I’m a peony farmer- going on year 14. Thanks so much for sharing these thoughts. Every time I suggest to folks about disbudding the first 3 years, I get these folks saying that they don’t do that and it’s not necessary, but it’s a scientifically proven process of where the plant sends it’s energy. Also- I commented on one of these peony posts about people needing to think ahead about just the things you talked about- needing help with harvest and processing and needing a cooler and was accused of being “negative!” Thanks for pointing out these important considerations!
Sadly, sometimes people have to fail themselves- even if it takes 3-5 years to see that someone else was correct. And they will not come back and tell you. So know that you are making a difference to wise people. Foolish people won’t listen to anyone. A large part of culture loves a quick fix. Typically life doesn’t work that way. Everything is time, relationship, & energy. Most ppl don’t want that. I’ll listen to any peony farmer whose learned, grown, and gained success from their practices.
Wise wise words coming from experience. Naturally everyone's experience is their own, but lets think about this. If peony (or any farming) were that easy and fool proof, lots of people would be doing it, and you wouldn't get $2/4 per stem. If a resource is scarce and therefore demands a high price there is a REASON it is scarce.
@@naomifehr669 I greatly admire Dave, but he maybe isn’t up on ALL research done in plants! 😉This practice of removing buds has been confirmed by several Horticulture Professors at the University of Ak in Fairbanks, based on research by Botanists at other Universities. It’s based on a process called the “Source Sink Relationship.” A plant has some parts that are a “source” of energy and other parts that use the energy. They injected a special dye into plants to see where the energy of the plant was being used. During the production and blooming of a bud, a great deal of energy was directed to the bud/ bloom and very little to the root system of the plant. In fact, it takes a lot of a plant’s resources to create a bloom. When our peony industry was getting started here in Alaska, we had many peony experts come up and do presentations. These were long time peony growers- some from generations of cultivating peonies. Across the board they all recommended clipping off the buds the first few years as a “Best Practice” because of this concept of the plant redirecting energy where it’s most needed. It will create a bigger, healthier root system in the peony plants. 😊
@naomifehr669 Dave said what exactly? I velieve he said you can harvest short stems (leaving plenty of foliage) & the peonies won't DIE, but she's saying it's been proven that it's extremely beneficial & it will cause the plants energy to focus on root growth (sense there's no flowers) & then in the LONG RUN, you'll have a much larger peony, with a much larger, healthier root system. & if you do cut from them too low, during too much foliage, to where it can't photosynthesize, it absolutely can die...
I have been a casual gardener (veg and flowers) for 40 years. Can't imagine how much work large scale flower gardening would be and how difficult it would be to get good looking harvest. Every year I am faced with new pests, which I can deal with using the squish method, but you can't hand pick beetles in a one acre patch. I totally agree that people hugely underestimate the amount of labour involved.
I'm also a peony farmer -- 6 years in -- and I wish I'd had this information when I started :)! Thank you for addressing the issue of monoculture farming. While I thought I understood the risks -- it's really hard to overstate just how tricky it can be to keep a farm full of one type of perennial healthy and productive. My fields are surrounded by natives and my soil is generally healthy, but when your plants are lined up in neat little rows and one of them gets a disease (rattlesnake virus popped up last year for me), it can be amazing how quickly they go downhill. The costs and labor to keep them healthy alone could easily offset profits. It's a beautiful and rewarding crop for sure; I'm just glad you're sharing such good insights.
I love your videos because you cut through the fluff and talk truth. You’re not afraid to share your opinions, which seem to be based on your experience. There’s nothing wrong with that! Keep doing what you do! Continued success in 2024 to you!
Marketing of courses is people selling the dream without acknowledging the reality. It's much easier to sell courses than it is to sell thousands of flowers, or else they would still be focusing on their flower farms, not the course sales.
I get what you’re saying and I agree, but I think it’s smart to diversify your income whether it’s a UA-cam channel or a course. As long as you are carrying yourself with dignity and transparency, there’s room for all of the ways to profit on your skills and knowledge.
@katrinahansen6830 Diversifying your income streams is always a good idea. I'm sure there is value in many courses, but selling them with dreamy statistics from the top .01% of growers is where ethics come into play.
Thank you for making this! The peony one drives me nuts and I was going to make a video on the fallacy of the assumptions but you made a much better one than I ever could have
You know how i know this was an excellent video. The comments section is buzzing. I think there are many trends within the flower growing community that are well overdue on getting push back. Glad someone has the courage to do it. Good content Bri. Cheers.
Wow, that’s a lot of good information. I’m just a home gardener and want to stay that way, but this makes me appreciate so much all the work you are putting into your flower farm, as well as educating us. Well done to you 😊
I'm a home gardener too. Sometimes I think, wow, it would be so wonderful to grow and sell flowers in pretty sundresses only working in the summer. Then a get a good dose of reality and go back to puttering in my gardening. I do share flowers and vege with the neighborhood. I do appreciate the work that goes into larger scale.
Great info! It's hard for anyone starting any kind of business to think of all the startup expenses and costs of running a business. It adds up quickly!
When JM Fortier's book came out in 2014, market garden start up costs were about $40,000. He outlines them well. That was WITH a BCS and implements. I just watched his recent interview with Bootstrap Farmer and he said he just ran the same numbers again and it came out to $90,000. Crazy.
So much this. While I don't think thats a terrible amount of money to set up a business which gives you a job, it's the fact that tghe ones selling the dream aren't talking about it@@thepragmaticfarmer6308
Thank you for your candid perspective on this. I have seen these claims from these well-known farmers and have taken several of their courses myself. I have learned a lot from them, but it is important that those considering farming as a future career recognize that these farmers and claims are selling you "the dream". Also, most of these courses teach you how to grow, but they do not teach you the business skills that are essential to building a profitable business.
Really helpful video! It's information like this that has helped me decide to keep my flower farming as a super tiny side-hustle instead of trying to expand. I love it so much but I don't think I would love it if I was hemorrhaging money. 😂 You didn't mention what I consider to be the two largest startup costs: land (and the maintenance and property taxes that go along with it) and soil remediation. If your soil is bad, it can take years to get really productive plants, unless you want to spend a fortune on bringing in compost from outside sources. It's crazy to me that I see a lot of people jumping into flower farming with no experience gardening. Even just a small family garden is so much labor.
Thank you for your transparency. I love growing flowers for bouquets in a small residential garden. Putting in the infrastructure from scratch (flower beds, raised flower beds, soil amendments, flower food, garden tools, irrigation timers and drip irrigation supplies, electrical conduit for hoops/tunnels, seeds etc) has been expensive. I'm investing into my hobby each year so I can grow more and scale it potentially for future sales, BUT i can't imagine how to set up a business plan to scale this to a professional farm. I imagine its a ton of work and lots of fine tuning every year. I like how you talk about risk and contingency plans that you have to consider (ex. You get hurt and can't work- hire someone-salary, loss of large crops-plant more than you need for spring, then summer, so your spending more on seeds as a backup plan). How does one learn how to get organized?😅 My goal is to learn how to make a variety of bouqs for spring, summer and fall using a variety of fillers this year. Im watching YTs to learn more about bouq recipes for the seasons and growing fillers. It's timing everything just right that i find most challenging. I'd like to learn how to utilze hoop houses to get earlier and later crops. Thanks for all you do to educate us. Much appreciated.
You are such a beautiful person! Thank you for sharing so much honest conversation on every aspect of home farming! You deliver so much valuable information! And you deliver it in a way that makes sense and is easy to digest and put to actual use! 😊💕
Thank you so much for this video, it repeats what I keep saying to people myself. I am a tiny urban flower farmer and I only get two months off in the winter, but my flower farm surrounds my house on a 0.146 acre city lot. How can I only take two months off when larger farms claim to be able to take more time off? Beats me. Also, the necessary infrastructure needed is so ignored in cost analysis, it is mind boggling to me.
@cognitive-botanical-therapy we are definitely not well represented on UA-cam, where a micro flower farm is anything under 5 acres. That's why I started my channel.
I'm only a hobby gardener but I used to do a lot of seed swaps. Sending them in the mail was getting too costly for me. I can only imagine how much it costs to ship flowers regularly especially with the rising costs. It's definitely something that gets overlooked when it comes to selling things nationwide or globally especially with people who sell their products online. I've seen a lot of courses and videos about making a lot of money selling microgreens. People can make a lot of money growing microgreens but there's a lot more involved that doesn't always get covered like finding buyers and the start up costs. I feel like this is something similar to what you were covering in this video. Thanks for keeping it honest and showing the reality of growing things as a business.
I forgot to add licensing or certification costs. I live in Texas and it's required to have a nursery floral license that can cost $110 to $180 depending on the size of acres the grower has. It's the same for selling seedlings too. That's a start up cost that I've seen a lot of people not covering either because their state doesn't have restrictions or they just don't know about it.
So helpful! Thank you for taking the time to dispel some misconceptions. I find the idea of flower farming gets people by the romantic, whimsical image of being in a sun dress picking wildflowers and making $$$! Lol So not the case 😆🥰👩🏽🌾🌸
You are so inspiring to me! Last year was my first year professionally flower farming and I love your straight forward approach and sensibility, your attention to detail is so important I appreciate your thought process. I also follow your regenerative philosophies as I’m healing my family’s land through regenerative flower farming and you advice is helping in abundance 💛 I cannot wait for the day when I can have two sheep of my own :) thank you as always -Melanie
As is your approach to all your content, such a thoughtful, analytical and encouraging (with the reality checks everyone needs to think through!) video. You remain my favorite youtuber to catch up with because I always learn something. Thank you for being so creative, encouraging, inquisitive, critical (in the best scientific sense of the word!), and generous in sharing your wisdom with us.
@@Blossomandbranch Bri (Bree), not sure. I love the time, energy, thoughtfulness, honesty, and dirty hands you put into your videos. I have a 100 ft X 40 ft cut flower garden. I'm 72 years old and I'm totally surprised how many mistakes I have made my first year and the amount of physical energy that goes into Cut Flower Farming (especially crawling along on the hard ground on my hands and knees). I started my adventure without the help of your videos which would have saved me tons of time, money, and wrong decisions. My favorite smile of the video was you and a staff member attempting to pull apart two plastic buckets that had hermetically sealed together. Did you ever get them apart? Better when they are cold/cool.
That was a terrific video. I have been thinking that the peony goldrush time is over. For those that invested 10 years ago kudos to you, for the insight. For me in Canada i see grocery store,s saturated with peony stems so I assume they are common. I am personally concerned about the future value of peonies with all the wholesale growers. Of course I live in Canada where we have no problem with providing them cool weather. It may be different in warmer zones.. Another trend I have noticed is all the videos and posts on growing 10 flowers. I am waiting for you to do a video on the pit falls of that retail business plan. Cheers Michelle
I appreciate you so very much. I am 62 and planning to start flower farming as part of my retirement. Your information helps me to plan for a better business in flower farming. You’re truly helping Cannot thank you enough. Still planning on flower farming. Will just be educated and smart about it
My husband will be retiring in 5 years. We have been looking at properties to open a winery. Well we found it early. 20 acres of beautiful sloping hills. And right out there by the road... A garage with an attached building that will be perfect for a cut flower shop! She already has peonies hydrangeas and other plants growing, but I can't really tell what they are because we are deep into our fall season here in Michigan! I wish we could share pictures on this platform. It is right at the entrance of a huge lake, retirement, community. All of those little old ladies are going to have to pass my shop on their way home! I can also maybe have some craft classes to teach some projects in a hands on classroom type setting... But with wine! ☺️
I’m not a flower farmer, and but I’m an veg grower & started a cut flower garden for my enjoyment. We’re working with limited space- but I’ve made sure to plant lots of other plants around my peonies! We’ve got 4 varieties of marigolds, 2 or nasturtiums, poppies, borage, and more!
The buckets are just air suctioned together! Take a yard stick, or something similar and wedge it down until the suction breaks loose! Thanks for the awesome info!
I think like most things in life selling flowers is not a get rich easy and quick scheme. You never can predict the weather or natural disasters. While the start up costs are cheaper than most start up businesses (especially if scaled up gradually) if you go into it with unrealistic expectations you will de disappointed and could get burned. I appreciate your honesty, people rarely are as open about cost and money as you have been.
I might reframe that I start up cost are more **enjoyable** but they are not ***less*** than a different kind of startup business… (there’s so many kinds of businesses//costs….)
Great info, things that look to go good to be true usually are! I can't believe anyone would invest so much in one crop, some years my peonies are spectacular and other years, yes things go wrong. This year they were all nibbled, only slightly, they still looked fabulous in the garden, but no they couldn't be sold as $4 stems. Diversification is the only way to flower farm, loose one crop, yes it's upsetting but there are others to fall back on. Now that our planet is in such crisis the weather is so unpredictable it's never a given that anything will crop. It's been crazy mild here in the UK, 9 degrees C up until this week, I've got plants leafing up..going to be a dodgy spring.
If you want to get buckets unstuck, use an air compressor and a narrow nozzle. To keep wet buckets from sticking, take a small chunk of wet sponge, put that piece in between each bucket, guaranteed to pull apart every time.
Thankyou for being so honest. I have only just closed my candy store after 15 years and gone back to my horticultural background. After the 2019 Black Summer Bushfires we were issued grants to assist us with business management which were hefty costs and the two people that wanted to take us on just left us on the kerb once they got their payments. I am completely gun shy now on signing up to courses that claim the world and give nothing in return. This year as our property was so devastated by the bushfires we are finally at a point that we can begin this new chapter of our lives, and after watching your videos for the past 12 months I have grown everything from seed myself and even though we are late getting those in if I get a few blooms or some tuber growth with the dahlias Im completely happy with that. We have planted over 400 strawberries into our gardens as a you pick and will be doing markets and have been working on recipes to utilise our strawberries for this next 12 months and selling those products at our local food markets. My belief is there is no magic spell that is going to turn our adventure into our retirement fund in the next 3-5 years, but the joy of being back in the gardens and growing fresh produce and flowers is going to give me more life fulfilment. Again thankyou for the videos you share, I am forever rewatching and learning from your guidance. Cheers Theresa Australia :)
Thank you!! I fell for this exact trap for a second. It seemed way too good to be true. Then all of you great very seasoned farmers released your thoughts and put the truth out there. THANK YOU!
I so appreciate this video of facts! We are going into farming to help with retirement so knowing the reality helps make us plan variables and keep diversity.
I found your channel as a suggestion by youtube channel "In the garden w/ Lisa Monique" I am in E/C TN and new to flower gardening. I am looking forward to digging into your videos and learning!
I just subscribed because I love your regenerative gardening/farming practices! I also learned something new about the peonies that I inherited when I bought my house. Thanks for doing what you do!
The peony craze doesn’t bother me, if you go bottom up, you can always sell mature potted peonies to get part of your investment back (total cost of the root + extra cost to cover a little of the labor.) it’s the tulips that drive me nuts! Yes, some farmers make a killing, but I see year 1 farmers investing heavy into tulips with hardly the customer base to do the volume for the profits and sell before the blow open. Just my personal opinion/observations.
Going into my 4th year flower farming & I agree with everything you've said! The hardest part for me has been marketing & advertising & finding the best avenue for making sales in my area... everyone is going to have a different niche that works for them. Right now, selling at farmers markets is what works for me... some people may do better with a roadside stand, selling to florists, wholesale, etc. But either way, whatever rpute you take, its definitely a lot of hard, backbreaking, physical work, & if you dont enjoy gardening, & being outside in nature, (even when its 100 degrees) youre not going to enjoy farming...
Thanks for the reality check! I have plenty to keep my busy with my garden and foraging, harvesting and putting up food. I don't have the energy on top of that to also run a flower business and all that it would entail. I am also a scientist working in Alaska so I see all too well the effects of a warming Arctic in our region (degrading permafrost, increase in fires, duration, and frequency; increase growing season length, temps and growing degree days. Anyone whose livelihood depends on favorable environmental conditions (farmers, ski resort operators, commercial fisher people, etc.) would benefit from better understanding climate change model predictions for their areas. Alaskans have a large, late season market on Peonies because they bloom later then those grown in the lower 48 states but with our warming climate and extended growing season, there may be a "shift toward earlier blooming times, which put Alaska’s peonies in more direct competition with other markets." I also wonder if those in the Lower 48 states looking to get into commercial peony growing are taking into consideration climate change. "Relatively cool winter temperatures are necessary for the plant roots to achieve dormancy. Therefore, as long as temperatures are consistently below 43°F for 70 days, dormancy will be achieved." These quoted sections are copied directly from this little info document produced by the Scenarios Network for Alaska and Arctic Planning, a climate change research group at the University of Alaska Fairbanks (UAF) International Arctic Research Center. uaf-snap.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/Peony-report.pdf The point is, there are so many things to consider when contemplating starting a farm. In interior Alaska, when farmers scraped away/bulldozed the forest to create fields, they exposed the ground to heat and eventually, if the fields were underlain by discontinuous permafrost, those areas starting sinking in and or becoming more wet. Huge fields were abandoned because of this.
What does this look like for growing a number of flower varieties and not just peonies? I appreciate your candor, although I do feel like my dreams of being a flower farmer were crushed before they even began 😢
``Might be true if you are useless at starting seeds...but then maybe flower farming was a poor choice 😂 Seeds are super cheap, crazy buying plugs IMHO.
I think it depends on how many flowers they are growing and factoring in the time it takes to start from seed instead of plugs. For some people the extra cost of plugs is worth the cost because they can use that time elsewhere. I think it only works out if they are a large scale operation. It could also be demand versus size too. I've seen a lot of small family run businesses switching to plugs because it's easier for them to keep up with the amount of all the flowers/produce they grow for market.
You really caught my attention talking about plastic. As a start up, I'm really trying to avoid it but it's challenging - most veg or flower growers on UA-cam utilize it. Any suggestions on how to begin & maintain beds while avoiding plastic?
Generally great info on peonies, but after successfully growing peonies for cutflower and root sales for 20 years, I have to say you are still a bit unrealistic about the amount of work, the level of production per plant and the difficult of turning those blooms into cash. By Iarge though, this is one of the most helpful presentations I seen for anyone who is thinking about peonies as a business venture
Thank you for saying this!! I thought I was the only one getting annoyed with the constant workshop sales pitches and misleading info. I used to love listening to the podcasts of one of these farmers, but they’re so focused on workshop sales now. A lot of the content overlooks the reality of the industry. So disappointing 😞
An excellent and informative video, especially regarding peonies - which is why I ignored all the hype forty years ago in favour of something far more profitable!
Smart to see through! There are so many articles about the same thing happening in Alaska. Many growers invested before they learned there was very little money after all
Such a great video! Thank you. I have been looking into greenhouses for my backyard. I really liked the one I saw in the first few shots of this video. What is that brand? Or did you build it yourself? Definitely subscribing!
What would be your thoughts on partnering with a local bee keeper? Or starting a bee colony in this setting? Is this just added expense and labor, or will supplying more pollinators to the area increase health in plants enough to be worthwhile?
Thanks for your honesty, Bri. So glad you're here. I'd been wondering if you were going to start overwintering your dahlias after hearing Jennie Love talking about that. 😁
Seeing you and your friend trying to separate buckets!!! Try placing the group upside down. Place your foot on the lower handle, on the ground. Lift buckets with force, holding the outter buckets on the butt end. Slightly twist. Good luck!
Putting your MBA to good use! Which UC did you get it from? I got mine from UCSD in 2017 for other endeavors, but now I'm toying with a small flower business similar to Danielle at Northlawn Flower Farm.
Thanks for the information. I have also heard that you can’t grow peonies if you don’t get frost or snow. They need the cold to bud. I don’t get either so I don’t grow peonies.
I retired last March. Just trying to garden and work 5 horses is a full-time job. No way would I be able to even think of doing a cut flower business in retirement.
Thank you so much for the honest truth about flower farming. I started a flower farm last year. I did a You-pick flower farm. I am still learning a lot!! I love that you use Sil blockers. I have never used them. Where do you get the Soil for them. This is so new to me. The trays you use, where would I get them. Thank you again for your video so helpful!
I’m surprised you labeled the peony BS only “misleading” and not “wildly misleading.” You have more restraint than I do! I am willing to bet, however, that selling courses to teach people how to make $240k/year growing peonies is very profitable!
Thank you. A few peony questions: how many plants do you have? My summer annual patch is just 30x75. I put about 60 peony roots in last fall and about 50 more this fall. At the end of the summer a couple plants looked like boytritis...do you have a resolution for this? I read about coral charm being susceptible, and i think thats what it was. This fall new roots of other varieties were planted on either side. Should i did up those roots, or wait to be sure i have plants with that fungus, and treat accordingly? Will they show signs of it automatically this year? I was contemplating adding another 100 this coming fall, just bc the deer leave them alone and they bloom when im not harvesting much else.
I also think you should mention that soooo many people have invested in peonies in the last 5 years, I worry the market will be saturated when most of these peonies come to maturity, which could mean that you get even less of a price for your flowers.
I just want joy in learning and surrounding myself in more flowers. If you teach a course on your property, let me know and I'll be the first to sign up. Your info is pro, no fluff, and your competence if obvious! Show me the way!
I have also heard this type of claim with Lavender farming. I also heard that most Lavender farms loose up to 30% of their crop every spring that they have to replant. Is that true?
I’m in sales and this economy is terrible so I’m growing plants as a side hustle. I don’t have that kind of land so unfortunately I am limited on what I can make unless I grow rare stuff.
Blows my mind that anyone thinks harvesting enough peonies to make 240k a year would be "easy". I'm no farmer but I've had 3 peonies I've been growing for a few years now and I barely ever get more than 2 flowers off of each one. Admittedly I'm not the best gardener and could be doing a lot more to make them produce better but I don't have the time! x
I’m a peony farmer- going on year 14. Thanks so much for sharing these thoughts. Every time I suggest to folks about disbudding the first 3 years, I get these folks saying that they don’t do that and it’s not necessary, but it’s a scientifically proven process of where the plant sends it’s energy. Also- I commented on one of these peony posts about people needing to think ahead about just the things you talked about- needing help with harvest and processing and needing a cooler and was accused of being “negative!” Thanks for pointing out these important considerations!
Sadly, sometimes people have to fail themselves- even if it takes 3-5 years to see that someone else was correct. And they will not come back and tell you. So know that you are making a difference to wise people. Foolish people won’t listen to anyone. A large part of culture loves a quick fix. Typically life doesn’t work that way. Everything is time, relationship, & energy. Most ppl don’t want that. I’ll listen to any peony farmer whose learned, grown, and gained success from their practices.
Wise wise words coming from experience. Naturally everyone's experience is their own, but lets think about this. If peony (or any farming) were that easy and fool proof, lots of people would be doing it, and you wouldn't get $2/4 per stem. If a resource is scarce and therefore demands a high price there is a REASON it is scarce.
Dave Dowling says no. Wondering what 'proof' you're talking about.
@@naomifehr669 I greatly admire Dave, but he maybe isn’t up on ALL research done in plants! 😉This practice of removing buds has been confirmed by several Horticulture Professors at the University of Ak in Fairbanks, based on research by Botanists at other Universities. It’s based on a process called the “Source Sink Relationship.” A plant has some parts that are a “source” of energy and other parts that use the energy. They injected a special dye into plants to see where the energy of the plant was being used. During the production and blooming of a bud, a great deal of energy was directed to the bud/ bloom and very little to the root system of the plant. In fact, it takes a lot of a plant’s resources to create a bloom. When our peony industry was getting started here in Alaska, we had many peony experts come up and do presentations. These were long time peony growers- some from generations of cultivating peonies. Across the board they all recommended clipping off the buds the first few years as a “Best Practice” because of this concept of the plant redirecting energy where it’s most needed. It will create a bigger, healthier root system in the peony plants. 😊
@naomifehr669 Dave said what exactly? I velieve he said you can harvest short stems (leaving plenty of foliage) & the peonies won't DIE, but she's saying it's been proven that it's extremely beneficial & it will cause the plants energy to focus on root growth (sense there's no flowers) & then in the LONG RUN, you'll have a much larger peony, with a much larger, healthier root system.
& if you do cut from them too low, during too much foliage, to where it can't photosynthesize, it absolutely can die...
I have been a casual gardener (veg and flowers) for 40 years. Can't imagine how much work large scale flower gardening would be and how difficult it would be to get good looking harvest. Every year I am faced with new pests, which I can deal with using the squish method, but you can't hand pick beetles in a one acre patch. I totally agree that people hugely underestimate the amount of labour involved.
Thank you for being bold in your honesty here. It is really needed right now
You are so welcome, thank you for being here!
I'm also a peony farmer -- 6 years in -- and I wish I'd had this information when I started :)! Thank you for addressing the issue of monoculture farming. While I thought I understood the risks -- it's really hard to overstate just how tricky it can be to keep a farm full of one type of perennial healthy and productive. My fields are surrounded by natives and my soil is generally healthy, but when your plants are lined up in neat little rows and one of them gets a disease (rattlesnake virus popped up last year for me), it can be amazing how quickly they go downhill. The costs and labor to keep them healthy alone could easily offset profits. It's a beautiful and rewarding crop for sure; I'm just glad you're sharing such good insights.
The old adage “if it sounds too good to be true, it probably is” applies to this industry so much! Thank you for your breakdowns! Preach on! ❤
I love your videos because you cut through the fluff and talk truth. You’re not afraid to share your opinions, which seem to be based on your experience. There’s nothing wrong with that! Keep doing what you do! Continued success in 2024 to you!
I personally love your “wisdom from the winter bunker” mood you’ve got going. 😄
Marketing of courses is people selling the dream without acknowledging the reality. It's much easier to sell courses than it is to sell thousands of flowers, or else they would still be focusing on their flower farms, not the course sales.
I get what you’re saying and I agree, but I think it’s smart to diversify your income whether it’s a UA-cam channel or a course. As long as you are carrying yourself with dignity and transparency, there’s room for all of the ways to profit on your skills and knowledge.
@katrinahansen6830 Diversifying your income streams is always a good idea. I'm sure there is value in many courses, but selling them with dreamy statistics from the top .01% of growers is where ethics come into play.
@@PetalAndStemFarmtotally agree!
I'm also annoyed by year 2 grower telling everyone how to do it. You're a rookie. Come back in year 6 or 7 when you've taken some lumps!
@@lisalasch9002 I think you’re replying to the wrong commenter
Thank you for making this! The peony one drives me nuts and I was going to make a video on the fallacy of the assumptions but you made a much better one than I ever could have
You know how i know this was an excellent video. The comments section is buzzing. I think there are many trends within the flower growing community that are well overdue on getting push back. Glad someone has the courage to do it. Good content Bri. Cheers.
Thanks so much! Definitely generated lots of talk!!
Wow, that’s a lot of good information. I’m just a home gardener and want to stay that way, but this makes me appreciate so much all the work you are putting into your flower farm, as well as educating us. Well done to you 😊
So nice of you, thank you!
❤😊 I agree. Thank you!
I'm a home gardener too. Sometimes I think, wow, it would be so wonderful to grow and sell flowers in pretty sundresses only working in the summer. Then a get a good dose of reality and go back to puttering in my gardening. I do share flowers and vege with the neighborhood. I do appreciate the work that goes into larger scale.
Great info! It's hard for anyone starting any kind of business to think of all the startup expenses and costs of running a business. It adds up quickly!
When JM Fortier's book came out in 2014, market garden start up costs were about $40,000. He outlines them well. That was WITH a BCS and implements. I just watched his recent interview with Bootstrap Farmer and he said he just ran the same numbers again and it came out to $90,000. Crazy.
So much this. While I don't think thats a terrible amount of money to set up a business which gives you a job, it's the fact that tghe ones selling the dream aren't talking about it@@thepragmaticfarmer6308
As a hobbies beekeeper, I appreciate those of you flower farming. It increases food sources for bees including local bees.
You being a beekeeper, I appreciate. This is wonderful! 🐝
You getting winters off sounds a lot like a (a teacher) getting summers off :) I always love videos debunking claims like this!
So true! Not like you're not lesson planning, gathering materials, self educating that whole time...!
Thank you for your candid perspective on this. I have seen these claims from these well-known farmers and have taken several of their courses myself. I have learned a lot from them, but it is important that those considering farming as a future career recognize that these farmers and claims are selling you "the dream". Also, most of these courses teach you how to grow, but they do not teach you the business skills that are essential to building a profitable business.
Really helpful video! It's information like this that has helped me decide to keep my flower farming as a super tiny side-hustle instead of trying to expand. I love it so much but I don't think I would love it if I was hemorrhaging money. 😂
You didn't mention what I consider to be the two largest startup costs: land (and the maintenance and property taxes that go along with it) and soil remediation. If your soil is bad, it can take years to get really productive plants, unless you want to spend a fortune on bringing in compost from outside sources.
It's crazy to me that I see a lot of people jumping into flower farming with no experience gardening. Even just a small family garden is so much labor.
I agree! So many new flower farms around here, and people haven’t even grown veggies. It’s gonna hurt after awhile, sadly 😢
So true! 🌿
As a retired CPA, I applaud your reasoned approach to flower farming. The only thing I would add is that no government can repeal Murphy’s Law.
❤ thank you thank you for this informative video. It was really helpful!
Thank you for your transparency. I love growing flowers for bouquets in a small residential garden. Putting in the infrastructure from scratch (flower beds, raised flower beds, soil amendments, flower food, garden tools, irrigation timers and drip irrigation supplies, electrical conduit for hoops/tunnels, seeds etc) has been expensive. I'm investing into my hobby each year so I can grow more and scale it potentially for future sales, BUT i can't imagine how to set up a business plan to scale this to a professional farm. I imagine its a ton of work and lots of fine tuning every year. I like how you talk about risk and contingency plans that you have to consider (ex. You get hurt and can't work- hire someone-salary, loss of large crops-plant more than you need for spring, then summer, so your spending more on seeds as a backup plan). How does one learn how to get organized?😅 My goal is to learn how to make a variety of bouqs for spring, summer and fall using a variety of fillers this year. Im watching YTs to learn more about bouq recipes for the seasons and growing fillers. It's timing everything just right that i find most challenging. I'd like to learn how to utilze hoop houses to get earlier and later crops. Thanks for all you do to educate us. Much appreciated.
You are such a beautiful person! Thank you for sharing so much honest conversation on every aspect of home farming! You deliver so much valuable information! And you deliver it in a way that makes sense and is easy to digest and put to actual use! 😊💕
Thank you so much for this video, it repeats what I keep saying to people myself. I am a tiny urban flower farmer and I only get two months off in the winter, but my flower farm surrounds my house on a 0.146 acre city lot. How can I only take two months off when larger farms claim to be able to take more time off? Beats me. Also, the necessary infrastructure needed is so ignored in cost analysis, it is mind boggling to me.
Evelyn, I'm farming on 0.18 urban lot. It's so reassuring to learn about others doing this!!
@cognitive-botanical-therapy we are definitely not well represented on UA-cam, where a micro flower farm is anything under 5 acres. That's why I started my channel.
I'm only a hobby gardener but I used to do a lot of seed swaps. Sending them in the mail was getting too costly for me. I can only imagine how much it costs to ship flowers regularly especially with the rising costs. It's definitely something that gets overlooked when it comes to selling things nationwide or globally especially with people who sell their products online.
I've seen a lot of courses and videos about making a lot of money selling microgreens. People can make a lot of money growing microgreens but there's a lot more involved that doesn't always get covered like finding buyers and the start up costs. I feel like this is something similar to what you were covering in this video. Thanks for keeping it honest and showing the reality of growing things as a business.
I forgot to add licensing or certification costs. I live in Texas and it's required to have a nursery floral license that can cost $110 to $180 depending on the size of acres the grower has. It's the same for selling seedlings too. That's a start up cost that I've seen a lot of people not covering either because their state doesn't have restrictions or they just don't know about it.
You explain things in such a clear, well organised, and comprehensive way
Glad you think so!
So helpful! Thank you for taking the time to dispel some misconceptions. I find the idea of flower farming gets people by the romantic, whimsical image of being in a sun dress picking wildflowers and making $$$! Lol So not the case 😆🥰👩🏽🌾🌸
You are so inspiring to me! Last year was my first year professionally flower farming and I love your straight forward approach and sensibility, your attention to detail is so important I appreciate your thought process. I also follow your regenerative philosophies as I’m healing my family’s land through regenerative flower farming and you advice is helping in abundance 💛 I cannot wait for the day when I can have two sheep of my own :) thank you as always -Melanie
Also transportation and also to make sure you have locations that can actually buy /sell that many peonies 😅
Bingo!! Definitely not a one-person job!
As is your approach to all your content, such a thoughtful, analytical and encouraging (with the reality checks everyone needs to think through!) video. You remain my favorite youtuber to catch up with because I always learn something. Thank you for being so creative, encouraging, inquisitive, critical (in the best scientific sense of the word!), and generous in sharing your wisdom with us.
I appreciate that, thank you so much!!
@@Blossomandbranch Bri (Bree), not sure. I love the time, energy, thoughtfulness, honesty, and dirty hands you put into your videos. I have a 100 ft X 40 ft cut flower garden. I'm 72 years old and I'm totally surprised how many mistakes I have made my first year and the amount of physical energy that goes into Cut Flower Farming (especially crawling along on the hard ground on my hands and knees). I started my adventure without the help of your videos which would have saved me tons of time, money, and wrong decisions.
My favorite smile of the video was you and a staff member attempting to pull apart two plastic buckets that had hermetically sealed together. Did you ever get them apart? Better when they are cold/cool.
That was a terrific video. I have been thinking that the peony goldrush time is over. For those that invested 10 years ago kudos to you, for the insight. For me in Canada i see grocery store,s saturated with peony stems so I assume they are common. I am personally concerned about the future value of peonies with all the wholesale growers. Of course I live in Canada where we have no problem with providing them cool weather. It may be different in warmer zones..
Another trend I have noticed is all the videos and posts on growing 10 flowers. I am waiting for you to do a video on the pit falls of that retail business plan.
Cheers
Michelle
1]grow from seed, economically, repetitively
2]marketing who you planing to sell to?
3]plan to work very hard
✍️🏼
Bingo!
Also transportation and also to make sure you have locations that can actually buy /sell that many peonies
The transport and the staff to pack and ship everything in a timely manner!
I appreciate you so very much. I am 62 and planning to start flower farming as part of my retirement. Your information helps me to plan for a better business in flower farming. You’re truly helping Cannot thank you enough. Still planning on flower farming. Will just be educated and smart about it
Thank you for educating! This teaching allows people to make educated decisions. Not hasty ones.
My husband will be retiring in 5 years. We have been looking at properties to open a winery. Well we found it early. 20 acres of beautiful sloping hills. And right out there by the road... A garage with an attached building that will be perfect for a cut flower shop! She already has peonies hydrangeas and other plants growing, but I can't really tell what they are because we are deep into our fall season here in Michigan! I wish we could share pictures on this platform. It is right at the entrance of a huge lake, retirement, community. All of those little old ladies are going to have to pass my shop on their way home! I can also maybe have some craft classes to teach some projects in a hands on classroom type setting... But with wine! ☺️
That is awesome, you can do it!! Sounds beautiful!
@Blossomandbranch I ordered your marketing plan for Gardens and I can't find the download. I've sent you an email.
As long as flower farm workers in Central America are earning $2 an hour, Trader Joes will continue to Fly in their flowers exclusively.
I’m not a flower farmer, and but I’m an veg grower & started a cut flower garden for my enjoyment. We’re working with limited space- but I’ve made sure to plant lots of other plants around my peonies! We’ve got 4 varieties of marigolds, 2 or nasturtiums, poppies, borage, and more!
Thanks for leading viewers through the whole thinking and research process.
To get the buckets unstuck you should try blowing compressed air between them. Saw a TikTok of it from the “what, no way” guy
The buckets are just air suctioned together! Take a yard stick, or something similar and wedge it down until the suction breaks loose! Thanks for the awesome info!
Oh we’ve tried that too 😂😂
I think like most things in life selling flowers is not a get rich easy and quick scheme. You never can predict the weather or natural disasters. While the start up costs are cheaper than most start up businesses (especially if scaled up gradually) if you go into it with unrealistic expectations you will de disappointed and could get burned. I appreciate your honesty, people rarely are as open about cost and money as you have been.
I might reframe that I start up cost are more **enjoyable** but they are not ***less*** than a different kind of startup business… (there’s so many kinds of businesses//costs….)
The overhead view of your gardens is amazing!
Great info, things that look to go good to be true usually are! I can't believe anyone would invest so much in one crop, some years my peonies are spectacular and other years, yes things go wrong. This year they were all nibbled, only slightly, they still looked fabulous in the garden, but no they couldn't be sold as $4 stems. Diversification is the only way to flower farm, loose one crop, yes it's upsetting but there are others to fall back on. Now that our planet is in such crisis the weather is so unpredictable it's never a given that anything will crop. It's been crazy mild here in the UK, 9 degrees C up until this week, I've got plants leafing up..going to be a dodgy spring.
I admire your gardening/farming practices. And appreciate your honesty. Thank you 🌱
If you want to get buckets unstuck, use an air compressor and a narrow nozzle. To keep wet buckets from sticking, take a small chunk of wet sponge, put that piece in between each bucket, guaranteed to pull apart every time.
Thankyou for being so honest. I have only just closed my candy store after 15 years and gone back to my horticultural background. After the 2019 Black Summer Bushfires we were issued grants to assist us with business management which were hefty costs and the two people that wanted to take us on just left us on the kerb once they got their payments. I am completely gun shy now on signing up to courses that claim the world and give nothing in return. This year as our property was so devastated by the bushfires we are finally at a point that we can begin this new chapter of our lives, and after watching your videos for the past 12 months I have grown everything from seed myself and even though we are late getting those in if I get a few blooms or some tuber growth with the dahlias Im completely happy with that. We have planted over 400 strawberries into our gardens as a you pick and will be doing markets and have been working on recipes to utilise our strawberries for this next 12 months and selling those products at our local food markets. My belief is there is no magic spell that is going to turn our adventure into our retirement fund in the next 3-5 years, but the joy of being back in the gardens and growing fresh produce and flowers is going to give me more life fulfilment. Again thankyou for the videos you share, I am forever rewatching and learning from your guidance. Cheers Theresa Australia :)
I'm enjoying being entrepreneurial because a base income gives security and helps mitigate anxiety.
Thank you!! I fell for this exact trap for a second. It seemed way too good to be true. Then all of you great very seasoned farmers released your thoughts and put the truth out there. THANK YOU!
I so appreciate this video of facts! We are going into farming to help with retirement so knowing the reality helps make us plan variables and keep diversity.
I found your channel as a suggestion by youtube channel "In the garden w/ Lisa Monique" I am in E/C TN and new to flower gardening. I am looking forward to digging into your videos and learning!
I just subscribed because I love your regenerative gardening/farming practices! I also learned something new about the peonies that I inherited when I bought my house. Thanks for doing what you do!
The peony craze doesn’t bother me, if you go bottom up, you can always sell mature potted peonies to get part of your investment back (total cost of the root + extra cost to cover a little of the labor.) it’s the tulips that drive me nuts! Yes, some farmers make a killing, but I see year 1 farmers investing heavy into tulips with hardly the customer base to do the volume for the profits and sell before the blow open. Just my personal opinion/observations.
Great video, really appreciate your honesty and knowledge. Where is the link for the flower bouquet course?
Check now, at the bottom of the description! Haha, thanks!
I love growing from seed except for lisis. I soil block too! Flower farming is lots of hard work but very rewarding. Great video!
Going into my 4th year flower farming & I agree with everything you've said! The hardest part for me has been marketing & advertising & finding the best avenue for making sales in my area... everyone is going to have a different niche that works for them. Right now, selling at farmers markets is what works for me... some people may do better with a roadside stand, selling to florists, wholesale, etc.
But either way, whatever rpute you take, its definitely a lot of hard, backbreaking, physical work, & if you dont enjoy gardening, & being outside in nature, (even when its 100 degrees) youre not going to enjoy farming...
Thanks for the reality check! I have plenty to keep my busy with my garden and foraging, harvesting and putting up food. I don't have the energy on top of that to also run a flower business and all that it would entail. I am also a scientist working in Alaska so I see all too well the effects of a warming Arctic in our region (degrading permafrost, increase in fires, duration, and frequency; increase growing season length, temps and growing degree days. Anyone whose livelihood depends on favorable environmental conditions (farmers, ski resort operators, commercial fisher people, etc.) would benefit from better understanding climate change model predictions for their areas. Alaskans have a large, late season market on Peonies because they bloom later then those grown in the lower 48 states but with our warming climate and extended growing season, there may be a "shift toward earlier blooming times, which put Alaska’s peonies
in more direct competition with other markets." I also wonder if those in the Lower 48 states looking to get into commercial peony growing are taking into consideration climate change. "Relatively cool winter temperatures are necessary for the plant roots to achieve dormancy. Therefore, as long as temperatures are consistently below 43°F for 70 days, dormancy will be achieved." These quoted sections are copied directly from this little info document produced by the Scenarios Network for Alaska and Arctic Planning, a climate change research group at the University of Alaska Fairbanks (UAF) International Arctic Research Center. uaf-snap.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/Peony-report.pdf The point is, there are so many things to consider when contemplating starting a farm. In interior Alaska, when farmers scraped away/bulldozed the forest to create fields, they exposed the ground to heat and eventually, if the fields were underlain by discontinuous permafrost, those areas starting sinking in and or becoming more wet. Huge fields were abandoned because of this.
Don’t forget in the winter - education! Farming is always changing and if you don’t keep up you can get left behind’
Thank you for your sincere explanation! Very refreshing 👏
Thank you for talking openly and honestly!
This is a very good video! Thanks for being brave and saying the truth, which is not always pretty. I appreciate it!
You talk so much sense and it's really good of you to educate others on this
Beautiful photos! I never really think about flower farms commercially (grew up cattle country lol - no flowers in sight! 😅)
What does this look like for growing a number of flower varieties and not just peonies? I appreciate your candor, although I do feel like my dreams of being a flower farmer were crushed before they even began 😢
Another viral video I’ve seen recently is that buying plugs is more profitable than starting from seed. 🤔
I saw that one too! SO much information glossed over in those videos.
Plug Connection is 30 minutes from me. No shipping and handling certainly makes it more attractive for me.
@@floweringevergreen3584that definitely helps!!!
``Might be true if you are useless at starting seeds...but then maybe flower farming was a poor choice 😂 Seeds are super cheap, crazy buying plugs IMHO.
I think it depends on how many flowers they are growing and factoring in the time it takes to start from seed instead of plugs. For some people the extra cost of plugs is worth the cost because they can use that time elsewhere. I think it only works out if they are a large scale operation. It could also be demand versus size too. I've seen a lot of small family run businesses switching to plugs because it's easier for them to keep up with the amount of all the flowers/produce they grow for market.
You really caught my attention talking about plastic. As a start up, I'm really trying to avoid it but it's challenging - most veg or flower growers on UA-cam utilize it. Any suggestions on how to begin & maintain beds while avoiding plastic?
Deep mulch is a great alternative that will enrich your soil and avoid plastic while helping prevent weeds! Cover crops are also very helpful.
Generally great info on peonies, but after successfully growing peonies for cutflower and root sales for 20 years, I have to say you are still a bit unrealistic about the amount of work, the level of production per plant and the difficult of turning those blooms into cash. By Iarge though, this is one of the most helpful presentations I seen for anyone who is thinking about peonies as a business venture
Thank you for the cautionary tale and wake up call. Super useful, and it really shows you are doing it and sharing your personal experience. ❤
Wonderful topic! Thank you for sharing your experience and knowledge! I love your videos and always learn something 😊
I’m anxious to hear the results of your soil blocking method.
Great video, thanks.
Thank you for saying this!! I thought I was the only one getting annoyed with the constant workshop sales pitches and misleading info. I used to love listening to the podcasts of one of these farmers, but they’re so focused on workshop sales now. A lot of the content overlooks the reality of the industry. So disappointing 😞
I agree. Very disillusioning… 😢
An excellent and informative video, especially regarding peonies - which is why I ignored all the hype forty years ago in favour of something far more profitable!
Smart to see through! There are so many articles about the same thing happening in Alaska. Many growers invested before they learned there was very little money after all
I can’t wait to see more of your garden❤
Such a great video! Thank you. I have been looking into greenhouses for my backyard. I really liked the one I saw in the first few shots of this video. What is that brand? Or did you build it yourself? Definitely subscribing!
What would be your thoughts on partnering with a local bee keeper? Or starting a bee colony in this setting? Is this just added expense and labor, or will supplying more pollinators to the area increase health in plants enough to be worthwhile?
I really appreciate the in depth information provided.
Thanks for your honesty, Bri. So glad you're here. I'd been wondering if you were going to start overwintering your dahlias after hearing Jennie Love talking about that. 😁
Yes! This is our second year doing it, her method works quite well-I use leaves instead of straw but we have had great success!
Seeing you and your friend trying to separate buckets!!!
Try placing the group upside down. Place your foot on the lower handle, on the ground. Lift buckets with force, holding the outter buckets on the butt end. Slightly twist. Good luck!
Putting your MBA to good use! Which UC did you get it from? I got mine from UCSD in 2017 for other endeavors, but now I'm toying with a small flower business similar to Danielle at Northlawn Flower Farm.
Thank you and glad to see you here! My MBA is from UC Irvine 😀
@@Blossomandbranch I've learned SO much from you. I've watched a number of your videos 2-4 times.
Thanks for the information. I have also heard that you can’t grow peonies if you don’t get frost or snow. They need the cold to bud. I don’t get either so I don’t grow peonies.
I retired last March. Just trying to garden and work 5 horses is a full-time job. No way would I be able to even think of doing a cut flower business in retirement.
New subscriber. Love your video. Where are you located?
Colorado! And thank you!
I need your marketing course... thanks for your wisdom and advise from a grower yr one
Thank you so much for the honest truth about flower farming. I started a flower farm last year. I did a You-pick flower farm. I am still learning a lot!! I love that you use Sil blockers. I have never used them. Where do you get the Soil for them. This is so new to me. The trays you use, where would I get them. Thank you again for your video so helpful!
She has a couple videos about soil block mixes. I started soil blocking last year and LOVE IT. Give it a shot!
Your videos are always so good and very informative. Thank you!
Beautiful sweater!
Thank you! 😊 I wish I had knitted it but someone else did for me -it’s a skill I’d like to learn!
Thank you for all this information ❤
This is such good, honest info. Super super helpful.
I’m surprised you labeled the peony BS only “misleading” and not “wildly misleading.” You have more restraint than I do!
I am willing to bet, however, that selling courses to teach people how to make $240k/year growing peonies is very profitable!
Thank you for sharing your expertise 💚
Totally agree with you!!! Love your style and videos.
Gotta love a good debunking video.
Thank you. A few peony questions: how many plants do you have? My summer annual patch is just 30x75. I put about 60 peony roots in last fall and about 50 more this fall. At the end of the summer a couple plants looked like boytritis...do you have a resolution for this? I read about coral charm being susceptible, and i think thats what it was. This fall new roots of other varieties were planted on either side. Should i did up those roots, or wait to be sure i have plants with that fungus, and treat accordingly? Will they show signs of it automatically this year? I was contemplating adding another 100 this coming fall, just bc the deer leave them alone and they bloom when im not harvesting much else.
Love your honesty!
I also think you should mention that soooo many people have invested in peonies in the last 5 years, I worry the market will be saturated when most of these peonies come to maturity, which could mean that you get even less of a price for your flowers.
Yes, this was the case in Alaska!
I mean $8.99 for 5 peonies at Trader Joe's from a local farm in Oregon with 40,000 plants @@Blossomandbranch
Is the same true for not harvesting dahlias for three years for the energy to go back into the tubers?
Do you not do any floras teas in the off season?
If my peonies have 7-8 eyes is the disbudding for 3 years still recommended?
Can I ask please,who do you sell that many flowers to.
Good rant!
I just want joy in learning and surrounding myself in more flowers. If you teach a course on your property, let me know and I'll be the first to sign up. Your info is pro, no fluff, and your competence if obvious! Show me the way!
I have also heard this type of claim with Lavender farming. I also heard that most Lavender farms loose up to 30% of their crop every spring that they have to replant. Is that true?
I would imagine lavender farming would have the same problem. Unless you’re turning the lavender into a value add like essential oils or wreaths, etc
I’m in sales and this economy is terrible so I’m growing plants as a side hustle. I don’t have that kind of land so unfortunately I am limited on what I can make unless I grow rare stuff.
Yikes. Thanks for the info.
Very interesting -thank you!!
Blows my mind that anyone thinks harvesting enough peonies to make 240k a year would be "easy". I'm no farmer but I've had 3 peonies I've been growing for a few years now and I barely ever get more than 2 flowers off of each one. Admittedly I'm not the best gardener and could be doing a lot more to make them produce better but I don't have the time! x