Is Your Bank Stealing Your SIPs? [Must Watch]
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- Опубліковано 5 жов 2024
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On the contrary, if we want to take some money from atm, and cash is not present (which happens frequently), we cannot ask any penalty from bank (instead our free atm transaction is still reduced).
RBI should send notice to all the banks. It will only happen when an influential person takes this matter to the court of law.
SEBi not rbi
RBI is the problem. RBI is not the solution. Take any issue to RBI, it will always side with the bank by default.
@@necromancer1765 Which is expected because they are all partners in crime.
Not sebi it's rbi for head of banks@@dvdpro-x9h
There's another major difference between a bounced cheque and turned down SIP installment.
A cheque involves a sizeable human time - which of course translates into salaries paid.
SIP is just one server talking to another and even if they 'waste' some time, it's in milliseconds at worst. So
1. Either charge the customer 'actuals' of server time.
2. The banks should employ better IT folks who deploy better algorithms than just keep making repeated attempts. How about sending a simple SMS to the investor after the first failed attempt?
Very true, it should be a small little one time charge just like NEFT/RTGS from our bank accounts. Definitely not for repeated attempts.
This happened to me once with HDFC Bank. I immediately cancelled all my mandates.
Please read the book - बैंकों का मायाजाल. You will get to know the true nature of Banks. Banks are actually meant for serving the super rich. They are not for the layman or general public.
Earlier there was no charges for mandate failure (ECS failure), but now its 590 rupee for 1 failure, it means almost return of 6 month gone if you have 1k sip.
First thing is I don't use any intermediary platform for SIP. Do it directly from the fund platform. Second thing is we have to be diligent on the availability of funds at that time when the SIP hits the account. Otherwise better do manual investments monthly when funds are available.
A cheque can bounce only once, mandate should have a transaction number so that repeated attempts should have the same number or there cannot be reattempts for same transaction number.
Bounced Cheques can also be represented by beneficiaries within validity period
Wow that's some shady practice from the banks! Thanks for sharing and making us aware about it!
Once you start the SIP.
The mandate is requested by the Indian clearing corporation and not by zerodha...
So yes technically its a kind of bounce only.
And there are n number of reasons the mandate can fail for...
So retrial mechanism is indeed necessary.
Nothing is wrong in retrial.
But i believe once the mandate fails for insufficient fund. The user should be notified with the reason of failure and time gap before making the 2nd attempt
So that user can add money to the account.
Exactly 👍
Even technically it is not a bounce.... ICC is requesting money on behalf of your investment account and not for third party payment.... You can't consider that as bounce.... For more info go through negotiable instrument act of 1988
It's considered as bounce Only if I'm obligated to pay that amount.. In Sip there is no obligation as such
@@Kong3287
When you setup the SIP mandate you agree to the contract. Any kind of mandate is an agreement which makes you liable to pay someone
And also ICC takes that money and make the payment to the fund house and in return you get the units.
It's a give and take relation.
It's not like depositing any kind of money to your own account in this case zerodha
Even if you default any RD payments it's considered as bounce only and you are liable to pay the penalty also.
My parents faced such issues in past
@@_Hello_World558 your understanding is wrong and if you faced that situation you need raise with RBI.... SIP is an instruction only and not mandate.... Please go through your SIP agreement and no were you will find the clause of non payment.... Which is applicable to cheque bounce....
6:25 Incorrect, when you register for a mandate on Zerodha, the default max amount is INR 1 crore and debit frequency is "As On When Presented". This literally means you have authorized Zerodha to debit as much as 1 crore rupees as and when it wants until the mandate calls for it.
I have never enabled mandates. I do my SIP payments manually. Sometimes when I don't like, I would not make payment. That's the flexibility I have if I do manual payment.
me too
It's not more called SIP.
Yes that's the best way. I do this religiously every month
That has a flexibility as well
Can you pls elaborate how you do it ?which platform do you use ?
It's ok, but then it's not a sip
Once it happened to me and I took it as a kind of lesson. I never knew the platform would attempt for a payment multiple times. Thanks to you.
It's only with axis bank. Niether HDFC nor SBI have charged me for not keeping SIP balance. Axis did charge me way back in 2020 too
It's in Punjab National Bank too
Sbi charged me bro
SBI charged me too multiple times when I missed, for 500₹ sip, i had to pay 255₹ for the missed payment
Hdfcbank also charging these one of my friend got charged
SBI charged me as well around 4k just 7 to 8 months back
Personally, I support the fact that multiple attempts should not be made on the same day or perhaps within seconds. Like you said money cannot magically appear within minutes but there is nothing wrong with treating it as a bounced cheque. If you write a cheque to yourself (different bank account) and it bounces the bank will charge you, similarly the bank doesn't care if the mandate was made to a biller or your own SIP account. Even a bounced cheque can be represented once or twice (I am not sure) but an unintentional benefit of cheques is that you cannot represent them for the next 2 to 3 working days as you will not get physical possession of it. Perhaps, they should not reattempt a failed mandate within 48 or 72 hours and the max attempts should be made similar to bounced cheques.
Thank you for making this video. I wasn't aware of this and neither was my family. I have told them all. It was really helpful.
I don't set anything in auto mode. I would like to do all such money things manually whenever possible. I don't do SIP, I invest that amount as lumpsum instead.
Happened to me once. Replace the mandates to the public sector banks, the charge is lower.
This happened to me 7 or 8 months back, this happened to me recently as well.
SBI and HDFC Bank accounts had debited for the same reason.
I too think its outrageous how banks are stealing from us and there's nothing we can do about it.
By the time RBI takes some action on the bank, many of us would have lost our money and ofcourse these banks will find someother way to extrot from us.
So at the end, banks would find new ways to steal the money and we will be loosing money.
Thanks for sharing this. My wife had similar experience with ICICI bank
Superb explanation and really thankful to you for creating this awareness in this video. Ofcourse, if it happens to anyone else other than you, definitely they would not have got back the unethical debit amount.
Thanks Ji!
At least in HDFC bank. I get message well in advance a week before that my SIP will be deducted on this perticular date.
Wonderful awareness and clearly explained, really appreciate your efforts!
IDBI BANK LTD CHARGES-₹590/- FOR SO CALLED PENALTY OF -₹500/- MONTHLY SIP DEFAULT.
It has happened to me too with axis bank. I have since closed the account.
Platform through which the SIP has been set up should make only one attempt & not multiple. Their should be a system in place by these platforms to inform the concern customer thru a call ( as the no of Nucience calls we get for opening sn ac) or a message.
Same happened to me on emi payment of 2 wheeler by NACH , the bank declined the transaction even I had sufficient balance , after the total period of downpayment I asked omnibuds on RBI ,they weren't even helpful but they said (RBI) you can go to court for such bounce transaction
I kinda directionally knew about this for a while so I don't schedule any SIP.
Just FYI if it's relevant, this penalty is implemented by banks on any scheduled txn:
1. EMI (of any sort)
2. SIPs
3. Recurring FDs (not entirely sure on this one though)
I would like to add some more nuance to the points in this video. I agree that the practice by the bank to present the mandate multiple times without checking in with the customer and then charging them for each time is an unfair banking practice in contravention with the RBI guidelines on how dishonour of payment instruments must be handled. However NACH mandates in general are equivalent to an advance cheque regardless of the use case. They can't differentiate between mandates for SIPs or mandates to pay loan EMIs. Therefore this warrants punitive charges which also includes a penalty levied by NACH on the destination bank for a failed transaction.
Nonetheless there is no justification for multiple representation without consultation with the account holder.
Each and every mandate should be known to customer. Hidden rules can be huge loss for common retailers.
I think compare this with an RD and how do they charge if the rd doesn't go thru.
You will be surprised within the same banks they fleece the customers .
Checks are cleared by human and charging for wasted efforts make a little sense. Sending an error code to Zerodha because of low balance is not even remotely similar. Looting the retail invested in the barb of policies.
Highly appreciable ! thanks for making this video !
I knew about this dacoity of axis bank before, so every sip of mine has been linked to SBI. I know as a retailer, I can't do much but I try to keep the sip number limited and invest manually as one time investment.
Too much automation is a pain. I do not use mandate. Just small step is required for payment thru UPI or net banking. You can combine payment for all SIP orders and pay in one go.
Thanks for making us aware of unscrupulous practices
This awareness video is really helpful sir. Thank you for taking time out for making this video and helping the fellow investors and novices in the market
Very useful video. Clearly , banks are making at money at the cost of the investor. Imagine an AI program that generates multiple requests, based on one failed attempt . This has potential for the broker and bank to collude and short change the investor.
And the other point is not facilitating the investor to set a limit on the amount and date while registering a new mandate. In both cases the amount is too large and the date is too far away. This has to change by providing flexibility to the investor.
RBI needs to proactively respond to this anomaly without waiting for a formal complaint, forthwith.
Is there any clear-cut directions from RBI? how can a bank consider it as a bounced cheque, on recurring payments?
Another reason to do regular lumpsum investments in liquid funds and then doing STPs from liquid funds to your desired mutual funds
ECS return charges were charged to me by ICICI bankway back in 2008 when my acc balance was very low .And there was no mechanism of redressal that time .
Private banks normally levy such high charges. Thats how they make profit.
I bank with SVC co-operative bank. They dont charge for such returns at all.
Don't do bank mandates, don't trust your bank blindly, make Sip payments through UPI everytime it's due in Coin. Don't be lazy, It takes less than a minute.
Not a question of being lazy, if it is discretionary every month. Most PPL are not disciplined enough and their systematic investment plan would fail.
Thank you for raising the issue
Same problem was happened to me sip was 2000 fine was 650 so i changed sip from 2000to 500
but you'll be notified via mail and sms right ??
Rather than mendates, SIP should be done through Billpay. Even on transaction failure no panelty is applied
We thank you for raising this issue. RBI must take action and clear what is to be done?
Thankyou for making this video. I’m for sure cancelling my mandates 👍
I feel so many issues with this particular with Bank known as AXIS bank. Please do anything with Axis bank with caution. Try to avoid them as your primary bank.
I will agree with you totally. As much as possible avoid Axis bank.
Thanks Bro! We need more friends like you.
Mandate is equivalent to a cheque issued i.e liability
The way you put up ur case represents wise consumer right awarenesss
Brother this is a rule implemented last year, if u don't have balance and mutual funds sip is bounced then fine u have to pay, nothing special for u, so better pause the sip if u don't want to pay
Thank you for this eye opening video.
When we try schedule neft or rtgs from our bank account and that day, there are no funds, our banks do not charge us anything, so why for failed ECS?
They could have treated first failed debit attempt as bounced cheque type case....why all attempt be treated as that when neither bank nor broker company has been authorised to make multiple withdrawal attempts.
My view : issue with Zerodha making multiple attempts. Need to check on that first. Secondly, banks will charge for ECS decline or no funds while attempting. Even in post office , RD Auto debit ECs decline they charge 50rs. Banks do charge for this. But the amount of charge we need to check ahead of these mandates. Mutual funds amc will not charge if any sip not processed, but banks will charge penalty due to clearing process. Lets always make sure to have enough funds to avoid these.
I know this from very early and that's why i dont have any SIP , i only invest money on the day when i have money in my a/c .
Never set up sip.
Good video. I hope you raised this concern with regulatory people such as RBI about banking system which don't stop charging for frequent retry if no money in the account. To sebi about zerodha if they retry within a day
Tq it is the big issue..I got this same issue thrice. But Ive noticed 3rd time.cancelled all sips.. Doing all manually now..
Almost similar instance happened to me also. Here also the culprit is Axis bank. I too checked with them, but the reply ws unsatisfactory and the debit money can't be reversed..It ws surprising..
I too am going to fight it out. In my case it ws rs591 only, but question is on what ground??
Thanks sir sharing Fact
Only one attempt should be allowed,a failed attempt should be notified to the account holder and should be approved before the next attempt is made.
The issue here is basically the likes of zerodha or bajaj fin doesnt inform you regd presentjng of NACH again and again. Recently RBI has asked these cos to sent SMS prior to presenting NACH.
Axis bank does these kind of things, not satified with the bank and closed the account.
Zerodha does not attempt sip mandate, its just a selling partner. Attempts made by AMCs.
Thankyou sir for making this video ❤
Plz share this story with Zerodha also so that they can rectify their system
We did:
tradingqna.com/t/an-appeal-to-zerodha-investor-awareness/168343
MANDATE made is as on when presented, zerodha shd hv asked u before retrying
Never go for mandates. The best way is to invest SIP amount in lumsum by placing manual order.
AMCs never charge banks charge. You write to the bank they are bound to reverse the charges
Same thing happened with me. It was only 1 attempt though by et money. Icici charged me 600
Yesterday my HDFC SIP is not credited to the AMC. Happened first time to me.
Thank you for the information Sir. I believe the API would have not hit recurringly & in your case the mandate was 4 but if the SIP's are 8, then 12 SIP's * 1 mandate would be around 6k INR is what I am guessing, not sure though
very well put... kudos
Thanks a lot for sharing this info
In our Country, Government & Institutions have Realised that an Average Salaried Middle Class can be Easily Squeezed and they can get away with it.
Thanks for sharing, we all face this but no one has the guts the share
Is sip mandate charges applied for removing the SIP
RBI and SEBI should come in and make some amends regarding this matter.
Try is once a day, for 3 consicutive days . This was zerodha's old behavior.
same carried over to bank mandate..
Mandate is the worst thing that happened to us.
I manually pay the SIP by neft
This is fraud , SIP CANNOT BE treated as a liability, please claim for the psychological damage , please raise such issues with the banking ombudsman board
Ombudsman works for the banks. By default their toking always protects the bank.
@@necromancer1765 100%
Thanks for awareness ❤
Sir, it has happened multiple times with me, every time 255₹ they charge
Axis bank cheated me through axis direct.What should i do .
Thanks for this video
Kudos 💞🔥🇮🇳 keep asking difficult questions❤
This is the game zeroda played with you. Why don’t you invest directly to AMC’s account.
Very informative brother
i just do my investment manually. takes max 15-20 minutes per month.
Happened to me last month 1.2k gone.. I forgot to keep balance in axis bank..
I invest only 4k n if they charge 4k for this then wats the point of investment
Kudos to the video. Whether have you received the refund without service tax?
Great awareness.
But, zerodha made zero money on their attempts, axis made.
Dont' blame both.
The question speaker weas raising is that when the first attempty failed why does zerodha need to try multiple times? They must have some profit out of doing it. Just like the STT charges quotient which came upa few days ago which SEBI is asking discount brokers to charge customers only for what is required. No business will do charity & zerodha will no do charity by offering free coin account for MF investments.
Sir, please let me know how to raise complaint, it has happened more than 10 times
It is better to do manual payment. Is there any charge applied on creating mandate and cancel the mandate
₹100+ GST per mandate creation.
@@blu-5500how to cancel mandate
@@blu-5500 Zero charges if you do it from the AMC website.
thanks for bringing it to notice
Please raise a complaint in RBI, there is a loophole.