Simple CNC Probing Ideas
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- Опубліковано 5 січ 2018
- My X-Carve CNC came with a Z probe but I wanted to explore other possibilities that would allow accurate homing in the X and Y directions as well. I look forward to other ideas.
Discover more from Inventables:
X-Carve: www.inventables.com/technolog...
Easel: www.inventables.com/technolog... - Навчання та стиль
Great explanation, thank you very much for sharing!
Glad it was helpful!
Great video! You've managed to explain a very complicated procedure in the most brilliant and easy way! Thanks for sharing your knowledge and improvements with us!
You're very welcome!
One of THE cleverest ideas and implementation I have EVER seen. But then having listened and watched our Peter Parfitt from the beginning; I am not the least bit surprised.
Keep it up Peter. You are truly a treasure in the world of "DIY videos"! VERY few are as unique as you dear person. "Simply Brilliant!"
Thanks for all the time you devote to helping others,
pat
Hi Pat, What can I say but thank you. Peter
I've just been starting up this hobby this explained out in a very easy way to understand how to not only make a z-probe but how to use code and a macro to do it. Thank you ♥
Hi Kodaijin, Many thanks for that feedback. Cheers. Peter
Absolutely brilliant and so simple. Well done and thanks so much for sharing.
Hi Andy, Many thanks. Peter
That right angle probe was BRILLIANT.
This is by far the best video on explaining probing and g code I have seen on the web. Well explained and spoken eloquently. Thank you for sharing your knowledge with us. 👍👍👍
Cheers. Peter
Thanks very much, for the most simple solution for setting up x,y,z and for a tool change all in one simple fixture on the spoil board, As I intend to use the spoil board surface as a reference, I have to put in the material thickness in the programming anyway, so I don't have to change the G code ever again NICE !! And I don't have to buy a bit setter So that save me money as well great Kind regards Hans
Hi Hans, Thank you so much. Cheers. Peter
Thanks for a lucid explanation.
Thank you so much for this video! This will save me so much time in setup! Very well done!!!
Hi Carl, Cheers. Peter
Perfectly explained, Peter! Thank you.
Hi Tim, Many thanks. Cheers. Peter
Thank you. Clear and easy to do. Very nicely put over.
Glad you liked it
Best CNC probe video!!! Thanks Peter!
Hi Antonio, Thank you so much. Cheers. Peter
Highly informative. Really given me something to think about so thank you for that.
Hi Wamiq, Cheers. Peter
Great stuff!! At first you demonstrated just the puck for Z, I watched you add the corner piece and wondered why you were taking a Z separately. I only had to watch a few more seconds. Nice work! Thanks for sharing your knowledge.
Glad it was helpful!
Hey Peter, I don’t even have a CNC machine but enjoyed watching the way you solved the starting location issue. I bet you aced Algebra. Have a Great Day!
I really like your probe fixture. It is very inventive!
Hi Jim, It works really well but with a simple CNC, used only from time to time, it is sometimes easier to just do the odd job by adjusting by eye. Cheers. Peter
Brilliant!!!! I was thinking about how to make XYZ probe the easiest way.. yours is the one!
Hi Oskar, Many thanks. Peter
Another cracking video - thanks Peter!
Hi Jonty, Many thanks. Peter
Mario at Santiago de Chile_Southamerica. Excellent !!!, and simple solution. I already did it, and is working perfectly. Many thanks for sharing it.
Thanks for sharing
Thank you for explaining it so nicely, especially the z-probe g-code walkthrough :) I usually use the built in feature in bCNC, but now I can incorporate that bit of g-code into my job files (once I have actually finished building my probe.. XD)
Glad it was helpful!
An elegant. Solution, as is your presentation. Enjoyed the video.
Hi Michael, many thanks. Cheers. Peter
Excellent video, well done and precise.
thank's
Hi Jack, Many thanks. Peter
Very helpful knowledge. Just what I was looking for today. Thank you
Glad it was helpful!
thank you, great video, excellent tips !
cheers from belgium
Hi Pierre, Thank you. Peter
Plus a CNC class With master Peter just perfect .thank you master for helping us, Very Very good .
Hello Peter
I didn't know it's the same language gcode as 3D printer.
Thanks a lot for your perfect video and drawings which validate the method.
Have a nice new year.
Hi Philippe, Many thanks. Peter
thank you master for helping us, Very Very good .
Thanks you very much, nicely explained. I understood everything thanks to all the walkthrough process.
Hi Kevin, It is really a simple subject but so easy to get wrong. Cheers. Peter
Good video shall try it on my homemade CNC as I have similar Z probe 😁👍
Good info. Thanks Peter
great video as always.
Hi Stephen, Many thanks. Peter
Thank You for this excellent explanation. cheers!! Happy Probing
You are welcome!
very thorough. Great job
Hi Jim, Many thanks. Peter
thank you master for helping us, Very Very good！
Great Ideas! Thanks for showing this! Regards Fritz
Thanks for watching!
Brilliant video.......masterclass indeed!
Many thanks! Peter
Morning Peter. Great vid, thanks. For a different take on your spoil board see the Marius Hornberger vid. This even allows you to use the MFT kit pieces in place of your brass pins. There is also a work coordinate setup using the g54, 55, 56 etc for remembering your work place home position so once set you only have to do the z axis. Keep up the good work
Thanks for the info! Cheers. Peter
Thanks Peter, good info buddy
1st brilliant ! Cheers. Peter
Absolute great video. Really well explained with perfect build up of information you need to understand to get to the heart of the matter..thanks a lot Peter!
Hi Luc, many thanks for the feedback. Cheers. Peter
Hello Peter, got around to make a touch-plate last weekend and try out the macro for Z-probing.
Turned out it touches, then goes up 10 mm (all correct), but then Z is set to zero, which should not be the case. (my touch plate is 10mm)
Looking at the code, is the G92 command correct? Because it looks like the direction of the Z is Negative for going up and positive for going down. So touching the plate and then G92 Z-15 would set the 'Z 0' at Z-30 (because your touch plate is 15mm, and now adding another 15mm..
It worked perfect for me after I made G92 positive..
Perfect solution
Many thanks. Peter
Brilliant! Thank you!
Many thanks Steve. Peter
es uno de los mejores videos que he visto.Magnifico trabajo
Hi Jose, You are very kind - thank you. Peter
@@NewBritWorkshop Hay un refrán en español que dice "Es de malnacido,no ser agradecido"Thank you for your job
Muchas gracias Peter
excellent video.
Hi John, Cheers. Peter
Hi, Many thanks for a truely expert explantion. I have a request, if possible. Could you please publish, in a downloadable form, the code for each step with the wonderful diagrams regarding position etc.
Brilliant!
Hi Andrew, Many thanks. Peter
This is almost exactly what I have done with my machine. Instead of the removable pins a fixed a piece of 12mm ply to the bed and had it cut a square corner. Then set that corner as G28. I set the z probe (a scrap of 3mm all plate) flush to the bed. That is G30. So my work flow is as follows. Power up, home machine, G30, change tool bit and probe Z, g28, set X0 Y0 and then go to work. I set my wcs origin in fusion as bottom left as you do but with the Z on the bottom of the stock. As I re-zero the Z axis each tool change instead of using tool offsets this doesn’t cause any problems. One other difference you may want to look into is whether the aluminium housing of your dewalt router has a conductive path to the collet. My D.C. spindle does which means I was able to make a permanent ground connection to the spindle and dispense with the clip. Sorry for the long post, hopefully you may be able to use one of my ideas this time round!
Hi Jamie, I have already checked the Dewalt and there is no conductive path. I like your approach. Cheers. Peter
thanks sir
Appreciate this was about three years ago, but are you as surprised as I am that homing to the corner of the stock adjusts the Z height down to the stock before the X and Y zeros? Great video, by the way!
The order can be changed very easily. Cheers. Peter
Thank you. "Aula Magna"
I like ther angle in the corner idea. btw you can edit the description to correct the glaring spelling error in X-Carve
Hi David, Many thanks for the advice on smelling !! Cheers. Peter
thank you so much sir
Most welcome
Wow, thanks
You are most welcome
"My X-Crave CNC came with a Z probe"
You must have really wanted that CNC machine
Yes I did Helibob,I see your into helicopters I have a Esky King don't fly it much.Into CNC now 😁
Hey Peter, I'm watching for the second time (it's that valuable!). I've purchased some 1/8" and some 1/4" brass rod (we don't use metric in Canada), and had already made a secondary wasteboard template off the original before I started X-Carve assembly. At about 2:12, you say after you were satisfied with your machine alignment, you used the X-Carve to drill the pin mounting holes, which makes total sense. My question is, before you start your machine, do you perform any kind of alignment check and/or process to ensure that the gantry has not been moved from your original alignment setup upon which the pin positions are based? I still have an alignment issue with the gantry not being square to the Y-Axes when the machine is not turned on, and my research through the Inventables forum indicates this is a fairly common problem. The consensus solution seems to be to use some sort of stop(s) to square the gantry before the machine is turned on. I'm not looking for commercial CNC accuracy, but I do wish to achieve a level of accuracy that is equal or better that I can do with my other woodworking tools.
As always, I appreciate the time you take to make and post your videos, but equally, the time you take to respond to viewer comments and concerns!!!
Hi Bob, Forgive me for not watching all my videos again.... Squaring things up with the machine turned off is really important as it means that every time you start up again the following day the machine will start from square (and should stay that way). One thing that I know I did not mention in my videos is the need to trim a tiny bit (I think about 2 mm) off the front and rear of the waste board where it contacts the supports for the Y rails. The reason for this is that the metal extrusion that is under the waste board going front to back is 2 mm too short - I have informed Inventables about this and they have acknowledged the point. Because of this the waste board is too big (in the Y direction)and it means that the metal work of the machine cannot be tightened up tight as the waste board is in the way. Next, check the whole assembly for square and if it is out loosen off the appropriate screws (it is in a video I am sure), align it square and tighten up again. Once everything is tight you can adjust the waste board to square it to the machine as it now will have clearance near those supports for the Y rails. To do this loosen all the waste board screws, put a pointed bit in the router and under Easel or UGCS control move the router around and adjust the waste board to the pointed tool. After this it should not matter if the machine is just a tiny bit out of square - as you say, it is not an industrial CNC. Peter
Hey Peter, I'm thinking on buying an X-Carve and I always enjoy watching your video. But before making my move I'm looking for an honest opinion about the Shapeoko cnc. Can you tell me something about this machine? Thanks
Hi Marc, I am sorry but I know nothing about the machine that you can call reliable. I understand that it is a small machine and it may be more solid than the X-Carve but I could be completely wrong. Peter
Hey New Brit... for the last micro you showed with the waste board clip... why not have the macro come down and touch of the plate... then lift say 1 inch... go to the work offset.. then do the z probe macro to set the z height. I don't know if UGS lets you use a M0 code (grbl supports it but I don't know if you can restart?? ) then you could put the two macros together and just drop the M0 after the move to Work offset then place your probe.. and cycle start to do the z probe.
Hi John, Yet another sensible suggestion, many thanks. This video is doing exactly what I had hoped and is generating a lot of thoughtful and practical ideas. Cheers. Peter
Hello Dear Peter. I always look your amazing videos, especialy with x-carve. That video was realy helpful for me. But still do not understood which comand to use after zeroing z,x and y to send the machine to starting point? Anyway after zeroing is done the bit stays in some offset for all three axis... is it G28?
Hi Tomas, I use G92 followed by the axis that I want to zero. If it is all 3 then the command is G92 X0 Y0 Z0 peter
Thanks alot Peter
Thank you for this explanation of probing. It was very helpful. I am confused by one thing. At the end when you are at your machine Home (assuming that is X0, Y0) and you are probing z0. You send a G92 X -28 Y-30.3. Since you are at 0 now and want to reset workpiece home, wouldn't you want to ADD those numbers to the existing position. I follow why you subtract earlier for bit radius and depth of brass cylinder but I am confused on the last part.
Hi Michael, It was a long time ago and I think that you may be right. Many thanks for this. Peter
You are correct. Great video, but there is a bug in the text for the single z probe operation. At the touch Z the probe is at the top of the work PLUS the metal plate thickness. In other words, the tip is hat thickness ABOVE the work. So you set that fact by telling it that Z height. Notice that the other probe Goode for XYX has it as a positive, not a negative.
I watched the video which I thought was fantastic. I then built the flat bar version shown in the latter part of the video. I followed the video precisely including your g-code on my x-care 1000mm machine. when I run the code the z axis will go down and touch the plate and retract and the x and y axis never move. And I am using UGS.
Not sure what I can do to help. Try doing a Google search for this specific to your CNC machine. Peter
@@NewBritWorkshop It's just the bigger version of your machine in the video. It's a X-Carve 1000. That's why I couldn't understand why it wasn't working. And I have made carvings with the machine in the past and I have no problem jogging it with all 3 axis. ???
Hi Peter,
another really good X-Carve video. I'm only on Carve #5 after assembling my Christmas present to myself here in Herefordshire; but already I can see homing, especially for multi -tool jobs, is a difficult technique.
I've not left Easel yet so I will return to this video once I'm up to speed with UGS.
One thought I had was if doing 99% of jobs from the same start point could moving the X and Y homing switch contact bolts to align with the workpiece corner work? Then you can issue a home each time then just prob Z?
Have you found with all your testing that the homing switches are v accurate?
Keep up the good work and thanks for taking the time to create these.
Another Pete
Hi Pete, Congratulations on your new toy ! Yes, I had thought of moving the homing switches a dash but I think my current mind-set is that they are a safety mechanism and should be just beyond where I normally work - this could be total nonsense. I have yet to test the accuracy of the homing position but have not seen any variation in the few goes that I have had so far. Cheers. Peter
Perfect! Not sure why there are 11 dislikes. Those people probably eat kittens. Thanks for the video.
I love it - many thanks. Peter
Hi Peter,
Not sure if this question has been asked, but where can I get the brass Z probe (puck) that you modified?
Excellent video and good material.
Hi Vance, It was part of the X Carve Z Probe kit. You could make your own using the X carve to get the two faces flat. Peter
Nice work I must be missing something i entered you command lines the machine moves perfectly the macros do what they are supposed however I can not get it to home like you did at 14 minutes in the video
Hi Richard, There is a command (which I cannot remember) but if you use the Universal GCode Sender program there are macros built in and you just press the relevant button. Peter
Hey Peter, AWESOME video on a subject I'm just delving into. I still have an alignment issue to resolve on my X-Carve, but after that I should be able to replicate the processes you demonstrate. Just wondering...did the scale on your Z-axis carriage come from Inventables, or is that a "Peter" modification??? Thanks for the X-Carve video series...I don't think Inventables could have hoped for better advertising.
Hi Bob, I think that the scale you refer to is part of the dust boot kit from Inventables. It is so each side of the height adjustment can be matched. Peter
Peter, I don't have a CNC but thought I'd watch anyway. Perhaps I'm some sort of sick CNC voyeur. Anyway, how does the macro get called in the V-carve (is it v-carve?) software? For example do you have to say: "Exec/Run/Call yourmacroname" as a command? If so, is it not possible to determine a variable for the depth of your wood and pass this to the macro so that you do not have to edit the file each time? For example: call zHomeMacro(20) would call your macro with a workpiece depth of 20. As X and Y are already determined in your setup, you could simply have your macro/function permanently saved in a file in all your projects and then call it with a couple of lines of code (one to declare your variable, one to call the macro) each time you return to home. Obviously, I have no experience of this software, but I do of programming in general, and I'd be surprised if there wasn't a possibility to declare variables.
Hi Rico, The "macros" that I am describing are used as ordinary files which get sent by UGCS (not V-Carve) to the CNC. There is a macro facility in UGCS but I have not used it. As far as I know there is no way to pass a parameter to UGCS macros but I would love an expert to confirm this. I used to write a lot of software but my programming suite (Delphi 2005) does not work with Windows 10. Were I able to get Delphi working then I would write a simple interface which would handle macros and allow parameters to be set. Peter
Hi Peter. Copying your gcode file (made in notepad and saved as a .gcode file) for z only probing I get an error loading the file 'invalid gcode in handleGCode: 38.2'Do you know what am I missing or doing wrong please
Hi Phil, I am afraid that I do not know what might be causing this other than advising that you look carefully at your file and see if any extra characters (maybe no printing ones) are present. Peter
Brilliant video. You explain things so clearly! Are you, or were you ever a teacher?
Hi Michael, I was a military instructor at several points in my career. Cheers. Peter
@@NewBritWorkshop That explains a lot - thanks for such a clear explanation of everything!
Having had a CNC for many years, which machine would you recommend for a new starter (me). Thx
I only really have experience of the X-Carve from Inventables. I have had the current one for at least 5 years and it works perfectly. Peter
Just a warning to anyone using G91 like this, if there is a G90 in any code you use it is likely it will upset all the X, Y and Z zeros you have set up. This could be the cause of the "unexpected" driving of the tool into the workpiece or the driving of X, Y and Z to somewhere other than the expected position. You need to thoroughly understand what G90, G91 and G92 do to use them safely.
Is there a reason not to use the probing macros built into UGS? Loading in your own files does not seem to gain anything over what UGS already provides unless I’m missing something. BTW, the X-Carve series that you’re filming is currently my favourite set of videos, so watching and learning.
Hi Kieran, Please tell me more about these macros. What version of UGCS has these? Peter
New Brit Workshop UGS Version 2 certainly has probing as I used it today with the inventables Z probe kit. It also has X and Y probing. I was going to get hold of some aluminium plate and try milling that to the right shape, but quite like your version made with some brass angle and the inventables Z probe puck.
New Brit Workshop see this video from Mr. Winder who wrote UGS. ua-cam.com/video/kpz-6x_synE/v-deo.html
Hi Kieran, But that is not what I have for UGCS - where do I get this version? Peter
New Brit Workshop Go to the following downloads web page: winder.github.io/ugs_website/download/ Then scroll down to the bottom of the page where you can find the ‘somewhat stable nightly builds’. That’s the version you want :-)
Does the xcarve use grbl?
If so will this work on say a 3018 cnc?
Yes, I think so. Peter
very good,but how if we use mach3?
Hi Farid, I am not familiar with Mach3 but assume that it has a probing function. Try a Google search. Peter
On your second Gcode in notepad isn’t the G92 z15 supposed to be -15 as shown i your first gcode thanks
Hi Muser, It could be - It is always best to set these things up, test them and then make sure that they are right. Cheers . Peter
Just a couple of comments... I think the Z move should always be the last move when doing a fast move to the home position. You don't want the tool sliding across the material while at Z=0.
I noticed that XYZ homing to the limit switches seemed to place the tool at a "safe" location. And you seemed willing to assume the location of XY zero based on the location of the brass pins. It seems like a permanently wired probe device (brass plate) could clip to the gantry. You should be able to pre-wire spindle ground. So you just hard home the machine at power-up, then unclip the Z plate and probe Z any time you have a tool or material change. Then clip it back on the gantry.
Hi Mark, Many thanks for this. Peter
@@NewBritWorkshop You have an awesome channel Peter. I just got my Super Dogs.
Hi Mark, You are very kind. Cheers. Peter
Thanks for the ideas. I have only one observation tough. Your machine is moving Z down first then X and Y when going to cero work position which is dangerous. It should go X and Y first then Z.
Many thanks for that. Cheers. Peter
I have a slightly different technique which is useful when you're doing a carve which completely removes the top surface of the stock. Like you I have a "bump stop" (you used brass pins, I have two strips of luan double sided taped into place). When I use Fusion 360 to model something I'll add a 25mm cube as a spacer in front of my 19mm high model and in the Fusion setup I use the top front corner of that cube as the home point of the carve - note that the cube has to be taller than your real stock. Once I do that I can hide that cube and it doesn't interfere with anything. I set the stock thickness in Fusion to be the actual thickness of the stock.
So then when I'm ready to carve I put the stock in the corner formed by the luan strips and I know that corner is at X,Y=100,100. I hope the machine, move the head to 75,100 and then use paper as a feeler gauge to move Z precisely down to the waste board, then just tell the machine to move Z+25mm and set that position in the air as my home for the carve. So even if my roughing operation mills material off the top surface of the stock I can still get back to that same home position. You may ask why you can't just set Z home to be at the bottom of the stock instead of the top - well I like to use Easel as my gcode sender and after the carve is complete it'll home the head - unfortunately that means it'll crash the bit into the completed carve if home is at the bottom of the stock (guess how I know).
Hi Steve, You need to make a video of this - not the crash with Easel though. Cheers. Peter
How did the 3rd line of your G-code not say -15 when the other G-code did ? :P
Hi Aaron, Good point - I will have to check this when I can next get at the CC. Cheers. Peter
any one have a idea how can i zero my machine position on center of the circle ???
Hi Aman, If you know the diameter of your circle it will be easy as long as you are happy to do a little geometry. Peter
Hey Peter - have you tried the Triquetra plate (triquetra-cnc.com)? I purchased one quite some time ago but I've never had a chance to break it out (mainly because my old shapeoko requires additional wiring for the z-probe).
-Tom
Hi Tom, No, never heard of it. Thanks anyway. Peter
I like your processes but get lost when trying to covert to inches. lol
It appears that you may have over thought things a bit. If you know in advance the x/y coordinates of 'home' for your work piece (which you need to for your last home-brew option to work), why not simply use the z-probe to measure the height of your work piece and then send the 'home' command? That is, through the use of your pins, you've already defined x and y (unless the x-carve has gotten out of alignment). The only value the software needs is the z-height. Perhaps I'm missing something?
Having said that, I think your refinements to the z-probe are genius. That will make setups much quicker and more accurate. However, I don't think that a tool change will require you to re-run the 'full' version of your setup routine. Again, X and Y should not have changed (the center of the bit is still the same). You just need to reset the z-height.
True. Peter
👏👏👏👏👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻🇺🇾🇺🇾🙂
if you set zero from the bottom in your slicer you would never need to ajust thicknes. great video tho
Thanks Paul.
Sorry to say but I find your solution very devious . . . Please give my solution a try and let me know what you think of it . . .
1 take a micro switch and drill a ~3mm hole in the back of the switch . . .
2 glue with 2comp epoxy the shaft of a broken cutter or dril in this hole . . .
3 solder two wires to C and NO of the switch and connect them with your Probe Terminal.
With this 50 cents tool you can Auto Level non conducting material. It will give you a precision/resolution better than 20 microns and works top when you want to engrave.
All letters and symbols will have exactly the same depth !
Hi Tom, Could you make a short UA-cam video of this please - it sounds really interesting. Peter
@@NewBritWorkshop I have an Image of the Probe and a 1 minute 94MB video (doing AutoLevel), please tell me how I can load these up in this answer !
Hi Tom, I get the idea and I am sure other will understand as well. As far as I know there is no way to include a picture in a UA-cam comment. Peter
@@NewBritWorkshop Hallo Peter, try this link . . . ua-cam.com/video/wOIXE9RCuBY/v-deo.html met vriendelijke groet, Tom
Hi Tom, Excellent for the Z axis but how do you then get the cutter installed at the exact same height? Peter
Brilliant idea, thanks for sharing!
I wonder if you would be interested in examining this: ua-cam.com/video/QN8yPjy6uTk/v-deo.html.
The young man is using a z probe to, essentially, topography the board surface before carving in order to conform to an irregular surface. His explanation was a little hard to grasp entirely, and if you are intereseted I would love to see you demonstrate it in your efficient thorough manner. Regardless of your response to this, I must say that your videos are the absolute best I have seen on CNC machining, I hope you keep making them and sharing your knowledge. Thank you.
That is very interesting. I believe what the special software does is to take the "map" created by the probing run and then as the gcode file is executed it makes an adjustment for the Z value. Nice idea and one that is only a short step away from full 3D carving. Thanks for sharing. Peter