Hey man! Greetings from South East Asia! Found out your channel few weeks ago and I'm hooked ever since! Very interesting to see how most of your videos focus on how to make good use of what one has in his/her hands. Could you do a video where you record with everything "worst" that you have and try to make good use of it (ie; recording a cheap kit with cheap cymbals in a room with poor acoustic treatment, with one cheap mic). I think it will be interesting to see your take on this particular scenario. Cheers!
Great video Ryan! There aren't much videos on the net on this subject. Which I think is way more important than it is usually believed to be. I'm envying your studio man! :D
I though the tone sounded great pre treatment. You have a nice sounding room here, at least what you hear in the video. What did you do for processing?
Well, I actually really dug the first example with the empty room! Lows from the kick were a little out of control but great reverberation from the snare, I’d love to have that in my room! I have a very bad room, 2.5 meters wide and high and 5 meters long, its super dry cause I over-dampened it, I put too much foam around me and the floor is all carpets. The lows are really tigh but the snare sounds too dead and there’s really no room usable sound. I really wanna go back to make it sound a little better. Also, moving the kit to a different spot in the room can make a big difference.
This is great. Yeah man, if you liked it then there's no rules to this stuff. Your room is almost the same size as my live room (Not the one in this video).
Ryan, another valuable video - thanks. I really appreciate how you consistently attempt to solve a problem with a low-cost solution, i.e., need to absorb wave bounce from the floor? Go pull a rug out of someone's trash! Although, I hope you got rid of the rug cooties first :-)
I am wondering about the placement of the overhead (AEA R88? I just got one). It looks like you have it on a diagonal to the drums. Could you briefly explain that placement? Thanks
Thanks Ryan. Could you just describe the layout of the microphone arrangement you were using at 3:55 with the extra carpet please, I couldn't quite make it out, and I liked it.
Everything was the same in all examples, except the room mics, which were an xy with a pair of sm57s. The overhead is a R88, CAD m179s on toms, i5 on snare top, m88 on kick.
Is it bad if I liked it totally live? Treatment just tightened it. That's not a bad sounding room. When I think "worst room" I think of despicable, harsh basement studios with the brightest walls on earth.
The toms seemed to be panned backwards compared to the kit. I heard the high hat and low Tom on the right... is that how it's panned, or am I losing my mind???
So, I have been toying with ideas of trying to make some passive transducer "pickups" that could be mounted in or on snare drums and kick drums and maybe even toms. Is there any precedent for this? Like has anyone ever made an "acoustic-electric" snare? Obviously it would be a bit harsh on the attack and could never be (just sticking with the snare example) a *complete* snare sound, but what about some piezo or neodymium transducers inside a snare, just to take the place of the close-mic? It would be isolated for cymbal-wash or bleed from the hat, and probably wouldn't sound much worse than any soloed snare close-mic track, right? Also for the kick, you could have something that maybe mounts ON the reso-head. You could use a non-ported head and mount your (larger, because it's being used on a kick) transducer right in the center, and wire it to an XLR male jack, and just leave it in there. Tell me I'm not the first person to think of this!
There are triggers(mainly piezo). But I never heard nor I can find any kind of picking actual sound with something other than microphone(including surface mounted). Maybe You're first. Go patent that ;P
The first question I have is what is the difference between what you are talking about and an electronic drum kit with heads (Roland) or a set of triggers on a kit.
Not triggers and not electronic drums. Take your snare, the acoustic snare you already have a few feet from you as you read this, and put some kind of microphonic pickup inside it, just like you would do if you were putting the piezo transducer inside an Ovation. Not electronic at all, not triggering a sample, the sound is all coming from the drum. This pickup, mounted inside the drum, would be to the drum's close-mic as a piezo transducer inside the Ovation is to a mic in front of the Ovation.
Czorny Lisek I only just saw your comment now. I'm not likely to patent it, unless I actually design a specific product and want to sell it, but not just the hypothetical idea. I do, however, think it's a good idea. I mean, solo a snare close-mic track and listen to it. It barely sounds like a snare, and it definitely doesn't sound good on its own, but the whole point of it is to just get a bit of extra signal on the snare hits, something that can be used to add attack and overall volume in a drum mix that needs to be heavy on the snare. I think an acoustic pickup of some sort inside the snare drum could be very useful for that.
This isn't exactly what you're talking about, but it's pretty close. They're piezo pickups (I think, I can't remember now) that clamp to your drum and sit on the heads and detect when you hit them. They're often used for firing off drum samples from some sort of drum module live but I've used them in the studio, too. They put out a terrible sound - basically a super short spike that sounds like a garbage can being ran over by a white noise truck - but they're super useful for firing off samples (that have no bleed) and opening gates. www.ddrum.com/query?upc=834035000328
1:21 - no damping
1:54 - damping behind kit
2:49 - extra panels
3:42 - added carpet
4:56 - added room mics
Thanks for the time codes!
thank YOU for these videos. absolutely one of my favorite channels for recording and mixing!
sounds better with damping for sure
It wasn't bad even wide open!
I've heard some people say that furniture is the best acoustic treatment.
(Like sofas, bookshelves, etc)
Hey man! Greetings from South East Asia! Found out your channel few weeks ago and I'm hooked ever since! Very interesting to see how most of your videos focus on how to make good use of what one has in his/her hands. Could you do a video where you record with everything "worst" that you have and try to make good use of it (ie; recording a cheap kit with cheap cymbals in a room with poor acoustic treatment, with one cheap mic). I think it will be interesting to see your take on this particular scenario. Cheers!
Cannot undertand why this channel has not doubled the subscribers of other guys...
Great job, thank you!!
Pre-treatment has a nice Led Zep vibe!
Fun fact; Led Zeppelin recorded some of their drums in a large staircase
Great video Ryan!
There aren't much videos on the net on this subject. Which I think is way more important than it is usually believed to be.
I'm envying your studio man! :D
Right on man!
I think I like the first change you did (just damping behind the kit)
I though the tone sounded great pre treatment. You have a nice sounding room here, at least what you hear in the video. What did you do for processing?
snare sound pre-treatment is soooooo good!
If you guys like this video. Pick up his other videos at his website. I think i have all of them and they are all worth the money!!!
Thanks man! Yes, I have courses that I create that go much deeper into recording topics.
+Creative Sound Lab Great video! It hit home for me when you mentioned 'control' of how much room you get. Cheers!
Yep, all about giving the mixing dude the control.
Bro I died when you said “rolling out this ugly rug that I found in a trash can” 😂
Well, I actually really dug the first example with the empty room! Lows from the kick were a little out of control but great reverberation from the snare, I’d love to have that in my room! I have a very bad room, 2.5 meters wide and high and 5 meters long, its super dry cause I over-dampened it, I put too much foam around me and the floor is all carpets. The lows are really tigh but the snare sounds too dead and there’s really no room usable sound. I really wanna go back to make it sound a little better. Also, moving the kit to a different spot in the room can make a big difference.
This is great. Yeah man, if you liked it then there's no rules to this stuff. Your room is almost the same size as my live room (Not the one in this video).
awesome demo... gonna watch again with cans for full effect! but definitively can tell either way
Nice!
Ryan, another valuable video - thanks. I really appreciate how you consistently attempt to solve a problem with a low-cost solution, i.e., need to absorb wave bounce from the floor? Go pull a rug out of someone's trash! Although, I hope you got rid of the rug cooties first :-)
Damping behind kit already makes a huge difference, more focused sound ! What do you guys use in your diy acoustic panels ? Rockwool ?
OC703, two inch thick. Some are 4 inches but most are 2 in thick.
@@creativesoundlab where do you put the 4 ins vs the 2 ins
My preference was right before the trash rug. But I get why you would want it to be able to dial up the room to taste.
What kind of drums are they?
so cool. Thank you for your time.
Wow man your videos are very helpful thanks for making them greetings from Mexico
I am wondering about the placement of the overhead (AEA R88? I just got one). It looks like you have it on a diagonal to the drums. Could you briefly explain that placement? Thanks
Thanks Ryan.
Could you just describe the layout of the microphone arrangement you were using at 3:55 with the extra carpet please, I couldn't quite make it out, and I liked it.
Everything was the same in all examples, except the room mics, which were an xy with a pair of sm57s. The overhead is a R88, CAD m179s on toms, i5 on snare top, m88 on kick.
Thank you
What you recording through? And what kind of mics? Also any eq compression?
any ideas or thoughts on recording drums outdoors (backyard, etc)?
Is it bad if I liked it totally live? Treatment just tightened it. That's not a bad sounding room.
When I think "worst room" I think of despicable, harsh basement studios with the brightest walls on earth.
The toms seemed to be panned backwards compared to the kit. I heard the high hat and low Tom on the right... is that how it's panned, or am I losing my mind???
This is what happens when the drummer makes the recording.
Yeah, I wasn't real sure how to pan this one. It was pretty close either way. I flipped it but it felt strange with the video.
Ryan, what's the finish on the ceiling? Tile? Did you hang anything to deal with reflection there?
Gosh it's just a bare sheetrock ceiling. The high ceiling is a printed tin pattern from 1920.
"It's really not suitable for recording..." Proceeds to sound fucking amazing even without treatment
This is brilliant !
Thanks
Hey Ryan,
How effective are regular acoustic ceiling panels hung on the walls as bass traps and general room treatment?
The more you have them out from the wall the better.
So, I have been toying with ideas of trying to make some passive transducer "pickups" that could be mounted in or on snare drums and kick drums and maybe even toms. Is there any precedent for this? Like has anyone ever made an "acoustic-electric" snare? Obviously it would be a bit harsh on the attack and could never be (just sticking with the snare example) a *complete* snare sound, but what about some piezo or neodymium transducers inside a snare, just to take the place of the close-mic? It would be isolated for cymbal-wash or bleed from the hat, and probably wouldn't sound much worse than any soloed snare close-mic track, right? Also for the kick, you could have something that maybe mounts ON the reso-head. You could use a non-ported head and mount your (larger, because it's being used on a kick) transducer right in the center, and wire it to an XLR male jack, and just leave it in there. Tell me I'm not the first person to think of this!
There are triggers(mainly piezo). But I never heard nor I can find any kind of picking actual sound with something other than microphone(including surface mounted).
Maybe You're first. Go patent that ;P
The first question I have is what is the difference between what you are talking about and an electronic drum kit with heads (Roland) or a set of triggers on a kit.
Not triggers and not electronic drums. Take your snare, the acoustic snare you already have a few feet from you as you read this, and put some kind of microphonic pickup inside it, just like you would do if you were putting the piezo transducer inside an Ovation. Not electronic at all, not triggering a sample, the sound is all coming from the drum. This pickup, mounted inside the drum, would be to the drum's close-mic as a piezo transducer inside the Ovation is to a mic in front of the Ovation.
Czorny Lisek
I only just saw your comment now. I'm not likely to patent it, unless I actually design a specific product and want to sell it, but not just the hypothetical idea. I do, however, think it's a good idea. I mean, solo a snare close-mic track and listen to it. It barely sounds like a snare, and it definitely doesn't sound good on its own, but the whole point of it is to just get a bit of extra signal on the snare hits, something that can be used to add attack and overall volume in a drum mix that needs to be heavy on the snare. I think an acoustic pickup of some sort inside the snare drum could be very useful for that.
This isn't exactly what you're talking about, but it's pretty close.
They're piezo pickups (I think, I can't remember now) that clamp to your drum and sit on the heads and detect when you hit them. They're often used for firing off drum samples from some sort of drum module live but I've used them in the studio, too.
They put out a terrible sound - basically a super short spike that sounds like a garbage can being ran over by a white noise truck - but they're super useful for firing off samples (that have no bleed) and opening gates.
www.ddrum.com/query?upc=834035000328
That was great.Thanks.
Right on!
Should I use foam acoustic pannel in my ceiling record room? And about foam bass trap? Does it really help?
I'm sure it makes a difference. If you have it, then use it. I think the ceiling is really important, so always try to treat it.
I actually might even prefer this room to your actual live room. The drums sound much tighter, less boomy, and more controlled.
interesting. Yeah, it's not actually that bad of a space. I might have to record here more often.
Your worst room sounds better wide open than my best room :D
what you need to do is show us how to record in a garage. make the "worst room" more extreme...recording in a hoarders house, for example.
Haha a hoarders house. That would be a nightmare.
That rug look like tundra ghillie suit.
HAHA!
Rob shatman
I need videos. Life is a nightmare. Distract me from it please. Thanks. Bad room? I think I got one of those.....
nice, I love your comments man. Keep them coming.