S-Cinetone vs HLG3 vs SLOG3 on the Sony a7S III | Real World Day & Night Comparison
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- Опубліковано 14 лип 2024
- In this video we explored and compared Sony's latest color profile S-Cinetone against HLG3 and SLOG3 on the a7S III. We tested overall color rendering, skin tones, dynamic range and low light sensitivity (night only) in both day and night outdoor scenarios. Hope you find this comparison helpful! Watch on to find out which one stood our as our favorite!
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Video Index:
0:00 S-Cinetone Footage
0:26 Introduction
1:24 Day Color Test
2:50 Day Dynamic Range Test
5:38 Night Color Test
6:11 Night Dynamic Range Test
7:50 ISO Test
8:24 Final Thoughts
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Hi everyone! Would like to clarify and rectify a statement that we mentioned in 8:07, the high base ISO for SLOG3 should in fact be 12800 and not 128000.
Incredible test and very helpfully! Thank you so much!
I’m glad it helps!!!
Super useful, many thanks for this video!
I hate reviews where you only see green leaves and unfocused close-ups that don't say anything. Your review is very informative, with people's faces and different exhibitions, I really appreciate the work and time you took to make this review. Go ahead friend!
Thank you so much!
Was thinking same, since i will be shooting mountain footage, sky, trees, buildings all are important to me, people to but not number 1. Since HLG3 seems good on people and HDR landscape plus seems more wysiwyg and less work? i love it. Also while one stop is nice, it's not insane.)
Awesome video thanks a lot for all this test 🔥🎥
Thank you very much for informative review !! Nice editing too!
Thank you so much!!
thank you so much for this video, it helps me so much on my filming workflow. You have earn yourself a new subscriber. 🎉
Thanks!! We do hope this video helps and gives you some insight into to the color profile.😬
Thanks mate for a really good comparison. Came here looking for an answer if I should use S-cine or Slog3 and looks like I'm going to give it a go with HLG3. Also, shout out for the model as she was extremely patient with all the different shots :D
Love the video brother, great, great information and comparison
I shoot hlg 3 bt2020 for weddings right now. slog is too hard for me to shoot on the go, and when I have to cover an entire event I can't be constantly switching my iso worrying about noise. yes 640 to 12800 def works best for slog 3. hlg3 seems to have some room for tweaking in post production if needed more so than baked in profiles. by the way good job don't listen to the haters. I noticed you responded in a very decent way to some people who just had nothing nice to say in the comments. we all learn over time
Thanks for your opinion, it's ones like these that will make up my mind eventually. I went back and fort (HLG3 better for 8 bit but i have 10 bit, so S-log3) but i hate the overexposing, so not much in my nature, wysiwyg is what i love (i shoot pictures most). HLG3 just seem better in that regard, and in absolute terms it's still really good for dynamic range.
What a great comparison and the great view of KL
Wow!!! Soooo beautiful footage!! Great work man🔥 I subscribed 👍
Thanks for the support and subs! 🔥🔥🔥🔥
I have tried various colour profiles and always come back to HLG3 - I guess that is the look I prefer
Yeah, I did a bunch of experiments and HLG3 is the one that best suits my needs.
Great video, thanks.
I just upgraded from the Sony ZV-E10 which I used to shoot 4K 4:2:0 8-bit in Slog 3 (I know, not best choice for 8 bit) to the FX6 Cinema Camera and boy am I amazed by the colors S.CInetone produces. I paired it up with the 24-70mm GM II and it's the perfect combo for everything I do. I'm not a colorist or whatever so I don't like spending my time color grading heavily but now that I got S.Cinetone and the ability to shoot 4K 10-bit 4:2:2 in XAVC-I all intra mode internally it's a dream. Love the colors it produces straight from the camera.
Good job. Thank you.
Great footage and comparison 👍
Hope it helps my friend 🙏🏻
Congratulations on your work, you explain very well, I loved the image where you are in your studio talking, what lens and profile did you use? Please
Hi Play By Pause, which PP would you recommend if I am filming walking in a forest and want to capture the sun rays going through the gaps? Very thorough and well presented video btw. Keep up the good work.
Thank you, I guess stick to HLG3 For now since I don't have Cine on my A7 iii
Good video, coming over from another system, these Sony profiles just seem like a headache I don't need. I like the comment below about SLOG3 being too much work. I guess it depends on your needs, 'tools for the job'. Sometimes these things get overhyped and for most production, interviews, event corporate pieces it can be overkill and 'overtime'. When it's just a single crew or possibly one extra, having a good profiles that suits most situations can't speed up work flow and then use another if it requires. Certainly worth doing our own tests in different conditions to see what works.
You are totally right !!!✌🏻
I use HLG-3 when there's no contrasty dynamic range, especially indoors, somewhat it has a sharper image too + easier to colour grade. S-LOG3 I normally use for daylight outdoors when I need to keep the dynamic range. Otherwise, when I know I can be just lazy, I shoot in S-Cinetone. In short, for the majority of the time, I shoot in HLG3. I am on a7IV + 10-bit.
Sir what software do you use to see your 10bits 4k clips before editing?, VLC / mpv dont work for me.
Been here before 2.63K Subs!
Awesome!!! Thanks for all the support and we will keep it up 💪🏼
Very good work! Sub! How easy is it to shoot with slog 3 this would be interesting!
im digging the hlg look
Been using HLG for the past 2 years. I think that I will stick to HLG.
so nice color
Muy útil. Excelente
Hlg2-3 still the best for me 🔥
Helpful
As an A7III user, I must say that the HLG3 profile look is the best. Especially since the 8 Bit image tend to be fall apart when grading.
This was very informative review !! Could you please tell me what metering mode did you use for day and night shots?
We just used the built in exposure meter right below the display 😬
I think you added a zero for slog3's iso - should be 12,800 - thanks for sharing your testing :) I just shot a music festival in S-cinetone and really happy with the results - as it got darker i switched over to slog3 and that worked great for me :)
You are right!
We have misspoke the extra zero for slog3
Thanks for pointing out !😇
where do i find s-cinetone? is that the same as like cine4? i have an a7c.
When using S cinetone I get the skin tones a little towards the yellow side of the vectoroscope for brown skin people. Did you observe that at all?
Very useful comparison, thanks.
I don't agree with your conclusion though. HLG does not have a better dynamic range. You won't see that much of a difference in overcast weather, like in your example, but on a bright sunny day, there's at least 2 stops difference between Slog and HLG.
I would avoid Slog3 on older Sony's, but on A7SIII it's perfect.
Then show me video of S-log 3 actually being better, i haven't seen it yet. Usually there's work around to make Hlg3 close (you would need 400% zooming noise to see difference). And also i wanna see the wysiwyg of both S-log3 and HLG3, i'm assuming first will be massively worse, every video i see the 1.66 stop overexposure just makes everything except model or dark part, 'white blown'.
Wherr can I find your slog3 and hlg3 luts?
commenting second time. this video is what the world needs to see. thank you so much for this detailed comparision
The color shift with 2 stops overexposed is quiet significant.
Maximum video output level for HLG3 is 100%, not 95%.
You've got smaller dynamic range for S-Log3 because you filmed in a normal dynamic range light environment - and you've loosed data. S-Log3 should be used only in high dynamic range scenes.
A low dynamic range profile "cuts" the light from the real world, and a high dynamic range profile "compresses" the light in a 8/10 bit format.
Thank you for this comparison, it was very useful! Maybe you will do part 2 in a sunny (less cloudy) day.
Thanks 'Play by Pause'. I googled S-log 3 vs HLG3 and came here. I really like your video, and wanted to know more about how S-log3 is tedious or not. I'm first and foremore a photographer, but i'm visiting some insane mountains that needs video to not regret it, so i'm speedcoarsing video. First the preference seemed HLG3 as it just fits the 8-bit vide of old camera's better, on 10-bit camera's people prefer S-log 3 again and some claim 'just overexpose 1.66 stops and done', but i hate that. I want Wysiwyg for video. S-log looks washed out (like skies will no longer look blue cause on purpose overexposing, i won't even know result when shooting that. I'm feeling HLG3 will be much better for that, even more so with the lower base ISO, and the -2/+2 stops that works correct (meaning if i aim for correct exposure i always should get best out of it. It may not be best in anything, but it's second/third best in almost anything, that's why it's so good, S-log3 is best (for HDR) but harder to use and no wysiwyg.
멋진 정보 많이배우고갑니다.
sir ji sony a7siii me film making ke liye best pfofile btane ki kripa kren..
Hii it’s amazing comparison…
Btw what is better between HLG1, 2 & 3?? Thankss
Personally we felt HLG3 has slightly more color and dynamic range when it compares to HLG1 and 2 but the down size with HLG3 is there’s more noise
I would personally still stick with HLG3 😬
nice comp. What was hlg3 mode? rec709 or rec 2020?
Rec2020✌🏻
我覺得影片做的很棒 很少人會這麼這樣做測試 辛苦你了也辛苦畫面的漂亮女生 期待接下來的視頻
谢谢你的支持！ 我们会越来越努力的💪🏻
You know, one of these days my head might explode trying to learn log shooting and grading hahaha
Haha there's a lot of alternative 😉
Hope you know learn something in this video.
HLG 3 + leeming lut in the day and S-cinetone + leeming lut in the night. HLG 3 introduces noise wich you can reduce using divinci's noise reduction.
I did similar tests and ended up using only HLG3. Under SLog3 face looks flat in most of the cases. There is no 3D woomph with SLog3 looking at the face. And with HLG3 you still can output HDR file.
Thanks, the more i look below the maximum theory (in wich S-log3 is best), the more i seem to prefer HLG3 (without actually having tried it yet).
@@Matti6950 Been using my A7SIII since 2020 and now I only shoot in HLG3. HLG3 has insane shadow recoverability, so you really expose for the highlights first. HLG3 seems to recognize 17 stops of dynamic range vs 15 in SLog3, it also has the luminance metadata from the sensor. Conversion LUT's don't seem to be the right way to do. Depending on the app, DaVinci Resolve seems to have insane color/luminance management over your footage, especially if you convert it first to DVR wide gamut then edit it in that extremely wide color gamut then tunnel it to Rec.709. HLG3 is so easy to edit with a very capable app like DaVinci Resolve Studio, which is top of food chain in color grading. Circular polarizers seem to extend your dynamic range as well as they reject harsh light especially outdoors, and gives an overall more pleasing image than a naked lens even at night and indoors. Could help with reflections on faces as well.
Большое спасибо за видео, примеры и время, которое ты потратил, чтобы донести свою точку зрения. Есть вопрос: я слышал мнение, что в каждом цветовом профиле sony A7siii есть два native ISO, в HLG первое 80, а второе 1600. Что нибудь об этом знаешь?
800 и 12800
What are the settings for HLG3 brother ?
How good is the low light performance on standard profile ?
i take better ISO AUTO HLG 3 or HLG very simple , but Slog 3 difficult Settings, Exposure and LUT Color Grading always does not work
:(
On a bright sunny day, you’ll instantly hate how the S-cinetone (BT709 SDR color space) handle the dynamic range.
On HLG side (which was originally being build by BBC and NHK as display refer color space for HDR content with max of around 10-11 stops of dynamic range to replace the CRT tube limitation) it will handle way enough luminance data with it’s absolute PQ value of 10,000 nits vs 100 nits max relative value of REC709.
I just don’t understand the hate on SLOG3 which was build to maximize the max dynamic range of the sensor and can handle color way beyond REC2020 color space, which part was the negative? On super bright day in Malaysia, believe me you’ll thank SLOG. Grading on DWG or ACES meaning you don’t need to tone map as you’re basically in the same huge scene refer domain.
Can you recommend good lut for HLG3 2020 to rec 709?
Hi! Unfortunately we use our custom LUT but we are going to release a video on how to color grade HLG. Remember to subscribe our channel before you miss it 😉
I can recommend the leeming LUT for a Rec709 transformation
Is your Slog3 ISO 250? Or is a mistake?
The native ISO In the A7SIII is 640 and 12800, and if you go lower than 640 you loose a lot of dynamic range and there is not point of using it
It’s not a mistake.
We tried to keep this test a neutral as possible since we are dealing with the other 2 color profile which can go lower ISO.
We do agree that slog3 didn’t perform that well below ISO640 and this test proven that it’s much logical to use slog3 if you’re require to use a higher iso☺️
Exactly what I thought seeing the 250 ISO for S-log 3.
Slog3 if exposed and graded correctly, has at least one stop better dynamic range than hlg3 and even more than cinetone.Also has more smooth transition between stops. That said if you don’t need all those stops of dynamic range hlg and cinetone are fine.
how can i your s-cine tone?
thank you! Slog Much better!
Hello sir best hlg3 setting
Can you share your Hlg3 settings please?
Its by default PP10 HLG3👍🏻
did you use auto white balance?
Manual white balance 😉
Does it make any difference when grading in RAW?
We don't see a huge different when u are doing simple grade but the prores raw definitely stands out when you are trying to have advanced color grading or color manipulate.
@@PlaybyPause Yes, but does shooting in S-Cinetone interfere in it?
I notice slog3 does not do well in low light unless the iso is cranked to12800. Any low iso with slog3 and your picture will have more noise than a kids daycare. It seems HLG3 is the real mvp but gets no real recognition when it should. More and more people are starting to realize SLOG3 is just too much work vs HLG3. At least, that’s what I am seeing at this point with the A7siii/FX3 users.
Yeah!! I do agree with your statement 😉
I wonder why did you use different shutter speeds, you used 1/125, 1/160, 1/250, 1/400, 1/640..., I thought you should double the fps or at least make it multiple of fps.
I had a hard time exposing SCinetone. The highlights didnt have much dynamic range.
Scinetone focuses more towards the skin tone so you might need to consider other profile if you are looking for my dynamic range 👍🏻😬
With HLG3 you are using BT2020?
what do you use with HLG3?
@@alonsogarrote8898 Rec2020. It gives you a much wider color gamut and color space, closer to SGamut3.Cine and other log formats. It's too easy to edit if you know how to convert and edit inside the transformation between Rec2020 to DaVinci Resolve Wide Gamut then finaly to Rec.709. All edits should be before Rec.709 to enjoy either Rec2100 color gamut or SGamut3 for SLog3.
Slog3 is very stretched and close to the noise floor, so any marginal error makes it pretty hard to recover. Haven't had any issues with HLG3 especially for weddings, Run & Gun, wildlife. Slog3 is wonderful if you know that you have full control over your lighting. You don't need to be afraid from the shadows, only expose for the highlights as HLG/HLG3 have a very strong shadow recoverability without destroying the image at around 2 stops at least.
HLG3 comes contrasty vs HLG and with stronger noise reduction to save you the headache. HLG has more noise. I think the embedded luminance out of the sensors metadata with HLG files help.
Give it a shot, it's way better than S-Cinetone and personally love how the image comes out but I tend to overexpose by at least 0.7+ up to 2.0 stops on the MM then you have full control over the luminance on post thanks to the HDR metadata. You can make it flat as hell with minimal contrast or push contrast as you like mostly without clipping. Set the zebras at 94 and if your exposure is slightly off you can easily correct it via false color filter in post.
SLOG3 最低ISO不是640嗎?
A7siii可以到ISO160，但是那个不是base ISO. A7siii 的base ISO640. 我们会建议用至少base ISO 或者 dual native ISO 👍🏻
Slog 3 all the way.
HLG technically should not have more dynamic range than Slog-3. If you are simply using the exposure meter on your camera to expose those shots (especially if you're intentionally overexposing twice it seems? 1.5 stops + 2 stops) then you are absolutely not exposing correctly.
That was my thought, he’s not exposing the shots based on the profile.
Gosh! Use an ND!
HLG3 for daytime & HLG2 for night...simple
As an ignorant about Sony cameras I liked the SLOG3 for overcast days as it boost shadow details and colors, makes the vegetation stand out
For the night shots my eyes prefer the S-Cinetone closely followed by the HLG3, as they bring more subject to background separation, and more local contrast in the ligth sources and contrary to what I would have believed the more neutral SLOG3 seems to have flattened the skin tones and even the light sources (especially when shot overexposed).
Amazing places to shoot... really enjoyed.
Why would you put so much time in showing ungraded slog and hlg footage which is totally meaningless since you HAVE to grade it before you can see the final result? What's the point of including UNGRADED slog in comparison shots, nobody ever watches slog without prior conversion!
Cause this (for me unless someone teaches me something new again) means HLG3 has better Wysiwyg nature then S-log 3.
@@Matti6950 Man both HLG3 and Slog are BY DEFINITION not wysiwyg formats - they are technical gimmicks to compress more dynamic range into a limited bit-space. You can only view them after applying a "de-compressing" conversion (LUT, etc). Watching them in "raw" form is like trying to figure out what the webpage will look like by reading the raw HTML code.
@@sunlit777 But HLG3 has to be overexposed a lot more. Also my camera (finally) have 10 bit video 4 2 2. Isn't that a fix to the 'limited bit space'? I also have a setting 'Gamma select' or something, it seems to show re 0709 or bt 2020 (very satured tbh), as in end product (making the whitish scenes more to the point (but not rdy yet). S-Cinetone is Wyziwyg? the default one on my camera (but now that i changed, i forgot wich one that is), definitely shows accurate video after reviewing on camera screen. Think it's S-cinetone.
Very pretty girl looks bored
You're messing up in two HUGE ways. First of all, this isn't a fair comparison because you're not shooting at native ISO's. Secondly, you're over/under exposing SLOG3 after you apply the LUT.... the correction goes before the LUT, or you end up ruining your footage and clipping your highlights (like you did). You're teaching absolutely incorrect information and I am astounded that this video has so many thumbs-ups.
Hi
To answer your first question, we did expose the test with a variety of ISO which involves their base or native ISO for each profile. It might not be the fairest comparison since all color profiles have their own strengths and weakness in different ISO(base or native) but we hope this video gives everyone a better idea of the pros and cons of each picture profile in different scenarios or settings.
In postproduction, we do agree with balance shots before applying any LUT/color grading and that's what we did. As some of the clipping highlights, it's part of the test and experiment since this video is about tests and real-world scenarios.
We hope the explanation helps☺️
Thanks
@@PlaybyPause I'm sorry dude, you're just wrong. If you're not open to learning the proper way of doing things, that doesn't affect me in the slightest. I just hope your viewers will be smart enough to look elsewhere for learning (if you're one of his viewers reading this, I suggest Gerald Undone for a proper teacher).
Gerald undone is definitely one of the great channel 👍🏻
wow, so did you got the time to do it right ???? if so please give us the link so we can see your point
@@seleemzid7881 sounds like you're happy with his content. enjoy!
Please speak english better
😉thanks for your advise
lol thats fked up
What other language do you speak?
While other people may be better at english, I understood it and fully appreciate his effort. Plus I came here to see HLG vs s-log comparison and like what he did and understood fine, so from my side, ty PbP