You have a great aesthetic. I think the Bolex falls over because while you can get the static balance correct, once the film starts to move through the gate the dynamic balance would likely be all over the place and the motors on the gimbal fails. The Camera motors moving, the weight distribution of the film is changing every second as the film spools from one reel to the other, and then the film is vibrating inside the camera, so there is a lot of shifting going on that would affect your dynamic balance. Beside that, you got great footage out of it.
As someone mentioned, the film moving from one spool to the other will affect the weight distribution more than you'd think. This is why cameras like the Arri-flex moves the film horizontally. I wonder if adding a counter weight under the camera would help move the center of gravity down to help stabilize. Either way, great footage outside of the wobbles. 16mm just looks so amazing.
I recently did this with a Super 8 Braun Nizo, on a lighter Ronin of course. I mounted my phone on the top of the camera though so that caused some balancing issues.
something about the robot-ness / flawed motion of the ronin mixed with the organic qualities of 16mm is really interesting in juxtaposition, you just have to find the right use for it.
AT LAST!!! At last somebody did something different! Well done Geoff! I am so tired of every fucking YT video about Bolex, shooting hand-held fucking boring stuff. This is Bolex + DJI Ronin S is fresh! Love it!
Using the GoPro as an additional viewfinder was wicked smart. My first thought about mounting my super 8 on a gimbal was how the heck I was going to line up my shot- this is a stellar workaround!
How did you attach the GoPro onto your camera? Was there a hot shoe on top of the camera to attach it to? I’m going to try this out of my Super 8 too but don’t want to damage the outside of the camera with anything
Nice work, mate! Pity about the ronin not holding the Bolex. Did you stiffen the motors for different payloads? You need to use the app for that alteration. It should technically hold the Bolex , even if it is too heavy.
you know i was wondering that myself. the film was loaded in daylight so we can expect a burn on opening, but was unloaded in a dark bag in a darkroom so idk about the closing burnout. could have been the viewfinder but the leak looks like spots and not a soft edged light bloom that you would expect from a light leak. its a possibility tho. another possibility is it might have been not dried completely after development, so when it was rolled out to be scanned the film was a little stuck to itself and peeled in the few droplets where we see the leak.
I didn't know what a Ronin S was, and I didn't know DJI made things other than drones, so at first, I thought you had somehow put a Bolex on a drone. Now THAT would be ridiculous. XD
I love your style and 16mm videos! Just bought a Bolex SBM with Kern 16-100mm Zoom. Lucky Me! Guess watching your video 10 times was kind of an insparation! One question: Since the Kern is not very wide - are u happy with the Switar 10mm u got? Is it sharp enough? Any glue where to get one? THX man !
PRESSYES MUSIC congratulations on the buy. it just depends on the project and look you want. the 10mm for these are the widest they make - there is a screw on 5mm front element that i was looking at for a while from kern. about $500. they are very sharp, pretty clean character for it’s time, and the r version of the lenses are designed to compensate for the slight prism distortion. the 10mm is about a 28mm/30mm fov - personally id like to go wider at 20mm or 24mm. so to do so, the options would be that screw on adapter i mentioned, getting a optex illumina 8mm (they make a 7.5 also i believe) for about 3k - i’ve seen some dp using it and it’s incredible. leica like. and the last option is the peleng (think that’s the spelling) 8mm 2.5 i believe, about 300$ on ebay. it comes as an ef mount, so it can be adapted to c mount. if you got the sbm, and want to use cmount or other glass you’re gonna need the bayonet to cmount adapter btw. about 100-150
switars can be had on ebay, definitely buy the best condition you can afford. people tend to embellish quality level a bit. if you get a good one they hold their value well. a return policy and good feedback on the seller is strongly preferred
@@ignacioarayaramirez2726 frame it first, and then quickly flip the switch. the lock is like a switch on the side of the camera, takes about half a second to turn it on and off
have fun but for me it was too fineky. i wouldn’t want to do it again, would rather try a simple flycam or something stronger like a movi. or just shoot it handheld i just guessed the focus distance and rolled. think i stoped down to f2? and that helped
This one looks sooooo good what frame rate did you shot the Bolex with? even with the failure of the ronin - that shots that came out looks so nice. Absolutely love the mood. I was wondering if you have some issues with lightleaks. What are those red things in the top left corner?
John Tuesday yeah i asked the developer about them - they weren’t sure it might be it was something with the drying of developer and the liquid stuck a little bit around the sprocket hole / there was a tiny bit of rubbing and it wore through part of a layer of the film causing that issue. if it was a light leak it would be soft and more of a gradient . so i cleaned my bolex and will shoot again and see if it happens again. i shot this at 36p and slowed to 24p, to soften it up a tiny bit
Did the issues come from the Ronin's weight limit? Or it was under the limit, but the general top heavy design of the bolex made it difficult to balance?
good question both i’ve ran a c300 on here which is also top heavy, and is pushing the weight limit. worked fine so if it was less tall, or if it was lighter, it would work. best bet when stabilizing a bolex is a more powerful gimbal or a steady cam, which i think im more lean towards, as i like the natural movement as compared to the robotic gimbal movement
the bolex sbm is mechanical and you wind it up to power it the ebm is electric and needs a custom battery or wall mounted power. i know a couple people who have solved batteries for it, not too complex
T.Y.G. yeah you can load in light. you can see the difference between loading in daylight and offload in a darkbag in a dark room by comparing the beginning and end of the footage. probably a bad habit. but it’s interesting to watch. think i was at f2 here which equals a f 4.5 depth of field on 35mm, set the focus by eyeballing the distance. on 16mm the falloff from focus to out of focus is more gradual compared with 35mm, and especially compared to 120mm. the bigger the surface area the steeper the falloff curve
Iguane Productions probably shouldn’t tho. vision 3 500t. got it from pro 8 in burbank. for reference the fipm burn at the start of the footage was from loading in daylight, and the light leaks at the end of the footage is from unloading in a changing bag
any 16mm film that is 100ft can be loaded in daylight as it has a daylight spool to cover most of the film from being exposed. Now "most" of the film is covered with the spool". if in daylight you will lose a few seconds while loading your camera or unloading your camera. But if you want every second of your film with no light leaks it is best to load and unload in complete darkness.
Jordan this is the native ratio of 16mm. super 16mm, is shooting on the same film but people modify the camera so the image is captured wider at a 16:9 ratio
if you like the look of film - the way it renders color, and captures luminosity, then there’s no replacement. personally i absolutely love it. you can look around on here an vimeo to see if super 8, 16mm, or 35mm is the look you want. basically there are super 8, 16mm, 35mm film cameras. for this category (16mm), it’s a great entry level camera. very very well built, cheeper than the higher priced sr2/3 bodies that will run about 10k for the system. i got this with a bid for about $600. but this model usually runs about 1-2k it cost $150 for the roll of film (including development and scanning) for what i shot here, about 2-3 minutes depending on the frame rate
Geoffrey Gonzales I was looking into 16mm seems about right for I want. my only concern is that if I shoot a music video I don’t know how I would sync the audio besides manually syncing in but 150 is not bad tbh!! Gonna keep doing research thanks for replying fast and making dope content! You most def earned my sub! Thanks! 😃😃😃👌🏿👌🏿👌🏿🙌🏿🙌🏿🙌🏿
they make a crystal sync motor for the newer models, rex 3 4 5 sb sbm. so yeah you’re gonna have to sync it but the speed will not drift which is a pain. this happens bc it’s powered by a spring and regulated by a spinning weight, so it’s variable the electric ones obviously already are synced
Kristian Abenojar one 100’ roll (2 and a half minutes long at 24p) is 50$, to develop and scan at 6k is 100$ i just get the 150$ package from pro 8 in burbank you probably can get it under 100$ if you scan at lower resolutions
Abe SC yeah maybe. if i hae to shoot 16mm stabilized i’ll probably just go with a flycam, simpler less finicky and has more organic movement which will probably pair with the cellulose well
@@GeoffreyGonzales that makes sense! Also, side note, somebody made some adjustments to the rig you made that I think you might appreciate ua-cam.com/video/HzxGXvM8Qdg/v-deo.html
Victor Zhao wow that’s a lot of film. what kind? you can always shoot it and then mail it in to them to develop with a harddrive. might be expensive tho
geoffrey gonzales I have Korda 7203 7213 7207 7219，now I uploaded a video here of my bolex ，welcome to watch it ua-cam.com/video/fmGgtpNeOX4/v-deo.html
I want to try this with my Bolex and Ronin S. It looks good! Bolex's probably don't balance well due to the film shifting the weight as you use it and other mechanical things maybe changing and throwing it off balance. Also a bit top heavy and probably almost too heavy for the Ronin. The light leaks on the sides of your film are probably due to you loading it in direct sunlight. I cringed when I saw that as you're supposed to load in low light areas or better yet, in the dark or a dark bag. Thanks for Sharing!
it didn’t work that well, very finicky. if i had to do it again i would try a flycam. but have at it - when i was testing it without a correction filter and nd filter and film it was working pretty well. also the gopro on top didn’t help the light leaks look like spatter to me, not soft as leaks tend to let me know how the footage turns out
if i remember correctly the bolex stuff was shot in 32p, slowed down 25% to 24p. bts commentary shot in 60p. the bolex footage duplicated 2.5 frames to fill so it’s still reads at 24p visually. this conversion is the same thing as watching a 24p movie at home on your 60hz tv / monitor.
I'll pass on the Ronin with a Bolex. I'm sure there are better options. I would be using a lot of swear words during a shoot like that, worse than "heck" and "gosh darn."
finally, somebody did it.
I was wondering if it was possible, and I still think it is
You have a great aesthetic. I think the Bolex falls over because while you can get the static balance correct, once the film starts to move through the gate the dynamic balance would likely be all over the place and the motors on the gimbal fails. The Camera motors moving, the weight distribution of the film is changing every second as the film spools from one reel to the other, and then the film is vibrating inside the camera, so there is a lot of shifting going on that would affect your dynamic balance. Beside that, you got great footage out of it.
haha I love this, I finally got a bolex and my roommate just got a ronin s and immediately suggested we try this
As someone mentioned, the film moving from one spool to the other will affect the weight distribution more than you'd think. This is why cameras like the Arri-flex moves the film horizontally. I wonder if adding a counter weight under the camera would help move the center of gravity down to help stabilize.
Either way, great footage outside of the wobbles. 16mm just looks so amazing.
I recently did this with a Super 8 Braun Nizo, on a lighter Ronin of course. I mounted my phone on the top of the camera though so that caused some balancing issues.
something about the robot-ness / flawed motion of the ronin mixed with the organic qualities of 16mm is really interesting in juxtaposition, you just have to find the right use for it.
AT LAST!!! At last somebody did something different! Well done Geoff! I am so tired of every fucking YT video about Bolex, shooting hand-held fucking boring stuff. This is Bolex + DJI Ronin S is fresh! Love it!
As someone that wants to try and build a 16mm camera so that we can use modern tech with it, this is very promising stuff.
Using the GoPro as an additional viewfinder was wicked smart. My first thought about mounting my super 8 on a gimbal was how the heck I was going to line up my shot- this is a stellar workaround!
How did you attach the GoPro onto your camera? Was there a hot shoe on top of the camera to attach it to? I’m going to try this out of my Super 8 too but don’t want to damage the outside of the camera with anything
@@superlovefilmmaking hot shoe to 1420 gopro mount
Another cool hack I've seen is taping a phone to the eyepiece of the bolex and using the phone as monitor
this is dope why am i just seeing this
Some smooth shots there bruv
Interesting. I'm looking for one of those to use with a Super-8 camera.
Great work man!!! Looks so different!!
Great work bud, I didn’t the same thing but with the regular Ronin worked pretty good . Keep film alive bud!!
Pasadena shooters in the house!
This is so fun!!!
Im trying it right now on the zhiyun crane 3s. So how the hell did you pull focus?
Your content is super next level!
A dream!
hey are you pressing the shutter release button on the front or are you doing it a different way. Thanks
there is a shutter lock on the side
5:10 !!! You should do the DSLR build tutorial video ! I don't own a Sony but, the idea behind that build looks cool.. Would love to try it.
Nice work, mate! Pity about the ronin not holding the Bolex. Did you stiffen the motors for different payloads? You need to use the app for that alteration. It should technically hold the Bolex , even if it is too heavy.
Pretty great comfy content
F*ckin lit. Dunno why this nvr occurred to me. Been meaning to drop by Pro8 to pick up some stock, now I got an excuse
Looks like you forgot to cover the viewfinder and light is coming in thru it
I understand the light leaks now. Loaded in sunlight….😅
tengo una bolex reflex h16 nueva jamas se grabo esta sin uso mi productora de tv lleva su nombre ...muy bueno tu video
where does the light leak coming from? didn't close the viewfinder or no filter tray or what?
you know i was wondering that myself. the film was loaded in daylight so we can expect a burn on opening, but was unloaded in a dark bag in a darkroom so idk about the closing burnout. could have been the viewfinder but the leak looks like spots and not a soft edged light bloom that you would expect from a light leak. its a possibility tho. another possibility is it might have been not dried completely after development, so when it was rolled out to be scanned the film was a little stuck to itself and peeled in the few droplets where we see the leak.
I didn't know what a Ronin S was, and I didn't know DJI made things other than drones, so at first, I thought you had somehow put a Bolex on a drone. Now THAT would be ridiculous. XD
🤔
ua-cam.com/video/lsRexSiCx20/v-deo.html
What did you use to mount to the bottom of your Bolex to attach it to the stabilizer?
Great work
Awesome video! You think the latest Ronin S2 will handle the bolex weight much better ?
probably, the payload of the ronin s is 8lb where the payload of the s2 is 30lb
@@GeoffreyGonzales any update (going into 2022) on what gimbal would best hold this setup’s payload
This is so cool.
Bo Chen thanks mang
I love your style and 16mm videos! Just bought a Bolex SBM with Kern 16-100mm Zoom. Lucky Me! Guess watching your video 10 times was kind of an insparation! One question: Since the Kern is not very wide - are u happy with the Switar 10mm u got? Is it sharp enough? Any glue where to get one? THX man !
PRESSYES MUSIC congratulations on the buy. it just depends on the project and look you want. the 10mm for these are the widest they make - there is a screw on 5mm front element that i was looking at for a while from kern. about $500. they are very sharp, pretty clean character for it’s time, and the r version of the lenses are designed to compensate for the slight prism distortion. the 10mm is about a 28mm/30mm fov - personally id like to go wider at 20mm or 24mm. so to do so, the options would be that screw on adapter i mentioned, getting a optex illumina 8mm (they make a 7.5 also i believe) for about 3k - i’ve seen some dp using it and it’s incredible. leica like. and the last option is the peleng (think that’s the spelling) 8mm 2.5 i believe, about 300$ on ebay. it comes as an ef mount, so it can be adapted to c mount.
if you got the sbm, and want to use cmount or other glass you’re gonna need the bayonet to cmount adapter btw. about 100-150
switars can be had on ebay, definitely buy the best condition you can afford. people tend to embellish quality level a bit. if you get a good one they hold their value well. a return policy and good feedback on the seller is strongly preferred
@@GeoffreyGonzales Thanks man! Your advice is highly appreciated !! Can't wait to shoot !
dope video man! i'm considering transitioning to film and i'm really liking this camera thanks to your video!
epic
yaaassssssssssss
he got the RZ and the BOFLEX, thats some BDE bro
2 poor life decisions
@@GeoffreyGonzales the bolex yes, the RZ absolutely not. if you had an rb then I would have agreed on the poor life decision
I don't recognize the label on the box for your film stock. Is it Kodak or something else?
it’s vision 500t, repackaged by pro8 in burbank
How did you trigger the camera? It seems the release button is pretty far away from the grips you set on the ronin 🤔🤔
the trigger can be locked when it is pressed
@@GeoffreyGonzales yes i know, but how was your workflow? You just locked the shutter and wasted some seconds before and after?
@@ignacioarayaramirez2726 frame it first, and then quickly flip the switch. the lock is like a switch on the side of the camera, takes about half a second to turn it on and off
Balance may have been a pain but you got nice footage
you´re crazy man!! Keep it up!
Great video man, definitely gonna try it with my Bolex and a ronin-s. You had any issue focusing without look into the viewer?
have fun but for me it was too fineky. i wouldn’t want to do it again, would rather try a simple flycam or something stronger like a movi. or just shoot it handheld
i just guessed the focus distance and rolled. think i stoped down to f2? and that helped
This one looks sooooo good
what frame rate did you shot the Bolex with? even with the failure of the ronin - that shots that came out looks so nice. Absolutely love the mood.
I was wondering if you have some issues with lightleaks. What are those red things in the top left corner?
John Tuesday yeah i asked the developer about them - they weren’t sure
it might be it was something with the drying of developer and the liquid stuck a little bit around the sprocket hole / there was a tiny bit of rubbing and it wore through part of a layer of the film causing that issue. if it was a light leak it would be soft and more of a gradient .
so i cleaned my bolex and will shoot again and see if it happens again.
i shot this at 36p and slowed to 24p, to soften it up a tiny bit
My brother in Christ you loaded the film in broad daylight. Do it in the shade or in a dark bag next time.
cool
Did the issues come from the Ronin's weight limit? Or it was under the limit, but the general top heavy design of the bolex made it difficult to balance?
good question
both
i’ve ran a c300 on here which is also top heavy, and is pushing the weight limit. worked fine
so if it was less tall, or if it was lighter, it would work.
best bet when stabilizing a bolex is a more powerful gimbal or a steady cam, which i think im more lean towards, as i like the natural movement as compared to the robotic gimbal movement
@@GeoffreyGonzales right on, thanks for the reply! I've got a K3 and researching what stabilizer will be a good fit. I'm leaning towards a flycam
hmm yes interesting video
Nice! I want a bolex too!
*palpatine voice* do it
Hey how were you powering the camera? I’m gonna get one but idk how to power the camera besides wall power
the bolex sbm is mechanical and you wind it up to power it
the ebm is electric and needs a custom battery or wall mounted power. i know a couple people who have solved batteries for it, not too complex
@@GeoffreyGonzales thank you, ya I realized after watching it was the windup h16 haha
got so many questions key being the rig. then, did i just see you load the camera in broad daylight? how do you get good focus
T.Y.G. yeah you can load in light. you can see the difference between loading in daylight and offload in a darkbag in a dark room by comparing the beginning and end of the footage. probably a bad habit. but it’s interesting to watch.
think i was at f2 here which equals a f 4.5 depth of field on 35mm, set the focus by eyeballing the distance. on 16mm the falloff from focus to out of focus is more gradual compared with 35mm, and especially compared to 120mm. the bigger the surface area the steeper the falloff curve
@@GeoffreyGonzales 'k thanks!
Interesting, you can load film directly in daylight without light leaks ? What kind of film is this, regular Vision 3 ?
Iguane Productions probably shouldn’t tho. vision 3 500t. got it from pro 8 in burbank.
for reference the fipm burn at the start of the footage was from loading in daylight, and the light leaks at the end of the footage is from unloading in a changing bag
@@GeoffreyGonzales how do you get light leaks from unloading in a changing bag?
@@ollek um, yeah you’re right idk want i was trying to say here. not sure where it came from at the end
any 16mm film that is 100ft can be loaded in daylight as it has a daylight spool to cover most of the film from being exposed.
Now "most" of the film is covered with the spool". if in daylight you will lose a few seconds while loading your camera or unloading your camera. But if you want every second of your film with no light leaks it is best to load and unload in complete darkness.
was you shooting at 24fps and what was your f-stop for most of the shots if you remember?
was shooting at 32p (slowed in post to 24) and wide open on this 10mm 1.4
May I ask what kind of lens it is?
switar 10mm rx 1.4
Think Issac Newton could tell ya why it worked fine without film and a running motor !
he isnt responding to my dms
how did you get that ratio ? Crop ?
Jordan this is the native ratio of 16mm. super 16mm, is shooting on the same film but people modify the camera so the image is captured wider at a 16:9 ratio
the title. i love it! haha was the film cam worth it? would you recommend or na? great video!
if you like the look of film - the way it renders color, and captures luminosity, then there’s no replacement. personally i absolutely love it. you can look around on here an vimeo to see if super 8, 16mm, or 35mm is the look you want.
basically there are super 8, 16mm, 35mm film cameras.
for this category (16mm), it’s a great entry level camera. very very well built, cheeper than the higher priced sr2/3 bodies that will run about 10k for the system. i got this with a bid for about $600. but this model usually runs about 1-2k
it cost $150 for the roll of film (including development and scanning) for what i shot here, about 2-3 minutes depending on the frame rate
Geoffrey Gonzales I was looking into 16mm seems about right for I want. my only concern is that if I shoot a music video I don’t know how I would sync the audio besides manually syncing in but 150 is not bad tbh!! Gonna keep doing research thanks for replying fast and making dope content! You most def earned my sub! Thanks! 😃😃😃👌🏿👌🏿👌🏿🙌🏿🙌🏿🙌🏿
they make a crystal sync motor for the newer models, rex 3 4 5 sb sbm. so yeah you’re gonna have to sync it but the speed will not drift which is a pain. this happens bc it’s powered by a spring and regulated by a spinning weight, so it’s variable
the electric ones obviously already are synced
Gufffabbbppff A 5K scan from 16mm?!
Tyson L 4444 🙃
Is it expensive to develop 16mm film?
Kristian Abenojar one 100’ roll (2 and a half minutes long at 24p) is 50$, to develop and scan at 6k is 100$
i just get the 150$ package from pro 8 in burbank
you probably can get it under 100$ if you scan at lower resolutions
Maybe try adding some counterweights! Check out Make Art Now's video on balancing the Ronin with crazy camera weight
Abe SC yeah maybe. if i hae to shoot 16mm stabilized i’ll probably just go with a flycam, simpler less finicky and has more organic movement which will probably pair with the cellulose well
@@GeoffreyGonzales that makes sense!
Also, side note, somebody made some adjustments to the rig you made that I think you might appreciate
ua-cam.com/video/HzxGXvM8Qdg/v-deo.html
How did you developed your film ？by yourself or some studio？
i drop it off at pro8 in burbank, they develop it. i get it scanned at 5k log overscan
geoffrey gonzales So lucky in California, there is no place in China to develop it，I have about 1600feet 16mm film not use ☹️
Victor Zhao wow that’s a lot of film. what kind?
you can always shoot it and then mail it in to them to develop with a harddrive. might be expensive tho
geoffrey gonzales I have Korda 7203 7213 7207 7219，now I uploaded a video here of my bolex ，welcome to watch it ua-cam.com/video/fmGgtpNeOX4/v-deo.html
quick question again, did the lab color correct this or did you send it as a log-c file and color corrected yourself?
they scanned it and i requested log. corrected it myself
@@GeoffreyGonzales okay thank u so much I just sent out my film and requested log c as well!
What shutter speed and frame rate were you filming in?
Casey Pflipsen 32p amd then i slowed it down slightly for here. softens up the movement a bit but still feels natural
@@GeoffreyGonzales thanks!
I want to try this with my Bolex and Ronin S. It looks good!
Bolex's probably don't balance well due to the film shifting the weight as you use it and other mechanical things maybe changing and throwing it off balance. Also a bit top heavy and probably almost too heavy for the Ronin.
The light leaks on the sides of your film are probably due to you loading it in direct sunlight. I cringed when I saw that as you're supposed to load in low light areas or better yet, in the dark or a dark bag.
Thanks for Sharing!
it didn’t work that well, very finicky. if i had to do it again i would try a flycam.
but have at it - when i was testing it without a correction filter and nd filter and film it was working pretty well. also the gopro on top didn’t help
the light leaks look like spatter to me, not soft as leaks tend to
let me know how the footage turns out
why upload in 5k60? it feels extremely unnatural now
if i remember correctly the bolex stuff was shot in 32p, slowed down 25% to 24p. bts commentary shot in 60p. the bolex footage duplicated 2.5 frames to fill so it’s still reads at 24p visually.
this conversion is the same thing as watching a 24p movie at home on your 60hz tv / monitor.
I'll pass on the Ronin with a Bolex. I'm sure there are better options. I would be using a lot of swear words during a shoot like that, worse than "heck" and "gosh darn."
that was my conclusion as well, at the end of the video
Unhappy ronin I se
get a bigger ronin and use 50D
50d for sure. steadycam seems more realistic for this
nice try