Failed 12W LED analysis and schematic
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- Опубліковано 4 жов 2024
- Opening a 12W Livarno Lux LED lamp that stopped working to see what failed in it. Reverse engineering the power supply schematic, how does it work, oscilloscope waveforms. Explaining an inverting buck-boost switching converter. Do NOT try to repeat what you see in this video!
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I absolutely love the way he touches the exposed LIVE circuitry without any safety concerns. That right there shows REAL electrical engineer👍👍👍
@agustinusreynaldi7101 ElectroBOOM is working with 110V mains so not exactly the same.. :)
I’ve heard about people getting shocked when touching single live wire even when they are NOT grounded. Why is that?
@@jasonvoorhees3282 It's because human body has very large capacitance to the environment which allows AC to flow through depending on humidity, resistance, frequency, voltage and so on and this is also called capacitive coupling.
@@ayemin9822 Very large capacitance= picofarads or nanofarads bruh.
2 videos during 3 days? Keep going! Do not eat. Never sleep. Just give us more videos.
Yes 🤤
As always, bloody good explanation. This is a really interesting piece. Surprisingly made for today's costcut times. It's sad that something with the potential to work for 20 years has to be thrown away after a year because of a stupidly made shell contact. Long live planet Earth!
Yeah, bayonet cap fittings are better in this regard. Of course the better edison screw fittings have the wire soldered to the side of the base, not "crimped" like this one. I guess with all that good circuitry, they had to find somewhere else to put the self-obsoleting feature.
3:55 i would consider that test "super dodgy ☠"
The schematic was "bloody complicated", but all made perfect sense when you explained it. Great video. It's a shame that so many products end up in premature recycling bin because of such a simple, preventable manufacturing fault.
Too many electronics with weak points in design, production, or QC.
@@dosgos It was a very nice circuit, well-made and easy to adapt to a screw-in or push-and-twist base. What let it down was relying on the connection between the wire and the metal threaded part, which is just pressing against it with no soldering. 7/10, could do better.
The results speak for themselves.
I always love the dodgy way you hold live components. I wish I was that brave 😅
"Safety is my number one priority" XD
safety third
Crazy Russian Hacker
This video was 100% Electroboom certified 🤣But with the bloody good explanation and information included
3:59 - I love the way You measure soldering connection 😂
Vďaka za toto video s vysvetlením činnosti LED svetla na sieťové napätie a škoda, že kvôli takej banálnej chybe sa to pokazilo, výrobca mal tie vývody rezistorov pekne zapájkovať na ten závit a na tú čapičku.
A good reminder that no matter how good your circuit is (and that lamp looks as though it should be quite nice, if the wire did not fall off the threaded part), a single bad connection is all it takes to stop it working altogether. In the UK, light bulbs have a push-and-twist base that looks a bit like the probe connector sticking out of an oscilloscope, with two locking pins that ride in J-shaped grooves in the lamp holder, two contacts on the bottom, one for live and one for neutral, and the outer metal does not form part of the circuit.
Consumers traditionally seem to have preferred light bulbs to be brighter rather than longer-lasting; and of course, you can only have one or the other, not both, unless you pay more for better-quality components and more LEDs so each one is dissipating less power. It only has to last just a little bit too long for you to think "Well, that was cr@p, I'm not buying that brand again". Over-stressing LEDs causes them to lose brightness as they age. So a new bulb will nearly always be brighter than the old one it replaced, because -- unless it was an early failure -- the old one will have been gradually getting dimmer all the time before it stopped working at all.
Of course, the whole idea of cheap, easily-replaceable light bulbs came about in the tungsten filament era, because even the best-made ones could only manage 2500 hours. Nowadays you can get LED light fittings that are meant to be installed permanently, or at least for a few years, and they probably are building new houses using these instead of fittings that take bulbs.
I am old enough to remember when the first LEDs became available to consumers, just dim little points of red light (green came a little later, and blue much later still; I remember paying a small fortune for one of the first blue LEDs) -- and cheaper audio equipment often featured a tungsten filament bulb with a rubber sleeve made to look like a fake LED!
Yeah, very safe testing. And I love the brand name of that electrolytic capacitor.
You the man!! You never even flinched when you shorted out the bulb and tripped your breaker. I suppose that is a daily event the way you operate. Keep up the great work! I love your content, and you are funny as hell!!
I was expecting what happened at 4:02 - bloody hell! ;)
that cat has really good insight
LEDs have a lifespan of around 50 years if used correctly. Unfortunately most modern manufactured items are overpowered for cheapness drastically reducing their life.
I am working on building my own LED lamps.
@@kyoudaiken It's the only way now.
@@kyoudaiken
Based and DIY worker pilled
Older Cree lights use the same grey silicone potting in their lamps. The circuitry is similar. I have gotten good life from my outdoor flood lights, but the cover over the LED's is not well sealed, and they die from water ingress. Great video, especially the mains shorting part! Thanks.
This is definitely the guy I would call and trust if I had an electrical issue 👍🏻
The more I learn about LEDs, the worse for the environment they seem. They do make for great videos and engineering tutorials.
Thanks for the hard work in making that schematic. Very interesting
That circuit was really strange. I'm glad he was up for the challenge.
Thanks DGW I don't understand much but just these schematics are a lot of work!! Thank you for these great videos!👋👋☺
I'm happy to have guessed the failure point by the looks of it. And I'm not happy with why it failed that easy, in the first place.
ElectroBoom moment 4:00
the crocodile clip shorted, not the full bridge rectifier
AXBOOM capacitor. Nice.
This would be a good name for a lithium battery.
LED-TA 125°C 😁
i love the way is explaining
Very cool design for a supply, with the big cap after the magnetics instead of before it like most do. Cool video :)
"And of course it's working..." *Shakes wire, BLITZ! ..darkness* . "...until you accidentally shorts the wires..." 😂👍Electro-Diode-gone-boom!
Excellent video as always!!! Thanks 😊 for making such great content!!!
Hi and thanks for sharing this information. You are king of drawing schematic.👍
Livarno brand is sold in Lidld supermarkets.
in my case the led chips are always the point of failure and most of time its one bad smd internally inside the 3 led package or just a loose phosphor layer due to heat expansions which can be made to work by applying light pressure and superglue to another year of use
Indeed was a SMPS video but I'm waiting for something like an LLC topology with Soft Switching, or a Full Bridge. Niceeeee!
HaHa,,, ThankYou for making my(our) day. Also very interesting video(s). Have nice week.
My experience with Lidl items (Livarno,Parkside, etc.) is that they are usually very well built as well as well designed. A lot of their items appear to be manufactured in the EU, but I guess some items are bound to be sourced from China, although it is unusual to see NXP components in a Chinese made item.
You explained it so beautiful. Thumbs up 👍👍👍👍
That excessive resin screams ECO all over the place. BTW. It was not the case for this one, but most failed LED lamps I've seen have black spot of death on some of the chips. They fail prematurely due to excess current/heat. Quicker than incandescent lamps even. But there is a way to make them last as long as they are supposed to last. What you need to do is to replace current setting resistor to something about twice the resistance. The lamp is going to be a little bit dimmer, but it's going to run MUCH cooler and last MUCH longer. Just buy a little bit brighter lamp than you need and mod it. I think BigClive shows how to do that in one of his videos.
We need an EU law that says that LED chips need to be ran at half their rated current and they are forced to put more LEDs in the lamps to satisfy brightness standards.
@@kyoudaiken
It's pointless to run LEDs at a lower voltage, when you then put in more of them to compensate. It is the same power dissipation in a confined case and that's what bakes the LEDs and other components (especially the electrolytic capacitors) to death.
@@superdau In fact, it's not the same power consumption. Look at the diode characteristic curve V/I.
@@kyoudaiken And you need to make sure manufacturers bother with it ..... Reputable brands do take care to run LEDs conservatively, but some fly-by-night merchant will just over-run the cheapest LEDs they can find, and hope the inevitable loss of brightness happens too slowly for you to notice. After all, a light bulb only has to last a little bit longer than your memory of buying it, lest you think "I'm not buying that brand again".
Sometimes it's worth paying a bit extra, especially for a light bulb in a hard-to-reach place such as over stairs.
@@kyoudaiken
The forward voltage change is too small to be of any relevance for this. The voltage drops 0.2V, maybe 0.3V, when going from typical 20mA to 10mA (of course I don't know what LEDs are used here, but the voltage change is typical when running a LED at half the nominal current). So less then 10% of a voltage, and thereby power dissipation change. That's in the order of "can be ignored".
Even resin can't stop you from reverse engineering of the circuits 😂
3:54 - 4:05 bloody hell ☠️
Shame that the poor contact resulted in the end of the lightbulbs' useful lifespan. Good to see how this bulb was made (I don't like all of that resin!) and hopefully any other bulbs from LIDL do not fail in the same way.
Also, only 5 large multi-chip LEDs for 12W? That seems like not a lot, those LEDs are going to be roasted...
The bulb only worked for a Lidl while
Thanks
I had a few failing that way. Engineered to fail
All of those components required to run a light source. 🙀
nice again as usual! why would it be wrong to that frequency would get back to the mains? I don't understand it, sorry! please explain!
Struth you get a lot of components for such a cheap LED. Looks like it was a dimmable design. Indifferent metal corrosion even happens faster in tropical regions.
Can you make a video in Czech language please, because I am curious about your normal language use 👨🔬
Videos in Czech are on my other channel ;)
I believe you fully about the longevity of fluorescent fixtures, but we have to remember the bathtub curve and think about it scientifically: If something lasted for 2 years, does that mean it's probably likely to last 10? How many fluorescent bulbs die early? Maybe the ones that are still working are just lucky ones. If I remember correctly the most wear on fluorescent lamps comes when you turn them on, so they're best for situations where lights are left on continuously, while LEDs are probably better for intermittent use if designed correctly.
Personally I prefer LEDs just for the better CRI but I still have some compact fluorescents installed. I did convert all of the long fluorescent tubes to LED just because they were failing anyway and the old-style magnetic ballast is not very efficient. I put probably about 10 or 20 LED lamps like this in our house and in a few years I've had 2 or 3 of them fail. Probably manufacturing defects that affect a minority of units.
+1 on the annoyance of multimeters shutting off automatically. Auto-off can sometimes be bypassed by holding down Function while turning on the meter (try it), but the auto-off feature should not exist on test equipment in the first place. I hate anything that turns itself off after only a few seconds or minutes and it's ridiculous to claim that it's an energy-saving feature when the manufacturer/seller included heavy-duty (zinc-chloride/zinc-carbon) in the box.
They now ship thousands of tons of useless zinc batteries across the oceans, but then claim that the annoying auto-off is saving resources? Bullcrap. Some multimeters will turn off the backlight after only 8 seconds and whoever designed that should be jailed. I've long wanted to make a youtube video showing how to disable the auto-off feature on multimeter backlights/flashlights by adding a latch mod or even a separate switch if that's easier, but every meter is different and I don't have a suitable place to record video anyway.
Danyk could show an example of such a mod, but he may not be interested and I suspect that the views would be poor while the questions in the comments would be numerous; a high question/viewer ratio ;). Thousands of meter designs exist and many people would want custom instructions for their own device.
Personally I appreciate the auto-off because I always forget to turn my meter off and it saves me from having to replace the battery constantly. If I'm going to do something that requires having the meter on for hours at a time, I would probably prefer to use a benchtop multimeter rather than a handheld one.
You have clearly never used a DMM without auto-off features. They drain batteries like nothing if you forget to turn it off, and then you have a pair of flat AAAs (in best case scenario as they are sold everywhere) or 9V battery (in worst case).
Why would that wire connection burn while passing low power? You can take off the screw terminal with an adjustable wrench, and might still be able to push it back on. It sucks that they don't make LED units openable.
Lead free solder Yippie yeah😝
It looks a well made lamp except for the crimping of the screw cap to the capacitor wire.
Hello, I actually came from your website in search of an email to ask you a question about an elecktronika 4. I live in the land of 110v . Do u think it is possible to switch out the internal 220v transformer with one that will work with 110-120v? Sorry to bug you with a stupid question. Love all the info you provided. Thanks so much 😊🙂🙂🙂
*Nice 😂 **03:58*
Cool jewel
3:59 elctrobooming intensifies... :))
Its a well built bulb
Is this a very constant fault? As it heats up, the plastic melts and the wire stops making contact.
Another cause is usually the poor quality of the LEDs.
I recently bought some EDM brand lamps, they all broke down after 3 days or a week... I gave up on this brand.
greetings from Portugal
Osram 8€ bulbs lasted 6months before dying. Literally worse than classic incandescent bulbs.
Для надёжности и долгой работы лампы отпаять один из параллельного подключённого резистора на 1,8 ома.
Ток через светодиоды уменьшиться, нагрев лампы станет гораздо меньше, яркость лампы упадёт незначительно.
Diode gone mehd(i) 😂
Can pls.do humidifier with high and low switch function.
❤❤❤
We can't expect LIDL to be selling high quality LEDs. Maybe they surprise us from time-to-time, but not here.
as an electrician 3:45 was painful to watch :D i suppose you use a transformer?
no. that was mains, but he's isolated from the ground
Just mains & ungrounded, personally I wouldn't dare 😅
Nice teardown, did you used wood or plastic chear to isolate your self, what is the best case working isolated from earth or not isolated in order to be protected by Rccb breaker.
Do you usually sit on a metal chear? Must be bloody cold.
@@j7ndominica051 they are some chears with metal frame , he must see where he put his feet if they are on the floor he will be electrified :-)
4:00 Ft with Electroboom
Słaby kontakt ponieważ się nagrzewał metal. Ta zalewa powodowała zwiększenie się przestrzeni i pogorszenie styku. Błąd konstrukcyjny. Pozdrawiam.
look burn marks on his sockets lol plenty short circurts
get the hammer... this is definitely will not be reversible 😂😂😂
dude casually hitting live wire ☠️ bruh
These lamps are designed to fail.
now repair the damage done by you cause its an awesome system
Why does they use too much resin 😂
It's make any sense😂
Probably to make it water resistant
@@FaysalKhalashi but in some points is still not water resistant 💀
I guess so they don't have to use some wrap around the pcb to prevent it to short in the base & make it more durable to handle transport
Add some salt 🥴
I bet ElectroBOOM made that capacitor. Hahahahaha
it's so utterly infuriating that we're mining all this irreplaceable shit out of the earth, investing a ton of energy into manufacturing these devices in the hopes that they'll reduce our overall energy usage, and then throwing them away because they couldn't be bothered to figure out an adequate means of attaching a wire to a piece of metal. like you have a whole supply chain with all sorts of fancy chemistry and advanced photolithography and precision machining, and then right at the end it's "just kinda touch the wire up against the thing and hope it stays there".
BRAZIL
This is awfully complicated! I had the same problem with German Aldi with Müller-Licht: The first I bought was over 8 €. I returned it after a year and the offered me a swap to a new light. I declined and got my full money back. With this money I bought from the same Aldi the same lamp for 5 € and made 3 € win. And so on. In the end I bought a lamp for 2.50 € and this is running for years now. It seems to be kind of a rental scheme with the winner on my side. Hint: ALWAYS keep the bill and the packaging and insist of the promised 50,000 hours lifetime, which are 5.7 years/24 hours daily running.
Very overly complicated. So much money spent on engineering to make it as complex as possible for nobody to be able to understand nor repair it, then even potting it. We need EU regulations against potting and rules that make it easier to take apart appliances. I think at this point we can be glad that we even are still able to buy LED lights wit Edison or Bayonet lamps... Here in Germany it is increasingly difficult to get fixtures with them. You are supposed to buy a lamp with integrated LEDs and bore new holes each time it dies...
That is terrible for the environment.
@@dosgos Yes. I am so mad, that I just started to plan to make my own LED lamps where I can easily maintain it.
It's not overcomplicated and it's designed this way to make it dimmable. That it's difficult for you to understand doesn't mean "it's made complex to prevent repairing"...
@@jb5631 There are way simpler circuit designs that make the LED bulbs dimmable, too.
@@kyoudaiken There are a lot of ways to achieve dimming compatibility & the one described in the video is quite common. That doesn't mean it's engineered like this "to make it difficult to repair" & "nobody be able to understand it".
Lol you ALWAYS have reference to ground by parasitic capacitance. Please, never touch any live wires coming from the grid.
Human body capacitance is about 120pF, so the capacitive current at 230V 50Hz is 8.7uA, not dangerous, as long as there's no direct ground connection.
These 25 year lifespan LED light bulbs often fail after 25 minutes! 👎🤣
this not a good video. you cannot play with mains voltage like that, and apologizing doesn't help
"Cannot" well you saw him do it 🤣
@@jb5631 I mean a rational person cannot do that. Stupid people can do everything
@@inseries5494 I'm sure he planned it well for the video & it should be fine since he is ungrounded but personally I would still feel way too uncomfortable & not dare to do it 😅
You have absolutely no right to tell someone how to live. Touching the live wire is not illegal if you do not pose a risk to anyone else than yourself. I play with 7 kV 50 mA neon sign transformer almost daily, dont complain about exposed mains bruh.