Tiger Heli M2 (Toaplan Garage) In-Depth Review - PS4 and Nintendo Switch
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- Опубліковано 6 лис 2021
- Tiger Heli M2 (Toaplan Garage) In-Depth Review - PS4 and Nintendo Switch. It is time for another M2 ShotTriggers Shoot em' up (shmup) review and this year's release is Kyuukyoku Tiger Heli (or Twin Cobra) by Toaplan! This has been expected ever since we learned that M2 gained the license to a lot of Toaplan STG and has been planning a shmup collection. The question of today's video is how well does M2 ShotTriggers deliver? Is this release up to the studio's high standards with previous releases like Ketsui DeathTiny, Battle Garegga Revision 2016, Esp Ra. De. Psi, or Dangun Feveron? As usual I go in depth and talk about not only the games included in this release, but also all the extra features that M2 include like leaderboards, replays, arcade challenge, save states, input lag reduction, custom mode, and an odd puzzle game Teki-Paki (which reminds me of Mean Bean Machine on the Sega Genesis ha).
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#nintendoswitch, #tigerheli, #review - Ігри
From what I know so far, the biggest reason they are releasing them game by game like this, is mainly due to the amount of work involved to properly reverse engineer these Toaplan boards versus a quick and dirty emulation. Apparently almost nobody knows how to work on them, and there is one person that has the knowledge to do it. So there is a time and cost associated with doing every single game/board one at a time. I totally get how most just want a big collection with all the games to feel it's worth the price, but from a cost of labor standpoint it would be impossible to ever recoup the expense. At least in terms of how M2 is painstakingly approaching each game and board, which is of course what we want and expect from them. I agree that the Aleste Collection was a better value proposition due to the brand new GG3 game included. That was likely the bulk of their expense on that collection. If they did that for every game, or let's say 4 games at a time, they'd have to charge hundreds of dollars per release to recoup that cost based on expected sales which wouldn't make sense either. So they likely decided to go one series at a time, and try to sweeten the package by adding the ports as well as unique and exclusive old Toaplan games like Teki Paki and Guardian here. I honestly have no idea if this will work out for them, and if they will sell enough to continue releasing them this way or abandon it if sales are poor, but that's my take on why it's being done this way. Doing a big collection all at once while reverse engineering the boards like this isn't feasible as it'd take them a few years longer and it would release at an unreasonable price point, with the amount of labor involved to do it. So I get it. On top of that, they are also big fans of Toaplan, and likely close with both Uemura-San and Yuge-San as well as other ex-Toaplan staff. So they are excited to help do each one of these series justice, highlight them, and release a product that the developers would be proud of. Basically make each series a big deal versus slapping them all together into a big package. A lot of us older "dad shmuppers?" lol appreciate our favorites being celebrated in this way. Just as you younger whippersnappers would love to see each Cave release have it's own special package, like Ketsui got one, versus just having every Donpachi slapped into one big collection and calling it a day.
But what I am disappointed about, and agree with you on, is that Twin Cobra did not get the same treatment as Kyu Tiger in terms of gadgets, as it deserves it. Many even prefer that version for the faster chopper and gameplay and it's the legit arcade release, not a port. So if they are going to go all out and do each series justice, that's an oversight in my mind. Likely due to money or time constraints but we can only guess. My other gripe I share with many others, as much as I love M2 as you do, is their unwillingness to put much effort into anyone but their Japanese base. To not release them internationally, even if delayed, at least digital only if the physical doesn't make sense, is confounding. They know there is an english speaking audience for their games, so to not include English menu options, while also not doing US releases is disappointing. I'm 100% behind their business decision to do this collection one series at a time if that's what makes sense financially. Time will tell if it flops and they have to change strategy or not. And I'm thrilled we will (hopefully) get a Truxton and Outzone/Fixeight collection one day, along with Dogyuun. All games that DO NOT have arcade perfect ports out there, unlike Batsugun which already is amazing on Saturn and includes the special version. You can add Grind Stormer/V-V to that list of arcade perfect ports I'm excited for. But it always bums me out that they have such a large international audience asking for their games that are treated as more of an afterthought. It's how things were in the 90s where we got the scraps from Japan and had to hound import shops for the full experience. And I don't believe any of it is malicious, so there is no reason for ire. But I definitely plan to do my best to communicate this through any channels I manage to find, including in future videos I make for their games too, to try and make their international audience more of a priority.
absolutely, I definitely do appreciate the approach the ShotTrigger team take with their releases and I do think they did a lot of great work on this release as usual. Overall, just as a buyer and consumer, I think with this release they might have sliced the potential audience a bit too thin aiming at the combination of players who take the genre seriously and are willing to pay full price (I am def in this group) that are also big fans of these early toaplan games (which I'm less in this group personally). If I were to advise the shottriggers team I would say that rather then making this a tiger-heli themed release, what might have worked better was to make it a toaplan shmup collection volume 1 and then include one of the heavy hitter titles in the release, just to fortify the value of the package. I think if they had this exact release, but also included something like a Truxton or outzone or something along these lines it would have worked better. I didn't mean to imply that I wanted them to go full capcom stadium and try to put all the toaplan games in one release ha. What is probably going to happen is that if they continue in this small slice model is that they are going to have pretty uneven fan response where some releases are going to get passed over and other releases that include the heavy hitter titles are going to be much stronger. This is probably where I divide off from other shmup fans but I don't think these early shmups, as important as they are, hold the same value as later shmups even in the toaplan library because the later shmups are just stronger releases that really hit the stride of the genre. So I think a smart strategy would be to make sure to pair these early games alongside at least one later release to add more value. it's a tricky balance, that's for sure.
@@TheElectricUnderground You’re definitely right on in terms of splitting the audience and possible uneven response. So I hope it ends up worthwhile for them to release them one way or another. I’m sure Tatsujin will get a good response along with their newer fare. I just hope games like Outzone and V-V do well as they’re both fantastic and some of my favorites of theirs. Knowing they are doing Sky Shark and Same3 next I guess those are still farther down the list.
@@ShmupJunkie I'm looking forward to these releases as well! I think what it going to happen is that the later they get into the toaplan library they are probably going to have stronger sales ha. Maybe they will start to beef up the releases a bit as well, it will be interesting to see what they do, let's just hope it doesn't take a year per release, that would be crazzy (with two z's).
Slap Fight and V-Five should be bundled together because they both play similar with the Gradius style power bar. I would assume V-Five is Slap Fight's sequel .
I remember seeing people begging for a Toaplan collection for years on Shmups. The games deserve respect, they're pivotal in the history of the genre and they seem to have got the respect they deserve with this. I know they seem a little archaic, but we're talking about 1984/5 when the coolest games at the time were Road Fighter, Commando, Green Beret, 1942, Gradius, Ghosts n' Goblins, Bank Panic, Choplifter, Skykid, SMB, Exciting Hour and Pacland. So think of them in that context.
I just hope they receive the support they deserve from the players so we can get the rest of Toaplan's frankly fantastic catalogue.
Thanks for the review. It seems pretty on point, for the most part. Wanted to point out (I see some other commenters added this) - the Switch physical release I have of this (mine I got from PlayAsia) included the DLC games without an additional separate cost. I'm sure the game itself was costly, I don't keep track of what it costs from PlayAsia but anyway, it was nice to see all of it included. We got the DLC code for the Nintendo store to get that little puzzle game. I like (to one degree or another ) ALL shmups so I don't nitpick perhaps as much as you did, this is a solid collection of games I remember from the arcade in the late 80's/early 90's and I also remember the ports on my NES & Genesis. They DO seem a bit dated, but for some of us older fans, dated is OK, it brings us back. :-D
Good review mate, your way of breaking this down is great
thanks my dude! This one was a tricky one to review but I wanted to try and give a fair perspective where it is a solid product, but maybe not one that fits all shmup fans as tiger heli and twin cobra are more in the classic shmup style.
Loved the dig at Ikaruga puzzlers at the end.
the opportunity was too good to pass up :-)
Finally, a review that we NEED!
thanks my dude! :-D
Toaplan Forever! …. that is all I got to say.
Had this a couple of weeks - no regrets at all in buying it - digging the different versions as well ...
Twin Cobra - Famicom, PC Engine, Mega Drive, NES
Tiger Heli -
Famicom, NES, Genesis
Get Star Arcade - Japan and International
All above are on the Card ...
The puzzle game is a download - not played it yet.
It's a lot of similar overall and was never going to be M2s most spectacular release - but the ports are all pretty cool imo and are worth playing casually.
I actually enjoyed this release more than I thought I would.
GetStar is quirky and i do appreciate it's inclusion.
I'd give the value a 6/10 and the games overall an 8/10.
Gotta love that cover art and i sincerely hope we get more similar releases soon.
Cool vid Mark.
♥️🕹
I think you hit the nail on the head. At the end of the day, even as someone who loves classic/retro shmups I can't get behind dropping this cash on tiger heli and twin cobra. It's one thing if they're included in a collection with a lot of games (like Darius cozmic or SNK 40th) but on their own I'm not a big fan.
I'll just be sitting here waiting for Batsugun....
Completely agree, it's too much cash for just an ok and very dated shooter. I'm loving the new R Type game and all its DLC content, but Tiger Heli is a hard pass.
Yeah I can definitely respect the work shottriggers put in on this release, just the games themselves don't catch me as essential material like many of the other m2 releases
The huge problem here, as I understand it -- and I might be misunderstanding entirely because I don't have a JP account, although really should set one up for Esprade and GG Aleste -- is that you can't buy games a la carte, piece meal. I know they're releasing Hishouzame next year which has me hyped... but I don't see myself playing Same Same Same for longer than half an hour. So like, just allow me to buy Hishouzame and that's it.
@@blossom357 yeah it's super weird... And it's funny because I'd probably pay a decent price for a pack that included those "80s toaplan military shmups" as one package but the way they're selling these is so odd.
I think it also just hurts knowing it'll be years before we get to the truly great Toaplan stuff...
@@GojiGuy Eh, Hishouzame is every bit as good as Batsugun. I do wonder what else you consider "truly great" outside of that one, though. Tatsujn/Ou? Zero Wing? V-Five? Out Zone and FixEight are pretty nice but I feel like most people who watch this channel would disregard them as "not shmups" so not sure if you meant those.
I don't own this collection but from owning all the console versions on real hardware, i'd say PC Engine "Kyuukyoku Tiger" is the variation most worth paying the extra for and potentially just as enjoyable as the arcade, it's more accessible due to slower enemy fire, looks & plays excellent and offers a significantly different experience with a 4:3 interpretation of the game with imho a superior rendition of the music compared to the arcade.
Yeah the console ports sound pretty cool, it's a shame they weren't included in the base package, or at some of them, or allowing for them to be bought individually.
I cant wait for your City Connection Deathsmiles review. That's my E3. 😁
I m both excited and nervous ha. I hope they deliver this time!
Not gonna lie, that Ikaruga joke hit me hard! Thumbs up for that.
Next years release is going to be a sky shark/fire shark collection according to nintendo life.
Let us hope this isn t going to take another year! That would be crazy
@@TheElectricUnderground think they said this spring on their last livestream!
@@TheElectricUnderground Im calling this. Performan, Ghox, Knuckle Bash, Snow Bros, Pipi & Bibis, Rally Bike, Wardner as future DLC filler games.
Awesome channel, and this guy, is a shooting PURIST 💪
Thanks my dude!!! ❤️
Excited for Twin Cobra! I have a jpn PCB and I remember bringing it to a shmups meet and friends that were getting URA loop of Ketsui struggled to get past 3rd level where I can't play Ketsui for shit managing to sail through level 6 of Twin Cobra. No rapid fire on my PCB so its a test of endurance and it's a double decker behemoth so this will be a welcome addition to the horde. Not going to bother with the DLC ports or probably Tiger Heli for that matter.
That s me for sure ha. I m pretty good at bullet hell these days and some manic shooters, but classic shmups tend to beat me down pretty good ha
So I got the game today. I wasn't liking Tiger Heli either but it was pretty fun once I switched to Arcade Custom and switched some of the options. I’ll do a full translation of the Custom Settings with recommendations.
ゲイム難易度設定 (Game Difficulty Setting) Put this on Rank D Very Hard
プレイヤー数設定 (Player Stock Setting)
エクステンド設定 (Extend Setting) 万 means 10,000
自機の移動速度 (Player Ship’s Movement Speed)
I like the second fastest 大幅に速い
当たり判定の縮小 (Hitbox Reduction)
recommend shrinking it all the way
ゲイム周回形式 This simply toggles between endless mode or 1 Loop mode
リトルヘリの耐久力 (Little Heli Stamina) 発 is a counter for shots and the last option is unlimited, I think 3 is a good setting
ボンバー発動時の無敵設定 (Bomb Invulnerability Time Setting)
オートボンバー (Auto Bomb) On/Off I leave this off, I think you still auto bomb if your bombs get shot they seem to actually have their own hitboxes
敵弾封じ設定 (Bullet Sealing Setting) On/Off Really recommend leaving this off, anything close to you will not shoot the game was not designed for this
敵弾上限設定 (Enemy Bullet Upper Limit Setting) 16/10/4/1/AUTO leave this at 16
ビッグタンク耐久度設定 (Big Tank Stamina Setting) 20/10/5/AUTO leave this at 20
*AUTO setting: This scales certain settings based on your ship and bomb count making the game easier if your resources are low
*Some settings say they only work on Loop 1
I forgot to explain "Enemy Bullet Upper Limit Setting", this is a hard cap on the number of enemy projectiles on screen at once. This game is slow enough, so that's I was said to leave it maxed. I wish they would have added a setting for 20 or 24.
Awesome!! Great tips! Yes I think custom mode is a big highlight
Hi Mark, can you explain the 30hz, 20hz, 15hz options on the rapid fire a bit more, I am unfamiliar with that. is it Just the rapid fire rate?
oh sure so the hz is how fast the autofire rate goes. In most cave games this doesn't matter because cave caps the fire rate in their game code (so 15hz is usually fine). But in old school shmups this rate control is important because of the shot limit. So if you have a 30 hz fire rate, the shots all cluster together like this
- - - XXX - - -
which is good if you are super close and point blanking, but if you are far away it kinda sucks. Whereas a 15 hz autofire will have the bullets more spread out like this
- - X - - X - - X which is much better for screen coverage far away. Ideally having both autofire rates on your stick is good because you can point blank with 30 but screen control with 15hz.
I'm old enough to remember Tiger Heli and 1942 when they were new, so while Tiger Heli might not be a big deal to younger players - it was a big deal to me and people of my age group. Like 1942 it was an important game of its time. I think M2 intended exactly what it says on the box - it's Ultimate Tiger - Heli. You get every possible version of Tiger Heli and its sequel Ultimate Tiger which fit the Shot Triggers remit, and a bonus Toaplan action game - Get Star which was a classic in its own right where I'm from.
The main problem for me is that the Western version of Ultimate Tiger - Twin Cobra (the game I'm used to) doesn't have M2 Gadgets and it's the version with respawns.
Also, if you press square in the settings you can change the auto-fire rate to something slower and more constant that's better compatible with the game.
I'll never play the consumer versions, but I don't really care. It's the definitive version of these games which is why they were included..
Teki Paki is supposedly M2's in office favourite and they chucked it in for free.
When it was announced M2 got the rights to Toaplan's back cat I thought it would be one of M2's shittier efforts tbh - like the recent half-assed Konami collections, so I'm glad it went this way.
The next one is Flying Shark/Same! Same! Same! - so that's likely to be the same - those 2 games accompanied by one of Toaplan's non STGs like Demon's World or Snow Bros perhaps, or Wardner.
I love Flying Shark still, so I'm definitely up for the next one.
Eventually they'll get to the more recent stuff.
Oh sweet Jesus, please not Wardner. God help us. I would settle for Same Same Same, and maybe a horizontal shooter of the era. I really think they would make everyone happy by putting truxton 1 & 2 on a disc.
Fuck Wardner. Although it struck me funny that the main characters sprite kind of looks like Eric Cartmen at a renaissance fair
@@opaljk4835 Wardner's great and generally regarded a classic.
Future Skeletons by whom? I’m not exactly impressed by a general consensus on anything. My experience is that it’s terribly tedious and charmless. I only have the mega drive version though. Maybe it’s a masterpiece in the arcade and in the nes, but somehow I doubt it.
Agree. Though I like the later Toaplan and Cave even more, I really love this package, but the console ports are a must have else, it feels to limited indeed (specially if it costs 40 digitally without the console ports). Bought the physical release on the Switch (amazon JP). Overall I think the complete package it worth the price.
Playing Tiger Heli after Battle Garegga feels like taking a break, but in a fun way. Little bit calm/relaxed. That said, I like Tiger Heli better then 1942 to be honest. From a historic perspective, it plays really well, specially considering it's one of their earlier games and their first shmup(?). Have no memories of Get Star, but it was probably nice in the arcade, though it plays a little bit sluggish for me, comparing it to KungFu Master. Still, it's nice that both arcade versions are added as a bonus. Also historically, if it wasn't added, most people (me included) would probably never have played it. Will probably come back to it.
TwinCobra is a blast. Also the PCEngine and Genesis version truly rock.
One thing I agree with The Electric Underground, it they keep up releasing these games in this way, it will probably take a long time (10 years?) before M2 finishes the Toaplan library....
@@opaljk4835 It's an arcade platformer of its time. I like it, the magazines that covered Arcade games liked it. Lots of people that aren't you liked it. Be more rational.
So if you have the physical copy on ps4 from Japan you only get the arcade ports?
Good question, I m not sure
Does the physical have the console ports??? It was over $90 AUD so i really hope so!!!
the physical does have the console ports, they are in a dlc card in the case I believe.
You can set the autofire rate the same way as any other M2stg release, you have to press square i believe. Lowest you can go is 10hz though, wish there was a 5hz because of the low on screen shot limit.
I swear I tried this and it didn't allow it this time around, you can do that in garegga and ket but now you just do a controller assign instead. ZPS reported the same problem as well
@@TheElectricUnderground just booted it up on PS4 to double check and you can set the autofire rate on the regular shot with square just not the preset 30hz shot. I think thats the issue unless their is a glitch on Switch or something
@@TheElectricUnderground It definitely works same as in garegga. You need to change the button away from the default 30hz one though to just "Shot" and then do it
@@TheElectricUnderground u need to assign controller to p1 before u can change the autofire rate with square
You have to push square on the regular shot button, not the turbo one.
What I'm hearing is that there's very little wrong with the ports themselves - the problem is just in the selection of games. I think this is covertly one of the most intricate releases they've put together. The handy numerical segmentation of the map screen, for example, is a stroke of genius - an evolution of the more basic map gadgets of previous releases. But yeah, especially if you're not a dadshmupper extraordinaire - looks like you'll be wallowing in dark ages of 80s shumps with M2 for quite some time.
It might be less of a wait than you think. With the Hishou Same! Same! Same! collection slated for this upcoming spring, it looks like their development/release cycle will hopefully accelerate, so Batsugun and such may be closer than we know.
Yeah that is a good summary of my thoughts. I think they have done good work, but I think if they were able to beef up the release with at least one bigger title like a Truxton or an outzone, if would have really helped justify the pricetag more. Or even in they included some meaty arranges that made the games play a bit more modern that would have helped as well.
Great video. Is the input lag lower than playing it on MAME? Is there any real benefit to this version over emulation? Or is it more for physical collectors and to support the developer? Recently I realised how off Saturn emulation was, input lag wise, when I beat Strikers 1945 and the final stage alone took me around 6 hours to memorize. The lag was so bad I couldnt really react to what was going on. Playing through the PS1 version it was much easier with the better emulation. Hopefully saturn emulation improves. I havent noticed that on MAME but I dont have the original PCB's either to compare. Gun.Smoke was brutal and felt very responsive when I completed it, on MAME.
I would say the lag is pretty similar to mame, maybe slightly lower (didn't bust out the lag tester on this one) but I would say that the biggest selling points versus mame are the online leaderboard and custom mode. The gadgets are pretty cool too :-)
@@TheElectricUnderground Nice. Yea that makes sense. An online leaderboard is a huge upgrade. That made the mission mode in Ninja Gaiden Black even more addictive back then.
For me, I'm absolutely loving twin cobra and tiger heli on custom and super easy!
I know it's not for everybody, but I'm loving both so far for what they are and for me a nice palette cleanser after the bullet hell cave/raizing shmups I've been playing lately
Get star is utter garbage though lmao but still quite a laugh.
Yes, I think if you into these two specific releases, i do think m2 were able to justify the price tag with all the extras, though I do think the dlc might have been a bit steep.
5:15 What is Exedra? I can't find that shooter.
Oh I meant etc :-) as in and so on
Does the physical release include all the content or is DLC still extra? Sorry if I missed this but I listened to the entire video seemed like the digital version was mentioned here. I love the content, keep it up. I’m finding lots of value in your videos and I appreciate your view on SHMUP’s & Arcade sticks.
Yes, physical version includes dlc :-) also thanks for tuning in!!! I m glad you are enjoying the vids
Yeah, it looks like they used the bulk of their resources making the arcade challenge menus (I love how they make it so visual - savestate menus don't work as well for me) and porting the console versions for this collection. I think they made the digital version with just the arcade ports a bit cheaper than usual partly in light of this.
They plan to put out the future toaplan garage releases at a faster pace than before, so it hopefully will be like 2 or 3 sets a year. There are a lot of toaplan games to get through though!
Yes I am hoping the same thing, if they take a year with each release that is going to be brutal for fans ha, I think you are right though they basically built most of the base here in this 1st release
Sorry if i say something dumb, but i found the codes to download the “kinda beat em up” game and the other 2 inferior console ports in the game case, on a paper, i thought was in all the game versions, aren’t they? 🤔
I believe if you buy digitally, the console ports are not included. They are additional paid DLC. PS4 physical version includes everything, but only the arcade games on disc and the rest are download codes. I buy physical and disappointed the console ports are not on the disc😡
Yes those codes are included in the physical release (which costs $65 or so) but if you get the digital release for 40, then you need to buy them as dlc
@@TheElectricUnderground ok sorry i give it as granted that was the fisical release review, my bad
@@nonentity2574 i was disappointed too
PSA in January 2024: This game is now available as a western physical release pre-order on Limited Run Games!
And it looks like its got all the ports/DLC.
@@oogrooq Yes, it’s the complete release :)
I can not seem to access the DLC menu when i insert the cd in my ps5. anyone having this issue?I can play the arcade no way to enter the dlc menu
I don't believe I bught the dlc, so I'm not sure what to do.
@@TheElectricUnderground does it give you the option to buy it?
God I want to support this I really do but with Deathsmiles and mushi physical it's almost impossible..... Plus I think M2 needs to make some releases "budget" releases, this being one of them.
Yeah I think in this case they hit a bit of an odd middle ground where the porting job might be more impressive then the source material ha. Maybe they should have thrown in one more big hitter like truxton just to help support the price tag
@@TheElectricUnderground honestly they should make the older toaplan games into a collection and make games like truxton and batsugun full "full price" releases.
@@joltzyclayton8674 Idk... Why would the OG Truxton or Batsugun be worth a full price release as opposed to Kyukyoku Tiger in your opinion? For me they are at the same level, worth the same price, whatever that may be (I wish they were cheaper as well though, at least if they don't include an arrange mode).
All of them are old games, their ports don't require finicky slowdown management or complex scoring systems that have to be carefully treated, so I think worth it or not is just a matter of personal preference :)
I would pay full price for each of these games on PC. But I really cba to play them on my console (although I do have M2's big releases, I just don't play them cos my PC is more convenient)
Which M2 staffer do I need to kidnap to get some PC ports already?
no kidding! It is a shame they seem to shun pc
+1 , give me more shmups on PC
@@TheElectricUnderground I lit can't think of a reason beyond a fear of piracy or something.
But I don't think that's actually a big deal for these types of games, fans of the genre are more likely to support it.
Hell I'd even pay for it in Japanese.
Further, my switch is banned from connecting online, so I would be forced to pirate them if I didn't have other options (I actually buy a copy for my wife's switch, and just play a pirated copy on mine)
Im a child of the 80's arcade so this collection is perfect for me. I bought the physical from amazon jp and it came with everything included, cost me about £65 which is very expensive, definitely a collection for those that love these games. In general I would take a more barebones port if it meant a cheaper price, faster turnaround and an increased player base.
I'll be honest, if it wasnt part of the shottriggers range I probably wouldn't have given it a single thought.
However I'm glad I did cos I'm so far loving the simplicity and balls to the wall challenge of both Tiger heli and twin cobra; a nice change of pace from the usual bullet hell shmups I've been playing lately
@@whatamalike They are classic games for sure. Many of the gameplay features found in these games were and are implemented in more contemporary shooters. Stone cold classics like Raiden owe a lot to Tiger Heli which released years earlier.
@@ThatGamingGuyfromthe70s yeah Toaplan are certainly very important to the development of the genre and outside of truxton and zero wing I knew little to none of their work until recently
Glad I do now though 😀
Yeah I think the game selection was just a bit too thin, I think if they added truxton or something it would have been easier to recommend
@@TheElectricUnderground Its definitely an easier collection to recommend if you have the nostalgia for them like I have.
Agree with the evaluation overall. I feel they could have easily moved this and the coming Fireshark/Flying Shark together. They all share similar military theme. 4 games would have made it more in line with Aleste Collection in terms of value. It's still ok though. I don't think we are only going to be getting 1 Shottriggers per year, I predict we will get 3.(2 this year with Aleste Collection and Tiger Heli) Next one is confirmed for Spring (Flying Shark/Fireshark). Then there are a minimum of 2 more Toaplan Shottriggers after that. (Tatsujin Oh, Outzone). Maybe they can get those out of the way by the end of 2022. Guessing we will also be getting another Aleste Collection and whatever other Aleste projects they are working on.
Hope they at least give us Batsugun soonish. 2023 maybe.
That is a great idea! I think merging together with firshark or by having a volume where they include one of the bigger titles with these early titles, like a truxton or outzone, would have really helped.
Even though it's not branded as shottriggers, we also got G-Darius HD this year which is M2 and has a lot of gagdets, save states, etc. So it's -almost- like we got 3 this year! ;)
I think once we get past this one and the next one, it’ll be all good. Although Toaplanheads told me Same3 and Hishou are two of their best, so 🤷♀️ It’s a bummer that I have to wait so long for them to get to games i’m really interested in, but M2 gonna M2. Can’t tell me Truxton and Outzone won’t be exciting. Sometimes Criterion’s just gonna release classics because they’re classic.
Yes exactly ha! I think later releases are going to be pretty sweet!
twin cobra is the first adding the three color power ups. Classic the best shooter in a 2 player mode
So cool that they put Ikaruga in there, even though that's not even a Toaplan game!
I know that is the real secret weapon of this collection!
Kyukyoku Tiger II wouldve been nice to include on this. That Saturn game goes for a million bucks.
I was going to post the same. I have a burnt copy and love it.
Also, Outzone is one of the games that they will re-release too. (Not sure) i want to see how it looks like with M2 gadgets. ^^
Oh snap I m looking forward to that! I hope it s soon and not Nov 2022 ha
What is this “shmup” you keep referring to???
You are in luck because I have a whole video about this question: ua-cam.com/video/PqQOUVhakb4/v-deo.html
I love Toaplan games so I already bought a copy of the game. As always m2 kills it with the ports but this bundle doesn’t feel at par with the previous releases. With Aleste we got a brand new game which upped the anticipation for this release but when I compare it to the others the “only” thing this release lacks is a great game. What I mean is that the port of two arcade games and ALL console ports is a really good deal and compared to, for example, ESP rade it’s a really good bundle, but ESP Rade feels more valuable as a game I guess.
Anyway let’s hope they bring out these Toaplan games quicker than one a year so we can play Truxton 2 and then get on with Batrider!
My feelings exactly 👍
Maybe do a video on the best "simple shmup." Or as I like to call them "proto shmup"... (well, maybe come to think of it "proto shmup" would be something like Asteroids or Space Invaders)? What do we even call these older shmups? They're obviously simple (as in "basic") as hell and different from what we normally think of as shmups these days. Anyways, it's hard to get too into these but some hold a soft spot in my heart. For me it's Life Force on NES, but it's probably more a nostalgia thing than the inherent play value.
I need to make a video about Galaga for sure! It has a warm place in my heart as well ha.
I really hope to have back the "magic touch of M2" for Hishou Same! Same! Same!... let's hope.... 😞
Nice video, but I never was a "big fan" of Tiger Heli...
Loved Tiger Heli in the arcade. This would be nice but I'm not a big enough fan to justify the spend. It's possibly not fair to expect more from M2 for games this old. There isn't as much one can do with the older ones.
yes for sure, I do think if they dropped in a truxton or an outzone it would have beefed up the release.
I agree.
I did experience some strange slowdown that was definitely not deliberate. Maybe only once or twice per play-through, though.
I didn’t really love the games themselves. They were just OK. Tiger Heli was short and sweet, but very basic and the movement speed made it really fustrating later in the game.
Kyuukyoku Tiger got brutally hard quickly, especially if you don’t know to get the blue weapon. Movement speed makes this one even more frustrating, coupled with the power up chasing. Also the colored weapon should be the first upgrade, not 3rd or 4th. Point-blank shooting tanks, kamikaze helicopters, perfect dodging helicopters, enemies coming from behind and jetting out of the sides of the screen suddenly... I felt the game didn’t give you the tools to succeed and want to play more, also it seemed the ability to dodge was stripped away because you can see and react to a bullet a full 2 or 3 seconds a head of time, yet it still hits you no matter what.
I did enjoy it somewhat, but I feel they could have chosen better games likes ones the fans have been wanting proper ports of for a long time.
I have many of the same feelings about the gameplay overall. I appreciate that they allow for some of this stuff to be changed but I do think a proper arrange mode could have really opened up the gameplay.
That puzzle game looks like a proto-Lumines to me. Hope M2 decide to release a Tatsujin compilation in the next year or so. Wonder if they will do 1 and 2 separately or together 🤔. Assume they would have the PCE and Megadrive versions of the first one and the Marty version of the second one included (or DLC 😠). I have heard their next release is Flying Shark tho, so we will see.
Yeah here's to hoping the next release has a bit more assortment of games, tiger heli is cool but at this pace it might be a while before they are done with the toaplan games.
Holy shit you musta really stepped in it with this review. The entire comments section is filled with essays the length of War and Peace.
Ha just a more complicated review I think :-)
You did not check the Square button in the settings...
You complained that the auto fire is only 30Hz, but in fact this is just a quick setting, you can choose a Shot button then push the Square button to select plenty of different speed from 12Hz to 30Hz
I did indeed! It was not available when I completed my review, ZPS also messaged me about this when the game initially released. I show in the video me pressing square on the previous m2 release Battle Garegga, so I was aware of this feature.
@@TheElectricUnderground I see that my version is at v1.02 that could be a feature they implemented later in an update.
I think what the Shottriggers team is doing is showing respect toward Toaplan. That's how they treat these games with care, this wasn't my favorite release they did. But it was one of the first shooter's they did it needed what they did here.
Make sure you play Kyuukyoku Tiger instead of Twin Cobra.
The japanese version displays an additional shot on screen simultaneously, which translates to it being more fun.
Yes for sure the Japanese version is better no doubt about it! Japan cobra ha
Twin cobra has faster movement and no checkpoints though ;) also red chopper best chopper.
Is that the same for Gazelle's port of this set to PS1?
@@TheRestartPoint Yes. I‘ve bought the PS1 version back in the day and once I’d learned about the differences, I switched over to playing the japanese original only.
I’m usually not huge fan of helicopters or planes type of shmups. It might be because of the large hitbox or slow movement or something. But it was better then I was expecting because I’ve never played Tiger heli or Twin cobra. Ever played D-Force on snes? (Shudder) That game should be studied on how you don’t want a Shmup to be like. Maybe that could be a future video?
That sounds really interesting! I ve never even heard of it, I ll have to give it a try
@@TheElectricUnderground The biggest issue is the hit-box. It’s way to big. It feels like they didn’t fine tune it
It's already been announced that the next Toaplan collection will feature Hishouzame and its notoriously difficult sequel, Same! Same! Same!.
Oh jeez ha. That s going to be a brutal review for many reasons X-D
Finally nin nin shipped my switch version...along with the damn much overdue cotton saturn tribute switch..speaking of which.. i still cant understand how to feel about it ahah
play this and then cotton side by side ha, the lag will be obvious in the cotton release XD
there was a ps1 port of these games with arranged music, not sure how why they couldnt include any extra songs.
Yeah seems odd considering shot triggers always include an extra ost
@@TheElectricUnderground The likely answer is rights issues, and copyright
@@serraramayfield9230 Yeah, in the MLiG M2 interview, they said they'd like to have a person on the team just dedicated to licensing work. I'd have loved for the FM Towns soundtrack to have made an appearance, but I have no idea what that would take logistically.
100% agree. This is an A release on the normal scale, but a B- on the M2 scale.
No Arcade version of Tiger Heli only NES !?
Hmm. M2 shot triggers is doing what they love for us, beyond the priority of profit. If we want them to survive we need to support even the era's prior to our personal experience. Is the port accurate? I think some standardized metrics and review methodology would rid of the, “I feels.” Maybe buying the Tiger Heli DLC funds DoDonpachi, not every investment is visible.
I get what you mean but as a reviewer I don't think it s right to let loyalty to a company influence my review of a specific product, my concern is what the customers get rather then trying to be a marketing wing of the developers, even the ones that I do like such as shottriggers. I think this review was very fair towards this release
@@TheElectricUnderground I really hope they do DDP...it's the grandfather of bullet hell. Sure they'd get Cave on board and their staff to give input.
@@serraramayfield9230 I wanted doj or ddp so bad. But we got this. Just pain
I hear ya. You and shmupJunkie are the only reviewers I’ll watch for a shooter. The arcade boards are ‘85/‘87 respectively, M2 is reverse engineering boards, makes sense to my small brain you would start that process with the 35yo boards that are deteriorating first. I’m a product of ‘79 and at 8 years old twin cobra was insanity! To get almost arcade perfect reproductions on a 2016 system for 40$ is an A+ in my book. Personally I came to hear lag tests and port accuracy, not opinions of this era. M2 is advertising and selling 80’s games in the 2000’s, not 2000’s version of an 80’s game. ‘Bullet Hell’ shouldn’t even be mentioned in this review. Not digging at you at all, I just wanted to give you some feedback from someone that truly enjoys your content. Keep it up.
This came out digitally on May 16th 2024. It’s $34.99! Plus the add on is $17.99!
Can you say “overpriced”?
I'm happy to pay full price for a quality port of a great game, even if the price for equivalent products is much lower. Although M2 Shottriggers are obviously the most talented team when it comes to arcade ports, I actually dislike how many features they include because it means time and effort and going into things I don't use i.e training modes (they tend to be worse than save states when you want to practice a section with realistic rank), arrange modes, easy modes etc. And this one has to be the worst offenders due to the odd choice of games. I can't imagine too many people actually care about all the console ports on there - I certainly don't. I just want to play an accurate port of Twin Cobra with good screen filters, mappable controls, low latency etc. I honestly would've preferred an ACA release like Raiden. That would've cost me 1/10th of the price and I wouldn't have to be waiting for a physical copy to arrive. I know you're not as big on the ACA series as I am but at least that way it would be financially viable to release it internationally and a lot more newcomers would be willing to check the game out with the lower price tag.
I’m firmly believing the heavy hitters will come later, one will have to wait through the “meh” toaplan releases. I’m personally waiting on Tatsujin/Tatsujin-Ou
Absolutely!!! Batsugun too
That is ridiculous, an extra $20 for the console versions. No way in heck I'm buying this.
Yeah I think they should have included them, or added 1 more game to the base release
I can't wait for Ray-Z
Similar sentiment with everyone in the comments here, but i cant complain, not Bash them too harshly.
I mean, reverse-engineering games from PCB board aint a cheap and easy job.
And we have *a lot* of games to be done the way M2 did, so.. yeah, that's gonna weigh them down.
Wait, Ikaruga isn't a puzzle game?!
I was shocked too
i wish there was at least one arranged soundtrack
yeah me too!
Damn M2, why there is no English menu?!
I know it s kinda brutal
Those games are kinda meh for me but it's cool to have that port. Thanks for great review Mark! Btw ofcourse screw us pc players.
yeah m2 are moving further and further away from the west with each release :-(
I know what you mean, I’ve bought it from playasia because I want to support the shottriggers team but I can’t help but bang my head against the wall at the arrangement of games they’ve put on here. Where the hell is zero wing? Truxton? Batsugun? Fire shark? Just feels like they took a year off to me. Disappointing man.
Yeah I do think they should have included at least one heavy hitter in the release like a truxton, outzone, or zero wing.
As a casual outside appreciator of the genre I can't speak to the quality of the ports, but just the games on offer seem rather underwhelming especially after going from GG Aleste 3. I've played GetStar more than the shmups tbh.
Yeah same here, I think this is a much more specific release for fans of tiger heli and early toaplan
I can see your point here. I have a physical switch Release with all games included, this puzzle game via download link. But - even peing a huge Twin Cobra Fan - it is hard to recommend this when you can get a physical G. Darius HD Release by M2 for Switch and PS4 here in Germany for around 30€. I love the Twin Cobra Versions for PC Engine and Mega Drive, so I'm somewhat happy with it.
Yeah I think this release my skew more favorable to console fans rather then arcade fans, which is kind of odd since shottriggers is all about bringing home accurate arcade ports ha. So less on the console and add another arcade title like truxton or something
@@TheElectricUnderground well, the Aleste Collection is anything but Arcade. If I remember this right, shot triggers is about M2s favourite STGs, not neccesessarily from the Arcade. But looking back to the Aleste Collection, compared to the Toaplan Arcade Garage, they might have thrown in some other games like Zanac or Musha and Denin Aleste.
It is a somewhat odd release, completely focused on the let’s say fifty hardcore fans of the Tiger Heli-franchise worldwide 😉
These very old school shmups are not my cup of tea honestly. I suppose there are fans out there... and maybe these games have a special place in M2s heart... but im just sitting here waiting for the next big thing. With so many old school titles in their pipeline, i wonder how many years it will take for them to give Dodonpachi or DOJ the modern perfect port they deserve. Think about these games with super easy and arrange modes and custom mode... good lord.
Yeah the to do list of needed shmup ports is massive!
Remember Mean Bean Machine? You'll like Puyo Puyo 2 alot more.
yeah I need to give that a try sometimes ha
As far as i know esp ra de and aleste doesnt have arrange mode too. Of course i would prefer other toaplan, cave, raizing or whatever port instead of this one but the port is fine and im enjoying the game a lot more than i expected. The problem i have with m2 is that they act like they dont want my money because publish in eu/usa shops and translate the menus to english is not a big deal but they act like western players doesnt exists or matter in anyway with 98% of their shmup releases and for that fact as much as i want to support them i dont fell very good doing it to be honest
Rade doesn't have a proper arrange (shame on them) but it does have a pretty close equivalent with the arcade plus that nerfs the boss milking and adds a new character and tlb. So it's sort of an arrange ha.
@@TheElectricUnderground yes thats true, esp ra de is more complete in this aspect but not much more
I actually passed on this release. It just doesn't appeal to me.
Yeah I think you need to be into these older style shmups, I probably won't play it much
@@TheElectricUnderground I can't wait until they release Out Zone and Truxton II
@@damonke79 batsugun is my fav!
@@TheElectricUnderground Batsugun looks awesome too. I've never played any of these games. Still fairly new to the genre
Old shmup enthusiasts and video game collectors love the tiger heli series but with all these shmups releasing now this one’s definitely a pass. M2 fire for doing these tho it’s still important
Yes for sure! Can't wait for batsugun!
An A studend in the class full of... LOL that was hilarious. And so true!
I added the bleep cause I thought it was funny XD
It’s not a random puzzle game!
I think it does seem like a pretty random inclusion ha. It makes sense because we know they bought the ips, but imagine you buy mushi on steam and it comes with Tetris or something ha
These are probably 2 of my least favorite Toaplan games…besides Wardner. Shmup wise though, they are definitely better than Wardner. Wardner better not get a release. I think they should do one release with all Toaplan’s Horizontal shooters, as I think there are a grand total of 3 (I’ll wait, love all of the mega drive ports)…but aside from Batsugen, all I want for Christmas is Tatsujin (truxton) and Tatsujin 2 (Truxton 2) as a collection.
Also the mega drive/nes ports of Tiger Heli and Twin Cobra are not worth 20 bucks. Twin Cobra is one of the hardest games I’ve ever played on the mega drive, and not fun like other kinds of impossible games. I would liken it’s difficulty more to the famous Wardner.
The PC Engine port of Cobra is excellent, with better music than the arcade
The Restart Point no shit, I’ll check it out. They did have a lot of great versions of Toaplan games
@@opaljk4835 Tatsujin (aka Truxton) on PC Engine was also excellent, Daisenpuu (Twin Hawk) is good too, and Raiden is very good (not Toaplan but may as well be)
I think them going with the series based releases was a mistake, I think what they should have done is done little volume collections as well because they are going to have massive releases with stuff like truxton and batsugun and then smaller releases like tiger heli. I think a more mixed release style would have been more even
Should of got the dlc there’s another game on there- get star
Ha that game looks pretty crazy!
M2 has mastered reverse engineering
60 $????? Damned
it is a pretty steep price, I think it would be an easier sell if it included one more big Toaplan title like Truxton or something.
@@TheElectricUnderground i waited 1 YEAR to buy 19.99 Crimson clover lol . I this "Games in wishlist Check-in everyday for Sale,and only buying in Sale Guy" but what can i SAY clover was IT Wörth Not to wait any longer. Thanks for the Tip. Ive would have never knew IT i Guess haha
Kyukyoku Tiger II wouldve been nice to include on this. That Saturn game goes for a million bucks.
Yeah I think they needed to add one more game