You are too humble. You are one of the most influential ak authorities i can think of. Mischa is the gun monk that lives in the woods. Kinda like Obi gun kanobi
I had started a Pioneer Arms Firearm Owners group on FB because there weren't any groups I could find that would discuss these firearms. When PAC went down, CJ, their Florida branch's VP, joined our group and informed us of a lot that went down at PAC. Long and the short of it, he let us know the owner of Pioneer in Poland stopped funding the group in Florida. He stated that everyone got fired and ATF took over everything in the building and firearms that were sent in for repair were stuck in ATF limbo. The group is still going, people are still reporting good things on their firearms, there's just no WTY support and you're kind of on your own.
No chance of a return, according to CJ? there was an update recently from another UA-camr with emails from PAC saying they may re-enter the US market in some form. I'm just super wishful, I love my 20 inch sporter, I have made it a Tabuk at home :)
@@Pallek997 The owner of the Pioneer brand is currently the Polska SVRN company, which until recently produced only very good quality AR-15 system rifles. After taking over Pioneer, it also offers AK system rifles under the names: AKMS Sporter, AKM Hellpup, AKM Sporter, AKM 22LR.
As the former VP of pioneer arms US. I can say we did are very best to only ship the best AKs to customers. After 7 long years of fighting with Poland and 2 in 10 guns being shipped over from Poland that needed major repairs the owner fired all employees in the US because we had over 2600 guns manufacturer so poorly they could not be repaired. That’s why you don’t see anymore .22 and hellpuppy over gassed to point of destruction. IO was never the problem the problem always was Poland. Building a great rifle takes money and when the owner of the company only cares about profit not product reliability that’s what you get. He now trying to find a new way to dump trash on the us market. In short everyone that ensured that AK you tested worked great are no longer there. In my opinion pioneer arms will be right back the way they used to be.
Thank you, notice i didn't blame IO or much of anyone else. I did my best to gloss over the earlier guns and earlier issues. This is only about hte here and now. In the end, i concluded that it was about profit; or rather lack there of for PAC.
I have had pretty good luck with my AK 22 by Pioneer. It’s still new and with 22 of course there’s always a preference in ammo that a particular firearm likes. I also figured that if it is malfunctioning I will just wrench on it till it works or it becomes a wall hanger. Just my two cents
I got one of their under folders from Classic firearms and it’s been an awesome rifle for the price. No issues with wear or function. For under $600 I couldn’t be more pleased with the product I received.
About 600 rounds now on my 20" Sporter blem. No strange wear yet. And always gotta mention it was 500 from Pioneer US in 2024. I don't pretend it's something better than it is but worth what I paid in today's market.
Had a tussle with someone on line on who knew more about AKs...You or Brandon Herrera...i told them you had probably forgot more than Brandon knew..lol I know he's pretty good but your knowledge goes way beyond anyone on line today.....thanks for everything...
@jefferyboring4410 more like oranges to oranges..Brandon spends more time combing his hair than studying Kalashnikovs .. everyone knows Fuller is king of builders..your not paying attention except to how Brandons a sexy UA-cam mother lover😛
I had bought a pioneer arms Hellpuppy the smaller version of the hellpup and I love it bro it’s tactical has 4 pic rails to add attachments and I’ve shot around 1500 rounds thru it so far and it’s been good to me
I may be wrong but it looks like the buttstock Pioneer put on there has a higher comb than normal soviet spec, that's also what caused the Zastava cheek slap too
Thank you for covering this! I was curious as to what took place with them. I DID want their 20” sporter model with a forged trunion but it seems too late now.
The owner of the Pioneer brand is currently the Polska SVRN company, which until recently produced only very good quality AR-15 system rifles. After taking over Pioneer, it also offers AK system rifles under the names: AKMS Sporter, AKM Hellpup, AKM Sporter, AKM 22LR.
The gun market is softening big time. Bummed that PA went out of business because it was still available option especially for those just wanting to test the AK waters.
@ agreed. I have their 556 under folder that bought for poo and giggles. It’s been a great shoot and just plain (knock on wood). I tried looking for a good overview of FEG 9mm but couldn’t find video from you.
Low round count (~400) on a forged 5.56.. quality seems similar to psa 101 I sold for it. Gave it an occam makeover.. Market is rough rn and the AK comminty is always brutal, not shocked a budget company went under
I have to agree with you PAC was really getting good in recent days. They were certainly giving PSA and Century a run for their money which was comical. Fit and finish is really nice on mine, I have to say. Fortunately, I was able to snag a 20" sporter right before they closed the doors lol. I thought it was great value for the money. I still need to do some first shots with it, but I did notice Aim Surplus still has some in stock.
What brand magazines work with the Pioneer Sporter. I just got a underfolder and have only one magazine? So far I really like the rifle. Fit and finish is great! A big Thanks to the guys who worked there butt's off here in the USA fixing all the problems they could trying to make a great firearm!
I was watching an older video about the history of arsenal, where you went through and named and described all the different models. You described an ak and said that the madel escaped your memory but guessed that it was an sgl 32.. was just letting you that you were correct. I have one
After having bought an Pioneer AK after watching y'all's 9-month trial with one, the title kinda gave me a mini-heart attack. Good thing I now know to not put sunscreen in it lol
Have a forged underfolder but did not throw it out a tree. It does not have as many rounds to it. I also have 0 complaints. Accept for the crappy pistol grip it came with. Which I changed
I bought a burned polish kit 1969 model circle ⭕️ 11 apparently some factory burned down. It’s been a good one. No odd bolt lug wear best ak kit deal I ever got. Was lucky I suppose just lucky but I’ve had several good builds from burned guns
I think their problem was that they had such a bad reputation they could not recover even after they started making a "good" product. The damage was done it was too late for them. Maybe if they went away for a short time and came back under a different name with new marketing and 100% guarantee they may have made it.
I wish someone would make more WWII semi-auto conversions. I remember when the PPS43c was going for around 300 in either 7.62Tok or 9mm. The kits are still very available.
Agreed. Problem I see with that is the start up costs of doing so. Parts kits are a finite resource, and there’s no telling the true quality of individual kits when they get them, plus the fact that many of those guns require hand fitting on top of just rebuilding them; this requires even more experience than just getting employees who know how to TIG or run a CNC. Hell, just getting the equipment and property to run an operation doing that is enough of an issue already. Anyway, add all that and compare it against the relatively small market within the overall firearms market… it’s not a super good look to invest into. It’s the same as all of the older rifles, pistols and such that I see people wondering why they aren’t reproduced by a new company; it’s just too prohibitive to cut into.
The fit and finish on the Pioneers is really nice. The only minor complaints I ever had was with the magwell being a little tight and shape of the wood front lower handguard. Seemed a little too modern of a profile on the palm swell for an AKM.
I have 2 of them...556 and the 762 both forged both just run everything you feed them... ive beat the heck outa the 556 and it just runs and it was a blem gun to start with.... idk mine are both awesome fer the price
I found you a helping person, tell me something how do i reduce from my molot russian made skeleton buttstock 308,(20 inch barrel) with less less invest over it Second do i keep this or i selk this out
When I bought mine, steel magazines would not fit in the magwell. I ended up filing the back of the magwell above the mag catch until the mags finally clicked in nicely. The U.S. import and conversion could have been better
Honestly, i think the USA side was the better one. A lot of QC issues were caught by those guys. When it comes to opening up magwell, just remember; can always remove more material if needed but its very difficult to add metal back if you take off too much.
I’ve got the grom underfolder, the warranty that came with it said it would be voided if you removed the pinned and welded extension. It hasn’t been shot mainly got it to have it.
I’ll give them this, they made that platform actually sbr ready vs the zastava m92 underfolder with the extension. can’t believe zastava was so lazy they just used the hole in the rear receiver to attach a bolted on underfolder.
If u wanna soften up a ak. Take an angle grinder or whatever and just cut a groove in the piston leak off a little pressure. I dunno why ppl judge high gas so bad. It’s a silly easy fix . Grind to much spot weld it up a bit
@ yep lots of ppl come in to sell things to me. I just tell em how it is and to try and wait. Hopefully it’ll be better next summer! Or so ,, bad election yr I tell em!
Those RAKs were so different and cool years ago and expensive. Too costly to be an impulse buy so i just forgot about them. I didn't remember them being a Pioneer product. That whole playing games with origin of manufacturer made them a no-buy for me.
Honestly I never minded a little "roughness around the edges" on an AKM. My 85' md65 even has some tooling marks on the charging handle. It gives it that authentic end of a dictatorship aesthetic. Too bad Pioneer went with MIM trunnions from the outset. It is hard to bring quality up later on and keep the same price. Also, word of mouth can be a death sentence in the modern internet gun community. Look how the Smith & Wesson CSX got nuked shortly after launch on UA-cam.
I think the entry level market for these guns is drying up cause of the ammo situation. If you could still get x39 for $200-250/Case, they'd be selling like gangbusters.
@@mattmorrison9379 PSL is a bit cheaper, mags are easier to find (generally speaking), and really we've seen slightly better accuracy too. M91 is nice but back when i had to sell one: PSL, M76, or M91? It was the one to go and it wasn't even a difficult call.
Misha. How are you with 7.62 x 25 ammo ? Shipping costs are high. I need to come your way one day. Would like to meet you. I'm about 150 miles east of you. I have a crate wirh your name on it. Also other calibers that I know yall go through on the channel. I bought a bunch of the Tok ammo few years back whenever you could buy the Pps 43 C and 4 mags for $400 bucks. But I slept on it and now they are $800.. So here I sits..
I found it a little suspicious and it could be just coincidence that that they were no longer going to be making the Beryl and were gonna be ramping up production on the Grot that within a month or two months that pioneer was done, and it was rumor they were getting some of their parts from FB Radom, also Misha you gotta get fox to shoot some of that old Norinco ammo, if you shot it, you know you shot it cause a very distinctive odor
Oh yeah, at least mostly. Most things like AR15s and AKs are very slow ATM; but..then there are random collectibles and C&R firearms that are very popular and selling for more right now. I'd say the market is 80% slow, with a 20% booming l ittle corner of oddities. Hope that makes sense? lol
You are too humble. You are one of the most influential ak authorities i can think of. Mischa is the gun monk that lives in the woods. Kinda like Obi gun kanobi
But doesn’t have time to respond to your comment. Shame
@@DelGTAGrndrsi never needed a response.
@@DelGTAGrndrs he will respond if you have a interesting question or topic.
He has responded to me quite a few times over the years...
@@DelGTAGrndrs Or simply didn't see it? Sometimes people don't do things out of mallace or bad motivations.
@DelGTAGrndrs He is the only blind UA-camr I know. Perhaps it is very time consuming to respond to hundreds of comments using assistance.
I had started a Pioneer Arms Firearm Owners group on FB because there weren't any groups I could find that would discuss these firearms. When PAC went down, CJ, their Florida branch's VP, joined our group and informed us of a lot that went down at PAC. Long and the short of it, he let us know the owner of Pioneer in Poland stopped funding the group in Florida. He stated that everyone got fired and ATF took over everything in the building and firearms that were sent in for repair were stuck in ATF limbo. The group is still going, people are still reporting good things on their firearms, there's just no WTY support and you're kind of on your own.
Hey there! I’m one of your admins on your grup. And like you said a lot of good things people are posting. Small PA community, love it
He has now commented on this video too.
No chance of a return, according to CJ? there was an update recently from another UA-camr with emails from PAC saying they may re-enter the US market in some form. I'm just super wishful, I love my 20 inch sporter, I have made it a Tabuk at home :)
@@Pallek997 The owner of the Pioneer brand is currently the Polska SVRN company, which until recently produced only very good quality AR-15 system rifles. After taking over Pioneer, it also offers AK system rifles under the names: AKMS Sporter, AKM Hellpup, AKM Sporter, AKM 22LR.
As the former VP of pioneer arms US. I can say we did are very best to only ship the best AKs to customers. After 7 long years of fighting with Poland and 2 in 10 guns being shipped over from Poland that needed major repairs the owner fired all employees in the US because we had over 2600 guns manufacturer so poorly they could not be repaired. That’s why you don’t see anymore .22 and hellpuppy over gassed to point of destruction. IO was never the problem the problem always was Poland. Building a great rifle takes money and when the owner of the company only cares about profit not product reliability that’s what you get. He now trying to find a new way to dump trash on the us market. In short everyone that ensured that AK you tested worked great are no longer there. In my opinion pioneer arms will be right back the way they used to be.
Dang, 2,600 poorly built guns seems like an awful waste of money and time to no end. Too bad.
Thank you, notice i didn't blame IO or much of anyone else. I did my best to gloss over the earlier guns and earlier issues. This is only about hte here and now. In the end, i concluded that it was about profit; or rather lack there of for PAC.
I have had pretty good luck with my AK 22 by Pioneer. It’s still new and with 22 of course there’s always a preference in ammo that a particular firearm likes. I also figured that if it is malfunctioning I will just wrench on it till it works or it becomes a wall hanger. Just my two cents
Sad but truth. Pionier Arms = SVRN (now) - Short story about fast money.
I got one of their under folders from Classic firearms and it’s been an awesome rifle for the price. No issues with wear or function. For under $600 I couldn’t be more pleased with the product I received.
Nice Video Thanks Misha and Fox 😀😇😀 The Pioneer Is Still Kicking 👍🏼😇👍🏼
Thank you, that does make sense.
100% great info.
Always, thanks
thank you, cheers
The launch off the porch at the end got a chuckle out of me, didn't expect it
About 600 rounds now on my 20" Sporter blem. No strange wear yet. And always gotta mention it was 500 from Pioneer US in 2024. I don't pretend it's something better than it is but worth what I paid in today's market.
Had a tussle with someone on line on who knew more about AKs...You or Brandon Herrera...i told them you had probably forgot more than Brandon knew..lol I know he's pretty good but your knowledge goes way beyond anyone on line today.....thanks for everything...
I Totally Agree Misha is The Gun Jesus of AK’s 😇
Word
Brandon Herrera is a roided out, coked out, shawty who is ALL about the grift. 🤣🤣🤣
Ya but it’s historical knowledge not builder working knowledge. It’s apples and oranges. It’s a silly argument
@jefferyboring4410 more like oranges to oranges..Brandon spends more time combing his hair than studying Kalashnikovs ..
everyone knows Fuller is king of builders..your not paying attention except to how Brandons a sexy UA-cam mother lover😛
Great video, Misha. Thanks for this
I speak for everyone, we’d be lost without you.
Been waiting for you to talk on this subject
I had bought a pioneer arms Hellpuppy the smaller version of the hellpup and I love it bro it’s tactical has 4 pic rails to add attachments and I’ve shot around 1500 rounds thru it so far and it’s been good to me
Thank you!
I may be wrong but it looks like the buttstock Pioneer put on there has a higher comb than normal soviet spec, that's also what caused the Zastava cheek slap too
Thank you for covering this!
I was curious as to what took place with them.
I DID want their 20” sporter model with a forged trunion but it seems too late now.
Super
The owner of the Pioneer brand is currently the Polska SVRN company, which until recently produced only very good quality AR-15 system rifles. After taking over Pioneer, it also offers AK system rifles under the names: AKMS Sporter, AKM Hellpup, AKM Sporter, AKM 22LR.
The gun market is softening big time. Bummed that PA went out of business because it was still available option especially for those just wanting to test the AK waters.
Honestly? I'd have recommended a PAC over a PSA if someone was decided just between those two.
@ agreed. I have their 556 under folder that bought for poo and giggles. It’s been a great shoot and just plain (knock on wood).
I tried looking for a good overview of FEG 9mm but couldn’t find video from you.
Low round count (~400) on a forged 5.56.. quality seems similar to psa 101 I sold for it.
Gave it an occam makeover..
Market is rough rn and the AK comminty is always brutal, not shocked a budget company went under
I have to agree with you PAC was really getting good in recent days. They were certainly giving PSA and Century a run for their money which was comical. Fit and finish is really nice on mine, I have to say. Fortunately, I was able to snag a 20" sporter right before they closed the doors lol. I thought it was great value for the money. I still need to do some first shots with it, but I did notice Aim Surplus still has some in stock.
What brand magazines work with the Pioneer Sporter. I just got a underfolder and have only one magazine? So far I really like the rifle. Fit and finish is great! A big Thanks to the guys who worked there butt's off here in the USA fixing all the problems they could trying to make a great firearm!
I have a fixed stock 7.62 model and magpul mags go in and out easily but they don't have metal feed lips, they're fine for a range mag though
I was watching an older video about the history of arsenal, where you went through and named and described all the different models. You described an ak and said that the madel escaped your memory but guessed that it was an sgl 32.. was just letting you that you were correct. I have one
Damn it, Misha. I have been out of the loop and just ordered a PM-63c before they are gone because of this video.
After having bought an Pioneer AK after watching y'all's 9-month trial with one, the title kinda gave me a mini-heart attack. Good thing I now know to not put sunscreen in it lol
While i try and avoid 'click bate', i just couldn't resist that one. That reaction to the smell was 100% sincere & unscripted too.
Have a forged underfolder but did not throw it out a tree. It does not have as many rounds to it. I also have 0 complaints. Accept for the crappy pistol grip it came with. Which I changed
Did anyone else notice it didn’t actually hit the tree? Well Maby the butt stock touched it.
I bought a burned polish kit 1969 model circle ⭕️ 11 apparently some factory burned down. It’s been a good one. No odd bolt lug wear best ak kit deal I ever got. Was lucky I suppose just lucky but I’ve had several good builds from burned guns
That's one way to deliver an AK.
airmail
I think their problem was that they had such a bad reputation they could not recover even after they started making a "good" product. The damage was done it was too late for them. Maybe if they went away for a short time and came back under a different name with new marketing and 100% guarantee they may have made it.
New brand (in Poland) - suveren small arms poland (SVRN)
not AK - now AR15
lol
I wish someone would make more WWII semi-auto conversions. I remember when the PPS43c was going for around 300 in either 7.62Tok or 9mm. The kits are still very available.
Agreed. Problem I see with that is the start up costs of doing so. Parts kits are a finite resource, and there’s no telling the true quality of individual kits when they get them, plus the fact that many of those guns require hand fitting on top of just rebuilding them; this requires even more experience than just getting employees who know how to TIG or run a CNC. Hell, just getting the equipment and property to run an operation doing that is enough of an issue already.
Anyway, add all that and compare it against the relatively small market within the overall firearms market… it’s not a super good look to invest into. It’s the same as all of the older rifles, pistols and such that I see people wondering why they aren’t reproduced by a new company; it’s just too prohibitive to cut into.
The fit and finish on the Pioneers is really nice. The only minor complaints I ever had was with the magwell being a little tight and shape of the wood front lower handguard. Seemed a little too modern of a profile on the palm swell for an AKM.
What years were most reliable
Good video, too bad they aren't available anymore. At least Pioneer kept trying to improve their product, can't knock them for that.
I have 2 of them...556 and the 762 both forged both just run everything you feed them... ive beat the heck outa the 556 and it just runs and it was a blem gun to start with.... idk mine are both awesome fer the price
I found you a helping person, tell me something how do i reduce from my molot russian made skeleton buttstock 308,(20 inch barrel) with less less invest over it
Second do i keep this or i selk this out
Omg ❤❤❤❤ I love the angle of topic’s and historical firearms lessons. God bless fearless MF
That sun screen smell 😅
WHEN PAC SHOWED PROMISE THEY GO BELLY UP I WANTED THE 20" SPORTER
FYI, Aim Surplus has the 20" Sporter still in stock....I got one directly from PAC right before they closed the doors.
When I bought mine, steel magazines would not fit in the magwell. I ended up filing the back of the magwell above the mag catch until the mags finally clicked in nicely. The U.S. import and conversion could have been better
Honestly, i think the USA side was the better one. A lot of QC issues were caught by those guys. When it comes to opening up magwell, just remember; can always remove more material if needed but its very difficult to add metal back if you take off too much.
What I like about ak is u can work on em with a mig ? Big hammer files regular tools and actually do some good things.
@@jefferyboring4410 damn straight
I’ve got the grom underfolder, the warranty that came with it said it would be voided if you removed the pinned and welded extension. It hasn’t been shot mainly got it to have it.
I’ll give them this, they made that platform actually sbr ready vs the zastava m92 underfolder with the extension. can’t believe zastava was so lazy they just used the hole in the rear receiver to attach a bolted on underfolder.
@@uzileopard6199 Yeah, that was pretty gross IMO.
If u wanna soften up a ak. Take an angle grinder or whatever and just cut a groove in the piston leak off a little pressure. I dunno why ppl judge high gas so bad. It’s a silly easy fix . Grind to much spot weld it up a bit
I have an antique shop and I feel bad economy. Sales are half what’s normal 2024.
Yep, its not been a great year for the entire gun business. All we can do is push on through and be careful with our dimes.
@ yep lots of ppl come in to sell things to me. I just tell em how it is and to try and wait. Hopefully it’ll be better next summer! Or so ,, bad election yr I tell em!
Those RAKs were so different and cool years ago and expensive. Too costly to be an impulse buy so i just forgot about them. I didn't remember them being a Pioneer product. That whole playing games with origin of manufacturer made them a no-buy for me.
To be fair, at least a majority of the parks were original (11) / FB-Radom types.
Honestly I never minded a little "roughness around the edges" on an AKM. My 85' md65 even has some tooling marks on the charging handle. It gives it that authentic end of a dictatorship aesthetic. Too bad Pioneer went with MIM trunnions from the outset. It is hard to bring quality up later on and keep the same price. Also, word of mouth can be a death sentence in the modern internet gun community. Look how the Smith & Wesson CSX got nuked shortly after launch on UA-cam.
I think the entry level market for these guns is drying up cause of the ammo situation. If you could still get x39 for $200-250/Case, they'd be selling like gangbusters.
One for the algorithm. And while im here, PSL or M91? What say you Misha ? Lol
Personally? PSL
@misha5670 yeah, just in general. I think I'm with you on this as well. M91 looks amazing, fit and finish etc. The PSL is more iconic I reckon.
@@mattmorrison9379 PSL is a bit cheaper, mags are easier to find (generally speaking), and really we've seen slightly better accuracy too. M91 is nice but back when i had to sell one: PSL, M76, or M91? It was the one to go and it wasn't even a difficult call.
Misha. How are you with 7.62 x 25 ammo ?
Shipping costs are high.
I need to come your way one day.
Would like to meet you.
I'm about 150 miles east of you.
I have a crate wirh your name on it.
Also other calibers that I know yall go through on the channel.
I bought a bunch of the Tok ammo few years back whenever you could buy the Pps 43 C and 4 mags for $400 bucks.
But I slept on it and now they are $800..
So here I sits..
Would you say it's just as gud as a WASR?
I want to smell that piston rod now.
That's what she said
So that's what you meant when you said 'smell test'. 🤔
*wink* completely unplanned
@@misha5670All the 7.62 Teleammo I ran smelled like skunk, lol.
just what the founding fathers had in mind.
I think the previous video was more of that; shooting guns with the French heeh.
Wow, ok... YT not allowing anything critical of the product to be posted? Didn't say anything Misha didn't. The collapse can't come soon enough.
What’s up with that tall ass rail? lol.
Talk about height over bore. 😂
that is standard is a standard rail and they are made that way so you can still field strip the gun and not have to remove your optic...
There starting back up in the usa.... not saying who there partner is yet but they are firing back up...👍
If you read down in the comments here, you will see an interesting one about all that.
I found it a little suspicious and it could be just coincidence that that they were no longer going to be making the Beryl and were gonna be ramping up production on the Grot that within a month or two months that pioneer was done, and it was rumor they were getting some of their parts from FB Radom, also Misha you gotta get fox to shoot some of that old Norinco ammo, if you shot it, you know you shot it cause a very distinctive odor
FB Radom makes the Beryl, not WBP, and it’s the Grot not Grom. So you can put your suspicions to rest. 😊
@@BD1234-e8x Well he was close to the name. Grom is a popular Honda.
Misha, do you see evidence that the gun market has softened a lot?
Oh yeah, at least mostly. Most things like AR15s and AKs are very slow ATM; but..then there are random collectibles and C&R firearms that are very popular and selling for more right now. I'd say the market is 80% slow, with a 20% booming l ittle corner of oddities. Hope that makes sense? lol
Cheek slap is caused by no having your face close to the receiver
Ain't putting my face that close to Fox's rifle....didn't you hear the smell comment? lol
Misha your cat’s declawed how do you keep the sofa safe?
Nope, not declawed. I suppose it does help that Peanut has only the 1 froot though
It’s not the cats he has a problem with. It’s the fox
Why the sunglasses indoors all the time? I feel like I am watching a blind gun collector.
You're exactly right.
I sell you a pioneer AK misha
pronounced rAdom, not raydom, lol
Really? no one has ever, ever, ever commented that before...nope, never. ;P
@@misha5670 im a noob
here misha
Kam A La
🍊 ♂️
Wink wink