Twin Peaks - Was Mr C victorious?
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- Опубліковано 8 вер 2024
- *SPOILERS*
A thorough look at some of the available evidence that strongly suggests the compelling possibility of a complete and total victory for Mr C at the end of Twin Peaks Season 3.
And if you're looking for cool articles about Twin Peaks and other damn fine television programs, you might like 25 Years Later.
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This edition contains SPOILERS for all things Twin Peaks. Please share your thoughts, theories, and observations regarding Twin Peaks.
Twin Peaks - Was Mr C victorious?
Seeing Kyle as Mr. C, makes me even more furious on why he did not get an Emmy nod (and he played three totally different characters!)
I'd go so far as to say four. The way he played Cooper in the final episode was like a version of good Coop with an undercurrent of Mr. C.
He did get nominated, but he didn't win...which he most definitely should have! :)
@@PimpDragon108 He was nominated for the Golden Globes, but not for the Emmys
Awards ceremonies are nothing but a bunch of industry politics and nepotism. That goes for the Emmy’s, the Oscars, and the Grammys. It’s all rigged from the outset. Always has been, always will be. Bunch of crap. I pay it no mind.
The scene of the third Diane in the car seeing red haired Diane and then having to have sex and sign in Linda... That whole thing was like seeing someone forcing in the last puzzle piece that didn't fit. WtF.
The ending to me was so what the hell just happened.
On a different note, the first time Dougie sees Sonny Jim he shed a tear. At the time I thought it was because something deep knew that was part of himself a son..
I'm glad that they made a Dougie with all of Dale's good traits to live a life, have another child and in general be happy with Janey,-E as and Sonny-Jim.
Knowing somewhere there is a Copper loving a simple life and having a wife, kids, like in Doctor Who, knowing in an alt universe her was happily together with that companion he loved. Made it ok to see him go on other adventures.
Anyway...
I never heard this theory that that Finally version was not completely Cooper. I'm sad now.
As for the forth piece of Diary, it was found ripped with fire walk with me writter in blood on the grass mound with half the locket in the traincar where Leland/Bob took Laura and Ronnette. Remember?
THERE THEY ARE, ALBERT! FACES OF STONE!
I’ve read that just as he said that! Lol!
The problem to me is, we don't know that Coop is trying to sacrifice Laura at all. He might believe that he's doing the right thing, bringing her home.
Yes
Exactly. That goes for every intention every character has in the show
For all we know, Coop may have believed Laura could somehow defeat or at least bring balance to the Palmer house that had become the house of Judy (and IMO is representative of Twin Peaks and it's world). After all, she seems to have been created for that purpose.
Maybe Dale was in more control than Bob was aware of. Mr. C may have thought he was trying to get Judy to join forces with her to gain more evil power. But maybe Dale wanted to get Judy to destroy her.
It’s strange that no one has pointed out the significance of how the final episode was shot differently than the rest of the series. The lighting, sound design, and editing were all fundamentally different. As if the characters weren’t in a TV show anymore.
It certainly felt to me like they had crossed over into our reality. It would explain using the real owners of the Palmer house for the final scene. I think Gordon's Monica Bellucci dream is set here too, Gordon's 'dream' is actually David Lynch in real life.
@@krunk9345 Unlike Twin Peaks and Deer Meadow, Odessa Texas is a real place.
jean paul so-true
You are actually right, to some extent. There's a noticeable difference in lighting particularly in Part 18. That said, I don't buy the 'it's the real world' theory.
Cody Farley - Yes... and it (Odessa) is a dismal, depressing, desolate place. I’ve been there, and believe me, I’m not just talking shit. Perfect setting for the purgatorial existence that ‘Carrie Page’ is trapped in.
There is one flaw in your logic: you assume bringing Laura to Judy is a sacrifice. But Laura is created by Fireman as a weapon/antidote to use against Judy. That's why BOB murdered her. And that is why Cooper changed the timeline and saved her. Now Laura can be there when Judy possesses Sarah, and somehow fight her, just like hulk hand guy fought against BOB. Judy should fear Laura, not the other way around.
Bravo. Exactly. Another acceptable plausible interpretation of the finale.
@@vdelrio999 Thank you. :)
rasnac agreed
As soon as he got to the 'Bad Coop is in charge' bit, and used all of the preceding "if x is true then y is true then z is true then aa is true then ab is true" to justify it, I stopped listening. It's a really well thought out, but utterly completely fucking stupid theory.
I agree. It’s a compelling argument but it’s predicated on the notion that Laura was being sacrificed. I’m sure about this.
For the author of this video, it’s true. That’s the beauty of Lynch’s work as a surrealist. There really is no answer no matter how hard we try to assign meaning.
It’s a fantastic ride and the discussion and points of view are endless. That’s why Twin Peaks season 3 is the best thing I’ve ever seen in television.
You're almost right, but not quite there (in my opinion, of course.). Mr.C originally won, and escaped, because Coop failed to confront him and ran away. A metaphor for being afraid of facing your inner darker self and accepting that sometimes traits like coldness, ruthlessness and selfishness can be necessary for doing what has to be done.
The reason he didn't have to be the one to kill Mr.C was because that was never the point. The point was making the decision to face him, which he did. Metaphorically this is accepting your inner darkness and becoming a real person, as opposed to an idealistic version of yourself, allowing you to complete the harder objectives.
Cooper does win, but the win comes at the cost of the Cooper we all knew and loved.
what? did I miss something? when did cooper run away? honest question here
oh do you mean that last scene in the black lodge in S2? I was thinking about end of S3 here
@@postmodernjungle4233 Season 2, final episode. He quite literally tries to run away but gets caught. This time, he heads straight towards him.
This is, excuse me, a damn fine video. I almost feel like several I was planning to make are now unnecessary, as I think you nailed so many of the same things. A few thoughts: If Mr. C was trying to get Judy in the last episode, I don't think he succeeded. The coordinates Mr. C visits in the penultimate episode are definitely the ones he was seeking (with Ray's and Jeffries's being the two that matched, the trap) because they are the coordinates Hastings and Ruth provided to Major Briggs, which we know because Briggs is also there, or at least the part of him that was able to escape. I also think the voice on the phone in episode 2 was actually Judy, who spawned BOB and would therefore have reason to say "I will be with BOB again." Judy wants BOB back, but wants nothing to do with Mr. C. In fact, I think Mr. C had never spoken with the real Jeffries before, given that when he meets the real Jeffries, the first thing he asks about is their initial meeting in Philadelphia. If they'd ever talked before, that subject would've been long since discussed.
I'm not sure if its Mr c thats present in "richard" coop. I think his demeanor and actions are bc he sacrificed his child like innocence to create the dougie tulpa for Janey-e and sonny Jim
I like this a lot more. Puts a lot more weight on the scene
I like the theory that Richard/Coop WAS the tulpa, and the real Coop was the one who went to live happily ever after with Janey
There's also the fact that he is on a very grave and serious mission from which he knows he may not return, understandable he isnt getting giddy over a cup of coffee lol
I have been thinking about what Lynch does. I don't think he creates art in the usual sense. I think he creates real ghosts that get in our heads completely. You can even laugh at the plot or whatever but still feel haunted by these images and presences. So the Emmys can snub TP or whatever, based on what they see as over the top or preposterous, but TPTR remains one of the most devastatingly impressing (impressive too, but I mean impressing on our psyches) works on TV ever, if not the most. Even watching this video, I start feeling like there is something in the room just out of the corner of my eye.
Happy Clam you have articulated something marvelous in this comment. I and most people, I believe, have the exact same thoughts and feelings as you. Well put mate.
That image of not-Laura (I forget her name) standing in front of not-the-Palmer's-house screaming in horror at the end of season three has haunted me ever since I saw it. Pure existential terror.
Agreed. Even though some parts of the third season don't work that well (many recurring characters have very little do do with the main plot threads), it's easily the best tv series I've seen the last 5 years or so. The stand out elements in this series are far above what anyone else have accomplished in the tv medium. Just thinking about episode 8 alone, makes my brain spin inside my head. It was pure cinema at a Kubrick/Tarkovsky level of brilliance.
@@josephcbugajski7105 Seriously. Even the choice to make the lights go out after she's staring at it and nothing's going on. It feels like a nightmare. Not because there's a killer clown or because you drove off a cliff. More like....it's the visual language of nightmares. The feeling of a nightmare.
"Meanwhile ..." Loved that! Awesome to see this video, and it makes me think that Lynch is the most complex human on the planet, or he has no idea what is happening and makes all of his decisions on a whim. And then chuckles as we try to unravel all of this. Up until now, my interpretation has been that Coop thinks he's completing his mission by returning Laura to her mother, and in the final moment realizes his mistake ... But the coffee. The coffee really is the lynchpin (ha!) in all of it. Clearly, we need a season four to clear all this up.
I know you should probably never take Lynch's work literally, but the sight of Mr C burning in the Black Lodge always said to me that he lost! Maybe some of his essence remained in Coop/Richard Coop, but Coop was in control.
I agree with him about RichardCoop being different and like a middle version of both or Cooper and Mister C united as one, killing two birds with one stone, the green stone in the Ring?
So now, no more Cooper and no more Doppleganger, now it's one person and that is why maybe Diane doesn't feel the same with him?
And i think when he says and now some things will change, the past dictates the future, it means, he is going to change the past, so everyone will remember differently or forget about past life.
And i do agree somewhat with the theory that we saw some of that changed world, where everyone acted different. No one is talking about Laura, but the question is, during their investigation on Laura and her pages, did they say she is dead or missing? That would decide which reality we are watching in that scene... i really need to rewatch
do you guys think it's possible that coop didn't really fathom the depths of his blunders until odessa when it came to mr c?
did it all hit him when he woke?
Yeah, I think that the pure, unbridled evil that Mr. C represented was definitely destroyed, or at least defeated. After ‘crossing over’, I think that a modicum of Mr. C was realigned with Cooper, hence his obvious flaws in that pocket reality and his indifference towards the residents of pocket reality Odessa. I think he was made whole again when Mr. C was killed/defeated. I agree that Coop’s ‘good side’ was in control after that, though you could definitely see signs that a dark side loomed within him. Had Mr. C been in control, then he never would have lead Laura/Carrie to Twin Peaks in order to defeat Judy... which was presumably the plan that the giant/fireman laid out for him from day one.
*applause* I love your theories. I really wish they had another season. I sure want more.
Though I definitely don’t want it to end, I just can’t realistically see how a 4th season would even be possible... going on the way season 3 (or ‘The Return’) ended. There was just too much finality in that last episode. Besides, so many key actors have died, and a few others are so up there in age that unless it’s already underway, which it isn’t, doing another season (which Lynch himself said would require 4 or 5 years of production) just doesn’t look like a viable option. Maybe a film would be a better idea.
@@Brewzerr That is what they said about season 3!
Eric Wycoff - Well, to be fair, they only said that about S3 because so much time had passed since the original series was cancelled. Many old fans, myself included, had long since written off the idea that a 3rd season would ever happen based solely on the passage of time. My reasons for not getting any hopes up for a 4th season has more to do with some very realistic obstacles. Namely, the age of many key actors and the age of David Lynch himself. Also, when S2 concluded in ‘91, it was only over due to cancellation by the network. They had already started planning to do a 3rd season, and left the storyline open. After having watched The Return, or ‘season 3’ six times, the final scene didn’t really leave much of an open storyline from what I could tell. It just reeks of finality to me. I actually *WANT* to be wrong about this. And who knows? Lynch has made an entire career out of defying everyone’s expectations, so I guess we’ll just have to wait and see. All I know is that if it doesn’t happen in the next 7 or 8 years, it’s highly likely that it will probably never happen.
Once again, if there is going to be any continuation, then I think a feature film is a much more plausible idea than another season.
@@BrewzerrI feel you on that and agree with everything you said, I really do hope that they will at least make 1 more movie or something that would be neat, but at the end of it all I am very happy with what we have got from lynch and the tema : )
Eric Wycoff - Oh yes, me too. I’m a longtime viewer/fan since the first season back in ‘90, and an even longer-time fan of David Lynch since I first saw Eraserhead at the midnight movies way back in the early 80’s. I think Lynch and Frost did a top-notch job with The Return. It wasn’t at all what I was expecting, but that’s one big reason I enjoyed it so much. The day that David Lynch becomes predictable is the day I start losing interest in his work. I never cared what the critics had to say. Lynch has always been ahead of his time... and the naysayers usually end up finally ‘getting it’ later on. Take Blue Velvet, which upon it’s release in ‘86 was bashed by most critics... and today is considered a ‘classic’. A lot of people have talked trash on The Return, but just wait a few more years. Opinions will change.
I just hope that if Lynch and Frost have any inkling of revisiting Twin Peaks again, they start getting on it very soon. Time is not working in their favor at this point.
Fascinating. And nice to hear from you again. Makes me nostalgic for the days of The Return, when so many of us would eagerly await your insights after each episode -a companionable voice to aid us in our quest to process the exquisitely complex layers of this masterful saga. Cheers!
BRROOOOOOOOOOOOOOO WELCOME BACK!!!!!! Just as I was getting bored with some of these other channels you come through, perfect!
This show, Twin Peaks Season 3, is without any question the most amazing television ever presented within the medium. True art first, then first rate intellectual entertainment second. Wow Lynch Wow, you have been an excellent tour guide the whole journey, and your interpretations always cause me to pause and rethink my interpretation. The mitigating factor in my opinion on Mr. C ultimately winning, is that as you say, his relentless path to Judy has zero remorse, no compromise. Yet Dougie reappears at home? I'm still feel there was a sense of good that happened, especially in the end. (Mr. C wasn't actually evil, just ruthless in his pursuit of evil) That said, we are equal but different on our POV... Keep up the amazing work sir.
Cheers!
So here is my theory. What if the ending scene refers to "two birds with one stone", meaning that Evil Coop is, as you said, the one controlling Cooper but is tricked by the Fireman into bringing Laura Palmer to Judy and therefore destroying himself and her? The good Coop on the other hand is with his family.
I like this! also is Richard equivalent to Mr C as Dougie is to Cooper. hmmmmm
@@NeoLudditevisons this is actually blowing my mind
@@Funkman47 i forgot i even thought this! Man what a show!
I think the point of bringing Laura home wasn't to sacrifice her, but for her to confront Judy/her darker self (and maybe merge with it). After all she was made by the Giant as a ball of light, after Bob was made from the explosion, so the idea was for her to fight the evil.
I always interpreted it as Laura being a ‘weapon’ of sorts, created by the giant as a line of defense only to be deployed at a certain time, when the white lodge is in danger of being destroyed, or taken over by Judy. I believe that in the 25 years after Laura was murdered by BOB, it allowed Judy to gain a foothold. That’s why it was necessary for Cooper to go back to 1989 and save Laura, so that she could be effectively deployed once she has confronted Judy (which she does at the very end). I believe this was the giant’s “two birds with one stone” strategy - go back in time and prevent Laura’s murder, then “find Laura” (as Leland says to Cooper in the red room), take her back ‘home’, and defeat Judy.
Many fans have this theory that Cooper’s act of going back to 1989 to save Laura was done outside of the giant’s instructions... that it was Cooper acting upon his own will, and that it somehow messed everything up and allowed Judy to win. I don’t believe that to be the case at all. I think it was all part of the giant’s original plan from day one. I think it was the only way to defeat Judy. If Laura was dead, then there could be no weapon. She *HAD* to be brought back... and I do believe Judy was defeated at the end. Possibly even destroyed. What I’m not too clear on is whether or not Laura and Cooper survived, or they’re just collateral damage.
@@Brewzerr , I agree with the first half of your comment, but how do you tell Judy is defeated at the end?
How do we tell she isn’t? It’s only a theory, just like everything else. That ending was obviously left open for interpretation, and that’s just how I interpreted it. No one knows what actually happened there.
@@Brewzerr , yes, but I am just curious about the clues that led to your interpretation.
Well, the main catalyst in leading me to that conclusion is a fairly simple one. I just can’t imagine that Lynch and Frost would shit all over the Twin Peaks legacy by legitimizing the finality of Judy as the victor. That would basically negate everything that ever happened on the show from day one. However, I do believe that Laura’s victory came at a heavy cost. There’s a good chance that neither she nor Cooper exist anymore. The weapon theory suggests that Laura, as the weapon, offered herself as a sacrifice for the greater good. She was fulfilling a destiny that was laid out for her at her conception when the giant ‘birthed’ her.
Coops first big coffee scene is when he first arrives at twin peaks. We know from fire walk with me that the coop we know from the show only exists when he gets to twin peaks. Prior to twin peaks, hes a stressed out agent.
If he goes back in time, prevents Laura from being murdered,, never goes to twin peaks, he never gains the chipper spark we know of.
That's an amazing point. So Carrie Page timeline is a Cooper who never met Truman, Hawk, Audrey, or Annie... I can see him, without the Twin Peaks people's influences, just spiraling into this cold version of himself. Very interesting perspective!
Charles Hoover Needham Interesting point. I never really gave much thought to Cooper’s personality being different in FWWM mostly because I tend to focus in on the Jeffries scene and those are weird odd circumstances that would put anyone on edge. But his tone and demeanor with Sam Stanley are particularly cold.
@@daveycash3479 Yeah, this is the guy still spiraling from having an affair with Earle's wife and the consequences of that. I love this theory.
Preventing Laura's murder wouldn't have meant that Cooper never went to Twin Peaks, because she was never the reason he was sent there. Ronnette Pulaski crossed state lines after being attacked and thus it became a federal case. After Cooper changed the events, Laura was considered a missing person's case which Cooper briefly investigated-this is detailed in Mark Frost's The Final Dossier.
Corn Pone Flicks That’s true and on a related note, the fact that Tammy and presumably Gordon remember that it was originally a murder complicate things even further. As Phillip tells Cooper that Cole would remember the “unofficial version”. What makes the Blue Rose team immune to the change in history?
I think the coldness at the end is from whomever Richard was before Cooper got there. Different than the way Cooper switched with Dougie, he seems to actually be Richard now. I think the power of Cooper was to hold on to the reality of what he was there to do even though to Richard, his memories of Cooper's life were fading like a dream. When he introduced himself as Cooper, he didn't sound as confident as when he performed other actions like fighting those men. Richard was haunted by his memories of being Cooper, because he had a life of his own before. I think that's the primary cause of his brooding attitude. He remembered being Cooper telling himself to remember that even though he would wake into this life, he was there to find Laura, even though she will also be someone else. The conflict was Richard struggling to accept that his dream was either as real or more real than his life, which would be very upsetting and hard to believe. That was part of Cooper's strength, to come back to life out of a dream.
I think the Imposter Phillip Jeffries was Judy. If you compare the voices of the Imposter Phillip Jeffries on the phone with Judy just before she bites the guy's throat out in the bar there's an uncanny similarity. There are also some things in Twin Peaks the final dossier that indicate that Judy was looking for Bob.
100%. That was her voice, the way she says New York proves it IMO
Not all of those lines are Bowie; his death in real life necessitated a second voice actor.
@elganzandere As it happens, none of the lines are Bowie. When David Lynch called him to ask if he'd like to return and he declined, he gave Lynch the green light to use the archive footage from Fire Walk with Me under the condition that they dub his voice because he was embarrassed about the southern accent he used in the movie. Being from the South myself, I really wish he hadn't made that decision because although his accent was noticeably manufactured, it wasn't by much. And I think the exaggeration suited the high tension situation.
@@Brandon_Powell i was unaware it was old audio. I agree with you on the accent - slightly campy, yet fitting.
Or... if Sarah is possessed by DoppleLaura, then Cooper was taking Carrie Page to maybe merge her with her Doppleganger, like how perhaps Cooper merged with Mr. C?
as per Jungian philosophy, Good Dale was bringing Laura to integrate her shadow self into the whole, like Cooper and Mr C after the fight at the station. That was good Coop's ultimate goal. But the timeline change messed with his final part of the plan. Dopplelaura is still out there somewhere in the new timeline inhabiting Sarah Palmer, she's just somewhere else besides the Palmer household
That's also what I believe is to be the case.
"Shadow - Take me down with you"
I'm confused about dopplegangers being capable of even posessing anyone, as it never happened before in the series, we only see Bob doing it. That's why I think Sarah is posessed by Judy, and the Fireman led Mr. C away from finding her (tricking him into the sheriff station) because he was worried about Bob (inside Mr. C) teaming up with Judy again.
@@shawnkavanagh2951 I'm confused about dopplegangers being capable of even posessing anyone, as it never happened before in the series, we only see Bob doing it. That's why I think Sarah is posessed by Judy, and the Fireman led Mr. C away from finding her (tricking him into the sheriff station) because he was worried about Bob (inside Mr. C) teaming up with Judy again.
It was all part of the Fireman's plan and Coop knew what had to be done. He couldn't bring Laura in harms way without his darker side so by both good and dark Coop merged together he was able to bring her to the Palmer house where Judy resided. What happened at that point is unknown but it's assumed that Laura, an entity of goodness shown by the golden orb, was to confront Judy in some sort of battle that we didn't get to see. Leaving the conclusion of said battle unknown and up to interpretation.
OMG, you summed up all of season 3 there in one big sentence! That's genius!
fetal freak this is definitely the theory i subscribe to as well. nicely summed up!
I agree-- Richard (the alternate universe Richard & Linda, Richard - not Richard Horne) was a "combination" of White Knight Agent Cooper and Dark Mr. C (remember the "uncomfortable" hotel bedroom scene?).. The Fireman understood the only way to fight (possibly defeat) Judy. It was the "plan" Coop discussed with Gordon before going into the Black Lodge. Coop either knew it was more important to fight Judy or hoped he could get "two birds with one stone" by becoming Alternate Universe Richard, defeat Judy AND return Laura home
fetal freak - That’s the best summation of The Return I’ve seen thus far, and I’ve seen many. I’ve seen a lot of people get *REALLY* out there with some their theories. Serious mindfuckery that goes off on some truly bizarre tangents. People definitely have a tendency to overthink Lynch’s work, when it all boils down to the fact that Lynch is an artist, and likes to leave his art open to interpretation. Even for himself. Your take on this is one of the only takes that I feel comfortable agreeing with.
@__hjg__2123 that motel scene was a sex magik ritual. She was his red woman.
What's your take on the dream interpretation? The return resembles Mulholland Drive in many ways. Cooper seems like an idealized self, possibly of Richard, who takes on qualities of both Mr. C and Dale. Richard looks like Mr C when he's driving Carrie Page, but has heroic qualities similar to Cooper, as evidenced by his intervention in Judy's diner. Naomi Watts had an idealized self in her dream, who's personality is similar to Cooper. In Richard's world, possibly the real world, there are elements that could have been brought into a dream. In Mulholland Drive all of the elements and characters of the dream are shown in the real word, but that's not the case in TP. It might be implied that they exist somewhere in Richard's world. In Mulholland Drive there's an important key, which, when used to open a mysterious box, leads to Naomi Watts waking up. Cooper has an important key that opens a door in a mysterious part of the hotel, which eventually leads to Richard's world. Prior to opening the door, Cooper says "we live inside a dream."
You can also argue, I suppose, that the dream was of the original timeline, which keeps both interpretations intact. That might explain why Carrie page screams because she remembers the original timeline.
"Now this is really something interesting to think about"
The game begins...
OMG, THE IMMENSE IMPORTANCE OF AN INSIGNIFICANT SCENE WITH A CUP OF COFFEE. Well done!!
All of Twin Peaks season 3 was in the mind's eye of Cooper, he was the dreamer inside the dream. He's either dead, in a coma or a mental hospital.
Mr C is Richard, one of Cooper's previous incarnations. He was probably an Occultist linked with the Trinity Test - a' la Jack Parsons.
Diane with the red hair is Linda, his occultist consort in the previous incarnation. She's based on Marjorie Cameron, the wife of Jack Parsons.
In the motel room they took part in a Sex Magik ritual to bring forth Judy into the world.
But in reality there is no Judy. This is just Cooper dealing with a guilty conscience about a previous existence. He refuses to see Richard as part of his soul's journey. So he turns him into Mr C. An evil double - alien to himself.
Until Cooper faces his dark-side, he won't be able to leave the lodge, which probably means be reborn, or maybe move to Nirvana and become an avatar in the great Buddhist wheel of existence..
Twin Peaks, the Return, is similar to Lost Highway, Mulholland Drive and Inland Empire. In that it deals with guilt, repression, multiple names and shifting personalities; all processed through the mind of one soul. A jigsaw puzzle of dream logic, we, the viewer have to put together.
Like Lynch's last three movies, it's also a comment on American history, wherein characters are loosely based on real-life icons and stories. I.E. Marylin in Mulholland Drive,
Or maybe he died in the hotel room, and everything since has been his afterlife? Maybe that's what Laura whispered to him, as in 'you're dead, Coop',
The gramophone being stuck might be symbolic of Cooper's state, as in his soul is stuck, he can't move on.
He's trying to save Laura, but it's pointless - they're both dead, and they're not coming back.
The Carrie Page character seems to be implying Laura wouldn't have turned out good. If she hadn't died, she'd have ended up in jail, or on drugs. It seems to be telling him to turn the page,
But he can't. Probably because he can't face up to the fact that in a previous existence he was evil. And maybe he's paying the price for that evil.
But I don't think Richard/ Mr C is as evil as Coop believes. Maybe he just got into occult and convinced himself he'd brought Judy into the world.
However, in Buddhism, demons are just products of wrong thinking, they're ultimately delusions we generate to distract us from the right thinking. The 8 fold Path to enlightenment.
The idea in the Buddhist/ Hindu afterlife, is not to fight it out with demons, or to try and become an angel, rather, the point of enlightenment comes when you can operate in the after life no differently to how you operate in life. To embrace death and rebirth as easily as changing a coat.
The giant seems to represent that kind of enlightened avatar. As if he acts no differently in or out of his physical body. All the other characters in the lodge speak backwards, move awkwardly, whereas the giant sounds normal, even ordinary. He's totally at ease with himself and the lodge.
I think in allowing the Dougie Jones persona exist after everything by recreating him, caused him to lose more of that childlike innocence. Possibly his constant need to to help was his downfall? That's why we have such a powerless Dale Cooper within the Bad Cooper?
9:00.... "wants"..... not "needs". Mr. C doesn't need anything. :) :) Loved the video.
great to hear from ya again, fam...i honestly believe the 4chan kid cracked it...last scene was 1989 (no r&r to go sign) cooper's disoriented because he forgot what laura whispered in the red room when he transferred into the dream world the fireman hid laura in (even though he knew the plan when he woke up & had mike create another dougie, he knew he was not coming back)...when they get to the palmer house, "what year is this?" fills carrie with consternation...then sarah calls to her from the waking world the morning her body was found in the pilot...but pete's fishing...2 birds: her scream knocks judy's lights out, she wakes up in 1989, cooper changed the past...no more bob or judy...the fireman, briggs, jefferies, cole, & coop's "plan" turned it all into a nightmare she wakes up from...cooper, is now a disembodied head, "we live inside a dream"...we know that from cole's monica dream where he only sees coop's body...hope this helps, it really tied all the loose ends together for me...cheers & love my fellow metaphysical twin peaks residents!
ps: i think coop switched fates with briggs...because in the new 1989 timeline mr c didn't disembody briggs...there was no way good coop could come back after all the awful stuff his clone did...especially since he martyred himself to save laura by getting lost in her dream...but good dougie was coop's happy ending.
Mar Shell Willis damn that’s really good
i swear i owe it all to some kid on 4chan...i read it 17 months after he left it like a christmas present the morning of 9/4/17...it read like a 6 line poem...the article is from nme, the british rock publication, it's called "did peakies already crack the code?" or along those lines.
@@marshellwillis5240 I think I found it www.nme.com/blogs/tv-blogs/twin-peaks-fan-theory-cliffhanger-ending-2133973
bang, bang...that to me was the missing puzzle piece...
"got the picture, & the frame..."
that mystery person is Judy. because I believe Lynch took Sarah Palmer's voice and make the pitch very low until it unrecognizable. you can try it yourself reverse the pitch very high and see if it sound like Sarah Palmer. I also believe the American Woman remix is a hint for this
I can’t believe you came out with a new video! I love your work!
What superb analysis !! You've been the absolute BEST since TP3 began. I'm hoping that Lynch does TP4 not only for the sake of all of us TP aficionados BUT also for your fantastic You Tube installments. God speed WLW. !! Till next time 👍👍👍
I think David Bowie is alive and he send us a message through that scene in Twin Peaks
bowie thekettle
@@kevcatnip7589 Tin Machine.
@@TheVultureVanityShow I'm a percolator, I'm a mama papa comin' for you
A new video, yes! This is awesome! Always really enjoy your videos man, considering and mulling over all kinds of perspectives while taking in your, always, very concise, clear, and thought-provoking streams of thought and description -- Really excellent use of rhetorical questioning and hypophora. I usually watch a choice episode or two (or five) of any TP material after taking your videos. It's become a kind of mini-ritual actually, one I've come to thoroughly enjoy
Usually I'll flip on Season 1 or The Return episodes. Sometimes, even, all of FWWM or The Missing Pieces if I have some time carved out - sometimes without time carved out, because, well... It's TP lol. Thank you so much for the upload here, your videos are really something to me, and obviously, many, many others. Always look forward to a new video or exploring the vast collection of content you've already created. I'm a creative person I suppose, very into music as far as listening and playing, movies, literature (mostly just reading), painting/drawing, but seriously, when I come across videos or just any general media-content like your's, I realize what true dedication really looks like, feels like, when it is manifested. Very happy to learn from and simultaneously enjoy the heck out of what you choose to make :) Thanks man! Best wishes to you, sincerely.
(I am also purely, genuinely wishing for more Twin Peaks, as far away as it could be or as unlikely as it may be, I still hold out a strong hope. If not though, all still remains in place to access and mull over anytime). I say my hope, wish is 'pure,' or whatever, but I mean this as if to say I'm wishing for more Twin Peaks not for the sake of it, or over-indulgence, or misplace wish-fulfillment... It's that there's, I think, incredible (ASTOUNDING, and I truly believe this), material, all kinds of material left in what is really the story of Laura Palmer, the little girl who lived (lives) down the lane, but also the story of the trauma of being, of existence itself, of the trauma of nothingness, the mysteries both small and large and looming that pervade our existence and imaginations, the relief somehow that things can swing in a direction of truth, goodness, sentience, care, heartfelt joy and exuberance that extends beyond the immediately perceivable -- Like Briggs shares with Bobby -- Even though our thoughts and very lives may congeal and fester in nightmarish, seductive places of abandon like the Waiting Room, and possibly the Black Lodge itself, or play out in desolate, violent dreamscapes mimicking nature to entrap and surround vulnerable souls, there sits the ending of FWWM, or the very last shot of S3 as Laura whispers once more into Cooper's ear, mercurial and somehow unknowable even beyond remaining ignorant to her actual words, there is hope yet again (hope again amidst desolation, just as, I suppose, there's a bit of super-dense, furious chaos yet again encircled within the realms of the White Lodge and what it represents). Huge ramble, yeah, but basically, I think the foundation of TP is so substantial, even given how The Return wraps up, that more material is not only possible but even necessary, should it go ahead at any time. Very few works, of any sort, warrants the necessity of continuation (but that is just a verbose opinion) - - but anyway, I have my reasons for wanting more TP extending even beyond my love and admiration for the show and all that it has inspired. It is very clear that you also have reasons for desiring the show's continuation, in my opinion, far beyond even the sheer narrative intricacy and allure of Twin Peaks, which is something that really sticks out about your material (so cool how you make this evident without saying it directly or trying to word it, it's actually laced in your voice I think, your reverence and awe for the show I mean, also powerful curiosity and true-to-form, honest-to-goodness hard thinking about its implications, descriptions, portrayals... Basically, I am just trying to say I greatly respect how you treat the show, how you tackle it and explore the world and its characters, its unique yet simultaneously ubiquitous features and flavors. Looking forward to seeing what happens with a possible continuation, or just further developments pondering what is here already - Either way, any time with TP and its fans is VERY well-spent (which to me at this point is more than fandom, not to get too out there with it, but 'more than fandom,' as in a kind of quiet, but definitive reverence for the show shared among all sorts of people).
Wow. I never thought of it like this at all. Fascinating video!
love your twin peaks vids, rum. going to get some lunch and mull over this properly
It is Rum, then?! I knew I recognized the voice watching his boxing videos
I find your theory interesting. Perhaps Cooper at the end wasn't sure what was going to happen when he delivered Carrie/Laura to Judy. Maybe on some "good cooper" level, he thought he was just "taking her home" as he seemed to have that in mind like a mantra. Maybe he thought she needed her mother (lol), but seriously, on some level maybe he was just taking her home to Sarah and thought this would heal everything. That sounds like something Dougie good Cooper might believe. But the Mr. C. side is in there, as you say, calling the shots beneath the surface.
You gotta throw that armpit scene at us every time! It's been like a year and I finally almost got it outa my head, then.....Wow Lynch Wow!
Splendid. You've just triggered a rewatch.
Hey WELCOME BACK AND GOOD JOB MISS YOU BRO! Cherry Pie and Coffee for everyone!!
👍🍰☕🌲
*Standing applause* W--Wow, just ... wow. I've seen/read a lot of TP Season 3 theories, but this.... it HAS to be the best. Just incredible. What a brilliant, astute mind you have. There's no leaps of faith (to my mind anyway), just logical conclusions based on the evidence the show provided us all with. I love it to pieces. And... as an aside... if Mr. C won and won hard, the final moments of (good) Coop sitting in the chair, traumatised as the credits roll, hit me harder than the ending ever could when I first saw it. We are witnessing a truly, thoroughly defeated man come to a realisation that it really was all in vain. Fuck :( I want to get the Bluray out and watch it all again now, with your summary of the show still fresh in my mind. I feel there's going to be a lot "OOOohhhhhhh, i seeeee" moments now :) Thank you, for uploading this masterful bit of work !
Sorry for long message, maybe ill edit it after posting... and thanks for another great video!
Okay, it's great, that when Mister C asks about Judy, they then disappear, like in FWWM scene, when Phillip doesn't want to talk about her, but when he does, he disappears.
The card symbol could be Judy yes, but could also symbolize the place where she may be.
Cooper shows the card to Dariya and also talks about coordinates, so if those two things are connected, then the coordinates take him to the Fireman's place, from Jack Rabbit's Palace,
where Briggs and possibly Phillips is, with the Fireman, who has Philip lookalike machines there (and where Ronette/Naido are) and above that box, which looks like a switch, the Jeffries machine looks like one pin of the switch and Cooper comes out of the window where the other pin could have been.
Now the owl cave symbol is shown to us in two angles. Arms.Horns/OwlWings up... and down.
Let me illustrate, sorry if i did this before, but i find it very interesting.
This is just my theory.. based on where you see which rotation of the symbol and where it supposedly takes you.
vOv Down, Inverted Owl = Ring (on the table, on finger when fingers face up, on the pile of dirt) = supposedly takes you to the Black Lodge, under Twin Peaks, if you see them as inverted mountains.
^O^ Up, Normal Owl = Ace Card, Phillips Symbol, Major Briggs Note, Hawk's Map (Hawk points at Brigg's station on the mountain, before Frank asks him about the symbol), so link this symbol with Major Brigg's station, which is under it. The Cow Jumped over the Moon, can relate on the Moon and Symbol, maybe. Or Maybe not : D
Also, when Cooper comes into the Glass Box, notice his posture, his arms, against the circle behind him. He might be making the Up Symbol (unintentionally), just to symbolize wings, since he's floating or as a hint to the White Lodge or im over-analyzing, but he's been to the Fireman's and the Naido place where he say Briggs, so that symbol connects : D
Anyway, it does seem like Tracy was sent, but she could just be his crush and they accidentally summoned the beast by the sex ritual, or someone sent her to do this without telling her or Sam.
Or no one knew this was how to summon it, but it happened by accident. Either way, Judy is at this point in New York.
The reason the guard was gone could mean either he left because Tracy was here to do the job, or the Guard fell asleep here and disappeared and woke up in another world/timeline or in the real : D
Anyway, by that, it adds up to this symbol and the coordinates leading UP to the Fireman's, which we all already thought was the White Lodge, so Up symbol could represent that.
Fireman says, "it's in our house now" and "it cannot be said out aloud now", possibly meaning, Judy is in the house (or captured) and they can't talk about her openly or they might disappear? and Cooper understands and is silent. We've already linked Fireman's Record's sounds to when Laura disappears and when Sarah stabs her photo. Also, Fireman's Palace, Ronnette is by the Fire, so it feel Fireman's place, Major Brigg's Station and this place are very much linked.
Rwo things, as you've discussed.
1- Sarah is (or possessed by) Judy, like Leland was possessed with Bob, (Leland said, "he came in me", like the Frogmoth went inside the girl). So, Sarah, being (possessed by) Judy is hitting the Good Laura who represents Love, or,
2- Sarah, having Laura's smile over Judy's black and white head, is trying to hit Laura because Laura is Judy, because after Frogmoth entered Sarah and Bob entered Leland, Laura was born.
So Laura is their child or the Frogmoth herself, or possessed or affected by it and Judy, if it's not Laura or her Doppleganger, then is definitely her Mother somehow.
If we go by that, then Mrs Tremond could be Judy and guess who's living in the Palmer House...
When Phillip says he met Judy above the convenience store, we see the boy say Judy. Does he and Jeffries mean Judy is Mrs Tremond? We never see her as Evil, neither her son, but they both meet Laura outside the diner and also in her dream.
Sarah looks at the Turkey Jerky, with a similar symbol, with horns up and its around a circle and says, since 1942, just two years before the Trinity Test, when the woodsmen came. Are they the Horsemen of the Apocalypse, because the Pale Horse is Death? And the reason we hear the horse sound when the Woodsman Leaves, could be, because he is the Dark, within the Pale Horse, who's name is Death and the Woodsman is killing everyone.
Also, since the toy horse is at Judy's Diner and then after cooper gets the address from the waitress, he reaches Laura/Carrie, where he again sees the horse and the number 6 Pole, where we heard MFAP making the whooping sound, which lead us to the Room above the Convenience store, where Judy was called out. This is why, i think the Pole is at Carrie Paige's place because Laura is connected to Judy and all things we see.
It also gives the impression, that Richard was dreaming about these regular things, which in his dream, like in all dreams, meant something else, because the dream world jumbles up things.
But then, when Carrie stutters in horror hearing about Sarah's name, it could mean, she is starting to remember the timeline where she was dead, because in the end, when she hears her mother call at her house, its like she realizes she's supposed to be dead and Cooper, didn't realize that she'd remember. We all would be screaming like that if we suddenly remembered we were supposed to be dead or get the memory of our previous version who was dead, in another life. At that point of realization, this reality or dream shatters, so they both are back in the Red Room, which takes them back to the Red Room.
Cooper's expression doesnt seem like he knows what's going on, or that he is trying to defeat Judy, as a lot of fans suggest, which may be right, but i never felt so, so far.
I think he was just trying to get her home thinking this is the 80s, where he and Diane had sex and went to bed. I don't think after waking up, he sees a calendar or date anywhere and doesn't realize, he's in another time or timeline.
This also makes us feel that when Cooper wakes up as Richard, he still believes he's Cooper, but is actually Richard, who says "we live inside a dream", where he's probably by now in a Lucid dream and watching all this, before he is about to wake up, so he's hurrying things, before he actually wakes up. So, when Phillip said it, somehow, Phillip realized that he doesn't really exist, but is a part of someone else's dream. This could be why Cole and Albert realize they are in a dream too, maybe dreaming somewhere else in the world where Cooper wakes up as Richard and Cole, Albert, they all have different names and may not have even met each other. This makes every character in Twin Peaks another person in the Richard reality, which looks very real.
Then Audrey, Diane say they are not themselves, because maybe they realize they are in a dream too and this character in this dream feels different.
But it's strange, that if Richard is the real person, why does he think he's Cooper?
This makes Richard's reality a dream too in some way, because no dreamy magic happens, until Laura screams.
It's also possible, that she killed that guy (who could be a regular criminal or drug dealer) and the other one ran away, who she asks about, "did you find him?". Possibly she called the cops and they could be after him or he could come back after her. So she'd be happy to see the FBI, but since this FBI doesn't know what's going on here, she refuses to tell him more.
She doesn't remember her name or Leland maybe Sarah makes some of her memory come back, or she also was in the same dream Richard was in, as Cooper. We forget dreams and some things can trigger it and suddenly we remember it. Its a natural thing. When she asks whats going on, it may mean she can't believe that this guy knows Sarah too from her dream (or another life, because like Richard, she also woke up as Carrie, but doesn't realize she's Laura. Do remember, this is not the world/time where Cooper saved her in the woods, she disappeared there, maybe that's when she woke up. People disappear because they are waking up from the dream.
At the Station, the lights dim, just like in Philadelphia HQ, when Phillip disappears.
When Laura screams, the lights go off and we find out, maybe this was also a dream and they must have woken up with a shock, or, they died and ended up in the Red Room or i dont know what.
So, maybe, saying Judy in the dream wakes you up and that is why you disappear?
Wearing the ring makes you disappear and go to the Red Room and if you die you go to the Red Room, which is also a place, where, according to one idea, you will get another chance to go to the world maybe as another person and if you remember, you die and are back to the Red Room, or wake up from that life/dream?
I really want to rewatch now.
IMO, Agent Richard was so obsessed with bringing Carrie back home just to end his journey once and for all, I also think that he wanted to know who Judy was and what is going to happen
Thanks for coming back, glad I’m not the only one still looking at the mystery.
I totally agree that Cooper minus Dougie gives us Richard Coop, with the inner battle now going to Mr. C. Was Dougie lost at 430? How? Why?
Also, I thought MIKE disowned BOB by cutting off the arm. Why then would he later be helping BOB?
Yeah, I think it was Judy wanting to reunite with BOB
I have never wishes for an additional season of a tv series so much.
Glad to see you are back sir. To be honest I thought this channel was done and buried since we have not heard from you in a long time. I'm glad I was wrong.
Wow! Great analysis! I missed your videos... And I still believe we have not heard the last from Twin Peaks✨ world yet! 😉
interesting that you didn't mention the shot of Mr C burning in the black lodge. I think that is the most compelling visually indication that Mr C as an entity did not win.
I don't think that mattered after Coop changed the past.. it pointed to the whole Coop who emerged from the grove to find Diane of all people
@@aaronhussey4213 but Coop's doppleganger would have still been stuck in the black lodge then too.
Maybe what we see burning in the chair is the empty husk now that the essence of Mr. C has now merged with Cooper/Dougie Coop
Yes, absolutely.
Yesterday I had a Twin Peaks dream that absolutely got me back into twin peaks. I felt like I found a clue. I haven't been thinking a lot about twin peaks 2017 until I had this dream. Then literally 2 hours prior my awakening, Wow Lynch Wow uploads a twin peaks video! This is truly lynchian stuff
But... Is it about the bunny though?
"There they are Albert!" Holy shit David Lynch cracks me the fuck up. Gordon Cole is probably my favorite Twin Peaks character.
Great video! I was just thinking about re-watching one of your videos, and then this pops up the same day. Your editing, writing, and diction are all great and getting better. The way you juxtaposed disparate clips to give evidence to your theories is very effective. Just as effective is your plain, yet funny, recounting of events. It may not seem very impressive to summarize a story, but it's not something everybody can do.
I hope you continue to make videos, because you're very good at it, and it's always a pleasure to get more David Lynch media. (Your videos about other subjects are also quite good)
Oh how I've missed your entertaining, thoughtful narratives with the dramatic "meanwhiles"! Enjoyed hearing your take on the characters' motivations.
I believe there will be more Twin Peaks. I wouldn't be surprised if Frost and Lynch were already working on ideas.
I honestly think this is it for him. Based on the BTS videos, Lynch does not like the hassle of studio production even when Showtime basically gave him carte-blanhe. If we do end up getting more, it’ll probably be more of an Inland Empire-esque miniseries revolving around mostly unrelated stories.
@@tatehildyard5332 I'm not sure about that. Lynch did directly state that he has some ideas based on Laura Palmer's missing diary page. And friction on set happens all the time with just about every director on every production.
Tate Hildyard - Sadly, I must concur.. for a few reasons:
1) As you mentioned , it’s no secret that he’s long been irritated by the tight constraints and forced, rigid schedules placed upon him by corporate studio types.
2) There is also the fact that several key actors from this series have since passed away. (Albert, Log Lady, etc..)
3) Possible Political reasons: Showtime’s executives are all Trump-hating liberals, and Mr Lynch committed a “cardinal sin” in the entertainment industry. He admitted in an interview shortly after the 2016 election that President Trump “could be one of the greatest Presidents we’ve ever had...Just give him a chance...”, or something to that effect.
As soon as I read that he said that, I cringed, as I knew there would be no 4th season, at least on Showtime... I hope I’m wrong!
@@p99shooter That wasn't the full quote, “He could go down as one of the greatest presidents in history because he has disrupted the thing so much. No one is able to counter this guy in an intelligent way.” He meant that Trump showed that anybody could become president.
He's also said in a separate tweet that Trump is causing suffering, so it was more so that people only the saw the first part and blew it out of proportion without looking at the rest of it.
P.S. sorry if this is messy I suck at explaining stuff.
Damian Bomm - That sounds correct. I was paraphrasing, that’s why I said “...or something to that effect.” I couldn’t remember from which article I had read it. And yes, the first part of his comment could have easily be taken out of context.
Politics aside, I have long been a fan of Lynch’s work, and still hope there is a 4th season. If not, I will cherish the gift of Season 3.
I can't tell you how many Twin Peaks analysis videos I've watched in my time, but this sir, was a DAMN FINE Twin Peaks Analysis video. Mr. Lynch would be proud.
the KEY is, In 1989 Laura and Agent Cooper saw each other in a dream, and the "Cooper" she and Cooper himself saw in the dream was Cooper 25 years older, Laura wrote the dream in the diary before her death, addressing Agent Cooper as "an older man" and there's one page missing from her diary. The younger Cooper addresses his dream with Diane in the recorder, so Diane was his diary. In 2017 season, Diane was hidden and replaced with a tulpa.
25 years later:
Episode17: Older Cooper found teen Laura (with the help from Philip Jeffries and MIKE) in Twin Peaks to bring her home and she disappears screaming in thin air and then Cooper suddenly in the waiting room meeting older Laura.
Episode18 (Final): Older Cooper found older Laura (Carrie Page) in Texas (with the help from the Fireman) to bring her home and she screams and then everything stops.
Laura' s missing page should written : "2 :53 ...Time and time and time again" WE LIVE INSIDE A DREAM -TWIN PEAKS THE RETURN.
What Laura whispered to Cooper in 2017 season final was her MISSING PAGE, in where they would eventually meet each other outside the red room/waiting room, in some "alternate worlds". In disbelief Cooper then utters "WE LIVE INSIDE A DREAM".
So who is JUDY (the extreme negative force)? Laura IS Judy. LAURA IS THE ONE. This is why 2017 Bad Coop was after her, because BOB who is still with him wanted Laura's body & soul, according to Laura's secret diary. Whoever is after her will vanish. She uses nickname "Ms Judy" after Judy Garland for some reasons. The Fireman (electricity?) was protecting Judy. Did the Fireman turned Laura into Judy?
The WHITE HORSE means someone you have in mind the most will become something in a different & more powerful form - "the Gumm (Judy Garland's old name/self) you liked is going to be back, in style."
So halellujah come on get happy!
I think it’s possible that after Diane and Cooper crossed over in part 16, we were introduced to a whole new Cooper or “Richard”. Yes, he has elements of both Mr.C and Dougie/OG Coop, but his demeanor and actions(specifically at the diner, “eat at Judy’s”) are unlike anything we’ve seen from any version of Cooper before. Just something to think about, and something we may get more insight into if we ever get Wisteria/Unrecorded Night.
Holy hell, man. It is amazing to me that, even though you have a vastly better hold on the events of the Return than I do, even you are unclear on a lot of points. And I still feel like I had a fair handle on them anyway. This thing is a monolith to densely plotted ambiguity. We're gonna be talking this out forever. I don't know why I ever expected any different. Well done, dude. Keep em' comin'. Keep the flame burning. I'll happily keep watching.
My god... you've done it again! Excellent analysis, well worth the wait! You've given me the gift of hope for a new season and a reason to re-watch the season again.
The three Coppers are all the same man. They are aspects of the Three Pillars, each necessary to the full man. The Middle Pillar is where the calm Dale Copper resides, he pulls from both of the other Pillars to preform wisdom., the act of truth and consequence, the act of CARE.
The never-ending mystery is such a joy. Thanx for your contribution to the world of twin peaks!
hot damn. Welcome back my favourite twin peaks video essayist. i think you're in the right ballpark with this but I have a slightly different opinion. I think in order to defeat Judy, cooper had to integrate his shadow self. You can't fight darkness without embracing your own darkness. Great to mull over new theories again nearly two years after the original broadcast.
1st off great video. I really enjoyed it.
My question is how do you know Carrie Page is supposed to be the sacrifice? Maybe Cooper believes that Laura can possibly defeat her mother.
It definitely might be that. If it's not a sacrifice, it appears it's a forced confrontation. In either case, however, Cooper never gave Laura a choice about what she was up against, and even if he didn't know exactly what was going to happen, surely he knew more than he shared with Carrie.
“And the fireman rushes in from the pouring rain” very strange. Thanks for another great video.
OMG!! Hello, friend! It is yrev very good to see you again!! And it's truly a joyous occasion to see another WLW video on the Tube. I'll be back after I actually watch it; for now, I just had to say how much I missed you!!
I’d say he played his part. He needed to get the money to build the box and bring Judy to our world. So he took over the criminal underworld over the course of two and a half decades.
But did Judy win? That remains to be seen if and when the story continues.
Sarah being a vessel for Judy probably limits what she can do here, and it seems her plans were at risk once Laura was saved. This much is apparent when she started smashing her photo.
I see Coop saving Laura is the equivalent of getting the Death Star plans to Obi Wan, but they still need to blow up the battle station.
Also, the problem with saying the current Coop is an amalgamation of Dougie and Mr. C is that we are shown Mr. C burning in the Black Lodge during episode 18. That shows that not only was he returned, but that part of the timeline remains intact.
I also consider it a possibility that it wasn’t Cooper who went to fetch Laura/Carrie, but instead the new doppelgänger, and Cooper instead went to be with Janey and Sonny Jim.
Final Dossier also shows that the only major change in this new timeline is Laura’s murder is now a disappearance, and Gordon who has been implied to have certain psychic abilities was told he would remember both versions of events.
My guess is that if Laura wasn’t killed, and Ronette never being attacked, then crossing state lines to make the case a federal matter then there would be no reason for a missing person’s case to get on the FBI radar overnight.
Unless Gordon sent Dale anyway to keep too much from being changed.
👍 Thanx for the love. I’m as smitten as when Mr. X came bursting out of the kitchen and said- “We've got chicken tonight, strangest damn things. They're man-made. Little damn things, smaller than my fist - but they're NEW!
Love your videos.
All along I expected Cooper to come back and save the day. I never even considered the possibility of failure until that final unsettling scene. He went from confident leaving the hospital, "I am the FBI," to confused at the house, "What year is this." It certainly felt like a loss.
However, the lights/electricity being extinguished in the Palmer house could be seen as the death or expulsion of evil. It reminded me of the lights in the Log Lady's house growing dim when she died, only more violent. I hope this means he did succeed in some way.
Oh, I’m so glad you’re back with more!
Great to be seeing a new video from you man! Keep up the great work.
IMO - there are multiple (even competing) "two birds with one stone" depending who.. Fireman wants to destroy BOB (Freddy Hulk hand) and defeat Judy (the plan to use Richard & Linda). Mr. C wants to find Judy (box) and stay out of Lodge (Dougie/Diane toulpas); Mike wants to return Mr. C to Lodge and get close to Bob. Gordon and Agent Cooper want to defeat Judy and destroy Bob (and/or return Laura home) - (and there are other combinations...)
I agree - it took Alternate Universe Richard (a COMBINATION of White Knight Agent Cooper and Mr. C ) to finally bring Laura back home. But, it wasn't meant to be a happy reunion. It was to defeat Judy/Sarah.
Also- very minor point -- but I always found it interesting how Phyllis Hastings very clearly knew (and probably had an affair with) Mr. C when he appears at her house and kills her (even Bill Hastings said to her - "I know of one, and probably others...").
I don't know, I've always seen Richard as both good and bad coop. He saves the girl at the diner but uses methods like Mr C would. They're both in there. I think Carrie Page is the missing page as well. As far as motivations, that's totally subjective but I do believe that cooper and Mr. C were both duped at the end by Judy, maybe 2 birds with one stone is taking out both coopers to somehow save laura, maybe that's what she whispered in his ear that made him cringe.
I had been thinking the same thing. Sometimes the simplest explanation tends to be correct (Akham's Razor as explained in CONTACT, right?). I agree that Carrie Page could be a missing "page" in a Wizard of Oz dream-alternate-reality-fuzzy logic kind of way. The problem with all of these theories is that language is limited and limiting. Some things cannot be translated into words, or just/solely words. Abstract concepts, smells, memories, dream logic, other universes, other dimensions, etc. might best be described or expressed as music, or through the juxtaposition of still and moving images, or A)ll of the above, B)eyond words, C)inema, D)avid Lynch.
I dunno. If it had been Mr. C at the diner he would have just blown those cowboys’ heads clean off their necks instead of shooting them in the legs.
I honestly didn't think Cooper knew Judy would be at the palmer house. I always assumed he was just hoping to jog her memory and return her to her mother.
Wow Lynch Wow, missed your voice. Watched every one of your videos when TP S3 came out. I was at a better time in my life when I was watching TP with my ex. A million things have changed sine then and your voice is a strange reminder to that. I plan on watching TP S3 in a few months. Maybe things will be good again when I watch.
Your error in this I believe is assuming bringing Laura to Sarah means her sacrifice. After Laura died, the world became darker and darker in 25 years. Because Laura wasn't there to counteract evil (That's the reason Fireman created Laura in the first place). Cooper and Mr. C were united in the Sheriff's Department. So he had to do the same with Laura and her Doppelganger who's inhabiting Sarah. Bring them together to balance good and evil once again. He's not sacrificing Laura but merely bringing her home, bringing her to being the same Laura who has been living a double life. Her scream at the end might signify her reunion with her doppelganger.
Also I don't know how you can say Mr. C achieved complete victory with such certainty. The superimposed face of Cooper in part 17 for me was the realization of Cooper of what must happen. What he has to do. And that can be done only by Cooper whose body has been soiled by 25 years of Mr. C. Neither good (Good Cooper) nor the evil (Doppelcoop) won at the end. He just ensured that evil doesn't win, that battle of good and evil continued as before.
Watching the Return it is clear that multiple time lines are collapsing. While watching it through the first time, certain facts and details appear out of place. Cooper altered time and as such one reality is collapsing. The lodge is a fixed place in time, immovable. Serving as a junction point for all dimensional planes. For Cooper the ultimate white night move would be to prevent Laura's initial murder. But this in itself suggests that Cooper is naive about the inner workings of time. Cooper failed in the original series finale because he acted in fear. Hawk warned him that a soul that approaches the dweller on the threshold with imperfect courage will be utterly obliterated. Similar to entering non existentence. The Tibetan book of the Dead discusses false realms and realities that are created as an intermediary place for the soul. I have this impression that in the final scene, Cooper is not committing a sacrifice but is bringing Laura to a place of realization. The sound of Sarah Palmer's voice emerging suggests that Laura is a awaking in her bedroom on February 24th 1989. Time is fixed and immovable but to exit Laura needed to realize her death. In this way there is a time line where Laura went missing, where Bob murdered her and one where she was stuck unaware of either. All events needed to exist to liberate two souls. The journey acts as a figure 8, an infinite circle symbolizing the karmic wheel. All points need to exsist for the characters to actually end at the Palmer house in the end. I believe the fireman hinted at this when he says remember Richard and Linda, two birds one stone. Cooper and Mr. C as one needed to be sacrificed in order for the reality to end. The larger question is who is the dreamer? Laura or Cooper.
I had forgotten how priceless and insightful your commentary is. Gosh, how I love this show!
Interesting insights, as usual. It's always a pleasure to find you have made a new Twin Peaks video.
So good to hear from you again! I was just ITCHING for more. 😉
I got an instant case of severe goosebumps again once I heard Laura scream at 2:14.
If they were part of the same person (Innocent Coop and Mr. C), then how did Coop regain his memories and appeared before Mr. C was defeated? Legitimate question btw ^_^
The way I see it, Cooper's consciousness was still trapped in the Lodge and by sticking a fork in an outlet he was able to cheat his way back into his own world.
Good one man! I think this kinda defeats the argument. Coop was back before putting the ring on Mr.c..Its offoly weird the way he behaves in the last episode do. Maybe Mr.c did join coop, but for the First time and did win.
Thanks for this great video, i also enjoyed a rewatch last week.
Almost forgot about this channell... :-)
Definitely an interesting take backed by lots of evidence! I, too, am itching for a 4th season! Great vid!
Wow such a fascinating analysis. You really deserve more views sir!
One thing I always loved is even tho Mr C is pure alien and evil, but when it comes to how the Black Lodge works and the way of things, Mr C is just as or if not MORE confused about all of these things than Cooper is. It’s a small detail but when it comes to storytelling it is perfect
in twin peaks, nobody knows anything.
According to my friend, the brilliant Cory Kaplan, who has his own series of really excellent peaks videos on Vimeo, the “unofficial version” is the 12 episodes after David Lynch left the series. Pete’s reference to “12 rainbow trout” and the twelve trees at Glastonbury grove, are supposedly hints to this. Hence, why no elements of those episodes (Annie, etc.) seem to exist in the return or in secret history.
Interesting, but Annie was mentioned both in The Return and TFD.
Well, Annie was communicating with Laura through her dreams as noted in her diary, true. Possibly still back in the “unofficial” timeline. I haven’t read the final dossier yet (unforgivable I know 😂) but in the secret history, Norma’s file makes no mention of Annie. I believe Annie may be a being of the black lodge or the white lodge whose purpose was to lure dale back into the “real” world. What’s interesting too, is Gordon Cole’s character seems to be tied to the real life creator David Lynch. He has a dream about Monica Bellucci, someone he may know in real life. This is one of the only references to real world stars, (the only other one I can think of off the top of my head is marlon Brando in the form of one eyed jacks and Andy and Lucy’s son in the return). So anyway, if Gordon knows things that the real David Lynch knows, it stands to reason that he may know something about “the unofficial version”.
Given BOB's basic construction, I don't think "he" can ever be truly killed. He's basically the black oil from The X-Files, a show which many from Twin Peaks also worked on. Somehow, I don't think punching him in the face is going to solve the problem forever. And I was disappointed beyond words in Cooper's fate after 25 years of waiting.
Good to see you back!
I missed you my friend! Glad to hear from you ! I agree
I actually think Sarah Palmer(Judy) was the one who called Mr C.
Interesting eh.. it could work either way
The phrase "...be with BOB again" certainly narrows the list of suspects. I figure it has to be Judy, The Arm, or Leland Palmer. I don't think Leland would ever want to be with BOB again, so I'd go with one of the other two.
I just like the connection that both Mr C and Ray thought they were speaking with Phillip Jeffries, when in actuality they may have been speaking with Phillip Gerard
I think Ray actually was speaking with the real Jeffries, who admitted to calling Ray. Their coordinates match, and lead to a trap, which is in line with what he says about Jeffries having hired him and Darya to take out Mr. C. I think Mr. C was actually hearing from Judy, particularly given the line "I missed you in New York," the "you" in this instance referring to the good Coop, who is indeed narrowly missed by Judy in New York in the glass box.
@@Corn_Pone_Flicks Good point about NY.. interesting
I liked the theory, but I don't think it would really work that way. If that is Mr. C in the final scene, why is he called Richard in this reality, once the Giant said the words ''Remember... Richard and Linda" directly to the real Cooper? The final scene was all or maybe at some point ''foreseen'' by the Giant. I mean, he would know if that was Mr C or Agent Cooper, right? So my point is, Cooper began to act that way because he was deeply confused with that ''new'' reality, but he knew he had a duty to fulfill. When he gets to this new Twin Peaks, where the reality now is that Laura Palmer wasn't actually brutally murdered by her father, but just got missing, he even gets a little bit more enthusiastic, resembling a lot that old Cooper.
Good fun, as ever, but I'm struggling with the central idea here: we know that Good Coop had a plan, concocted with the Fireman, and that he followed through on that plan. Bad Coop was killed, yes, but that doesn't mean his attributes were returned to Good Coop. Effectively they were not two parts of the same being, but rather separate entities that met for the first time in the Black Lodge. So once killed, Bad Coop was either simply vanquished or perhaps returned to the Black Lodge. As for the unseen enemy of Bad Coop, indeed that was either Philip, Mike or perhaps another tulpa. Could've been Diane's tulpa too, as she didn't seem very pleased to be helping him. After all, if we take everything we see at face value, then this tulpa creation facility at the Black Lodge may have been used over and over during the intervening 25 years. Who created tulpas of whom? How many, and for what?
It seems to me like the overarching message here is to seek balance between your light and dark side. Laura and Coop were too good to know how to make peace with their shadow selves, but perhaps if they'd known how to then they could've lead lives that were more fulfilling and less mired in tragedy..?
Good to have you back.
Amazing stuff as always my friend! You'll find my thoughts in the usual places, a lot to digest!
You could be right. In other words, in the end, no matter how many good natured people are in the world, death and the mystery of what’s beyond that will always win.
how the HELL is it that this channel doesn't have more subs? always spot on with theories imo.
Wow indeed, I didn't notice that Mr. C dont want coffee or the reunited Dale attitude towards coffee, that was great. By the way I'm not sure about the sacrifice thing.
My theory, and I've seen it shared elsewhere, is that the final episode takes place in our world. The Cooper we get has reconciled the dark and light aspects of himself and emerged a realer, more regular version. The light Cooper existed in the Garden dimension which was the first two seasons of the show. The ending of the show, while many see it as a sign that Judy has been successfully trapped, was so grim and unnerving because it was commentary on the state of affairs in our own world, or more succinctly that we are living in a world gone awry after the detonation of the first atomic bomb.
Great job on this. With Lynch's later work (from say, Lost Highway on), I'm not sure if my head spins more when I don't know what's going on or when I do.
Never made the connection of Coop floating in the black box (dressed in black and white no less) to Judy floating during the birth of Bob (which is shot in black in white) until this video....Coop and Judy have their arms bent in different directions while they're floating too though. I'm sure others have noticed this. Just thought it was interesting.