First off, your landings are fine. Great, even, given how little solo time you have in that plane. Even the one you were upset about only looked like a tiny bump to me. As far as Cessna vs. low wings (I don't have much Piper time, but about half my total time is in the Mooney that I own) to me it's more about pitch attitude than floating. My recollection is that to get the Cessna to really stop flying you have to get the nose much higher, which is uncomfortable for most people, whereas the low-wings stall out at a lower nose-up attitude. From your flying, you clearly don't need my advice, or anyone's really. As you correctly concluded (and said), it's all about speed control and energy management. Love your videos. Keep up the good work! A couple of editorial comments. I'm totally jealous of you being able to rent an airplane with an Aspen. I love those, and I've only flown an airplane with one once. I think it would be super-cool if you would do a video featuring it. Almost no one has really dug into them. I find it interesting that you use the opposite convention for using your Garmin 430. I *always* have track up, and I get absolutely infuriated when I'm flying a club airplane and someone has set it to North up. The thing about track-up is you can basically use the GPS to steer the airplane by peripheral vision by keeping the magenta line straight up and down; this is particularly useful when you're flying instruments. Could I ask a favor Gareth? I'm looking to find out a couple of things about the Lake Parker approach when flying into Sun-n-fun. I'm wondering two things. 1) What's the initial position that the Lake Parker approach asks you to start at? Is it the power plant on the northeast corner of the lake? Or is it a point 2 or 3 miles east of the powerplant? I know what the NOTAM says, I'm curious as to what the actual approach people say. 2) Where do the Lake Parker controllers (or the tower) tell you to fly south off the Interstate? Do they tell you to fly *between* the ball water tower and the cake tower? Or do they tell you to directly overfly the cake tower? (Again, I know what the NOTAM says, I'm curious of the actual directives from ATC on the day.)
A lot to take in there. Firstly, thanks for your kind words. It’s much appreciated. I’ve just come home after a day of flying with Otto, so I’m going to take it easy this evening, but I’ll come back to you regarding your other points and questions tomorrow when I’m a little more fresh.
@@ZeroThreeDelta Groovy. No worries. Oh, and I hear yout about the "oh, wait--I can go flying whenever I want!" feeling. I also felt it when I joined the flying club, and again when I owned an airplane.
I flew a 172s on Friday, it was my first solo in that one, with a 180HP. it flies like a rocket, has heading autopilot, nice plane.. any ways., when i took off RWY 15 (KDVN) winds were 160/8 when i got to Dubuque (KDBQ), landing on RWY 18 winds were 150/14G24. I came in with 3 nootches, and it bounced 3x and floated quite a bit. When i returned home, i landed with 1 nootch, and as soon as i touched i raised the flaps, and it didnt float at all. Not sure if that's standard procedure or not, but it really helped keep the plane on the ground after landing, and did not float at all. next time the wind is more stable and not so gusty, i am going to just do XWND TNGs to find the correct combination. i am thinking when landing with wind, land with 1 or 2 noootches
Looked like you started the flair slightly higher on the first one, so by the time you were above the runway you'd already killed off a bit of energy so it settled sooner. Bear in mind you are flying alone too - it's easier to "plant" when it's heavier! Honestly though unless you are landing short-field there's nothing wrong with a bit of float if you are expecting it - just aim a bit further ahead of your intended touchdown point. Having a bit of extra energy means more positive controls too, esepcially if it's a bit bumpy. The first time I nailed a completely float-free landing in a Cessna it actually scared me a bit, because you are literally landing with "nothing left" energy wise. Perfect short-field landing, but if you go too far the other way you'll end up dropping it in like a brick! Keep searching for that sweet-spot!
Come on Gareth....every landing you walk away is a good landing...every landing you can use the plane afterwards is a perfect landing. I fly 182 also, and yes....it floats more the our Piper's , but hey....who cares, as long as you have runway left....no problem, I guess. Btw.....nice video!
Just wanted to say that I enjoy watching your videos, even the ones with that other guy. LOL Bought his Commencing Engin Start shirt. Looking forward to seeing what you come up with. Good luck.
I likewise am at a loss as to why the homely, pokey C172 is so popular. It's used a lot by flight schools yet it isn't easy to land at all, especially in windy conditions. As the plane loses speed during landing heavy inputs are needed to maintain control. The C172 doesn't float as badly as the Mooney M20 but students often float and bounce their C172 landings until they get a feel for flaring under different conditions (especially weight and wind conditions).
7:03 - WeatherGods being notified... "Alert. Alert... High Wing Cessna on short final. Proceed with auto-updraft now. 3..2..1... Now" WeatherGods!!! "What? Oh... was that Gareth? We'll get him next time." 10:54 - Voice signature activated. Similar to LewDix. Auto-updraft engaged. 13:11 - I suppose it's just go with the numbers, and deal with the float. My Take.. FWIW: My entire PPL was in a C-152, where I had to lead all my turns with my knees. Then I transitioned to the C-172 and found that it was bit like a SUV and took a while to tame. When I tried out the Katana DA-20, I immediately took to it and found it really stable. So... My theory is that it's OK to learn in a squirrelly high-wing, because it really keeps you on your game. I appeared to be immediately ahead of the DA-20 for other things aside from control-input, so that was good. Who knows... Fly what you can - the Hobbs meter is the same device.
I teach in the 172 SP every day. Your instinct is correct, 70 kts is a bit quick for short final. A good safe final speed in the Skychicken is between 60 and 65 kts. At 60 kts you will feel a slight sinking feeling right through your...well, backside and the plane will have a slight nose up attitude. Buyer beware that if you come in at 55 kts your controls will be very soft and you will really have to wrestle with the plane if you have any wind at all. Give a 60 knot short final a try next time you fly, you will still have good positive energy to the runway and it should help with that lovely float. Congrats on your certificate! Keep up the good work and fly safe.
Flew another SP today and landed at 60 knots. Still a little float, but we had gusts down the runway. Touchdown was very nice. I'll do a second video on this soon.
Nice flying. First landing maybe the best. Classic😂. Overthinking it? All landings were perfectly fine to good even. I’m finishing up my night flying and prepping for check ride myself in a pa28. Hopefully this month 🤷🏻♂️. Cheers. No experience in a Cessna yet but feel like I need to do it. I think somewhere it’s overthinking it. Presumably less energy (speed) into the roundout/ flare will do the trick (like u mentioned) plus mileage. Early days yet in Cessna for you.
I thought you did pretty well with those landings considering it was “anchors away” time. Nearly over now but hope you and the family had a good Easter.
I fly a pa28-180, had the opportunity to fly a 172 a few weeks back. 172 does feel a little sloppy and hard to get her on the ground when light. Don’t fly below your target published approach speed, you’ll lose authority (You mention 55kts)
@@ZeroThreeDelta @Zero Three Delta Hey, by the way, I like your channel and your previous chronicles with Lewdix. I have a UA-cam channel as well that will focus more on aviation soon. I am in Ottawa Canada. Let me know if you ever want to come up for a visit in a post-pandemic world. I'll fly you over great points of interest in Ontario and Quebec.
Another cool video, and yes, the Cessna tend to float if that speed before the keys are above 65kt. BTW , what’s up the Pirates of Caribbean themeish music?
The day I make my 10th no float landing AND make the 1st turnoff I believe I will sprout wings and ascend to a utopia reserved for superior beings. My FBO always has a crosswind so a perfect slow flight and stall landing is a luxury.
Is that a "Flight Outfitters Waypoint Backpack" I see in the back seat??? They are a lil pricy but I love mine. Very well thought out on the layout of compartments.
Can't wait till you guys get your own plane and can fly whenever you want, no more renting or high wing stuff:) Till then you can always come to Kissimmee and get to ride around with me (it's a Beechcraft Sierra, low wing) haha Now it's time to begin your IFR ticket!! It's been a fun journey for ya and look forward you seeing you keep on trucking! Get your wife back in the training so she can get her license as well!!
It was a 1.2 at $169 per hour + tax, so $216. Not the cheapest place around. Same thing with the other company I use (172 but not an SP) would have been $168.
@@Dakren12 I will, but not straight away. I’d like to enjoy a little time outside of the training environment and just enjoy my privileges for a while.
@@ZeroThreeDelta oh my goodness, I didn't realize it was such an old idea! That's already 3 years ago. Lewis has really made it a classic in his Cessna videos though. This video would have been perfect with it especially considering the title and the thumbnail
Your speeds are too high. I fly the pattern like this.... reduce power abeam the numbers, first notch and pitch for 80. Turn base, add 2nd notch and slow to 70. Turn final, add full flaps and slow to 60. I like to cross the numbers with power out at 55 with passengers and 50 when lightly loaded. I fly the Cherokee and Arrow as much as I do a 172 and I find that the Cessna requires more speed control because they want to fly.
First off, your landings are fine. Great, even, given how little solo time you have in that plane. Even the one you were upset about only looked like a tiny bump to me.
As far as Cessna vs. low wings (I don't have much Piper time, but about half my total time is in the Mooney that I own) to me it's more about pitch attitude than floating. My recollection is that to get the Cessna to really stop flying you have to get the nose much higher, which is uncomfortable for most people, whereas the low-wings stall out at a lower nose-up attitude.
From your flying, you clearly don't need my advice, or anyone's really. As you correctly concluded (and said), it's all about speed control and energy management.
Love your videos. Keep up the good work!
A couple of editorial comments.
I'm totally jealous of you being able to rent an airplane with an Aspen. I love those, and I've only flown an airplane with one once. I think it would be super-cool if you would do a video featuring it. Almost no one has really dug into them.
I find it interesting that you use the opposite convention for using your Garmin 430. I *always* have track up, and I get absolutely infuriated when I'm flying a club airplane and someone has set it to North up. The thing about track-up is you can basically use the GPS to steer the airplane by peripheral vision by keeping the magenta line straight up and down; this is particularly useful when you're flying instruments.
Could I ask a favor Gareth? I'm looking to find out a couple of things about the Lake Parker approach when flying into Sun-n-fun. I'm wondering two things. 1) What's the initial position that the Lake Parker approach asks you to start at? Is it the power plant on the northeast corner of the lake? Or is it a point 2 or 3 miles east of the powerplant? I know what the NOTAM says, I'm curious as to what the actual approach people say. 2) Where do the Lake Parker controllers (or the tower) tell you to fly south off the Interstate? Do they tell you to fly *between* the ball water tower and the cake tower? Or do they tell you to directly overfly the cake tower? (Again, I know what the NOTAM says, I'm curious of the actual directives from ATC on the day.)
A lot to take in there. Firstly, thanks for your kind words. It’s much appreciated.
I’ve just come home after a day of flying with Otto, so I’m going to take it easy this evening, but I’ll come back to you regarding your other points and questions tomorrow when I’m a little more fresh.
@@ZeroThreeDelta Groovy. No worries.
Oh, and I hear yout about the "oh, wait--I can go flying whenever I want!" feeling. I also felt it when I joined the flying club, and again when I owned an airplane.
Great camera perspective of the instrument panel especially when floating , so you can see air speed. Was dancing around 50k and just floating away 😀.
Yeah, that view is popular. I’ll have to do more with it in future videos.
I flew a 172s on Friday, it was my first solo in that one, with a 180HP. it flies like a rocket, has heading autopilot, nice plane.. any ways., when i took off RWY 15 (KDVN) winds were 160/8 when i got to Dubuque (KDBQ), landing on RWY 18 winds were 150/14G24. I came in with 3 nootches, and it bounced 3x and floated quite a bit. When i returned home, i landed with 1 nootch, and as soon as i touched i raised the flaps, and it didnt float at all. Not sure if that's standard procedure or not, but it really helped keep the plane on the ground after landing, and did not float at all.
next time the wind is more stable and not so gusty, i am going to just do XWND TNGs to find the correct combination.
i am thinking when landing with wind, land with 1 or 2 noootches
Casually using the word "nootch" 😂
Looked like you started the flair slightly higher on the first one, so by the time you were above the runway you'd already killed off a bit of energy so it settled sooner.
Bear in mind you are flying alone too - it's easier to "plant" when it's heavier!
Honestly though unless you are landing short-field there's nothing wrong with a bit of float if you are expecting it - just aim a bit further ahead of your intended touchdown point. Having a bit of extra energy means more positive controls too, esepcially if it's a bit bumpy.
The first time I nailed a completely float-free landing in a Cessna it actually scared me a bit, because you are literally landing with "nothing left" energy wise. Perfect short-field landing, but if you go too far the other way you'll end up dropping it in like a brick!
Keep searching for that sweet-spot!
Will do! I was amazed at the speed when it ‘had nothing left’.
Come on Gareth....every landing you walk away is a good landing...every landing you can use the plane afterwards is a perfect landing. I fly 182 also, and yes....it floats more the our Piper's , but hey....who cares, as long as you have runway left....no problem, I guess. Btw.....nice video!
Thanks!
I will be at Sun N Fun Saturday. Looking forward to seeing you.
Likewise.
I heard MZeroA have pulled out due to covid.
@@ZeroThreeDelta they sure did. Gives us a chance to dominate the world! 😊
@@blueskyaviationpilottraining hi.
@@grummangreaser4701 hello my friend
Amazing videos like always!
Appreciate it 😁
Just wanted to say that I enjoy watching your videos, even the ones with that other guy. LOL Bought his Commencing Engin Start shirt. Looking forward to seeing what you come up with. Good luck.
Appreciate it! 😁
I've found that full barn door, then as you cross the threshold, door open and anchor out, works best 👍
😂
I likewise am at a loss as to why the homely, pokey C172 is so popular. It's used a lot by flight schools yet it isn't easy to land at all, especially in windy conditions. As the plane loses speed during landing heavy inputs are needed to maintain control. The C172 doesn't float as badly as the Mooney M20 but students often float and bounce their C172 landings until they get a feel for flaring under different conditions (especially weight and wind conditions).
7:03 - WeatherGods being notified...
"Alert. Alert... High Wing Cessna on short final. Proceed with auto-updraft now. 3..2..1... Now"
WeatherGods!!!
"What? Oh... was that Gareth? We'll get him next time."
10:54 - Voice signature activated. Similar to LewDix. Auto-updraft engaged.
13:11 - I suppose it's just go with the numbers, and deal with the float.
My Take.. FWIW: My entire PPL was in a C-152, where I had to lead all my turns with my knees. Then I transitioned to the C-172 and found that it was bit like a SUV and took a while to tame. When I tried out the Katana DA-20, I immediately took to it and found it really stable.
So... My theory is that it's OK to learn in a squirrelly high-wing, because it really keeps you on your game. I appeared to be immediately ahead of the DA-20 for other things aside from control-input, so that was good.
Who knows... Fly what you can - the Hobbs meter is the same device.
I teach in the 172 SP every day. Your instinct is correct, 70 kts is a bit quick for short final. A good safe final speed in the Skychicken is between 60 and 65 kts. At 60 kts you will feel a slight sinking feeling right through your...well, backside and the plane will have a slight nose up attitude. Buyer beware that if you come in at 55 kts your controls will be very soft and you will really have to wrestle with the plane if you have any wind at all. Give a 60 knot short final a try next time you fly, you will still have good positive energy to the runway and it should help with that lovely float. Congrats on your certificate! Keep up the good work and fly safe.
This sounds good ill have to try for myself on Monday
Flew another SP today and landed at 60 knots. Still a little float, but we had gusts down the runway. Touchdown was very nice. I'll do a second video on this soon.
Nice flying. First landing maybe the best. Classic😂. Overthinking it? All landings were perfectly fine to good even. I’m finishing up my night flying and prepping for check ride myself in a pa28. Hopefully this month 🤷🏻♂️. Cheers. No experience in a Cessna yet but feel like I need to do it.
I think somewhere it’s overthinking it. Presumably less energy (speed) into the roundout/ flare will do the trick (like u mentioned) plus mileage. Early days yet in Cessna for you.
Indeed. I’ll get there!
I thought you did pretty well with those landings considering it was “anchors away” time. Nearly over now but hope you and the family had a good Easter.
“Anchors Away” 😂
Speed is the main factor.
Indeed. I’ll get it right on the second attempt.
I fly a pa28-180, had the opportunity to fly a 172 a few weeks back. 172 does feel a little sloppy and hard to get her on the ground when light. Don’t fly below your target published approach speed, you’ll lose authority (You mention 55kts)
Absolutely. I knew this but didn’t apply it. First time solo in a 172 though so playing it safe. I’ll do better next time.
@@ZeroThreeDelta @Zero Three Delta Hey, by the way, I like your channel and your previous chronicles with Lewdix. I have a UA-cam channel as well that will focus more on aviation soon. I am in Ottawa Canada. Let me know if you ever want to come up for a visit in a post-pandemic world. I'll fly you over great points of interest in Ontario and Quebec.
Hi, on the GPS, press "Menu" and then chose "North UP" + "ENT"... This should work
Yeah, I fixed it shortly after I mentioned it.
1st one was a greaser ! Well done ! Hope to be flying the Florida skies when they let me in the country :-/
It’ll happen eventually! 🤞🏻
Another cool video, and yes, the Cessna tend to float if that speed before the keys are above 65kt. BTW , what’s up the Pirates of Caribbean themeish music?
It’s royalty free music. There’s a link in the video description for who I use 😁
@@ZeroThreeDelta well since it's free music!😁 that music is crazy 😆
I’ll be at sun n fun with Polk state aerospace so hopefully I’ll get to see you and lewdix!
Hopefully!
You are too hard on yourself, it will be better and better.
By the way it’s impossible NOT to hear who you’re instructor was..😂 love your videos.
True. Where was the f u gravity!? 😂
that callsign is so ironic
Haha. It’s definitely easy to remember.
The day I make my 10th no float landing AND make the 1st turnoff I believe I will sprout wings and ascend to a utopia reserved for superior beings.
My FBO always has a crosswind so a perfect slow flight and stall landing is a luxury.
Really need a “full barn door” shirt
😂 I was contemplating it!
Is that a "Flight Outfitters Waypoint Backpack" I see in the back seat???
They are a lil pricy but I love mine.
Very well thought out on the layout of compartments.
No, it’s just one of their flight bags.
Great video. Do all planes you rent have a gopro mount in the ceiling between the seats, or do you have a non-permanent mount I don't know about?
I’ve been lucky - they’ve all got GoPro mounts. Saves me having to put them in and not getting in trouble lol.
I would blame the last landing on that 1papapapapapapa guy
I agree 😂
Can't wait till you guys get your own plane and can fly whenever you want, no more renting or high wing stuff:) Till then you can always come to Kissimmee and get to ride around with me (it's a Beechcraft Sierra, low wing) haha Now it's time to begin your IFR ticket!! It's been a fun journey for ya and look forward you seeing you keep on trucking! Get your wife back in the training so she can get her license as well!!
Yeah, but the high-wing stuff gets good views lol.
What's the total cost for a Cessna rental trip like that? If you don't mind a breakdown
It was a 1.2 at $169 per hour + tax, so $216. Not the cheapest place around. Same thing with the other company I use (172 but not an SP) would have been $168.
@@ZeroThreeDelta Thank you! I appreciate the breakdown. I'm just getting started on my PPL! Will you be going for your IFR?
@@Dakren12 I will, but not straight away. I’d like to enjoy a little time outside of the training environment and just enjoy my privileges for a while.
"You can't say "bomb" on a plane!"
It’s ok if you’re on your own 😂
You can when you’re the PIC 🤣
Try 20 degrees flaps.
That occurred to me on the flight back. I’ll try a bunch of different configurations next time.
@@ZeroThreeDelta I think those barn doors are much more effective on the 172.
@@TerryD23 I agree. You can really feel them when they’re deployed.
No float music?!
What would that sound like? Just wind?
@@ZeroThreeDelta like Lewis has, the jeopardy theme song
That was my idea lol. Check out the video of him and I flying to Bartow on my channel 😉
@@ZeroThreeDelta oh my goodness, I didn't realize it was such an old idea! That's already 3 years ago. Lewis has really made it a classic in his Cessna videos though. This video would have been perfect with it especially considering the title and the thumbnail
Probably, but what’s done is done 🤷🏻♂️😁
Your speeds are too high. I fly the pattern like this.... reduce power abeam the numbers, first notch and pitch for 80. Turn base, add 2nd notch and slow to 70. Turn final, add full flaps and slow to 60. I like to cross the numbers with power out at 55 with passengers and 50 when lightly loaded. I fly the Cherokee and Arrow as much as I do a 172 and I find that the Cessna requires more speed control because they want to fly.
Yep, exactly what I said in the video after departing back to Leesburg 👍🏻
@@ZeroThreeDelta I had already typed all of my comment out when I got to that part. I was too lazy to go back and edit. 🤷♂️
😂
@@ZeroThreeDelta Was just going to comment this. Got to bring these boats in slow! Great vid
70 knots on final 😶
The rematch, which I shot yesterday, is better.
I’ll be there on Saturday. I want you to sign my Cessna shirt.
😂😂😂
I’ll sign it. Not sure what I’ll write, though 😁
@@ZeroThreeDelta just write, “the wings are in the wrong fucking spot. Bye”
@@grummangreaser4701 😂 done!
Instant sub.
Welcome! 😁