Totals League of Dungeoneers. 25 Dungeon crusade. 24 Dungeon Universalis. 23 But as had been said, I don't think you can go wrong with any of them if old school dungeon crawl is your jam.
@@TheDungeonDive I know you said the numbers "doesn't mean anything", but I think you could do a 1-5 instead of 1-3. That way, you could kind of show how far each game is to each other. Like the points where DUN and LoD were miles apart from DC, that could give points like 1 to DC and 4 and 5 to the other two. I know 2nd place is in the middle, but extending the points this way, you could have the middle one kind of leaning one towards one or the other, or right in the middle with 1 - 3 - 5. Hope that is understandable! Love this video, very good for people to ask "what do I like to play" "what do I prefer" fantastic. I think my choice of LoD is good, but the FOMO in me really want all, haha!
There are no places. That was the whole point of the video if that wasn’t clear. Each of these games is awesome and we should consider ourselves lucky to be living during this golden age of gaming.
Timestamps: 1) Ease of Learning - 5:32 2) Ease of Play (How Well it Plays Solo, Setup, Teardown, etc.) - 7:51 3) Component Quality/Quantity - 10:18 4) Visual Appeal - 13:00 5) Overland Adventure Component - 14:47 6) Dungeon Crawling Component - 17:32 7) Loot - 19:41 8) Bestiary - 21:32 9) Random Encounters - 23:26 10) Character Creation - 25:10 11) RPG Feel - 26:48 12) Future of the Game and Customization - 27:54 Final Thoughts - 30:10 I'm surprised no one has made time stamps yet! 😅 I kept coming back to this video for Reference, so figured others would need it too!
Thank you, Daniel. About Dungeon Universalis, we are still working on new projects that will undoubtedly surprise you much more (with a lot of experience in all areas and better technical and economic resources, everything will be much easier). :)
Awesome. I love Dungeon Universalis. My main request would be a simplified Automated Dark Player. There are way to many rules to remember for the ADP right now and on top of that the AI system for monster targeting is very tough to manage. Improve the AI rules and I think you'll have an amazing solo system on your hands. Otherwise, it's basically a game I only pull out if I don't feel like running an actual RPG, but still feel like playing the dungeon master role.
@@MrCrimsonMaskIts very much worth the money, even more so if a random map generator is included in the new edition. I do sympathize with high Canadian shipping costs though.
Great video! I'd just like to point out DC's excellent monster patrol route system which I think is totally unique for this type of game. Well done to all the developers as we truly are spoilt with this type of game.
Hello Mel and good morning to you! :-) it's really nice to see you pop up here. I haven't chatted with you in a while so I hope you're doing good and enjoying any games you're playing. There are a few things I want to thank you for, Mel. I want to thank you for mentioning the patrol route system in Dungeon Crusade. That's something I put a lot of thought into and creativity. Like I've said many times, ever since I was young, I wanted a living dungeon where monsters and creatures would have this type of invisible AI where the player would not know where they will move next. And the patrol route system does this perfectly. So thank you for mentioning that. I also want to thank you, Mel, for your friendship, excitement for the game, and for your support over the years. You are one of the original Crusaders, as I call it, and I will always be eternally grateful to you. I would love to meet you one day and play a game with you and get some pizza! Lastly, do keep in mind I'm working on two new modes for the game. The 1 is quite a creative dungeon random generator mode, and the other one is called Quest Challenges. This is going to be a mode where the games are anywhere from 45 minutes but no longer than 2 hours. I know a lot of people are looking forward to this. As we wrap up the reprint, this is where my time will be to finish these up. I hope you have a great Tuesday, Mel; I'm trying to get back to all the nice comments here. Talk to you soon. ..Rodger:-)
I absolutely love your breakdowns for everything. Your videos always help me form my final decisions when trying to decide if I want to purchase and play particular dungeon crawlers you may happen to cover.
Great video Daniel. Looking forward to getting my copy of LoD’s. In the meantime I’m working my way through a solo play through of DUN playing one hero with two mercenaries.
Really great dice rolls! Just incredible! I've been practicing all day, and I think I'm finally getting my technique down! Sometimes I can roll a 1 then a 2!!! Ok, I'm gonna get back to practicing now👍🏼
Excellent 12pt. reviews and comparisons! Your description of League of Dungeoneers reminds me of your description of Fallen Land--the open world experience with true sandbox explorations. The auric colors of Dungeon Crusade are popping, but League of Dungeoneers has a lot going for it which attracts me to it!
When I first watched this video, I had none of these now I have all three including the ace version of Dungeoneers, which arrived just the other day! Thank you!!!
I really enjoyed this video (though a few more special effects for dice rolling would be great 😉)! Please consider doing more of these "comparisons" between similar games, even if you do not have the game anymore. The reasoning between multiple games really helps more than anything else to decide if I would like a game or not!
Just for your information: there is a huge, excellent random dungeon generator and even a random campaign generator for DUN on BGG. I haven´t played the others yet, but I think DUN also plays very well solo. Thanks for the vdeo!
Yeah - for that point I was talking about what's included in the box only; printing out cards is a real PITA for me. It really needs an official one included in the box, and I think it's sorely missing. Your play-through videos were great! Well done!
I think your point at 2:00 is what puts me off these games - the game that combines the old school thrill of dungeon crawling but throws out all the "accepted knowledge" will be the one to rule them all yo would imagine?
Agree with Daniel 100%. I sold my copy, one of the main reasons being backers were promised a random dungeon system but never got it. An app behind a paywall doesn’t count.
Wow! I love your content! Great Job! That epic dice rolling was taking me out.😂😂 Dungeon Crusade is my favorite Dungeon Crawl, that I’ve only played once due to time constraints. However, I’m thinking of nabbing up the others because of your video. Thank you!
Hello there Julius, and good evening to you. 🙂 Great to hear from you here! I said this in our group to you, Daniel did an outstanding job in going over each of the games. I really enjoyed everything he had to say about them. And thank you Julius for EVERYTHING you have done for me, the game, and the community. You're truly one of a kind and a great friend to me. I'm glad we met on the Crusade! I hope that you have a great night, Julius;, if you ever need anything, please let me know. Talk to you soon. 🙂
League of dungeoneers only has official standees but it is made to be miniature agnostic, and the pictures in the rulebook of awesome minis in awesome 3d terrain dungeons hype me up to play and makes me me want to upgrade my fantasy collection to make cool dungeons for it , good video, can’t wait to get my copy of dungeon universalis
This was a great comparative analysis of these three games. I’ve been kind of waiting for someone to do this for the new big ol’ dungeon crawls. And I sort of knew it’d be you.
Went all in on Dungeon Universalis 3rd campaign. My reason for choosing this was simply the amazing review lonesome gamer did on his channel paired with detailed sessions to watch. He addressed all my possible concerns and up until today this game is the only one which ticks all the right boxes for me. I especially like the toolbox and sheer amount of options to tinker with and being able to turn it into my very own game. Add to this the fact, that you can also use existing minis and tiles of other games. My only minor concern is the solo playability. But with such a great devoted development team and community, I am more than confident that it will be a great experience.
Ok - wanted to totally zero in on your point about LoD needing more non-combat encounters - especially in the dungeon play. Having more of these "role-play" moments will be important to save the game from being a move-fight-move-fight wash/rinse/repeat experience - especially if you want to play this for long stretches of time. But you're right that it evokes WHQ 95 very strongly (and offers more satisfying tactical combat) so it is definitely a solid engine that deserves to be tuned and added to.
Great video! I've really enjoyed your coverage of LoD and can't wait for it to get to my table. I also have DUN on the way from the latest kickstarter but as time goes on I am starting to wonder about just selling it. I definitely plan on playing these games solo and I think LoD will serve me better for that purpose. Also, great dice rolling! Some people complain that dungeon dives are too random and luck based, but they are clearly just unwilling to spend the time to get good at rolling dice.
I have played DUN solo, and for me it is fabulous that way. There is an app that makes this very easy and with minimal play time disruption. Whilst I too am looking forward to LoD, I doubt it will replace DUN at the very top of my favourites list. There is a depth to DUN in terms of it’s roleplaying and campaign systems that LoD approaches, but does not surpass, IMHO.
@@williamegan6756 I haven’t played DUN myself, but from watching videos it seems like there is a lot to manage when playing it solo. Is it less overwhelming than it looks?
@@justinrastin8802 Hmm, good question! I’d say if you’ve played old school RPGs like D&D or Pathfinder , then no, not overwhelming at all. Like those systems (and like LoD), there are options to simplify the rules and do away with aspects that slow the game down (ex. encumbrance, or variable terrain and condition modifiers in combat). The monster cards do a great job of helping keep track of the vast bestiary. But the game is still going to be more complex than something like Descent. The thing is, the more you grow accustomed to the system, the less complex it ultimately feels. But that can take time. 😊
These 3 are "Anti Gloomhaven" and thank goodness for that! Im expecting LOD in April but very much like the other two in philosophy. The trend for modern board games has very much sided with euro sensibilities. It's a reflection, imo, of the main consumer demographic. Upper middle class or better. I have been to 4 Dice tower "events" and as a Amerithrash, theme gamer i can say that 90% or more of the gamers at these events prefer if not solely enjoy euros. Awesome vid btw!!
Hello Geek Gamers, and good evening to you. :-) I hope you're doing good and having an excellent weekend. This is Rodger, the creator of Dungeon Crusade and the Avalon Adventure board game. I wanted to let you know I would be very happy to send you a copy of the Avalon Adventure board game and Dungeon Crusade for you to check out if you like. I truly stepped out to break the mold of the fantasy adventure/RPG/dungeon crawl genre to give people something creative, innovative, something I was passionate about, and in a new direction. There were many revisions to the game, tweaks, and a brand new revised rule book that is getting excellent reviews. Feel free to email me, and we'll work out the details. I've checked out your channel over the years, and you provide some great content. I wish you the best with it! :-) Have a great evening, stay safe and happy gaming. Talk to you soon... Rodger 🙂
@@GroovusGamesUnlimitedThanks for the generous offer and I’m glad you enjoy my channel. I will take a pass on receiving your game, but I wish you all the best with it.
@@GeekGamers01 Hello there, geek gamers, and good evening to you. :) I hope that you had an excellent Monday. And no problem at all. If you ever change your mind, the offer still stands. I wish you the very best with your channel and thank you for everything you do in our board game community. Have a good night, stay safe and happy gaming; talk to you soon...Rodger :)
Crap - with DUN and LoD on the way, now I need to be on the lookout for the DC v2 KS - with DD-designed content? Oy! (in the best possible way). These Sunday videos are killing it Daniel! Best part of Sunday for me! 🙂
Soon Dungeons of Doria to be included in that battle. It places itself pretty well in the old school modern classical dungeon crawler that comes with standees (and for sure top one in the loot category xD)
I agree completely, with a single caveat -- while I agree DUN would do well to include a few tables in its huge rulebook for random generation, I think in its current state it shines more for its premade campaign than adventuring on the fly. I don't know how much content is included in the other two, but when you include all expansions DUN has something like 300+ hours of premade dungeoneering to do.
Fantastic video. It's silly but I laughed at each of your dice rolls. I like that none of these games usurps the other, and each offers individual elements. Having seen and disliked the the new editions of Warhammer Quest, Decent, and Dungeon Saga, it's great seeing smaller publishers creating deeper and more evolved old school dungeon board games.
Totally! We have so many amazing options these days. But also, the new WHQ games rule! Silver Tower is in the Dungeon Dive masterclass series. One my favorite games of all time. BSF is great as well.
@@TheDungeonDive absolutely. Very informative the decision making is hard. If these are my top three requirements in order which one would you recommend? 1. Solo Play 2. Overland Adventure 3. Easy (comparatively) to learn Things that are less important to me Time, space, storage, minis
Hey Daniel, have you tried playing DUN solo again after getting the bestiary cards? It really makes the experience much smoother with the ADP having all the items, skills and weapon info on the monster cards. It's just so so good and it realy helped me to play solo. Using the Bestiary book only is indeed cumbersome. Cheers!
Daniel, thanks for a terrific video. As usual, I always learn more than what the Video is supposed to be about, in this case, for example: good ways to evaluate games in this genre. I plan to buy the next version of Dungeoneers. I had already decided that although Dungeon Crusade was amazing and imaginative, it is a game I wish to PLAY but not to OWN. Dungeon Universalis strikes me as too complicated, and that's saying something, considering that I have enjoyed Magic Realm and Aeon Trespass: Odyssey. I have a much better idea what to expect from League of Dungeoneers, and how to decide about its expansions. I have also decided not to get into any game of Craps where you are rolling the dice. -toby
Hello there Paul, and good evening. :) I hope you're doing good, and it's great to see you pop up here! Thank you for your kind words about Dungeon Crusade. LOL, I think you know the game better than me. But it was a real honor to have Dungeon Crusade right alongside these other two epic and awesome games. Daniel did a fantastic job on this video. I hope you have a great Wednesday, Paul, and as always, thank you for your amazing friendship, excitement for the game, and support. I will always be eternally grateful to you and everyone else. Talk to you soon. . Rodger :)
I have only played DUN solo using the automated overlord and I think it is one of the best game AIs out there. It has worked very, very well for me. Balance has been great. Not too easy, not too hard.
This is very useful, thank you for doing this. There are points for all that I really like and then things that turn me off. I think DUN really is a toolkit and designed as such. However... for myself...I need minis. Can't do standees, it's just not in me. So whatever game I'd choose, I'd end up proxying anyway.
What do you think of the automated dark player. I made characters which was really fun for dungeon universalsis. But didn’t start playing yet. I’m currently playing shadows of brimstone and that might be a year.
Thanks Daniel! This was a great, well- articulated and very knowledgeable take on three giant games. We don’t get this nuance from any other DC board game reviewer, which is why we always come back to the Dungeon Dive! As a solo player myself, I do feel the solo element of Dungeon Universalis is much stronger than most people give it credit for. It can be an uphill struggle to master the rules, but once you’re there, it is (for me) board game heaven! It has unmatched depth and fantastic campaign play. I know I’ll love League of Dungeoneers for many of the same reasons, and can’t wait to get my copy. For me, it definitely has the brightest future ahead just because of its similarity to Warhammer Quest. It is definitely tapping into a huge, unmet need right there! Hopefully Michael will give us more and more content down the line. I’m more on the fence about Dungeon Crusade, as friends have told me it is long, repetitive and (after some plays) gets quite tedious. I have it coming on Kickstarter though, so I guess I’ll be able to judge for myself. Agree with you on the awesome art, though.
Hello William, and good evening to you. :-) This is Rodger, and I hope you're doing good. I wanted to jump in here and say HI! and let you know a few things. First and foremost, William, I want to thank you for your friendship, excitement for the game, and support of the Avalon Adventure board game and Dungeon Crusade. I'm sincerely grateful to you and everyone else. Also, there's so much to say about Dungeon Crusade! I wanted to point a few things out and let you know some information on the game and some things to look forward to. When you combine the Avalon Adventure board game and Dungeon Crusade, it is truly a very creative, grandiose, and innovative experience that goes in a new direction. That is what I set out to do. Give people & fellow gamers something new to enjoy and experience. In a nutshell, your Heroes are going to be tasked with completing quests on three different Quest tables. Quest tables 1 and 2 are exploring the dungeon and everything it has to offer. And there is a lot it has to offer. When your Heroes go to Quest table 3, I always think of it like a showdown with your Heroes and the Guardians of the dungeon. The Guardians are like the bosses of the dungeon. Like the heroes, the Guardians can level up and obtain level 4, making them incredibly deadly. So if you picture it, Quest table 1 and 2 has your Heroes exploring the dungeon, going into chambers, combating the champions within, finding Quest items, smashing open crates they find, mining and crafting power gems, discovering secret rooms, and so much more. The end game, Quest table 3, has your hero squaring off against these high-level guardians. To me, that's like the climax of the game. Hopefully, I explained that well enough. Lastly, I'm not sure if you ever saw this video, but at your convenience, check out this introduction and overview of the Avalon Adventure board game and Dungeon Crusade. I think this video will get you quite acclimated to the game and show you everything I'm talking about. But of course, if you ever need help, I'm always here for everyone; just let me know. I hope you have a fantastic Tuesday, William, and thank you again. Talk to you soon... Rodger :-) ua-cam.com/video/y0e4R478egg/v-deo.html
@@GroovusGamesUnlimited Thanks very much for the detailed and informative repose, Rodger! I am still eagerly anticipating my copy, and look forward to seeing how the Avalon Adventure and Dungeon Crusade games interact to give one that truly epic experience. The Guardians as bosses at the climax of the adventure are cool, and I hope will make for great endgame battles where my heroes will triumph after great struggle, and feel awesome at their success. I guess what’s important for me is that I get that sense of it feeling like a great story, with a beginning, middle and end despite not having an overarching‘narrative’, if you know what I mean. I differ somewhat from Daniel in the sense that I like having a little more structure to what happens (it’s also why I really like Folklore the Affliction, for example, and am kind of ‘meh’ on Shadows of Brimstone). In any case, I want to congratulate you on creating Dungeon Crusade - it’s passionate developers like yourself that keep our hobby growing in new and rich directions! All the best.
Great overview. I have pledged on DuN and LoD and have been very tempted by DC because it looks amazing. I do have some concerns that I have so many games and spend so many hours building and painting minis and terrain, that I won't have time for these games. I definitely wouldn't have 6 hours for Dungeon Crusade and that is the main reason that I haven't gone ahead and backed it.
Sorry, maybe I missed it. But which of these 3 games have you decided not to 'burn' in the fire pit. Love your legerdemaine skills with the dice. How they can change without touching them is so awesome. America's Got Talent is in your future!
I had the same question. I thought that a 1 would equate to 3 points, a 2 would equate to 2 points, and a 3 would equate to 1 point. Add each game's score and we'd get a comparison of the totals. I feel kind of let down by the video.
Sorry to provide you with free entertainment. The whole point of the video was to show that all three games are awesome and there are no losers, only winners, and the winners are the players who get to play these great games. If you're worried about the points it was: League of Dungeoneers. 25 Dungeon crusade. 24 Dungeon Universalis. 23 There. Now you have a winner and a loser. Happy?
Will you do a review of Tanares adventures? And do you think it compares to these ones? Been looking for my first big box game, League of dungeoneers has my votes between these three because I will play mostly solo, but everytime I see Tanares it really makes my hypemeter go up.
Fantastic breakdown- not sure why i watch these things as I’m getting DUN and LoD, but was still nice to get a sense of what Dungeon Crusade is like and will be looking for 2.0 on crowdfunding!
Question: When you talk of the League of Dungeoneers rulebook is that a copy from the recent campaign or a much older one? If it is the recent one I can ask Michael if the upcoming reprint/expansion campaign will be containing a revised rulebook. Thank you for any clarification. Cheers
Ludic Dragon they have translated into several languages. When the other two have translated versions they will have my attention. The DUN application is not at all intrusive as in other games like Descent or mansions of madness...
That’s great! Always good when games are released in other languages. I don’t mind technology in my games, but when it comes to old school style games I want all paper / cardboard.
@The Dungeon Dive For sure. They all look good. But, I'm more looking for something that has a strong dungeon randomization engine and something more traditional and simple in its setting. LoD looks like the perfect mix.
Great video as always. I love Dungeon Crusade, but I would love smaller loot cards, cos as it is, it takes too much spaces for each hero(you need to play 6) even on a big table. It's a unique game, far away from the two others. I'm like you not a Dun fan because it's too much work solo, and more a rpg than a board game. I'm waiting for LoD...as I'm not lucky as you ;-)
Excellent video. Great information here. I LOVED your spot-on dice rolling Magic!! 😂 … you even managed to change a D100 into a D10 roll!! AMAZING! 😆… I’m surprised you didn’t talk about the set up time for Dungeon Crusade. It took me 2hrs on average to set up the game and that was with having a full custom organizer… this is one game that could seriously benefit from an app that would handle the room encounter and seeding of the dungeons… can’t count how often I pulled it out looked at the fantastic art and then put it away to do something else. 😅
I like apps in games, but not in my old school games. With old school games, I don’t want technology. There are a ton of topics I could have discussed. I couldn’t possible cover everything!
Just mentioning the 2 hr set up times… Not apps specifically. I was just saying that Dungeon Crusade is an absolute BEAST just to set up…my thought was in the this case an app would eliminate the need for most of the tokens, Storage issues, and most of all the hours it takes to get the game in playing order each time you want to play it... 😅
I really like the tokens in DC because they make it really easy to make my own quests! That would be hard to implement in a simple app. But I may be in the minority on this. :)
I remember you mentioning that when you played D&D …that you never really played it, you just made characters… it could be like that, you just spend hours setting up Dungeons and that’s how you play…😂
Fantastic video. DUN is the main one for me, and your coverage helped me solidify that choice. Do you know if Roger plans on doing a narrative-driven expansion? The lack of one is the only thing stopping me from getting DC. I'm a reader who likes to play board games - mostly dungeon crawlers - once or twice a week as a sort of tactile reading experience, so having some sort of cohesive story is a requirement for me.
I doubt that. Not really the focus of the game. I think that's what makes it really stand out in the sea of modern story-based narrative games. Its more in line with what I like - a game where I get to be in control of the story and make it up myself.
I agree that DUN needs cards for dungeon generation. I would like to see in all games more choose your own adventure style encounters. I like the idea of being able to avoid a fight or trap or having a certain item that makes defeating the boss easier. I also like goofy nonsensical encounters that don’t effect anything.
Lol I’m a sucker I backed all of these…. I really really hope we see the big box storage solution for Dungeon Crusade. So many of us asked for it throughout the campaign and with as long as the manufacturer has taken to even get to working on that game I’d had hoped for them to get it in…
Love this video. It saddens me that we have 3 epic games and so far 2 of them (haven’t gotten LoD yet) haven’t fully captured the magic for me. Crusade is awesome but it’s just waaaaay too long in a single session. DUN for me just wasn’t even close to what I was looking for (although the solo DM rules helped me think of a good way to solo Descent 1st Ed). LoD looks to be the best so far but the dex requirement for melee is a bit oof. So far descent 1st ed. Road to Legend still reigns supreme. It just hits all the notes. Now if only a good solo could be made. Applying DUNS rules work great. I just don’t have the time/patience to build a per monster AI system and OL upgrade tree.
Very interesting! I did not like Road to Legend at all. Totally fell flat for our group. I did not like the competitive nature of the game at all. We just ended up using the cardboard for games of D&D. :)
lol nice! Yeah the game is REAL cut throat and thats for sure not for everyone. But if thats taken aside, the game is a campaign sandbox, with overworld travel, semi randomized dungeons, a clear end game objective, a great character progression system, and plenty of loot. These are essentially the notes i look for in a replacement and so far most games are missing at least 1 part. For example, I can already see LoD is missing the 'clear end game objective' DUN to me had minimal character progression, not the greatest loot, and no randomized dungeons. Ive been looking for a coop/solo replacement for almost 15 years and still cant find one. LOL. A professionally made solo/coop ruleset, or at least a real good one would make RtL the best Sandbox crawl for me. It has all the piece just not the rules.
For me, Dungeon Universalis is Road to Legend done right. It's very similar, but the overlord player can play competitively, or more like a traditional GM where they just facilitate the fun. I can't think of a board game with better character creation and progression than DUN. For me there are so many better replacements for Road to Legend. Maybe your nostalgia for the feelings of that time are too strong? Hopefully something comes along soon that you like! We are living in the golden age of adventure and dungeon crawl board games!
...so would you say that buying and playing DUN for solo will give me insight into getting more out of the solo play available in my underutilized complete Descent 1st Ed. set...or could you identify those insights gleaned from "...the solo DM rules helped me think of a good way to solo Descent 1st Ed)." Any help would be appreciated. Cheers.
@@TheDungeonDive, so "...replacements for Road to Legend". What might they be if it's not too big a question and unrelated to your video. I was just saying to B DouubleDs that I've been dreaming of finally playing my complete Descent 1st Edition (disregarding the fact that i haven't done so much already) and hearing that DUN might help or even that there may be other alternatives intrigues me. Cheers
The odds of rolling a d12 and getting 1-12 in order is about 1 in 9 trillion. I’m not even taking into account some of the other rolls you pulled off. I’d be suspicious that anyone could get that lucky in a single take, so it must be a matter of skill.
You mentioned Shadows of Brimstone and Darklight as possible comparisons here, how would you rate Folklore in that group? I know it has overworld and dungeon crawling like all of these... PS: I loved the dice rolling bit in this video, made me laugh every time.
These games were unfortunately plagued during it's release. While I have hopes for 2nd edition I feel sorry for the backers that got screwed with the giant list of erratas that should have been caught
Great video, Daniel. Thanks for your effort. While character creation is one of your twelve points, character progression isn't. Can you maybe give some insight into this (what happens during leveling up, what is the level cap?)?
Makes sense, we all look for different things in games. Thanks for the answer :) I am playing Advanced Heroquest lately and I gotta say the combat is pretty cool and simple!
What I feel was a missing section from your overview is no mention of both the amount of time each of those games takes to set up and play as well as the amount of table space needed. Had I realised what a table and time hog Dungeon Crusade is I would not have backed it as both time and table space constraints mean I will never get to play it sadly.
I had a list of over 40 potential topics. I didn't want the video to be 3 hours long, so I narrowed it down to 12. I talk in great length about the table space needed for DC in my hours of coverage on that game!
Thorny subject really in terms of solo play. Along the meandering path my limited funds take me I have both DC and LoD awaiting fulfilment. I missed out on the second DUN and the warehouse overflow and the recent campaign because I just didn't have the money. Right now I am staring at the Kick and Go inventory page knowing that I am much more likely to be a Daniel-esque gamer than not so why do I also need DUN,...except...I do also collect games I dream of playing one day...to many in fact. Maybe I need DUN as an aspirational marker to fail at in solo play...except I already have that with my 40 year old copy of Magic Realm! Any thoughts or encouragement for this tired aging mind will be much appreciated. Cheers
@@TheDungeonDiveYes, I have watched many of them...although not so much of DUN which I have seen plenty of elsewhere but the game still resides in a kind of nebulous in-between place for me. I must say you do an impressive job of responding to the wall of posts from viewers which is what got be thinking about DUN again after reading B DoubleDs observation "...the solo DM rules helped me think of a good way to solo Descent 1st Ed)." and your response "For me there are so many better replacements for Road to Legend" with regard to BDD's experience of improving Descent gameplay having studied DUN's solo DM rules...we'll see, in the end I am just not an app guy especially if subscriptions are involved. Thank you for your response. Daniel. Have a good weekend. Cheers.
Not sure why you believe DUN requires an app to play, I've been playing DUN solo since it's first inception and only use what comes out of the box, no app needed. And finding powerful loot should be linked to the level of danger and the amount of time played, I really enjoy the random element of loot finds in DUN.
It needs an app to keep the mystery of exploring when playing solo / co-op. I’d rather it used cards for that and for generating random quests. I’d play the game a lot more if it has an official cardboard solution in the box for random quests and exploration. That’s something I think the game is missing. But remember, that’s just my dumb opinion. Everyone will also have their own dumb opinions. :)
@@TheDungeonDive don't forget DUN is all about the campaign, so the Dungeons are preconstructed as part of the campaign. There are guidelines in the main rulebook for creating random dungeons. I'm sure the designers would be interested in anyone who can design a workable dungeon generator using cards or a chart you roll dice to generate.
Oh yeah! It's just for me, DUN excels as a 1 vs many game. It feels like that was the focus of the original design, and I think it shows. But again, that's only for me. Other people will obviously feel different. And as I said, it's just an amazing thing that all three of these awesome games are available at the same time. We truly are lucky, and no one can go wrong with any of them.
Scores are meaningless. And I probably would have made a mistake in adding, and then everyone would have complained. But people complained either way. LOL! UA-cam - the place for complaining!
@@williamegan6756 hahaha fair enough they are big scrolling games but Gloomhaven I'd say is the Daddy of starting off all these Kickstarter big RPG enormous epic boxed Dungeon Crawler games 🤣🤣
Totals
League of Dungeoneers. 25
Dungeon crusade. 24
Dungeon Universalis. 23
But as had been said, I don't think you can go wrong with any of them if old school dungeon crawl is your jam.
Wow! That was close! I knew it would be.
@@TheDungeonDive I know you said the numbers "doesn't mean anything", but I think you could do a 1-5 instead of 1-3. That way, you could kind of show how far each game is to each other. Like the points where DUN and LoD were miles apart from DC, that could give points like 1 to DC and 4 and 5 to the other two.
I know 2nd place is in the middle, but extending the points this way, you could have the middle one kind of leaning one towards one or the other, or right in the middle with 1 - 3 - 5.
Hope that is understandable! Love this video, very good for people to ask "what do I like to play" "what do I prefer" fantastic. I think my choice of LoD is good, but the FOMO in me really want all, haha!
There are no places. That was the whole point of the video if that wasn’t clear. Each of these games is awesome and we should consider ourselves lucky to be living during this golden age of gaming.
how about with the League of Dungeoneers.2nd printing?
Timestamps:
1) Ease of Learning - 5:32
2) Ease of Play (How Well it Plays Solo, Setup, Teardown, etc.) - 7:51
3) Component Quality/Quantity - 10:18
4) Visual Appeal - 13:00
5) Overland Adventure Component - 14:47
6) Dungeon Crawling Component - 17:32
7) Loot - 19:41
8) Bestiary - 21:32
9) Random Encounters - 23:26
10) Character Creation - 25:10
11) RPG Feel - 26:48
12) Future of the Game and Customization - 27:54
Final Thoughts - 30:10
I'm surprised no one has made time stamps yet! 😅
I kept coming back to this video for Reference, so figured others would need it too!
Thank you, Daniel. About Dungeon Universalis, we are still working on new projects that will undoubtedly surprise you much more (with a lot of experience in all areas and better technical and economic resources, everything will be much easier). :)
Hopefully we see an in the box solution for random quests and dungeon exploration!
Awesome. I love Dungeon Universalis. My main request would be a simplified Automated Dark Player. There are way to many rules to remember for the ADP right now and on top of that the AI system for monster targeting is very tough to manage. Improve the AI rules and I think you'll have an amazing solo system on your hands. Otherwise, it's basically a game I only pull out if I don't feel like running an actual RPG, but still feel like playing the dungeon master role.
Sadly I backed at 1 euro but the game is just way to expensive for me to get where I want it to be. $250 CAD 😢
@@MrCrimsonMaskIts very much worth the money, even more so if a random map generator is included in the new edition. I do sympathize with high Canadian shipping costs though.
Please release a space version mixing xenos psych Mecha robots and take my money 💰
Wow that is exactly how I roll my dice behind my DM screen!!
10/10 for the commitment to the dice rolling bit
As usual, your video is very thorough and light years away from any hype, thanks for sharing Daniel !
My pleasure!
Impressive dice rolling skills! Great video too :)
Great video! I'd just like to point out DC's excellent monster patrol route system which I think is totally unique for this type of game.
Well done to all the developers as we truly are spoilt with this type of game.
Hello Mel and good morning to you! :-) it's really nice to see you pop up here. I haven't chatted with you in a while so I hope you're doing good and enjoying any games you're playing.
There are a few things I want to thank you for, Mel. I want to thank you for mentioning the patrol route system in Dungeon Crusade. That's something I put a lot of thought into and creativity.
Like I've said many times, ever since I was young, I wanted a living dungeon where monsters and creatures would have this type of invisible AI where the player would not know where they will move next. And the patrol route system does this perfectly. So thank you for mentioning that.
I also want to thank you, Mel, for your friendship, excitement for the game, and for your support over the years. You are one of the original Crusaders, as I call it, and I will always be eternally grateful to you. I would love to meet you one day and play a game with you and get some pizza!
Lastly, do keep in mind I'm working on two new modes for the game.
The 1 is quite a creative dungeon random generator mode, and the other one is called Quest Challenges. This is going to be a mode where the games are anywhere from 45 minutes but no longer than 2 hours. I know a lot of people are looking forward to this. As we wrap up the reprint, this is where my time will be to finish these up.
I hope you have a great Tuesday, Mel; I'm trying to get back to all the nice comments here. Talk to you soon. ..Rodger:-)
Dice rolling (fixing) skill was awesome & funny
The brawl for it all!
I absolutely love your breakdowns for everything. Your videos always help me form my final decisions when trying to decide if I want to purchase and play particular dungeon crawlers you may happen to cover.
Happy to help!
Great video Daniel. Looking forward to getting my copy of LoD’s. In the meantime I’m working my way through a solo play through of DUN playing one hero with two mercenaries.
This video takes first place in the category of... 'effortless fun'!
Really great dice rolls! Just incredible! I've been practicing all day, and I think I'm finally getting my technique down! Sometimes I can roll a 1 then a 2!!! Ok, I'm gonna get back to practicing now👍🏼
Excellent 12pt. reviews and comparisons! Your description of League of Dungeoneers reminds me of your description of Fallen Land--the open world experience with true sandbox explorations.
The auric colors of Dungeon Crusade are popping, but League of Dungeoneers has a lot going for it which attracts me to it!
Really hard to beat the look of DC.
When I first watched this video, I had none of these now I have all three including the ace version of Dungeoneers, which arrived just the other day! Thank you!!!
Oh nice! Fun!
Wow! That is a very complete comparison. Thank you for doing the work.
I really enjoyed this video (though a few more special effects for dice rolling would be great 😉)!
Please consider doing more of these "comparisons" between similar games, even if you do not have the game anymore. The reasoning between multiple games really helps more than anything else to decide if I would like a game or not!
DUN is the only one I won’t have, the other 2 are on the way. I don’t feel like I NEED DUN though, but I could be persuaded.
I have DUN and DC.....waiting on LOD. Lots of dungeon crawling fun! Nice video!
Just for your information: there is a huge, excellent random dungeon generator and even a random campaign generator for DUN on BGG. I haven´t played the others yet, but I think DUN also plays very well solo. Thanks for the vdeo!
Yeah - for that point I was talking about what's included in the box only; printing out cards is a real PITA for me. It really needs an official one included in the box, and I think it's sorely missing. Your play-through videos were great! Well done!
I think your point at 2:00 is what puts me off these games - the game that combines the old school thrill of dungeon crawling but throws out all the "accepted knowledge" will be the one to rule them all yo would imagine?
Agree on both points. In addition, the point about discounting the website (it is not an App) is rather arbitrary as is the final category.
An app and a website are the same thing. Lol. It’s technology that ruins the old school vibe.
Agree with Daniel 100%. I sold my copy, one of the main reasons being backers were promised a random dungeon system but never got it. An app behind a paywall doesn’t count.
Love this style of episode! More!
Descent 2nd ed is still one of my favorite dungeon crawls. I love minis, so I would use minis to play any of these games.
Oh wow, this was so good! I backed both DUN and LoD with the latter arriving soon there’s a lot I’m looking forward to, thanks!
This is a great breakdown! Thank you so much!
Wow! I love your content! Great Job! That epic dice rolling was taking me out.😂😂
Dungeon Crusade is my favorite Dungeon Crawl, that I’ve only played once due to time constraints. However, I’m thinking of nabbing up the others because of your video. Thank you!
Hello there Julius, and good evening to you. 🙂 Great to hear from you here! I said this in our group to you, Daniel did an outstanding job in going over each of the games. I really enjoyed everything he had to say about them.
And thank you Julius for EVERYTHING you have done for me, the game, and the community. You're truly one of a kind and a great friend to me. I'm glad we met on the Crusade!
I hope that you have a great night, Julius;, if you ever need anything, please let me know. Talk to you soon. 🙂
Knocked it out the park again Daniel. Great content and detail. Thanks.
League of dungeoneers only has official standees but it is made to be miniature agnostic, and the pictures in the rulebook of awesome minis in awesome 3d terrain dungeons hype me up to play and makes me me want to upgrade my fantasy collection to make cool dungeons for it , good video, can’t wait to get my copy of dungeon universalis
Yeah! Go for it.
This was a great comparative analysis of these three games. I’ve been kind of waiting for someone to do this for the new big ol’ dungeon crawls. And I sort of knew it’d be you.
Went all in on Dungeon Universalis 3rd campaign.
My reason for choosing this was simply the amazing review lonesome gamer did on his channel paired with detailed sessions to watch. He addressed all my possible concerns and up until today this game is the only one which ticks all the right boxes for me.
I especially like the toolbox and sheer amount of options to tinker with and being able to turn it into my very own game. Add to this the fact, that you can also use existing minis and tiles of other games. My only minor concern is the solo playability. But with such a great devoted development team and community, I am more than confident that it will be a great experience.
As someone who has backed both DUN and LoD, this was exactly what I needed, haha. Fantasic video!
Great video, love the format.
Would to see this done for the old school classics (AHQ, Quest 95 etc)
The video I really waiting for! Thanks a lot!
Ok - wanted to totally zero in on your point about LoD needing more non-combat encounters - especially in the dungeon play. Having more of these "role-play" moments will be important to save the game from being a move-fight-move-fight wash/rinse/repeat experience - especially if you want to play this for long stretches of time. But you're right that it evokes WHQ 95 very strongly (and offers more satisfying tactical combat) so it is definitely a solid engine that deserves to be tuned and added to.
Great video! I've really enjoyed your coverage of LoD and can't wait for it to get to my table. I also have DUN on the way from the latest kickstarter but as time goes on I am starting to wonder about just selling it. I definitely plan on playing these games solo and I think LoD will serve me better for that purpose. Also, great dice rolling! Some people complain that dungeon dives are too random and luck based, but they are clearly just unwilling to spend the time to get good at rolling dice.
Thank you! That dice rolling took many years of practice.
I have played DUN solo, and for me it is fabulous that way. There is an app that makes this very easy and with minimal play time disruption. Whilst I too am looking forward to LoD, I doubt it will replace DUN at the very top of my favourites list. There is a depth to DUN in terms of it’s roleplaying and campaign systems that LoD approaches, but does not surpass, IMHO.
@@williamegan6756 I haven’t played DUN myself, but from watching videos it seems like there is a lot to manage when playing it solo. Is it less overwhelming than it looks?
@@justinrastin8802 Hmm, good question! I’d say if you’ve played old school RPGs like D&D or Pathfinder , then no, not overwhelming at all.
Like those systems (and like LoD), there are options to simplify the rules and do away with aspects that slow the game down (ex. encumbrance, or variable terrain and condition modifiers in combat). The monster cards do a great job of helping keep track of the vast bestiary. But the game is still going to be more complex than something like Descent.
The thing is, the more you grow accustomed to the system, the less complex it ultimately feels. But that can take time. 😊
@@williamegan6756 Thanks for the response!
I love such videos! If I had to go with only of them, it would be DUN for me
Just found this video. Was thinking of backing the league of dungeoneers. Appreciate this video
I cant quite help feeling you fudged some of those dice rolls 😁 Glad Dungeon crusade done so well, Roger is the man!😁
You can’t prove anything!
These 3 are "Anti Gloomhaven" and thank goodness for that! Im expecting LOD in April but very much like the other two in philosophy. The trend for modern board games has very much sided with euro sensibilities. It's a reflection, imo, of the main consumer demographic. Upper middle class or better. I have been to 4 Dice tower "events" and as a Amerithrash, theme gamer i can say that 90% or more of the gamers at these events prefer if not solely enjoy euros. Awesome vid btw!!
Thanks! Glad you enjoyed it.
Really enjoyed this one, Daniel. Can we meet up and hit the craps table in Vegas soon?
And the winner is......ME....or anyone else who loves dungeon crawl board games. What a fabulous (and can't-miss) choice the three games represent.
You get it! :)
Well done
Nicely done. I haven’t played Dungeon Crusade and I’m sure I never will, but your points on the other two resonated very well with how I feel too.
Hello Geek Gamers, and good evening to you. :-) I hope you're doing good and having an excellent weekend. This is Rodger, the creator of Dungeon Crusade and the Avalon Adventure board game.
I wanted to let you know I would be very happy to send you a copy of the Avalon Adventure board game and Dungeon Crusade for you to check out if you like. I truly stepped out to break the mold of the fantasy adventure/RPG/dungeon crawl genre to give people something creative, innovative, something I was passionate about, and in a new direction.
There were many revisions to the game, tweaks, and a brand new revised rule book that is getting excellent reviews.
Feel free to email me, and we'll work out the details. I've checked out your channel over the years, and you provide some great content. I wish you the best with it! :-)
Have a great evening, stay safe and happy gaming. Talk to you soon... Rodger 🙂
@@GroovusGamesUnlimitedThanks for the generous offer and I’m glad you enjoy my channel. I will take a pass on receiving your game, but I wish you all the best with it.
@@GeekGamers01 Hello there, geek gamers, and good evening to you. :) I hope that you had an excellent Monday. And no problem at all. If you ever change your mind, the offer still stands.
I wish you the very best with your channel and thank you for everything you do in our board game community. Have a good night, stay safe and happy gaming; talk to you soon...Rodger :)
Crap - with DUN and LoD on the way, now I need to be on the lookout for the DC v2 KS - with DD-designed content? Oy! (in the best possible way). These Sunday videos are killing it Daniel! Best part of Sunday for me! 🙂
Thanks, Tom.
Soon Dungeons of Doria to be included in that battle. It places itself pretty well in the old school modern classical dungeon crawler that comes with standees (and for sure top one in the loot category xD)
Yes indeed, Heide!
Cheers
I agree completely, with a single caveat -- while I agree DUN would do well to include a few tables in its huge rulebook for random generation, I think in its current state it shines more for its premade campaign than adventuring on the fly. I don't know how much content is included in the other two, but when you include all expansions DUN has something like 300+ hours of premade dungeoneering to do.
That’s totally fair. I just prefer random quests / dungeons over ore-made and written ones.
Fantastic video. It's silly but I laughed at each of your dice rolls. I like that none of these games usurps the other, and each offers individual elements. Having seen and disliked the the new editions of Warhammer Quest, Decent, and Dungeon Saga, it's great seeing smaller publishers creating deeper and more evolved old school dungeon board games.
Totally! We have so many amazing options these days.
But also, the new WHQ games rule! Silver Tower is in the Dungeon Dive masterclass series. One my favorite games of all time. BSF is great as well.
I've been waiting for this:)
This is so exciting, I have been thinking about picking up one of these. Thanks!
Hope you get some good info.
@@TheDungeonDive absolutely. Very informative the decision making is hard. If these are my top three requirements in order which one would you recommend?
1. Solo Play
2. Overland Adventure
3. Easy (comparatively) to learn
Things that are less important to me Time, space, storage, minis
@@shrekage Just get all three of them:)
@@Kanoo_stream ha ha and keep them in shelf with rest 100 of them 🤪
Hey Daniel, have you tried playing DUN solo again after getting the bestiary cards? It really makes the experience much smoother with the ADP having all the items, skills and weapon info on the monster cards. It's just so so good and it realy helped me to play solo. Using the Bestiary book only is indeed cumbersome. Cheers!
I have not yet. Just haven't had the time to get this re-learned and back to the table.
Daniel, thanks for a terrific video. As usual, I always learn more than what the Video is supposed to be about, in this case, for example: good ways to evaluate games in this genre. I plan to buy the next version of Dungeoneers. I had already decided that although Dungeon Crusade was amazing and imaginative, it is a game I wish to PLAY but not to OWN. Dungeon Universalis strikes me as too complicated, and that's saying something, considering that I have enjoyed Magic Realm and Aeon Trespass: Odyssey. I have a much better idea what to expect from League of Dungeoneers, and how to decide about its expansions. I have also decided not to get into any game of Craps where you are rolling the dice. -toby
Absolutely awesome. I had the dungeon crusade and had to let it go due to its overwhelming amount of rules, never played DUN and decided to back LOD.
I have all three but the problem is I’m waiting for DUN and LoD to come in. I will say I love DC and it’s currently my #1.
Hello there Paul, and good evening. :) I hope you're doing good, and it's great to see you pop up here!
Thank you for your kind words about Dungeon Crusade. LOL, I think you know the game better than me. But it was a real honor to have Dungeon Crusade right alongside these other two epic and awesome games. Daniel did a fantastic job on this video.
I hope you have a great Wednesday, Paul, and as always, thank you for your amazing friendship, excitement for the game, and support. I will always be eternally grateful to you and everyone else. Talk to you soon. . Rodger :)
Seamless special effects.
Really helpful comparison of those titles!
Thank you. Glad you found it useful.
I have only played DUN solo using the automated overlord and I think it is one of the best game AIs out there. It has worked very, very well for me. Balance has been great. Not too easy, not too hard.
It's just too complex for my simple mind to handle on its own!
This is very useful, thank you for doing this. There are points for all that I really like and then things that turn me off. I think DUN really is a toolkit and designed as such.
However... for myself...I need minis. Can't do standees, it's just not in me. So whatever game I'd choose, I'd end up proxying anyway.
Death to plastic! ;)
@@TheDungeonDive,huzzah!👿👿
I don't know why but the dice shenanigans got me good lmao
It was fun. :)
What do you think of the automated dark player.
I made characters which was really fun for dungeon universalsis. But didn’t start playing yet.
I’m currently playing shadows of brimstone and that might be a year.
It works well. Just too much to keep track of for me as a solo player.
Thanks Daniel! This was a great, well- articulated and very knowledgeable take on three giant games. We don’t get this nuance from any other DC board game reviewer, which is why we always come back to the Dungeon Dive!
As a solo player myself, I do feel the solo element of Dungeon Universalis is much stronger than most people give it credit for. It can be an uphill struggle to master the rules, but once you’re there, it is (for me) board game heaven! It has unmatched depth and fantastic campaign play.
I know I’ll love League of Dungeoneers for many of the same reasons, and can’t wait to get my copy. For me, it definitely has the brightest future ahead just because of its similarity to Warhammer Quest. It is definitely tapping into a huge, unmet need right there! Hopefully Michael will give us more and more content down the line.
I’m more on the fence about Dungeon Crusade, as friends have told me it is long, repetitive and (after some plays) gets quite tedious. I have it coming on Kickstarter though, so I guess I’ll be able to judge for myself. Agree with you on the awesome art, though.
Oh yeah. DUN is a super strong solo game for most people. It’s just not for me.
Hello William, and good evening to you. :-) This is Rodger, and I hope you're doing good. I wanted to jump in here and say HI! and let you know a few things.
First and foremost, William, I want to thank you for your friendship, excitement for the game, and support of the Avalon Adventure board game and Dungeon Crusade. I'm sincerely grateful to you and everyone else.
Also, there's so much to say about Dungeon Crusade! I wanted to point a few things out and let you know some information on the game and some things to look forward to.
When you combine the Avalon Adventure board game and Dungeon Crusade, it is truly a very creative, grandiose, and innovative experience that goes in a new direction. That is what I set out to do. Give people & fellow gamers something new to enjoy and experience.
In a nutshell, your Heroes are going to be tasked with completing quests on three different Quest tables. Quest tables 1 and 2 are exploring the dungeon and everything it has to offer. And there is a lot it has to offer.
When your Heroes go to Quest table 3, I always think of it like a showdown with your Heroes and the Guardians of the dungeon. The Guardians are like the bosses of the dungeon. Like the heroes, the Guardians can level up and obtain level 4, making them incredibly deadly.
So if you picture it, Quest table 1 and 2 has your Heroes exploring the dungeon, going into chambers, combating the champions within, finding Quest items, smashing open crates they find, mining and crafting power gems, discovering secret rooms, and so much more.
The end game, Quest table 3, has your hero squaring off against these high-level guardians. To me, that's like the climax of the game. Hopefully, I explained that well enough.
Lastly, I'm not sure if you ever saw this video, but at your convenience, check out this introduction and overview of the Avalon Adventure board game and Dungeon Crusade.
I think this video will get you quite acclimated to the game and show you everything I'm talking about. But of course, if you ever need help, I'm always here for everyone; just let me know.
I hope you have a fantastic Tuesday, William, and thank you again. Talk to you soon... Rodger :-)
ua-cam.com/video/y0e4R478egg/v-deo.html
@@GroovusGamesUnlimited Thanks very much for the detailed and informative repose, Rodger!
I am still eagerly anticipating my copy, and look forward to seeing how the Avalon Adventure and Dungeon Crusade games interact to give one that truly epic experience. The Guardians as bosses at the climax of the adventure are cool, and I hope will make for great endgame battles where my heroes will triumph after great struggle, and feel awesome at their success.
I guess what’s important for me is that I get that sense of it feeling like a great story, with a beginning, middle and end despite not having an overarching‘narrative’, if you know what I mean. I differ somewhat from Daniel in the sense that I like having a little more structure to what happens (it’s also why I really like Folklore the Affliction, for example, and am kind of ‘meh’ on Shadows of Brimstone).
In any case, I want to congratulate you on creating Dungeon Crusade - it’s passionate developers like yourself that keep our hobby growing in new and rich directions! All the best.
Just late pledged Dungeon Crusade. How could I not after hearing your thoughts? Thanks, man!
Great overview. I have pledged on DuN and LoD and have been very tempted by DC because it looks amazing. I do have some concerns that I have so many games and spend so many hours building and painting minis and terrain, that I won't have time for these games. I definitely wouldn't have 6 hours for Dungeon Crusade and that is the main reason that I haven't gone ahead and backed it.
Sorry, maybe I missed it. But which of these 3 games have you decided not to 'burn' in the fire pit. Love your legerdemaine skills with the dice. How they can change without touching them is so awesome. America's Got Talent is in your future!
I didn’t total anything up. Numbers were just for fun. :)
I had the same question. I thought that a 1 would equate to 3 points, a 2 would equate to 2 points, and a 3 would equate to 1 point. Add each game's score and we'd get a comparison of the totals. I feel kind of let down by the video.
Sorry to provide you with free entertainment.
The whole point of the video was to show that all three games are awesome and there are no losers, only winners, and the winners are the players who get to play these great games. If you're worried about the points it was:
League of Dungeoneers. 25
Dungeon crusade. 24
Dungeon Universalis. 23
There. Now you have a winner and a loser. Happy?
@@TheDungeonDive I am happy actually. The video was slightly misleading. Don’t take it personal.
Rolling a 7 for point 7 and still swapping the dice, excellent touch ^_^
I wish I could say that was on purpose...
Will you do a review of Tanares adventures?
And do you think it compares to these ones?
Been looking for my first big box game, League of dungeoneers has my votes between these three because I will play mostly solo, but everytime I see Tanares it really makes my hypemeter go up.
I will not. It was too expensive and too much plastic.
Fantastic breakdown- not sure why i watch these things as I’m getting DUN and LoD, but was still nice to get a sense of what Dungeon Crusade is like and will be looking for 2.0 on crowdfunding!
Question: When you talk of the League of Dungeoneers rulebook is that a copy from the recent campaign or a much older one? If it is the recent one I can ask Michael if the upcoming reprint/expansion campaign will be containing a revised rulebook.
Thank you for any clarification.
Cheers
It's the one included in the kickstarter.
@@TheDungeonDive, Ohh..., well that's something to look forward to,...I suppose...
Thank you for this clarification, Daniel.
Cheers
Ludic Dragon they have translated into several languages. When the other two have translated versions they will have my attention. The DUN application is not at all intrusive as in other games like Descent or mansions of madness...
That’s great! Always good when games are released in other languages. I don’t mind technology in my games, but when it comes to old school style games I want all paper / cardboard.
Looks like I made the right decision with LoD. That's the game for me. Can't wait to get my hands on it.
Can't go wrong with any of the three, really.
@The Dungeon Dive For sure. They all look good. But, I'm more looking for something that has a strong dungeon randomization engine and something more traditional and simple in its setting. LoD looks like the perfect mix.
Great video as always. I love Dungeon Crusade, but I would love smaller loot cards, cos as it is, it takes too much spaces for each hero(you need to play 6) even on a big table.
It's a unique game, far away from the two others.
I'm like you not a Dun fan because it's too much work solo, and more a rpg than a board game.
I'm waiting for LoD...as I'm not lucky as you ;-)
Excellent video. Great information here. I LOVED your spot-on dice rolling Magic!! 😂 … you even managed to change a D100 into a D10 roll!! AMAZING! 😆… I’m surprised you didn’t talk about the set up time for Dungeon Crusade. It took me 2hrs on average to set up the game and that was with having a full custom organizer… this is one game that could seriously benefit from an app that would handle the room encounter and seeding of the dungeons… can’t count how often I pulled it out looked at the fantastic art and then put it away to do something else. 😅
I like apps in games, but not in my old school games. With old school games, I don’t want technology. There are a ton of topics I could have discussed. I couldn’t possible cover everything!
Just mentioning the 2 hr set up times… Not apps specifically. I was just saying that Dungeon Crusade is an absolute BEAST just to set up…my thought was in the this case an app would eliminate the need for most of the tokens, Storage issues, and most of all the hours it takes to get the game in playing order each time you want to play it... 😅
I really like the tokens in DC because they make it really easy to make my own quests! That would be hard to implement in a simple app. But I may be in the minority on this. :)
I remember you mentioning that when you played D&D …that you never really played it, you just made characters… it could be like that, you just spend hours setting up Dungeons and that’s how you play…😂
Everything is play.
Fantastic video. DUN is the main one for me, and your coverage helped me solidify that choice. Do you know if Roger plans on doing a narrative-driven expansion? The lack of one is the only thing stopping me from getting DC. I'm a reader who likes to play board games - mostly dungeon crawlers - once or twice a week as a sort of tactile reading experience, so having some sort of cohesive story is a requirement for me.
I doubt that. Not really the focus of the game. I think that's what makes it really stand out in the sea of modern story-based narrative games. Its more in line with what I like - a game where I get to be in control of the story and make it up myself.
@@TheDungeonDive Gotcha. Thanks for the insight!
I agree that DUN needs cards for dungeon generation. I would like to see in all games more choose your own adventure style encounters. I like the idea of being able to avoid a fight or trap or having a certain item that makes defeating the boss easier. I also like goofy nonsensical encounters that don’t effect anything.
Really nice work ... but, unfortunately, it only made it harder for me to decide!
Lol I’m a sucker I backed all of these…. I really really hope we see the big box storage solution for Dungeon Crusade. So many of us asked for it throughout the campaign and with as long as the manufacturer has taken to even get to working on that game I’d had hoped for them to get it in…
Love this video. It saddens me that we have 3 epic games and so far 2 of them (haven’t gotten LoD yet) haven’t fully captured the magic for me. Crusade is awesome but it’s just waaaaay too long in a single session. DUN for me just wasn’t even close to what I was looking for (although the solo DM rules helped me think of a good way to solo Descent 1st Ed). LoD looks to be the best so far but the dex requirement for melee is a bit oof.
So far descent 1st ed. Road to Legend still reigns supreme. It just hits all the notes. Now if only a good solo could be made. Applying DUNS rules work great. I just don’t have the time/patience to build a per monster AI system and OL upgrade tree.
Very interesting! I did not like Road to Legend at all. Totally fell flat for our group. I did not like the competitive nature of the game at all. We just ended up using the cardboard for games of D&D. :)
lol nice! Yeah the game is REAL cut throat and thats for sure not for everyone. But if thats taken aside, the game is a campaign sandbox, with overworld travel, semi randomized dungeons, a clear end game objective, a great character progression system, and plenty of loot. These are essentially the notes i look for in a replacement and so far most games are missing at least 1 part. For example, I can already see LoD is missing the 'clear end game objective' DUN to me had minimal character progression, not the greatest loot, and no randomized dungeons.
Ive been looking for a coop/solo replacement for almost 15 years and still cant find one. LOL. A professionally made solo/coop ruleset, or at least a real good one would make RtL the best Sandbox crawl for me. It has all the piece just not the rules.
For me, Dungeon Universalis is Road to Legend done right. It's very similar, but the overlord player can play competitively, or more like a traditional GM where they just facilitate the fun. I can't think of a board game with better character creation and progression than DUN. For me there are so many better replacements for Road to Legend. Maybe your nostalgia for the feelings of that time are too strong? Hopefully something comes along soon that you like! We are living in the golden age of adventure and dungeon crawl board games!
...so would you say that buying and playing DUN for solo will give me insight into getting more out of the solo play available in my underutilized complete Descent 1st Ed. set...or could you identify those insights gleaned from "...the solo DM rules helped me think of a good way to solo Descent 1st Ed)." Any help would be appreciated. Cheers.
@@TheDungeonDive, so "...replacements for Road to Legend". What might they be if it's not too big a question and unrelated to your video. I was just saying to B DouubleDs that I've been dreaming of finally playing my complete Descent 1st Edition (disregarding the fact that i haven't done so much already) and hearing that DUN might help or even that there may be other alternatives intrigues me.
Cheers
The odds of rolling a d12 and getting 1-12 in order is about 1 in 9 trillion. I’m not even taking into account some of the other rolls you pulled off. I’d be suspicious that anyone could get that lucky in a single take, so it must be a matter of skill.
It's the one thing in life I'm good at.
You mentioned Shadows of Brimstone and Darklight as possible comparisons here, how would you rate Folklore in that group? I know it has overworld and dungeon crawling like all of these...
PS: I loved the dice rolling bit in this video, made me laugh every time.
Folklore is completely different. It has more narrative campaigns and doesn’t have random dungeon crawling.
These games were unfortunately plagued during it's release. While I have hopes for 2nd edition I feel sorry for the backers that got screwed with the giant list of erratas that should have been caught
Great video, Daniel. Thanks for your effort. While character creation is one of your twelve points, character progression isn't.
Can you maybe give some insight into this (what happens during leveling up, what is the level cap?)?
Too much to type. Maybe I’ll make another video in the future. I would rate thusly: DUN, LOD, DC.
How do they compare to shadows of brimstone
I’ve got videos of all. Probably best to watch and apply the information. I wasn’t thinking of SoB in comparison.
How would you rate the combat between the 3?
I prefer simple combat that I don't have to think about so 1. DC, 2. LOD, 3. DUN. I'm not good at games, so I don't love really tactical combat.
Makes sense, we all look for different things in games. Thanks for the answer :) I am playing Advanced Heroquest lately and I gotta say the combat is pretty cool and simple!
What I feel was a missing section from your overview is no mention of both the amount of time each of those games takes to set up and play as well as the amount of table space needed. Had I realised what a table and time hog Dungeon Crusade is I would not have backed it as both time and table space constraints mean I will never get to play it sadly.
I had a list of over 40 potential topics. I didn't want the video to be 3 hours long, so I narrowed it down to 12. I talk in great length about the table space needed for DC in my hours of coverage on that game!
@@TheDungeonDive The main reason for me realising DC would never see the light of day for me was watching your videos! 😉
Yeah - it can be unfortunate. That is a nice thing about DUN. It gives an epic experience, but isn't a total table hog (most of the time).
I gotta give it to Hexplore It.
Great game. Very different than these three.
@The Dungeon Dive Absolutely different. But it's where I get my party-based, overworld and dungeon crawling adventure game fix these days.
Thorny subject really in terms of solo play. Along the meandering path my limited funds take me I have both DC and LoD awaiting fulfilment. I missed out on the second DUN and the warehouse overflow and the recent campaign because I just didn't have the money. Right now I am staring at the Kick and Go inventory page knowing that I am much more likely to be a Daniel-esque gamer than not so why do I also need DUN,...except...I do also collect games I dream of playing one day...to many in fact. Maybe I need DUN as an aspirational marker to fail at in solo play...except I already have that with my 40 year old copy of Magic Realm!
Any thoughts or encouragement for this tired aging mind will be much appreciated.
Cheers
All of my thoughts on the subject of these games are in my videos. I have very detailed playlists for each of these with hours of material.
@@TheDungeonDiveYes, I have watched many of them...although not so much of DUN which I have seen plenty of elsewhere but the game still resides in a kind of nebulous in-between place for me. I must say you do an impressive job of responding to the wall of posts from viewers which is what got be thinking about DUN again after reading B DoubleDs observation "...the solo DM rules helped me think of a good way to solo Descent 1st Ed)." and your response "For me there are so many better replacements for Road to Legend" with regard to BDD's experience of improving Descent gameplay having studied DUN's solo DM rules...we'll see, in the end I am just not an app guy especially if subscriptions are involved.
Thank you for your response. Daniel.
Have a good weekend.
Cheers.
Not sure why you believe DUN requires an app to play, I've been playing DUN solo since it's first inception and only use what comes out of the box, no app needed. And finding powerful loot should be linked to the level of danger and the amount of time played, I really enjoy the random element of loot finds in DUN.
It needs an app to keep the mystery of exploring when playing solo / co-op. I’d rather it used cards for that and for generating random quests.
I’d play the game a lot more if it has an official cardboard solution in the box for random quests and exploration. That’s something I think the game is missing. But remember, that’s just my dumb opinion. Everyone will also have their own dumb opinions. :)
@@TheDungeonDive don't forget DUN is all about the campaign, so the Dungeons are preconstructed as part of the campaign. There are guidelines in the main rulebook for creating random dungeons. I'm sure the designers would be interested in anyone who can design a workable dungeon generator using cards or a chart you roll dice to generate.
Oh yeah! It's just for me, DUN excels as a 1 vs many game. It feels like that was the focus of the original design, and I think it shows. But again, that's only for me. Other people will obviously feel different. And as I said, it's just an amazing thing that all three of these awesome games are available at the same time. We truly are lucky, and no one can go wrong with any of them.
good comparison but i wanted to see the scores
Scores are meaningless. And I probably would have made a mistake in adding, and then everyone would have complained. But people complained either way. LOL! UA-cam - the place for complaining!
No mention of Gloomhaven 🤣🤣. Can't beat the old school DCs
Absolutely! Gloomhaven not even in the same league as these three. 😄
@@williamegan6756 as in not as good as these three or in God Level Tier and untouchable 🤣🤣
@@Mark-nh2hs Hehe, take your pick! 😎 I’m not a huge fan of Gloomhaven, although I appreciate what it’s done for the Dungeon Crawling genre.
@@williamegan6756 hahaha fair enough they are big scrolling games but Gloomhaven I'd say is the Daddy of starting off all these Kickstarter big RPG enormous epic boxed Dungeon Crawler games 🤣🤣
Nope. GH is more of a Euro-puzzle game, with a fantasy theme. A dungeon crawl for people who don't typically enjoy dungeon crawls like these.