We Need to Discuss
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- Опубліковано 30 вер 2024
- Link to the tweet in the video: / 1127935564274196480
Followup Video from Wolf the Red: • @TheWisdomOfOdin (Jaco...
Link to Declaration 127: www.declaration...
SPLC article on Volkism: www.splcenter....
Recognizing Fascism in Heathenry: northofannwn.w...
Heathen youtubers for you to check out:
Wolf the Red: / @wolfthered
Wind in the World Tree: / @windintheworldtree
So for this video, we're looking at The Wisdom of Odin and some statements that he has made both in the past and recently regarding Declaration 127 and the Asatru Folk Assembly, known as the AFA.
Patreon: / oceankeltoi
Twitter: / oceankeltoi
Twitch: / oceankeltoi
Instagram: / oceankeltoi
ending theme music by Karl Casey @ White Bat Audio
Wolf the Red made a followup to this video with a lot more information, turns out things are far worse than I knew when making this video. You can see his video here: ua-cam.com/video/aTRTZ0zfWz4/v-deo.html
If you think the Ancient Norse Vikings, would tolerate Transsexuals, or even Homosexuals in their ranks, you are an idiot. These people worshipped STRENGTH, the rainbow crowd would be banished from their villages, racism is normal for Non Christians, ethnocentrism is in all peoples, it not right, but it is what it is.
Ready to admit you were fooled by the covid scam yet?
Ocean I fight them! Idc about who likes me or who doesn’t! You can’t condone behavior that’s morally wrong….
@@Ruralronin Morals depend on the person
@@johnmctavish3544 ok. Doesn’t change what I said.
Note to self; Ocean has a scary mode.
And. It. Is. Awesome.
Well considered, well worded, well presented.
Thank you, Ocean.
nah. calling europein ethno things racist, is racist, you wouldnt say that about other races doing the same
@@audhumbla6927 Except you would. Paganism and Heathenry are religious in nature and not racial. We may think of it as uncommon but we don't see Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Taoism, Buddhism, ect. turning away people that aren't ethnically representative of the faiths region of origin, and the same stands for Paganism and Heathenism. The AFA is at it's core a white supremacist hate group and should be recognized as such.
@@T0B3Announc3d Ur wrong. all paganism is local and specific to its people. If a native american would say that only his people can practice his belief, you wouldnt say shit, so stop having diffrent standards for whites, thats racism. Paganism is ancestral.
@@T0B3Announc3d Judaism is the most racist religion on earth lmao.
Haitian Vodoun, Santeria, Palo Mayombe are all ancestral based faiths like Norse heathenry.
Stephen Mcnallen sounds exactly like a christian scamvangelous preacher....
Honestly, sometimes I feel like people who don’t openly condemn groups like that are worse than the groups themselves. Because they normalize that bullshit and allow it to continue.
Exactly the issue
All it takes for the triumph of evil is for good folk to do nothing
@@Project_Algiz read up on McNallen's theories on heathenry and race and come back to me
yup. dr. king’s famous letter from birmingham jail heavily condemn the white moderate, even saying that the klan and brutal cops aren’t the “true” enemies-that the people who say that they’re “politically moderate/indifferent,” the ones who say they agree with your goal but can’t support your methods, are the enemies. silence is violence.
@@Project_Algiz Shame there doesn't seem to be a forthcoming response to this post. I'm kind of new to it all, but I'd like to know what the issue with implicit or even explicit in-group preference is. As far as I see it, from this video the AFA don't seem to advocate violence towards other people. If they do, I'd very much like to be informed.
Have you tried to educate him or did we jump straight to acting like a bunch of gatekeeping Christians?
They're Christians dressing it up in weird AF anime Asatru LARP.
the pagan community should be a safe place for all people no matter your sexual orientation, gender, race, culture, or nationality. we can and all should be able to be who we are.
How is it racist to say that heathen gods are in the DNA of certain European people? Is Yahweh the Abrahamic god not in the DNA of most semitic people? Are the Loa not in the DNA and ancestry of sub-saharan African traditions and their diaspora?
Uh yeah all of that would be not only racist but reductive mockery of the Gods.
@@OceanKeltoi how? Explain.
@@lk1590 i’ve gone into this in other videos. But essentially it limits the Gods in favor of poor politics, which is just a mockery of the Gods. This all boils down to spiritual protectionism in the form of identity politics, which is just racism.
The only problem I have with this video is it’s fishing,and you are making it all about he had to make his thoughts or feelings known for your benefit and your feelings,if I was Jacob I would ignore you because it’s a religion channel and obviously you want it to be a political channel,or you could be mad that he makes more money then you and in a shorter period of time became more popular and better well known,either way you should keep your thoughts and feelings to yourself because I ignore the racism and the AFA and my feelings on the politics shouldn’t matter to others just like yours don’t.
The thing that really bugs me about the Asatru Folk Society (aside from the obvious stuff) is their implied anti-adoption stance. Of all people, I feel the Norsemen should understand that family is more than blood.
@Gerrit Todd I mean adopting Loki was canonically a pretty poor decision.
@@cbo1244 I'm talking about the original Eddas and Sagas.
Bruh literal Norse/Germanic clans were all almost exclusively blood relatives/direct family what're you talking about? I mean unless you wanna' count slaves as adoption lmao.
I strongly agree, as and Icelander I was raised in a society that was (and still sometimes is) very conservative when it came to the tradition and values of our ancestors and one of the most cherished and sacred values is: Family is sacred. No matter if some one was related in blood or not, if you loved them like family, treated them like family and viewed them as family. Then they are family, and if someone dishonored or wronged one member of the family, it was viewed as a dishonor and wrong doing on all of them. Why do you think the sagas have so many blood feuds going on.
To quote Dom Torreto,"Family."
So, new pagan here. Only reason I know of WoO is because the YT algorithm put him front and center in my feed. I personally found him a little too, woo woo for lack of a better term. Some information seemed ok but I kept searching being new to paganism and also being someone that likes to read and absorb information. As I've learned more I think WoO is just doing this for cash. Which by itself, ok whatever, but coupled with the AFA stuff and the seemingly predatory behavior of new pagans who are vulnerable as new pagans and will latch onto whatever "nice" face gets presented in front of them. And I think thats what this dude is doing, presenting a nice face and exploiting the vulnerable to get money while hiding his toxic behavior.
Edit: I want to say thank you Ocean for being a reliable source of information. I like the historical approach of what I have seen so far. I feel I have some differing political views but nothing that couldn't be talked over and I get the feeling you'd be down for that if we were in a situation we were talking one on one about it. Regardless, I appreciate your work. What I have seen so far.
Thanks ocean ,someone needed to tell him his views are not our views, and he really wasn't needed in the internet anyway he had nothing too teach ,no wisdom of Odin to pass on
I always felt like he was a bit show off like and i wasn't sure what i thought abt him but after this video I've made up my mind I'm glad i found ocean first
He literally has no connection to the afa, also im guessing you havent listened to his podcast he uses alot of the donations and puts it forward to buying land for a hall.
@@crushinnihilism “you’re a pagan role playing as a Viking” simply means someone who is a pagan, which can refer to a broad spectrum of different faiths, is cosplaying as a Viking, which for the Norse, was a job.
So essentially you’re saying “you’re a non Christian cosplaying as a Viking, just be atheist like a rational person.” Which I assume isn’t the message you were trying to send.
Im a former atheist who converted to Norse paganism. I know the general atheist view of reality(obviously there’s some differences between people since atheism is not a monolith). I know that trying to convince you of the validity of my faith is a pointless endeavor, so I will not try.
Instead, I’ll say this: this comment is no different from an evangelical Christian telling us to believe what they believe. Is that the energy you want to bring to a mature discussion?
@@crushinnihilism ah, my apologies. That comment looked suspiciously evangelical so I didn’t realize you weren’t being antagonistic
Welp, time to unsub
Late catching on?
@@OceanKeltoi Yup, I use to think you were wise, this video showed I was in-fact a fool indeed, a fool for listening to you.
And just for clarification, I don't particularly follow WoO aside from being subscribed and occasionally watching a video, I don't really care for him, it was your takes and opinions that i disagree with, very much disagree with as a matter of fact, so I'm doing us both a favour and leaving because there is nothing of value for me here, and you gain nothing from me being here either.
Consider me doing us both a favour
As someone who's recently come into exploring this path, I found him first.
I appreciate you bringing this forward.
With my mixed family, I am mad for not realizing this sooner.
I found him yesterday. Whoops.
I am in a similar situation
Means something to me on my journey. Then I edited to add one missing letter and lost it. And thus is how it works in what we call life. The quest for the unobtainable...perfection...typically leads to going from being as close as one can get w/o being to rolling one's ass into another zip code.
Sometimes I wonder if I am replying to the intended recipient!?
With a mixed family you've got bigger problems.
This is a pretty unsophisticated criticism, consisting mostly of canned Woke clichés and "None of my friends likes you"-style groupthink.
A small example, but claiming "We believe gender is not a social construct" is _transphobic_ is highly intellectually disingenuous, but sadly typical social media fodder. That perspective is simply the other side of the opinion scale on a controversial socio-biological claim. Are you thus claiming that only one opinion (conveniently, your own) is acceptable on this matter?
Indeed the whole (fill-in-the-blank)phobic construction has been widely debunked as a low-brow shame tactic, which functions essentially to bully a point through by claiming any who believe contrary are irrationally fearful (the literal definition of phobic). As in, "I think maintaining a healthy body weight is a good life decision." "Oh, so you're fat-phobic." "Oh okay, you're right, I don't believe that anymore, thanks."
Also, weird take calling the AFA _misogynistic_ (yet another typical sound-byte) when the post you are referencing on-screen literally says "We celebrate our feminine ladies." Doesn't sound much like hatred or prejudice toward women to me...
I could go on, but...well one more: have you not noticed how people like yourself seem so bothered that an organization celebrates white lives and indigenous white culture, yet oddly never seem to mind literal advertising campaigns, Netflix channels, Google themes etc. that proudly proclaim the "Beauty and power of black voices", raising up "Black perspectives, black lives, black stories" etc?
Don't reflexively dismiss that double-standard. Why is one more acceptable to you than the other? Especially when these groups like the AFA are advancing an indigenous religion that was virtually wiped out by the Christian church. Heathenism _is_ a marginalized indigenous religion. Lumping them in with mean ol' slave-owning Whitey on the basis of skin color alone, I imagine is the reason. Yet it wasn't Pagan Icelanders owning slaves; indeed, they were more-often captives and slaves themselves thanks to the Barbary Pirates and the Ottoman slavers.
Underrated comment.. A lot of Oceans followers don't have critical thinking.
@@BlackDoomsOpinion its because they are all counter-wank redditors who aren't actually interested in debunking folkish germanic polytheism without incurring the word "racism."
@@rapecel "Counter-wank redditors" lmao
@@BlackDoomsOpinion Sensational correctionism would probably better fit the "beliefs" that these supposed polytheists assume. It is a derivation of moral correction espoused by Christian theology, and is, in my opinion, utterly alien to germanic thought.
Oh look, a hug box
We are open and accepting heathens unless of course you disagree with our liberal talking points.
amen
Quit it with your belly aching.
I've never considered myself to be a FAN of WoO, but I subscribed to his channel and watched most of his videos. The bigger his community grows, the more it gives off the feeling of turning more and more into a cult. I wasn't able to put my finger on it, but watching his content gave me very mixed feelings. After watching this video, I will unsubscribe WoO immediately and will share this message. This is so so so important! Thank you for putting this together!!
Totally agree.... only watched a couple of his videos... and just couldn't put my finger on what bothered me... but needless to say...don't watch his videos anymore... 🤷♀️
Yeah me too. The more I watched the more culty it got.
He’s giving me the vibe of someone who’s never belonged and probably was bullied and now overdoes it and gets high on power, I can’t take him seriously or respect him. Meanwhile ocean comes off as an amazing and respectable man just through his intellect and wisdom, he doesn’t have to be flashy or anything.
Isn't all religions a technical form of a cult tho, not starting an argument with anyone just my view on it
@@Cathy1864 Yeah gonna have to disagree with you there he had 2 females getting married at one of his gatherings .. but this video just seem to attack his choices of freedom like the Covid crap .. if your worried about Covid stay home .. Sorry but seems here Ocean is just punching down and twisting his words.. could Jacob have worded it better sure but .. Gender identity isn't fluid your one or the other that's biology ..
I am a Black American veteran in his 50's that has always since I was a child viewed the All-Father as the face of God.
I am the 5th generation of a family of Soldiers that has served in all our wars since the civil war.
After watching your video's and hearing the wisdom of your thoughts I have decided to subscribe to your channel.
Hail, and know you are, without question, most welcome in this faith
Odin in called the All-Father, not the Some-Father, after all.
Ooga booga
@@hippyjoe Booga ooga. lol
Warrior family u have.
You are the king of soy in the pagan community
More of a chicken and rice guy tbh
Don’t need to her about woke BS.
This isn’t “WOKE” snowflake.
If only Japanese can truly be Shinto, why shouldn't only Germanics be Asatru?
When he says he doesn't 'openly' support them makes it sound like he's slipping them twenties under the table or something.
"i don't OPENLY support them guys! not OPENLY!"
*asks steven mcnallen about how to celebrate holidays on twitter*
It's just a serpents way of saying "your too stupid to read between the lines"
saying you don't openly support someone kind of means you openly support them though ...
like, it implies you covertly support them, but obviously you just told everyone.
Well, he was a used car salesman before he got this gig, so...
@@phyllisdicks9830 I read that as "used car swordsman" XD
This seriously makes me angry. I'm a naturalist atheist. But that's just me. I was SO close to being a full blown anti-theist. I wanted to say "all religion is bad. Nothing good comes from it!" But then I found you. Aliaki. Wolf the red. Calon. And it softened me. It helped me. And I love watching ya'lls content. I love learning about what you believe. You've thought through it, you've discussed it, and discovered something. I know we'll differ on just what you discovered but you have it! And it occasionally makes me pause and think "you know, there might be something to this whole god(s) thing after all."
But folkists, and WoO and the AFA come in and try really hard to destroy that. They make it SO easy for an angry atheist to point to them and say "see? Paganism isn't any better than Christianity or Islam! Paganism still makes people stupid sheep that want to kill in the name of their religion too!!"
These people and their actions are not only dangerous to social progress. Not only create fertile ground for potential violence. Not only dangerous to frith and pagan unity. It is also dangerous to the growth of paganism itself. For both outreach so paganism as a whole will be considered and respected, but also bringing new pagans into a safe and accepting religion where they feel comfortable and free to be who they are with the blessing of their gods.
I am certain that if I found a folkist or WoO instead of you, I'd be an angry anti-theist today. And that's not OK. I don't know how much I can do or how much it matters, but you have my support in getting rid of these people.
No frith with folkists.
I just read this comment and damn. This hit me. Thanks for your words.
@Trinity M you must be new. The "violent sheep" comment in reference to the Abrahamic religions is a common argument used by anti-theists to try to discredit religion. It is common, and thus well known, especially in the atheists spheres. (A place Ocean frequents.) I do not agree with that take as I am not an anti-theist. And obviously, I didn't exactly go into the nuance of the argument because frankly, it didn't matter. The point wasn't that the argument was valid its that anti-theists will use folkism to try to strengthen the argument.
If you want to talk legitimacy of religion, we can do that. If you want to talk about harm that religion does, or harm that people do in the name of religion, we can talk about that too. But that's not the conversation being had.
The conversation being had is simply that folkism gives anti-theists more ammunition to be dicks to religious people and I don't like that. So folkism needs to not. Hence no frith with folkists.
No matter where you go and no matter what group you associate with at some point you are going to run into bad people because there are good and bad in all groups. That is something you should probably keep in mind. The best thing you can do is find a group of people you can stand and hang out with them. You don't all have to think and believe the exact same things. I don't trust groupthink and hive minds myself, but as long as there is respect and open, honest communication that is the important thing.
@Trinity M Buddy. As a member of the Faith, I just have this to say: read through the post again. Properly, this time.
I went into this video as WoO fan, but after this, I sadly can't watch and support Jacob any more. I will say, He has some good videos, But he has some shitty associations that I simply can't stand by or even try to justify. This is very disheartening information to hear.
I’m the exact same as you, but glad I know this info now so I don’t waste my time as a new pagan
I'm in the same boat. I even recommend him and I've just finished sharing this video with those people and hope they follow suit and stop support him.
Same. I've been on this path for 11 years and stumbled across Jacob's work a few months ago. I've watched the majority of his videos but had not listened to the podcasts, and I am not active on twitter, so I missed this troubling information.
I'm sure Ocean ended up in my recommends because of WoO, and I'm wary of new sources but his "Viking puppers" video won me over :D Yes, Fenrir is a good doggo. I've since subscribed here and been exploring the channel - and honestly I've actively avoided this video while I determined whether I felt I could trust Ocean's content. Here I am, and I am shocked and dismayed. I have enjoyed Jacob's conversational style and the relative safety and casual nature of his video topics (something I can watch without feeling the overwhelming urge to take notes). Not sure I'll stay there much longer, at minimum I won't be recommending his work to anyone until he speaks out on this topic
Why didn't you just reach out yourself and ask him instead of posting all these videos? This is cringe . Focus on good content about Heathenism instead of this cheesy reporting.
Or you could let people do what they want
@@alibolink0719 In this day and age? No, we have to herded like cattle to groupthink
@@alibolink0719 but pitbull1975 is just critiquing Ocean like how Ocean critiqued The Wisdom Of Odin, unless critiquing is also the same as not letting people do what they want in wich case why is Ocean allowed to keep people from doing what they want to do and pitbull1975 isn't.
as a dane, i find this butchering of my and my ancestors belifs wildly offensive to me. (dane, from denmark, in scandinavia) if any was wondering. good vid my dude
As a fellow Dane, I wholeheartedly agree. Nothing in the sagas or Eddas mention Volkish rhetoric. There are many archeological finds of Viking Corpses of other ethnicities, meaning being a Viking was more so cultural than ethnic.
As an American who just started practicing.. my sincerest apologies for my shithead country. I wanted to connect with my ancestors and find some sense of identity outside of my Christian upbringing and I’ve been utterly distrusted learning how it’s practiced here in the states. I live in the northwest, in one of the most progressive and accepting cities in the country, and everyday I see ravens. I do not think this is a coincidence. I believe the Aesir are with those who worship regardless of anything else.
@@neurohackstv5723 not to mention that there have been graves found with people who were at very least gender nonconforming if not somewhere on the transgender/non-binary spectrum.
@The Bearded Dragon gender nonconforming just refers to people who do not conform to cultural gender norms, so like a woman doing an assumed male task like joining a raiding force, they are still women. We call them tomboys nowadays. No need to be offended, it's not a new idea.
Here I was quoting the interpretations of grave goods by professional archaeologists in reference to female warriors being explicitly buried with grave goods associated with male warriors and not shield maidens and regular female warriors. There have also been viking graves of non-combatant males buried in female clothing and with female-associated goods. These people may have just been defying gender roles or they may have been what we call transgender now. There have also been rare graves associated with individuals with a mix of gendered grave goods. We also know from text that Loki's gender descriptors and pronouns change when in a female form, indicating explicite gender fluidity, compared to when Thor disguised as a woman, but still referred to explicitly as male.
It is hard to say much on people being explicitly transgender, nonbinary, or gender fluid, especially as these explicit descriptors are recent. There is an enormous body of evidence of what we call transgender and nonbinary people existing throughout human history in non-viking cultures. Gender variance was generally better tolerated in pre-Judeo-Christian cultures. Because of this, gender variance and gender role defiance was demonized in Judeo-Christian holy texts. Generally, if a group is not othered or demonized, humans don't come up with special words for them, since they're seen as unusual parts of the norm.
(Also, the exisrence of transgender people is not a load of bull. It is well documented that there are metabolic and physical brain morphology differences between pretreatment transgender and cisgender people, biology says non-cisgender people are real).
I know that the existence of transgender people is the hot new culture war, but that doesn't mean that we might possibly have existed among the viking population.
@The Bearded Dragon oh, yes, women serving in the Marines would be considered gender-nonconforming as it's not commonly expected for a woman to enter military service, and usually actively discouraged. This has nothing to do with her brain's gender or her instinctual sexual preferences.
I’m truly gladdened to know I have a brother who thinks like me. Just found you! Already a fan brother.
Agreed. It's really nice to hear all this.
i agree
@@aaronhuntsman7176 yes? What do you want?
The pomposity in this video is cringe worthy. You talk like you're the pope of paganism, with your meter and dramatic pauses, but you're just a dude with a Mjölnir pendent and a beard like the people you're criticize. So, you don't agree with him or the afa. Cool. They don't agree with you either. The world keeps on spinning.
This is a great video especially since YT pushes his videos on Norse paganism. I recently started looking into Norse paganism and watching some WoO videos did nothing sit right with me. Coincidentally afterwards I came across Aliakai and her video which confirmed my suspicions.
Hey, I've got a similar experience. Its like a BS detector went off listening to him.
I recommend downloading the app "Pagan and Witches Amino" its helped me.
Alikais video on this subject was recommended to me like right after a video I watched of him disturbed me. The gods know what they’re doing.
Yeah his vids seemed kinda cool at first but the more I watched the more something has started to feel a little off. At first I thought he was just a bit of a show-boating type, and he seemed maybe a bit arrogant. I had not gotten to any of his videos where he said any of the stuff sited in this video though, and just..... wow. I'm not familiar with Aliakai, I'll have to take a look at her vids.
I watched one full episode and a couple segments of his channel and had too much cringy creepy crawlies to go any further, not to mention he just sounds like a dick.
So is he a fascist? Now I like him more
lol, me too
At ocean keltoi, I'm curious if you openly condemn similar mindsets from the other ethnic branches of the world tree... what is your opinion of obviously racist spiritual groups such as, say, the black hebrew isrealites? Or, as another example, the recognized terrorist (religious) organization that was duly elected to ruling office in Palestine, Hamas?
I mean yeah. Not a fan of either, obviously. But also what on earth are you doing asking this on Christmas day? This was very weird. Merry Christmas, the Black Hebrew Israelites engage in antisemitic conspiracy theories and fabricated history 🎄
No frith with Nazis!
I really hope this religion doesn't go full on political. Dont want to sit with that crap
Yeah politics is bad. Never do anything political.
@@OceanKeltoi This is political, your stance is very left wing
@@fritjofvalerijs800 So being open to all peoples without hate or prejudice is only left wing? Are you saying that all the people on the right are bigots?
@@satyrsak no Fritjof Valērijs is saying that the video contains a left wing stance in the sense that the left wing often also uses the idea that not speaking about something is the same as embracing it and the video contains stances on LGBTQ+ community that are leftwing. At least thats the left wing stances i could could gather from the video.
My only question, is why is it a bad thing that some people still want white people? Why do we have to conform to the new “social norm” and have multiracial families? There’s nothing wrong with it at all, someone’s race shouldnt dictate who loves them but if he is right, that white people are starting to dwindle and aren’t keeping our population numbers the same then are we not going to put ourselves at risk of persecution? Look at the United States right now, the socioeconomic support for white people is far less than that of any other race. I’ve been denied from colleges before just because I didn’t meet the criteria for my race. Even in the military all it takes is one person to claim you made a racist statement and you can lose your career and possibly even face jail time even if you never made such a statement
OK could someone answer this question for me! I live with a Christian and a Jewish roommate I've had many conversations about religion and recently we've had quite a few conversations about the AFA due to them being in the news more. My Jewish roommate lived in Israel for many years and she had an interesting perspective on the AFA saying that you can't truly follow "Asatru" unless you are of northern European decent.. she pointed out that many Jewish people look down or don't really consider you a true member of the Jewish tribe if you convert because membership in the tribe is solely based of your decent. She also brought up how Hasidic Jews generally don't allow marriage outside of the tribe. She also said that she believes she has a deeper connection with her god because she can trace her family back to the 12 original tribes. So my question is this..why is it acceptable for other religions or cultures to allow or not allow conversion based on ethnicity or decent but when it comes to a Northern European religion it is considered deplorable. If you are Jewish or Muslim you can usually trace your heritage back to the 12 tribes or Muhammad (ie the Saudi royalty) however many northern Europeans are also able to trace their family back to the royal family's of northern Europe (ie the Danish and Swedish royalty trace their liniage back to King Gorm the Old who claimed decent from the Volsung tribe which in turn we are told by the Saga of the Volsungs was decended from Odin.) So again where do we draw the line with what is OK and what is not acceptable?
You should have heard the non sense the Southern Baptist Church taught back in the 1980's regarding the 12 tribes, the lost tribes, and how the children of Noah populated the world. Such as the Danes are the descended of the tribe of Dan. Young Earth creationist fluff.
Your Jewish friend doesn’t really represent the Jewish ideology, it sounds like Zionist rhetoric to me, especially likely if she was raised in the Israeli school system where they teach the racist genetic narrative, I should know I spent time there growing up. The Ashkenazim (Slavic Jews) have used that narrative against the Mizrahim (Arab Jews) to claim ethnic superiority and establish segregated schools and neighborhoods.
But there’s a reason why there’s these different “Jewish ethnic groups”, because they’re so heavily mixed with other non Semites, like Russian (Slavic) Jews, Amazigh (indigenous North African) Jews, Kurdish (Indo-Iranic) Jews, etc. these people are not even related to each other anymore. Only your mother has to be Jewish for you to be recognized, and it’s mostly the orthodox that still practice that, converts are more accepted now.
The Jewish law isn’t about genetics being passed down, Judaism allows for lots mixing, it’s about upholding the cultural and religious traditions, which is a duty allocated to the mother.
Many people in Europe have female Jewish ancestors, I’m German and I have them way back in my matrilineal ancestry, so by the law I could be recognized as Jewish if I wanted to, even though no one has been Jewish in my family for over 200 years. And even my best friend is half Polish (Jewish mother) and Irish, her synagogue recognizes her. And her husband is a heavily mixed Peruvian, so by Jewish law their children will be recognized as Polish-Irish-Spanish-Scottish-Quechua-Italian Jews, and will most likely be offered a “birthright” trip to Jerusalem even though they don’t have any ethnic Semitic ancestry or if they do it’s about 1% now. They would hold more genetic claim to Machu Picchu and Brú na Bóinne than to Jerusalem.
That whole genetic thing is a more recent racist “one drop rule” narrative adopted by zionists to validate the colonization of the Fertile Crescent and to treat native Semitic Jews (such as Syrian Jews) like second class citizens and appropriate their specific cultures as their own. It’s equivalent to Euro-Americans being like “I’m 1/36th Cherokee so therefore I get to wear a Navajo ritual headdress”.
Thank you for coming to my tedtalk
@@BunsBooks "Polish-Irish-Spanish-Scottish-Quechua-Italian-Jews" 🤣 excellent! Thanks for the reply I really wanted a differing opinion!
Because the white race is weak and being abused because of their weakness and naivety. Im Ulster Scottish and grew up in LA. There wasn't a day that went by where I wasn't reminded of my race. The most fervent antiracist "conservative" republicans who refuse to see race and to stick up for their own people seem to very densely populate the midwest and rural 99% white communities here in America. It is almost as it they have had it easy and havent had neighbors r*ped and killed.
Be it Odin or Christ. Both better send me to hell for not fighting for my people.
Because there is a war on whitey. Be ashamed and breed out your race.
Stop virtue signalling
I recently converted to from atheism to Norse Paganism, and I’ve found myself on WoO’s channel a lot because I am still a beginner when it comes to the actual practices of the faith. Thank you for preemptively stopping me from going down the wrong path
Lol. Doesn’t mean he’s a bad person.
@@FableIVGaming It does, softy.
@@Dice_roller So to be a good person you have to be a Progressive and agree with every single tenet of that faith? Lol it's absolutely hilarious that you far leftists claim to be "pagan", actual pagans from the past would eat you for breakfast. Figuratively speaking of course, I'm not saying they were cannibals, I just mean they would not recognize you as kin. They would be disgusted by many of your beliefs and practices, and you would be disgusted by nearly all of theirs.
You did not convert to Norse Paganism. You already follow a religion. If I insulted Odin, you wouldn't care at all. But if I said something about race and IQ, you would be horrified and attack me as though I just blasphemed your god. That's because you are already a zealous acolyte in the Cult of Woke.
Thank you for this eye opening WoO was the first hethan content channel I came across well I was referred to them by a friend. Anyway I'm glad to be here to experiance your content. I find the structer of your videos and the way you speak to be quite captivating and well thought out and organized. Thank you for the information ocean.
This honestly breaks my heart. I thought I finally found a group like his community to worship and practice with and I guess I didn't. Being in his discord and all that I still felt like I didn't fit in and some of the things being said gave a cult like feel to it. The group gatherings, the membership, a fundraiser for a hall, and so much more. Don't get me wrong I would love to attend those but it felt like a mini hierarchy was forming and it felt weird to me. It felt like I was back in the Mormon church, paying to worship and exist with my heathen family. Thank you for this and I'm kicking myself for not seeing this video sooner
Hierarchy is not an issue, that is a fundamental, meaning inescapable, part of all society. The issue is what that hierarchy is based on.
@@patrickbertlein4626im always suspicious when someone says hierarchy isn't the problem lolol you're gonna need to clarify what you mean because all hierarchies have the potential of tyranny built into the framework
@@eminentbishop1325 hierarchies are a natural part of any social structure, even if implicit. Yes, it has potential for tyranny, but it also brings order to chaos. Nothing is absolutely good or bad. There is a right dose for everything, and hierarchies are no different. A healthy hierarchy benefits everyone, while an unhealthy one turns into tyranny indeed
@@victor_bueno_br hierarchies are not natural. Its a conceptualization of reality, not reality itself. What people define as hierarchies is just a means to organize information into a definitional framework, which in itself it can limited i.e. you defining it as a natural process when hierarchy isnt something that exist in the natural world. Its not as if animals purposely organize themselves into these systems. The systems are just tools we use to simplify complex sets of data and the hard truth is that the spectrum of truth is far wider than it can intuitively seem
@@victor_bueno_br but i should say i dont necessarily disagree. Social systems seem to organize along those lines. How natural that is or a representation of a good for society i think is that gray area of discussion
I used to follow Jacob when he first started the channel. He gave a warm welcome to the new people coming into heathenry while also putting a smile on my face.
It hurts to have to turn my back on the dude but well, Cult leader vibes.
All though I do hope he manages to see past his blindness as well as the toxic people around him.
You can call them toxic but atleast they stay in their lane . I find woke people patrolling and complaining about everybody else's opinions toxic. Waste of time.
@@OriginalFallofMind
Woke people don't "patrol", they call out the hate where they see it on their path. Being woke simply means to be aware of social issues, so proudly, that is what I am. If your opinions are called out as toxic, you are probably hurting someone.
Wisdom Of CryptoFolkism
The entire lore is blatantly racist.
@@Arnaere No.
@@satyrsak It's implicitly racist when it constantly glorifies blue eyes and red or golden hair. It's explicitly racist in stories like the one in the Heimskringla where a chief is born black and treated like he's cursed. His own mother does not love him. At the conclusion of the story he is turned white and his people love him again.
>believes in ethnic religions
>angry when someone mentions they are ethnic
OK, I've got an honest hard question... I've never been to a group blot, but I've been a practicing pagan for about 2yrs now. Why can't all of us just be fine with our ancestors? Why do my "white" germanic ancestors matter, to anyone else but me? If your "black", are your ancestors not just as important to you? Whatever you are, wherever your from, is important, because it's what you come from. Can we not all respect that and praise that idea. And give reverence to all ancestors? Why does one have to be more "true" than the other to some people?? Why the comparison? You do you and I do me, and we respect each other when we meet for dinner or blót, what's so hard about that?
BTW, I think mostly ancestors matter most when you know/remember them specifically. I do not know King Harold, other than stories, so... what would this matter if I was relation without knowledge of that ancestor specifically?
I think the problem here is even AFA say you do you and i do me, they do not seek to impose their worldview on anyone but themselves, they just want to remain separate and isolated like many faiths, especially Native American ones which were a big influence on McNallen. This video condemning them however is trying to force other people to conform with their beliefs and worldview
@@fritjofvalerijs800 I agree. If a bunch of people want to form a spiritual or religious group that excludes certain people, ok; let them. As long as they're not forcing people to join them and don't abuse or attack others, I see no problem. I feel that attacking these sort of groups only validates, in their eyes, any concerns or fears they may have. If they want to separate themselves from others, peacefully, let them. In a way, making videos condemning a group I probably would not have found out about otherwise is just free advertising for them.
@@kalinora3901 Interesting view which should be discussed at a table, because I do see your point as well as I can understand ppl feeling threatened by this group. I'm with you though that I wouldn't have heard about the AFA most likely without some of Ocean's videos and me personally, I couldn't care less about them.
The issue with this is when honoring your ancestors turns into thinking that your skin color makes you superior to every different skin color out there. Groups like the AFA with racially exclusionist philosophies rarely stop at 'merely' being exclusionist, and often act as a foundation to more extremist views and possible activities; it's not a coincidence that many members of the AFA have also been found to be members of more radical Volkish and supremacist organizations (and are a big reason for the rise of heathen symbols among neo-Nazi and fascist groups).
I was in his discord for awhile and the vibe was.... really very weird. Being female in that space was a bad experience.
He claims to have had a vision of Odin telling him to "gather the folk." 🙄 Yeah, ok, guy
His name is Jacob. Idk why that makes me laugh as hard as it does.
@@proudsaiyanprince2651 I looked up what Jacob meant as a name and now I'm laughing too! :D
heaven forbid someone has a religious experience when practicing a religion. you're just an atheist LARPer.
Yeah, its funny
Bigotry is objectionable however there is nothing wrong with expressing concern about how Europeans are losing their homelands
Ummm "the afa keep to themselves" not really, had M.N and members of the afa attack my Celtic group on fb because we openly welcome gays
Someone doesn't know their own mythology then.
For example when Loki turned himself into a female horse and gave birth to Sleipner, Odin's eight-legged horse. It doesn't seem very LGBT-unfriendly.
@@georgegrimnirsson2017 well, it's a social group and have a structure so... what's the problem? Of course it's different from having a real life group but it's still a way of studying and socialize.
Hey, just wanted to say don't worry about that troll trolling your group structure. They probably have no social life to speak of at all 😂
@@1987ashgriff Agreed.
@@aidanpaim805 Just was going to ask if you had joined Ocean's discord yet, I'd like to know more about this group.
I was apart of WoO patreon and discord for a few months before one day I cancelled everything and left without a word. I have never personally spoken to Jacob but there is a vibe in his groups and with his content that is very specific. I felt like I had to follow Jacob's path of paganism to fit in. If you aren't in the clique then what you have to say is overlooked and I was left feeling degraded and confused. Luckily I've been sucked into spiritual blackholes before and pulled myself out pretty easy but I can imagine that new pagans and lonely practitioners really let this type of thing flood their mind. It's a sticky situation that's for sure
Ah, people who believe that the All-Father is rather the Some-Father.
Yep sadly
@L7M What are you trying to imply? Be exact.
Using the SPLC as guidance is a major fault line.
Man keep up the great work. WoO pushes innacurate information which took me months to find out by myself. I applaud you and Aliakai for being courageous for speaking the truth. Wassail!
Which "inaccurate information" exactly?
@@alfredharrison597 pretty much everything. All the information he quotes from either come from outdated books with outdated innacurate information or is his personal take on aspects of the faith that don't match to what the history and texts state. And worse he is racist.
@@luchadorelmachomalo Oh no not the 'R' word. Pretty much everything in heathenry and paganism is peoples interpretations and opinions on text that even the oldest, were second and third hand accounts of stories
Honestly just came across your channel a while back, and I was interested in this topic and learning more about this faith. However just seems the more I watch(i have only seen a handful of your vids) the more I feel like its just really a mask for left leaning political propaganda and their ideologies. I haven't seen a video about WHAT is practiced, just anti racism, differences in Asatru, Norse Pagan, or Heathenry, and a few other vids as that is what YT is just choosing for me.
I don't really understand what this religion is about except all the political statements(indirectly implied) in your videos I have seen. Just kinda turns me off from learning more. I don't want to be political or involved, just find something I can practice and agree with without having politics be involved. Want to stay true to the principles of old and not have to care about modern adaptations I guess.
Again if you have any vids specifically about history of the religion and related content I haven't seen it. I shall try to look for those. I am still interested in learning more about it all and why Asatru has been condemned(for intellectual purposes). Hopefully I can find what I am looking for, without the need to talk about racism and gender in every other sentence(I don't come to YT to hear about it, I get enough from my brother and news networks).
If you want to learn about what Norse paganism/heathenism/whateverism is all about, in simple, fairly approachable language, look up Dr Jackson Crawford. If there was a way to direct message me, I'd invite you to do that (if you know how, then go for it). I'll talk about what I know with you til we're blue in the face; I don't give a damn about people's politics anymore (everyone is wrong about *something*, so whatever). I'm also tired of politics coming up, and there definitely seems to be this vibe of "iNcLuSiViTy YaY" out there and it's getting kind of old; why can't people just *be* and hammer on somewhere?
Anyway! Sorry for the ramble; it's been a long day. Havamal, Prose and Poetic Eddas, Dr Jackson Crawford, May K Hella (both are on UA-cam, and I don't think they bother with even vaguely political stuff).
I didn't know racism was political
@@alibolink0719 When a certain political group of people vehemently use it as a defense mechanism and use it as a label, it becomes political. Not difficult to wrap your head around.
@@MrComputerCoder Oh no I agree. But racism as a concept isn't inherently political
Just ran across one of these videos at random on YT thought it was interesting and wanted to know more. So I clicked the icon next to the name Ocean Keltoi which took me to his specific YT channel. From there I watch the vids I find interesting, informative, &&/|| entertaining!
This is the first time I've heard of any of these people or the AFA. Then again I'm British and my focus has been on reading the eddas and learning about the Gods
Hey wookie, I'd stick to that ,these organisations are just nuts
@The Wookie
Good focus, my friend! That's my own, as well.
Same bro because when things become huge and organized things branch out and big problems occur just keeping doing what your doing be yourself by yourself is the best way.
This is the first instance of the AFA being brought to my attention as well and I am deeply disturbed that they have such an appaling view of this kind. Honestly I was unaware that issues of this kind existed in heathen society.
@@sabeydanielgmailcom I'm kinda the same. I was aware that the NatSocs and WS had seized some symbols and used the Gods in "heretical ways" but I wasn't aware of a formal organisation doing it until I watched this
My first introduction to Heathenry was WoO(Yes, I know he and his lot are Asatru) then I got a good feel for his community and dipped. I found your videos shortly after and they are quite helpful.
You leftists are so dramatic.
Good grief, you idiots don’t understand what this situation actually represents & means, at all.
@@Dice_roller Who are you referring to?
@@Dice_roller its been 2 months and you still cant debate MrDarth lol
@@Carl_ATHF I don’t have too dummy, the video speaks for itself. Lmao.
Hey all, what are some non-problematic Heathen UA-camrs y’all would recommend? There’s Ocean and Wolf, obviously, but for people new to Heathenry (Hi everyone), it can be kind of difficult to sort out the bad apples...
@Kyladescope I can vouch for Wind in the Worldtree personally. He's a good man and extremely intelligent and thoughtful in his observations.
Arith Härger
Sarenth Odinsson is good too.
Skaldi is a good one
As mentioned by others Arith Harger has great factual historical info, and he has openly addressed many of the issues talked about here regarding ancient Norse attitudes on homosexuality and gender as being nothing like AFA. If you want in depth information from a truly intelligent and kind person you’ll like him.
I just came across this video and have been watching your channel to get a better understanding of norse heathenry (my boyfriend is a heathen and is actually on your discord server). I greatly appreciate this video as one of the things that made me, as a Jewish person, incredibly nervous when my SO started exploring heathenry was the ties it has had to the alt right. He actually told me about this video and I've come to see so many heathens speaking out about the AFA and it's put me so much at ease. I also just want to be as supportive as I can.
Well damn. Ocean's got an intimidating streak to him. He's usually so calming that I didn't see that coming.
It was a necessary point though. While unity is a largely good thing, there are some people you just can't afford to unify with as is. Besides, bigotry is inherently exclusionary. Unifying with them in excluding everyone they are bigoted against.
Thank you Ocean. As a minority myself, it means lot to see you take a stand for us. ❤
@Bean Oak There is nothing intelligent about you! (Ocean struck a nerve, snowflake?)
"intimidating" LOL
As a lifelong atheist who has recently been teetering on the edge of finding some form of faith stumbling across your videos while searching for intersectional pagans, I really can’t thank you more for making your stances on racism, nationalism, homophobia, and responsibility to your community so clearly and firmly stated. So, seriously, thank you so very much. I’m glad I came across your channel.
ou do know that Vikings didn't accept LGBT+ People, It was considered an insult, If you google the word "Eigir" you'll learn how Vikings nor Oden would accept a trans or LGBT person into asgard, You were given your gender by the gods when you were born and it should stay that way, stop trying to be special. It doenst matter what these people think, History is History and you would've been killed for you actions back in the day.
You're young and ignorant, you'll grow out of it, but dont expect Allfather to turn his eye towards you until you accept who you are, which is the gender you were born with.
It pisses me off that people like you "Look into Paganism" You're the ones making our religon look like a joke to the outside world and you are the reason we'll never be taken serious, If you're a man Thor will beat his hammer until you find yourself back to your masculinity and if you're a woman, may Freja guide you back to your Nurturing and Loving Feminine side. End of Discussion.
Sincerely Whilliam Nilsson
and that’s what turns people away from faith, as I have, even as a straight cis male. If that is how the gods really are, they deserve nothing more than sneering contempt, and you deserve even less than that.
This is how the gods really die, they simply outlive their usefulness. After all, _we_ created _them,_ not the other way around, and we just as easily snuff them out. Götterdämmerung, literally.
This sounds like christian preaching politics in the church too much for me. That has naught to to with your own spirit. Maybe this is some peoples baggage Jesus, arguing about politics and ignoring the personal self journey.
I came back to the Norse Paganism and when I left I don't think he had started his channel. When I came back I wanted to brush up on things better and he came up. While some of his videos were alright. Some just seemed off. I joined him on patron and that's when things really got fishy for me.
He didn't have an LGBTQ board on the discord. Instead it was a private chat room started by members. He reluctantly gave in and cited something about having a bad relationship with a female to male transgender man. I don't understand what that has to do with him not having an LGBTQ board up. I've since canceled my Patreon to him and unsubcribed from his youtube channel.
He just uses word salad to answer tough questions.
Just unsubbed after watching Ali's video
Question: why should there be a LGBTQ board?
@@Anonymous-sq6eo Because LGBTQ pagans exist and were part of the discord. Don't they deserve to have a place to post about being LGBTQ and Pagan.
@@TheNibNerd are LGBTQ doing things differently? If not, why is it necessary to have it?
Well put; more light put on the bundle of red flags out there.
All cultures used to be really proud of their ancestry. Why is it seen as racism today?
It's only racist when White people do it. Everyone else gets a pass.
As a complete non-Asatruar, the entire dialogue presented in this video looks ridiculous and wholly unappealing. Politicizing your religion into various sub communities only shows that there is no transcendent basis, but merely another worldly ideology. Another 'community'.
All blood is red.
I have been apart of the Heathen community for a year now and for the last two months I was a Patreon member of Wisdom of Odin. I was blinded by the need for a community and did not pick up on the way Jacob talked and how he discussed certain topics until I was shown Aliakai's video about 3 days ago. I then began looking at your videos along with Red the Wolf. I thank you for this information because I was introduced to Heathenry when I worked in corrections and saw it used as a white supremacists movement. I have worked very hard this last year when I told people I was Heathen to make sure they understood that I support all sexual orientations and races because I would be asked about that alot when people found out about my path in the old ways. So again thank you for the information and I look forward to obtaining more knowledge from open minded Heathens.
I have to congratulate you on being able to acknowledge where you made mistakes or didn't spot red flags. That can be really difficult. Ocean's discord (Ocean's Hold) is an excellent place to start with a solid community.
@@OrganisedChaosHere do you know how to join? I made similar mistakes for the same reasons
@@kassietheobald9165 If you look in the description of any of the omnipotent beard podcast episodes, there's a link labelled discord. That link should let you join. There's a pretty active entry point to chat in which is a few channels while the mods get a feel for you (protects us against bigots) and once you get past that point the server is a whole lot bigger.
9:55 as a German citizen I can only say this is utter nonsense, although there are a lot of other Germans (10%-15%) who would agree with him.
That’s closer to the truth than you might think. Germans are having less babies, and most of the immigrants are Turks and Arabs, who do have big families.
Simple math, like it or not. I am not saying we should kick them out or discriminate against them, but that does not change the fact that he is more right than wrong.
@@Anonymous-sq6eo quick question: how do you define "German" - and would you say the melanin content of your skin says anything about how German you are? (edit: not trying to put words in your mouth - but at least in the context of the video it seems that German (or European for that matter) equals white.)
That aside. Germans having less babies (as in: the birthrate dropped to about 1.5) is true. most of the immigrants being Turks or Arabs is, however, wrong. Most of the immigrants are Romanians, followed by Poles, Bulgarians, Italians, Kroatians and then it's perople from Syria and Turkey. (Germans re-immigrating to Germany excluded). (quick look at the national statistics, 2019).
Now, it is a question / a point of discussion / a claim that pops up every so often and while I would intuitively agree with hamanime 'well, I have a gut feeling' isn't an argument. So allow me to think out loud for a moment as I try to find a better reply.
Only looking at the immigration (as opposed to the saldo; immigrants from an area minus emigrants to that area) (2020): of 1.6-ish million about 1.2m are from Europe (of which about 40k are from Turkey and about 20k from Russia). Now, not axactly sure who 'the Turks' are - if it's just Turkey or also other nations in that area. So I'll leave that open. As for 'the Arabs' I suppose you mean 'the Arab world' adding the immigration numbers from those 22 states we arrive at ~125k (with the most coming from Syria and Iraq) and it includes those whose nationality is unclear, unknown or who don't have one (total of ~10k). Afaik immigration is also not tied to acquiring the German nationality - the only ones not included are those who are 'waiting on their status' as what I think is now called a "regular migrant" (aka someone showing up at the immigration office with all the needed documents and is waiting to be entered in the 'residence registry' - no idea if that's how it's actually called. But you have to tell the state where your place of residence in Germany is.) - those registered as refugees / applying for the status as a refugee seem to be counted as formally their residence in Germany is whatever facility they stay at.
Granted, the German-wide average of mothers-of-not-German-nationality is ~25% (2019) but given the above numbers I would assume the majority of those 25% are from other European countries.
www.destatis.de/EN/Themes/Society-Environment/Population/Migration/_node.html
www.destatis.de/DE/Themen/Gesellschaft-Umwelt/Bevoelkerung/Wanderungen/Publikationen/Downloads-Wanderungen/wanderungen-2010120187004.pdf?__blob=publicationFile (only German though)
@@Anakianaj Generically European, German...stop the bullshit. Europeans are being bullied with socialists opening the gates of false prosperity to wild illegals who could care less about our culture. It's only to destroy our sovereignty
@@Fatelovesirony960 look, I'm open to have a discussion. but if you make an argument, please support it with facts and evidence from credible sources. My line of thinking is that generally people tend to be biased in some way and looking at the numbers can put things into perspective. If of the over a million and a half people that immigrate to Germany (which includes those whose status is so far unclear afaik) only a faction are not from the OECD countries (as in their nationality) then there's really not much else to say about it. Except you have some information that I don't have and would be kind enough to share your sources with me?
“Hi i’m Jacob and i am a Norse Pagan” No, Jacob. Take a look at the mirror. You’re obviously not.
I don't agree with racist bullshit, the ALLFather is the father of ALL. But, I also don't agree with being forced to make them the thing that defines what my religion is, and that's what this feels like.
This was like watching my favorite history teacher tear apart the class clown for not paying attention. It was fun to see your angry side for once and I have to say, I've never seen a man be so angry yet so calm at the same time.
@Anglo-Saxon Idk why?
Well damn.. He was one of the first heathens I found on YT... Guess I'll be putting some distance from him now
Sacrificing this post to the algorithm as engagement 🔥🤷🔥
Jacob does not activly oppose the AFA, at the same time you actively do support BLM. Should you really be the one to throw the first stone? Just stay away from all hate groups...
One year on and I'm still waiting for the coof to wipe us out. This video aged well lol.
Edit, going even further into the video this guy is nothing more than a current thing enjoyer who wants me to be outraged about other peoples non-conformity to the status quo.
If this boy was around 100 years ago his 'morality' would have consisted with the current thing then and I suspect so would many of his subscribership.
Thank you for this, i am very new to norse paganism but i come from punk rock and this is a very similiar fight the struggles of true skinheads. Thank you for this information, I feel much more confident and welcomed as a queer person. This honestly means a lot. ❤
Were all just men and women trying to live good by the Gods and Goddesses. Some do it well, others not so much. In the end i wish anyone who follows the path the best in this life and the best in their mind.
Even with his mistake and poor practices, I do have to thank him for helping me in my early days of the faith, which did in turn lead me to you. It is sad to see someone go down a path of poor decisions. But I am glad to be informed of his mistakes before I got lost in them myself. Thank you.
@Anglo-Saxon believing in something like gods or mythology is literally belief / faith what are you on about
you cant say, that ones practice is poor thats wrong
Imagine being transphobic AND believing in Loki 😂
Also noting WoOs constant use of “folk” that seems to just mean “Arian “ to this other dude
I'm still a bit of a Heathen hatchling right now, and I started my research and experience in the community through woo and I became a patron and signed up for the yule gathering but as of recent I've been discovering videos left and right exposing woo and his community, thank you for opening my eyes to the truth about woo and leading me to canceling my patron subscription and leaving his discord server
So, WoO and the AFA are in other words, based?
So what, he loves and supports his own people.
If by his own people, you mean racists, yeah, i imagine so.
Support yall? Bro he sold all his stuff and moved away and is now grifting to the celts. He will never build that hall. He will never take care of yall. You're just dollars to him.
@@OceanKeltoi yep. this is a european religion. he's right, you're wrong.
I'm currently agnostic (used to be Catholic) and looking into other religions and what really baffles me with Jacob Toddson is how he reacts to criticism. I told him in the comments of a video that he's spreading lies about Catholicism and that he should do more research on this topic (since he comes from a protestant backround) and he literally called me a brainwashed. Kind of bad how he treats his viewers who criticize him. I unfollowed him because of his very imature reaction.
As mixed race person I find this all facilitating. It should be added for fairness that his Holiness the Dali Lama said Europe is for Europeans and should help others get empowered and that those people should then leave, going back to their own home countries.
But then again, the Dali Lama, is about full equality and not partial equality for the world.
I don’t like hearing about fire and war implying to non Europeans in Europe and I also am clearly aware of some of my people stabbing White European for dating some of my peoples Middle Eastern “women”.
You can’t really have a healthy talk unless we talk about the whole picture.
As a mixed race person, I’m really about fairness as I don’t fit in with any group, it’s a easy and natural stance for me as much as one thrust upon me, by nearly everyone I’ve met, and especially minorities wondering how much color I have.
I would like to know, does this channel think his Holiness the Dali Lama is wrong?
A spiritual leader displaced from his home country and who roughly speaking wanders the world because of it?
One who’s been greatly financially supported by Whites, spiritually applauded by them too, including advocates for his Holiness and Tibetan suffrage due to CCP actions of Han racial expansionism.
When I herd DL advocate for native Europeans I thought it karma for good deeds done to him, and also bravery to side step the whole 20 years of evil Nazism.
But then again, 20 years doesn’t define anything about Europe, or at least it should not.
And yes, I am Jewish enough to have been killed for my blood line. I am fully aware but I am also aware of Po Pot, Stalin, Mao, Imperialist Japanese superiority and other psychos/systems that get the velvet glove treatment when really they are part of a genocidal whole against humanity.
I see no equal treatment or attention put on other groups. Why is that? It’s not because it’s stopped elsewhere. There are Japanese only streets in Japan, and even Thailand that Japan runs. Just as a easily searchable feeling, I mean fact, which ever word people believe is truthful.
Also, I don’t see Jacob as you have implied money hungry, if anything I would say you are, because those who point the finger from my life experience in that vein often are the ones guilty of it.
Either way, I think your argument is he is Pro European / White, but minus the shade that groups like Brown Power / La Raza sometimes put out from some rallies I’ve scene.
I think your against Woo because he may (I’m not sure 🤔) be behaving like other groups of minorities that are pro their own minority?
If so please due tell. I never reply to UA-cam comments as their hard to manage but for this, I surely will as I have been a fan of Jacob for about 6 months or so and have scene nothing negative from him, but that of deep passion for his journey and the sharing of that warmly.
Jacob is clearly aware I am mixed race and has been warm and inviting, hearting comments of mine and responding.
You on the other hand idk if would get the same loving 🥰 treatment. Intellectuals often despise blue collar type people but you could surprise me 😉.
I’m not Heathen but I’m fascinated by the religion and love learning more. What you said about WoO was facts man, we need more good people like you in the world, period.
Well then you are not learning, just joining the mobs.
Having just listened to the sh*t heaped by several channels on to Wisdom
of Odin I am of a mind that it must be a good channel to choose to
follow. So much hate and and Antifa style vitriol shows shallowness and
fear. Chao!
🤓🤓🤓
@Gage Acosta Neo nazis are not slick lmao
Makes sense now why he won't fully harshly condemn the AFA. What a bad look. WoO should NOT be posturing as a leader within the movement with his shitty behavior, let alone his lack of knowledge on the topics he tries to present. As said at the end in regards to the AFA, WoO is also free to stand alone.
they don't care about your woke cancel culture.
I kept thinking the dude was saying Voltron.
I am a new member into heathenry and I’m also European and I can say that thank the gods that I found this video cause I was watching the other guy’s videos for introductions into this faith. I think the main goal of Norse paganism or Asatru is that we accept everyone that wants to be part of it . These guys should completely abandon the faith cause they’re making excuses to be racist. This is about tolerance and respect not violence and racist behavior 😢
@@cavalierxii3036 Asatru isn't only for us Europeans, sure we have history and their culture written down in history but that doesn't mean that people from other countries outside of it cannot be believers. This is not OUR GODS this is EVERYONE'S GODS at least to people that want to follow asatru. I don't understand what's so confusing about my first message, literally there's no excuse to be racist just because you're pagan or wanting to its believers to be simply "white". That just nonsense... also have boundaries in what sense? I can understand like accepting members on their level of approach of the faith, but not using it as an excuse to say "we need to save the white race or the white race etc..." Still, think whatever you want to think but justifying racism just because you are calling yourself asatru is not having boundaries in fact you're overstepping them.
You are just appropriating the norse religion to make your own.
Just think of your own gods that are inclusive, don’t appropriate other cultures to your benefit.
Have you ever thought of what you deem as racist, may have been the norm in the past?
@@Anonymous-sq6eo I think they only distinguished between slaves and free men, not by the color of their skin. What are you saying is that due to your assumptions the asatru folk can be racist cause you people think that they were a white supremacy folk. But you have no proof about it whatsoever. Also what you're saying is that we also can support slavery because they were into slave trading back at the time... Cool let's kidnap children and woman in order to sell them...
My opinion is based on respect. Religions and culture can evolve the same happened with christianism, I'm not sure if they were racist (norse people) but behaviours as slave trading and racism are no longer permitted nowadays and you cant justify to be racist just because you claim to be asatru...
We have to treat everyone equally independent of what they believe and their colour of their skin, so if we going to make this work we cannot implement racism and slave trading back because they are against basic human rights. There's no excuse in those treatments, is like saying your grandfather was racist so you're racist cause he was one... they were different times with different goals in life and their way of living were pretty much different from ours. There's no excuse towards racist behaviour. And I feel truly sorry for the asatru folk to have racist people among their lines claiming that they're only racist cause of their religion. That's bullocks
BTW you're not living in 10th century might consider that as well...that even if we were racist, slave traders and conquerors at the time that doesn't mean we're declaring war in other European countries because we want their money and riches nowadays. If you want to believe in other religions you have to believe with the rules and laws of every country also human rights in mind. You can't kill people just because they're black or white... unless you want to go to prison.
"We should accept everyone" and then right after that "these guys should completely abandon the faith." Very dogmatic and Christian like imo. Also, while anyone can choose to follow Asatru it's important to point out that it was never a global religion like Christianity or Islam. It was very focused on ancestors and tribe. From a modern pov the Norse would probably be viewed as "racist"
@@MrFredstt yeah but you should have into consideration the times that we're living in, just because they were into racism back in the early centuries doesn't mean that we have to be, that's just another excuse to cause harm and denigrate people depending on their beliefs or culture. As to abandon the faith I said it because as I mentioned before there are no excuse towards questionable behaviour, if they're going to use religion in order to do that well, they might as well consider to use something else because not everyone is like that. Besides to the ancestor argument it was like that back then, they had their faith already during a long time ago and it was passed from fathers to sons. Right now, its completely different cause what we're doing is reconstructing it from the little extracts we have from them, so we cannot expect to believe or put it in practical in the same way, because our background and laws are different apart and surely we're missing info. We're different that we were centuries ago and just saying things like just because in the 9th century they were racist and focused on ancestors we should be exactly that, when we have a way modern society and rights. I understand the historical background but being racist saying things like "they were racist at the time" "they were focused on ancestors" its just another excuse to be one. And definitely they don't need religion to be one.
This sounds like a whole lot of woke wanna be heathenry
It's weird how the conversations around the most basic moral objections gets framed as 'woke' as a way to somehow dismiss it.
@@OceanKeltoi
You are a Christian who likes marvel too much. Muh basic moral objections. Get lost.
@@monkeymoment6478 Get lost yourself, you don’t understand Norse Paganism at all. You fool.
Ugh. This is the kind of stuff that made me avoid the Norse pantheon for so long. McNallen and the AFA use Nazi imagery. The fact that wasn’t a deal breaker is disappointing and disgusting.
They DON ‘T use Nazi imagery those images many are ancient indo European images that existed centuries before the Nazis .
The fact the Nazis hijacked those symbols does not make them specifically Nazi symbols get your facts right before being duped by this fraudulent bullshit.
All the politics and “holier than thou arts” reminds me why I’ve always been a solo practitioner. You have people talking about grading moral superiority based hatefulness of a hate group.
6:30 "...you can either placate them, or fight them. And as we've seen, there isn't another option"- Well, there _is_ another option, actually. You can ignore them. And make them irrelevant.
Okay, Ocean, at 12:36 that's an outright lie from you. That's not what that post says.
These channels are ridiculous from a pagan/heathen point of view. competely, i can show these arguments to my black native mates here and my arabic friends and they all think us white people are mad for not looking after our DNA
DNA was teh gift of the gods, to be different from eachother, diversity.
The native here practice more like Stephan talks in their own tribes and its a great thing, they dont need to loose everything we are trying to remember from all the carnage and amnesia in our own people as an echo of many wings of Judaisms influence on world beliefs
It is an ancestry practice, including the connections to the gods within us, and yes they match our DNA genetic code and our energetic signatures
this concept is allot harder for people to realise that only have IDEAS or LOGIC about the past as opposed to pagans and heathens who meet see and know the gods face to face, this subject needs to be crossed by real holy men/women who know the gods
There were lores about inter marrying in every tribe on the panet, and yes though rare it did happen and they had customs to make sure each culture wasnt being watered down, IE
WHITE woman marries a NATIVE Aboriginal here, she has to learn their ways their customs and leave heres to the world where she came from
visa vera, otherwise you lose the depth of dreaming ie working within the pantheon and practicing actual ancestry magic becomes impossible,
the different pantheons and aspects and arcytypal overlays are complete tribal systems, when you mix the faiths you loose parts within your own ths loosing the whole bigger self evolving awakening process and connectedness of a system of LORE.
I was taught this my a BLACK NATIVE aboriginal LORE man
but yes SOVEREIGNTY for all
Wake up white people
Wearing a hammer and calling yourself a heathen doesnt mean your awake to it
arguing like a bunch of christians over bullshit is not walking between worlds,
is not meeting your ancestors, is not astral working into the unknown
and its not stepping back into that great garden of EDEN where you can hear the trees speaking
and the land speaking or the Gods appearing before your eyes
This is still the tree of life, and to real heathens who tune into this stuff
we often put our head in our hands in despair ..ie these people do not know what they speak of at all
so far from truth, so far from natural, so far from the earth , the land fire, life death
its so embarrassing to wear my hammer and have ppl associate me with any of this crap
An honestly if any of my heathen brothers, real trained warriors were here, wede rip if off their necks.
I did come across some mcnallen videos awhile back, To learn more on old germanic spirituality & yes very disturbing content. Was hoping to learn more about the old ways & instead learned more about his wierd aryan revival that completely went off the path of what i was looking for.
Thank you for sharing this information, I am new to Norse paganism and I’m lgbtq. So I’m trying to find my place here, this helps a ton.
Look, some pagans are pro LGBTQ while some are anti LGBTQ
Welcome! I'm not new but I'm part lgbtq as well. Glad to see more Lgbtqia+ coming into heathenry, you don't stand alone in this!
@@dapperspaghettimonster also there was this capitol rioter that is heathen I think and hes a republican. Also the Nazis were very supportive of paganism since they liked their roots.
@@dapperspaghettimonster thank you so much !
@@Hazelthenerd please don't ignore my comment you ignorant
I love you man I have never heard anyone speak out like this
It's really nice to find a creator who has addressed this so directly. I don't mean Wisdom of Odin, I mean the whole concept of race and acceptance in the community. Involving myself in this community I was given a word of warning to stay on high alert for the predatory and problematic sides of the religion, and thus far you're the only person who has taken the (correct) stance of acceptance within the community. Thanks.
hell yes hail to ocean keltoi
Didn't really have much of an opinion of the guy (only seen maybe 5 of his videos) but I'm glad this is being brought up. At least the UA-cam algorithm is finally recommended channels from more communities of Heathens. Prior to this I had no idea your channel existed. I look forward to seeing more from your channel.
just subscribed to your content .. love it ... the found this video.. you smear jobbed this guy without proper context. Just calling it out as 127 would have me do. Oh and btw 17 years on this path ... this was not worthy of your character as i have enjoyed your other content fully and would never expected this from you
explain to me how it is racist to want to preserve your own folk. Explain to me how it is racist to want to preserve our own culture and identity. I can tell you from my experience that Odin loves people who are true to their kin. You are an enemy to the gods and an enemy to all native Europeans. Hail Odin and hail victory!