Holy shit! I just learned VV don't work off-field, I thought since Jean/Sucrose burst swirl a long time, I was getting the shred, and I was doing the rotation totally wrong! Thanks!
They were always there, but it was thought that they were balanced around those flaws. Then Neuvillette comes and does everything. I'd be saltier about it if his gameplay wasn't so dull.
I did an abyss run with my friend's c0r1 Neuvillette and it ... I mean it was hilarious how much he massacred everything, but gosh that gameplay sure wouldn't draw me in. I skipped he and Furina for Raiden and will probably skip Nahida too (though I'll absolutely get Furina on her rerun) Like at the end of the day as much as I enjoy theorycrafting stuff, this is an easy game, and I so much more enjoy vertically investing in the characters that excite me and are fun to play than just following a KQM rotation with the most meta teams. Nahida is fully cracked and I absolutely get it but I don't like her gameplay at all and the power spike isn't worth cringing every time she goes from DDR dance to T-pose run
I think her c2 is quite a game changer for those who absolutely love her, but if she's not your favorite I cant reccomend going for her cons at all when Nahida or Furina exist now and a more varied selection of characters youd rather use your rolls on like Nilou, Neuvi, Kazuha or Yelan. She's still worth picking up at c0 though!
I agree. cos you end up playing her for few months and then switching to the next carry. I am also against Nahi and Furi c2 cos I overbuild my chars and then its just not fun anymore
She’s absolutley my favorite character, currently I have her at c0r1, however, I am at a nearly 260 crit value build on my artifacts. By far my best built character I have. I feel like I need her c2 so I can let her shine!
I have her c3 and she was really strong back then. She is still strong, but my experience with c0 Navia made me realize how big their difference is relative to their cost of pulling and team building.
@@BlazeGamerThat's only really the case on paper. But as we've all seen in practical testing, navia performs significantly better than paper suggests due to huge amounta of frontload in her kit. There really shouldn't be an investment level at which raiden does better than navia.
@@BlazeGamerWhere are you even getting that info lmao? C2 raiden hyper is like a 70-72k dps team, C0 navia teams can go up to like 65k, and navia gains around 30% from C1 and C2. Where is this supposed destruction happening?
@@fennecnation138 65k is unrealistic its the theoretical limit, and her c2 is not even close to 30% dps increase its at best conditions 20% which ia not reliable, not mentioning navia has a lot of magrin for error and uncertainty each rotation while raiden is consistent
I hope Chevreuse kinda helps with a lot of her "issues," being that her buffs aren't circle impact and she doesn't need to be on-field to trigger the ATK buff, electro & pyro shred, and the electro and pyro damage bonus at c6. Now we just need some more pyro off-fielders or maybe Xiangling and Thoma (and Dehya?) are enough.
@@marcusaurelius4777you're mistaking the comment's meaning. OP is saying that Chevreuse would help Raiden's issues, not saying the other way around that Chevreuse has issues with Raiden. Raiden's gonna be goated for aure
C4 Raiden owner here. I don't regret getting her cons but at this point where we're at in the game, I think it's not necessary anymore unless you're simping hard for her. I'd love to trade my Eula cons for Furina and Nahida's C2 if I could as well lol.
i have c6 raiden for waifu reasons and i kept saying to newer player, chasing after c2 raiden is like you invest big on an older dps. Power creeping exist and my c0 neuvilette easily out damage my raiden. Plus, you always could constellation that new dps on future banner. Imagine yourself having c4 neu or c6 navia in few years, it will easily out damage your c2 raiden that cant grow with more constellations. Btw im not just talking about investment=gacha, goodluck spending months and years on emblem domain for raidens relic 😕. Getting those 250-270%ER with decent attack and crit ratio isnt the same at all as farming for xiangling and xingqiu. Best scenario is you are f2p that want to use national team and have the catch (but then why you spend so many fates to c2 her lmao, better get c0 furina, c0 nahida, c0neu, etc). but if i saying this people will say im gatekeeping them from raiden lol.
As much as Raiden is one of my favorite characters and would appreciate the c2 damage increase, her damage is enough at C0. I mainly use her in a hybrid quickbloom build or double hydro, and the damage is far from lacking. I used to want it a lot, and still kinda do, but I'm a bit of a collector and would prefer to get some of the new characters instead. Xianyun, Chiori, Arlecchino, and Clorinde are all coming soon. Maybe Clorinde will also fulfill that hypercarry role at c0 better than Raiden, seeing as she's the top duelist of Fontaine. Technically lore-wise Raiden should be stronger, but sometimes gacha powercreep>lore.
I think it can be summarized as; She's still really good, she's just not AS standout compared to everyone else anymore now that we have characters like Alhaitham and Neuvillette who compete with her, so C2 is usually only worth it if you really like her style. IMO it's better this way. More options in a game is always good.
add to that the fact that a bunch of other characters at c2 will do similarly or better. if you like her it can be very worth it but if youre doing it for meta reasons, pulling some charactres at c0 can be better and if oure going for cons then getting cons for those will be way better
@@fennecnation138 Good thing that's not Raiden lmao. Literally the only character in the game that fulfills that criteria is Alhaitham who we all know is busted. Even Neuv wants C1 to hit his peak.
@@moritz4026 Nah I'd personally z say Alhaitham's better than Neuv at C0 personally. Maybe in heavy AoE they're similar but in anything less I don't see a scenario where I'd prefer C0 Neuv unless you're running him with C2 Furina or something. Keep in mind I have both and at R1.
A lot of this makes a lot of sense, but what gets me sometimes is "well she's bad at multi-wave small target floors" and the like held up as big negatives. Lots of characters are bad at that, there's basically always a boss side of abyss and you should have an AOE team set up for that. The argument of "the investment in c2 is not worth it vs c0 of three other characters" is super sound. It's not at all going to power spike your account the same way, and I'm saying that as someone who has saved 700 pulls for c3r1 while fully knowing it is not a good investment. But calling her *bad* is a different level, like if your goal is to make purple lady do big smashy, she's still really capable of doing that, if you like her you're not gonna regret it, but it's absolutely a bad idea if you just are looking for power. Personally she's my favourite character and I hated having her being stuck as an off field skill bot for a cabbage patch kid, so I'm gonna enjoy my nukes xD
@@maevethefox5912 since you seem to be a smart person, you are better off just ignoring those, along with the simps defending their $200 investment at any cost. they both leave comments driven by emotions, without reason.
@RafaelBelvederese I get baffled by how personally some people take an easy single player game. Like I'm no simp, but I've absolutely spent $200 towards Raiden, and the closest to justifing it I'll do is "I'm not poor and I think she's neat" Like you don't gotta convince randoms on the internet it's the best choice in every possible way. "I wanted to play purple lady and not green toddler" is good enough
I liked raiden so much that I spent half of my primos for her c3 + r1 weapon in 2022 and farmed 16 months straight for a good emblem set, her dmg is still absolutely insane but now seeing my c1 Neuv with a 4* weapon doing even more dmg sometimes while also being satisfying to play feels weird
if you like her just go for it. I always like her vanilla playstyle and never got bored playing her in years. I enjoy her c2 more on helping random coops, theyre reaction from one shotting everything is hilarious
You can have my C4 Raiden when you pry her from my cold, dead fingers. Raiden National is just so synergistic, so easy to play, and still slaps to this day. I genuinely can't imagine going into an Abyss without it.
I've been searching info about how worth It is C2 raiden nowadays now that her rerun is in a few days, i learned so much about this vid and as shes my favourite character ill go for her C2 r1 or possibly c3. Thanks for all the useful information! Great video!!
I have C3R1 and unless against mostly single wave chambers I run Fischl or Yae instead of Sara. Yes, it's lower overall damage, especially with higher Raiden investment. But, swapping out Sara changes the team damage profile that I prefer for multiwave content (either by having a 2nd nuke via Yae or more consistent dps from Fischl). As always, sheet calcs is great for optimizing your team but it's not the full story.
I think we’re at the point where if you like the character it can be justified to pull for additional copies or weapon investment to make them better. I personally don’t use my raiden c0 since dendro options are more comfy / less rotation locked. With raiden you have to prioritize doing a rotation in a certain order and then getting everyone back to full energy to do it again, but I also like double hydro raiden teams (even pre-furina I was using yelan/XQ and kuki as last slot just so I don’t have to play circle impact, pretty solid team but probably better now with furina and a burst healer). Nilou teams and alhaitham teams have rotations but are less restrictive / punishing if you mess up the order.
I am really glad that even though she is one of your favourite you went over her downsides and value relative to current roaster She seems to suffer from similar issues to eula with the energy probalems, overkilling and dps distribution through out rotation like you demonstrated.
@@mickysaifnot really the case since some greedy TCs from KQM have been cal'd that in a lot of Raiden teams in sims and sheets she can burst off cooldown with just 180ER lol.
I wish you could talk about chevreuse + C0vs C2 raiden comps too, i personally have c1 raiden and i will go for c2 because i am hunting sara cons and ofcourse chevreuse, its 50-50 so if i loose its good and if i win its even better but yeah i love to see video about raiden chevreuse bennet sara hypercarry comp and ofcourse national raiden but with chevreuse
Thanks, this is the question I have right now because I have Raiden and Nahida C0, and can only get C2 for one of them because I also want to get other characters. Nahida it is then.
I wanna know about how good Nahida C2 is too, also I don't see many people go for Nahida C3 as much as Raiden C3 either, not a big dmg increase I think
@@a-passerbyNahida c3 is pretty worthless as her own damage doesn't contribute that much to overall team DPS. For Nahida you should either go c0, c2 or c6, anything in between is a waste.
@@supernieva2419 Literally all of her cons are extremely beneficial so there's no bad stopping point. The closest to a bad stopping point she has is probably c5 because her own damage, whilst pretty good, is usually not the focus of the team. For most players, I'd recommend c2 as a general stopping point, but going beyond that is still beneficial. c1: Improves her buffing capabilities a lot c2: Makes it so that a non-teamwide healer can max out her buff and nearly doubles her damage c3: Improves her buffing capabilities a lot c4: Massively improves ER requirements c5: Increase her damage a decent amount c6: Gets rid of the requirement of running a healer in her teams as she is now one (the best one in the game actually). Also allows her to be played as a pretty insane hydro hypercarry.
She isn't worth 400 pulls of course but I got one copy of her on the last rerun and I got one when her banner first ran, so I am getting C2 now because I have a guarantee.
As a raiden main, she's one of the most overrated units in the game. Don't get me wrong, she's a good character but she's not S tier like nahida or kazuha like some people make it seem. People don't seem to understand that at c0 she's a driver not really a main dps, her damage at c0 is nowhere near actual hypercarries and that's fine bc her role is more of a half on field half off field support/battery/driver. At c2 yeah she's definitely carry level. For me she's an upper A tier
@@Azzywrld224 i wouldn't rank any 5* as S tier aside from nahida, kazuha and yelan. On fielders will always be less valuable as supports and even then alhaitham and neuvilette are objectively better than raiden (who mind you i still wouldn't put in S tier, though neuvi is as close as it gets for an on fielder and i can see an argument made for him)
I think you sound better. 😮 Yeah Raiden has some glaring issues with overkilling units and wasting damage. The initial slash restores 0 energy. So if that deletes the room you start with nothing in the next as you have demonstrated. I think Raiden teams with other carries work around her issues. For example Raiden + Navia. You don't want to waste a Burst on a low HP enemy but there still too tanky to kill with normal attacks? Use Navia. Or Raiden double Hydro with Yelan, Furina and Jean. That one in terms of energy feel extremely good. I do have a C3 Yelan and C3 Furina. So that is another story here. And C1 Yelan gives another charge. So that alone can help the energy economy so much. So even when I start a round with 0 energy I can still get regain my bursts very quickly. ~Foxfire
I still use my c2r1 Raiden almost every Abyss (and I've recently gone back to using her in overworld with double hydro as well) because despite having her since her first banner, I still enjoy her playstyle. So for me, the extra pulls were definitely worth it (especially since I won the 50/50 twice while pulling c2) but I definitely would not recommend others to pull past c0 unless they feel the same. I might even roll on her new banner and see if I can win the 50/50 for c3.
yeah as much as i love Raiden, she definitely isn’t the best pick for multi-wave rooms in abyss… especially at c2+… BUT my c2 Raiden is still my go-to DPS pick for bosses/DPS checks in abyss! my fave team for her is a sunfire overvape variation w/ Bennett, Kazuha, and then either Yelan or Xingqiu… but now that Furina has been released sometimes i’ll put her in the hydro slot and swap out Kazuha for Jean to just absolutely delete boss health bars lol ✨
I feel the exact same way, and she is my favorite character in the game as well. I started the game the month before her release specifically because I saw her design and she was the first 5 star I ever got. I went all in on her first banner and after failing to reach my goal, I saved for most of inazuma to get her C3 on her rerun in 2.5 and then saving for engulfing lighting in 3.3. I would say that she in the current meta, she is currently a pretty mid character, no longer so easy to play by comparison to other 5* carries and her utility is pretty niche, because half of her supporting power budget is placed in extra energy recharge, and with the way energy recharge works in the game, you either have enough energy recharge to get your burst back on cooldown, and it becomes your least valuable stat, or you don't, and it skyrockets in value. This means her energy refund only really makes a meaningful difference in your team power if you have an artifact set that trades out a specific amount of energy recharge that Raiden effectively provides, in exchange for offensive substats like crit rate and crit dmg. And, with artifact being the hell that it is, and no artifact loadouts, no sane person would do that. But I don't regret investing in her because, I was C1 with the Catch for like 5-6 months and that really made me appreciate the power difference that the jump to C3 provided. Those early constellations are necessary if you want to turn her from a niche tool in your toolbox into a swiss army knife for all kinds of content that relies on dps checks. Ever since I pulled her, despite getting a bunch of great new characters since, i have never gone through abyss without being able to find a good use for her in my teams (even if, for a lot of that period, it was on hyperbloom teams). But you should probably make peace with the fact that this isn't the most efficient way to turn your primos into account power anymore, and should only be considered for people who love Raiden and want to make her work.
As a c2 raiden owner i like to replace sara with fish At c2 level of investment fish is lower damage but in exchange you get a great battery ,sub dps and shield breaker (the team is way more versatile and it feels much better to play too) I strongly recommend to give this version a shot (Also this team prevents the overkilling enemies problem in abyss and feels much better in open world since you have a sub dps and battery)
@@mickysaif i personaly dont like yae because she feels even more cluncky than sara 😅( also you will be forced between losing bennet uptime or using yaes ult unbuffed . Both feel bad to me) My top pick is fish because of previoualy mentioned reasons But yelan or furina feel pretty good too
@@Archerrrrr-jz7iqYae Mikos skill and burst cool down are more aligned to Raiden. Maybe your rotation is wrong that's why you think Yae is clunky to Raiden.
Yup. Also, not sure how different the dmg even is without Sara's bufff when you also factor in Fischl's dmg is significantly higher than Sara's. Especially on fights like the Tulpa, Fischl just abuses her A4 in that fight.
This is why i use Baizhu instead of bennett.yes i’ll lose a lot of DMG but now I have a perfect rotation that when Ei burst end kazu burst is ready then baizhu then sara + the dmg lost isn’t important cause every thing already dead in the end of rotation any way ✨
I was planning on C2'ing Raiden, then a week ago decided I'm better off C2'ing my Nilou and pushing my C1 Yelan towards C6 every time she reruns. Hopefully I get my C3 Tighnari to C6 in the process as I think he's one of the most fun characters to play.
As a C2 Nilou haver I can say that it was indeed a very good investment. I also have C2 Yelan, and while I don't plan to C6 her, I can only imagine how broken that would be given how strong she already is at C2
@@m.frehmann7373 I'm just at the point in the game where I have a ton of decently built characters and just want to have fun. I haven't really enjoyed Fontaine so far minus picking up Furina :(
@@whyismynametaken123 yeah same, the game is just boring in terms of endgame content. My plan is to get arlecchino and then take a break… . C6 yelan also didn’t saved me from my burnout, that’s why I wouldn’t recommend it :(
@@m.frehmann7373 I felt the same when I received C3 Raiden. after that I can’t play with her outside the abyss. Everyone writes that Neuvillette is stronger and now I doubt whether it’s worth waiting for his rerun. I think this could kill any remaining interest in the combat content in the game.
Finally! Finally someone said it, pointed out the exact flaw of Raiden. I have been telling the same thing since her release but 💩 kids told me how can dealing more nuke dmg be a flaw even after explaining how she generates ER.
If were talking c2 pull value she definitely falls off because her constellation only affects herself, youre better off pulling for c2 nahida since she works with a variety team + your hyperbloom damage is similar to raidens burst (rotation time of course) overall makes the game less boring in the long run
Lost me somewhere around 3:00 mark. Like you said Raiden is versatile. So then change teams and do different rotation if you are worried about VV not applying on 2nd wave cuz she delete the 1st wave so fast. And how come I didn't see a Dendro/Catalyze/aggravate/hyperbloom showcase on this video? A 100% yes C2 is worth it for me, no drama yes-ish bs answer. Pull for it if you want to it's a good investment. She works so well with so many existing characters. And would be great if she works well on so many future characters🎉🎉🎉
Only Lyney beats her in 8c speed run tournaments in CN. She took home 2nd and 3rd place because her hyper carry team is incredibly strong. Very much meta however they use C3R1 because that 3rd constellation is surprisingly strong but the Lyney has to be C6 to beat that so for value imo raiden hyper carry is one of the Lowest costs for vertical investment in the game since C3R1 is meta instead of C6
I never thought her playstyle was bad i just also never thought her damage was that great because i tired of farming emblem before i got to more reasonable standards for her artifacts. I wouldn’t mind having her C2 but more so i can enjoy using her when i do, but not going to force myself to get it i just already have C1 last i checked.
Butterfer gets a lot a flack for his hyperbloom vid but on one of his recent streams he actually put it pretty well; C2 Raiden is a strong character. But she's not heads and shoulders above the other DPSes, especially when you do an equal amount of investment in them compared to how you would with Raiden.
Yeah jstern also talks about how people keep comparing c2 raiden to c0 5*s which causes the perceived difference, most characters with either signature or cons compare well with her.
My c0 raiden is still quite fun to play with for both hyper and rational. With the addition of furina her double hydro is a fun comp. She hasnt really fallen off with huge frontloaded dmg, batterying your team and constant onfield electro dmg from e.
why we are even discussing Hypercarry team? Rational was meta before and it is also meta now. C2 raiden in national teams fixes the lack of single target dps of that team.. making it the most universal team that works for any chamber half of any abyss (with very rare exceptions). And also fixes cases when you kill the wave with her slash without restoring energy , both because her personal damage will be lower than in a hypercarry and because it may be an option just to auto attack with raiden to proc for example xingqiu and vaporize from xiangling... and to burst on next wave.
Even before Fontaine miden simps couldn't understand that ever her C2 can't match C0 Childe or C0 Hu Tao . But now we have Neuvillete , Furina who are better than C6 Miden
@@coffeemug1012 yeah thats whale territory and he at most calcs C2R1 for characters but it was nice to see how big of a difference the over invested teams do compared to our teams
I get bored with my characters way too fast, so I never invest my hard earn primogems for constellation. I prefer a bunch of C0 5stars characters than a few characters with constellation.
Same. In star rail I invest vertically because difficulty is higher and combat is not as fun for trying out different characters. But in Genshin I just want a new shiny toy every month. I have 23 lvl 90 characters after 2 years of playing
Get 1 copy and call it a day guys. She is still good at C0. I got her only in her 2nd rerun. Raiden changed my account with her versatility. She's not my fav character but still she's a top unit and can help clear abyss. These are some teams I use in abyss and clear 9 stars. AlH Raiden Nahida ZL Ayato Raiden Kazuha/Nahida ZL Raiden Yelan/Fischl Kazuha ZL/Bennett Raiden Yelan Jean Bennett/Furina
Based take I agree, as a c3 raiden haver she is still very strong, but there are a lot of other options out there now that can perform just as well if not better
She still remains a meta in vertical investment. the last continuous speed run tournament in CN with cash prizes in 8 costs, which is the category with you normally carry with raiden C2-C3 remained the second best DPS with front charge damage according to the chinese players. her traditional hyper raiden is still best team with a ton of time by far compared to other variants, so if you go pull for raiden C2-C3 you will too need sara C6 for her best team.
For a c2 character equipped with BiS 5* weapon...those are some very expensive requirements for those numbers at this point You are a simp and want to roll for her go ahead but getting constellation just to clear the 12 floor of the abyss its extremely silly
I may not have raiden but I’m getting her so I think my takes are abit valid (correct me if I’m wrong ) raiden is an electro unit and one of the best ones she is viable at c0 but c2 makes her a dps with the addition of dendro reactions which buffs electro units viablility electro is only used for application other than dps so I feel that raiden c2 has fallen of in her role as a dps because of how over tunes the Fontaine units are overtuned as hell so raiden dps has fallen off but raiden as a sub dps hasn’t because dendro is still viable
I've always preferred to use Raiden in a dual carry team, rather than as a sole carry. Sole carry Raiden relies too much on her burst and the buffs, and makes how she fuels the team less impactful. When it comes to things like electro-charged and aggravate, there just are better electro options. And I think usage shows this... hypercarry Raiden has never been huge. But give her another DPS to share time with, one that is energy hungry, and ideally some other energy hungry teammates, and you come out ahead. And sure, now you are out a buffer, so your peak isn't as high, but the valley isn't as low anymore either. Basically, if the team that has Raiden doing direct damage (as opposed to triggering blooms) doesn't want Raiden's energy regen , why is it even bothering with Raiden?
Never saw the hype of Raiden C2 and never will. Character's like HuTao and Ganyu feel more rewarding to to pull off correctly and do more damage. Raiden's a good as a Eula support or hyperbloom unit - that's it.
video isn't wrong, but also the new dungeons are designed to allow new units to shine. she still has one of the best designs in the game too, that's hard to beat.
I have found Raiden C2 Nahida, Furina, Jean(or Kazuha if you don't need to heal) , just as powerful as any other team for her and is way more comfortable imo My Raiden is at C0 btw.
I played since 1.0, then when raiden come out i played her with bennet and xiangling for soo long, then i realise that childe internasional just better in any aspect. So i stop playing her till now
As a hypercarry she is basically an buffed electro Eula, which is not necessarily a good thing, and as a hyperbloom trigger she is only slightly better than Kuki in some comps
I got won TWO 50/50 in a row within 45 wishes so now I have her C2 since I already pulled for her and her weapon her last banner 🎉❤🎉❤🎉 feeling so lucky
6:19 Jean doing 1% damage in Double Hydro, what is that comp 😭 Honestly yeah, my biggest issue with Raiden is that she relies on doing her autoattacks to recharge her energy-hungry ult. Her damage being frontloaded is great, but it does have the downside of making it difficult to recharge her if she overkills enemies. Still, I think Raiden is plenty strong even at C0 (I have no cons on any limited characters and Arlecchino is the only one who MIGHT change that) even if there are other hypercarries that are stronger and easier to use now. The important thing is that she can clear Abyss, and she definitely can.
C2 Raiden will only ever fall off for me when both sides are immune to electro or something. She's been clearing every Abyss for me since her debut, and her side is always quite easy. Always having full energy back as long as she gets to finish her combo. And her ER refill to the team makes rotation smooth. Also interruption resistance even in the face of consecrated beasts. Number-wise, maybe she's less impressive than some, but I found her whole kit to be well thought-out and strong.
I'm happy I invested in constellations for other characters, like Nahida and Furina, because they don't just amplify their own damage but the rest of the team's as well. This means that more than just hyper teams can benefit from this investment: Nahida's C2 shreds defence in quicken teams, gives a straight up 20% dps increase to all bloom reactions (burgeon, hyperbloom, and even Nilou bloom teams), and getting Furina to C2 increases both the floor and ceiling of her buff while at the same time making it way easier and faster to reach her ceiling ON TOP of also increasing the base damage of her own skill by buffing her own max hp. Raiden C2 is better for funny screenshot numbers, but Nahida and Furina constellations can make a lot of teams feel way stronger.
Her damage isn’t just the screenshot though. People forget that it’s spread over a 7-9 second duration. The initial damage is high, but as per what TGS said, the other subsequent damage is apart of the kit. You miss out not only in damage . But you don’t get any energy generation neither.
No... Xianyun could have if her buff worked on raidens burst form plunges since it's considered burst damage and Xianyun buffs Plunge damage she doesn't recieve this very good buff.
That's why I prefer playing my C2 on Raiden National than Raiden hypercarry for abyss. The team is boring after years of playing it, but it's a nice backup team for when my new fave character can't 36-star the current abyss yet.
Idk if yall just don't know how to cycle your rotations but my c2 r1 Raiden is easily my most trusted character ever. The is pretty much no abyss I don't use her national or hyper carry team in 🤷♀️
General mahamatra is great but still can't surpass raiden so i think even if chlorinde come as champion duelist she also can't, the kagemusha of makoto is going to stand alone..
@@JoaoGabrielSVaz Nope her c2 is specified to Dendro teams only that too with transformative reactions. While as furina buffs everything except transformative.
I have Nahida , Neuvillette and Alhaitham And C2R2 Raiden Shogun (she is my favourite and I got lucky on her pulls) , I Think this video is exaggerated. If you make a video like this about every character, all of them will have some flaws (I mean obviously, they need to balance the game right) Overall the fact that, 1) Her E is so freaking useful for elemental rxns 2) Her burst does crazy damage and refunds your other party members burst while having an interruption resistance Just make her amazing to play Also her C2 is literally the best constellation ingame , or one of the best , I think that’s something everyone agrees on
It's not the character's fault hoyo plays chess with people in order to make them pull for new characters that "work" better against problems they create.
I think you should have mentioned that every on-fielder considered better than her like Alhaitham, Neuvillette or Navia also happen to be able to split their field time and can freely swap off or on. For units like Itto or Scara who can apply res shred from via resonance and Faruzan respectively, it's not an issue to follow this playstyle. But for her, it is a bigger detriment than overkilling.
for me, a 40% dps increase in the best case scenario on my c0 raiden non furina/rational teams would just allow me to 1 rotate a boss instead of needing 2 rotations, not a priority for me im still gonna try to get chevy though lol
Cheverous Bennet and Sara with Raiden works better you get the double pyro 25 percent atk increase and the double electro and hella survival because Bennet and cheverous heals lol
Thanks for explaining the meta during Raiden's release. I started playing in 2023, didn't like her play style, and didn't understand why many content creators say she's a good pull. Her burst is too short and she spends time chasing after staggered enemies. Wanderer felt more comfortable spamming NAs, with much less party utility of course. Now compared to Hu Tao, Ganyu & Ayaka play styles, I see why Raiden is so popular.
The issue is not that people think raiden is broken at C2 and above, the issue is that people mostly think she's a useless dps at C0 which honestly I don't think it's very true, personally I had a lot of fun with C0 either hypercarry or other teams but still I prefer more characters over constellation
I'm going for her C2. I love her and im comfortable with the characters I have anyway and I want to shower her with the best. I like to play with her and i have fun to do so. If i could, I would've given back my Neuvillette for her C3. Is Neuvillette strong? Yes but so boring that he's benched. Even Alhaitham who I used to like is benched because I now rather use Tighnari, I love his team with Miko/Nahida/Zhongli. In the end, if it clears the abyss when I feel like playing it, I'm happy. The only constellation I'm considering is also C2 Furina because, again, I love her. And I'm still skipping Hutao, Yelan, Kazuha and Navia. I would give back my Neuvillette and Alhaitham is benched. But what matters is to play with those we have fun with, right? People who only care about big numbers and having the best are the ones who will slowly fall off in love with the game because there's nothing much left to enjoy but be a slave to the numbers.
I never liked Hypercarry Raiden, so my team is C2 Raiden, Yae, Kazuha and Baizhu, with as strong results as Alhaitham Hyperbloom or Neuvilette Hypercarry
Have her since 2.1 unfortunately didn't get her naginata in every re run but it's not escaping this time. 40k+ primos ready to be dumped. If I'm left with something then going for cons. Idgaf if she does 3 dmg I'll max out my Goddess.
Yes-ish
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day 459 of asking TGS for a Ga Ming build and team video with the calculated dpr
well, ok then
6:22 is it raiden c0 and would you still recommend raiden?
Holy shit! I just learned VV don't work off-field, I thought since Jean/Sucrose burst swirl a long time, I was getting the shred, and I was doing the rotation totally wrong! Thanks!
The flaws of other dps are more noticeable now after overturned neuvillette release
They were always there, but it was thought that they were balanced around those flaws.
Then Neuvillette comes and does everything.
I'd be saltier about it if his gameplay wasn't so dull.
@@el7284Genshin is basically a variety of different ways to left click, idk what u expected with neuvillette
@@el7284nevulette is basically more mobile hydro ganyu
Looks like you missed alhaitham. :P
I did an abyss run with my friend's c0r1 Neuvillette and it ... I mean it was hilarious how much he massacred everything, but gosh that gameplay sure wouldn't draw me in.
I skipped he and Furina for Raiden and will probably skip Nahida too (though I'll absolutely get Furina on her rerun)
Like at the end of the day as much as I enjoy theorycrafting stuff, this is an easy game, and I so much more enjoy vertically investing in the characters that excite me and are fun to play than just following a KQM rotation with the most meta teams. Nahida is fully cracked and I absolutely get it but I don't like her gameplay at all and the power spike isn't worth cringing every time she goes from DDR dance to T-pose run
I think her c2 is quite a game changer for those who absolutely love her, but if she's not your favorite I cant reccomend going for her cons at all when Nahida or Furina exist now and a more varied selection of characters youd rather use your rolls on like Nilou, Neuvi, Kazuha or Yelan. She's still worth picking up at c0 though!
I agree.
cos you end up playing her for few months and then switching to the next carry.
I am also against Nahi and Furi c2 cos I overbuild my chars and then its just not fun anymore
Agreed! 💯
you really thought we wouldn't notice that you snuck in nilou in there
She’s absolutley my favorite character, currently I have her at c0r1, however, I am at a nearly 260 crit value build on my artifacts. By far my best built character I have. I feel like I need her c2 so I can let her shine!
C2 Nahida, Furina and Kazuha are just a much better investment than raiden c2
Tysm!!!! I’ve been digging for this content high and low recently. Thank you for always releasing content that i need and want
I have her c3 and she was really strong back then. She is still strong, but my experience with c0 Navia made me realize how big their difference is relative to their cost of pulling and team building.
c0 navia > c0 raiden but c2 raiden > c2 navida with a small diff
@@BlazeGamerThat's only really the case on paper. But as we've all seen in practical testing, navia performs significantly better than paper suggests due to huge amounta of frontload in her kit.
There really shouldn't be an investment level at which raiden does better than navia.
@@fennecnation138 na im taking that on account, raiden on paper destroys navia
@@BlazeGamerWhere are you even getting that info lmao? C2 raiden hyper is like a 70-72k dps team, C0 navia teams can go up to like 65k, and navia gains around 30% from C1 and C2.
Where is this supposed destruction happening?
@@fennecnation138 65k is unrealistic its the theoretical limit, and her c2 is not even close to 30% dps increase its at best conditions 20% which ia not reliable, not mentioning navia has a lot of magrin for error and uncertainty each rotation while raiden is consistent
I hope Chevreuse kinda helps with a lot of her "issues," being that her buffs aren't circle impact and she doesn't need to be on-field to trigger the ATK buff, electro & pyro shred, and the electro and pyro damage bonus at c6. Now we just need some more pyro off-fielders or maybe Xiangling and Thoma (and Dehya?) are enough.
@@marcusaurelius4777dude calm down
@marcusaurelius4777 I think they were saying they hope Chevy helps solve Raiden's issues, not that Chevy has issues herself.
@@csatt13 Chevy 😂😂😂😂😂
@user-iw2vf7pb7s Bennet is better used with Xianling, so, yeah, definitely need another off-field pyro.
@@marcusaurelius4777you're mistaking the comment's meaning. OP is saying that Chevreuse would help Raiden's issues, not saying the other way around that Chevreuse has issues with Raiden.
Raiden's gonna be goated for aure
C4 Raiden owner here. I don't regret getting her cons but at this point where we're at in the game, I think it's not necessary anymore unless you're simping hard for her. I'd love to trade my Eula cons for Furina and Nahida's C2 if I could as well lol.
Isn’t Eula’s best constellation Furina c2😂
@@Marz333Besides her c6 lmao
@@Marz333 eula's best team is hyperbloom too (at c0) which is rly funny ngl 🤣
i have c6 raiden for waifu reasons
and i kept saying to newer player, chasing after c2 raiden is like you invest big on an older dps. Power creeping exist and my c0 neuvilette easily out damage my raiden. Plus, you always could constellation that new dps on future banner. Imagine yourself having c4 neu or c6 navia in few years, it will easily out damage your c2 raiden that cant grow with more constellations. Btw im not just talking about investment=gacha, goodluck spending months and years on emblem domain for raidens relic 😕. Getting those 250-270%ER with decent attack and crit ratio isnt the same at all as farming for xiangling and xingqiu. Best scenario is you are f2p that want to use national team and have the catch (but then why you spend so many fates to c2 her lmao, better get c0 furina, c0 nahida, c0neu, etc).
but if i saying this people will say im gatekeeping them from raiden lol.
neuvi is just insane
wait your c0 neuvi outdamages raiden?
@@lekoesic she only deal higher nukes and thats it. cant compete with that huge long everlasting hydropump
@@soyo_te4465 man i was planning on pulling for her c2 after saving for 140+ fates... guesd i'll just save them
As much as Raiden is one of my favorite characters and would appreciate the c2 damage increase, her damage is enough at C0. I mainly use her in a hybrid quickbloom build or double hydro, and the damage is far from lacking. I used to want it a lot, and still kinda do, but I'm a bit of a collector and would prefer to get some of the new characters instead. Xianyun, Chiori, Arlecchino, and Clorinde are all coming soon. Maybe Clorinde will also fulfill that hypercarry role at c0 better than Raiden, seeing as she's the top duelist of Fontaine. Technically lore-wise Raiden should be stronger, but sometimes gacha powercreep>lore.
C0 I can only do 175k maybe cuz my build is bad but I’m planning on getting c2 this rerun to see the difference
I think it can be summarized as;
She's still really good, she's just not AS standout compared to everyone else anymore now that we have characters like Alhaitham and Neuvillette who compete with her, so C2 is usually only worth it if you really like her style.
IMO it's better this way. More options in a game is always good.
add to that the fact that a bunch of other characters at c2 will do similarly or better. if you like her it can be very worth it but if youre doing it for meta reasons, pulling some charactres at c0 can be better and if oure going for cons then getting cons for those will be way better
I wouldn't call a C2 character that barely competes with C0 of the other characters really good.
@@fennecnation138 Good thing that's not Raiden lmao. Literally the only character in the game that fulfills that criteria is Alhaitham who we all know is busted. Even Neuv wants C1 to hit his peak.
@@jjilatt123 just because neuvillettes c1 is insane doesnt mean he isnt at least just as good as haitham at c0
@@moritz4026 Nah I'd personally z
say Alhaitham's better than Neuv at C0 personally. Maybe in heavy AoE they're similar but in anything less I don't see a scenario where I'd prefer C0 Neuv unless you're running him with C2 Furina or something.
Keep in mind I have both and at R1.
My goat, discovered your channel a week or so ago and it has helped me so damn much!
A lot of this makes a lot of sense, but what gets me sometimes is "well she's bad at multi-wave small target floors" and the like held up as big negatives.
Lots of characters are bad at that, there's basically always a boss side of abyss and you should have an AOE team set up for that.
The argument of "the investment in c2 is not worth it vs c0 of three other characters" is super sound. It's not at all going to power spike your account the same way, and I'm saying that as someone who has saved 700 pulls for c3r1 while fully knowing it is not a good investment.
But calling her *bad* is a different level, like if your goal is to make purple lady do big smashy, she's still really capable of doing that, if you like her you're not gonna regret it, but it's absolutely a bad idea if you just are looking for power.
Personally she's my favourite character and I hated having her being stuck as an off field skill bot for a cabbage patch kid, so I'm gonna enjoy my nukes xD
who called her bad?
@@RafaelBelvederese various people in the comments
@@maevethefox5912 since you seem to be a smart person, you are better off just ignoring those, along with the simps defending their $200 investment at any cost. they both leave comments driven by emotions, without reason.
Don’t put shade on Nahida because she made Raiden obsolete😭
@RafaelBelvederese I get baffled by how personally some people take an easy single player game.
Like I'm no simp, but I've absolutely spent $200 towards Raiden, and the closest to justifing it I'll do is "I'm not poor and I think she's neat"
Like you don't gotta convince randoms on the internet it's the best choice in every possible way. "I wanted to play purple lady and not green toddler" is good enough
I liked raiden so much that I spent half of my primos for her c3 + r1 weapon in 2022 and farmed 16 months straight for a good emblem set, her dmg is still absolutely insane but now seeing my c1 Neuv with a 4* weapon doing even more dmg sometimes while also being satisfying to play feels weird
Ouch
i only pull for waifus
@@arceptor my man
@@arceptorNerd 🤓
i got her c2r1 today. after saving for almost a year, i couldn't be happier
if you like her just go for it. I always like her vanilla playstyle and never got bored playing her in years. I enjoy her c2 more on helping random coops, theyre reaction from one shotting everything is hilarious
i think i can relate. I love the vanilla playstyle of Yoimiya and Ayato, i never get bored of it 🥰
Interesting how the changes to the enemies had about as much effect as new gear and character choices
Thanks for the nice calc graphs!
I mean prime example is venti
He is either work very well or complete deadweight depend on what enemy line up they have
You can have my C4 Raiden when you pry her from my cold, dead fingers.
Raiden National is just so synergistic, so easy to play, and still slaps to this day. I genuinely can't imagine going into an Abyss without it.
I've been searching info about how worth It is C2 raiden nowadays now that her rerun is in a few days, i learned so much about this vid and as shes my favourite character ill go for her C2 r1 or possibly c3. Thanks for all the useful information! Great video!!
I went for c2
I have C3R1 and unless against mostly single wave chambers I run Fischl or Yae instead of Sara.
Yes, it's lower overall damage, especially with higher Raiden investment. But, swapping out Sara changes the team damage profile that I prefer for multiwave content (either by having a 2nd nuke via Yae or more consistent dps from Fischl).
As always, sheet calcs is great for optimizing your team but it's not the full story.
I think we’re at the point where if you like the character it can be justified to pull for additional copies or weapon investment to make them better. I personally don’t use my raiden c0 since dendro options are more comfy / less rotation locked. With raiden you have to prioritize doing a rotation in a certain order and then getting everyone back to full energy to do it again, but I also like double hydro raiden teams (even pre-furina I was using yelan/XQ and kuki as last slot just so I don’t have to play circle impact, pretty solid team but probably better now with furina and a burst healer). Nilou teams and alhaitham teams have rotations but are less restrictive / punishing if you mess up the order.
I am really glad that even though she is one of your favourite you went over her downsides and value relative to current roaster
She seems to suffer from similar issues to eula with the energy probalems, overkilling and dps distribution through out rotation like you demonstrated.
honestly the energy problems aren't as bad because you typically build her with 250+ er
energy problems...?
I mean it is only happenes if you overkill the enemise. C0 Raiden should not have this problem, at least this was the pint TGS made.
@@mickysaifnot really the case since some greedy TCs from KQM have been cal'd that in a lot of Raiden teams in sims and sheets she can burst off cooldown with just 180ER lol.
I wish you could talk about chevreuse + C0vs C2 raiden comps too, i personally have c1 raiden and i will go for c2 because i am hunting sara cons and ofcourse chevreuse, its 50-50 so if i loose its good and if i win its even better but yeah i love to see video about raiden chevreuse bennet sara hypercarry comp and ofcourse national raiden but with chevreuse
Thanks, this is the question I have right now because I have Raiden and Nahida C0, and can only get C2 for one of them because I also want to get other characters. Nahida it is then.
I wanna know about how good Nahida C2 is too, also I don't see many people go for Nahida C3 as much as Raiden C3 either, not a big dmg increase I think
@@a-passerbyNahida c3 is pretty worthless as her own damage doesn't contribute that much to overall team DPS. For Nahida you should either go c0, c2 or c6, anything in between is a waste.
@@voii0777 Thx!!
@@voii0777what about furina wats she's best cons
@@supernieva2419 Literally all of her cons are extremely beneficial so there's no bad stopping point. The closest to a bad stopping point she has is probably c5 because her own damage, whilst pretty good, is usually not the focus of the team. For most players, I'd recommend c2 as a general stopping point, but going beyond that is still beneficial.
c1: Improves her buffing capabilities a lot
c2: Makes it so that a non-teamwide healer can max out her buff and nearly doubles her damage
c3: Improves her buffing capabilities a lot
c4: Massively improves ER requirements
c5: Increase her damage a decent amount
c6: Gets rid of the requirement of running a healer in her teams as she is now one (the best one in the game actually). Also allows her to be played as a pretty insane hydro hypercarry.
She isn't worth 400 pulls of course but I got one copy of her on the last rerun and I got one when her banner first ran, so I am getting C2 now because I have a guarantee.
that's the way to go.
Basically same but I’m on a 50/50 😮 hope I win with the pulls I have
@@ShadowStyle369 Good luck with your pulls.
The only thing that’s broken is my heart when I realise she’s not real and not mine 😢
my solo damage went from 98k -> 138k -> 165k with c0r1 c2r1 and c3r1 so id say savinf from the last banner was quite worth it
As a raiden main, she's one of the most overrated units in the game. Don't get me wrong, she's a good character but she's not S tier like nahida or kazuha like some people make it seem. People don't seem to understand that at c0 she's a driver not really a main dps, her damage at c0 is nowhere near actual hypercarries and that's fine bc her role is more of a half on field half off field support/battery/driver. At c2 yeah she's definitely carry level. For me she's an upper A tier
shes SSSS rank for me. i just like her character
Oh she’s definitely s tier
@@Azzywrld224 i wouldn't rank any 5* as S tier aside from nahida, kazuha and yelan. On fielders will always be less valuable as supports and even then alhaitham and neuvilette are objectively better than raiden (who mind you i still wouldn't put in S tier, though neuvi is as close as it gets for an on fielder and i can see an argument made for him)
I think you sound better. 😮
Yeah Raiden has some glaring issues with overkilling units and wasting damage. The initial slash restores 0 energy. So if that deletes the room you start with nothing in the next as you have demonstrated.
I think Raiden teams with other carries work around her issues. For example Raiden + Navia. You don't want to waste a Burst on a low HP enemy but there still too tanky to kill with normal attacks? Use Navia. Or Raiden double Hydro with Yelan, Furina and Jean. That one in terms of energy feel extremely good. I do have a C3 Yelan and C3 Furina. So that is another story here. And C1 Yelan gives another charge. So that alone can help the energy economy so much. So even when I start a round with 0 energy I can still get regain my bursts very quickly. ~Foxfire
I still use my c2r1 Raiden almost every Abyss (and I've recently gone back to using her in overworld with double hydro as well) because despite having her since her first banner, I still enjoy her playstyle. So for me, the extra pulls were definitely worth it (especially since I won the 50/50 twice while pulling c2) but I definitely would not recommend others to pull past c0 unless they feel the same. I might even roll on her new banner and see if I can win the 50/50 for c3.
yeah as much as i love Raiden, she definitely isn’t the best pick for multi-wave rooms in abyss… especially at c2+…
BUT my c2 Raiden is still my go-to DPS pick for bosses/DPS checks in abyss! my fave team for her is a sunfire overvape variation w/ Bennett, Kazuha, and then either Yelan or Xingqiu… but now that Furina has been released sometimes i’ll put her in the hydro slot and swap out Kazuha for Jean to just absolutely delete boss health bars lol ✨
Exactly. Of course she's not gonna be great if used in situations she isn't built for.
Got raiden c0 last year.
Just got her c1 and c2 this banner with 90 pulls! Twas so worth it!
Saving for her weapond noww
Worth up to 270 wishes + 90 energy just to get contested by one skill damage button umbrella warfare
get some game knowledge
Navia is modern day Eula. The random pellet mechanic plus CRIT or no CRIT such a throwback to 1.5
Why is there no talk about raiden national?
I feel the exact same way, and she is my favorite character in the game as well. I started the game the month before her release specifically because I saw her design and she was the first 5 star I ever got. I went all in on her first banner and after failing to reach my goal, I saved for most of inazuma to get her C3 on her rerun in 2.5 and then saving for engulfing lighting in 3.3.
I would say that she in the current meta, she is currently a pretty mid character, no longer so easy to play by comparison to other 5* carries and her utility is pretty niche, because half of her supporting power budget is placed in extra energy recharge, and with the way energy recharge works in the game, you either have enough energy recharge to get your burst back on cooldown, and it becomes your least valuable stat, or you don't, and it skyrockets in value. This means her energy refund only really makes a meaningful difference in your team power if you have an artifact set that trades out a specific amount of energy recharge that Raiden effectively provides, in exchange for offensive substats like crit rate and crit dmg. And, with artifact being the hell that it is, and no artifact loadouts, no sane person would do that.
But I don't regret investing in her because, I was C1 with the Catch for like 5-6 months and that really made me appreciate the power difference that the jump to C3 provided. Those early constellations are necessary if you want to turn her from a niche tool in your toolbox into a swiss army knife for all kinds of content that relies on dps checks. Ever since I pulled her, despite getting a bunch of great new characters since, i have never gone through abyss without being able to find a good use for her in my teams (even if, for a lot of that period, it was on hyperbloom teams). But you should probably make peace with the fact that this isn't the most efficient way to turn your primos into account power anymore, and should only be considered for people who love Raiden and want to make her work.
same I'm still farming emblem since two years to perfect her and this time I'm getting her c2 as f2p, so excited
As a c2 raiden owner i like to replace sara with fish
At c2 level of investment fish is lower damage but in exchange you get a great battery ,sub dps and shield breaker (the team is way more versatile and it feels much better to play too)
I strongly recommend to give this version a shot
(Also this team prevents the overkilling enemies problem in abyss and feels much better in open world since you have a sub dps and battery)
true you can replace sara with fischl or yae in those multi wave situations which tgs mentioned
@@mickysaif i personaly dont like yae because she feels even more cluncky than sara 😅( also you will be forced between losing bennet uptime or using yaes ult unbuffed .
Both feel bad to me)
My top pick is fish because of previoualy mentioned reasons
But yelan or furina feel pretty good too
@@Archerrrrr-jz7iq i disagree. Yae is such an easy character to use. Throw her skill every so often and swap out
@@Archerrrrr-jz7iqYae Mikos skill and burst cool down are more aligned to Raiden. Maybe your rotation is wrong that's why you think Yae is clunky to Raiden.
Yup. Also, not sure how different the dmg even is without Sara's bufff when you also factor in Fischl's dmg is significantly higher than Sara's. Especially on fights like the Tulpa, Fischl just abuses her A4 in that fight.
This is why i use Baizhu instead of bennett.yes i’ll lose a lot of DMG but now I have a perfect rotation that when Ei burst end kazu burst is ready then baizhu then sara + the dmg lost isn’t important cause every thing already dead in the end of rotation any way ✨
I was planning on C2'ing Raiden, then a week ago decided I'm better off C2'ing my Nilou and pushing my C1 Yelan towards C6 every time she reruns. Hopefully I get my C3 Tighnari to C6 in the process as I think he's one of the most fun characters to play.
kinda regret yelans c6 cuz u really dont need that dmg in most cases. Go get her c2 mby and save some pulls trust me...
As a C2 Nilou haver I can say that it was indeed a very good investment. I also have C2 Yelan, and while I don't plan to C6 her, I can only imagine how broken that would be given how strong she already is at C2
@@m.frehmann7373 I'm just at the point in the game where I have a ton of decently built characters and just want to have fun. I haven't really enjoyed Fontaine so far minus picking up Furina :(
@@whyismynametaken123 yeah same, the game is just boring in terms of endgame content. My plan is to get arlecchino and then take a break… . C6 yelan also didn’t saved me from my burnout, that’s why I wouldn’t recommend it :(
@@m.frehmann7373 I felt the same when I received C3 Raiden. after that I can’t play with her outside the abyss. Everyone writes that Neuvillette is stronger and now I doubt whether it’s worth waiting for his rerun. I think this could kill any remaining interest in the combat content in the game.
Finally! Finally someone said it, pointed out the exact flaw of Raiden. I have been telling the same thing since her release but 💩 kids told me how can dealing more nuke dmg be a flaw even after explaining how she generates ER.
If were talking c2 pull value she definitely falls off because her constellation only affects herself, youre better off pulling for c2 nahida since she works with a variety team + your hyperbloom damage is similar to raidens burst (rotation time of course) overall makes the game less boring in the long run
Bro makes no sense 4:18 I would Obviosly never use raiden burst at the end when the enemy hp is like
Lost me somewhere around 3:00 mark. Like you said Raiden is versatile. So then change teams and do different rotation if you are worried about VV not applying on 2nd wave cuz she delete the 1st wave so fast. And how come I didn't see a Dendro/Catalyze/aggravate/hyperbloom showcase on this video? A 100% yes C2 is worth it for me, no drama yes-ish bs answer. Pull for it if you want to it's a good investment. She works so well with so many existing characters. And would be great if she works well on so many future characters🎉🎉🎉
Only Lyney beats her in 8c speed run tournaments in CN. She took home 2nd and 3rd place because her hyper carry team is incredibly strong. Very much meta however they use C3R1 because that 3rd constellation is surprisingly strong but the Lyney has to be C6 to beat that so for value imo raiden hyper carry is one of the Lowest costs for vertical investment in the game since C3R1 is meta instead of C6
I never thought her playstyle was bad i just also never thought her damage was that great because i tired of farming emblem before i got to more reasonable standards for her artifacts.
I wouldn’t mind having her C2 but more so i can enjoy using her when i do, but not going to force myself to get it i just already have C1 last i checked.
Butterfer gets a lot a flack for his hyperbloom vid but on one of his recent streams he actually put it pretty well; C2 Raiden is a strong character. But she's not heads and shoulders above the other DPSes, especially when you do an equal amount of investment in them compared to how you would with Raiden.
Yeah jstern also talks about how people keep comparing c2 raiden to c0 5*s which causes the perceived difference, most characters with either signature or cons compare well with her.
@@luminous3558i mean why would you compair c0 vs c2 in the first place thats just bias tbh
shes still only barely better than c0 alhaitham and c0 hutao with 3-4 star weap with c2r1 investment on shogun.
@@luminous3558 yet her C2 R1 loses if not equal or only slightly better to a C0 Neuv R1, amazing balancing
@@keku52 You missed the part where Raiden has frontload dps and Neuvi doesn't. You have to look at the whole picture and not just one number.
My c0 raiden is still quite fun to play with for both hyper and rational. With the addition of furina her double hydro is a fun comp. She hasnt really fallen off with huge frontloaded dmg, batterying your team and constant onfield electro dmg from e.
The video we've been waiting for! TGS the goat
hol up... wait... vv doesnt work for off field swirls? where on earth is the visibility on this
In genshin if something doesn't literally say that work off field it generally means it doesn't work off field
Wow, this is actually the exact question I've been wondering about for the past week. Great video!
why we are even discussing Hypercarry team? Rational was meta before and it is also meta now. C2 raiden in national teams fixes the lack of single target dps of that team.. making it the most universal team that works for any chamber half of any abyss (with very rare exceptions). And also fixes cases when you kill the wave with her slash without restoring energy , both because her personal damage will be lower than in a hypercarry and because it may be an option just to auto attack with raiden to proc for example xingqiu and vaporize from xiangling... and to burst on next wave.
Even before Fontaine miden simps couldn't understand that ever her C2 can't match C0 Childe or C0 Hu Tao . But now we have Neuvillete , Furina who are better than C6 Miden
i think this is the first time i saw 91K DPS on any team you calced
but yeah there are better characters now that raiden doesn't feel special anymore
tbf he never calcs 9 gold teams
@@coffeemug1012 yeah thats whale territory and he at most calcs C2R1 for characters but it was nice to see how big of a difference the over invested teams do compared to our teams
I get bored with my characters way too fast, so I never invest my hard earn primogems for constellation. I prefer a bunch of C0 5stars characters than a few characters with constellation.
Same. In star rail I invest vertically because difficulty is higher and combat is not as fun for trying out different characters. But in Genshin I just want a new shiny toy every month. I have 23 lvl 90 characters after 2 years of playing
now most c2 we got is one of the best cons for its char. now i feel like the more genshin add new char, the old one will be the least efficient
I can’t wait to finally get her c2. But I agree with your line of thoughts! Times have changed since her first banner.
Most dissapointment his her disability to break shields.
Get 1 copy and call it a day guys. She is still good at C0. I got her only in her 2nd rerun. Raiden changed my account with her versatility. She's not my fav character but still she's a top unit and can help clear abyss. These are some teams I use in abyss and clear 9 stars.
AlH Raiden Nahida ZL
Ayato Raiden Kazuha/Nahida ZL
Raiden Yelan/Fischl Kazuha ZL/Bennett
Raiden Yelan Jean Bennett/Furina
Half those teams would want kuki instead. Raiden is about as flexible as hu tao.
@@luminous3558 why would I need Kuki when I have ZL or Bennett 🤣
Based take I agree, as a c3 raiden haver she is still very strong, but there are a lot of other options out there now that can perform just as well if not better
She still remains a meta in vertical investment.
the last continuous speed run tournament in CN with cash prizes in 8 costs, which is the category with you normally carry with raiden C2-C3 remained the second best DPS with front charge damage according to the chinese players.
her traditional hyper raiden is still best team with a ton of time by far compared to other variants, so if you go pull for raiden C2-C3 you will too need sara C6 for her best team.
The good thing is that Sara always come with the Raiden banners, so you'll end up getting her c6
Just a question but how do u NOT HAVE MAX STAMINA 😭😭
For a c2 character equipped with BiS 5* weapon...those are some very expensive requirements for those numbers at this point
You are a simp and want to roll for her go ahead but getting constellation just to clear the 12 floor of the abyss its extremely silly
I may not have raiden but I’m getting her so I think my takes are abit valid (correct me if I’m wrong ) raiden is an electro unit and one of the best ones she is viable at c0 but c2 makes her a dps with the addition of dendro reactions which buffs electro units viablility electro is only used for application other than dps so I feel that raiden c2 has fallen of in her role as a dps because of how over tunes the Fontaine units are overtuned as hell so raiden dps has fallen off but raiden as a sub dps hasn’t because dendro is still viable
I will pull for c3 anyway in a few days because i love my hypercarry raiden
Thanks for another great video, TGS!
I have her C0 and compared to Alhaitham or neuvillette she hits like wet noodles
I've always preferred to use Raiden in a dual carry team, rather than as a sole carry. Sole carry Raiden relies too much on her burst and the buffs, and makes how she fuels the team less impactful. When it comes to things like electro-charged and aggravate, there just are better electro options. And I think usage shows this... hypercarry Raiden has never been huge. But give her another DPS to share time with, one that is energy hungry, and ideally some other energy hungry teammates, and you come out ahead. And sure, now you are out a buffer, so your peak isn't as high, but the valley isn't as low anymore either. Basically, if the team that has Raiden doing direct damage (as opposed to triggering blooms) doesn't want Raiden's energy regen , why is it even bothering with Raiden?
She feels really strong
Its just that new character are very strong.
I use raiden with furina and its so easy to clear abyss with.
Never saw the hype of Raiden C2 and never will. Character's like HuTao and Ganyu feel more rewarding to to pull off correctly and do more damage. Raiden's a good as a Eula support or hyperbloom unit - that's it.
video isn't wrong, but also the new dungeons are designed to allow new units to shine. she still has one of the best designs in the game too, that's hard to beat.
I have found Raiden C2 Nahida, Furina, Jean(or Kazuha if you don't need to heal) , just as powerful as any other team for her and is way more comfortable imo My Raiden is at C0 btw.
Nahida & Furina c2>Raiden c2>>>>>>>>>Zhong & Venti c2
I played since 1.0, then when raiden come out i played her with bennet and xiangling for soo long, then i realise that childe internasional just better in any aspect. So i stop playing her till now
As a dolphin, I barely use my Raiden but she's so pretty she'll probably be the 1st 5* I will C6 just for the sake of.
As a hypercarry she is basically an buffed electro Eula, which is not necessarily a good thing, and as a hyperbloom trigger she is only slightly better than Kuki in some comps
I got won TWO 50/50 in a row within 45 wishes so now I have her C2 since I already pulled for her and her weapon her last banner 🎉❤🎉❤🎉 feeling so lucky
6:19 Jean doing 1% damage in Double Hydro, what is that comp 😭
Honestly yeah, my biggest issue with Raiden is that she relies on doing her autoattacks to recharge her energy-hungry ult. Her damage being frontloaded is great, but it does have the downside of making it difficult to recharge her if she overkills enemies. Still, I think Raiden is plenty strong even at C0 (I have no cons on any limited characters and Arlecchino is the only one who MIGHT change that) even if there are other hypercarries that are stronger and easier to use now. The important thing is that she can clear Abyss, and she definitely can.
Raiden gets her energy very fast even without a burst so its very easy to get her burst even without a fav user😊
Cope
@@sydorovich2532skill issue
@@sydorovich2532 Help I'm not coping just fax girl she may have 90er cost but it looks like a 50 cost burst
C2 Raiden will only ever fall off for me when both sides are immune to electro or something.
She's been clearing every Abyss for me since her debut, and her side is always quite easy. Always having full energy back as long as she gets to finish her combo. And her ER refill to the team makes rotation smooth. Also interruption resistance even in the face of consecrated beasts.
Number-wise, maybe she's less impressive than some, but I found her whole kit to be well thought-out and strong.
Should add that I do NOT think you should pull her C2 for power if you don't care or like her as a character.
I'm happy I invested in constellations for other characters, like Nahida and Furina, because they don't just amplify their own damage but the rest of the team's as well. This means that more than just hyper teams can benefit from this investment: Nahida's C2 shreds defence in quicken teams, gives a straight up 20% dps increase to all bloom reactions (burgeon, hyperbloom, and even Nilou bloom teams), and getting Furina to C2 increases both the floor and ceiling of her buff while at the same time making it way easier and faster to reach her ceiling ON TOP of also increasing the base damage of her own skill by buffing her own max hp.
Raiden C2 is better for funny screenshot numbers, but Nahida and Furina constellations can make a lot of teams feel way stronger.
Her damage isn’t just the screenshot though. People forget that it’s spread over a 7-9 second duration. The initial damage is high, but as per what TGS said, the other subsequent damage is apart of the kit. You miss out not only in damage . But you don’t get any energy generation neither.
Couldn't Chevreuse make her more competitive going forward?
No... Xianyun could have if her buff worked on raidens burst form plunges since it's considered burst damage and Xianyun buffs Plunge damage she doesn't recieve this very good buff.
That's why I prefer playing my C2 on Raiden National than Raiden hypercarry for abyss. The team is boring after years of playing it, but it's a nice backup team for when my new fave character can't 36-star the current abyss yet.
Yeah, I already got her c3. And now is the perfect moment to get her weapon since both weapons will be usable fot my acc
Idk if yall just don't know how to cycle your rotations but my c2 r1 Raiden is easily my most trusted character ever. The is pretty much no abyss I don't use her national or hyper carry team in 🤷♀️
Got 3 copies of Raiden with 160 pulls, no regrets here but man I got lucky. Now hoping to C6 Sara and Chev
General mahamatra is great but still can't surpass raiden so i think even if chlorinde come as champion duelist she also can't, the kagemusha of makoto is going to stand alone..
PLS compare all the c2 of archons!!!! NAHIDA , Furina n Raiden!!!
Furina's is best, Nahida is 2nd and Raiden is last. Same would go for account value.
Nhaida still best.
@@JoaoGabrielSVaz Nope her c2 is specified to Dendro teams only that too with transformative reactions. While as furina buffs everything except transformative.
I have Nahida , Neuvillette and Alhaitham
And C2R2 Raiden Shogun (she is my favourite and I got lucky on her pulls) , I Think this video is exaggerated. If you make a video like this about every character, all of them will have some flaws (I mean obviously, they need to balance the game right)
Overall the fact that,
1) Her E is so freaking useful for elemental rxns
2) Her burst does crazy damage and refunds your other party members burst while having an interruption resistance
Just make her amazing to play
Also her C2 is literally the best constellation ingame , or one of the best , I think that’s something everyone agrees on
It's not the character's fault hoyo plays chess with people in order to make them pull for new characters that "work" better against problems they create.
May i ask what id the best electro hypercarry at this date?
I think you should have mentioned that every on-fielder considered better than her like Alhaitham, Neuvillette or Navia also happen to be able to split their field time and can freely swap off or on. For units like Itto or Scara who can apply res shred from via resonance and Faruzan respectively, it's not an issue to follow this playstyle. But for her, it is a bigger detriment than overkilling.
I did 20 pulls on her banner to get chevreuse and got her c2 and no chevreuse
7:44 Is there any other way to see more of these damage graphs? Like a website for example
there is the gcsim site, but is a bit complex to use, but you can see how much damage each character does, and all of that
@@viva862 thx
for me, a 40% dps increase in the best case scenario on my c0 raiden non furina/rational teams would just allow me to 1 rotate a boss instead of needing 2 rotations, not a priority for me
im still gonna try to get chevy though lol
Cheverous Bennet and Sara with Raiden works better you get the double pyro 25 percent atk increase and the double electro and hella survival because Bennet and cheverous heals lol
Thanks for explaining the meta during Raiden's release. I started playing in 2023, didn't like her play style, and didn't understand why many content creators say she's a good pull.
Her burst is too short and she spends time chasing after staggered enemies. Wanderer felt more comfortable spamming NAs, with much less party utility of course.
Now compared to Hu Tao, Ganyu & Ayaka play styles, I see why Raiden is so popular.
Raiden > Wanderer
Idk how you can compare a polearm to a catalyst tho
The issue is not that people think raiden is broken at C2 and above, the issue is that people mostly think she's a useless dps at C0 which honestly I don't think it's very true, personally I had a lot of fun with C0 either hypercarry or other teams but still I prefer more characters over constellation
That's why Xiangling overload is the answer
I'm going for her C2. I love her and im comfortable with the characters I have anyway and I want to shower her with the best. I like to play with her and i have fun to do so.
If i could, I would've given back my Neuvillette for her C3. Is Neuvillette strong? Yes but so boring that he's benched. Even Alhaitham who I used to like is benched because I now rather use Tighnari, I love his team with Miko/Nahida/Zhongli.
In the end, if it clears the abyss when I feel like playing it, I'm happy. The only constellation I'm considering is also C2 Furina because, again, I love her.
And I'm still skipping Hutao, Yelan, Kazuha and Navia. I would give back my Neuvillette and Alhaitham is benched. But what matters is to play with those we have fun with, right?
People who only care about big numbers and having the best are the ones who will slowly fall off in love with the game because there's nothing much left to enjoy but be a slave to the numbers.
I never liked Hypercarry Raiden, so my team is C2 Raiden, Yae, Kazuha and Baizhu, with as strong results as Alhaitham Hyperbloom or Neuvilette Hypercarry
Have her since 2.1 unfortunately didn't get her naginata in every re run but it's not escaping this time. 40k+ primos ready to be dumped. If I'm left with something then going for cons. Idgaf if she does 3 dmg I'll max out my Goddess.