Wheel Of Time's Biggest Hurdle!
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- Опубліковано 19 вер 2024
- My thoughts on the wheel of time show's biggest challenge!
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Imagine a PG-13 version of Dumai's Wells... -_-
Please no, I would rather not
How do you censor the literal shredding of human beings while still keeping the adrenaline rush of the whole battle u cant so nope
@@wilson1728 Easy, have them vanish into puffs of magic. One could wail that that would ruin the tone/message/ect. but that can be done and very well might be done depending on the targeted demographics.
This, is literally the battle I'm the most excited to see, I'm mean, it's a carnage, it's messy and bloody, I hope they'll do it justice.
I wanna see the HUMAN GRINDER
Didn't realize how dark it could be until I was listening to audio books with my kids in the car.
Yeah, when I have kids I'll introduce the books when there about 12 or 13. Lots of darkness.
@@nicktauro1839 I hate to do this but... *when
The 2nd book gets more noticeably dark and gruesome
@@nicktauro1839 honestly I read them that young, but I don’t feel like someone should. Jordan does some really cool things with points of view but they were lost on me. Character flaws were lost on me. What’s an unreliable narrator?/s I even emulated a few cause they were the good guys and why should I examine things anymore closely? The books need you to have perspective that I just don’t think most kids will have.
Additionally all the sexual things are kinda not something I’d be comfy handing to a 13 year old. Those can get pretty dark.
Yeah this is not YA at all. I think best to be at least 12 to read this. Some may say higher but I and my friends were fine with Rated R content at that age and began reading adult books. Some parents may say 13, 14, 16... super conservative parents... 30. Lol
Honestly impressing Daniel and the Goblin Clan will be their biggest hurdle.
i read that as 'daniel green and the goblin clan will be their biggest hurdle' and was like: '???? dont know how we're gonna do that, but good for us, i guess?' LMAO
"Do you want to hold a knife or sword in the intro?"
Daniel: yes
Sword and dagger is a genuine historical way of duelling.
people calling WoT "almost YA" straight up forgetting about dumai's wells
i mean what about lanfear skinning a person while keeping him alive to feel the pain? WOT is dark as hell
And the town that turns into murderous zombies every night, killing their loved ones and friends, and cant remember it in the morning. Like damn, that was horrifying.
tbf, I don't think young adults would have trouble reading such things, even tho they're not commonly in YA books. Like cmon, I read WoT when I was 12, and so has many other people.
Or the mass enslavement and dehumanization of female channelers on Seanchan. Or Rand slowly becoming harsher and crueler as both the madness and the weight of responsibility take their toll on him. Or a bunch of other things
WoT might not be a grimdark low fantasy like GoT, but its more than capable of having very dark scenes and storylines
@@aliciamae14 Hinderstamp, the town where the Dark has already won and broke them from the wheel to endlessly torture.
Biggest hurdle for the WoT show? Impressing Daniel Greene.
Nah, Daniel is relatively easy to please (he was relatively ok with The Witcher which was a terrible show), no the bigger hurdle will be pleasing Quinn’s ideas who is also a fan of the Wheel of Time.
Comparisons to GoT. That will be the one big thing that everyone will compare it to, and it will only work against it. If WoT manages to overcome that, then holy fucking hell strap in cause we're going on a ride.
Exactly
Season 8 was bad enough that GOT won't be the hurdle it used to be.
@@robertblume2951 but could also be the reason people don’t bother with another fantasy series. Stupid but true
@@AwakeArise sure but those people would pass if wheel of time was better than GOT. So it's not really a comparison. The same thing could be said for all the terrible fantasy tv shows like sword of truth. They turned off a portion of the audience as well.
The last seasons have destroyed the potential of GoT to become legendary. I don't know anyone who has rewatched or is eager to rewatch the series again.
The book series is extremely dark. Jordan is just so excellent at leaving the details to our imagination, that it can seem very light. Make no mistake, this book series is a horror
Yeah it really is. It's far darker in concept and content than Game of Thrones which mostly just boils down to people being cunts to each other. It's just not in writing style. But there is some horrifying stuff going on constantly.
The scene in Fal Dara where they walk into the dungeon... with the writing on the walls and the gibbering mess of humanity left in the cells... that is going to be one hell of a scene and, in my opinion, needs to be DARK to really portray it
And the bubbles of evil! Holy crap there's so much horror potential
I would make that scene the season finale ending scene if they're blurring the line between season 1 and 2 like it seems like they are.
@@PsyrenXYSpoliers:
The entire Tearian neighborhood that freezes and turns to dust...
Just everything with Fain
That sounds familiar but I’ve only read first 5 and haven’t for a while
As dark scenes go, just imagine actually watching Rand trying to resurrect the small girl with the OP, trying to make the blood flow in her veins and so on... thats pretty disturbing, not the mention the scene where Rand seemingly at random cuts the heads of people and uses the OP to make them kneel headless in front of him...
No shit.... It's VERY easy to "consciously" filter WoT.... But DG nails it in his analysis (not description, let's actually utilize our vocabulary, shall we?
Oh my gosh yes!
@@briancohen-doherty4392 you dropped this; )
@@briancohen-doherty4392 who shat in your cereal this morning?
@@briancohen-doherty4392 Im not sure if theres a language barrier issue going on here, but did i say something upsetting by mistake? you seem angry at me.
The biggest hurdle is us staying sane after the show drops
COMIC CON PANEL LATER TODAY AAAAAAAAH
@@milospollonia1121 Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhh
I’ve thought the exact same thing. At first I was thinking that this would feel very G-rated compared to say GoT. And then I really thought about it and was like “no, actually if they show everything this story really is it will be at least close to as R-rated as GoT.”
I feel like GOT really put most of the dark stuff from books in the show even a lot of sex stuff that's not in the books but left out some of the violence. WOT however doesn't go into great detail on that stuff although it is summarized that it's taking place. Honestly I hope they are able to balance it in when the story needs it to stay interesting to the people who didn't read the books.
@@JJ-nu8qi I agree. It’s interesting to me when I really think about some stuff from the books. I’m actually only 6 books in, but even simple things like the co-Ed Aiel sweat showers, right? Not that it is super sexual (or at all sexual as the Aiel see it), but we see it through the lens of Egwene and Rand mostly and they view it in a very teenager sort of way where they are more embarrassed than anything else where the idea makes them blush. But those same scenes shown on screen would come across more like the scenes in GoT when Dany is being bathed by people. While not super sexual, they definitely have a very “adult” feel to them. One could argue that there shouldn’t be anything sexual about those things, but in American culture at least they certainly feel that way. Yet when Jordan does it they don’t feel that way. I don’t know, I may not be making much sense.
Only cause the author stuffed it with his own sexual fantasies either directly or indirectly.
I mean sure 3 characters all fall in love with the big Mary Sue and they all want to marry him and are happy with the others as well.
@@IzroneI Definitely a lot of parts in the book will probably be looked at as more sexual when you see them. When I read these books it's always in my mind that his wife was one of the editors and sometimes I feel like she influenced the way he explains and writes about certain topics. I could be way off but I just get that feeling as well as it being from an uptight farm teen kinda of way of thinking depending on who he's narrating from.
NC 17
I've only read the first three books so far but regarding stuff that's dark, what happened to Egwene in The Great Hunt with the Seanchan really hit me in the heart and made me FURIOUS.
First and only time I threw a book
yeah that hit hard for me too.
Agreed, some of the hardest scenes to read I’ve come across in a while.
The abject despondency that Egwene begins to sink into over the course of the Great Hunt hit different. I'm pretty sure it's what drove my utter loathing for even the concept of slavery.
Spoiler
Exactly. That's why I stopped reading 4th book with just reading first 3 chapters or so. (Seachan's showed up again, and I was like 'yeah cool story but not for me, not now at least' )
The Biggest Hurtle for Wheel of Time is not getting dismissed as a Lord of the Rings & Game of Thrones ripoff in the first two seasons. Mount any argument you'd like for why that's not true, but given what fantasy properties are the biggest ones in the minds of the television viewing public, and it's hard to say honestly that's not going to be the first impression of non-book readers.
I'm really looking forward to arguing online with dolts who don't realize Eye of the World came out WAY before A Game of Thrones!
@@PsyrenXY well, don't think the dolts would think it is similar to GoT. But for sure Eye of the World feels like LoTR ripoff if you don't know why it was like that. I hope they somehow alleviate this problem in the show so it wouldn't die at its first season like some kind Shannara thing
@@PsyrenXY yeah but no one will think it's a rip off of GoT cause it has zero of the complexity or nuance or just interesting stuff in that show.
They will think it's the tedious LotR rip off it actually is.
But the first Book IS a by purpose lotr ripoff/hommage
@@mytimetravellingdog It's not* a ripoff, as Yeah Bae says, it's a homage & something that grew into something unique & equal to LotR.
As for GoT, that didn't have nuance, it had a some twists & that's about it.
*ETA
The biggest hurdle is going to be the battle of the sexes, imo. It's a theme front and center through the entire series, and I don't think modern audiences are going to care for it. And it's difficult to remove because it's the driving factor behind half of what the characters do in the book.
The videos with a fighting tool in hands jumping around in front of a green screen have such a chaotic energy. I love it
The series starts with a man going mad and killing his entire family for gods sake. The books are dark af and needs to be shown as such in my opinion
Also they need Robert Jordan's hat on Barney Harris aka Matrim Cauthon... for promotional stuff. They can use replicas for the scenes, of course.
I'm almost always most worried about post production. Depending on how good or bad it's done, it can completely pull you out of what you're watching.
I'm about to start the sixth book and from everything so far these books need the darker elements for the story. I don't think it will come across as fully if the horror is ignored. I've been needing to take short breaks for digesting the story every once in a while, but to me that just made everything so much more compelling and fascinating... I hope they go with your approach 🙏
Do the books get better after the first? I'm 90% done book one and it seems to be a little slow for me
@@russgionette7884 Personally I think it really reaches something special around books 4-6, slows down a bit afterwards but really picks up in the last 4 or so. Book 1 always felt a bit LOTR-y to me compared to the rest
@@russgionette7884 yes
@@russgionette7884 I am personally not a huge fan of the first book, but the second one is one of my favorites in the series.
@@russgionette7884 the second book kicks off Big time
one of the best videos i've seen so far regarding the show.
The Aes Sedai nightmare scene is hilarious and will not be made less so with graphic cookpots.
I am not rememberig that scene. When was that?
@@rettthebest I think he’s referring to when some of the rebel Aes Sedai go into Tel’aran’rhiod for the first time and of course are unable to properly control it, and get pulled into a nightmare where they’re being tortured by Trollocs.
@@brandenmerritt1 Yeah, that's a pretty important section. It sets up how horrifying Nightmares are and how much you do NOT want to get sucked into one.
Then we see Perrin going "IN WE GO MOTHA FUCKAS!"
It's that reference that makes what he's doing so impressive.
Yeah, the Aes Sedai refuse to be out done by a bunch of sandy old Wise Ones in strong womaning so they go to the tower in tel'aran'rhiod without supervision and get swept up in a wandering nightmare. It makes Perrin and Egwyne (maybe Nynaeve and Elayne too? ICR) look better by their variably successful mastery of the dream.
It also pays off the established threat of the dream, which would otherwise be a bit of a Chekhov's squib. Is that a saying?
And it's a major turning point for the political relationship between the Tower and the Aiel.
Dude you’re freaking right, I forget sometimes but this could easily be more dark then GOT! Rand in a box, Seanchan "Training" new pets..., Trollocs eating people, Trollocs being killed/ terrified of Padan Fain, making Myrddraal swords, all the sex, the sweat tent conversations, the sword fights are practically glossed over... Rand being seduced multiple times, the naked punishments with the Aiel. The spankings of trainees in the white tower...
I hope so
"Making Myrddraal Swords"
You really had to remind me of this, DIND'T YOU??? Argh :D
"making Myrrdraal swords" .. What is this referring to?
@@lsdeann_3293 there’s a scene of a line of humans outside a Trolloc forge and every once and awhile a sword is completed they quench the new blade by shoving the hot blade into a human. Basically each weapon requires a human sacrifice to make them.
Remember when Fain crucified a Fade...
Robert Jordan writes light hearted fights.
Asha'man rolling hill of Earth and Fire
Asha'man, kill!
You know Tam fighting Trollocs while Rand hides. That scene in the first episode itself will set the dark tone clearly. Plus the ravens and myrdraal haunting esmond field villagers before the attack night will itself shine subtle darkness.
Then the Whitecloak scene with Perrin and Egwene. Idk how they're going to do it though if Moiraine is the main POV.
The Ways and Machin Shin (The Black wind) is going to be interesting. I've always wanted see what that would look like on a screen
It took me 3 re-reads to catch that when the Aes Sedai say pillow friends they mean a lesbian couple essentially. I was a teenager when I first read it and just never noticed until now.
I'm not gonna read the books because I want to review the show was a new viewer and criticize it based on it's own merits, which I don't think that I'd be able to do if I read the books.
You gotta read the books though because they are SO good. Maybe after the show. 🤔
Definitely give them a read. Have read all of them at least 3 times, love love love the stories, and characters and, world. Just wonderful.
That's a great idea! I'll be curious to see reactions of all the folks just watching the show without having read the books, and there will be millions of them. I'm looking forward to seeing what my sister thinks of the show.
I have had these thoughts. I'm reading book 5 right now, and I just thought the other day, "People are naked a lot."
Gots to love the Aiel
Especially women
Think about how obsessed Rand gets with all the Maidens who’ve died for him. And then how his PTSD gets mixed with his insanity. Stuff’s gonna be wild.
Think about when rand animates that little girls corpse in desparation with calandor, that's so damn dark
Less than 4 hour until the comic con panel. Let's hope for a trailer.
Edit: A new poster with Nov 2021 release date . No trailer unfortunately.
Will They Though? I Really Hope So!
Dont get your hopes up! Its still a long before till november!
Is it happening?
They released a new poster along with a Novemember 2021 release date. No trailer unfortunately.
Considering we were like 95% sure it would be released in either November or December, this basically just cuts that in half. An actual date would be nice! Lol.
I would bet later November though... between 15th and 30th. We shall see.
I never realized how utterly amoral Game of Thrones was until I saw it on the screen. It made it even more real, IMO. I really hope that they do not shirk away from some of the less scrupulous and graphic part of this series. They are so important to convey. Sheinar, Aiel, visits to Thakandar, the Seanchan, bring it on, please.
In regards to the age rating of the show, Rafe as said "I want it feel simultaneously *adult* but accessible to all"
1:53 nice of Robert Jordan to drop by and lend his writing skills. Bit odd he only had time to do one episode though
Just dropping here a huge THANK YOU for informing me of this series. Your channel jumped at me a few days ago and through your videos I finally decided to buy e-book The Eye of the World today and damn it is good. I read 1/6 of it like nothing (time flies when you are reading something good).
I hope the Amazon series will be good, but I prefer to think that it will be bad and then either pleasantly surprised or not surprised at all.
Haha how was that Daniel? George Martin: LOOK AT IT! 🤣
I just finished reading the series for the first time and that scene with the cutting off hands and feet shook me. Especially the impact it had on the other good guys in the room of just "Oh, he's actually f@#$ing terrifying if he gets mad."
Yes that scene was so against everything I believed of this character. It was so very much OUT of character, it was horrifying
I just want the sadness conveyed. So many scenes in wot hit me really hard. I cried with Elder Haman for all of the lost cities. Rand's first trip through Rhuidean? Oof
Aviendha's future visions...
I think the most horrific scene i remember from the books WITH a horrific tone, is the creation of Mydraal amd their blades- it terrified me what the hell is happening there.
No. No no nonooooooooo!
@@Anthony_Cika ?
@@merai4024 the dialogue of a prisoner being held by the force creatures at shayol gul in the extended prologue of The Lord of Chaos.
@@Anthony_Cika sorry i cant really remember, didnt read the series in years and im still on the great hunt in my rer3ad
That didn't really get to me too much. At that point, we'd already seen so much that I kind of got numb to the horror elements. I mean, Padan Fain crucified a Myrdraal. That's f@#$ing terrifying. Compared to that, quenching a sword in a still-living human feels a little mundane where in any other series it would be horrifying.
Towards the end of the series Rand became one of the most terrifying characters and I hope they really nail that aspect
Zen Rand was cool and chill tho. Darth Rand was something else though.
@@christiansouthwick4712 absolutely. Post-dragonmount clarity was where it's at
@@cloudbloom yessir. the apple tree scene is SO GOOD omfg
@@christiansouthwick4712 Apples First!!
I think Stranger Things is a good comparison, where the themes are relatively light, but there is blood and oh-so-much gore. Literally piles of blood and guts.
I just finished Book: 4, and without getting into spoilers, did we all forget the fact that Trollocs were chopping up people and stewing human body parts in pots? Yeah “kid friendly” 😂
You can imply that quite easily without showing it. That's not a big hurdle
I can tell you something that won't be a spoiler: "MEN! WE HATE MEN!"
Btw that is also the same.
I just really don’t want a ton of nudity everywhere, I’m okay with most other things
I hear ya but book 2 Seanchan it’s there, Aiel it’s all over the place, and that’s before any conversation about romantic interests playing out.
Early early in the series there's not very much. In the first book there's really only REFERENCES to some baths, but we don't really see that.
In book TWO though there's an extensive scene where one of the lead female characters is ENTIRELY naked for an extended period of time. She's up and about DOING STUFF as well, not just sitting down or anything easy to edit around.
As the series goes on, especially in certain sections, there's pretty casual nudity all over the place. I wouldn't say it's a TON exactly, but there's a fair amount depending on where the story is at the time. All the nudity has a point to it though, it's not there just as pointless fan service, like a character opening the wrong door and "oops, naked lady".
@@haku8135 to be fair there is one scene that basically does do that in book two if I remember correctly.
In some cultures, nudity isn't as big of a thing, or at least not viewed at the same way. I think Jordan did a great job with that too. The Two Rivers folk were far more reserved than anyone else outside their area with basic nudity. Public bathhouses were and are a real thing, nude ritual magic is a real thing, sex is a real thing. I hope we see plenty of nudity as is in the books and normalize it. I'm not talking pornography, but we shouldn't be so uptight about naked bodies.
Most of the nudity in the book was pretty pointless. If the folks at Amazon don't want nudity, they can tell the exact same story with clothes on and it wouldn't be any different.
I'm especially excited because I'm reading the series for the first time now. My goal is to reach at least 5 books before the show releases. On book 2 right now.
Rand and Mat on the road to Caemlyn is consistently nerve wracking. That's one of the things I'm looking forward to seeing.
SPOILERS
It is really important, especially to Mat’s character development. I’m afraid they will cut too much of it-that we won’t see the paranoia and suspicion overtake him gradually, or the effect he has on others as he moves down the road with the dagger (both a parallel and foreshadowing to ta’veren effecting the world), and we won’t see him still fight to take care of Rand, even though he also isn’t in the best of shape because friendship. Hopefully, they give the sequence its due.
The goblin's rage slowly began to turn him into Tau. He never noticed the process, but it happened nontheless. When the metamorphosis was complete, his dual blade-microphone wielding skills were on par with those of blackpenredpen.
You never cease to blow my mind with these videos
I would personally love it if the showrunners leaned into the horror elements more, insofar as framing it as one would frame any good horror movie that isn't wholly explicit on gore, but because of that hits all the harder when a moment of gore pops up. With books it's all well and good to let the reader fill in the gaps with their own horrified imagination, but when it comes to visual media, you have to give the audience something otherwise they'll just be left confused and or wondering what the big deal is. I think if they strike a good balance between "the horror of what you don't see" punctuated with "the horror of what you do see", I think it can work. Like with the myrddraal, not even something that has to be gory to be scary, it'll be enough if they frame it so their suddenly showing up out of the shadows is something so creepy and unsettling it just twists your insides into knots.
They'd better do Dumai's Wells justice or I will be very salty.
Cut the all braid tugging and you'll probably down to three series.
Lmao😂
Don’t forget the smothering of skirts
Thank you (seriously) for putting something in my head that I never thought of. I’ve been reading these books since their original release and the “fade to black” or not forcing you to really see the darkness has just been there. I think I need to reread them all but stare at and really think about the dark. This may be a great adventure.
And then for all the comparisons The Eye of the World gets for being a Tolkien knock-off, it actually reads more like a frantic horror story most of the time. With all the nightmare sequences and creatures being thrown at you.
I want to see both. Rand cutting of heads and limbs, and then going into a full ballet rehearsal.
I actually care initially how they look, but yes, they will actually take over how we picture them. Also, because wheel of time is a fantasy book with a huge ass fanbase, the actors will be pressured to give their best and I am confident they will be good.
After 4eading the books and listening to the books over many times. I agree you Daniel..
3:49 made me cackle. So true, thats exactly what Martin does.
I showed the picture of all the Trollocs and the Myrddraal to my little brother, and he said "the most horrific one is that one" and pointed at Daniel.
I don't have a super visual mind so I care way more that actors portray the essence of the character well rather than looking like I might have pictured them.
Nailed it. I was thinking the same thing. Striking the Wheel of Time tone is going to be hard with the state of the content. I don't want Wheel of Time to feel like Game of Thrones, but I also don't want the story to be censored. It's tricky.
Somehow I'm worried about how cities will look. The Ogier architecture might be really hard to show. Also the differences in how the each major city looks and the cultural differences across the whole continent.
That’s one of the reasons I wish this show had been animated. Surreal and strange architecture, landscapes, and things like the Fades cloaks not moving would look better with animation in my opinion. Plus, you could get the characters to look right and still get great actors to voice them.
@@alaska4939 I also would have preferred the show to be animated.
But oh well, still hopeful for the show.
@@gokbay3057 me too. I’m trying not to get my hopes to high though because Hollywood always has disappointed me.
Reading through the comments, and I am still reminded as the the weirdest quirk of America culture. Some of us have no problem with scenes of graphic violence, but lose our minds at even tasteful, non exploitative nude scenes.
I realized Jordan didnt focus on the gruesomeness, but I never got the idea that it wasn't there or it was small. Book after book the world is a brutal and horrific place in many ways where everyone comes up against physically or emotionally extreme situations
I never realized that anymore interpreted this series as lighthearted. I liked that he was able to keep a tone that didn't leave you bleeding on the floor.
I disagree with the idea that you can't filter out or mute these things in a visual medium like Robert Jordan did through prose. Compare for example someone being cut in half or decapitated in Invincible vs in Star Wars. You can *literally* fade to black or aim the camera in a non revealing angle or just mention things in dialog etc...
Me too. I think, you could do the violence similar to Lord of the Rings, it doesn't have to be gory to be dark.
The biggest hurdle will be getting past the hours of footage of just Nynaeve tugging her braid. HOURS.
great video, goblin. i was reading the great hunt and stopped to watch the video. no regrets.
back to the book
‘Woking’ it to death will be the biggest hurdle.
I've always thought it's biggest hurdle is it's weird gender politics. The whole boomer humor "men be this way and women be this way" gets old fast for me.
One of the darkest moments to me was when we first saw compulsion the way the scene was played was terrifying
At this point (as in pre-release stage) I am most worried about the marketing.
Grim dark is definitely going to be needed for a true story telling of the wheel of time. I'm down with how ever they show it though, November can't come quick enough!!
Didn’t Rafe Judkins say it would be “adult but accessible”?
I think you're right. So I think it will be pretty adult but just not over the top.
@@Ktulured55 Yeah I think it will possibly be traditional boobs and butt type nudity with some fairly graphic violence but not to a glorified, almost torture porn level like GoT did. I think this would suit the tone of the series best.
@@Zandohaha The arc with the guy who cuts off that one guy's dick is still some of the most fucked up shit I've seen on television. Then he rapes that one redhead sister. That arc was just disgusting. There are literally 0 redeeming qualities about it. I didn't even like the final battle and I don't get all the praise it gets.
I’m up to book five and I’ve never once thought WoT was near YA in tone. I literally had no idea the series had that perception. That’s super weird to me.
What a great video and funny...great job great content bud!
Dumais Wells could be the darkest and most gruesome scene in any show or movie.
I also feel a similar way about Brandon Sanderson's darkness.
At first I thought they'd softball it for a wider audience, but if its anything like Carnival Row in tone, then we're all in for a ride.
Just finished Fires of Heaven! Finally after too long away I’m back into regular reading! After book 5 I’m excited to carry on! Getting the feeling that I’m now in a mew phase of WoT and I’m hoping to make the most of it before the slog. What book do most think it happens at?
Some disagree that the slog even exists. Most commonly people say books 7 to 10 but part of that was the wait for new books for people reading them as they were published. Don't worry about it and keep reading!
I agree with Seth, dont worry about the Slog. I acknowledge its existence, but the books are still incredible works. You get a LOT of great Mat and Perrin moments during that time as well.
People say 7-10 are the slog.
I disagree. Books 5 and 6 almost made me quit altogether, but the slog has been pretty enjoyable!!
I finished book 9 two weeks ago and am currently halfway through book 10. These two are definitely sluggish - with important shit happening of course.
For me, it was definitely book 10! Uggghhh!!! It is all material that happens before the end of book 9. My theory is that Robert Jordan was getting pressure from the publisher to put out a new book, so he just put together some deleted material from books 8 and 9 and called it good. Luckily, book 11 is great!!
Currently on my first read through and I’m on Fires of Heaven, and I have to say that this video was extremely insightful. Like, you brought ideas to the forefront that I didn’t even realize, but now I see it plainly. And I totally agree that you can’t omit the darker aspects of the series. I’m all for leaning into the dark, horror aspects. Well done.
I feel like it can still be done in a pg-13 way if you want. Typically for nudity/violence it's then shown that it's happening without it actually being shown itself through camera positioning/angles. Like for nudity showing a character undress but always pointing the camera above/below the bits that would make it R or obscuring them with other things in the scene. Or for cutting off someone's hand: showing the start of the cut, then a face reaction shot, then the result of the hand being off. That kind of stuff. Not sure if that'd be the best option everywhere in the show but that is an option.
I get what you mean about not being able to show trolloc cookpots without them being terrifying. I've always gotten a dumb picture in my head of a drawing of like, a round trolloc boiling a stick person over a poorly drawn fire. And that's always made the threat of being in a trolloc cookpot less dangerous to me considering it gets to a point where characters can kill trolloc relatively easy. But the reality is it would be so much worse than that.
Trying to capture Jordan's poetic swordfights in cinema is a herculean task.
I'm skeptical of anyone being able to pull that off
very true, but also very easy as most move-names do not have explicit actions pinned to them, so actors/writers/choreographers can go nuts
@@gemoije796 I'm sure we'll get great fight scenes, I just don't think they're going to feel the same.
@@zackglenn2847 I'd say as long as there's a distinct and percievable difference between the skill levels of various characters with the various weapons/abilities, the general feel of the fights will be the same. Ideally the choreography for the sword fights would feel like a flowing dance like it's described in the books, and some distinct moves have important callbacks and references later in the series, but after shows like The Witcher I'm not sure a same high standard of choreography can realistically be consistent throughout a series.
I think that a big hurdle this show will come up against is differentiating itself from Amazon's Lord of the Rings series. This assumes the LOTR series will have a tone close to the movies. If the tone of the WoT series is darker than the LOTR series, I think that they could complement each other very well. I just hope they aren't too similar in tone. Lord knows I don't want to hear "I'd rather just watch the LOTR show, it's basically the same."
judging by the track record of every single movie made in the last 20 years, i can safely say it will probably suck
I just finished my first listen to the audio and it brought to mind exactly this. You can't have WoT without trolloc cook pots, its right up there with braid tugging. The balance is gonna have to be just so, I can't wait!
I wonder what they'll do with Aran'gar when they reach her, since this part did not age well.
I don't think RJ wanted to write an 'evil trans' character, but I have little doubt this will come off as one, and I'm not sure what the Amazon writers will do about that.
Maybe change Balthamel's gender? Or just cut out Aran'gar entriely?
Don't know, I'm wondering too but the thing is that every character has a lot of dark moments, so it's quite balanced, and for some 'good' characters the line is thin between the 'good' and 'evil', so I don't think it will be much a problem.
But, at the same time, not doing the gender swap can also be seen as discriminatory, as well as not having a trans villain be seen as using trans characters as "tokens".
What I'm saying is, there is no "right" approach and people will be pissed no matter what
What nonsense, there's nothing trans about it......
It's literally a completely different body. The crazy mob will complain about it one way or another anyways so it's best to stick to the books and ignore the whiners :D
@IdleBigots I'm not against the gender swap, nor do I think it sends any political message, I'm just saying that's bound to upset the people who look for hidden political agendas either way they do it.
As for it being necessary, you might be right, but I don't exclude possibility of rewriting the arc without the swap and turning out alright.
I don't have a strong opinion on it so I'll just take it as it is.
@IdleBigots That's fair, and honestly I don't know why I'm debating this because I don't disagree with you. I guess I will that with all the hype and how GoT ended we are about to see a lot of stupid discussions and clickbaity articles
Jordan initially had a much darker grimmer tone but the publisher told him he had to tune it down for a teenage audience because they didn't think fantasy would sell to adults. His manuscript for the first book was actually the first three books and they split it up, because it would have been too big to bind. Imagine the tone drastically changing in the TSR, which is where those EOTWisms start disappearing.
0:00 The biggest question since the meaning of life XD
Robert Jordan had the luxury of allowing the reader to use their imagination to fill in the darker scenes, so there was no need to describe them in detail.
The darker it gets the more successful it will become!
I agree. Jordan’s writing was geared toward a broader audience, so that even children could read it. (I did as a child). So it would make sense that he wouldn’t sensationalize the writing to horrify the reader. But I do want to see a more adult version on screen.
Spoiler of book 1:
Just want to see how the do the fire in the eyes and mouth of Ba'alzamon without it looking really weird, my brain just can't see it
Spoiler book 2:
Or the Battle in the Sky. Shit's wild.
I agree with you Daniel, however, I am in the opposite camp on what I would prefer. This will e a challenge and it will be interesting to see how people respond to it depending on which camp they take. I also don't see it working very well if they try to take a middle road.
I'd like them to go dark in a way, but at the same time they should stay away from nudity
“Robert Jordan prose are”
-Daniel Green 2021
I reallt hope they go the darker route
Really good point that a lot of people probably haven't thought about! I'm with our Goblin leader though - the darker elements were there when you read it, Jordan just made it so you had to find it. I think the risk is that the license to be grittier could allow story tellers to abscond a little further in the interest of these darker themes. Could be wrong though!
Wheel of Time's biggest problem is going to be wokeness and progressivism. Hollywood injects politics into an awful lot of their art.
I pray that doesn't happen here and that instead, they focus on telling a good story and doing characters justice instead of virtue signaling.
The scene of the Sharom erupting in black flame is one of the most haunting apocalyptic scenes I've read in any book; on top of that, the sheer brutality and tragedy of the history of what the Aiel people experienced left me shocked and depressed. Jordan's work is greatly moving and has some of the highest highs and lowest lows (emotionally) I've experienced in a series yet. The show has much to live up to. Cautiously optimistic...