Well done! When I got my Linn I read everything I could, It then took 9 hours to successfully get it bouncing correctly but it was worth the effort. I hope you’re now enjoying it as much as I do.
The LP12 still is king and always will be. It even looks like a record player unlike some that look like an oil rig or something from the inside of an old washing machine. Quality costs money and the Lp 12 is worth every penny. They are a bit fiddly to set up but once you learn it is easy to achieve and don't forget to twist the springs to get the bounce correct this is done by holding the bottom of the spring with finger and thumb and pushing it upwards and turning it at the same time. Always try this if you cannot get the bounce right one spring at a time . Yes it makes a difference. Then once you have your bounce correct don't forget to level the arm. The top of the arm tube must be 100% level with the arm and stylus resting on top of an lp on the platter. Only then is your LP12 properly set up.
I also had an LP12 Sondek for a few years and, while I enjoyed it's sound, I gave up eventually and sold it. The constant fiddling and uncertainty of the suspension staying as it should, became too much for me. In its place I got a ClearAudio non suspended t/t which is plug and play, as long as you level it correctly. Much happier now the paranoia has gone! 🙂
The Thorens suspension (upon which the Linn is plagiarised) is far superior...better made, better quality materials and easier to set up. The Thorens TD 160 Super was a masterpiece.
I love the Linn Sondek, now I have a Thorens which is very good but the LP12 is excellent, both have independent suspension to avoid feedback, all others for me are garbage because they feedback bass
Well done. I've just dismantled and cleaned, rewired and re-assembled a SME 3009 2 improved, proving that, like you, these things can be done with patience. Now about this old Omega watch of my Dads thats stopped.............. .......
I enjoyed your video. From the late 1970s I’ve been entertained by all the debate surrounding the Linn Sondek LP12. Here we are in 2024, and it still entertains! In March 1983, I purchased a Heybrook TT2 deck, with Linn LVX arm and A&R P77 cartridge from Paul Green in the City of Bath. Price £270. Paul let me take home for the previous weekend, a Linn LP12 and a Heybrook TT2, for auditioning . Following that weekend of listening, I found that I could discern no significant difference between the two decks, so purchased the Heybrook. I still have that Heybrook in its original state. Only the drive belt and the cartridge have been replaced - just once, with identical replacements. The deck has throughout those 41 years performed without fault, and consistently given me utterly satisfying enjoyment of the music from my LPs, and all without periodical Linn style ‘services/upgrades’. I guess I just ‘missed out’ in the last 41 years on all that hectic LP12 ‘after-life’. When in the process of purchasing my first CD Player in January 1993, I remember listening to a host of CD players at Radford HiFi, and grumbling quietly to the shop manager that I was disappointed that this so called ‘great improvement’ in sound quality via the then new CD format, was not as great as I had been led to believe. “That’s because of the quality of the Heybrook deck”, came back the reply. Once the I had [purchased the CD Player (Rotel, Limited Edition, £380), all my subsequent music purchases were CDs. The Heybrook just plays my old LPs. I sense that Turn-Table purchasers are in reality, just trying to hang onto the coat tails of the higher quality digital CD audio. And for what it is worth: The quality of the audio coming out of our loud speakers is governed by the skills of the recording studio, getting its work cleanly transferred into the grove or digital reproduction formats. Our chosen home electronics simply play back what has been stored into either the LP’s grove, or the CD’s digital encoding. No doubt the Linn LP12 debate will continue, and I will continue to be entertained. Thanks to you one and all down through the years.
i have an LP12 and a Thorens TD150 mk1. I changed the springs on my Thorens, and can confirm its a job that requires patience and full focus. it is however very rewarding when its done. Arm wise i have an SME3009 mkII with a fluid damper trough and auto arm lifter fitted to LP12, and a Rega 350 fitted to the Thorens, also fitted with trough dampener. one for 45's and the other for 33Lps. they keep me very happy.
With the springs and grommets removed check the suspension retention bolts are tight against the top plate before rebuilding. Always, always, always disconnect the tonearm lead before attempting any suspension adjustments. the tonearm cable is effectively a fourth spring and will influence suspension alignment. Once you're happy that the armboard is parallel with the plinth cut-out, the platter is level and the bounce motion correct (up-down pistonic; no wobble or rotational movement) reconnect the arm lead to ensure the suspension alignment is not compromised (the arm lead may push / pull against the suspension). If the suspension is affected the arm lead will need redressing and, probably, the length adjusting in the plinth "P" clip until the difference in suspension alignment with lead disconnected / reconnected is minimised. A hair dryer can be (carefully) used to re profile the arm lead if it looks in danger of fouling anywhere. Same principle with the drive belt (not the hair dryer though!!)which should always be removed as, again, it's effectively tensioning / pulling against the suspension (the belt is, effectively, the fifth spring). Once all back together it should be possible (not for the faint hearted this!) to tap the label of a playing record, setting the suspension in motion, without the stylus skipping. If it jumps it's back to the drawing board (or set-up jig!) Hope this helps
I purchased my Linn LP12 back in the 80s and my little Hi-Fi group was stunned by it's performance compared to a Technics direct drive. Marching on and a 32-5, HiCap, 250 (Naim in Salisbury, UK) and the transformation was almost complete. A set of Harbeth BBC style monitor loudspeakers completed the setup. Surreal sounds ensued and the whole group went down this route with some changes to amps and speakers, but the LP12 was the pivotal source. The advent of CDs and CD players were crushed by the LP12 with the A-B demos and evenings of beer fueled analysis - basically any excuse for a party night! The LP12 setup was a thing for magicians back then, but it was all backed up by surprisingly technical reviews of the turntable and it's output and the matching Naim amps. One of the best Hi-Fi demos I've ever heard was the above setup with full blown active Isobarik speakers with a 6 pack of Naim 135 amps (mono block 250s back then). This all took place in a dealers flat over a shopping precinct in Windsor! Those were the days... the current top spec LP12 is a pricey item now, for ever diminishing returns. Oh, and the fluted Afromosia plinth, as you have I think, was always the one to go for... Great video!
I used to sell these in the early days. Often with issues. Baring too tight, took hours to lower the platter. Ticking motors. Many would not purchase as it would only run at 33rpm. No 45 rpm. Thorens TD160 outsold it 10/1 and many hours saved in setting up.
I fabricated 2 plinths for mine 9 years ago then “taught” myself all of its workings…….. Still waiting for my Blue Peter badge though!!..🤪….( some will understand )…. Nice video…
I'll tell you what I think: I think you deserve a medal and a couple of thousand dollars from Mr. Tiefenbrun. No, all kidding aside, I'm about to throw in the towel on my last Linn Sondek LP12 and I have owned three. Let me explain and I feel this very strongly. My current Linn dates to about 1985 and I purchased it from a friend who used to sell them and then, in 1991, he went through a crisis of sorts and dropped out of society. He sold me his Linn. I loved it. So, to try and make this long story short and legible, I have had this 'table for 30 years. And I used to live just south of Tampa Bay, Florida. And there used to be a very good dealer in Tampa. I am going to leave his name unmentioned because I think he lost interest in the "product" and the last time I went for a "tune-up" and considerable upgrades ($2,600); I think he did a miserable job. I believe he is out of business. So, my beef is with Mr. Tiefenbrun. He has made a product that is so "dealer dependent" with a deplorable dearth of dealers, it no longer makes sense to own one. He makes a Ferrari without the dealer support to keep the product tuned and running even if I had the financial wherewithal to do so. You can't just pay $25,000 and get an amazing product that will last you 40 years, no. You have invested in a continual financial tweaking without the people who know what they are doing. That being said, I commend you on your patience and diligence. I do not have the patience to spend money on that "jig" or "rig" even if the one you bought is a clever design and good value and then to spend a day to see if it is bouncing correctly. That's what I paid my dealer for. I'll take a Rega thank you.
@@MrNicks-gn8jc I think you are spot on. I point out later in this discussion that there is a reputable Linn dealer just north of Atlanta, Sound Image. Chris and Lawson are chief proprietors. It's a 4-hour drive. I suppose if I look at a new cartridge every 8-9 years and couple that with springs and a general "tune-up", perhaps it makes sense to keep the 'table. I do own a much cheaper back-up that I could live with: Thorens.
I am from the UK (of a certain age), and prior to watching this video I lusted after this machine. Now I think I should have been "certified" if I'd bought one. However, now that you've gone through the "having teeth pulled" process, I hope it does the "business".
I OWNED THIS TT FOR 12 YEARS, SUFFERED FOR 3 YEARS - PRICEY SURVICE CHARGES, TAUGHT MYSELF HOW TO WORK ON IT AND I CAN DO IT AS GOOD AS ANY.... YOU MUST BE PATIENT AND LISTEN WELL.......
Just started my second period of ownership of an LP12 and loving it. This time I’m going to be buying carefully selected after market upgrades from time to time. The first will be a power supply upgrade from the Valhalla. I have the jig and have already set up the suspension, serviced the Valhalla, replaced the vintage arm cable with Mogami Neglex, fitted a cast base board with three height adjustable vibration absorbing feet and fitted a brand new Audio Technica AT-OCS9SXL moving coil cartridge. I’m so thrilled I have purchased 25 records in a month, from £1 in antique shop to £60 for the latest Coltrane, Blue Train issue due out later in the month. Don’t knock these turntables if you’ve never heard one. They are simply brilliant.
So are many other turntables. The Linn is a great sound turntable, the only problem is Linn has generated so much marketing hyperbole that exaggerates the differences between turntables. I have owned an LP-12 as well as many others and I've listened to them and many arm cartridge combos. The differences are nowhere near as great as Ivor and Linn contend. That's not to take away the LP-12's excellence especially their recent very costly versions. My favourite sounding turntable is the Oracle mk IV which I still use, to my ears it's a bit more vivid and precise... the Linn sounds a bit thicker and romantic but both are great and would suit different amp speaker combos.
@@jimsregaturntableshifijukebox Mij...How's you? Jim's Rega!? I got new devices, I'll subscribe to your new channel.I met you here on Daves channel originally, Nice one.
Anyone saying Linn is nothing special most likely never owned one. It’s a very dependable retro table and extremely well made and engineered plus great for tweakers. My own 1st yr table just went thru a real biblical too the roof flood and after a clean and oil works perfectly because it’s made from real materials no MDF. Regarding this video however It cost me $100 (Aussie)for a full service (first one it’s had) that’s springs and everything, by an ex Linn importer. Good on you for having a go tho. Take no notice of the negative comments about your Linn and enjoy a real piece of HiFi sweetness. One tip. Don’t be stingy on the arm and cartridge and it will reward you for it. Wall mounting also helps with sprung tt designs if you don’t have dead solid flooring.
Hi, Great territorial . I purchased mine back in 1983/4 secondhand for the price of £350 , Sadly now mine sits on my shelving as a piece of art as the motor has packed up last year and electronics and I've been quoted £1500 to have it repaired , and as I am now retired in my 70s I cannot afford to have it done , so I cannot play my vinyl anymore . Phil from the Moulin France.
There's a Linn LP12 for sale near me, but after watching this video, I think I'll stick with my Thorens! A job well done. Any more maintenance to come?
very nice seeing an LP12 in great condition. My dad had an LP12 , A Thorens TD 160 a Garrard 301 and Zero 100s two idler, two belt drives..the Garrards were much easier to maintain, but all four sounded fantastic
If you buy Linn you need to become your own technician. I came to this realization after having to dispose of a Linn turntable and then later the tone arm for lack of serviceable parts. I now see that their newest completely in-house made tone arm uses the same cheap plastic parts at $4000 cost that eventually busted into about eight different pieces and could no longer be glued together (or replaced)on my tonearm. “If it’s _ Scottish it’s CRAP!”
Hi from Germany. I have a linn from the pre Circus ara. I bought a used Walhalla, a Circus kit and a trampolin. Then i build a Table Out of 4 MDF boards. Every thing went great and was a lot of fun. The best Upgrade was the Walhalla. Looking for a used lingo now. Thanks for the Video.
Just make sure it's a Lingo 4 power supply. Early models had noise issues from switch mode power supplies. Plus the four use a 12 volt AC motor with a tachometer for speed control. This guy is a hack. I can't believe anyone listens to him. He doesn't own basic setup tools and runs it through a cheap Parasound phono preamp. It seems that any clown who gets a UA-cam channel is an expert; expert at not knowing what they're doing. Watch videos from proper outlets that have sold Linns for decades(Chesire Audio for one) or any of the others.
The little ribbon connector looked as if it was only partially in on the Valhalla. Check the next time you open it up? I had a Linn from 87 to 94, but replaced it with a much more neutral Pink Triangle Anniversary which is still doing excellent service.
Hi, As I said earlier on my other device Great territorial on the Linn LP 12 , I will get it up and running if not this year beginning of next year, It was strange watching your tutorial this morning get me a bit of inspiration to finally mount my Deck on a separate shelf hanging off the wall because before it was on a stack towel system which sat on the floor on spikes but the big problem was when I lowered the arm I didn’t have much time to get to my seating area before the stylus touch the record problem being I have suspended oak beam flooring and it causes vibration. So the only way now it will move is if I have an earthquake as it is connected to a granite wall which is approximately 3 foot thick. That’s enough of my gambling on, Keep up the great work look forward to your next tutorial, Just thought of something else that you was talking about burning CDs and copying the record, Just after I brought my Linn I purchased a Nakamichi DR2 to copy my vinyl onto tape it is a beautiful bit of kit apart from changing the belt which I done last year it is still going very well . Phil from the moulin France.
Thanks for this excellent detailed video, my Ariston Audio RD 40 is due a service, and that oil may be worth using, not sure if you know but Lynn audio was formed after the 2 directors of Ariston Audio fell out and parted ways with Ivor going off to start Lynn Audio in East Kilbride not far from Glasgow, the RD40 I have was built in Prestwick in the early 80s, Prestwick is about 12 miles from where I live (Irvine). and that old turntable is featured in most of my YT posts, but the old girl is due a service.
Try Glasgow audio, I used them for my RD11 superieur last year and they were great to deal with cost me £80 for technician to go over it n went to collect expecting to pay more ,nope no more.👍
Great effort. The price of these units was and has always been too much for me . The LP12 was promoted as the be all end all TT which isn't the case IMO. I'm happy with my Project TT and MC cartridge combo.
I listened to the Sondek Pink triangle and ended up with the AR ETL 1 turntable which sounded better!Still use it now and also a thorens TD 125 mark ii which I use mostly for mono! I never really was a fan of Linn myself it was overpriced for what it was to me! But it as many fans who love it and that one looks really nice for its age!
You are entitled to saving a bunch of money. And you've saved yourself from all the hype and paranoia of audiophiles and dealers with credit card eyes. Anyone with patience can do what you did. And you can even make your own stand to raise and level the LP-12. I have never been convinced the new springs and grommets are necessary either. Or, special oil. (I think it's good quality machine oil with graphite in it.) Good going, and enjoy your Linn LP-12.
The Thornes 125 uses 3 point suspension also. I just replaced the 40+ year old springs last year. Wow that circuit board seem overly complex for a turntable.
Having watched various operatives play around with the suspension on the Linn then applying the 'bounce test', I confess to being rather amused. In service, the suspended assembly doesn't behave as we're led to believe but rather, the chassis should remain placid while the wooden plinth does the bouncing. In any event, the most careful 'setting up' of this flawed contraption can never ever get the game 'right' and as soon as the turntable is moved, all that effort is set at nought - consider the belt tugging away at the sprung section during playing.
When you have set up a hundred LP12's with all the variations and lately there are a lot of options then maybe you can be called certifiable. I used to work for a LINN dealer, flew out to the distributor for training and have been to the Glasgow factory. The old one, not the beautiful new facility. I set up countless tables including Rega's. But that was a while ago and I definitely do not consider myself a qualified tech anymore. I mean I'm familiar with the latest products and I could do it but I have the local dealer work on mine now as they're as good or better than anyone else with over forty years of experience. I don't know if your video was showing the final setup with the record playing but it looked like the arm board and platter were in motion when it was playing a record. The table Being thirty plus years old thirty plus years old I would check to make sure the three bolts are perpendicular(90deg) to the base. Make sure the base is really level, then take a 4mm Allen key and place it between the platter and the top plate at the three points between where the springs are located and just raise the height of the platter until it clears the Allen key. Don't be too concerned about the arm board other than that it's not touching the base anywhere. Could be other reasons for it not being exactly right. Then adjust the springs making sure the distance between the platter and top plate stays the same, and readjust the height if needed. If you really got this right, you should be able to play an Lp, pick a point between the spindle and tonearm and start tapping to get the platter and arm board into oscillation without it skipping, then you've done a great job. Owning a dedicated socket screwdriver(5/16) is not a bad idea.
3:47 "Once you believe you've sorted out your front end or source, then you can focus on the rest of your components." Sounds so easy when you say it. I've tried to "sort out" my front end for 30 years, changing tons of turntables, cartridges, cables and phono stages. Generally, each sounds better - and worse - than the others in its own ways and depending on the production of whatever record you are currently playing. But that is what keeps the Hi-Fi industry going, I suppose: never having proper industry standards to follow, but everyone to himself following his own agenda or simply shooting in the dark.
@@MODAC I find that I keep ending up in the same spot as where I began, which is with a Thorens TD 150 Mk I upgraded according to a scheme Loricraft was offering sometime around 1990, i.e a much stronger and heavier plinth, a broader arm board and an SME 3009 tonearm. As you can probably imagine it looks almost exactly like a Linn Sondek. You can easily get tighter and more accurate turntables when it comes to speed, rhythm and bass, but the soundscape is like nothing I've come across, open and deep and almost romantic, for want of a better term. It certainly adds something to the music, and it can't just be that pleasant harmonic distortion. I've had Regas and Clearaudios, and in some ways they sound more like a master tape in a studio, but I just can't take that hammering bass and glossy black background, in fact they trigger my tinnitus and even give me muscle contractions in the face. The old Thorens girl is nothing like that; she has something that unsuspended decks, direct drives and moving coil cartridges simply don't offer. They may speak to my brain but not to my heart. At least that's been my view now since the day before yesterday ... Thanks for the video btw ...
Well, hello there... Yes, not quite yet certified until you rebuild that Valhalla Board, it burns up every twenty years or so and it has to be repaired/rebuilt. On eBay, someone will rebuild your board for $109 plus shipping (90 day warranty), $39.37 from Bulgaria, $52.12 plus shipping in Great Britain, or buy the parts yourself for about $50. Tutorials, of course, on UA-cam (isn't everything on UA-cam?). BTW, been there, done that... regards, tio Jimmy
I believe Linn Products has to grant you that certification and it's usually reserved for Linn dealers and involves some rather lengthy hands-on learning sessions. Linn are very particular down the last detail. To be a certified LP-12 setup technician you must cross every T and dot every I exactly as they say.
I had the poor man’s Linn the Heybrook TT2 which was a copy of the Linn setup with a Linn Basic arm. The set up procedure was the same and I update the table mount frame (many years ago) and I had the local dealer do it, badly as it turned and and I redid it, and it was a nightmare to set up as you say. The plus of this is I guess the isolation, the negative is the bounce every time you touch the LP or yen arm pickup. Again as you say, there must be a better way and there are stacks of turntables out there without this annoying bounce! The there is a lot of claims in hifi, but you sill have to get an LP that is flat, undamaged from the pressing/packing procedure (this seems to be back to the old days with this problem) so if any of these issues, then it doesn’t matter how fancy your turntable is! Get a CD player or Stream if you want your music crackle/pop free 😆
I’ve got an Ariston rd11 and rd80 the first upon which the Linn was “ based” , amongst others that feed my compulsion and I agree there are many design flaws one would not expect from a “ high end” product , one is the continually having to pamper and cuddle them just so they do the job correctly . The irritating bounce every time you touch the arm seems one such flaw and overly done by extending to the entire arm board when it needs only to be under the tonearm itself .The Ariston Rd11 was also this way originally but it was remodeled later so the arm board was rigid apart from the separate small plate for the tonearm , which was sprung . so didn’t cause it to bounce when lifting the tonearm at the end of a record and resting one’s wrist on the arm board . The Thorens 150 is the same overly sprung design There are always pros and cons with formats thst translate a live performance into a material , repeatable format . I love my vinyl albums and turntable because they give more than the sum of the parts in pure enjoyment even with their flaws , but some of these just seem to remain due to dogmatic design and a true designer one would have thought would have recognized these flaws and sought to alleviate them , much like Roy Gandy of Rega has said is his design philosophy and all true designers of any equipment . I suppose it’s like any interest, any hobby there often is no reason or logic to explain why one loves and enjoys it , even its limitations .but the limitations and rewards add up to make the whole a more enjoyable experience . Just as classic cars are technically a pain sometimes , are obsolete , slower , need more maintenance and care etc , but when I see an e type jaguar or even an old MG or 50s Ford , I know they are far more enjoyable and loved .sometimes we love the things that are imperfect far more than those that are. At least that’s what I tell myself when I’ve broken down on a country lane in the winter or my early pressing of a rare album has developed a mysterious new scratch . But Linn turntables as great as they are , should they also be so much trouble to get to run correctly ? Because even an E Type Jag runs beautifully for years before needing an engineer just to fix the suspension settings or get the wheels aligned in balance !
@@saudade369 It does say a lot for modern turntables that are fixed, no bouncing. I guess you have seen the mag lift supported platter, it wobbles all over the place, a design gone far to far, the wow and flutter must be awful 😱 But you are right, it’s the sun of the parts 👍
Yes,I’ve been intrigued by the magnetic suspension .it seems a great idea in principle but in my limited understanding of opposing magnets providing a repelling , suspension type cushion they always have a force that is making them very unstable horizontally , and would suggest they are indeed rather unstable . I would have thought if this is the principle they’re based upon the designers would have found a way to compensate but , maybe not as much as needed . Of course I may have totally misunderstood the principle completely , physics was not my subject , pr9bably why I became an artist instead and as far away from it as possible ! It does seem an amazingly good idea though if done well .modern turntables although fixed , do have forms of suspension don’t they , just not the very highly sprung types we’ve grown to know and love ( ahem) . @@David-xl9cp
@@saudade369 I think with Hi-Fi it’s a fad lead world and what’s in this year is the best ever. You read all the fantastic must have reviews and a year later they are going in a completely different direction. I have seen so many must have hi-fi gadgets that have completely disappeared in a couple of years.
Hint. The key to making the suspension easy to adjust, is to make sure that the three spring bolts are absolutely vertical, and not leaning to one side or the other. Linn actually makes a "bolt straightening tool" for doing this, which consists of a T shaped bar the slides over the bolt, and has a level built into the T part. You physically bend the bolts so they are straight. The currently supplied springs are very consistent, and usually require very little tweaking. Also, make sure the top grommets are properly seated, with the flange entirely inside the hole in the subchassis, and that the tonearm cable is dressed in a way that it doesn't influence the position of the subchassis. Good luck!
I enjoyed watching your video. So I'll be watching more of them. I spotted a cat wandering by as you were setting-up the suspension. Cats+ turntables are not a good mix. Hope it didn't insist upon helping you! I have an Axis plus a couple of other makes. The Axis is fitted with a Jelco tonearm and they work well together. Did dealers in your part of the world make such a song and dance about how the platters ring? They were so enthusiastic about how many seconds the platter would ring for. Never understood that, as platters that make or transmit any sort of noise are generally frowned again.
Fantastic video.👍🏼👍🏼You have done great job.Don't care what about say so called audiophile people.I don't like them.I have this turntable.Linn is not for all.some spacial technical sense is must necessary for linn lp12 owner's.but our India no technical support I'm not get for servicing this turntable.very sad.My audio equipment's service engineer suggest to me go for pioneer plx1000.because it available our India.also he give me a new pioneer plx 1000.but I'm not fully satisfied that.🙏🙏🙏
I still have my 1996 LP12 Basik with Akito II Tonearm. The sad part of my Linn story was at the very beginning. I actually took my almost brand new LP12, to a local authorized Linn dealer. I gave them close to $600 for a new K18II Cartridge, that was a ripoff. The dealer kept my LP12 for 6 weeks, that seemed like a very long time to change a cartridge. When I picked it up, and took it home I was happy, used it for about 4 month's. Then one day the queuing mechanism went straight down, literally slid down the plate. When I inspected the Hex Locking Nut on my precious Akito II Tonearm (also barely 6 month's old) HORROR! Some Monkey at the authorized Linn dealer apparently did not have the proper Allen Wrench and took a small screwdriver and literally "bored-out" the threads on the Hex Nut. Sad to say that when I complained, the dealer said that the Warranty of the service had expired. So I never ever bought Linn again. I realize it was not the fault of Linn, but that local Linn dealer never made another penny off me. The Akito II is still damaged, but I managed to find a larger Hex Nut plug and made it work. Eventually I may take that to a reputable machine shop and have then re-thread the part that fastens the queuing level. Hi End Audio is not all peaches and cream.
Great video! Sorry to post to it late. I’m debating purchasing a local 1997 version of this table to replace my Thorens Td166 that I bought back in the 80’s.... thoughts. Enjoy your videos & been subscribed for a while... my Linn search brought me here
She may not think you're deserving of a Linn servicing certificate. But if she's like most partners of audio enthusiasts, I'm sure she thinks you're certifiable.
It’s a stretch to say I am able to discern before and after, if it sounds better with new springs. It’s maintenance, like with a car…original springs were over 30 years old. Easy to do. What did you expect?
Ivor was a hustler selling his snake oil products which at one time I use to sell Late 70s-80s - Linn was a good table nothing special - At seminars he would take a telephone in & out of a listening room trying to convince Listeners there was a difference to sound
I think we should beware of anyone who self-certifies themselves-you don't know what else they teach dealers on the LP12 course at Linn HQ in Eaglesham.
@@MODACHere in Oz $3000 to $5000 will buy a TD1500 = no slouch A Linn Majik is $7,500 to A Climax at $44,000. I appreciate your response but my mind is not changed as yet
I have the original Linn 1972. I kid you not. It's rather flimsily built. The cabinet joinery is/was a joke with a 3mm MDF sheet to cover the bottom.... Over hipped piece of overlarge floating Aluminum plater. The amount of money they milked from the elitist audiophiles who have too much spare money is amazing. As an experiment, in the future, i'm going to remove all the springs and fully tighten the while floating system into a solid non bouncing deck and see if there are any differences in sound. I would doubt that there would be one single Linn owner who would have tried that experiment.
Actually one of the best LP12 setup videos I have seen, great stuff. You are very lucky to get an LP12 from the original owner locally and in that specification and condition, it is just lovely - very jealous. Most in Europe are like Triggers Broom: ua-cam.com/video/LAh8HryVaeY/v-deo.html When I went to buy mine, living here in Ireland, I saw an advert for one down in Cork. I spoke to the Cork man on the phone and he wanted to know why I wanted one, what spec I wanted and all of this, a full interrogation. It was if to say, you can't just buy and LP12 you have to pass the test. He turned out to be a little like yourself, a self certified master of LP12s and whilst I didn't buy his LP12 he did end up changing parts for me and servicing it. He made his own jigs, support stands and had all sorts of ideas about it. A gas man as they say. That was about 15 years ago and I am still in touch with him today. In that time he has had Michell Orbe's, SME 20/2s but still always comes back to the LP12.
You are dreaming , linns latest lp 12 just released is regarded as one of the best regardless of price. Linns turntables are cheap compared to those 3 level decks .this one you have is a dinosaurs
I responded to this post above and how I now feel about the LP12 Turntable. I live in Tennessee. Nearest Linn dealer I know of that will work on them is just north of Atlanta in Roswell, GA. Chris and Lawson at Sound Image. They used to be in Marietta.
What product is there , particularly a highly engineered one , thst needs continual pampering and adjusting just to get it to do its job well amd correctly ? I can think of none . Usually a designer would recognise that there are major design flaws in his product that these continual adjustments are symptoms of something fundamental and needs attention . If a highly designed high end car or aeroplane needed similar attention above the usual demands of safety then a designer would assume something wrong and redesign it . I recognise high end , “ thoroughbreds “ are often sensitive and need occasional pampering but it seems to the extreme in the case of Linn turntables . The design is perhaps flawed , the bounce for example . In a manual deck where the entire arm board bounces along with the platter when ever a hand is placed on it and one needs to retrieve the tonearm from the nd of the record , how ? It seems badly considered in its function and ergonomics to have such moving bouncy parts when one is trying to care for sensitive things like a stylus and record ! Is there perhaps a special Linn arm / wrist jig to place one’s arm when moving off or picking up the tonearm from the bouncing record ? Or am I being very much a heavy handed Phillistine and not understanding the sophisticated ways of the audio elites ?
Great deck but vastly over rated. Even at the time there were numerous decks at least as good as, if not much, much better....Im thinking Thorens TD160 Super, Oracle, Michell, Pink Triangle....Linn, the masterpiece of marketing of over engineering...I know because Ive owned one (over 10 years) and owned their speakers. Very good, but not the greatest. Pure BS.
Well done! When I got my Linn I read everything I could, It then took 9 hours to successfully get it bouncing correctly but it was worth the effort. I hope you’re now enjoying it as much as I do.
The LP12 still is king and always will be. It even looks like a record player unlike some that look like an oil rig or something from the inside of an old washing machine. Quality costs money and the Lp 12 is worth every penny. They are a bit fiddly to set up but once you learn it is easy to achieve and don't forget to twist the springs to get the bounce correct this is done by holding the bottom of the spring with finger and thumb and pushing it upwards and turning it at the same time. Always try this if you cannot get the bounce right one spring at a time . Yes it makes a difference. Then once you have your bounce correct don't forget to level the arm. The top of the arm tube must be 100% level with the arm and stylus resting on top of an lp on the platter. Only then is your LP12 properly set up.
I also had an LP12 Sondek for a few years and, while I enjoyed it's sound, I gave up eventually and sold it.
The constant fiddling and uncertainty of the suspension staying as it should, became too much for me.
In its place I got a ClearAudio non suspended t/t which is plug and play, as long as you level it correctly.
Much happier now the paranoia has gone! 🙂
The Thorens suspension (upon which the Linn is plagiarised) is far superior...better made, better quality materials and easier to set up. The Thorens TD 160 Super was a masterpiece.
I once dated a girl named Linn Bounce in college. 😜. Can't believe how meticulous you were on restoring this turntable. Great job.
Did not restore it. Just needed some maintenance. Thanks
I love the Linn Sondek, now I have a Thorens which is very good but the LP12 is excellent, both have independent suspension to avoid feedback, all others for me are garbage because they feedback bass
Well done. I've just dismantled and cleaned, rewired and re-assembled a SME 3009 2 improved, proving that, like you, these things can be done with patience.
Now about this old Omega watch of my Dads thats stopped..............
.......
I enjoyed your video.
From the late 1970s I’ve been entertained by all the debate surrounding the Linn Sondek LP12. Here we are in 2024, and it still entertains!
In March 1983, I purchased a Heybrook TT2 deck, with Linn LVX arm and A&R P77 cartridge from Paul Green in the City of Bath. Price £270.
Paul let me take home for the previous weekend, a Linn LP12 and a Heybrook TT2, for auditioning .
Following that weekend of listening, I found that I could discern no significant difference between the two decks, so purchased the Heybrook. I still have that Heybrook in its original state. Only the drive belt and the cartridge have been replaced - just once, with identical replacements.
The deck has throughout those 41 years performed without fault, and consistently given me utterly satisfying enjoyment of the music from my LPs, and all without periodical Linn style ‘services/upgrades’.
I guess I just ‘missed out’ in the last 41 years on all that hectic LP12 ‘after-life’.
When in the process of purchasing my first CD Player in January 1993, I remember listening to a host of CD players at Radford HiFi, and grumbling quietly to the shop manager that I was disappointed that this so called ‘great improvement’ in sound quality via the then new CD format, was not as great as I had been led to believe.
“That’s because of the quality of the Heybrook deck”, came back the reply.
Once the I had [purchased the CD Player (Rotel, Limited Edition, £380), all my subsequent music purchases were CDs. The Heybrook just plays my old LPs.
I sense that Turn-Table purchasers are in reality, just trying to hang onto the coat tails of the higher quality digital CD audio.
And for what it is worth: The quality of the audio coming out of our loud speakers is governed by the skills of the recording studio, getting its work cleanly transferred into the grove or digital reproduction formats.
Our chosen home electronics simply play back what has been stored into either the LP’s grove, or the CD’s digital encoding.
No doubt the Linn LP12 debate will continue, and I will continue to be entertained. Thanks to you one and all down through the years.
i have an LP12 and a Thorens TD150 mk1. I changed the springs on my Thorens, and can confirm its a job that requires patience and full focus. it is however very rewarding when its done. Arm wise i have an SME3009 mkII with a fluid damper trough and auto arm lifter fitted to LP12, and a Rega 350 fitted to the Thorens, also fitted with trough dampener. one for 45's and the other for 33Lps. they keep me very happy.
With the springs and grommets removed check the suspension retention bolts are tight against the top plate before rebuilding. Always, always, always disconnect the tonearm lead before attempting any suspension adjustments. the tonearm cable is effectively a fourth spring and will influence suspension alignment. Once you're happy that the armboard is parallel with the plinth cut-out, the platter is level and the bounce motion correct (up-down pistonic; no wobble or rotational movement) reconnect the arm lead to ensure the suspension alignment is not compromised (the arm lead may push / pull against the suspension). If the suspension is affected the arm lead will need redressing and, probably, the length adjusting in the plinth "P" clip until the difference in suspension alignment with lead disconnected / reconnected is minimised. A hair dryer can be (carefully) used to re profile the arm lead if it looks in danger of fouling anywhere. Same principle with the drive belt (not the hair dryer though!!)which should always be removed as, again, it's effectively tensioning / pulling against the suspension (the belt is, effectively, the fifth spring). Once all back together it should be possible (not for the faint hearted this!) to tap the label of a playing record, setting the suspension in motion, without the stylus skipping. If it jumps it's back to the drawing board (or set-up jig!) Hope this helps
I purchased my Linn LP12 back in the 80s and my little Hi-Fi group was stunned by it's performance compared to a Technics direct drive. Marching on and a 32-5, HiCap, 250 (Naim in Salisbury, UK) and the transformation was almost complete. A set of Harbeth BBC style monitor loudspeakers completed the setup. Surreal sounds ensued and the whole group went down this route with some changes to amps and speakers, but the LP12 was the pivotal source. The advent of CDs and CD players were crushed by the LP12 with the A-B demos and evenings of beer fueled analysis - basically any excuse for a party night! The LP12 setup was a thing for magicians back then, but it was all backed up by surprisingly technical reviews of the turntable and it's output and the matching Naim amps. One of the best Hi-Fi demos I've ever heard was the above setup with full blown active Isobarik speakers with a 6 pack of Naim 135 amps (mono block 250s back then). This all took place in a dealers flat over a shopping precinct in Windsor! Those were the days... the current top spec LP12 is a pricey item now, for ever diminishing returns. Oh, and the fluted Afromosia plinth, as you have I think, was always the one to go for... Great video!
I used to sell these in the early days. Often with issues. Baring too tight, took hours to lower the platter. Ticking motors. Many would not purchase as it would only run at 33rpm. No 45 rpm. Thorens TD160 outsold it 10/1 and many hours saved in setting up.
I fabricated 2 plinths for mine 9 years ago then “taught” myself all of its workings…….. Still waiting for my Blue Peter badge though!!..🤪….( some will understand )…. Nice video…
You have definitely earned the right to buy yourself a prize.
thank you.
I'll tell you what I think: I think you deserve a medal and a couple of thousand dollars from Mr. Tiefenbrun. No, all kidding aside, I'm about to throw in the towel on my last Linn Sondek LP12 and I have owned three. Let me explain and I feel this very strongly. My current Linn dates to about 1985 and I purchased it from a friend who used to sell them and then, in 1991, he went through a crisis of sorts and dropped out of society. He sold me his Linn. I loved it. So, to try and make this long story short and legible, I have had this 'table for 30 years. And I used to live just south of Tampa Bay, Florida. And there used to be a very good dealer in Tampa. I am going to leave his name unmentioned because I think he lost interest in the "product" and the last time I went for a "tune-up" and considerable upgrades ($2,600); I think he did a miserable job. I believe he is out of business. So, my beef is with Mr. Tiefenbrun. He has made a product that is so "dealer dependent" with a deplorable dearth of dealers, it no longer makes sense to own one. He makes a Ferrari without the dealer support to keep the product tuned and running even if I had the financial wherewithal to do so. You can't just pay $25,000 and get an amazing product that will last you 40 years, no. You have invested in a continual financial tweaking without the people who know what they are doing. That being said, I commend you on your patience and diligence. I do not have the patience to spend money on that "jig" or "rig" even if the one you bought is a clever design and good value and then to spend a day to see if it is bouncing correctly. That's what I paid my dealer for. I'll take a Rega thank you.
Yes you can invest $25k and get a table that will last 40 years...it's called a TECHNICS SP1000R !! :)
@@MrNicks-gn8jc I think you are spot on. I point out later in this discussion that there is a reputable Linn dealer just north of Atlanta, Sound Image. Chris and Lawson are chief proprietors. It's a 4-hour drive. I suppose if I look at a new cartridge every 8-9 years and couple that with springs and a general "tune-up", perhaps it makes sense to keep the 'table. I do own a much cheaper back-up that I could live with: Thorens.
I am from the UK (of a certain age), and prior to watching this video I lusted after this machine. Now I think I should have been "certified" if I'd bought one. However, now that you've gone through the "having teeth pulled" process, I hope it does the "business".
I OWNED THIS TT FOR 12 YEARS, SUFFERED FOR 3 YEARS - PRICEY SURVICE CHARGES, TAUGHT MYSELF HOW TO WORK ON IT AND I CAN DO IT AS GOOD AS ANY.... YOU MUST BE PATIENT AND LISTEN WELL.......
Just started my second period of ownership of an LP12 and loving it. This time I’m going to be buying carefully selected after market upgrades from time to time. The first will be a power supply upgrade from the Valhalla.
I have the jig and have already set up the suspension, serviced the Valhalla, replaced the vintage arm cable with Mogami Neglex, fitted a cast base board with three height adjustable vibration absorbing feet and fitted a brand new Audio Technica AT-OCS9SXL moving coil cartridge. I’m so thrilled I have purchased 25 records in a month, from £1 in antique shop to £60 for the latest Coltrane, Blue Train issue due out later in the month.
Don’t knock these turntables if you’ve never heard one. They are simply brilliant.
So are many other turntables. The Linn is a great sound turntable, the only problem is Linn has generated so much marketing hyperbole that exaggerates the differences between turntables. I have owned an LP-12 as well as many others and I've listened to them and many arm cartridge combos. The differences are nowhere near as great as Ivor and Linn contend. That's not to take away the LP-12's excellence especially their recent very costly versions. My favourite sounding turntable is the Oracle mk IV which I still use, to my ears it's a bit more vivid and precise... the Linn sounds a bit thicker and romantic but both are great and would suit different amp speaker combos.
Good job Dave I'd say you're competent, due to your care and attention to detail.Nice one bud.All the best from Scotland 🏴
Nice to see you're alive John. 😉
Jim 🏴🙂
@@jimsregaturntableshifijukebox Mij...How's you? Jim's Rega!? I got new devices, I'll subscribe to your new channel.I met you here on Daves channel originally, Nice one.
@@JD-lk7im I'm fine John, just changed the name of my channel, that's all.
Hope all well with you and your wee pal.
Mij/Jim 🏴🙂
Anyone saying Linn is nothing special most likely never owned one. It’s a very dependable retro table and extremely well made and engineered plus great for tweakers.
My own 1st yr table just went thru a real biblical too the roof flood and after a clean and oil works perfectly because it’s made from real materials no MDF.
Regarding this video however It cost me $100 (Aussie)for a full service (first one it’s had) that’s springs and everything, by an ex Linn importer. Good on you for having a go tho. Take no notice of the negative comments about your Linn and enjoy a real piece of HiFi sweetness. One tip. Don’t be stingy on the arm and cartridge and it will reward you for it. Wall mounting also helps with sprung tt designs if you don’t have dead solid flooring.
Hi, Great territorial . I purchased mine back in 1983/4 secondhand for the price of £350 ,
Sadly now mine sits on my shelving as a piece of art as the motor has packed up last year and electronics and I've been quoted £1500 to have it repaired , and as I am now retired in my 70s I cannot afford to have it done , so I cannot play my vinyl anymore .
Phil from the Moulin France.
Thanks. That’s a ridiculous price for a repair. I suggest you look at a new Rega turntable. They are very nice and a fraction of the cost.
Amazing video! I wish to be able to have more turntables to play with. I love your channel. Regards from the UK.
Awesome! Thank you!
Long time ago I fix one LP12 and confirm it sounds a better than my Thorens, specially in the bass definition
There's a Linn LP12 for sale near me, but after watching this video, I think I'll stick with my Thorens! A job well done. Any more maintenance to come?
very nice seeing an LP12 in great condition. My dad had an LP12 , A Thorens TD 160 a Garrard 301 and Zero 100s two idler, two belt drives..the Garrards were much easier to maintain, but all four sounded fantastic
Thanks I am love your sense of humor 😊
If you buy Linn you need to become your own technician. I came to this realization after having to dispose of a Linn turntable and then later the tone arm for lack of serviceable parts. I now see that their newest completely in-house made tone arm uses the same cheap plastic parts at $4000 cost that eventually busted into about eight different pieces and could no longer be glued together (or replaced)on my tonearm. “If it’s _ Scottish it’s CRAP!”
You'll have to be sworn to secrecy and learn the secret handshake. Looking forward to your CAL ICON MK II part 2 video.
Hi from Germany. I have a linn from the pre Circus ara. I bought a used Walhalla, a Circus kit and a trampolin. Then i build a Table Out of 4 MDF boards. Every thing went great and was a lot of fun. The best Upgrade was the Walhalla. Looking for a used lingo now. Thanks for the Video.
I'm looking for a Lingo as well. Thx
Just make sure it's a Lingo 4 power supply. Early models had noise issues from switch mode power supplies. Plus the four use a 12 volt AC motor with a tachometer for speed control. This guy is a hack. I can't believe anyone listens to him. He doesn't own basic setup tools and runs it through a cheap Parasound phono preamp. It seems that any clown who gets a UA-cam channel is an expert; expert at not knowing what they're doing. Watch videos from proper outlets that have sold Linns for decades(Chesire Audio for one) or any of the others.
The little ribbon connector looked as if it was only partially in on the Valhalla. Check the next time you open it up? I had a Linn from 87 to 94, but replaced it with a much more neutral Pink Triangle Anniversary which is still doing excellent service.
Hi, As I said earlier on my other device Great territorial on the Linn LP 12 , I will get it up and running if not this year beginning of next year,
It was strange watching your tutorial this morning get me a bit of inspiration to finally mount my Deck on a separate shelf hanging off the wall because before it was on a stack towel system which sat on the floor on spikes but the big problem was when I lowered the arm I didn’t have much time to get to my seating area before the stylus touch the record problem being I have suspended oak beam flooring and it causes vibration.
So the only way now it will move is if I have an earthquake as it is connected to a granite wall which is approximately 3 foot thick.
That’s enough of my gambling on, Keep up the great work look forward to your next tutorial, Just thought of something else that you was talking about burning CDs and copying the record, Just after I brought my Linn I purchased a Nakamichi DR2 to copy my vinyl onto tape it is a beautiful bit of kit apart from changing the belt which I done last year it is still going very well .
Phil from the moulin France.
Even Garrard turntables from the old mid-century cabinets were on springs.
Thanks for this excellent detailed video, my Ariston Audio RD 40 is due a service, and that oil may be worth using, not sure if you know but Lynn audio was formed after the 2 directors of Ariston Audio fell out and parted ways with Ivor going off to start Lynn Audio in East Kilbride not far from Glasgow, the RD40 I have was built in Prestwick in the early 80s, Prestwick is about 12 miles from where I live (Irvine). and that old turntable is featured in most of my YT posts, but the old girl is due a service.
Try Glasgow audio, I used them for my RD11 superieur last year and they were great to deal with cost me £80 for technician to go over it n went to collect expecting to pay more ,nope no more.👍
@@stevenhunter3454 Thanks, will look into that.
Great effort.
The price of these units was and has always been too much for me . The LP12 was promoted as the be all end all TT which isn't the case IMO. I'm happy with my Project TT and MC cartridge combo.
I listened to the Sondek Pink triangle and ended up with the AR ETL 1 turntable which sounded better!Still use it now and also a thorens TD 125 mark ii which I use mostly for mono! I never really was a fan of Linn myself it was overpriced for what it was to me! But it as many fans who love it and that one looks really nice for its age!
You are entitled to saving a bunch of money. And you've saved yourself from all the hype and paranoia of audiophiles and dealers with credit card eyes. Anyone with patience can do what you did. And you can even make your own stand to raise and level the LP-12.
I have never been convinced the new springs and grommets are necessary either. Or, special oil. (I think it's good quality machine oil with graphite in it.)
Good going, and enjoy your Linn LP-12.
The Thornes 125 uses 3 point suspension also. I just replaced the 40+ year old springs last year. Wow that circuit board seem overly complex for a turntable.
Nicely done Dave 👍
Jim 🏴
Having watched various operatives play around with the suspension on the Linn then applying the 'bounce test', I confess to being rather amused. In service, the suspended assembly doesn't behave as we're led to believe but rather, the chassis should remain placid while the wooden plinth does the bouncing. In any event, the most careful 'setting up' of this flawed contraption can never ever get the game 'right' and as soon as the turntable is moved, all that effort is set at nought - consider the belt tugging away at the sprung section during playing.
When you have set up a hundred LP12's with all the variations and lately there are a lot of options then maybe you can be called certifiable. I used to work for a LINN dealer, flew out to the distributor for training and have been to the Glasgow factory. The old one, not the beautiful new facility. I set up countless tables including Rega's. But that was a while ago and I definitely do not consider myself a qualified tech anymore. I mean I'm familiar with the latest products and I could do it but I have the local dealer work on mine now as they're as good or better than anyone else with over forty years of experience. I don't know if your video was showing the final setup with the record playing but it looked like the arm board and platter were in motion when it was playing a record. The table Being thirty plus years old thirty plus years old I would check to make sure the three bolts are perpendicular(90deg) to the base. Make sure the base is really level, then take a 4mm Allen key and place it between the platter and the top plate at the three points between where the springs are located and just raise the height of the platter until it clears the Allen key. Don't be too concerned about the arm board other than that it's not touching the base anywhere. Could be other reasons for it not being exactly right. Then adjust the springs making sure the distance between the platter and top plate stays the same, and readjust the height if needed. If you really got this right, you should be able to play an Lp, pick a point between the spindle and tonearm and start tapping to get the platter and arm board into oscillation without it skipping, then you've done a great job. Owning a dedicated socket screwdriver(5/16) is not a bad idea.
Thanks for your insightful comments.
3:47 "Once you believe you've sorted out your front end or source, then you can focus on the rest of your components." Sounds so easy when you say it. I've tried to "sort out" my front end for 30 years, changing tons of turntables, cartridges, cables and phono stages. Generally, each sounds better - and worse - than the others in its own ways and depending on the production of whatever record you are currently playing. But that is what keeps the Hi-Fi industry going, I suppose: never having proper industry standards to follow, but everyone to himself following his own agenda or simply shooting in the dark.
Thanks. It’s a journey for sure. I am considering trying out a VPI table in the future. But I’m good for now.
@@MODAC I find that I keep ending up in the same spot as where I began, which is with a Thorens TD 150 Mk I upgraded according to a scheme Loricraft was offering sometime around 1990, i.e a much stronger and heavier plinth, a broader arm board and an SME 3009 tonearm. As you can probably imagine it looks almost exactly like a Linn Sondek. You can easily get tighter and more accurate turntables when it comes to speed, rhythm and bass, but the soundscape is like nothing I've come across, open and deep and almost romantic, for want of a better term. It certainly adds something to the music, and it can't just be that pleasant harmonic distortion. I've had Regas and Clearaudios, and in some ways they sound more like a master tape in a studio, but I just can't take that hammering bass and glossy black background, in fact they trigger my tinnitus and even give me muscle contractions in the face. The old Thorens girl is nothing like that; she has something that unsuspended decks, direct drives and moving coil cartridges simply don't offer. They may speak to my brain but not to my heart. At least that's been my view now since the day before yesterday ... Thanks for the video btw ...
Did check the tone arm cable dressing, when you unplug the cable it should not alter the position of the sub chassis.
Well, hello there... Yes, not quite yet certified until you rebuild that Valhalla Board, it burns up every twenty years or so and it has to be repaired/rebuilt. On eBay, someone will rebuild your board for $109 plus shipping (90 day warranty), $39.37 from Bulgaria, $52.12 plus shipping in Great Britain, or buy the parts yourself for about $50. Tutorials, of course, on UA-cam (isn't everything on UA-cam?). BTW, been there, done that... regards, tio Jimmy
I believe Linn Products has to grant you that certification and it's usually reserved for Linn dealers and involves some rather lengthy hands-on learning sessions. Linn are very particular down the last detail. To be a certified LP-12 setup technician you must cross every T and dot every I exactly as they say.
I actually received a message from the Linn service trainer in Scotland who said I did a great job!
I had the poor man’s Linn the Heybrook TT2 which was a copy of the Linn setup with a Linn Basic arm. The set up procedure was the same and I update the table mount frame (many years ago) and I had the local dealer do it, badly as it turned and and I redid it, and it was a nightmare to set up as you say.
The plus of this is I guess the isolation, the negative is the bounce every time you touch the LP or yen arm pickup.
Again as you say, there must be a better way and there are stacks of turntables out there without this annoying bounce!
The there is a lot of claims in hifi, but you sill have to get an LP that is flat, undamaged from the pressing/packing procedure (this seems to be back to the old days with this problem) so if any of these issues, then it doesn’t matter how fancy your turntable is! Get a CD player or Stream if you want your music crackle/pop free 😆
I’ve got an Ariston rd11 and rd80 the first upon which the Linn was “ based” , amongst others that feed my compulsion and I agree there are many design flaws one would not expect from a “ high end” product , one is the continually having to pamper and cuddle them just so they do the job correctly . The irritating bounce every time you touch the arm seems one such flaw and overly done by extending to the entire arm board when it needs only to be under the tonearm itself .The Ariston Rd11 was also this way originally but it was remodeled later so the arm board was rigid apart from the separate small plate for the tonearm , which was sprung . so didn’t cause it to bounce when lifting the tonearm at the end of a record and resting one’s wrist on the arm board . The Thorens 150 is the same overly sprung design
There are always pros and cons with formats thst translate a live performance into a material , repeatable format . I love my vinyl albums and turntable because they give more than the sum of the parts in pure enjoyment even with their flaws , but some of these just seem to remain due to dogmatic design and a true designer one would have thought would have recognized these flaws and sought to alleviate them , much like Roy Gandy of Rega has said is his design philosophy and all true designers of any equipment .
I suppose it’s like any interest, any hobby there often is no reason or logic to explain why one loves and enjoys it , even its limitations .but the limitations and rewards add up to make the whole a more enjoyable experience . Just as classic cars are technically a pain sometimes , are obsolete , slower , need more maintenance and care etc , but when I see an e type jaguar or even an old MG or 50s Ford , I know they are far more enjoyable and loved .sometimes we love the things that are imperfect far more than those that are. At least that’s what I tell myself when I’ve broken down on a country lane in the winter or my early pressing of a rare album has developed a mysterious new scratch . But Linn turntables as great as they are , should they also be so much trouble to get to run correctly ? Because even an E Type Jag runs beautifully for years before needing an engineer just to fix the suspension settings or get the wheels aligned in balance !
@@saudade369 It does say a lot for modern turntables that are fixed, no bouncing. I guess you have seen the mag lift supported platter, it wobbles all over the place, a design gone far to far, the wow and flutter must be awful 😱
But you are right, it’s the sun of the parts 👍
Yes,I’ve been intrigued by the magnetic suspension .it seems a great idea in principle but in my limited understanding of opposing magnets providing a repelling , suspension type cushion they always have a force that is making them very unstable horizontally , and would suggest they are indeed rather unstable . I would have thought if this is the principle they’re based upon the designers would have found a way to compensate but , maybe not as much as needed . Of course I may have totally misunderstood the principle completely , physics was not my subject , pr9bably why I became an artist instead and as far away from it as possible ! It does seem an amazingly good idea though if done well .modern turntables although fixed , do have forms of suspension don’t they , just not the very highly sprung types we’ve grown to know and love ( ahem) . @@David-xl9cp
@@saudade369 I think with Hi-Fi it’s a fad lead world and what’s in this year is the best ever.
You read all the fantastic must have reviews and a year later they are going in a completely different direction.
I have seen so many must have hi-fi gadgets that have completely disappeared in a couple of years.
Love the jig. Cool tool...
After 40 years of setting up Linns, I'm still waiting for my medal or prize.
Hint. The key to making the suspension easy to adjust, is to make sure that the three spring bolts are absolutely vertical, and not leaning to one side or the other. Linn actually makes a "bolt straightening tool" for doing this, which consists of a T shaped bar the slides over the bolt, and has a level built into the T part. You physically bend the bolts so they are straight. The currently supplied springs are very consistent, and usually require very little tweaking. Also, make sure the top grommets are properly seated, with the flange entirely inside the hole in the subchassis, and that the tonearm cable is dressed in a way that it doesn't influence the position of the subchassis. Good luck!
I enjoyed watching your video. So I'll be watching more of them.
I spotted a cat wandering by as you were setting-up the suspension. Cats+ turntables are not a good mix. Hope it didn't insist upon helping you!
I have an Axis plus a couple of other makes. The Axis is fitted with a Jelco tonearm and they work well together.
Did dealers in your part of the world make such a song and dance about how the platters ring? They were so enthusiastic about how many seconds the platter would ring for. Never understood that, as platters that make or transmit any sort of noise are generally frowned again.
Cat is not interested in my gear. Never had that experience with a dealer and platter ringing. Thanks for watching!
Garrard 401 works for me. (SME arm) my brother runs a LP12. I wouldn't swap🌚
ok job ,my lp12 needs new springs to..
Okay, ya got me beat. I only have three turntables...
Fantastic video.👍🏼👍🏼You have done great job.Don't care what about say so called audiophile people.I don't like them.I have this turntable.Linn is not for all.some spacial technical sense is must necessary for linn lp12 owner's.but our India no technical support I'm not get for servicing this turntable.very sad.My audio equipment's service engineer suggest to me go for pioneer plx1000.because it available our India.also he give me a new pioneer plx 1000.but I'm not fully satisfied that.🙏🙏🙏
Sorry to hear your dilemma. Can you get Rega, Project, or Technics?
@@MODAC Thank you. I'm trying for 1200mk2 🙏🙏🙏
I still have my 1996 LP12 Basik with Akito II Tonearm. The sad part of my Linn story was at the very beginning. I actually took my almost brand new LP12, to a local authorized Linn dealer. I gave them close to $600 for a new K18II Cartridge, that was a ripoff. The dealer kept my LP12 for 6 weeks, that seemed like a very long time to change a cartridge. When I picked it up, and took it home I was happy, used it for about 4 month's. Then one day the queuing mechanism went straight down, literally slid down the plate. When I inspected the Hex Locking Nut on my precious Akito II Tonearm (also barely 6 month's old) HORROR! Some Monkey at the authorized Linn dealer apparently did not have the proper Allen Wrench and took a small screwdriver and literally "bored-out" the threads on the Hex Nut. Sad to say that when I complained, the dealer said that the Warranty of the service had expired. So I never ever bought Linn again. I realize it was not the fault of Linn, but that local Linn dealer never made another penny off me. The Akito II is still damaged, but I managed to find a larger Hex Nut plug and made it work. Eventually I may take that to a reputable machine shop and have then re-thread the part that fastens the queuing level. Hi End Audio is not all peaches and cream.
That is a very sad tale. I’m a DIY when it comes to mechanical projects. I leave the electronic work to the professionals. Good luck. 👍🏻
Great video! Sorry to post to it late. I’m debating purchasing a local 1997 version of this table to replace my Thorens Td166 that I bought back in the 80’s.... thoughts. Enjoy your videos & been subscribed for a while... my Linn search brought me here
Warning: if you buy a Linn you will be sucked it to an alternate reality. I’m having fun, though.
Well done, mate.
I’m pretty close. St Augustine here.
Nice. Me too!
Medal definitively earned. How's it sounding post servicing ???
Can't really A/B before and after, but sounds excellent. Look out for a future video of me doing a more extensive upgrade. Thanks
Nice! .... But how does it compare to your Technics??? Does that suspension make a noticeable difference with damping?
You can certainly work on any Linn I happen to acquire.
No thanks!
She may not think you're deserving of a Linn servicing certificate. But if she's like most partners of audio enthusiasts, I'm sure she thinks you're certifiable.
THE most frustrating turntable to set-up and the bounce 'paranoia' - oh my God. Never again!
Great job.
Great job , but check the belt, one side does sound better than the other.
Er... thanks, but did it sound any better to you?
It’s a stretch to say I am able to discern before and after, if it sounds better with new springs. It’s maintenance, like with a car…original springs were over 30 years old. Easy to do. What did you expect?
I have used Mobil high speed machine spindle oil a 1 liter bottle why cheaper than the black stuff.
It thin lite oil.
Ivor was a hustler selling his snake oil products which at one time I use to sell Late 70s-80s - Linn was a good table nothing special - At seminars he would take a telephone in & out of a listening room trying to convince Listeners there was a difference to sound
Wtf are you talking about
I think we should beware of anyone who self-certifies themselves-you don't know what else they teach dealers on the LP12 course at Linn HQ in Eaglesham.
So you think I’m serious?
Thank you for the video.
Did you do the Cirkus Bearing upgrade I saw got one did you mount it ?
Nope, I decided that what I had was good and sold it.
Why is Linn considered the top of the suspended TTs?
I would rather a Thorens and half the price
Maybe because they can be continually updated/upgraded. A desirable Thorens is not that cheap.
@@MODACHere in Oz $3000 to $5000 will buy a TD1500 = no slouch
A Linn Majik is $7,500 to A Climax at $44,000. I appreciate your response but my mind is not changed as yet
Do you have an Ebay link from which tom order the Linn setup jig?
Look in the description below. That’s the seller’s name. One not currently listed. Maybe he’ll make more if demand is there.
Hello, thx for this technical lesson ! I'm very jalous of your jig. Can you give the ref ? I'd like to buy one. Kr from Brussels
Look on eBay. That’s where I found it.
I love this turntable. 5*
wife is always right - - no matter what!
Peace love linn
I have the original Linn 1972. I kid you not. It's rather flimsily built. The cabinet joinery is/was a joke with a 3mm MDF sheet to cover the bottom....
Over hipped piece of overlarge floating Aluminum plater.
The amount of money they milked from the elitist audiophiles who have too much spare money is amazing.
As an experiment, in the future, i'm going to remove all the springs and fully tighten the while floating system into a solid non bouncing deck and see if there are any differences in sound. I would doubt that there would be one single Linn owner who would have tried that experiment.
I'm suprised your wife didn't just say your certifiable😀
She does.
The cash cow !
Actually one of the best LP12 setup videos I have seen, great stuff. You are very lucky to get an LP12 from the original owner locally and in that specification and condition, it is just lovely - very jealous. Most in Europe are like Triggers Broom: ua-cam.com/video/LAh8HryVaeY/v-deo.html
When I went to buy mine, living here in Ireland, I saw an advert for one down in Cork. I spoke to the Cork man on the phone and he wanted to know why I wanted one, what spec I wanted and all of this, a full interrogation. It was if to say, you can't just buy and LP12 you have to pass the test. He turned out to be a little like yourself, a self certified master of LP12s and whilst I didn't buy his LP12 he did end up changing parts for me and servicing it. He made his own jigs, support stands and had all sorts of ideas about it. A gas man as they say. That was about 15 years ago and I am still in touch with him today. In that time he has had Michell Orbe's, SME 20/2s but still always comes back to the LP12.
I believe your wife was just jealous of you doing the jig and bouncing Linn numerous times!
What do you guys think, you asked at the end.
Me : Change wife.
Are you Certifiable? Certified Audiophiliac!
your Certified ok. I think your wife will agree . Certifiably Nuts. only kidding enjoy your videos.
You are dreaming , linns latest lp 12 just released is regarded as one of the best regardless of price. Linns turntables are cheap compared to those 3 level decks .this one you have is a dinosaurs
Is the nearest dealer in Ft. Pierce?
Jensen Beach I believe. Their website doesn’t even mention Linn. It’s all about home installation stuff.
@@MODAC Thanks
I responded to this post above and how I now feel about the LP12 Turntable. I live in Tennessee. Nearest Linn dealer I know of that will work on them is just north of Atlanta in Roswell, GA. Chris and Lawson at Sound Image. They used to be in Marietta.
Bro, you should have started with: Btw. there are lots of chicks 🐥 😅
What product is there , particularly a highly engineered one , thst needs continual pampering and adjusting just to get it to do its job well amd correctly ? I can think of none . Usually a designer would recognise that there are major design flaws in his product that these continual adjustments are symptoms of something fundamental and needs attention . If a highly designed high end car or aeroplane needed similar attention above the usual demands of safety then a designer would assume something wrong and redesign it . I recognise high end , “ thoroughbreds “ are often sensitive and need occasional pampering but it seems to the extreme in the case of Linn turntables . The design is perhaps flawed , the bounce for example . In a manual deck where the entire arm board bounces along with the platter when ever a hand is placed on it and one needs to retrieve the tonearm from the nd of the record , how ? It seems badly considered in its function and ergonomics to have such moving bouncy parts when one is trying to care for sensitive things like a stylus and record ! Is there perhaps a special Linn arm / wrist jig to place one’s arm when moving off or picking up the tonearm from the bouncing record ? Or am I being very much a heavy handed Phillistine and not understanding the sophisticated ways of the audio elites ?
Not continual at all. Thx
...and remove the paper towl ; )
Sex,drugs,or gambling is a lot healthier
Great deck but vastly over rated. Even at the time there were numerous decks at least as good as, if not much, much better....Im thinking Thorens TD160 Super, Oracle, Michell, Pink Triangle....Linn, the masterpiece of marketing of over engineering...I know because Ive owned one (over 10 years) and owned their speakers. Very good, but not the greatest. Pure BS.
Linn is classic British BS LOL
just a poorly designed thing