From what I understand, the turbochargers get worn out over time, and the bearings are typically the first piece to give in. At notch 5 or past notch 5, the turbo can no longer supply the amount of air required, because it can’t spin at a fast enough rate. The fuel delivery remains the same however, causing an overly rich air fuel mixture. All the fuel is ignited then forced out of the exhaust, creating a large flame.
I should also imagine that by the point the oil seals would be shot, which may release engine oil into the exhaust. This could then build up in there until it catches fire by other means or the means described above
Diesels don't react quite like that regarding rich fueling, You are partially correct tho regarding wear but it's not the turbos as such. old turbos explode if they have excess bearing wear and if they are blowing less the engine won't actually run hotter. That's from exhaust manifold leakage or exhaust flexi, slip joint wear etc allowing the extremely hot exhaust gas to cook the inside of the compartment, burn all the insulation and then the paint. Diesels are just air amd fuel, a reduction in ether results in power loss as fueling is proportiomal to airflow. low boost will make black smoke or thick white smoke depending on fuel rate with reduction in boost. massive Heat is generated at high power settings with exhaust gas temps around 500ºc to 550ºc and at 35psi + boost pressure that gives you a hot as fuck hairdryer in a closet comparison.
Great job! Just saw one of those "toasted' GEs in a train video, and you nailed the look. It's apparently so common that the narrator of the video didn't even bother to mention it.
GE units have been called Toasters or Popcorn Poppers by traincrews, since the 70's. The U18B's of the Maine Central were known to going into afterburner from time to time.
As a modeler of balsa wood airplanes, plastic models of cars, ships and planes and I am also an extensive model railroader... I have always laughed at "artist" of canvas painting and paper drawings... Because I have always said, I'm an artist too, except my canvas is not 2 dimensional, instead its 3 dimensional and I use all the same painting techniques brushes, and artist pastels and weathering powders as an "artist" would. You sir have nailed my argument with this video.. Your work is fantastic and realistic, and in 3 dimensional! Awesome job and thanks for sharing!!!
They catch fire there because the turbo is right there and when the turbo goes out it catches fire. The fire comes from the motor oil that is cycled through the turbo to cool it. The oil gets on the hot outside of the turbo and catches fire which spreads because the running turbo even though broken is still turning throwing oil everywhere spreading the fire. What you've done is a really good representation of the real thing. 👍
Only if you're modelling a railway where, for some reason, locomotives are allowed to routinely catch on fire…!!?! On this side of the Atlantic, we've learned that… not all types of train in service here can cope with being doused from end to end with seawater, and will instead shut down pending someone arriving in a van and plugging in a laptop to tell various systems they really need to restart now.
A few years ago, in Tehachapi, I saw a BNSF unit that had burned, and you could see both the previous Warbonnet AND Burlington Northern paint schemes underneath. Unfortunately I was too slow with my camera. It was going to Bakersfield and I was going to Mojave.
Yes, it may look a little bit thick, but from the way it looks to me, it looks as though the paint bubbled or charred look while it was on fire and gives. I like this technique and I'm going to give this a try. It would be nice if you could give me a list of the types of paints that you used. I like to paint a lot of my own engines and I like to use scalecoat 2 paint my diesel engines in Union Pacfic. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
@@nsmodeler24, thanks for the quick reply and the list of paints that I need. I used to model in HO scale and I got out of model trains around the late 80s and got back in it just last year around Christmas. But, I model the Union Pacific in N scale. Though I am quite proficient in straight painting, I've never really tried to weather anything. From the way things look nowadays, it's not enough to be able to paint an engine and have it look Factory new, now you got a whether the heck out of it. I used to make really good money painting engines, rolling stock and now I have to learn how to weather. Thanks again for the video and keep up the good work I enjoy your videos on your your layout and that operating coal unloader is really something special.
Hey josh! Question , I’m building a new layout and was wondering if u could give me tips on how to make a great yard and switching area ? I already have my mind set on a double mainline but inside I have a lot of space
Usually it’s a loose fuel line. Fire starts from hot turbo exhaust and heat in that area of the engine. Also a failed turbo can cause this issue. The turbo sits in the rear of the GE engines.
It's called a "run away" engine. It occurs when the turbo fails and unburned fuel and oil collects which in turn causes a complete meltdown of the turbo unit causing the engine to run wide open until the fuel in the lines is completely depleted (which as long as the fuel pump is still functioning means it will run until the tank is empty or the engine literally destroys itself due to intense heat)
YES the turbo made these burns. But the term toaster also came from flow by dry sump radiators. The coolant would not flow until operating temp. when hotter coolant would meet a cold radiator thus making cracks
If it idles for long enough and the Piston rings are not in the best shape, oil can pool in the exhaust side of the turbo, and if the engine gets hot enough it can light that stuff up, or blow it out of the exhaust with no fire
I have heard that fires are sometimes caused by unburnt fuel being ejected with the exhaust and burning as it leaves the stacks. Not sure how correct this is, but it sounds like a feasible explanation
I would love to do that on a SD or a GP and make it all rusted and just old and make have that on my mainline and I have to say I love this detail for BNSF and NS
EMD products such as the ones you describe do suffer similar fires, although far more rarely than GE machines. Typically, the culprit is carbon build up in the exhaust manifold, leading to large deposits that ultimately ignite.
It's caused when a Turbocharger goes out the bearings can no longer keep the oil in it and it blows by catches on fire and spews out that's why it looks like the fire has ran down in a river
When The Diesel Engine is burning too rich, too fast to completely burn all the fuel and it shoots out the exhaust, drips down and catches fire subsequently... Lack of efficiency, aka Respective Railroad Firm isn't properly maintaining their locos.
That's great, I have a rubbish armchair and it needs redesign. It looks like the classic Ikea Poang but the seat is a loop of steel tube instead of moulded ply, and it cuts into my legs when I fall asleep in it. Is there anything I can do to make it more comfortable or does it simply need replacing?
From what I understand, the turbochargers get worn out over time, and the bearings are typically the first piece to give in. At notch 5 or past notch 5, the turbo can no longer supply the amount of air required, because it can’t spin at a fast enough rate. The fuel delivery remains the same however, causing an overly rich air fuel mixture. All the fuel is ignited then forced out of the exhaust, creating a large flame.
I should also imagine that by the point the oil seals would be shot, which may release engine oil into the exhaust. This could then build up in there until it catches fire by other means or the means described above
Sounds correct there chief!
Diesels don't react quite like that regarding rich fueling, You are partially correct tho regarding wear but it's not the turbos as such. old turbos explode if they have excess bearing wear and if they are blowing less the engine won't actually run hotter. That's from exhaust manifold leakage or exhaust flexi, slip joint wear etc allowing the extremely hot exhaust gas to cook the inside of the compartment, burn all the insulation and then the paint. Diesels are just air amd fuel, a reduction in ether results in power loss as fueling is proportiomal to airflow. low boost will make black smoke or thick white smoke depending on fuel rate with reduction in boost. massive Heat is generated at high power settings with exhaust gas temps around 500ºc to 550ºc and at 35psi + boost pressure that gives you a hot as fuck hairdryer in a closet comparison.
The burn marks on the side are from internal fires, which can happen with dash 9s
Perfect Job🛠👍
Handmade, only Airbrush. Like me 🤩🤩🤩
I have always liked this effect. I've done similar effects on a couple locomotives. These look great. Thanks for sharing.
Great job! Just saw one of those "toasted' GEs in a train video, and you nailed the look. It's apparently so common that the narrator of the video didn't even bother to mention it.
Huh that's cool, wait... I don't have paint...
wait I don't even have a model train
what am I doing here
you're BROADENING YOUR EDUCATION
I have been thinking of doing this to a couple of my Dash 8-40 BW units, so thanks for the awesome tutorial!! You do great work.
What a useful and interesting technique. Thanks for sharing this.
Great looking effect. Looks very prototypical.
Wonderful tutorial! I will definitely implement this on my engines
Looks great Josh! Thanks for sharing your technique!
GE units have been called Toasters or Popcorn Poppers by traincrews, since the 70's. The U18B's of the Maine Central were known to going into afterburner from time to time.
Very nice my compliments sir
Very interesting
As a modeler of balsa wood airplanes, plastic models of cars, ships and planes and I am also an extensive model railroader... I have always laughed at "artist" of canvas painting and paper drawings... Because I have always said, I'm an artist too, except my canvas is not 2 dimensional, instead its 3 dimensional and I use all the same painting techniques brushes, and artist pastels and weathering powders as an "artist" would. You sir have nailed my argument with this video.. Your work is fantastic and realistic, and in 3 dimensional! Awesome job and thanks for sharing!!!
no one thinks model making isn’t art.
Excellent how to video, I really enjoyed watching this 👍
They catch fire there because the turbo is right there and when the turbo goes out it catches fire. The fire comes from the motor oil that is cycled through the turbo to cool it. The oil gets on the hot outside of the turbo and catches fire which spreads because the running turbo even though broken is still turning throwing oil everywhere spreading the fire.
What you've done is a really good representation of the real thing. 👍
This is exactly what happens to these locos.GE's are notorious for this more so than EMD's.
Great video Josh, loved the effect of the brush skills you have. Kudos!!!
The thickness of the paint gives the whole effect texture, which 'looks' right, even though it's perhaps not to scale.
Great tutorial. Thanks for sharing
Thanks! - Josh
Awesome job well done Josh!
Hey Josh this is great work, thank you for sharing with us, very nice!
This is a great video for every modeler to see for their prototype locomotives
Only if you're modelling a railway where, for some reason, locomotives are allowed to routinely catch on fire…!!?!
On this side of the Atlantic, we've learned that… not all types of train in service here can cope with being doused from end to end with seawater, and will instead shut down pending someone arriving in a van and plugging in a laptop to tell various systems they really need to restart now.
Very neat
Excelent work, from Argentina.
Nice work. Congratulations :)
Looks great. That is something I had never thought about. Thanks.
Love it. Thanks for all of your awesome tutorials
THANK YOU...for sharing. Nice.
Very cool!
This was a must watch for me, very nice technique
Good ideas and looks great...
Very good tutorial. I've tried it a few times but never really had it come out very well. Thanks for posting!
Thanks! Best of luck, and please let me know if I can help in any way. Happy to :)
Those some spicy trains.
A few years ago, in Tehachapi, I saw a BNSF unit that had burned, and you could see both the previous Warbonnet AND Burlington Northern paint schemes underneath. Unfortunately I was too slow with my camera. It was going to Bakersfield and I was going to Mojave.
Perfect job.
Yes, it may look a little bit thick, but from the way it looks to me, it looks as though the paint bubbled or charred look while it was on fire and gives. I like this technique and I'm going to give this a try. It would be nice if you could give me a list of the types of paints that you used. I like to paint a lot of my own engines and I like to use scalecoat 2 paint my diesel engines in Union Pacfic. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Hey Kenney, thanks for the kind words. Yes, listed below are the materials (manufacturer):
- Light Brown Paint, enamel (model master)
- Flat Black Paint, enamel (model master)
- Flat White Paint, enamel (model master)
- Medium Grey, enamel (model master)
- Dark Grey, enamel (model master)
- Light Brown Weathering Powder (AIM Products)
@@nsmodeler24, thanks for the quick reply and the list of paints that I need. I used to model in HO scale and I got out of model trains around the late 80s and got back in it just last year around Christmas. But, I model the Union Pacific in N scale. Though I am quite proficient in straight painting, I've never really tried to weather anything. From the way things look nowadays, it's not enough to be able to paint an engine and have it look Factory new, now you got a whether the heck out of it. I used to make really good money painting engines, rolling stock and now I have to learn how to weather. Thanks again for the video and keep up the good work I enjoy your videos on your your layout and that operating coal unloader is really something special.
Hi Josh are you definitely using the MM Enamel and not the MM acrylic range ? Thanks
Looks really nice I l’m thinking of getting some dash 9s might be, something to think about
I torched mine :) it didn’t work when I tried to run it though :( LOL
Well that sucks
just torch the entire thing and say it had an accident
Usually the cause is a Turbocharger.
What song did you use in the background? I love it!
4'33" by John Cage for most of the middle bit (techno remix)
This is mod is priceless
Smt you should try it on your Canadian National dash 9!
Does GE make ANYTHING that doesn't fail??
Hey josh! Question , I’m building a new layout and was wondering if u could give me tips on how to make a great yard and switching area ? I already have my mind set on a double mainline but inside I have a lot of space
Like did on BNSF burn 🔥 very cool 😎
Nice work!
Josh. What brand of weathering powered do you use & where can I get it ? I need a ton of weathering powder for my steel mill. Thank you.
And that was me thinking that you talking about the AEM-7...
Great work 👍
Some times you can see these with doors upside down... would be interesting to give that a shot.
That looks really cool.
Bob Ross of modeling
That is awesome
Looks good man!
And here I wish that I had the painting skills to pull this off...
cloner8o
Patina Style. Done on old cars and trucks.
I noticed the NS model has extensions on the top of radiator. Was that done from scratch or is there part or kit to do that?
Needed this! Thanks!
Very Nice! Who makes these engines that you used?
Both are made by Atlas. They're c40-8ws. Thanks for watching!
Cool!
Usually it’s a loose fuel line. Fire starts from hot turbo exhaust and heat in that area of the engine. Also a failed turbo can cause this issue. The turbo sits in the rear of the GE engines.
Love the work by the way. Keep it up!
@@thebrothahood2143 Thanks for the info! That makes sense. - Josh
It's called a "run away" engine. It occurs when the turbo fails and unburned fuel and oil collects which in turn causes a complete meltdown of the turbo unit causing the engine to run wide open until the fuel in the lines is completely depleted (which as long as the fuel pump is still functioning means it will run until the tank is empty or the engine literally destroys itself due to intense heat)
A turbo fire isn't necessarily a runaway. Turbo fires are much more common.
YES the turbo made these burns. But the term toaster also came from flow by dry sump radiators. The coolant would not flow until operating temp. when hotter coolant would meet a cold radiator thus making cracks
Jesus did that one , 0:59 ..he even left his autograph.
The most burned up one i saw on CSX was the middle part where the logo is was gone like really burned out
What do you use for weathering powder?
Where to buy this locomotives
If it idles for long enough and the Piston rings are not in the best shape, oil can pool in the exhaust side of the turbo, and if the engine gets hot enough it can light that stuff up, or blow it out of the exhaust with no fire
This could theoretically happen to any locomotive with a turbo charger, right?
Can you do the Burn marks on passenger locomotives
I don’t have a ge locomotive I’m thinking about doing this if I get one
I have heard that fires are sometimes caused by unburnt fuel being ejected with the exhaust and burning as it leaves the stacks. Not sure how correct this is, but it sounds like a feasible explanation
exhaust leak from inside compartment usually. 500ºc will burn your arm hairs so paint gonna feel the pain just as much.
Rust-Oleum makes a paint called rusty metal primer kind of looks like rust to check it out
I would love to do that on a SD or a GP and make it all rusted and just old and make have that on my mainline and I have to say I love this detail for BNSF and NS
EMD products such as the ones you describe do suffer similar fires, although far more rarely than GE machines. Typically, the culprit is carbon build up in the exhaust manifold, leading to large deposits that ultimately ignite.
How would you do that on Amtrak Locomotives?
I know this is not a GE but you should do an sd70acc please
GE machines doing GE Stuff
Fire at the stack is caused by hot oil igniting from mechanical failures in the engine.
I believe it's when they blow a turbo
VA Railfan ayy u watch josh too!
@@NOVARailandWeatherEnthusiast are you going to Ashland train day? I'll be there
@@railfangraham4182 Thank for the info! -Josh
VA Railfan yes I will be!
It's caused when a Turbocharger goes out the bearings can no longer keep the oil in it and it blows by catches on fire and spews out that's why it looks like the fire has ran down in a river
What else needs weathered is the coal /grain / box cars with patina and graffiti on the sides.
Maybe side tracks that are all bent out of shape.
i sub u nice job
Thanks for watching :) - Josh
Usually theses things tend to happen because of wet stacking
Usualy the turbo catches the oil on fire.
They caught fire because of issues with the fuel pump
Rip /9s and sd60s
When The Diesel Engine is burning too rich, too fast to completely burn all the fuel and it shoots out the exhaust, drips down and catches fire subsequently... Lack of efficiency, aka Respective Railroad Firm isn't properly maintaining their locos.
Step1
Set it on fire
Too funny
GE toasters hahahaha
The title should be how to ruin your train
Sure is a lot of armchair Engineers on this site
That's great, I have a rubbish armchair and it needs redesign. It looks like the classic Ikea Poang but the seat is a loop of steel tube instead of moulded ply, and it cuts into my legs when I fall asleep in it. Is there anything I can do to make it more comfortable or does it simply need replacing?
This video should be called "how to ruin the look of your model train but adding ruined details"
you put it on to thick dude... you have chunks on it it doesnt look good up close.. try more dry brush and let the layers dry in between!!
Why don't you speed them up slowest video ever
put them in a microwave
That looks great :)