How Important is Your Turn in CardWars? - Devlog
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- Опубліковано 30 тра 2024
- Devlog 01
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I legitimately tried to talk slower, but I think I somehow ended up talking faster. Bear with me while I get used to editing videos of this format- But that means if you like them already- they will keep getting better and better!
Live Sundays Mondays Wednesdays and Thursdays @ 6pm cst
We play Dark and Darker on Sundays and Mondays!
If this video is popular I will try to get another one out as soon as possible- We will likely be transitioning away from gaming content on UA-cam, however we will continue to stream as usual for the foreseeable future. You should stop by!
Not everything suggested, or created for the BigHoles CardWars project, is going to be added to the game. If we decide to use your idea, suggestion or artwork- it will be communicated and credited to the original creator. Any public post intended as a suggestion or contribution to the game, the original creator no longer has exclusive rights to that idea.
#BigHoles #episode2 #adventuretime #cardwars #adventuretimefanart #jakethedog #finnthehuman #devlog #gamedev #gamedeveloper #cartoonnetwork #tabletop #adventure #time #whatif - Розваги
Please dont stop making these... the idea of this game being show accurate just feels like a fever dream fr
"Show accurate card wars" is the most "my 10 year old's self dream" idea since chainsaw man
I couldn't agree more. I cherished the mobile game so much, and was distraught when it was removed due to cheaters exploiting it. I would pay a lot of money to have an accurate rendition of this game. Also, nice background music with the Into the Breach soundtrack 👀.
Bro yapping 💀
I always thought that the whole joke was that the game was to complicated and made no sense
When I was a kid I looked if a game like this existed
9:00 the fact that an early prototype of anything is even somewhat fun is a very good sign for future development
even tho the prototype is infront of my eyes, I still don't know if he is going to make a board game or a digital game.
@@jaxthejaximus6296I believe there was already a Kickstarter for a IRL set.
The graphics he's demoing also looks like a real game rather than a faked animation simply made for presentation rather than a real game
Looks like a video game to me, cant see creatures beating each other to death in real life (legally) afterall
@@tomikun8057
So it will be f2p, NICE!
@@jaxthejaximus6296 never said it would be f2p :/
@@tomikun8057it looks like he’s using the video game, “tabletop simulator” which allows people to create tabletop games
board games, and card games.
Hi- I’m a graphic designer and artist, I have actually tried to make a physical version of this game and I would be happy to help in anyway I can with card images.
did you see the physical version by cryptozoic
7:30 "did some scrappy doodles" as you show the most charming and stylistically consistent rough draft art to exist
they are scrappy. they are good scrappy.
9:10 I think the rule should be: "If you have 5 cards, discard one and draw another. If you have more than 5 cards, discard one per turn until you have 5. If you have fewer than 5 cards, draw one per turn until you have 5." This works as a sort of mana system, and it limits a player from having too many cards for too long.
Also, limit the number of cards on each side of the board.
This makes alot of sense, it allows for large combos as long as you get can get a good set up for them, but it also time limits the setup, and it fixes the runing out of cards issue
I think this is the simplest and most show-accurate solution (as other commenters mentioned in the show it seems like players usually have 5 cards throughout the game). Also, I think cleaner phrasing would be:
"Discard and draw step: If you have 5 or more cards, discard. Then, if you have fewer than 5 cards, draw a card."
It actually solves the problem but the normal one keep it more show accurate and as he stated it's not that big of a problem if the deck is big enough it will be fine .
I'm only replying to have this moved toward the top of comments, he has to see this
to solve the issues of complicated combat, you should remember the "Wars" part of card wars. yes it's a card game, but it's also a tabletop wargame, like 40k or Dust.
A well mixture of many good things
A good game to look into might be heroscape. It's a hex based mini/card wargame.
No one is talking about old RTS games. It's the closest game genre possible.
Rts?
@@gu3282RTS?
I fucking love this. I'm a game design student and almost every video I see talking about making games use some of the worst habits that all of my professors warn about. Getting an unfinished half baked prototype in front of another human and using that experience to inform your design process made you better than practically all of them. This is A+ work.
What are so other common pitfalls of novice game designers?
Mind sharing good resources on the topic? I'm looking to improve my (admittedly new) and fictional card game
@@gaopinghu7332I would also like a tip or two on what to avoid
@@gaopinghu7332 Generally game development should go like this Prototype->play test->iterate-> repeat. Prototype is building a basic concept of what you want, just something that gets the idea across and "functions". Play test is getting that in front of another living human being. As much as people want to build the games they would want to play, I can guarantee the game they would want to play a rigorously play tested game. Iterate is taking what you learned from the play test and applying it to the game and making sure to write that shit down. Going what if I did this to my game because you forgot you already tried that has hurt me so many times in the past. Getting used to this cycle and keeping everything written down and up to date is probably the biggest hallmarks of a great designer. Oh also try to work with others like artists and music people, my room mate does music stuff and has single-handedly made terrible games worth playing.
@@rizkiramadhan9266 My advice would be to look less at game developer resources and more at real world resources. Reading a couple articles about how user researchers run psychological studies or manage large qualitative data sets will help every play test be worth more and show some interesting similarities in how users talk about there experiences. I would also look into some studies about decision processes in card games. Psychology is a very important factor to consider when making games so looking at games through that lens will reveal a lot.
That “roll 1d6 and a 6 is a crit” is such an elegantly simple rule that I’m gonna steal it for a simplified version of D&D I’m making. Awesome project.
It's an idea I came up with for a boardgame adaptaion of R6 Siege and works incredibly well actually
An idea to address the wandering bald man and how studying can be finished mid battle.
Every action: card played, attack taken, card flooped, etc. would count as "time passed": im goning to refer to time passing as "ticks".
So the wandering bald man could have text thats says "every 4 ticks move to an adjecent lane: roll dice: odd move left, even move right".
Studying can take "X ticks" based on what is being studied.
This way, we are able to simulate the board and cards as being alive and add extra depth to how you need to consider your actions.
Also, I wanted to say that i really like the idea that your card resources are extremely limited. That way you can focus more on the terrain you start with and put more strategy in the start of the game. Becasue if the game is anything like in the show then games wont be very long lol.
As for damage delt by the pig to the wandering bald man, maybe damage can be ramping. The pig hits 1 then 2 on its next hit, then it will always hit 2 on an subsequent attacks becasue its "max damage" is listed as 2.
Seconded! Ticks sound like a great idea.
Bump
This is great!
Maybe pig goes 1 hp hit, 2 hp hit, 3 hp hit... etc
I like the idea of gameticks on paper but I feel like every single card played would just be annoying to keep track of, so maybe something very similar but slighly simplified like, “once every [number] turns, [creature] does [passive action]”
For example, Wandering Bald Man might have a description like “once every turn, Wandering Bald Man Wanders.”
In this case, I’m using “Wanders” as a keyword here, that means to move a set amount in a random direction, determined by dice. Since the grid used hexagons, there are 6 different directions that you can move for every space, each direction can be assigned a number on the die to determine which direction he wanders.
Man, can't wait for my brain to fucking explode while trying to understand the full ruleset
i loved watching the card wars episodes as a kid and i cant wait to see how this game is developed.
I really wanted to offer something that seemed rather important during the battle phase, that being how creatures seem to be able to choose pretty much any lane they want for target and how a few times we see creatures declaring attacks together, so in those cases it may be simpler to have a system of some sort that to start your battle phase you can declare multiple attacks as one action and have a single counter phase from the opponent which will help keep the game moving a little faster and make it stop less for simple attacks. I will admit I haven't rewatched the episodes for a while though I don't exactly remember a battle phase where they attack, get stopped or succeed and then new creatures are brought into play and then can battle in that same battle phase so it mostly seems like a safe overhaul and a few other notes just as someone who as played and even designed card games myself some amount of limits and potential action need to be accessible AKA How many summons of creatures you can make OR a limit on how many "Strong" creatures you can play, maybe having those stronger creatures have conditions like controlling 3 corn fields and having a useless swamp creature live X turns on the field for the immortal maze walker and etc as a way to maximize deck building as even gimmicky and weirder effects can find a place in some deck or version of a deck somewhere, second is the draw mechanic and there's 2 choices, Draw until you have X amount of cards or if you have 1 card in hand you discard and then draw 2 which can force players into important decisions between potentially deck important cards but there does need to be some way to have at least some opportunity to draw more cards than you started the game with to give you more actions as with the current one potential lockouts for one player or draws seem very possible throughout its future if unchanged.
I want to point out some detail I've noticed in the show about flooping and activating: the players turn the cards in different directions. I haven't checked 100% of the footage, just the original episode. But flooping seems to consistently turn the card counter-clockwise and activating seems to consistently turn the card clockwise.
Examples include: Finn flooping his land cards at the start of the match, Jake flooping the Silo of Truth on turn 1, and Finn flooping the pig in response to the Husker Knight attack all turn the card counter-clockwise. While Jake attacking with the Husker Knights, Finn activating the Ancient Scholar to study and Finn activating the Pig to attack the Wandering Bald Man all turn the card clockwise.
Edit: typo
Hmm, that would make breaking down so much of the games more interesting. While also making it more clear which cards are flooped and which are activated
For the card drawing/discard, I don't think we ever see someone in the show not start a turn with 5 cards. Maybe you draw back to 5 at the end of your turn THEN get to discard and draw at the start of your next turn
I was thinking something similar. Except the game would go in rounds with the use of 5 cards marking the ending of the round. All the players would have to expend there cards/mana in order for the next round to start. Then everyone would draw 5 cards again. If a person runs out of cards before someone else the person without could still floop cards and do everything except playing new cards because they can't draw cards until the start of the next round.
The immediate problems with this that I can think of is running out of cards in your deck and table space if there are to many rounds. However, you can play to a certain number of rounds if you want. I don't really know the winning condition so I don't know how it will effect it.
Yess
@@sadbronze6291 oh something like this could work but i think if one person runs out of cards the other play gets 1 more turn in the round. And players could call for the end of a round early by saying this is their last turn
Similar to yugioh rush duel
@@sadbronze6291 Another problem with that would be that someone could decide to never play their last card, if they think the current situation is advantageous to them, tho @nathanmulder8947 's idea would fix that.
I just love the kind of problem solving strategies you have to pull out in order to progress with the insane task that is ahead of you, simple watching you find your way is very intersting, the game promises
This is a game I would literally play every day.
As someone that played Gwent, a smaller deck and enough draw will lead to a deck being so consistent that you end up playing the same game every time, which limits the randomness. Limiting the number of copies of each card in a deck can counteract that.
Marvel snap had the best solution. 12 cards, no dupes. Deck si reliable and makes games not too slow. Having no dupes prevents games being too consistent. Since you always finish with like 4 cards not drawn
@@casval2781sorry that was meant for different comment (if you saw)
@@casval2781 To further talk about this.
Marvel Snap starts you with 3 cards, draw every turn.
The game only lasts 6 turns (unless a certain card is played)
So you usually end up seeing 9/12 of your cards.
That's fairly consistent, compared to other card games.
But the with both players playing at the same time (and many abilities depending on where the card is played leaving some guesswork), and there being a large variety of randomized locations that are revealed as the game goes on, there's a degree of unpredictability introduced that extends beyond just the deck itself.
10:15 on drawing & discarding cards, just a brief glance at the in-show footage makes it seem like every player always has five cards in their hand. An idea is that every time a player discards a card for whatever reason, they follow that up by drawing a card, and vice-versa, whenever they recieve a card for any reason, they must first discard a card, so that their hand by the end of the interaction will always equal five.
Not sure what this will entail for playing a card from your hand, maybe at the end of the turn or in the next turn's discard/draw phase the player replenishes their hand to five, either one could work.
I think you could add to this that in the next turn you'd get a fixed amount (one or two) cards as replenishment, you don't get punished for keeping an ace up your sleeve and don't flood the board.
This could also probably preserve the idea of limited resources if decks are small and you lose by running out of cards to draw. That way it still incentivises building on what you have because just doing something new each turn rapidly increases the rate at which you will run out of cards.
I was thinking you could just replenish your hand to 6 and then discarding one to 5. But maybe adding some kind of mana system to restrict infinite card playing. That way you’d still have the draw and discard phase to start
I remember when I was five watching these episodes and wanting to play these games so bad thank you. This is my dream come true
This works how Yugioh Rush Duels works, the only issue is that it can be very prone to balancing issues in a near zero mana system, Rush Duels has to HEAVILY underpower cards because drawing that many cards is so powerful.
11:40 lmaooooo imagine being a fire dog and getting your face caved in by a freaking pear
I'm loving this, I'm trying to support you however I can. Making positive comments, sharing the video, and liking!
Became a member literally seconds after you mentioned it. You're doing globs work
Who is globs
@@user-yv5ch2wc1ythe version of god in adventure time, kind of? Not really but basically thats it
@@user-yv5ch2wc1yGrob Gob Glob Grod is a god-like entity from Mars with four faces.
He was friends with Abraham Lincoln.
@@jollthebroyeah they only made him the “god” because they want to get away with saying “oh my glob” or in other words “oh my god” lol.
The guardian of mars@@user-yv5ch2wc1y
For the situation in which the Scholar raised the pig from the dead, I figure that the ability is similar to the foretell mechanic from Magic: The Gathering:
The Scholar is flooped during the controller's main or battle phase to "study" a spell. During a later turn, the Scholar can be flooped or activated again to "finish" studying a spell and cast it.
In the show, Finn likely activated the Scholar on one of his previous turns, having it study the "Raise the Dead" ability. He then activated it again during his reaction phase to raise the pig from the dead and floop the pig, eating Jake's corn fields and disabling his corn-element creatures. Jake also wasn't aware that Finn had Raise the Dead available, meaning it is likely a hidden ability, similar to Foretell.
Just gonna crank this comment up!
Also, great solution!
I imagined it functioned more like a saga enchantment that returns the pig from the graveyard when the saga resolves
The scholar was moved to the “Cave of Solitude” and when he came out of the cave he had finished studying. So perhaps it was the action being in the cave which allowed him to study a spell kind of like (if scholar spent the previous turn in the cave of solitude, he may cast x spell when he leaves). As it seems characters depend on the environment around them, it makes sense that it would be an ability made possible via the scholar and the cave “synergizing”
I think the spell studied is decided not before but rather after you finish the study- you don't *actually* study a skill but rather open the window to use one of the many skills they offer within different conditions- "can only be used in x phase" or "requires x type of creature".
also(kinda like what @cjams115 mentioned) the study could just be a built-in-mechanic within the scholar that lets it study a spell. the learned spell could differ by a structures type, whatever landscape it's in etc: " _scholar_ stumbled upon the _cave of solitude_ while wandering around the _cursed soil_ , the teachings inside are invaluable. _scholar_ can now _re-animate the dead_ ."
To me it looks like something along the lines of mtg's ability keyword 'inspired' - much more than foretell (Jake is just constantly ignoring what's happening on opponent sides, I get a feeling he isn't the greatest player..) inspired means a creature must be tapped (or flooped, maybe we flooped it to move into a building for example) - in our case it might even come with a further restriction that we needed to have it flooped with the specific building, it then reads that when it becomes untapped (so on a future turn usually) it can perform a unique ability.
In mtg many creatures may choose not to untap until it is beneficial, for example giant oyster may remain tapped.
So I propose that our Scholar may have an ability that reads 'floop in a lane with a building that allows studying - Scholar may remain flooped as long as he is inside the building, if Scholar was not unflooped this turn you may unfloop it and remove it from the building and if you do you may resurrect target creature that died in a neighboring lane, you may not attack or perform further actions with Scholar this turn'
It's possible that this is too restrictive and then in addition to that you may be able to choose one of several different effects, this being one of them, and that would align somewhat with the surprise effect but since even then all choices that can be made should have been clear it's just Jake ignoring Finn's actions and being dismissive that had him react the way he did.
For example disciple of the ring is such multi-choice creature, we simply replace the original payment with our version of inspired and we get Scholar.
I like to imagine the antient scholar revive was a time gated event. the card was now activatable in reaction phase due to how many phases have passed
00:05 missed the opportunity to say scrooblin' and scrat-scrobblin'
i have been refreshing your page for 168 hours. Salvation has come, brothers
Yeah haha, immediately after the first vid I went waiting mode
Crazy how much people like the idea
The idea of having a game where your draw pool is so small because you’ve got what you need to win on the board to start is really appealing to me, and I feel like it would be a fascinating way to see how people make different setups. One could be all in on the draw, one only on field mechanics, one using draw cards for a single land defense or another creating some sort of burn mechanic. It sounds like a ton of fun just making a setup!
I think that a cycling type effect could be really powerful in an interesting way in this game. Since it could be a creature's main selling point or the ability of a land. Giving you less power but dramatically increasing your ability to search your deck (by mulliganing a card every turn)
it would be a good idea to make each "type" have a very unique playstyle which will allow for more randomness
Loved the video!
I think the discard/draw mechanic of the game and limiting the number of actions a player has is incredibly interesting for the game. A majority of games will just simply give you a spell to cast Raise the Dead on a low level creature. But instead, this game encourages the use of synergy... such is the case with the Ancient Scholar having to research in the School House, and then being able to use that ability presumably once per turn. More than likely there could be a card draw mechanic, but it would also have to use a level of synergy and then your source of card draw could be dismantled by the enemy. It's all about the archetype you're going for.
However, as for what to do about when you run out of cards... This is completely up to you. Since this doesn't seem to be something explored in the show, do what makes the most sense and is also the most fun. On one hand, letting the player draw a new card when they run out on their turn keeps things fresh and interesting for them but causes a great power shift and encourages hyper aggressive play. On the other hand, not letting the player draw at all causes a great slow down and now the player is just activating structures without feeling as though there's much they can do. Perhaps that's punishment for their actions, but instead of the hope for a top deck they're left feeling bored and also hopeless.
As Jake displays, if you can steal an opponent's card... card draw must not be that uncommon. I'm not very familiar with the Land and Structure format, but you can make even more quirky rules if you wish. For example: If a player has at least two Land sections with No Structures on them, they can draw a card at the start of their turn if they don't have any. However, if they have more than two Structures on Land Sections they may not. This would solve our problem of hyper aggressive play since a player with a large board wouldn't get the benefit, yet a player now falling behind would get the opportunity to try and bounce back.
I'm not sure dice are the way to go, but making the gameplay as fun and as interesting as possible with combat is always great! I think the appeal of this game is the pure complexity, and having so many moving parts that the opponent forgets about all of them. Having a Hot Dog Prince and Slime Bear each with a decent attack being unable to overcome the enemy forces, but also on your board is the Witch of Above Average Inspiration in the Tundra lane whose ability is to give a boost to attack and defense to all allied creatures in the same lane as her. However, the opponent completely forgot that the Traveling Caravan is also there, so at the start of your Battle Phase you activate the Traveling Caravan's ability to bring itself and up to two creatures in the same lane as it into an adjacent lane of your choice, moving to the Swamp Lane. This causes the Witch's Ability to now affect all allied creatures once activated.
Though I think I understand what you mean. You want that feeling of leaning in and looking at each creature, wondering who's going to win. Dice are just a scary way to go since at that point, chance is deciding the fate of your very limited resources. If you want that same feeling, you could also have a lot of structures, creatures, and Lands that can Reactionarily affect your creature and provide a buff which would make both players more invested in every fight. Though I'm not sure how often that happens in the show.
Last thing I promise. Again, a huge part of this game is synergy. A game ending on the first turn really defeats this, and at least having some time for set up would be nice. If I were to just throw some numbers out, I think an incredibly fast game should be over in 4 turns. An incredibly long game should be over in about 12-14 turns. The average game should last about 8 turns. Enough to get synergy going, enough to play one or two huge cards, and then the game ends. I really really hope you go the ultimate synergy route with this game, because I think a lot of people would find that really fun.
Thank you for listening to my ramblings.
For the wondering effect, it could just be "at the start of your turn roll a d4, move creature to respective lane". For the drawing/discarding/hand size thing maybe once your hand runs out, at the start of your turn you draw a set amount (like 2 or 3) but discard them at the end of your turn. This way you still have to manage your hand so you have responses to your opponent, but still have cards if you run out, while still punishing you for mismanagement of your resources
i love how the “rough draft” cards look, there’s a level of simplicity and raw charm that i really like
I always prayed someone who was good at making games would bless us with this game and now that its happening im ready and happy for the ride
i love how you're out here trying to make sense of something the writers were also definitely just making up as they went along
and you're doing a damn good job of it too keep it up man
For random actions of cards like the bald man, there is a extra deck that at the start of each player turn a player draws from.
The players both contribute X cards to the deck, each of the cards explaining a effect of something happening.
For example: "when drawn toss a coin. Heads all spirits move a lane to the right, tails all spirits move a lane to the left."
I really hope you don't abandon this project midway cus I have seen that happen with too many people. This has potential to become something amazing
Good luck with this, you have my support
I am already in love with these videos, I really hope these pick up good traction for you. Bringing fictional games from shows to life like this is such a wonderful thing to see
For "discard and draw" you could use that to say "you can only have 5 cards at maximum", you could choose to draw a card by discarding one from your hand, and Jake could've been willingly tricking Fin in a "screw with the newbie" sorta way.
I do believe that Jake says when you run out of creatures you lose, so as a fail condition that would make sense to have limited cards, it would also make deck building more important. But as an alternative perhaps you have a small deck of other cards but you can only have a specific amount of creatures/structures played on your board. And then if a creature dies, you have to wait a turn before you can replace them.(or in Finn’s case he revived the pig).
The discard then draw could be that you discard a card, then draw until you have 4 cards in your hand. You can see characters with less than four cards in hand suddenly having 4 cards such as the scene when Finn runs out to talk to BMO he only has 2 cards in his hand, then when Finn drags him back in and tells him to take his turn Jake has 4 cards in his hand.
I'm here rooting for this game and for you!!!
And while you keep trying to see how all this overcomplicated game works, I'll give my to cents and give some ideas for cards and the archetypes
-Refreshing Spring Owner: Wandering. This card can randomly un-floop one of your flooped cards at the start of the End Phase. If he's on a lane with Refreshing Spring structure is in, un-floop 2 cards instead if the effect triggers
-Heated Warrior: Autoplay: This card can play itself at any moment from your Hand. If you normally play Heated Warrior, you can only Discard a card but not draw in your next turn
-Keyword idea: Nurture X: If you take X actions to Nurture this card (Imagine stuff like feeding, giving a bath, hugging or whatever), activate it's Nurture effect
-Lovely Granny: Nurture 4: The Lovely Granny randomly generate the cards: Apple Pie, Birthday Money, Elderly Wisdom or Little Pinch on the Cheek.
Apple Pie: Cures and give 3 Max Health
Birthday Money: Generate between 3 to 10 gold coins
Elderly Wisdom: if a card is Studying, reduce the rounds needed in 1
Little Pinch of the Cheek: The ally card gains +1 Max HP and +2 Damage
-Crazy General: Randomly, the Crazy General can choose any ally creature card to do an Action which you can't change. If the action is Attacking an enemy card, the Allied Creature gains +3 Attack
-Friendly Bunny: If this creature Nurtures another Allied creature, it gives them +1 Max HP
-Structure: The Great Campfire: If more than 1 creatures sit and talk on The Great Campfire for a whole round, Nurture 1 to all. If you floop Marshmallows or Meat, Nurture 2.
-Structure: Firework Factory: Every turn there's a 1 on 5 chance to generate 1 Firework card. When this Structure is destroyed, there's a 1 on a 6 chance to Destroy an enemy Structure.
That's it for the moment, because if I keep going I won't stop and there's other ideas that for the moment idk how to describe lmao
I believe that research exception you noted, as well as any similar delayed effects, could be activated on a reaction turn if their effects would have activated on the players next proper turn. It would add a bit of strategy to remembering if the opponent has any delayed effects incoming when choosing to attack.
This is the only UA-cam series that matters right now.
No literally
the "OCW" he says in the video, means the original card, which is the first one, with finn and jake, "DDCW" is the other one that shows up a couple seasons after that first game. For those who didn't watch the first video 👍
One game that handles "combat where both players wait to see what happens" really well is Unmatched, where combat is resolved by simultaneous play of cards. I think there are definitely ways to implement that kind of thing in this game.
One simple idea I had is this - what if the card you discard at the start of your turn informs the randomness in some way? Maybe there is a symbol or a number on it that determines how the wandering creatures move and how combat will be changed this turn. Since you discard face down, this element will be hidden until the appropriate phase!
the study could just be a special scholar move that lets it study a spell. the spells you could learn can be related a structures type, whatever landscape it's in etc: " _scholar_ stumbled upon the _cave of solitude_ while wandering around the _deadmans soil_ , the teachings inside are invaluable. _scholar_ can now _re-animate the dead_ ."
it don't got to be all that specific either. you can just have a pool of some existing spells you think scholar could learn and let the type of structures/landscapes etc narrow it down. this is actually far better than just giving the scholar some pre-decided skills to learn or limited towers to interact- it opens up space for *variability* which is arguably the most important thing in ANY GAME.
I think the spell studied should be decided not before but rather after you finish the study so you don't *actually* study a skill but rather open the option to walk outta there with one of them in hand! ANY TIME! or no... but YES! Don't think thats broken bcuz everything is EQUALLY BROKEN- staying in there could much very much aswell result in a volcano destroying them both! Man I wish I could just make this game myself or atleast be involved more but damn uni is getting close and I don't got time to code SHIT! Coding sucks too so that doesn't help y'know?..
I'd be glad to help the creative process though, this is my dream game and I am very much interested. PLEASE KEEP GOING I AM BEGGING YOU SIRRRRR SIRE SERGEANNTT
Episode 2: "Ignoring a few contradictory outliers, we can break down turn structure into three distinct phases."
Episode 45: "The one problem that this potential Blind Auction system has is that when resources are gained via floop or activation, a player could hypothetically monopolize the economy through repeated use of structures or high-health cards."
I am so ready to get lost in the weeds of this. You're doing great work so far!
I play a farmland card I can tap it for one mana so I can play dairy cow because dairy cow is a grazing type and I have greenest grass and play I get five milk counters on her which attracts Raging Bull from my hand. Raging Bull has ten attack but I can sell the five milk counters to the grocery store that I have on my side of the field 15 dairy dollars I then convert 15 dairy dollars to the 30 mana and that lets me play big gun I give my Raging Bull a big gun and now he has 20 attack okay so you and now you might say well on a second you have tollgate cards on your side of the field at any same if and with tollgate cards how could my dairy driver possibly afford to bring the milk counters to the grocery store how you ask the same things because I have a good work ethic card in my hand I play it and dairy driver gets a raise which means he can afford all the toll gates ok the extra dairy dollar is my dairy driver has I invest him and play a cheese factory the cheese factory creates one cheese per turnstile at the top five cards my deck and here we go the black of the read I don't think that cars even legal anymore black brie gets served and I received three colorless cheese Chakra with three colorless cheese chakra I can tap my cheese back three three more times and now I've done a tap somersault with a somersaulting cheese factory I can create triple the cheese output and get nine cheese chakra
@@ESALTEREGOI understand the reference
Pro zd
This is really cool; the second video has me even more invested. I don’t know if you’ve considered this, but assigning timing restrictions is how MTG simplifies the rules of when and if cards can be played during certain phases. Looks to me like some of the actions can be summed up similarly, like forming structures being “sorcery speed” but spells and flooping are generally “instant speed”. In this way, cards and their text can then be designed to break timing restrictions simply, deliberately and consistently.
Also for the research mechanic, it sounds like Hideaway from MTG, where a condition can be met and the Land or Enchantment that contains the hidden creature can be activated at instant speed or (theoretically) automatically.
He made it clear about what you can do and can not do in the reaction phase So there is no actual need for timing restrictions
@@kaizenyasou6963 I see what you mean about defining when things can or can’t happen, but timing restrictions are more practical for games with greater complexity. It is a framework wherein a number of rules exist for the different card types, so it has the same effect as telling you what things can go where but makes association, contextualization and practice much easier. For example, instants behave differently during your turn and opposing players turns in MTG, but the timing rule: instants can respond to any cast/trigger/phase change permeates all regular gameplay.
I remember when I used to cut up cards, draw on it, and play a pseudo-“Card wars” with it.
I also remember there was a Card Wars RPG game on mobile/IOS
Okay with the study abilty I can see a reason why the wizard finish studying during Jake turn. Maybe the ability of the Wizard states "If this creature in the school house for one turn, Wizard can revive one target creature from your graveyard back to field." Counting the turn you put them into the school would be one turn, meaning the ability would be ready to use one in your opponents turn. That why it was able to be use during corner attack state, a turn has pasted.
Man you deserve the world, i am going to support this project via the youtube thing, remember that sponsors' ideas should be suggestions and not compulsion to make changes, create the game in accordance with your own heart and mind, i truly hope that the project will grow to such a size that Adventure Time creators will themselves want it to be an offical card wars game, i absolutely admire how committed you are to make feel it authentic to the show's episode, please forgive me for my poor english, lots of love
Really love the “checking if anything happens” mechanic, since it has the stated benefit of not constantly slowing the game down for just one mechanic, but also means potentially all players are invested in the outcome since they both likely have a random effect tied to it. If it ends up staying, it might be a good idea to formalize it in the turn structure
Like gave it as this game’s “upkeep” or a before battle phase!
Another comment had the great idea of having "ticks" that simulate time passing, each player action is a tick and are relevant for many cards and effects. I am thinking that this could work together with the "checking" mechanic well, allowing both players to see the "ticks" # and the counters of it that cards/effects related to it have, perhaps tick reliant cards and effects are only triggered when checking, so players could try and strategize the best time ti "check"; to trigger some effects and avoid triggering others. This also explains why it would be hard to Jake ti keep up with everything that is going on and be surprised; a beginner player would have trouble keeping up with all of this in an advanced game state, beginners try to keep in mind the timing and ticks of only some of their cards and advance players might be as accurate as the automatic tick counters (this would be only be possible to impliment in a virtual environment as well)
Maybe each phase transition is marked with a die/dice roll, and each card with a "random" action has an assigned numer(s) for its potential action(s)?
Sort of like the harvest rolls in Settlers of Catan, everyone is effected by the results of the roll.
@@RipOffProductionsLLC that's a very elegant solution to avoid bogging the game down with too many seperate dice rolls.
Here's an idea on how the "research" mechanic might work: We know that when a card starts it's research, it takes a certain amount if time before the research is done and a new ability becomes available.
Since we've seen that the research can be completed on an opponents reaction phase, it can be one of two things:
1. research takes X number of phases to complete, meaning using a reaction phase in response to an opponents actions will actually speed up all ongoing research on both sides (assuming the reaction phase is a phase that doesn't always happen anyway, but is "created" when responding to an opponent)
2. the research actually takes less time to complete than we see happen, but as the controller of the researcher, you may choose to either complete or finish the research on command, including during a reaction phase
6:15 In the game FRAG, the attacker rolls a number of dice equal to the attack value, and the defender rolls equal to their current health +bonuses.
(Rocket 5D = 5d6) divided by (Health 3 = 3d6), rounded down = damage
Buildings could count as armor or a terrain feature like if defending, +1 to defense, if attacking +1 to offense
9:25 In Summoner Wars, you can discard cards to build up mana for bringing out units
I had a thought. The research exception in the reaction phase may be because it is an "if it exits a building after X turns" effect, and a creature LEAVING a building might be a thing you can do during the reaction phase. With the ancient scholar's revive ability being the reason why the pig can floop immediately.
5:00 the research could be written as “takes x turns” where x includes turns taken by all players. That would explain how it can resolve during an opponents turn. The drawback is that playing with more opponents would dramatically change the rate of research actions.
Another comment suggests "ticks" based off cards played/used/activated/etc. That can trigger the more "random" effects.
I propose maybe a turn/phase change based die roll system that trigger all cards with "random" effects matching result number(this simplifies things by not requiring every player to roll for every random effect individually)
Of course, both those proposals have the same issue when adding extra players, but maybe the rules would be to multiply the requirements by the number of players? Or maybe the fact that in a 4 player game you getting 4 research at 4 times speed is "balanced" by you having 3 times the enemies to potentially deal with(who are also getting 4 times research speed)
My idea for the draw and discard rule, I think that once your "Library" is empty, you could shuffle your discard pile and have it become a new library to draw from. This way, the choice on which card to discard goes from "I guess I'm not playing this card this game." to "I guess I'm not playing this card anytime soon, but might come back to it later."
The combat system could be, each creature has a default action (like defend or attack) and one or two special actions depending on the card. Players write down their chosen actions simultaneously before revealing them. For example, if both creatures choose to attack, roll a d6 to determine the outcome (rolling a one might mean the defending creature counter-attacks and take no damage)
Don't forget that physical tabletop opens up a lot of possibilities, just as it closes off some. The wandering behaviour of the pig could be decided by, for example, dropping a d6 from a certain height, and moving the pig to wherever it rolls. You can definitely make the most of the physical interaction with the cards and objects.
Amazing video! Two thoughts I had:
1. I interpreted the result of the study action as a built in ability rather than something you select as research. For example, the ancient scholar would always learn raise dead when you send it to study, and it becomes an ability of the scholar itself, like upgrading the creature. This makes sense to me, since Finn never specified what the scholar is studying.
2. One idea for the lands is to have each type have a special quirk that affects your gameplay, such as corn being something that is grown and razed.
I think the study ability should be similar to sagas or multi-use cards in MTG. "When flooped, send scholar to (any study related building), then choose one- (things they can study) Then put a counter on this card. Add a counter at the beginning of your upkeep step. Once this card reaches X counters cast chosen ability"
Moving this here from my earlier reply: The scholar was moved to the “Cave of Solitude” and when he came out of the cave he had finished studying. So perhaps it was the action being in the cave which allowed him to study a spell. kind of like (if scholar spent the previous turn in the cave of solitude, he may cast one of x spells when he leaves). As it seems characters depend on the environment around them, it makes sense that it would be an ability made possible via the scholar and the cave “synergizing”
Hey literally became a member just so you can see this. Perhaps blind auctioning and commodity speculation could be the draw mechanic. Say you could only buy a card off the top of your deck, each player placing blind bids on whether they want that card. If you bid more then your opening you draw. And the other player gets to speculate.
Perhaps you could you could speculate on the type of card drawn. Perhaps betting on what cards are left in the deck. Maybe you could only bet on your opponents deck. Correct speculation means more $ for the player who is not drawing on average.
This could create a Meta game of when one player vs another is powerful. You could blow everything turn 1 or 2 bet heavily and be left with nothing left when your opponent draws turns 3 4 5 6.
In practical terms I imagine both start each turn with 5 "gold" at the start of round 2 they both hold out their bet with a cuped hand reviewing simultaneously. The winner draws and loses the gold he spent for the draw.
The loser gets to place any gold he did not initially bet on "speculations". This would be a tile thing where he could put money across the card types.
Say structure, creature, land, spell. You could put all your money on a structure card and when it's a land you get nothing. Or if its structure you double your money. Or spread it out and always get something back.
Failed bets to purchase a draw or on wrong speculations are returned to the player that made them. That way the player that is not drawing is typically the one that is getting more gold.
I like the idea- but given that one of the only explicit things we know about the game is that you simply "discard a card and pick up a new one." This speculation thing could be more confined- and only done in certain situations maybe. But at this point it's hard to say.
Man it's amazing how fast you work, from building, designing, analyzing the cardwars game to writing scripts, voicing, editing (really well might i say), and uploading videos. I subscribed from the last video and was expecting a month until the next one drops but wow. You are doing amazingly and I'm sure with this fun concept a lot more viewers will be attracted to your channel. Keep up the great work.
Since card Wars is a tcg game with a board, It is possible to recreate It with a touchscreen tv embed on a coffee table, i may do It when this project is done with the obvious permitions
Wdym permissions bigholes doesn’t own the ip plus it would be free publicity for him if you posted it online
@@cyprus1005 hes, de doesn't own the iP, but he did all the heavy work of actually making It playable, so Its more than Fair to give the credit
@@amydoesart3724 No, seeking permissions in this type of edge case will only serve to stifle your iniative. Go after! Intellectual "Property". none of this is our property it is creative commons fair use at this point
A good rule of thumb for the two phases might just be that In the main phase you can affect stuff within your 4 lands, and in the battle phase is when you can move creatures or spells to attack other lands. For example, the scarecrows could still attack with their scare because they technically aren't leaving their land to do so nor is it a physical attack.
I'm not sure if I can help but I remember reading an adventure time comic that was specifically about card wars. Thats actually the reason I clicked on your first video, I barely remember anything about it and it feels like just a distant memory but your video reminded me. Not sure If it has any useful information but figured it would be worth letting you know about. Just looked it up and it's called Fionna and Cake Card Wars. All I remember is that it has some sort of crying panda lol.
Maybe the research function could be an effect that resolves after a certain amount of a countable actions are performed, for example phases (Draw, Main, Battle, Reaction), and is forcibly activated once the criteria is fulfilled, even during the opponent's turn.
Research could simply conclude on the end of your turn, however many turns that research would take, then it would be available during your reaction or your next turn
@@Gepwin idk if this would be a problem or not
but with this only finish research during reaction you can't research structures or creatures as "cannot play structures or creatures during reaction"
which maybe with the spirit of card wars there could be edge cases for these
For the research mechanic, I think it can be on the creature card what abilities it can learn and how long it takes to learn those abilities, maybe you put a die on the creature and uptick the dice each phase it is in a structure it can learn from, and the player can choose to "cash in" the "research points" to learn the spell, for a one time use. There would be a variety of different spells a creature can learn, each with its own mechanics and rules, similar to MTG where there is a variety of abilities with rules but are just named as the keyword on the card, (ie. Trample, Deathtouch, etc.). So for Finn's creature, it would say: Revive (5) or something to that degree.
That's an insanelt good idea
For handling randomness, instead of adding an additional component, like dice, draw from the top of your deck. Some information on the drawn card affects the outcome.
So for instance, if all cards have an element associated with them, you can use this in place of the faces of dice. "If corn is draw, do X, if mud is drawn, do Y"
This also opens interesting deck building avenues of building mono type decks or poly decks. (which is a common trope in deck builders.)
This hasn't been discussed yet, but this could be part of the significance of your original land set up. Your lands open up what elements your allowed to include in your deck during deck building. Perhaps some cards require more than 1 type of element. Either 2 of one, or a mix of others (again, similar to something like magic).
okay so like, i love this. I wish i had more ideas but for now I mainly just have two, one revolving around the Ancient Scholar Finn plays
when activating it, it goes to a schoolhouse to learn. it comes out after learning the raise raise the dead spell. and 2: how the game would kinda go
so my idea is frankly a bunch of different scholars each with their own sort of thing they can chose to do.
where for a turn they either go into a building that's either a schoolhouse or related to what they are (like if a corn scholar were to go into a corn field)
then on the card would be possibly 3 options for the player to chose so that after a turn when the scholar has finished studying they've come out with a spell that they know, the scholar by all means is still weak but if allowed to build up and learn a spell could possibly be game changing.
This also gave way into an idea of scholar interactions with buildings whereas if a scholar were to persay go into a hospital to learn they may learn a spell about healing other creatures so then maybe you'd make a list or a specific spell that is tied to buildings scholars can learn etc etc.
Another idea based around Finn talking about basic logic is that the game can really go just about any way it's all just about having fun and deciding who's the dweeb and the cool guy.
In the show Jake had a strong start and clear win presented for him, but Finn got slightly lucky and used general logic of "Pigs like corn" kinda like if you can just make the game a fun possibly appeasing "story" then that's the goal. Like a game where people argument against each other about the immortal maze walker being strong but then because the opponent had the radial tower of conflictions it caused the immortal maze walker to be conflicted about it's bloodlust and then turn to harmony aka the other side.
damn this was long, sorry :)
I love the idea of the cards in your hand count as your "mana". Makes games short and straight to the point. It also encourages different strategies solely based on your opening hand, and how your different card effects may or may not turn the table to your advantage. Also adds a lot more flexibility into deck building; instead of having a deck that just has that one key card you're hoping to play, there could be multiple key cards (which could be based on your main element/faction), and the rest of the cards in the deck are just there generally for support/helping you get to those cards faster.
I really like Globulin and the ideas you got so far! I think we should have a structured “Element” and “Type” System, where some/all cards have a strength and weakness to those Elements/Types. Id maybe lower/combine some elements and keep the Card Types to just Creature(s), Spells, and Structures/Buildings. Landscape (like Corn Fields) can go with the elements too.
im here for it, I remember looking for something related to AT and CW years ago and found your channel because of it. I wish you the best on this project!
I have an idea that Card Wars might have a little bit of DnD when creating the rules, that the players have the option to decide what actions are allowed on creatures, buildings, and on the environment. Just due to the fact that the cards have a brief description of them for their main purpose. But it's up to the players to choose what it is weak to or strong against. Which could explain why Finn and Jake took 2 hrs to go over the rules because they were as making them as well. Much like DnD, it can take a while to start playing because you're creating the game. But it's just an idea!!
I really like the the hard discard 1, draw 1 card. If you can't discard, you can't draw. However, in the show, games can go on for a while without people running out of cards and players seem to remain around 5. SOOOOOO....
I propose the following.
1)One turn start, discard one card. Then draw one card if you discarded a card.
2)Some cards have effects that allow the drawing of cards like "steam engine: when an ally dies on a lava-type field, draw a card."
3)On turn end, if you have more than 5 cards, discard down to 3 cards (for a little risk/reward for overdrawing).
This essentially gives you 5 "mana" to set up an economy if you don't go for a blitz run. Some may forgo economy and spend all their cards offensively to win in 1 or two turns which I think is very in line with the show and interesting. It's kind of like going for a 4 move check-mate vs methodically eliminating the enemy's pieces in chess. To limit the gain from them while encouraging planning and forward thinking, the cards should be weirdly specific like the above example. Also, it's just funnier.
I really like the “pick an element and draw random cards for your deck”
13:24 I think that in order to make this make sense, you could give the pig an ability like: "When attacking for the first time during a combat or reaction, this creature deals half of its base damage. This ability resets at the beginning of your next turn." Or you could give a short couple words that are a term for that like... I dunno, "This creature has Slow-Startup." It could also have layers(for example, you could give The Pig a plus 3 to attack, and it would end up dealing 4 damage the first hit, then 5 damage every other hit until the start of your next turn).
I'm very excited to see where this goes, cant wait for for updates
Thanks! I appreciate your support and will be keeping you up to date!
13:25 there may even be a factor where attacks have a chance being preformed weaker/nerfed
Please don’t stop! This is a wonderful idea and so worthwhile. Your doodles are so entertaining too!
12:20 I feel like Jake would be the kind of person to main a 45/5 monster out of all the cards in the game.
I read the notification as “Making Biblically Accurate CardWars” lmao
The wizard finishing his study could just be like a trap card effect
This is amazing! The cards are so awesome! You definitely have the creativity and wacky ideas that I'm sure the game will feel as if it came directly from the world! It's amazing!
This is gonna be a really fun series to keep up with. Thank you for undergoing this feat
For the discard with an empty hand, they could theoretically discard a card from the top of their deck, then draw. Which would mill their own deck faster
If a small deck were had, itd be fairly impactful
I mentioned this on the last video, but I think a minimum had size would be useful. Instead of having cards that grant you draws, you instead have a set hand size of 5 that you draw up to on draw phase. Discard before that gives players the opportunity to remove "dead" cards from their hand before replacing them.
Also, I would once again like to mention The Pokemon trading cards game's method of starting the game with weak/basic Pokemon on your bench. Might be a good way to populate the play field before turns begin. This would also potentially allow for sacrifice mechanics to get out scarier creatures.
This is super cool!! I'm excited to watch you continue to work and develop! You're the bomb!
This is amazing! As a casual viewer of the show I can’t wait to see where this goes. Keep up the good work!
I really like the idea of only ever having 5 cards playable in the hand by always drawing and discarding. It is a very good idea.
Underrated channel. loving this series.
Your should make each turn a season or time of day that impacts certain crit levels or actions of certain animals. Make it naturally change every turn or give cards like "Snow storm, an unexpected winter storm has blown through. Winter is early" and snow elements and wind elements would get a massive buff and corn would take a hit.
one thing to remember is that cards can have effects that "break" the base rules of the game.
You do NOT need to have your base rules account of or even allows all of the things you see done in the tv show.
These effects can be moved to the card its self.
I hope this helps the dev process b/c this is a very important rule in pretty much all tcgs.
for example
bald man: During each player's standby phase: randomly choose a player and roll a d6. based on the result move the bald man there.
this way you do not need to account for this interaction in your base rules.
I don't know if anyone else have brought this up yet, but creatures could just have special abilities that trigger when they enter the battlefield, instead of them being spells/creatures. The earlings, for example, would scare up to two of your opponent's creatures for their next turn as their ability trigger.
Maybe I'm looking at it purely from an MTG perspective, but it's something that could work really well with Card Wars
For the dice damage i suggest something like that:
1= the creature misses the attack.
Any number from 2 to 5 = the creature deals it's normal damage.
6= the creature deals crit damage which can mean double damage or each creature has it's own crit damage which I think is a bit better than just double damge I mean it will make more interesting cards and fun interactions not just higher number higher crit .
Also maybe having the special effect of a card(creatures and can add structures that will activate an attack during combat )tied with a certain number from 1 to 6 which will add more randomness as you want.
You're awesome...I wish I had the patience and skill to take up a project like this!
love the ideas and cant wait for the game to come out. keep up the good work :D
I am so excited to see this
Maybe if you run out of cards in hand you can sacrifice cards to get another one
I've always wanted to play show accurate card wars since I was a kid 🥹 watching these make me so happy! Love your videos please never stop making them
I think an element of chaos and randomness at the core of Card wars’s design would be interesting and really fun and chaotic. This could be an explanation as to why Jake, despite being an experienced player, was surprised at a lot of the things which happened on Finn’s turn. Like maybe the Immortal maze walker only switches sides from spirit tower at a really low percent chance BUT since the pig made the cornfields less powerful the spirit tower had an advantage over a percent increase.
Also Respect for the use of cave story music.
this is looking awesome! Keep up the good work :) you have something really special here i think. Just as a side note, in some TCGs the players do say "in my X phase..." to then follow with "in my attack phase"...in the few MTG tournaments i played this was more often than not. These were in the UK, so not sure if it's a country thing or not.