I will email you.
Some photos would be fantastic. My email is info@mcqbushcraft.co.uk. Ive actually plumbed in the cable through an existing hole above the wiring loom in the firewall. It looks like its actually for the cable from the previous setup?