When I was a child, I thought Riker was being a little unreasonable. Now, decades later, I realize that Riker was being Data's friend, and pushing him to experience a unique opportunity for personal growth.
@@cursedcanine8414 😂😂😂 I can’t say I wouldn’t either but I thought the scene was funny. Throw back the rest of a good drink and say Well time to get to work. Besides I used to be a big fan of the series and from what I can remember the alcohol that they serve is called synthahol or something like that and supposedly it’s effects can be easily shaken off if need be I think I don’t know my memories kind of hazy on that part
This is my favorite episode of TNG. The look between Picard and Guinan at the conclusion . . . An understanding 500 years in the making. Just one of many nuances in the tale. Excellent writing!
Data acts like he lacks emotions but really he just lacked the ability to process them. Moments like this & several others honestly proved he did have at least a very basic not even childlike emotional capability. After all he's clearly quite pleased or at least comforted to know he can die, & very clearly saddened by his obvious differences to humanity. That was something I always felt was poorly structured around Data's character bio in relation to the series lore.
We as humans lack a context for purely intellectual responses to situations that for us would evoke strong emotions. Can we definitively assert that a positive or negative response to that which is perceived as appropriate or inappropriate, can only exist within an emotional framework?
@@danieldickson8591 Yes, yes we can. Talking like Data doesn't really make you look smart y'know. He's obviously showing signs of pleasure from the comforting knowledge that he like any human is mortal & shows obvious signs of discomfort to being unable to fully process & emulate certain human traits such as emotions & humor. Which both discomfort & pleasure are emotional responses to something.
Yeah. The writers clearly recognized early that Data was a more interesting character when he has wants and likes and dislikes, but they felt like they couldn't officially walk back on what they had established.
Personally i felt like they always left data completely down to viewer interpretation. He obviously get more putwarldy human as the series goes on. Its the most stark in the last episode where we see data when picard wouldve first met him and data with more human traits firther on. But as far as emotions go its and open book. He on the one hand seens to have a very basic version of emotions that he almost learns on accident being unable to process the fact that sometimes he is more human than he realises. On the other hand he often shows himself as a being who has learndd human mannerisms and behaviours such as a moral code or care for his friends but he often says things that show that he doesnt process as much as we think he does. I like how data is entirely up to interpretation but i especially like what he represents, can a machine learn emotions and self awarness and if so are they simulated a mimickery of others behaviours or a true version of understanding or does a machine have a capability to develop a unique form of emotions innate to its being. I also like how this additionally makes us question our own being. Are we any different are we just biomechanical computers who simulate feelings to work together in an environment do we truly feel or are we like a machine just processing inputs and generating outputs. Data to me is a case study of what it is to feel and to be
@@shiindaisuke3159 "Talking like Data doesn't really make you look smart y'know" No, but the fact you went straight to this makes you look like you're projecting pretty hard.
This is a gem of an episode good god. Geordie offering DATA a game of Chess because he knows Data enjoy it, even though he's going to lose! Just to make a guy who doesn't have emotions feel better
I like how unsettled all of the other characters are by this, and I think it speaks to a unique aspect of their relationship with Data. We all have to live with the reality that one day, not only will we be gone but everyone we love as well. When you are first confronted with this as a child, it is one of the most disturbing things you have to figure out how to cope with, that the people you love most are impermanent. With the crew of the Enterprise, however, they had one person for whom this was not true. Data was the one person in the entire universe they never had to consider the possibility of death for. It was probably very comforting in a strange sort of way. But now they're being slapped in the face with his destruction as well. In a way, it's almost like being a kid again and having to relearn about mortality a second time.
I do not know what kind of childhood you had. But the vast majority of children do not face this subject until they are in their adulthood or have a parent die. But no child should have to even think about such adult things!!
@@jessicapearson9479 Uh, I had the normal kind of childhood. You know, the kind where you have a pet or very old relative die, and your parents had to explain to you what had happened. Jesus, did you live in a plastic bubble or some shit until you were 18?
@@jessicapearson9479 for myself, i cant remember then i was First confronted with death in the Family. Our extended Family was really big, my mother was one Off her youngstes siblings AND im by far the youngest Off Mine. So every few months there was an burial for someone i knew. Cancer, accidents, even in our Village. Expecting death was Something quite normal for me at that time.
@@jessicapearson9479 But many do. I didn't have a parent die, but when I was 5 a good friend's father died in Vietnam. That's my first memory of our lack of permanence.
I recommend you check out Hal Holbrook's one man show. Not that anyone alive can actually say what a good representation would look like. (I might well be wrong, are there films, home movies, anything available?)
Only if you define "caring" as exclusively a feeling. I don't think Data values his own existence less than they do, or is less motivated to continue to exist.
@@OptimusWombat Except that he still "cares" in the sense that he has motivations regarding things he wants to happen, and things he doesn't want to happen, which manifests as priorities which he "cares" about to varying degrees. The ability to have this dispositional and wilful outlook toward the world which is informed by both positive and negative valuations very much resembles something which is at least equivalent to being able to have certain kinds of positive and negative FEELINGS about certain things. It's just that his motivations, and his expressions of those motivations, are, for the most part, only ever expressed in action rather than in terms of human types of feelings. His extreme reliability regarding valuing the lives of others, in being honest, and in always staying true to what he agrees to (such as agreeing to follow the laws and regulations of the Federation/ Starfleet), combined with his apparent IMMUNITY to having negative feelings having an adverse effect on his cognitive or physical abilities, makes him an extremely admirable character. However, is apparent immunity to the negative effects of increased cognitive focus on outcomes which he consistently does everything in his power to avoid, is borderline unrealistic.
well tng story arc on tv been telling more interesting richer story than the cinema movies to me... plus the cinema tng film colors havent been looking so good to me...
This was the very first episode of Star Trek I ever watched. It got me hooked and then I dropped off. Years later, I’ve come back again, and lemme tell you, I’ve missed it.
4:07 THAT would have been the time for Guinan to notify them that SHE WAS ON EARTH in the late 1800s!!!! DUH. Because Data was shocked to find her there. Thought she was brought there from his time. She does say FULL CIRCLE but we don't know what that means, at that moment.
The strongest point to me in this scene is how upset Riker is at the thought of his friend dying. Adding that he can speak about it TO that friend makes it even better.
It's clearly a symptom of the fact that star trek dialogue is written to sound plausible and not because it is structurally consistent (although the writers tried very hard and star trek used to be one of the best efforts to be consistent.) They just dropped the ball on this one, and it's hilarious Picard says it as if it might mean something to him when it doesn't need to be.
I wondered if it was a ad lib? I am going to try and store this and if it ever come up that I can say 'type r ! ' in a conversation at least it will amuse me!
I remember watching this episode for the first time years ago on BBC2, and this Type R line felt strange then as it continues to do so now. I still can't figure out why the line was added or why Picard would say it, and in such a commanding fashion. Very strange...
Spiner plays the part of a machine so well, I can easily see him playing the T-1000 in Terminator 2 just as good or even better than Robert Patrick. He is one of the best actors I've ever seen but I also believe that Brent's charm and good looks also played a huge part in making Data such a popular character.
Something people don't understand about Data is how his emotions work. He has them on a logical level but lacks the physical part of emotion. When we get mad, We understand that we do not like what we are experiencing and it is frustrating but along with that we have physical reactions like an increase in blood pressure and stress hormones ect. Data's emotion chip gave him approximations of those physical reactions.
That's an interesting theory into it--cognitive recognition of emotions without the physical attributes. There could be truth to that; emotions are as much a physical experience as a mental one. I've always believed more on the line of, Data does lack emotions except curiosity, perplexion and fascination, and he has one real driving motive, to be more human. This combo provides him enough to live, learn and grow as a person, despite no other technical emotions. But he understands things: he understands when people mistreat him, disrespect him, and when people are kind and those who he'll benefit being around to learn about humanity. So the idea of eventually dying offers "comfort" because it aids in his drive to be more human, regardless of actual emotions. However, I believe he's designed from head to toe to have emotions, that Soong intended to give him an emotion chip long ago but Lore luring the Crystaline Entity screwed that up. Soong became much more vigilant in getting the chip to work right, but all the chip does is activate dormant programs and subroutines, and keeps everything stable. It's more of an activation chip. Just another idea to throw in there.
There you have it! Lore is Left brain and Data is Right brain. It actually makes a lot of sense. Data always keeps an open mind and is very creative with music and art, whereas Lore is very "black-and-white" always looking at things from the calculated perspective of absolutes.
This clip right here shows one of my favorite things about picard data says he is a type R and he knows what data means people tend to forget Picard was a science officer before he became a captain.
Wasn't he a xeno-archaeologist though? Not to say you can't know archaeology and computer science, but it does seem like it would be a little outside his field of expertise...
4:10 - I don't know why, but Geordi's "Something, isn't it?" made me laugh out loud. Your best friend's severed cybernetic head was discovered underground the de facto capital of the Galaxy after being being displaced in time by half a millennium. I mean, he's not wrong. That's certainly something.
TNG got a lot of flack for all the technobabble, but it got the balance right more often than not. This scene shows how just the right amount of technical explanation can still advance the story without becoming gobbledegook. Voyager, and later shows, got this balance completely wrong and used technobabble 'instead' of a plot. The viewer was expected to take the explanations at face value, with no way of understanding what was being said, because deep down there was no technical reason for things.
Well, there are many car parts that are referred to as "type-r" ranging from tire rims, bumpers, bumper extensions, and even shift nobs. There's much more than that, but it's entirely possible that the type of part, which is used commonly in 20th century cars (as well as today's cars) is an engineering standard that persisted well into the 24th century. So it's possible that Picard might have been familiar with it in a historical context or knew of it from an engineering class at Starfleet Academy. Though not necessarily familiar enough that he could understand it in the context of Data's construction. So he remembered it in passing, as an afterthought from his academy days. Just a theory.
I'm so very appreciative you include this section of such an amazing episode! I have been searching for a long time for the dialog associated with the siliated life form from Davida 2
I always liked how, in the episode, Picard realizes he can’t pin down exactly when he first met Guinan. She tells him, he has to go down to the planets surface, or they may never meet.
I like that they used Data to explore these themes. They have been done several times before. Tolkien's elves felt this way. It was why they left Middle Earth for the Undying Lands: They simply had grown tired of constantly outliving the things and places they had grown to love. And "Death brings me closer to being human." I'm reminded of Asimov's "Bicentennial Man". Andrew Martin, the robot who became mortal so he would be declared a human being. This is what Star Trek should be, exploration of timeless themes.
Why? Much better space things to make visually presentable. Rehashing old themes is last thing anyone needs to keep re-living. Read or watch about it and move on.
Star trek has literally always been a progressive show, by an ahead of his time progressive creator. I don't understand where you could possibly have watched the same show as me.
I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought of the elves and the Undying Lands. It seems Data's issue was being immortal among mortals. Perhaps he'd do better hanging out with elves lol.
From what I remember about this episode Data’s death, wasn’t a permanent one, it was a temporary death, and he was eventually revived in a way being able to exist again.
That was hilarious, Data saying once his old friends are dead he would find new friends, and outlive them as well. A fine touch of humor by the writers. 😆
I never took that as intending to be humorous. In a way it’s even sadder. If Data had lived indefinitely, he would lose everyone he loved over and over and over.
Super talented actor, humanity has no idea how paradigm his acting skills will link to embark in future phenomenons with mankind. Face to face with the reality of sentient species they created, It is written & begun.
It’s an interesting thing they explore, but it’s really undermined by how easy they re-activate Data’s head in the next episode, kinda makes it really premature they assumed death when the head was basically just turned off.
Brent Spiner was the best actor on ST. The things he adds that you don't even notice shows how much deeper he knew his character. When Data turns his head sometimes it's a multiposition movement instead of a smooth singular motion. If he and Jeffery Coombs did a broadway show playing all the characters it would be amazing.
Brent Spiner is one of the best if not the best actors, period. He plays the part of a machine so well, I can easily see him playing the role of the T-1000 in Terminator 2 just as good or even better than Robert Patrick. He also plays all kinds of human or human-like characters well, from noble heroes to nasty and sadistic villains.
Think I'll go back and watch Times Arrow. Thanks for giving me a reason to watch Star Trek and not work on any push bikes today (I was looking for an excuse 🤣)
Good luck finding a show with writing this good today. The philosophical observation of how an immortal being devoid of emotions would respond to learning of their own death. Unlike humans, they would be comforted to know that they will not live to the heat death of the universe or get trapped buried alive for eons on some distant planet. They kinda side step it by basically reviving the old head in a time paradox where his current head would have to wait the 500 year before being reactivated, so he doesn't really die. It's literally a week later when he gets transported to the past, and his head gets buried. Essentially, that head is only a week older if you cut out the 500 year deactivation.
BECAUSE CPT JEAN LUC PICARD THE GREATEST STARFLEET CAPT TO EVER EXIST WAS A SCIENCE OFFICER BEFORE HE WAS A CAPTAIN. HE WASN'T BORNT INTO THE CAPTAINS ROLE HE GREWD INTO IT. HE PROBABLY STUDIED BRAINOLOGY AT STARFLEETUNIVERSITY BEFORE TRANSFERIGN TO CPT COLLEGE
Data is very human in personality and capable of emotion though he’s not in touch with them as others. This makes sense since it is theorized that emotion are a byproduct of intellectual development. From a Myers-Briggs perspective he is an INTP personality type. This means that he values logical thinking first, followed by thinking of the intuitive possibilities in a careful way. His thinking goes to extroverted feelings last which is when he shows a concern for others or understands that LaForge is wanting to discuss his feelings. Data’s own feelings on death are precisely how introverted feeling demon functions, which can lead INTP to nihilistic thoughts when younger but can transition to self acceptance and generativity behavior when they mature. Many fans of SciFi are of the INTP personality type and are this drawn to Data as a role model. INTP make up only about 3% of the general population, tend to be quietly introverted and prefer to be behind the scenes. This makes Data’s behavior seem exotic, alien and robotic to most people but on closer inspection, he’s all too human inside. Just different.
Looking at Data's face up close reminds me of how flat and fake color contacts looked back in the 80s and 90s. Today, they have contacts that look so natural that you can't tell at all. Spiner had beautiful blue/grey eyes. Wish they let him keep that instead of requiring him to wear the creepy yellow contacts.
Time isn't fluid at all though. That was Data's point. Time is more of a set road that the universe travels down. Sure, you can go either direction on the road, but that is just you moving back and forth in time. Anything alread built into the road is already there. His severed head was just part of that road, meaning his death was also part of that road...they just hadn't gotten to that part of the road yet.
There's a theory that time is more like a solid block. Everything that has ever happened or will ever happen is already set, we're just moving through it. The end of the Universe has already happened, it just hasn't occurred yet.
It's strange, Jordy is left handed but uses his right when talking to data. Is this some social rule to aways use the hand furthest from who your talking to or is it a camera angle / stage direction. I never switch to my off hand, while drinking tea/coffee.
Geordi: Let's get together later for a game of chess. This is the android that drew a stalemate against Kolrami playing strategema, and you want to play him in chess?? Good luck.
"Type R!?"
*Quickly realizes he doesn't know what that means and looks for a subject change*
"Can you predict how long this has been in the cavern?"
Loved the way he said it too. "type R" like you could hear that capital letter R like he was about to get all Shakespeare acting in the scene. LOL
I thought that at first, but now I think it was written to show that Picard is just as shaken as Riker by saying something unnecessary.
"Like my antique Honda Civic?"
"Mine is a type R."
"Type R?"
"Yes sir. It means I have more horsepower and a bigger wing."
@@Vorael And Vtec
When I was a child, I thought Riker was being a little unreasonable. Now, decades later, I realize that Riker was being Data's friend, and pushing him to experience a unique opportunity for personal growth.
Eeyup.
So we just ignore the fact the guy whose responsible for the ships engines and what not was getting sloshed before he went to work? 😑🤨
@@davidb4090 I'm pretty sure it was synthehol
@@davidb4090 scoty from the original series drank on the dam job and when youre deling with gods and racsist aliens i would open a bottle myself
@@cursedcanine8414 😂😂😂 I can’t say I wouldn’t either but I thought the scene was funny. Throw back the rest of a good drink and say Well time to get to work. Besides I used to be a big fan of the series and from what I can remember the alcohol that they serve is called synthahol or something like that and supposedly it’s effects can be easily shaken off if need be I think I don’t know my memories kind of hazy on that part
Picard: "Type R? Well, that explains everything!"
The fact that Picard and Riker are all: WE WILL STOP THIS DATA.
And he’s all: Nah.
@UncleMikeNJ And just like any living beings, Spock lies. They do have emotions and it does change at will. Data does not.
The fact that the head is there is proof that they can't change it.
This is my favorite episode of TNG. The look between Picard and Guinan at the conclusion . . . An understanding 500 years in the making. Just one of many nuances in the tale. Excellent writing!
E Coleman - What is the title of this episode and what Season & Episode is it from?
@@GW28533 "Time’s Arrow"
Episodes 126 and 127. The 26th episode of the fifth season and the first episode of the sixth season. A two parter!
@@ecoleman5690 Thank you for taking the time to answer my post. Appreciate it !
Still is my favorite episode(s)
This is why I can't look at Whoopie now. From this, to her talk show form.
Spiner's acting is top notch.
Tom Cruise himself wouldn't dare chop his own head off for a mere TV show.
Not even.
Lol hellova stunt
He would if Miscavage told him to.
Funny
Committed to the part
Tom does whatever the church of scientology tells him to 😂
Data acts like he lacks emotions but really he just lacked the ability to process them. Moments like this & several others honestly proved he did have at least a very basic not even childlike emotional capability. After all he's clearly quite pleased or at least comforted to know he can die, & very clearly saddened by his obvious differences to humanity. That was something I always felt was poorly structured around Data's character bio in relation to the series lore.
We as humans lack a context for purely intellectual responses to situations that for us would evoke strong emotions. Can we definitively assert that a positive or negative response to that which is perceived as appropriate or inappropriate, can only exist within an emotional framework?
@@danieldickson8591 Yes, yes we can. Talking like Data doesn't really make you look smart y'know. He's obviously showing signs of pleasure from the comforting knowledge that he like any human is mortal & shows obvious signs of discomfort to being unable to fully process & emulate certain human traits such as emotions & humor. Which both discomfort & pleasure are emotional responses to something.
Yeah. The writers clearly recognized early that Data was a more interesting character when he has wants and likes and dislikes, but they felt like they couldn't officially walk back on what they had established.
Personally i felt like they always left data completely down to viewer interpretation. He obviously get more putwarldy human as the series goes on. Its the most stark in the last episode where we see data when picard wouldve first met him and data with more human traits firther on. But as far as emotions go its and open book. He on the one hand seens to have a very basic version of emotions that he almost learns on accident being unable to process the fact that sometimes he is more human than he realises. On the other hand he often shows himself as a being who has learndd human mannerisms and behaviours such as a moral code or care for his friends but he often says things that show that he doesnt process as much as we think he does. I like how data is entirely up to interpretation but i especially like what he represents, can a machine learn emotions and self awarness and if so are they simulated a mimickery of others behaviours or a true version of understanding or does a machine have a capability to develop a unique form of emotions innate to its being. I also like how this additionally makes us question our own being. Are we any different are we just biomechanical computers who simulate feelings to work together in an environment do we truly feel or are we like a machine just processing inputs and generating outputs. Data to me is a case study of what it is to feel and to be
@@shiindaisuke3159
"Talking like Data doesn't really make you look smart y'know"
No, but the fact you went straight to this makes you look like you're projecting pretty hard.
This is a gem of an episode good god.
Geordie offering DATA a game of Chess because he knows Data enjoy it, even though he's going to lose! Just to make a guy who doesn't have emotions feel better
What episode and season is this?
@@XXLpinut Its is season 5 episode 26 called Time's Arrow and part two is the start of Season 6
God; Geordi.
If Data can enjoy chess, then he obviously has emotions.
I like how unsettled all of the other characters are by this, and I think it speaks to a unique aspect of their relationship with Data. We all have to live with the reality that one day, not only will we be gone but everyone we love as well. When you are first confronted with this as a child, it is one of the most disturbing things you have to figure out how to cope with, that the people you love most are impermanent. With the crew of the Enterprise, however, they had one person for whom this was not true. Data was the one person in the entire universe they never had to consider the possibility of death for. It was probably very comforting in a strange sort of way. But now they're being slapped in the face with his destruction as well. In a way, it's almost like being a kid again and having to relearn about mortality a second time.
I do not know what kind of childhood you had. But the vast majority of children do not face this subject until they are in their adulthood or have a parent die. But no child should have to even think about such adult things!!
@@jessicapearson9479 Uh, I had the normal kind of childhood. You know, the kind where you have a pet or very old relative die, and your parents had to explain to you what had happened. Jesus, did you live in a plastic bubble or some shit until you were 18?
@@jessicapearson9479 for myself, i cant remember then i was First confronted with death in the Family. Our extended Family was really big, my mother was one Off her youngstes siblings AND im by far the youngest Off Mine. So every few months there was an burial for someone i knew. Cancer, accidents, even in our Village. Expecting death was Something quite normal for me at that time.
@@jessicapearson9479 But many do. I didn't have a parent die, but when I was 5 a good friend's father died in Vietnam. That's my first memory of our lack of permanence.
@@jessicapearson9479 lol
I love this episode! Not only for Data speaking French, but also the best portrayal of Samuel Clements ever put to film.
I recommend you check out Hal Holbrook's one man show. Not that anyone alive can actually say what a good representation would look like. (I might well be wrong, are there films, home movies, anything available?)
The emotional differences make it clear that Picard and Riker care more about Data as a person than he does himself.
Only if you define "caring" as exclusively a feeling. I don't think Data values his own existence less than they do, or is less motivated to continue to exist.
It's not that he "doesn't" care, it's that he's incapable of caring.
@@OptimusWombat Except that he still "cares" in the sense that he has motivations regarding things he wants to happen, and things he doesn't want to happen, which manifests as priorities which he "cares" about to varying degrees. The ability to have this dispositional and wilful outlook toward the world which is informed by both positive and negative valuations very much resembles something which is at least equivalent to being able to have certain kinds of positive and negative FEELINGS about certain things. It's just that his motivations, and his expressions of those motivations, are, for the most part, only ever expressed in action rather than in terms of human types of feelings.
His extreme reliability regarding valuing the lives of others, in being honest, and in always staying true to what he agrees to (such as agreeing to follow the laws and regulations of the Federation/ Starfleet), combined with his apparent IMMUNITY to having negative feelings having an adverse effect on his cognitive or physical abilities, makes him an extremely admirable character. However, is apparent immunity to the negative effects of increased cognitive focus on outcomes which he consistently does everything in his power to avoid, is borderline unrealistic.
It's like they're talking down a suicidal person from jumping.
You have internet access in Arkham Mr. Nigma?
For those that don't know, this episode actually kicks off a fantastic series of reality ending books because of the Devidians.
@Cold Snap yeah, there's a few, but the 3 I'm referring to are about 20 years after this episode. Definitely worth a read
Picard's huffed, "Data, is this yours?" gets me every time.
well tng story arc on tv been telling more interesting richer story than the cinema movies to me... plus the cinema tng film colors havent been looking so good to me...
That’s because the cinema is for action films.
The movies are universally horrible. Except for the first contact. TV show is good
It’s oddly wholesome seeing Data, the most logical member of the crew, being optimistic of his death. Seeing it as a way to be more human.
Curiousity knows no fear.
I love the way Picard says "TYPE R" so forcefully as if he knows what that means lol
This was the very first episode of Star Trek I ever watched. It got me hooked and then I dropped off. Years later, I’ve come back again, and lemme tell you, I’ve missed it.
4:07 THAT would have been the time for Guinan to notify them that SHE WAS ON EARTH in the late 1800s!!!! DUH. Because Data was shocked to find her there. Thought she was brought there from his time. She does say FULL CIRCLE but we don't know what that means, at that moment.
The strongest point to me in this scene is how upset Riker is at the thought of his friend dying. Adding that he can speak about it TO that friend makes it even better.
The type R comment from Picard was funny... redundant, but funny 😁
It's clearly a symptom of the fact that star trek dialogue is written to sound plausible and not because it is structurally consistent (although the writers tried very hard and star trek used to be one of the best efforts to be consistent.) They just dropped the ball on this one, and it's hilarious Picard says it as if it might mean something to him when it doesn't need to be.
R-Type?
I wondered if it was a ad lib? I am going to try and store this and if it ever come up that I can say 'type r ! ' in a conversation at least it will amuse me!
Like a Honda? 😂
I remember watching this episode for the first time years ago on BBC2, and this Type R line felt strange then as it continues to do so now. I still can't figure out why the line was added or why Picard would say it, and in such a commanding fashion. Very strange...
I love how Picard says “Type R” like he knows what he’s talking back.
TYPE R .... then just moves on completely
He just assumed it's the filter in his brain responsible for pirate speach.
Brent Spinor's performance is always on spot! The way he moves and talks makes Data believable as an android made to look and act human.
Spiner.
I assume you don't mean his cat 🦓😃
Spiner plays the part of a machine so well, I can easily see him playing the T-1000 in Terminator 2 just as good or even better than Robert Patrick. He is one of the best actors I've ever seen but I also believe that Brent's charm and good looks also played a huge part in making Data such a popular character.
Something people don't understand about Data is how his emotions work. He has them on a logical level but lacks the physical part of emotion. When we get mad, We understand that we do not like what we are experiencing and it is frustrating but along with that we have physical reactions like an increase in blood pressure and stress hormones ect. Data's emotion chip gave him approximations of those physical reactions.
That's an interesting theory into it--cognitive recognition of emotions without the physical attributes. There could be truth to that; emotions are as much a physical experience as a mental one.
I've always believed more on the line of, Data does lack emotions except curiosity, perplexion and fascination, and he has one real driving motive, to be more human. This combo provides him enough to live, learn and grow as a person, despite no other technical emotions. But he understands things: he understands when people mistreat him, disrespect him, and when people are kind and those who he'll benefit being around to learn about humanity. So the idea of eventually dying offers "comfort" because it aids in his drive to be more human, regardless of actual emotions.
However, I believe he's designed from head to toe to have emotions, that Soong intended to give him an emotion chip long ago but Lore luring the Crystaline Entity screwed that up. Soong became much more vigilant in getting the chip to work right, but all the chip does is activate dormant programs and subroutines, and keeps everything stable. It's more of an activation chip. Just another idea to throw in there.
There you have it! Lore is Left brain and Data is Right brain. It actually makes a lot of sense. Data always keeps an open mind and is very creative with music and art, whereas Lore is very "black-and-white" always looking at things from the calculated perspective of absolutes.
Left side/right side. Left side is sinistram. Sinister.
Shrewd observation, Carman.
Cool
Only a Sith deals in absolutes
interestingly their names seem reversed
I love Rikers reaction to Data examining his head
"Your head is not an artifact!"
This clip right here shows one of my favorite things about picard data says he is a type R and he knows what data means people tend to forget Picard was a science officer before he became a captain.
Wasn't he a xeno-archaeologist though? Not to say you can't know archaeology and computer science, but it does seem like it would be a little outside his field of expertise...
I believe it was much more along the lines of... "Oh... okay, then."🙂
Picard was really upset about this case. He was showing some really reassuring/fatherly characteristics here.
4:10 - I don't know why, but Geordi's "Something, isn't it?" made me laugh out loud. Your best friend's severed cybernetic head was discovered underground the de facto capital of the Galaxy after being being displaced in time by half a millennium. I mean, he's not wrong. That's certainly something.
TNG got a lot of flack for all the technobabble, but it got the balance right more often than not. This scene shows how just the right amount of technical explanation can still advance the story without becoming gobbledegook. Voyager, and later shows, got this balance completely wrong and used technobabble 'instead' of a plot. The viewer was expected to take the explanations at face value, with no way of understanding what was being said, because deep down there was no technical reason for things.
Well, there are many car parts that are referred to as "type-r" ranging from tire rims, bumpers, bumper extensions, and even shift nobs. There's much more than that, but it's entirely possible that the type of part, which is used commonly in 20th century cars (as well as today's cars) is an engineering standard that persisted well into the 24th century. So it's possible that Picard might have been familiar with it in a historical context or knew of it from an engineering class at Starfleet Academy. Though not necessarily familiar enough that he could understand it in the context of Data's construction. So he remembered it in passing, as an afterthought from his academy days. Just a theory.
I liked voyager. Granted Im a dragon age fan and love listening to flemeth.
@@Not-an-Alien
Was very cool to hear Janeway doing some voice work.
Sometimes the technobabble in TNG made sense in some parts (or sounded that way). I can’t remember a specific example though.
@@JimiGosu type r is Hondas way to over charge for something lol
I'm so very appreciative you include this section of such an amazing episode! I have been searching for a long time for the dialog associated with the siliated life form from Davida 2
I always liked how, in the episode, Picard realizes he can’t pin down exactly when he first met Guinan. She tells him, he has to go down to the planets surface, or they may never meet.
I like that they used Data to explore these themes. They have been done several times before.
Tolkien's elves felt this way. It was why they left Middle Earth for the Undying Lands: They simply had grown tired of constantly outliving the things and places they had grown to love.
And "Death brings me closer to being human." I'm reminded of Asimov's "Bicentennial Man". Andrew Martin, the robot who became mortal so he would be declared a human being.
This is what Star Trek should be, exploration of timeless themes.
Why? Much better space things to make visually presentable. Rehashing old themes is last thing anyone needs to keep re-living. Read or watch about it and move on.
Star trek has literally always been a progressive show, by an ahead of his time progressive creator. I don't understand where you could possibly have watched the same show as me.
@@1014p you'll understand when you get older, and see your friends and family die.
I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought of the elves and the Undying Lands. It seems Data's issue was being immortal among mortals. Perhaps he'd do better hanging out with elves lol.
@Table Salt have you ever watched star trek? Like... Ever?
I really love how Picard considers that the head could be Lore's and that this is one of his shenanigans.
Ah, man...to think I was lucky enough to watch these shows before the current...incarnation...I feel blessed beyond measure.
new star trek is trash, but there are other shows now that make quality sci fi instead. there is always good art out there if you look
The Orville is classic Star Trek in all but name
That ancient Android head looks suspiciously like Mark Zuckerberg😮
Using the thumbnail photo to start the video so it’s one contiguous experience from tap to video start to finish. Insert Chefs kiss
“It has occurred, it Willicur”
Well, gee willikers
Star Trek has ever been a wellspring of philosophical exploration.
Man, when TNG is good it's really fucking good.
Picard: "Type ARRRR !!????"
It's almost as if he knew exactly what that meant
From what I remember about this episode Data’s death, wasn’t a permanent one, it was a temporary death, and he was eventually revived in a way being able to exist again.
Yeah but now his head is 500 years older than his body.
@tuseroni I mean story wise he blows up so it doesn't matter anyway
I love how Picard says "Type R?!" like he is pretending to know what that is.
That was hilarious, Data saying once his old friends are dead he would find new friends, and outlive them as well. A fine touch of humor by the writers. 😆
I never took that as intending to be humorous. In a way it’s even sadder. If Data had lived indefinitely, he would lose everyone he loved over and over and over.
Super talented actor, humanity has no idea how paradigm his acting skills will link to embark in future phenomenons with mankind. Face to face with the reality of sentient species they created, It is written & begun.
I wouldn’t be surprised if there were bloopers of Brent Spinner doing jokes with his head. 😂
It’s an interesting thing they explore, but it’s really undermined by how easy they re-activate Data’s head in the next episode, kinda makes it really premature they assumed death when the head was basically just turned off.
Brent Spiner was the best actor on ST. The things he adds that you don't even notice shows how much deeper he knew his character. When Data turns his head sometimes it's a multiposition movement instead of a smooth singular motion. If he and Jeffery Coombs did a broadway show playing all the characters it would be amazing.
Brent Spiner is one of the best if not the best actors, period. He plays the part of a machine so well, I can easily see him playing the role of the T-1000 in Terminator 2 just as good or even better than Robert Patrick. He also plays all kinds of human or human-like characters well, from noble heroes to nasty and sadistic villains.
Picard asks "Type R?" like he's pretending to know what Data is talking about.
"TYPE R?!??"
I don't know why, but the way he says that so emphatically just cracks me up 🤣
For a spit second, I wanted to cry out, "Freeze! One false move and the android gets it!"
Great show
You'll always be alive to Us.
the way picard look at Data sometimes... i think they should get a room 😆
This ties in nicely with the last episode of Star Trek Picard Season 1.
Unlike the current portrayal of Picard, Data in that episode actually felt like Data.
Time's arrow love it about to go and watch it now.
“Type - R!?” lol Picard pretending he knows what that means.
Think I'll go back and watch Times Arrow. Thanks for giving me a reason to watch Star Trek and not work on any push bikes today (I was looking for an excuse 🤣)
Am I the only one that has the hum and beeps of the enterprise D on constant repeat in their office for ambience?
Good luck finding a show with writing this good today. The philosophical observation of how an immortal being devoid of emotions would respond to learning of their own death. Unlike humans, they would be comforted to know that they will not live to the heat death of the universe or get trapped buried alive for eons on some distant planet. They kinda side step it by basically reviving the old head in a time paradox where his current head would have to wait the 500 year before being reactivated, so he doesn't really die. It's literally a week later when he gets transported to the past, and his head gets buried. Essentially, that head is only a week older if you cut out the 500 year deactivation.
I love how Picard says "Type R?" with such conviction.
Why the hell he would know what that even meant?
It sounded a bit like he was annoyed at how emotionless Data was, talking about the whole affair.
BECAUSE CPT JEAN LUC PICARD THE GREATEST STARFLEET CAPT TO EVER EXIST WAS A SCIENCE OFFICER BEFORE HE WAS A CAPTAIN. HE WASN'T BORNT INTO THE CAPTAINS ROLE HE GREWD INTO IT. HE PROBABLY STUDIED BRAINOLOGY AT STARFLEETUNIVERSITY BEFORE TRANSFERIGN TO CPT COLLEGE
He was a science officer before becoming a captain.
Star Trek TNG is home. Warm tea (earl grey) on a cold day
Something about picard demanding if the head is data's is hilarious to me.
"i can now look forward to death"
been there
I like Data's alien perspective on his own mortality.
Would have been nice to have gotten a follow up to his thoughts about being mortal after they reattached his centuries old head to his body.
I assume it was no longer functioning, or else it wouldn't truly die
@@JordanBeagle It was functioning and he wore it for the rest of his life.
That’s no way to get ahead in life, Data.
It's a shame he wasn't more headstrong.
Rewatching this is illuminating. Akiva Goldsman truly did understand Data.
Data is very human in personality and capable of emotion though he’s not in touch with them as others. This makes sense since it is theorized that emotion are a byproduct of intellectual development. From a Myers-Briggs perspective he is an INTP personality type. This means that he values logical thinking first, followed by thinking of the intuitive possibilities in a careful way. His thinking goes to extroverted feelings last which is when he shows a concern for others or understands that LaForge is wanting to discuss his feelings. Data’s own feelings on death are precisely how introverted feeling demon functions, which can lead INTP to nihilistic thoughts when younger but can transition to self acceptance and generativity behavior when they mature. Many fans of SciFi are of the INTP personality type and are this drawn to Data as a role model. INTP make up only about 3% of the general population, tend to be quietly introverted and prefer to be behind the scenes. This makes Data’s behavior seem exotic, alien and robotic to most people but on closer inspection, he’s all too human inside. Just different.
Data does have emotions. He just can't feel them as intensely as Lore until he got his emotion chip.
he said Type "R" like he knew what a type "R" was, come on Jean Luc🤣😂🤣
Red dwarfs Kryton has spare heads ………… my favourite is the cranky one with the Yorkshire accented
Such a good 2 piece.
Since I watched this as a kid, every time someone says "it will occur", I think of Data saying "It will occur. It has occurred."
Why is this looking so much better quality then the Netflix's version?
TNG really was some good stuff back in the day
.... ah... my teenage years... BOY, I WAS A HUGE DORK....
Riker is forced to say crazy things hence his constant sarcasm, your head is not an artifact 😂
You ever just feel like you are lost in time
Love this episode.
This is my favorite episode of Star Trak.
Brent did a good job playing the character
Looking at Data's face up close reminds me of how flat and fake color contacts looked back in the 80s and 90s. Today, they have contacts that look so natural that you can't tell at all. Spiner had beautiful blue/grey eyes. Wish they let him keep that instead of requiring him to wear the creepy yellow contacts.
Data is a determinist. He failed to realize that time is just as fluid going backward as it is going forward.
Time isn't fluid at all though. That was Data's point. Time is more of a set road that the universe travels down. Sure, you can go either direction on the road, but that is just you moving back and forth in time. Anything alread built into the road is already there. His severed head was just part of that road, meaning his death was also part of that road...they just hadn't gotten to that part of the road yet.
There's a theory that time is more like a solid block. Everything that has ever happened or will ever happen is already set, we're just moving through it. The end of the Universe has already happened, it just hasn't occurred yet.
_Type L_ (sometimes _LX)_ commonly denotes Luxury model... and _Type R_ usually means the stripped down Race model.
Lore is the more luxurious model with built in emotions, while Data is the stripped down basic version.
I’m gonna watch this now. What episode and season is this?
They really should have done more about Guinan's back story. We got hints but they never really went into it.
"Data is this yours?" - Cpt. Picard
3:40 Interesting that Data greatest dream with all this impressive abilities is to become human
To be fair, most of the humans in STTNG are generally better humans than the current ones.
Data was human in every way except his physical body.
And in Picard he actually succeeds in his desire to be human but they don't make a big deal of it even though it's the thing he's wanted most.
It's strange, Jordy is left handed but uses his right when talking to data. Is this some social rule to aways use the hand furthest from who your talking to or is it a camera angle / stage direction. I never switch to my off hand, while drinking tea/coffee.
"These fossils only exist in one place..." LETS GO THERE NOW!!
"We found Data's head beneath San Francisco." seems like a line that should be preceded by "this may sound really bizarre, but..."
I miss this show
man, they got so worked up about his possible future death, yet that time they thought he blowed up they were like "welp that sucks....ok moving on"
I think it’s cool that Data’s head is 500 years older than the rest of him.
Geordi says the fossil is found only on Davidia Two in the Mirab sector. I wonder if they went there with their sails unfurled…?
Never really thought about it till now but like for the rest of his life his head was 500 years older than the rest of his body
Make it so!
Boss move 😎👍
When Riker says "on my way" does he mean "to the bridge" or "to Devidia II"?
Geordi: Let's get together later for a game of chess.
This is the android that drew a stalemate against Kolrami playing strategema, and you want to play him in chess?? Good luck.
Spock could stalemate the computer on his best day and Kirk still played him.
100% because Geordie wants to do something that Data enjoys, even though he's going to lose he wants to try make an emotionless android feel better
Your girl still sleeps with you even though she knows you'll win
Geordi's a glutton for punishment.
Losing is one of the best ways to get better.
"Type R?' like he knows what it is haha
Data: "...I can now look forward to death."
2020 survivors: "SAME brother!"