Sten felt like an alien culture even though he was still a human looking race, taash looks like an alien but feels like a valley girl trying to get daddy's attention
I could have loved Taash character if it was a much more flesh out character. "They were doing it" In my opinion they set this game up to fail on purpose. Despite all the negative stuff in the game I could have loved the characters if they just bothered with them instead it's like watching an episode of Sweat Valley High.
I find ironic that in the famous meal scene Taash mother doesn't actually oppose her daughter but calmly attempts to understand something that is clearly kilometers away from her ideas (she even attempts to explain what's the closest thing to being non binary that she's aware of in order to have a starting point from which to create a common ground), while Taash freaks out like she's possessed and doesn't even try to explain anything to her mother as if she's just supposed to accept everything without understanding. All this and yet the game wants us to think Taash is the victim
You comment reminded me of the "why are you gay" interview, and not just the meme-worthy line. The first half of the interview is the interviewer is trying to understand an activist's position and complaints about the society. The intervew is really good because the guy is very polite and trying to understand the activist.
Funnily enough, Taash having a mother there AT ALL is already a huge retcon since Qunari's parental roles begin and end with "make baby, baby is born". After the baby is born, the Tamassrans handle everything else and the parents return to whatever their role in society was. Which makes it odd that, not only is Taash's mother there, she's fully loyal to the Qun.
What I notice about Taash's declaration that she's non-binary is that she immediately looks at Rook with hostility. I don't know if this is intentional or not, because the animation is so bad, but it looks like she is inviting a challenge to her declaration. Her lips aren't moving, but I hear "Yeah, you heard that. Gonna stop me, Dad?" It's not respectable or respectful.
Even after the infamous Bharv scene, Isabela will still posthumously misgender Taash if you were in a relationship with them. If Taash dies, Isabela will say something about "the way *she* looked at you," which really shows all the time and effort BioWare put into this game's writing.
I said this before when I saw someone found it, it was probably a mistake from the voice actress, because at the end of the day, you brain will just slip into what you were taught. It requires insane levels of effort to actually shift what you learned as a child when you're now thirty or whatever. But it highlights that even in the real world, where they are actively trying to change language, it doesn't work, so in Veilguard, it EXTRA doesn't work.
@@weareharbinger914Or...and hear me out here I know this is a wild idea...maybe the voice actress....read the script 😱 Maybe the script called her "her" and the voice actress just did her job. An insane idea I know.
@@weareharbinger914 I disagree, because you're second point requires one major thing. "They have to care." I don't think they actually care, about anything. Taash was a non binary weapon used to beat people over the head. They don't actually care. Example when flat chested Isabella pulled her barf move, Taash asked what she was doing. Itty bitty Issy said she was barfing, and Taash said "Oh, okay". So Taash knew what mosquito bites Bella was doing...so why ask? (I'll stop with the small boob jokes now.) Taash is the one who asked not one of the other two who had no idea. Why did Taash ask? Because they don't care. It was just a moment to club the player in the face Another example for how much they don't care. This is a world of magic....just magically change your gender. And I mean fully. Go to a mage or witch or whatever and have them give you the bits you want and remove the bits you don't. Shape shifting magic exists, it could be done. Why isn't that done? Lack of care. They don't actually believe it, they want the brownie points for including it.
I really, really miss Sten's obtuse and direct personality, which cared little for social graces (at least towards those outside the Qun). It would be hilarious to listen to him argue with all the Veilguard companions. *"Why are you here?"* (Just to suffer?)
It's more, "Ferelden does suck, but they produced two good things: The Warden and Cookies. That'll be something to consider when we finally decide to come here in force and fix all this crap."
having the "you can't be a Woman" chat with Sten as a Warrior Noble is actually really interesting when you know the family history of the Couslands, they Earned their spot as nobility. I don't remember all the details exactly but the OG ruler of Highever got murked by his wife Flemeth. yes that Flemeth. and with no heir behind to hold claim of their land for the sake of preventing the inevitable Power Vacuum they elected the captain of the Guard as their new leader and holder of the noble title that captain was your Wardens Ancestor, who then declared their independence from the Howes and slapped them around for like 30 years in a War they Won and took a sizable chunk of land as their own along with their now established independence. and the Couslands and Howe family have been Frienemies ever since. so given that Military might is kind of a Big Deal within Highever, it would make sense that it's perfectly Normal for Women of the Cousland family to take up arms as fighters, including your Warden's mother who dies protecting her mortally wounded husband. while there are a couple who point out that its quite unladylike to spend so much of your time honing combat skills. they don't bother to try challenge you on it, you're a Cousland and they like their teeth remaining inside their mouths where they belong. at least until you meet Sten and you can respond to his confusion with your own confusion, you can argue that he's dumb and what the Qun does is dumb or you can do your best to explain that what you do isn't necessarily limited by what you are if you're willing to put the effort in. there are exceptions to every Norm, and what's the Norm for you is an Exception to him.
My headcanon is that Taash is a perverse allegory of the game itself. Someone Who has no idea of what their identity is anymore and how to approach the subject but still think that they’re the coolest thing around. They try to be a bit of everything and fail completely but they will demand you do push up if you call them out on that.
Honestly, I would have loved to see a qunari woman struggling with sexist traditions of the Qun, but in a sense "I do not fit into what Qun defines as normal for a woman but that doesen't make me any less of a woman" but oh well.....
I feel I should point out that or I suppose remind, that the Qunari would accept Krem as a man not because they genuinely care about his perspective/feelings but because he has the best traits for being in the role of a warrior. If Krem ever joined the Qun and as he grew older he decided to hang up his sword and attempt to vary or differ from that path, maybe become a baker or a doctor? The Qunari would refuse this, if not flat out attempt to re-educate him or even subject him to Qamek, if he pushed his luck enough times. The Qunari and the Qun as a whole, does not have or believe in individuality, even the very concept is alien to them. Don’t get me started on “family” from the perspective of the Qun. Seeing Taash and her “mother” go against the Qun by referring to each other as mother and daughter, while also attempting to make it where they follow the Qun (at least Taash’s Tamassaran/Mom), when in reality any true member of the Qun would separate the two and attempt to re-educate them until such a relationship is broken. Family units do not exist in the Qunari culture, as such relationships are viewed as inefficient in their society and thus has no place, according to the doctrine of the Qun.
Sten was a deep and well crafted character. His philosophical side was what won me over; hearing him talk about the Qun, stories of his people, and the Qun's teachings was truly a well thought out experience that left a lasting impression on people. Bull was a good character as well. Loyal to the Qun and his given role, but afraid of it at one point in his life when it meant having the people he genuinely cared about and the life he felt happy living taken away. Despite his aspect, Bull had a heart of gold and was very clever despite his strength. Taash is like an overly hormonal teen. She's loud, angry, upset and has a very uncomfortable character. She acts like an animal for no solid reason; growling and shouting like a savage in an attempt to assert dominance or impress. She's more like a Kossith than a Qunari, but that doesn't excuse her behaviour and mentality.
@@davidspearim5552 The Arishok was an honorable and good character with an unfortunate end. Despite him saying that he "wasn't equiped to explain", he still made a lasting impression on people with his conversations. Much like Sten, he displayed a philosophical side to his character. He showed great patience despite the bullying from the fearful and ignorant he had to endure in Kirkwall. He also had a sense of justice and second chance when he defended the Vidithari from arrest. I very much preffered to see him walk away alive with Isabella than have to kill him.
I've been playing a lot of Baldur's Gate lately and the tolerance with regards to your party is astounding. You can willing dismiss / kill off party members right in act 1, even poor rolls will result in their deaths as well. Also you can completely miss them if you didn't explore thoroughly enough. Compare to Veilguard where all the party members are mandatory, they can't be killed off until the ending, they can't be dismissed, they're even mission mandatory in some cases. BG3 really spoiled us of how good an RPG could be, where games like Veilguard aren't even in the same league.
Owlcats done same thing. You can kill or remove all of your party members. You can piss them off so much, they will leave you. If you try to became something, that they don't like - they will try to kill you. Or you can sacrifice them for your own immortality.
Sten and Bull were so different from one another but yet still we’re amazing characters. Sten was dogmatic in the ways of his people and his secret mission to be a spy in Fereldin. But thanks to the MC he changes a little bit after helping defeat the Blight. Hard headed but honest he was a delight. Bull was an outcast that decided to take on the ancient role of dragon slaying ever since their return(dragons were thought extinct for a thousand years until they suddenly returned and this the Dragon Age started). He is still of the Qun deep down but more open minded and charismatic. He was a great. Even in DA2 the Arishok who ends up becoming a villain is a devout believer of the Qun to an extreme degree. Doing the things he does because he believed it to be right and..like all well written villains did have a point about how horrible people are. Tash….is none of this. She is a self insert character from some dev that wanted to push a real world political agenda that fell flat. Bad voice acting, bad writing, and an ugly character model didn’t help either. They spit on the lord of the Qunari just to “do what we they want” and it didn’t succeed
12:27 Meaning something they pulled out of their ass because they wanted to add Krem to the story. I want people to remember the conversations with Sten, the original Qunari...the real Qunari. "Women don't fight." And "women can't be men." We can not say that being trans is part of Qunari culture because as Sten told us, it is literally not. It would've made more sense the other way. If Krem was a Qunari who left the Qun because he wanted to be viewed as a man so he joined another nation to do so. It's just another example of how they did it wrong. They don't like the Qunari, because the Qunari are counter to everything they stand for...and they can't allow that to exist. The same way Veilguard doesn't allow you to be mean, the Qunari the way they were originally written can not be allowed to exist. That is why they have done everything they can to destroy the Qunari. They're gentrifying the Qunari, whitewashing their culture to fit their sensibilities. Fascinating.
@@blackromeoKOK Individuals like Krem would be required to accept the gender bestowed on them by the Qun, or else they would be branded as Tal-Vashoth. That being said, the Qun might assign gender independently of the person's biological sex. It would be an interesting inversion if the Qun declared that a biological male was actually a woman, but the person in question still felt like a man.
I think an important detail that players tend to miss with Iron Bull & Krem is that just because the Qunari have a word to define transgenderism - doesn't mean they welcome or accept it. The Qun has specific terms for the mages and those who left the Qun. The former have their mouths sewn shut, the latter are treated as "a fate worse than death". Iron Bull is a Qunari spy surrounded by Andrastians. He has lived among them for a while, so he knows what sentiment is welcome and what isn't. And the Charges, albeit pleasant, are a tool at the end of the day (unless the Inquisitor pushes the Bull unto a specific path by sacrificing the dreadnought). Keeping Krem & the rest in good graces is advantageous, so that's what the Bull does - personal sentiment is just a bonus. Another example from DA:I is Viddasala (the female Qunari in Trespasser). She (the Viddasala is a title and not a name) is not a warrior but a priest - one that, to quote the wiki, "specializes in finding, studying, and stopping magic (...) also handles the conversion of foreigners and the re-education of Qunari dissidents." She has an assignment to stop Solas (a mage) and tries to do so even after getting pretty definite proof that it's not possible for someone like her. The "Dragon Age: Those Who Speak" comics had some good insight into the Qun too. That was probably the first time we saw a female Qunari (a Tamassran with a more personal name "Raasan") and it delved into how some Qunari women are taught how to wield weapons if their station demands so (like spy/emissary). The comic came out in 2012 and is pretty cool - though it's position in canon is questionable as it features King Alistair. (And since Veilguard isn't canon, that's where reliable info on the Qun ends.) P. S. I am so happy you returned to the lore videos. The internet drama gets exhausting after a certain point.
Yeah, people forget that Bull IS a Liar by role, profession and title. Just because they have a word for it on the Qun doesn't meant their society accepts it.
Exactly right. We have to remember the Iron Bill's name under the Qun was Hissrad iirc. Meaning LIAR... For me, all the things he said to Krem were always lies, since transgenderism under the Qun does not make sense at all...
Alistair being king is supposed to be Canon, he is so in another piece of literature where he ends up fighting Sten as the Arishok. But they make a lot of things 'canon that doesn't make much sense. How Solas got the 'lyrium idol' was similar, didn't make any sense, but thats now canon and quite literally required for Veilguard to happen.
I have to say one thing that throws me off about Tash, is that she is a qunari, she sounds like a human from SoCal. The character doesn't have an accent like the other characters within the universe (who speak with mostly European sounding accents). She sticks out like a sore thumb, unlike Sten (who looks like a human) yet is a qunari.
A huge thing that is brought up extremely subtly in inquisition was the idea of gender transitioning. Krem talks about how one is to go about it which requires taventer mages and blood magic as well as a high risk to it as well. Krem states that the risks are far from even thinking it's worth it and is better to accept who you are rather then try to change it. It's a very very obscure comment to come across but it's there and addresses the lore that there is no surgery you can get to change and the risks are far to great making it better to learn to love yourself for who you are. This in itself is a powerful message as it is and very much addresses the topic of transition well. The failguards handling of such a topic is to ignore the already established lore and go "bow to me and if you don't then your a shitty person because even if you apologise you taken my victim hood away".... it makes sense surgery's for breast removal and such would not be viable even with healing magic because as it states.. the healing will try to restore the injury as best it can... translation.. try to restore the destroyed body part.. now this isn't saying that you can't lose limbs or get scars, because you can but it would not be useful in such complex surgeries as well as the world of thedas does not have the knowledge to do such surgeries
@stopthatgirl7 That's why when people still pretend that our beloved devs of old are still the same, I get confused. All of them have gutted the talent and replaced them. They all just wear a mask
DAO and DA2 made the Qun interesting, as the Qunari had a truly different worldview. DAI I thought was mostly a downgrade in that regard as that is where they started inserting 'modern' sensibilities with very little actual Qunari involvement(but the whole choice between the loyalty to Bull's beliefs or loyalty to his people was a good dynamic), but Veilguard...well, that just ruined everything, seemingly intentionally. I don't like the Krem thing because it clashes with Origins, that Sten cannot even properly fathom a female warrior, but by Inquisition, which is about ten years later, apparently the most rigid social system on the planet now has a new term, specifically for that? Not a chance. But, they did TRY. One of the big problems with Taash's character that despite being in her 20s, she acts like a child, and talks like an autistic child. She wears Qunari culture as a costume, basically and her mother is obviously meant to be portrayed as 'bad', but clearly isn't, a bit overbearing, sure, but not at all malicious, her 'redemption' at using the correct pronouns laughably undercuts her death. Taash also seems to be a walking hypocrite, as not only the identity thing she doesn't respect in others, she doesn't follow the Qun. But in her first meeting, when she seeing the Antaam with the Dragon she tries to invoke the Qun? It made no sense. Especially when she seems to get angry at the disrespect the Antaam show the Qun. It personally pisses me off that they refer to anyone who is the Kossith race as 'Qunari', they don't even say they're Vashoth or Tal-Vashoth. Definitely led me to believe the devs, or at least the writers, did not play Dragon Age 2. Hell, you basically never even hear the term 'Bas' anymore. And I still don't understand the whole 'Antaam left' thing, it seems entirely arbitrary that the entire military just up and left and the Arishok(aka Sten) is nowhere to be seen. Basically, I miss the Arishok from DA2. Best Qunari.
While it does seem like David Gaider has gone all in on the ideology in recent years, the man is a much better writer than anyone who worked on Veilguard. A great example of this is how well he wrote Dorian in Inquisition. Dorian was gay, but it wasn't the entire point of the character. Still, he found a way for it to factor into his personal story in a way that made sense, and in a way that was much more interesting than if it had simply been about his parents not approving of his sexuality. I really thought Dragon Age was in decent hands with Patrick Weekes, who did great work on the Mass Effect series, but boy was I wrong on that one. Oh and you are really good at putting these videos together, Nuhre, keep them coming!
When I saw the original concept art for Evataash, I wanted to cry. She was supposed to be this cool fem Qunari fighter, but now is watered down to an annoying preachy fanfiction insert
As a fan of DA and the world of Thedas, this is a well articulated and thoughtful analysis that gives voice to my frustration and disappointment at what DA has been turned into. Well done.
I always appreciated sten gets approval when you like get philosophical and entertain his metaphors. Like the turtle's shell one (its been awhile) and he just accepts your response and keeps the metaphor going 😂
I also cant get over the fact this new "Bioware" made a face for Neve, and said "fuck it, slap the same face to Isabella and Morrigan" They are like indian triplets with same face. Shows how lazy they were
Ok, I do get a lot of complaints about the game But I'm not super sure about that one lol, I think it may just be the super yassified makeup they all have. Isabella has a much more rectangular facial structure in this one, Neve a bit more square. Eyes are different too. Morrigan deffo doesn't look like Morrigan (I should know, she, along with Zevran, were my first video game crushes as a teenager) but I don't think her facial features have a middle eastern/central Asian look imo
@@AzureRoxe You're talking about Bellara and the Girl with Strife, right? Tbh, I don't really care what race the elves are in appearance. We, as player characters, have always had the option to make them look however we want, whatever race we want. I do wish they had kept the more distinct elven features, like the nose bridge and their really big, animal/alien eyes. Elves used to have a very unique look tbh, and most of it is gone now. Even so, they're new characters, so I really don't think it matters. I kinda get complaining about how Morrigan and Isabella might look, because they don't look much like prior games versions, but I still don't see the race thing necessarily with them either. The writing in the game is ass, the design is mid, but this isn't it imo.
Reading about the character Taash was originally going to be thanks to the artbook's info.........we legit got screwed of a potentially amazing character.
I like your angle of critique here. You are not denying “wokeness”; instead, you are showing how “the MESSAGE” without wokeness could have been stronger, deeper, lead to more conversations, and left a lingering effect on every player, including conservatives. I wonder what Mr. Gaider thinks about it. He has to be loyal in public, that's for sure; however, as the writer who is responsible for the most of the progressivism in the first 3 games, I wonder how he thinks about all the missed opportunities in Veilguard.
The world is going to change regardless of what people like or don't like. I think video games are actually a good medium to introduce people to topics they might not be comfortable with when done properly. If Taash had gone by they/them pronouns from the beginning and they had 100% made her more dragon like as a way to show that she's more than a Qunari, and she has her own category in the Qun, people would've thought she was a cool character and not questioned it. But they made it a big deal, so everyone made it a big deal as well.
Another Nuhre banger, it great seeing you cover these themes and building upon what Dragon Age stood for. If only we could have had someone like you on the writing team.
This video is perfect, I especially love the beginning where you talk about Dragon Age's political writing being so engaging because it is modelled very clearly after real world political ideologies and issues but abstracted enough into its own fantasy world so as to allow exploration of political ideas without the overwhelming emotional baggage of the life and death politics we all live with. Very few video game franchises explore this concept as deliberately and successfully as DA and thank you for making that point because I think it's the most important one in all of this veilguard mess. I have way too much to say about how massacred the qunari are in this game, but to keep it short. Shathann is the most interesting and most wasted character in the game, her central theme of motherhood vs. society could have been one of the most compelling plotlines in the franchise had they just noticed what they had!! She was literally born into a society where she was taught NOT to be a mother and to instead become a fulltime academic with no aspirations for anything else. She does this, clearly studying enough about Qunari culture to understand more about what Adaari are and what society does to fire breathing Qun, she then gives birth to this child that by rights she is meant to hand over to her society to be raised instead of her and nonetheless despite how clearly she enjoyed her role as a scholar priest (since she continued that role after leaving the qun), despite all her education and upbringing telling her to not have a connection to this child and to accept how things work under the Qun. Shathann somehow figures out that Taash is an Adaari, and something between her knowledge of what will happen to this child she just birthed and some emotion that she was not meant to feel (maternal instincts, a sense of motherhood, deeply human themes we could've explored within the world of Thedas maybe? MAYBE?!) she realizes she needs to abandon her entire culture, life, and role to risk everything all on her own for the sake her child's future as she finally feels a fracture with The Qun (another really interesting theme veilguard decided not to explore for no reason). The dinner table scene is one of the most cringe scenes in the game but it also contains the only scene in the game that actually made me feel anything for any character and its when Shathann snaps back at Rook critiquing her treatment of Taash by saying that she knows she "was an inadequate mother," its the best moment of dialogue in the game and it makes me so fucking mad because on paper they had what could've been one of the best characters in the entire series and they just left it all on the table, literally. Like of course she wasn't a "good mother" she had just abandoned everything she had known to raise a child with the only thing guiding her being the belief system she had essentially just abandoned, and god only knows what her life was like a tal-vashoth civilian defector single mother living in probably one of the most lawless countries in Thedas and the writers just arraaaghghhhh. Really good video as always, thank god you made these lore videos because they make me feel like I'm not crazy.
I always found it strange that it was the Qunari of all the races they went so hard on making them the gender focused faction. DA2 has many faults but they got the Qunari right out of all the games where it's one of the few times Dragon Age had a unique identity among other RPGs. Then with Inquisition right around the time Qunari started to look more human again is where things changed for the worse. If there's one good thing about Trash is that people went back and revaluated Origins and Sten again as I've seen a resurgence in his popularity after Veil Guard. Iron Bull I always found hit or miss. I think a lot of what he has to say you have to take with a grain of salt as he is really good at half truths and lie by omission. He has his moments but a lot of his story felt rushed to me especially with the Chargers as they are introduced and next mission they can be killed off so not as much attachment to a core part of Iron Bull's character. Still Bull was miles better than Trash who managed to become the worst companion in all of Dragon Age. Worse than Anders, Sebastian, Vallana, Sera, Vivienne, just all of them are handled better than Trash. Qunari were among the most interesting parts of Dragon Age and it's a shame how badly they devolved as the series progress.
Dragon age two second act is basically carried by the Aristok, such a powerful figure who balances the line as both terrifying Villain with a interesting sense of honour that makes you almost forget he’s more than happy to slaughter Kirkwall over a relic.
Eww, Taash. The worst character I have had the misfortune of seeing in a Bioware game. I would not be surprised if Taash was self insert from the writer.
@@PrimaItalia it’s worse, because I’ve met non binary people in my life who are normal ass people who don’t get offended from being misgendered. Taash is a walking stereotype that has done nothing but normalized to the community to view NB people as a joke. This is what happens when writers make characters via pandering or self-insert.
It was, self insert by Mr bushe, but did it as ftm instead of mtf trans. Everything about tash screams biological man, packaged as a female who wants to not be female.
the dinner table conversation confirms it, it literally sounds like the writer just dragged their last Thanksgiving dinner from 5 years ago into the game
@@PrimaItalia it’s worse because I know normal NB people who don’t behave as petulantly as Taash. They are a stereotype gay has only done damage to representing that community. Don’t trust corpos like BioWare when they say they are “inclusive” when they literally demonize normal people and LGBT people calling this out..
Taash is easily one of the most forced and out of place characters. If Taash was a normal human and the world where she lives was a modern day setting, her arch wouldn't feel so shoe horned. This change wouldn't make Taash's arc better as a character if you ask me or have her ideas be more valid, but it could at least be more natural. Or maybe, since we are out of a so rigid, efficiency driven and heavily role reliant society as the Qun, it would make her worse, I dunno.
"No Qunari would ever cower helplessly, not woman, nor elderly, nor child. They would fight for their survival with tooth and nail." -Sten at Redcliffe siege. I'd say it's more of the career aspect than the fight itself. I was under the impression that Qunari women are held in higher esteem than men, and a woman wanting to be a man/warrior is demeaning themselves. Fighting is something that must be done not something you want to do. It's like having a top rate education and choosing to be a janitor or sanitation worker rather than the manager or even the CEO.
Sten was a good character and I, as a man, could really identify with him and his thoughts & choices. There were many other great characters in DA:O. After the obvious crap of Inqusition, I I skipped Veilgaurd because it was even wore and I couldn't really relate to any of the characters in DA:I.
It's really interesting to see how Sten bashes female companions of the Warden, but gradually accepts female Warden as a leader. Later in Inquisition we are shown that Qunari can accept strong female leaders, as long as they serve in Ben-Hassrath. I don't know if Sten knows the structure of Ben-Hassrath that well, but it could be one of the reasons he accepts the female Warden as a leader. Grey Wardens to him may seem a lot like Ben-Hassrath - straying away from the traditional way for the greater good.
Tash could have been a complex character. With how the base culture of the Quanari are it would have been easy to tell her story based off of world lore. They already have unique way of looking at genders. Shows no one that worked on Veilguard was an actual fan of the franchise. Great video.
I always saw Aqun-Athlok as another form of Qunari efficiency. If a woman was super talented fighting why not just declare her a man and put her to use in the army, it wouldn't make sense trying to make her do something she isn't good at if she's way more efficient in the army than say as a priest or artisan. Since free will isn't really a thing under the Qun I don't think a qunari woman would mind it at all
Out of all the characters, Taash’s existence is the most confusing. Even with the lore changes the writers did with the Qunari, she doesn’t make any sense. Taash is basically given everything on a silver platter, with little to no pushback, and yet, her behavior and attitude implies otherwise. So instead she comes off as very selfish and rude and even childish. She should have been the easiest to write as an interesting character, with her gender identity struggles giving us more insight into the Qun, especially a decade later with the literal end of the world on the horizon, but instead we’re given this self-insert of a Mary Sue who is seemingly more of a protagonist than the actual protagonist. If anything, Taash would have been better off as a human woman with the physical build of a buff man and very little would actually change about her story. The Qunari stuff can be easily explained with her living within proximity of them and being very interested in their culture. It honestly feels like the writers wanted the coolness factor of her being a Qunari without everything else that comes with it. She’s supposed to be a twenty-something Qunari who doesn’t follow the Qun and lives away from their community but yet knows how to (fluently) speak the language and knows what the Qun dictates enough where she’s able to chastise the Antaam for not doing their roles, the latter of which is very hypocritical of her. Looking at the wiki, Shathann fled to southern Rivain with a newborn Taash; so, we can safely assume that Taash should have no attachment to the Qun but rather be critical of it due to how rigid and restrictive it is especially in comparison to the freedom she has had her entire life (and maybe that conversation between her and the Antaam was her being sarcastic). We can also assume that Shathann taught Taash everything about the Qun and the language. However, I don’t think there ever was hard confirmation that Shathann, knowing nothing else but the Qun, set those same rules and restrictions on Taash, because Taash doesn’t act like someone who’s ever lived that way. Based on Shathann’s dialogue, it does seem to be normal for her to comment on Taash veering away from what she considers the norm, and in the infamous nonbinary scene, from her tone and the way she tries to understand things with the words she knows, she comes off as someone open-minded, yet still struggling with the culture deeply ingrained within her. In contrast, Taash is quick to anger and harshness. This conversation shows us that the writers definitely wanted Taash’s relationship with her mother to be tense and complicated by the two different worlds they each grew up in, but it fails because Taash’s behavior doesn’t match up with what the writers want us to believe. They want us to believe, without seeing consistent and concrete evidence, that Taash has long struggled with trying to be the ideal daughter, that she has to force herself to be someone that she isn’t. And the thing is that a person’s gender identity and their expression of it has an effect and is affected by various things in their life; so seeing the writers put in these other things but falling incredibly short of having them be reflective in Taash’s character just tells us where their priorities were during game development. (And according to another youtuber’s video, even Shathann isn’t immune to bad and inconsistent character writing.) If they wanted tension in the mother-daughter relationship, they could have had 1) Shathann’s parenting style be what she knows from the Qun, so Taash would either be quiet and passive and go along with it because she wants approval or be rebellious and butt heads at every turn; 2) Shathann tries her best but struggles with what’s the Qun and what’s actually her and ends up being way too permissive, so Taash becomes a spoiled brat and takes advantage of her mom’s insecurity of being a good parent; 3) Shathann trying her best and erring too much on the side of being strict, so Taash either openly rebels and they butt heads or secretly rebels by lying and sneaking away to do what she wants. A maybe interesting path that I thought the writers could done with Taash’s story was actually have her grow up under the Qun, without the fire-breathing, and have her be an actual warrior in exchange for her discarding her gender identity; thus, she is now neither woman or man but simply a sword for the Qun. Like, she could be one of the best and strongest, a one-man army. In the face of the end of the world, or maybe just to defeat Solas, she could have been sent to help Varric and Harding around the time they recruited Rook(, and this could have some tie-in with the choices made in Inquisition about Iron Bull). Even though she is there to help them, her orders from Par Vollen override everyone else’s, and because she’s a sword of the Qun, she cares for no one else but them, not even herself. This would make her, at worst, a kind of an antagonistic ally, but Varric and the others need her because they don’t have a team to take on Solas, so they need all the allies they can get. Taash would be an unchanging character throughout the game, very rigid and secure in what and who she is and her role according to the Qun, and to disrupt that security, Shathann, the weirdly worried Qunari of a mom, could have followed Taash after learning that she’d been sent on this mission. For whatever reason, ever since the birth of Taash, Shathann slowly started questioning the Qun and became more of a heretic to the point where she needed to be reeducated. So, Shathann’s appearance would enrage Taash because the former keeps disobeying the Qun for selfish reasons, even though those selfish reasons are for Taash’s sake. Then throughout the game, they can have this back-and-forth where Shathann is able to draw Taash out of her warrior identity long enough to speak her mind and argue her points until they’ve reached a peak where one or both of them break. Also, one last thing: this is very shallow of me, but I hate the voice they chose for Taash, because it doesn’t fit her as a Qunari or as the badass warrior she’s supposed to be. It’s also very modern sounding.
With Bull, choosing to save the chargers is ultimately very satisfying imo. Even after assassins are sent by the Qun, Bull gets to spar with Krem again. Like you said, he gets to keep his chosen family, and knows the Inquisitor has his back. Reiterating the theme that the Inquisition can become a kind of safe haven for people of all walks of life. What do we learn from Taash’s story? She says from beginning to end that she feels more like a man than a woman. And her mother, though confused, tries her best to understand. Her story was lacking at best, nonexistent at the worst.
The game play was JANK, as your boy Leon would say, but DA/DAO's strength was mainly in the story. I only played DA (I do have the DAO unltimate edition on PS3), because by the time Origins came out I had already created a playable character from every racial type and it was emotionally hard to rapidly move on. The game got me so invested in the crew, their stories and the ability to influence their choices and fates. So Origins came out and so did an avalanche of other PS3 titles and I never got back around to finishing the Origins arc. In agreement with your sentiments: Failguard is completely lacking in the area that made it stellar. Failguards' writers appear to not give a shit about lore, entirely lack creativity and imagination, fail to understand proper conversation etiquette, narrate and speak down at the audience...Let me catch my breath, no I'm done. Fun video.
It’s pretty clear the writer of the Taash scene was having a therapy session in game and it was just cringey. I’m sick of fixing people’s mommy and daddy issues in a video game. Get it together.
Banger! This is my favorite content from you. It's so well written and provides learning and growth, if only the haters could understand honest criticism, we could have it all. Great story telling, great game play , art direction, world build, and yes room for diversity. I hate "DEI" content not because of the diversity itself but for how badly it's done and how shoe horned it is at the price of establish world building. It's like wanting to represent natives Americans by allowing your character to wear a feather head piece. Bad representation is insulting and destroys what could of been done well and interesting. The fact of life is simple, if your going to do something, do it well or don't do it at all.
Much of what you said can be applied to any piece of established entertainment. Breaking canon or established lore the way Vileguard did would've been unthinkable in the past, yet here we are.
Sten is one of my favourite characters in a game ever. I love lore and different made up cultures in fantasy media. If I want to talk to nb Susan I talk to nb Susan in real life.
Central Asian nomads (Ancient Turks and their descendants, I don't know about Mongols) used to have women who took roles of men, fighting on horse and wearing men's clothes. (Turkic languages do not have grammatical gender distinctions so maybe it was easier to them speech wise, don't know). Among Kazakh people (who used to be nomads until the October Revolution) these women were called "yerkek-shora". History has interesting examples, but why bother, Bioware?
Same in Albania and certain tribes in Africa, women could socially transition in societies with strict gender norms for multiple reasons, from being a sole inheritor to their father and to tribe lacking enough men of fighting age to field and wife up brides, but why bother.
Taash's character is just insufferable. I 100% agree that her inclusion of the story was to simply push real world politics instead of creating a character to deepen the understanding of a rich world. Her struggle is incredibly shallow. Instead of getting a character where we could see a struggle with identity in a society that's not fully accepting of it, she instantly gets the little kid treatment and everyone starts using pronouns. Then a character gives an explanation on why long drawn out apologies are bad by explaining it in the longest, most drawn out way possible. Taash could have been an interesting character. What I find interesting is her California valley girl attitude COULD have worked in this game...if everyone else didn't talk the same way 😒. Taash is a good contrast between Sten and Iron Bull. A horribly written character vs two well-written, fleshed out characters. Taash is a great example of why you should NEVER create a character for political reasons only. Everything about Taash sticks out like a sore thumb. Her design, her attitude, even her motivations are all cringe-worthy. Taash can be summed up in two words: wasted potential.
The fact that Taash's mom is apparently going against the Qun, but also wants her to know the Qun was so weird. It would have been interesting if they leaned into the idea that her mom ascribes to a twisted interpretation of the Qun, and the equivalent of the nonbinary label was forced on her from a young age. Taash's arc would be her slowly realizing that her mother had brainwashed her, and it ends with her learning about the real Qun and accepting herself as a woman.
I am so angry that the game didn’t bother to examine the cultural dynamics of anything whatsoever. Like bruh. Taash went to a Tevinter mage during a period of personal struggle, and that Tevinter mage put them in touch with more Tevinter citizens for guidance. They came out not with Tevinter-based terms for what they are but 2024 Earth explanations and terms. There could have been examination of the legacy of war between Tevinter and the Qun, plus fears about the corruptive nature of mages. Even if Taash wasn’t struggling with that, Shathann could have been. There could have been worry about whether the Tevinter citizens were preying upon Taash in a time of need or sincerely reaching out to give support. But no. No history of conflict between Tevinter and the Qun allowed to be examined. Venatori/Antaam OTP too important.
I love this, it heavily explains what the specific problems with Veilguard as a whole really are... My biggest issue with Taash personally is the negative stereotype she represents. She is rude, interruptive, loud, annoying, stupid and at times even downright rapey... All of these words is what people, whom we'll say are on the "wrong side" of LGBT support, has associated with the tag for years. - If Taash is truly Bioware's hope of "bringing a Non-binary character in", could they at least not have tried breaking free from that kind of negative stereotype? Unless of course, like I am beginning to believe, they did it on purpose...
Taash: "Please respect my pronouns." Also Taash: "No, I don't care that you asked me to stop, I'm going to keep calling you corpse fucker just because I find you creepy until the player tells me to stop." Really does not make them a likeable character.
The stereotype exists for a reason, and it's one the community actively and willingly cultivates. It's what they believe is morally righteous behavior.
@@InvertedWIng This. They believe hedonism and hook ups are superior to committed relationships, they believe they are cooler, better and superior to cishet people, they arrogantly lecture everyone, they constantly play the victim and call everyone names. It's simply accurate to what most of them are like. Perverse, rude, deeply narcissistic and arrogant, self-righteous people.
Brilliant thesis and the fact its in your second language even better. I bet this will make your bestie Eddie seethe with rage. If you broaden the idea further of identity and realisation of self growth you have :- Allistair : the reluctant heir Liliana: no matter which path so much growth Morrigan: from heartless witch to doting mother (depending upon the path) Fenris: mastering his Past Blackwall: the fale warden Cole : the compasdion spirit playing pinnochio Serra: from her jokdey childlike nature developing in to maturity. All of them show growth and change written with maturity and nuance. But when you have writers so mentally stunted and indoctrinated into the globohomo belief system no wonder veilguard was so shallow, its writers are barely well rounded people.
Was it ever said before Inquisition that ‘in the Qun woman can be men’ and vice versa in any Dragon Age media? I remember Sten saying women can’t be warriors and that you can’t change things like where you’re born or your eye color.
Guess what the artbook reveals Emmerich was designed back in the time of project Joplin and they got him right from the first sketch, that's why he shines, actually talented people made that character
Taash's gender identity was never the issue. It was the lack of impact, conflict, and respect for the lore. Thank you for looking deeper into the real problems with this character.
I disagree with the Iron bull. Simply because Iron Bull was the symptom of the beginning of the end for Bioware and Dragon Age. I felt it extremely even when I was a dumb kid playing the game, that Iron Bull made zero sense and just wasn't a fun character to get to know, unpopular opinion as it is. Simply because the character of Iron Bull and the Ben Hassrath being secret police just makes it extremely, I guess, on the nose, if I have to say it, and you know where the devs headspace is at. Hear me out, going by Inquisition itself, the Ben Hassrath became secret police, okay, so why is the Bull a part of it? I remember some conversation where he said he was chosen caused he thinks differently or something, could be wrong since he was so forgettable, I forgot about most of the things about him, but I believe that was the case, which is a terrible person to choose for Ben Hassrath. You are now in a role where you are supposed to "reeducate" and fulfil spy activities and whatnot, but you don't think of the collective and at the drop of a hat, would actually change sides? Like, think about this, why would the Ben Hassrath choose people who "think differently" and would maybe question the Qun and send them out into the rest of the world where they would potentially formed lifelong bonds with people, which could caused problems for them? Even if the "think differently" thing was just me misremembering, it still doesn't make sense why the Ben Hassrath especially is not trained and "indoctrinated"(again, I hate how the Qun is made to be this malevolent force which has to resort to USSR, Stalin tactics to make the citizens compliant, even though previous interaction with the Qunari doesn't show they would do such a thing) to such a point where they would not be able to divorce themselves from any outside simulation like any good spies. Why have someone be like the Bull and have potentially dozens upon dozens of traitors ready to turn. It is just all so stupid. On the other hand, the Arishok in DA2 was the perfect Qunari and gave us more insights into Qunari culture and ways teases by Sten. And I bring this up because especially with how Qunari culture is, it makes no sense why like 99.999% of the Qun in both Inquisition and and Veilguard isn't like Sten and the Arishok. Like, really, if they weren't, they would have long since left and became Tal-Vashoth or something like that. Not staying in the Qun and being allowed to act as they are and not being forced to conform. And don't get me started on Tash or Taash or whatever her name is. Dumbest character ever. If you are a Quanri with the Qun, born and raised in Qunari society, where apparently secret police exists, how would you be able to develop into you yourself? These people never lived under a true state where it acts like funny moustache man Germany and Stalin USSR. The people who grew up and lived there with the knowledge of what they've been indoctrinated with, think so much more differently than an American from California. Hence why this dumb nut as a character existing whatsoever, and being as openly 21st century American from California, all it does is show how bad of a writer all these jokers are.
Taash is a poor attempt of combining Iron Bull with his "wild" sexuality and making you feel comfortable. The "bitchyness" of Jack that you dislike but same time you feel like you can relate to her anger, once you know her backstory. Then with Dorian on his sexuality not being accepted by family, and where he comes from from some expectations pushed onto you. Lucanis feels like a poor combination of BlackWall as a visual base. Trying to get the charm of Dorian of his poshness, and then Anders conflict with Justice that you see in Dragon Age 2, but you actually don't see that struggle that he has. Bellara is like a weird mixture of Tali from Mass Effect with her quirkiness and innocent attitude, but you see her backstory and actually understand why she's so upbeat, then becoming more serious as well, with family drama, along with her people. Also you see her tinkering properly in the Mass Effect universe, not just "poof" it works. Then throw in some Merrill because elf and weird quirkiness. Neve is like a weird combination of Aveline from DA2 and Garrus from Mass Effect. I couldn't care to look up the others, patience was lost. But this is how I saw these characters "personalities" and stories was made and inspired by.
As I wrote in my Steam review, which I am not sure is even up anymore due to censorship of differing opinions, I have come to the conclusion that every companion is a racist/ethnist stereotype. Neve is the Middle Eastern man-turned-woman who has to hide it. (The game doesn't say it, but look up Neve's voice actor.) Bellara is the smart annoying Asian. Lucanis is the soft-hearted Mafioso. Emmrich is the genteel older gentleman with a dark secret. Davrin is the tough Black athlete. And Taash is the acting-out teenager with an overprotective parent. The devs have spectacularly failed their own "inclusivity" tests.
Taash annoyed me so much during my first playthrough. It seemed like every other dialogue with her was either about her identity, being upset at her mother, or being pissed off about the Qun/other qunari, and her comapnion quest constantly has those teams pushed into your face as well. I only added her to my team when my "friendship" with her was falling far behind compeared to the others. Having said that however, I did get some new/different dialogue from taking her along during my second playthrough, so she isn't as grating, but her cut scene focused moments are still the only ones I speed past/skip forward in, and she's still by far the companion I bring along the least, and the one who's companion quest I only get to when there's nothing else to pick.
All in all, Krem is Krem. Krem didn't focus on the gender aspect, but rather what the difference in gender meant in terms of a ever growing morality and practices of members withing the Qun. It is an opportunity to reveal more about the other characters and their opinions of individuality and traditions. It all goes to make the world feel more complicated, evolving, and bigger. In Dragon Age Veilgaurd, it is 100% hyperfixated on Taash and Taash's experiences. The tunnel vision makes Taash's side story feel self-absorbed, because it doesn't even have any interest in the opinions of others, seemingly dismissing any other opinions, and in continuously hits the same surface level information about feeling out of placed over and over without visually showing the player outside of their relationship with their mother (which is avoidable given that the mother was originally accepting of the idea under a different Quinari term). It makes it a shallow and boring. Because it is all about Taash, and Taash is already a surface level character. Once the game has explored all they can with Taash's experience, it goes in circles, as it doesn't give a f*ck about exploring how that relates to the world around them.
When we studied gender in anthropology the professor had to take time to explain to us that gender is a social construct but its difficult to determine gender when valuable remains and contexts aren't available. So we have to base it on what we have and what we know and that means learning gender roles and items of those times. So we ended up associating gender to items, roles, and duties. Some people adhere to strict duties and roles and occasionally we would find people who associated with mixed roles and items. When I learned about Taash I was excited to see if the Qunari would associate gender like that, with roles and duties and what that means to someone who can and will do both or neither. Anyways I was pretty disappointed by Taash's story
One thing I've often found amusing since the days of DA:O is how the Qun more or less openly looks at males and goes "Yeah, nah, you're too dumb to work the crafts. Off to war you go!" 😂 I always loved the honesty in that
Didn't finish watching yet, but IMO, even Iron Bull was already kind of a shitty qunari... with all his lecturing us(Even somewhat scolding us if we bring it up again outside of cutscene) about how Krem is totally a man by the Qun standards(Which goes directly against what Sten says, and doesn't fit Qunari ideology which discourages any kind of individuality at all). Iron Bull can be likeable though, which is why some people mistakenly consider him much better than T(r)aash, but in actuality he only is marginally so, because he is written to be likeable(Which might highlight difference between David Gaider and Patrick Weekes as writers... though Gaider got a lot more deranged in past few years, so I guess Iron Bull was an effect of his brainrot beginning to take hold), but at the same time he is a big walking retcon of qunari lore for the sake of modern political pandering. Once I realized that about him, I never felt bad about having him just sacrifice the chargers for Qunari alliance, and then get killed by Inquisitor in Trespasser.
Very nice video! A question regarding content creation: I noticed you are using the music from the Dragon Age games in the video. Are you able to still monetize the video or does it get copyright claimed?
You can use any video game soundtrack (not Nintendo's though) and you won't get copyright striked. That's because there's too many gameplays on UA-cam and Twitch, and if they strike everyone, they won't make money 🤭
well said, I like these kinds of videos of your more, while I don't like Bull's character to much he did have depth to him, Tash is....missing an R in her name, Sten had interesting interactions with his own worldview which does come to a head
So we had Sten a devote memeber of the Quin. Ironbull, A voluntary member of the quin that (depending on the player) can either stay as part of the Quin and fullfill his role or abandon his role and the quin. And now... Taash who was raised outside of the Quin. Her mother and taash are Tal-vashosh, people that have rejected the Quin and ghe Quanri and these two groups do not like eachother. So again. One loyal. One walking a tight rope that could go either way. And one that has been completely removed from that society. So if Iron Bull was about making a personal choice. And Taash is suppose to respresent "freedom" then why boil everything down to taash and her gender identity???? This is our FIRST time recruiting a tal-vassoth so HOW do they live? What does it look like for a group of Quanri who have left the Quin and their teachings look like??? This could have opened up this area of the world that players havent seen yet and it would have been a GENUINELY interesting story point. Image visiting an area where other Quanri have formed a little community and you get to see this seperate society and how it differs from the Quanri that everyone is fimilair with. Also on dragon age inquestion if you play as a Qunari you are a apart of a tal-vassoth mercenary group. (I think it was mixed raced but the point stands) So they have some sort of structure. Are there hidden communities? Where do they live? How do they live? What makes taash question herself when they have the FREEDOM to do whatever they want??? Do they want to join the Quin? Or is it something else???? Anyway. Sorry for the book report but there was a bunch of different directions to go woth this one and they picked the worst one on the list.
the same character that is non-binary goes around saying that dragons can't have kings, only queens. she's quite the biggot, what if a female dragon identifies as a male?
While taash was controversial for a lot of things. There is one line that i cannot forgive and will forever damn that character for.... "Who doesn't like dragons?" ...... for real?
Sten felt like an alien culture even though he was still a human looking race, taash looks like an alien but feels like a valley girl trying to get daddy's attention
Wish there was a way to kick Taash out of the party. She got on my nerves throughout the game.
Just ignore her and let her get deleted in the end
I could have loved Taash character if it was a much more flesh out character.
"They were doing it"
In my opinion they set this game up to fail on purpose. Despite all the negative stuff in the game I could have loved the characters if they just bothered with them instead it's like watching an episode of Sweat Valley High.
Close. A post modern American that never had a dad. Just like the one she is inspired from...
couldn't have said it better myself
I find ironic that in the famous meal scene Taash mother doesn't actually oppose her daughter but calmly attempts to understand something that is clearly kilometers away from her ideas (she even attempts to explain what's the closest thing to being non binary that she's aware of in order to have a starting point from which to create a common ground), while Taash freaks out like she's possessed and doesn't even try to explain anything to her mother as if she's just supposed to accept everything without understanding. All this and yet the game wants us to think Taash is the victim
You comment reminded me of the "why are you gay" interview, and not just the meme-worthy line.
The first half of the interview is the interviewer is trying to understand an activist's position and complaints about the society. The intervew is really good because the guy is very polite and trying to understand the activist.
Not to mention she baldfaced lies to her mother's face in front of other people. Her mother was a saint to put up with that.
Funnily enough, Taash having a mother there AT ALL is already a huge retcon since Qunari's parental roles begin and end with "make baby, baby is born". After the baby is born, the Tamassrans handle everything else and the parents return to whatever their role in society was.
Which makes it odd that, not only is Taash's mother there, she's fully loyal to the Qun.
@@AzureRoxe You're absolutely right. I had forgotten about that.
What I notice about Taash's declaration that she's non-binary is that she immediately looks at Rook with hostility. I don't know if this is intentional or not, because the animation is so bad, but it looks like she is inviting a challenge to her declaration. Her lips aren't moving, but I hear "Yeah, you heard that. Gonna stop me, Dad?" It's not respectable or respectful.
Even after the infamous Bharv scene, Isabela will still posthumously misgender Taash if you were in a relationship with them. If Taash dies, Isabela will say something about "the way *she* looked at you," which really shows all the time and effort BioWare put into this game's writing.
Or maybe shows that deep down, Isabela doesn't give a flip about your pronouns.
I said this before when I saw someone found it, it was probably a mistake from the voice actress, because at the end of the day, you brain will just slip into what you were taught. It requires insane levels of effort to actually shift what you learned as a child when you're now thirty or whatever.
But it highlights that even in the real world, where they are actively trying to change language, it doesn't work, so in Veilguard, it EXTRA doesn't work.
@@weareharbinger914Or...and hear me out here I know this is a wild idea...maybe the voice actress....read the script 😱
Maybe the script called her "her" and the voice actress just did her job. An insane idea I know.
@@blackromeoKOK lol, yes, that is entirely possible too, which leads to my second conclusion.
@@weareharbinger914 I disagree, because you're second point requires one major thing. "They have to care."
I don't think they actually care, about anything. Taash was a non binary weapon used to beat people over the head. They don't actually care.
Example when flat chested Isabella pulled her barf move, Taash asked what she was doing. Itty bitty Issy said she was barfing, and Taash said "Oh, okay". So Taash knew what mosquito bites Bella was doing...so why ask? (I'll stop with the small boob jokes now.) Taash is the one who asked not one of the other two who had no idea. Why did Taash ask? Because they don't care. It was just a moment to club the player in the face
Another example for how much they don't care. This is a world of magic....just magically change your gender. And I mean fully. Go to a mage or witch or whatever and have them give you the bits you want and remove the bits you don't. Shape shifting magic exists, it could be done. Why isn't that done? Lack of care. They don't actually believe it, they want the brownie points for including it.
I really, really miss Sten's obtuse and direct personality, which cared little for social graces (at least towards those outside the Qun). It would be hilarious to listen to him argue with all the Veilguard companions.
*"Why are you here?"* (Just to suffer?)
Someone actually did an AI mock up of Sten at the dinner conversation
In the mind of the narcissist, anything less than IMMEDIATE 100% submission is oppression.
"It doesn't make sense, how can you be neither a man nor a woman?"
I love Sten because once he discovers cookies hes like "man Ferelden doesnt suck anymore, can I take these home?" and Iron bull is a super bro to me
It's more, "Ferelden does suck, but they produced two good things: The Warden and Cookies. That'll be something to consider when we finally decide to come here in force and fix all this crap."
having the "you can't be a Woman" chat with Sten as a Warrior Noble is actually really interesting when you know the family history of the Couslands, they Earned their spot as nobility. I don't remember all the details exactly but the OG ruler of Highever got murked by his wife Flemeth. yes that Flemeth. and with no heir behind to hold claim of their land for the sake of preventing the inevitable Power Vacuum they elected the captain of the Guard as their new leader and holder of the noble title
that captain was your Wardens Ancestor, who then declared their independence from the Howes and slapped them around for like 30 years in a War they Won and took a sizable chunk of land as their own along with their now established independence. and the Couslands and Howe family have been Frienemies ever since.
so given that Military might is kind of a Big Deal within Highever, it would make sense that it's perfectly Normal for Women of the Cousland family to take up arms as fighters, including your Warden's mother who dies protecting her mortally wounded husband. while there are a couple who point out that its quite unladylike to spend so much of your time honing combat skills. they don't bother to try challenge you on it, you're a Cousland and they like their teeth remaining inside their mouths where they belong.
at least until you meet Sten and you can respond to his confusion with your own confusion, you can argue that he's dumb and what the Qun does is dumb or you can do your best to explain that what you do isn't necessarily limited by what you are if you're willing to put the effort in. there are exceptions to every Norm, and what's the Norm for you is an Exception to him.
Ahhhh the writing of the good ol days.
My headcanon is that Taash is a perverse allegory of the game itself. Someone Who has no idea of what their identity is anymore and how to approach the subject but still think that they’re the coolest thing around. They try to be a bit of everything and fail completely but they will demand you do push up if you call them out on that.
Honestly, I would have loved to see a qunari woman struggling with sexist traditions of the Qun, but in a sense "I do not fit into what Qun defines as normal for a woman but that doesen't make me any less of a woman" but oh well.....
I feel I should point out that or I suppose remind, that the Qunari would accept Krem as a man not because they genuinely care about his perspective/feelings but because he has the best traits for being in the role of a warrior.
If Krem ever joined the Qun and as he grew older he decided to hang up his sword and attempt to vary or differ from that path, maybe become a baker or a doctor?
The Qunari would refuse this, if not flat out attempt to re-educate him or even subject him to Qamek, if he pushed his luck enough times.
The Qunari and the Qun as a whole, does not have or believe in individuality, even the very concept is alien to them.
Don’t get me started on “family” from the perspective of the Qun.
Seeing Taash and her “mother” go against the Qun by referring to each other as mother and daughter, while also attempting to make it where they follow the Qun (at least Taash’s Tamassaran/Mom), when in reality any true member of the Qun would separate the two and attempt to re-educate them until such a relationship is broken.
Family units do not exist in the Qunari culture, as such relationships are viewed as inefficient in their society and thus has no place, according to the doctrine of the Qun.
Sten was a deep and well crafted character. His philosophical side was what won me over; hearing him talk about the Qun, stories of his people, and the Qun's teachings was truly a well thought out experience that left a lasting impression on people.
Bull was a good character as well. Loyal to the Qun and his given role, but afraid of it at one point in his life when it meant having the people he genuinely cared about and the life he felt happy living taken away. Despite his aspect, Bull had a heart of gold and was very clever despite his strength.
Taash is like an overly hormonal teen. She's loud, angry, upset and has a very uncomfortable character. She acts like an animal for no solid reason; growling and shouting like a savage in an attempt to assert dominance or impress. She's more like a Kossith than a Qunari, but that doesn't excuse her behaviour and mentality.
The Arishok in da2 Is the best
@@davidspearim5552
The Arishok was an honorable and good character with an unfortunate end. Despite him saying that he "wasn't equiped to explain", he still made a lasting impression on people with his conversations.
Much like Sten, he displayed a philosophical side to his character. He showed great patience despite the bullying from the fearful and ignorant he had to endure in Kirkwall.
He also had a sense of justice and second chance when he defended the Vidithari from arrest.
I very much preffered to see him walk away alive with Isabella than have to kill him.
I've been playing a lot of Baldur's Gate lately and the tolerance with regards to your party is astounding. You can willing dismiss / kill off party members right in act 1, even poor rolls will result in their deaths as well. Also you can completely miss them if you didn't explore thoroughly enough.
Compare to Veilguard where all the party members are mandatory, they can't be killed off until the ending, they can't be dismissed, they're even mission mandatory in some cases.
BG3 really spoiled us of how good an RPG could be, where games like Veilguard aren't even in the same league.
In Veilguard they can't even fall in battle, not even temporarily.
Owlcats done same thing. You can kill or remove all of your party members. You can piss them off so much, they will leave you. If you try to became something, that they don't like - they will try to kill you.
Or you can sacrifice them for your own immortality.
Sten and Bull were so different from one another but yet still we’re amazing characters.
Sten was dogmatic in the ways of his people and his secret mission to be a spy in Fereldin. But thanks to the MC he changes a little bit after helping defeat the Blight. Hard headed but honest he was a delight.
Bull was an outcast that decided to take on the ancient role of dragon slaying ever since their return(dragons were thought extinct for a thousand years until they suddenly returned and this the Dragon Age started). He is still of the Qun deep down but more open minded and charismatic. He was a great.
Even in DA2 the Arishok who ends up becoming a villain is a devout believer of the Qun to an extreme degree. Doing the things he does because he believed it to be right and..like all well written villains did have a point about how horrible people are.
Tash….is none of this. She is a self insert character from some dev that wanted to push a real world political agenda that fell flat. Bad voice acting, bad writing, and an ugly character model didn’t help either. They spit on the lord of the Qunari just to “do what we they want” and it didn’t succeed
12:27 Meaning something they pulled out of their ass because they wanted to add Krem to the story.
I want people to remember the conversations with Sten, the original Qunari...the real Qunari. "Women don't fight." And "women can't be men." We can not say that being trans is part of Qunari culture because as Sten told us, it is literally not.
It would've made more sense the other way. If Krem was a Qunari who left the Qun because he wanted to be viewed as a man so he joined another nation to do so.
It's just another example of how they did it wrong. They don't like the Qunari, because the Qunari are counter to everything they stand for...and they can't allow that to exist. The same way Veilguard doesn't allow you to be mean, the Qunari the way they were originally written can not be allowed to exist. That is why they have done everything they can to destroy the Qunari. They're gentrifying the Qunari, whitewashing their culture to fit their sensibilities. Fascinating.
Holy Shit. My man, I couldn't have said it better myself.
Extremely wise take here
@@blackromeoKOK Individuals like Krem would be required to accept the gender bestowed on them by the Qun, or else they would be branded as Tal-Vashoth.
That being said, the Qun might assign gender independently of the person's biological sex. It would be an interesting inversion if the Qun declared that a biological male was actually a woman, but the person in question still felt like a man.
I think an important detail that players tend to miss with Iron Bull & Krem is that just because the Qunari have a word to define transgenderism - doesn't mean they welcome or accept it.
The Qun has specific terms for the mages and those who left the Qun. The former have their mouths sewn shut, the latter are treated as "a fate worse than death".
Iron Bull is a Qunari spy surrounded by Andrastians. He has lived among them for a while, so he knows what sentiment is welcome and what isn't. And the Charges, albeit pleasant, are a tool at the end of the day (unless the Inquisitor pushes the Bull unto a specific path by sacrificing the dreadnought). Keeping Krem & the rest in good graces is advantageous, so that's what the Bull does - personal sentiment is just a bonus.
Another example from DA:I is Viddasala (the female Qunari in Trespasser). She (the Viddasala is a title and not a name) is not a warrior but a priest - one that, to quote the wiki, "specializes in finding, studying, and stopping magic (...) also handles the conversion of foreigners and the re-education of Qunari dissidents."
She has an assignment to stop Solas (a mage) and tries to do so even after getting pretty definite proof that it's not possible for someone like her.
The "Dragon Age: Those Who Speak" comics had some good insight into the Qun too. That was probably the first time we saw a female Qunari (a Tamassran with a more personal name "Raasan") and it delved into how some Qunari women are taught how to wield weapons if their station demands so (like spy/emissary). The comic came out in 2012 and is pretty cool - though it's position in canon is questionable as it features King Alistair.
(And since Veilguard isn't canon, that's where reliable info on the Qun ends.)
P. S.
I am so happy you returned to the lore videos. The internet drama gets exhausting after a certain point.
Yeah, people forget that Bull IS a Liar by role, profession and title. Just because they have a word for it on the Qun doesn't meant their society accepts it.
Exactly right. We have to remember the Iron Bill's name under the Qun was Hissrad iirc. Meaning LIAR... For me, all the things he said to Krem were always lies, since transgenderism under the Qun does not make sense at all...
Came for the drama, stayed for the lore vids
Alistair being king is supposed to be Canon, he is so in another piece of literature where he ends up fighting Sten as the Arishok.
But they make a lot of things 'canon that doesn't make much sense. How Solas got the 'lyrium idol' was similar, didn't make any sense, but thats now canon and quite literally required for Veilguard to happen.
@@Artemisarrowzz For all we know, there IS no term and The Iron Bull was lying to Krem the entire time. Has anyone beyond him confirmed the term?
I have to say one thing that throws me off about Tash, is that she is a qunari, she sounds like a human from SoCal. The character doesn't have an accent like the other characters within the universe (who speak with mostly European sounding accents). She sticks out like a sore thumb, unlike Sten (who looks like a human) yet is a qunari.
Sten truly was the best window to the quanari culture
A huge thing that is brought up extremely subtly in inquisition was the idea of gender transitioning. Krem talks about how one is to go about it which requires taventer mages and blood magic as well as a high risk to it as well. Krem states that the risks are far from even thinking it's worth it and is better to accept who you are rather then try to change it. It's a very very obscure comment to come across but it's there and addresses the lore that there is no surgery you can get to change and the risks are far to great making it better to learn to love yourself for who you are. This in itself is a powerful message as it is and very much addresses the topic of transition well.
The failguards handling of such a topic is to ignore the already established lore and go "bow to me and if you don't then your a shitty person because even if you apologise you taken my victim hood away".... it makes sense surgery's for breast removal and such would not be viable even with healing magic because as it states.. the healing will try to restore the injury as best it can... translation.. try to restore the destroyed body part.. now this isn't saying that you can't lose limbs or get scars, because you can but it would not be useful in such complex surgeries as well as the world of thedas does not have the knowledge to do such surgeries
Imagine if they hired writers that cared about dragon age and its past
Imagine if they hadn’t fired or forced out the writers that did.
@stopthatgirl7 That's why when people still pretend that our beloved devs of old are still the same, I get confused. All of them have gutted the talent and replaced them. They all just wear a mask
@@jonathansoko1085Partially incorrect; the old guard is more than happy to call you scum for not liking new writers' garbage.
Veilguard is one of the worst betrayals of a franchise.
Wait for Mass Effect, there's still room for deep down
I am terrified for the kotor remake
DAO and DA2 made the Qun interesting, as the Qunari had a truly different worldview. DAI I thought was mostly a downgrade in that regard as that is where they started inserting 'modern' sensibilities with very little actual Qunari involvement(but the whole choice between the loyalty to Bull's beliefs or loyalty to his people was a good dynamic), but Veilguard...well, that just ruined everything, seemingly intentionally.
I don't like the Krem thing because it clashes with Origins, that Sten cannot even properly fathom a female warrior, but by Inquisition, which is about ten years later, apparently the most rigid social system on the planet now has a new term, specifically for that? Not a chance. But, they did TRY.
One of the big problems with Taash's character that despite being in her 20s, she acts like a child, and talks like an autistic child. She wears Qunari culture as a costume, basically and her mother is obviously meant to be portrayed as 'bad', but clearly isn't, a bit overbearing, sure, but not at all malicious, her 'redemption' at using the correct pronouns laughably undercuts her death.
Taash also seems to be a walking hypocrite, as not only the identity thing she doesn't respect in others, she doesn't follow the Qun. But in her first meeting, when she seeing the Antaam with the Dragon she tries to invoke the Qun? It made no sense. Especially when she seems to get angry at the disrespect the Antaam show the Qun.
It personally pisses me off that they refer to anyone who is the Kossith race as 'Qunari', they don't even say they're Vashoth or Tal-Vashoth. Definitely led me to believe the devs, or at least the writers, did not play Dragon Age 2. Hell, you basically never even hear the term 'Bas' anymore. And I still don't understand the whole 'Antaam left' thing, it seems entirely arbitrary that the entire military just up and left and the Arishok(aka Sten) is nowhere to be seen.
Basically, I miss the Arishok from DA2. Best Qunari.
You may talk your shit but this shows you can back it up 100%!
While it does seem like David Gaider has gone all in on the ideology in recent years, the man is a much better writer than anyone who worked on Veilguard. A great example of this is how well he wrote Dorian in Inquisition. Dorian was gay, but it wasn't the entire point of the character. Still, he found a way for it to factor into his personal story in a way that made sense, and in a way that was much more interesting than if it had simply been about his parents not approving of his sexuality. I really thought Dragon Age was in decent hands with Patrick Weekes, who did great work on the Mass Effect series, but boy was I wrong on that one. Oh and you are really good at putting these videos together, Nuhre, keep them coming!
Chad "I enjoy the company of men" vs Virgin "I'm non-binary"
David Gaider left at the end of Inquisition, I think sometime around Joplin being re-worked but before the Live smService concept died.
Another well thought out and knowledgeable essay, Ara.
Thank you, John. I'm glad you enjoyed it. I love making them ❤
When I saw the original concept art for Evataash, I wanted to cry. She was supposed to be this cool fem Qunari fighter, but now is watered down to an annoying preachy fanfiction insert
Which is ironic knowing the person who wrote the character. It felt like a self insert.
Sten is best qunari from best DA game
The arishok imo
The arishok is goated
As a fan of DA and the world of Thedas, this is a well articulated and thoughtful analysis that gives voice to my frustration and disappointment at what DA has been turned into. Well done.
I always appreciated sten gets approval when you like get philosophical and entertain his metaphors. Like the turtle's shell one (its been awhile) and he just accepts your response and keeps the metaphor going 😂
I also cant get over the fact this new "Bioware" made a face for Neve, and said "fuck it, slap the same face to Isabella and Morrigan"
They are like indian triplets with same face. Shows how lazy they were
I mean, they did the same thing to the Asari in Andromeda. The literal only Asari with an individual face was Peebee.
Ok, I do get a lot of complaints about the game
But I'm not super sure about that one lol, I think it may just be the super yassified makeup they all have.
Isabella has a much more rectangular facial structure in this one, Neve a bit more square. Eyes are different too.
Morrigan deffo doesn't look like Morrigan (I should know, she, along with Zevran, were my first video game crushes as a teenager) but I don't think her facial features have a middle eastern/central Asian look imo
@@TrystLyonesse Then you look at the literal first 2 female Elves you see and they're both Asian.
@@AzureRoxe You're talking about Bellara and the Girl with Strife, right?
Tbh, I don't really care what race the elves are in appearance. We, as player characters, have always had the option to make them look however we want, whatever race we want.
I do wish they had kept the more distinct elven features, like the nose bridge and their really big, animal/alien eyes. Elves used to have a very unique look tbh, and most of it is gone now.
Even so, they're new characters, so I really don't think it matters. I kinda get complaining about how Morrigan and Isabella might look, because they don't look much like prior games versions, but I still don't see the race thing necessarily with them either.
The writing in the game is ass, the design is mid, but this isn't it imo.
The faces in general are quite ugly in the game models
Reading about the character Taash was originally going to be thanks to the artbook's info.........we legit got screwed of a potentially amazing character.
I like your angle of critique here. You are not denying “wokeness”; instead, you are showing how “the MESSAGE” without wokeness could have been stronger, deeper, lead to more conversations, and left a lingering effect on every player, including conservatives.
I wonder what Mr. Gaider thinks about it. He has to be loyal in public, that's for sure; however, as the writer who is responsible for the most of the progressivism in the first 3 games, I wonder how he thinks about all the missed opportunities in Veilguard.
The world is going to change regardless of what people like or don't like. I think video games are actually a good medium to introduce people to topics they might not be comfortable with when done properly. If Taash had gone by they/them pronouns from the beginning and they had 100% made her more dragon like as a way to show that she's more than a Qunari, and she has her own category in the Qun, people would've thought she was a cool character and not questioned it. But they made it a big deal, so everyone made it a big deal as well.
Another Nuhre banger, it great seeing you cover these themes and building upon what Dragon Age stood for. If only we could have had someone like you on the writing team.
Glad you enjoyed it!
This video is perfect, I especially love the beginning where you talk about Dragon Age's political writing being so engaging because it is modelled very clearly after real world political ideologies and issues but abstracted enough into its own fantasy world so as to allow exploration of political ideas without the overwhelming emotional baggage of the life and death politics we all live with. Very few video game franchises explore this concept as deliberately and successfully as DA and thank you for making that point because I think it's the most important one in all of this veilguard mess. I have way too much to say about how massacred the qunari are in this game, but to keep it short. Shathann is the most interesting and most wasted character in the game, her central theme of motherhood vs. society could have been one of the most compelling plotlines in the franchise had they just noticed what they had!! She was literally born into a society where she was taught NOT to be a mother and to instead become a fulltime academic with no aspirations for anything else. She does this, clearly studying enough about Qunari culture to understand more about what Adaari are and what society does to fire breathing Qun, she then gives birth to this child that by rights she is meant to hand over to her society to be raised instead of her and nonetheless despite how clearly she enjoyed her role as a scholar priest (since she continued that role after leaving the qun), despite all her education and upbringing telling her to not have a connection to this child and to accept how things work under the Qun. Shathann somehow figures out that Taash is an Adaari, and something between her knowledge of what will happen to this child she just birthed and some emotion that she was not meant to feel (maternal instincts, a sense of motherhood, deeply human themes we could've explored within the world of Thedas maybe? MAYBE?!) she realizes she needs to abandon her entire culture, life, and role to risk everything all on her own for the sake her child's future as she finally feels a fracture with The Qun (another really interesting theme veilguard decided not to explore for no reason). The dinner table scene is one of the most cringe scenes in the game but it also contains the only scene in the game that actually made me feel anything for any character and its when Shathann snaps back at Rook critiquing her treatment of Taash by saying that she knows she "was an inadequate mother," its the best moment of dialogue in the game and it makes me so fucking mad because on paper they had what could've been one of the best characters in the entire series and they just left it all on the table, literally. Like of course she wasn't a "good mother" she had just abandoned everything she had known to raise a child with the only thing guiding her being the belief system she had essentially just abandoned, and god only knows what her life was like a tal-vashoth civilian defector single mother living in probably one of the most lawless countries in Thedas and the writers just arraaaghghhhh. Really good video as always, thank god you made these lore videos because they make me feel like I'm not crazy.
I always found it strange that it was the Qunari of all the races they went so hard on making them the gender focused faction.
DA2 has many faults but they got the Qunari right out of all the games where it's one of the few times Dragon Age had a unique identity among other RPGs.
Then with Inquisition right around the time Qunari started to look more human again is where things changed for the worse.
If there's one good thing about Trash is that people went back and revaluated Origins and Sten again as I've seen a resurgence in his popularity after Veil Guard.
Iron Bull I always found hit or miss. I think a lot of what he has to say you have to take with a grain of salt as he is really good at half truths and lie by omission.
He has his moments but a lot of his story felt rushed to me especially with the Chargers as they are introduced and next mission they can be killed off so not as much attachment to a core part of Iron Bull's character.
Still Bull was miles better than Trash who managed to become the worst companion in all of Dragon Age. Worse than Anders, Sebastian, Vallana, Sera, Vivienne, just all of them are handled better than Trash.
Qunari were among the most interesting parts of Dragon Age and it's a shame how badly they devolved as the series progress.
Dragon age two second act is basically carried by the Aristok, such a powerful figure who balances the line as both terrifying Villain with a interesting sense of honour that makes you almost forget he’s more than happy to slaughter Kirkwall over a relic.
Eww, Taash. The worst character I have had the misfortune of seeing in a Bioware game. I would not be surprised if Taash was self insert from the writer.
@@PrimaItalia it’s worse, because I’ve met non binary people in my life who are normal ass people who don’t get offended from being misgendered. Taash is a walking stereotype that has done nothing but normalized to the community to view NB people as a joke. This is what happens when writers make characters via pandering or self-insert.
It was, self insert by Mr bushe, but did it as ftm instead of mtf trans. Everything about tash screams biological man, packaged as a female who wants to not be female.
the dinner table conversation confirms it, it literally sounds like the writer just dragged their last Thanksgiving dinner from 5 years ago into the game
And I thought Cora and feeble from andromeda were bad
@@PrimaItalia it’s worse because I know normal NB people who don’t behave as petulantly as Taash. They are a stereotype gay has only done damage to representing that community. Don’t trust corpos like BioWare when they say they are “inclusive” when they literally demonize normal people and LGBT people calling this out..
Taash is easily one of the most forced and out of place characters. If Taash was a normal human and the world where she lives was a modern day setting, her arch wouldn't feel so shoe horned.
This change wouldn't make Taash's arc better as a character if you ask me or have her ideas be more valid, but it could at least be more natural.
Or maybe, since we are out of a so rigid, efficiency driven and heavily role reliant society as the Qun, it would make her worse, I dunno.
"No Qunari would ever cower helplessly, not woman, nor elderly, nor child. They would fight for their survival with tooth and nail."
-Sten at Redcliffe siege.
I'd say it's more of the career aspect than the fight itself. I was under the impression that Qunari women are held in higher esteem than men, and a woman wanting to be a man/warrior is demeaning themselves. Fighting is something that must be done not something you want to do. It's like having a top rate education and choosing to be a janitor or sanitation worker rather than the manager or even the CEO.
Sten was a good character and I, as a man, could really identify with him and his thoughts & choices. There were many other great characters in DA:O. After the obvious crap of Inqusition, I I skipped Veilgaurd because it was even wore and I couldn't really relate to any of the characters in DA:I.
How dare you bring logic into this! Jokes aside, Well done video! Hope we get more!
I am loving these character analysis videos. You're really smart and i enjoy your takes. I hope you keep making more!
It's really interesting to see how Sten bashes female companions of the Warden, but gradually accepts female Warden as a leader. Later in Inquisition we are shown that Qunari can accept strong female leaders, as long as they serve in Ben-Hassrath. I don't know if Sten knows the structure of Ben-Hassrath that well, but it could be one of the reasons he accepts the female Warden as a leader. Grey Wardens to him may seem a lot like Ben-Hassrath - straying away from the traditional way for the greater good.
Tash could have been a complex character. With how the base culture of the Quanari are it would have been easy to tell her story based off of world lore. They already have unique way of looking at genders. Shows no one that worked on Veilguard was an actual fan of the franchise. Great video.
I just realized something! I never questioned that guy identity from Bull squad because he was so natural.
Krem is a person. Taash is a lecture in the shape of a person.
Finally got a time to watch this!
*Taash*
Power: 100
Skills: 100
Survivability: 100
Genetic Advantage: 100
Body Size/Muscle: 100
Self (Feeling) Important: 200
Empathy: -200
I always saw Aqun-Athlok as another form of Qunari efficiency. If a woman was super talented fighting why not just declare her a man and put her to use in the army, it wouldn't make sense trying to make her do something she isn't good at if she's way more efficient in the army than say as a priest or artisan.
Since free will isn't really a thing under the Qun I don't think a qunari woman would mind it at all
Out of all the characters, Taash’s existence is the most confusing. Even with the lore changes the writers did with the Qunari, she doesn’t make any sense.
Taash is basically given everything on a silver platter, with little to no pushback, and yet, her behavior and attitude implies otherwise. So instead she comes off as very selfish and rude and even childish. She should have been the easiest to write as an interesting character, with her gender identity struggles giving us more insight into the Qun, especially a decade later with the literal end of the world on the horizon, but instead we’re given this self-insert of a Mary Sue who is seemingly more of a protagonist than the actual protagonist. If anything, Taash would have been better off as a human woman with the physical build of a buff man and very little would actually change about her story. The Qunari stuff can be easily explained with her living within proximity of them and being very interested in their culture. It honestly feels like the writers wanted the coolness factor of her being a Qunari without everything else that comes with it.
She’s supposed to be a twenty-something Qunari who doesn’t follow the Qun and lives away from their community but yet knows how to (fluently) speak the language and knows what the Qun dictates enough where she’s able to chastise the Antaam for not doing their roles, the latter of which is very hypocritical of her. Looking at the wiki, Shathann fled to southern Rivain with a newborn Taash; so, we can safely assume that Taash should have no attachment to the Qun but rather be critical of it due to how rigid and restrictive it is especially in comparison to the freedom she has had her entire life (and maybe that conversation between her and the Antaam was her being sarcastic). We can also assume that Shathann taught Taash everything about the Qun and the language. However, I don’t think there ever was hard confirmation that Shathann, knowing nothing else but the Qun, set those same rules and restrictions on Taash, because Taash doesn’t act like someone who’s ever lived that way. Based on Shathann’s dialogue, it does seem to be normal for her to comment on Taash veering away from what she considers the norm, and in the infamous nonbinary scene, from her tone and the way she tries to understand things with the words she knows, she comes off as someone open-minded, yet still struggling with the culture deeply ingrained within her. In contrast, Taash is quick to anger and harshness. This conversation shows us that the writers definitely wanted Taash’s relationship with her mother to be tense and complicated by the two different worlds they each grew up in, but it fails because Taash’s behavior doesn’t match up with what the writers want us to believe. They want us to believe, without seeing consistent and concrete evidence, that Taash has long struggled with trying to be the ideal daughter, that she has to force herself to be someone that she isn’t.
And the thing is that a person’s gender identity and their expression of it has an effect and is affected by various things in their life; so seeing the writers put in these other things but falling incredibly short of having them be reflective in Taash’s character just tells us where their priorities were during game development. (And according to another youtuber’s video, even Shathann isn’t immune to bad and inconsistent character writing.) If they wanted tension in the mother-daughter relationship, they could have had 1) Shathann’s parenting style be what she knows from the Qun, so Taash would either be quiet and passive and go along with it because she wants approval or be rebellious and butt heads at every turn; 2) Shathann tries her best but struggles with what’s the Qun and what’s actually her and ends up being way too permissive, so Taash becomes a spoiled brat and takes advantage of her mom’s insecurity of being a good parent; 3) Shathann trying her best and erring too much on the side of being strict, so Taash either openly rebels and they butt heads or secretly rebels by lying and sneaking away to do what she wants.
A maybe interesting path that I thought the writers could done with Taash’s story was actually have her grow up under the Qun, without the fire-breathing, and have her be an actual warrior in exchange for her discarding her gender identity; thus, she is now neither woman or man but simply a sword for the Qun. Like, she could be one of the best and strongest, a one-man army. In the face of the end of the world, or maybe just to defeat Solas, she could have been sent to help Varric and Harding around the time they recruited Rook(, and this could have some tie-in with the choices made in Inquisition about Iron Bull). Even though she is there to help them, her orders from Par Vollen override everyone else’s, and because she’s a sword of the Qun, she cares for no one else but them, not even herself. This would make her, at worst, a kind of an antagonistic ally, but Varric and the others need her because they don’t have a team to take on Solas, so they need all the allies they can get. Taash would be an unchanging character throughout the game, very rigid and secure in what and who she is and her role according to the Qun, and to disrupt that security, Shathann, the weirdly worried Qunari of a mom, could have followed Taash after learning that she’d been sent on this mission. For whatever reason, ever since the birth of Taash, Shathann slowly started questioning the Qun and became more of a heretic to the point where she needed to be reeducated. So, Shathann’s appearance would enrage Taash because the former keeps disobeying the Qun for selfish reasons, even though those selfish reasons are for Taash’s sake. Then throughout the game, they can have this back-and-forth where Shathann is able to draw Taash out of her warrior identity long enough to speak her mind and argue her points until they’ve reached a peak where one or both of them break.
Also, one last thing: this is very shallow of me, but I hate the voice they chose for Taash, because it doesn’t fit her as a Qunari or as the badass warrior she’s supposed to be. It’s also very modern sounding.
With Bull, choosing to save the chargers is ultimately very satisfying imo. Even after assassins are sent by the Qun, Bull gets to spar with Krem again. Like you said, he gets to keep his chosen family, and knows the Inquisitor has his back. Reiterating the theme that the Inquisition can become a kind of safe haven for people of all walks of life.
What do we learn from Taash’s story? She says from beginning to end that she feels more like a man than a woman. And her mother, though confused, tries her best to understand. Her story was lacking at best, nonexistent at the worst.
Great job Nuhre! Excellent Thesis.
Thank you!
The game play was JANK, as your boy Leon would say, but DA/DAO's strength was mainly in the story. I only played DA (I do have the DAO unltimate edition on PS3), because by the time Origins came out I had already created a playable character from every racial type and it was emotionally hard to rapidly move on. The game got me so invested in the crew, their stories and the ability to influence their choices and fates. So Origins came out and so did an avalanche of other PS3 titles and I never got back around to finishing the Origins arc. In agreement with your sentiments: Failguard is completely lacking in the area that made it stellar. Failguards' writers appear to not give a shit about lore, entirely lack creativity and imagination, fail to understand proper conversation etiquette, narrate and speak down at the audience...Let me catch my breath, no I'm done. Fun video.
It’s pretty clear the writer of the Taash scene was having a therapy session in game and it was just cringey. I’m sick of fixing people’s mommy and daddy issues in a video game. Get it together.
fantastic video! I never played DA but followed the Veilguard's controversy. Now I will certainly play the previous games in the series
Banger! This is my favorite content from you. It's so well written and provides learning and growth, if only the haters could understand honest criticism, we could have it all. Great story telling, great game play , art direction, world build, and yes room for diversity. I hate "DEI" content not because of the diversity itself but for how badly it's done and how shoe horned it is at the price of establish world building. It's like wanting to represent natives Americans by allowing your character to wear a feather head piece. Bad representation is insulting and destroys what could of been done well and interesting. The fact of life is simple, if your going to do something, do it well or don't do it at all.
Thank you! More coming right up!
Much of what you said can be applied to any piece of established entertainment. Breaking canon or established lore the way Vileguard did would've been unthinkable in the past, yet here we are.
Sten is one of my favourite characters in a game ever. I love lore and different made up cultures in fantasy media. If I want to talk to nb Susan I talk to nb Susan in real life.
This is the first Nuhre video I've seen without her being censored 100 times 😅
The Arishock would declare this video approved by the Qun
Taash will go down in Dragon Age infamy as a textbook example of how NOT to write the Qunari.
Once again another banger character comparison!!!
Central Asian nomads (Ancient Turks and their descendants, I don't know about Mongols) used to have women who took roles of men, fighting on horse and wearing men's clothes. (Turkic languages do not have grammatical gender distinctions so maybe it was easier to them speech wise, don't know). Among Kazakh people (who used to be nomads until the October Revolution) these women were called "yerkek-shora". History has interesting examples, but why bother, Bioware?
Same in Albania and certain tribes in Africa, women could socially transition in societies with strict gender norms for multiple reasons, from being a sole inheritor to their father and to tribe lacking enough men of fighting age to field and wife up brides, but why bother.
Taash's character is just insufferable. I 100% agree that her inclusion of the story was to simply push real world politics instead of creating a character to deepen the understanding of a rich world. Her struggle is incredibly shallow. Instead of getting a character where we could see a struggle with identity in a society that's not fully accepting of it, she instantly gets the little kid treatment and everyone starts using pronouns. Then a character gives an explanation on why long drawn out apologies are bad by explaining it in the longest, most drawn out way possible. Taash could have been an interesting character. What I find interesting is her California valley girl attitude COULD have worked in this game...if everyone else didn't talk the same way 😒. Taash is a good contrast between Sten and Iron Bull. A horribly written character vs two well-written, fleshed out characters. Taash is a great example of why you should NEVER create a character for political reasons only. Everything about Taash sticks out like a sore thumb. Her design, her attitude, even her motivations are all cringe-worthy. Taash can be summed up in two words: wasted potential.
The fact that Taash's mom is apparently going against the Qun, but also wants her to know the Qun was so weird. It would have been interesting if they leaned into the idea that her mom ascribes to a twisted interpretation of the Qun, and the equivalent of the nonbinary label was forced on her from a young age. Taash's arc would be her slowly realizing that her mother had brainwashed her, and it ends with her learning about the real Qun and accepting herself as a woman.
I am so angry that the game didn’t bother to examine the cultural dynamics of anything whatsoever.
Like bruh. Taash went to a Tevinter mage during a period of personal struggle, and that Tevinter mage put them in touch with more Tevinter citizens for guidance. They came out not with Tevinter-based terms for what they are but 2024 Earth explanations and terms. There could have been examination of the legacy of war between Tevinter and the Qun, plus fears about the corruptive nature of mages. Even if Taash wasn’t struggling with that, Shathann could have been. There could have been worry about whether the Tevinter citizens were preying upon Taash in a time of need or sincerely reaching out to give support.
But no. No history of conflict between Tevinter and the Qun allowed to be examined. Venatori/Antaam OTP too important.
I love this, it heavily explains what the specific problems with Veilguard as a whole really are... My biggest issue with Taash personally is the negative stereotype she represents. She is rude, interruptive, loud, annoying, stupid and at times even downright rapey... All of these words is what people, whom we'll say are on the "wrong side" of LGBT support, has associated with the tag for years. - If Taash is truly Bioware's hope of "bringing a Non-binary character in", could they at least not have tried breaking free from that kind of negative stereotype? Unless of course, like I am beginning to believe, they did it on purpose...
Taash: "Please respect my pronouns."
Also Taash: "No, I don't care that you asked me to stop, I'm going to keep calling you corpse fucker just because I find you creepy until the player tells me to stop."
Really does not make them a likeable character.
The stereotype exists for a reason, and it's one the community actively and willingly cultivates. It's what they believe is morally righteous behavior.
@@InvertedWIng This. They believe hedonism and hook ups are superior to committed relationships, they believe they are cooler, better and superior to cishet people, they arrogantly lecture everyone, they constantly play the victim and call everyone names. It's simply accurate to what most of them are like. Perverse, rude, deeply narcissistic and arrogant, self-righteous people.
Sten: Awesome
Iron Bull: Fun
Taash: Traash
Brilliant thesis and the fact its in your second language even better. I bet this will make your bestie Eddie seethe with rage.
If you broaden the idea further of identity and realisation of self growth you have :-
Allistair : the reluctant heir
Liliana: no matter which path so much growth
Morrigan: from heartless witch to doting mother (depending upon the path)
Fenris: mastering his Past
Blackwall: the fale warden
Cole : the compasdion spirit playing pinnochio
Serra: from her jokdey childlike nature developing in to maturity.
All of them show growth and change written with maturity and nuance. But when you have writers so mentally stunted and indoctrinated into the globohomo belief system no wonder veilguard was so shallow, its writers are barely well rounded people.
Pretty soon RPG’s will be about paying bills and delivering food just to get by.
Wow that was a fast ❤️ I’m flattered 🤗
@@dannyloveI'm always keeping an eye out 👁
@ I just got here! Are you a vampire?
Was it ever said before Inquisition that ‘in the Qun woman can be men’ and vice versa in any Dragon Age media? I remember Sten saying women can’t be warriors and that you can’t change things like where you’re born or your eye color.
yes, example is in the video when Bull intorduces term for trans person
The only interesting character story in the entirety of DAV that feels even somewhat fleshed out is Emmerich's.
Him and Davrin are the only normal ones
Guess what the artbook reveals Emmerich was designed back in the time of project Joplin and they got him right from the first sketch, that's why he shines, actually talented people made that character
Really like your takes in these analysis vids! Looking forward to more! 🙂👍
Thank you, Silvia!
Taash's gender identity was never the issue. It was the lack of impact, conflict, and respect for the lore.
Thank you for looking deeper into the real problems with this character.
Another character analysis vid! Thank you for the early Christmas gift.
Happy holidays!
Thank you for this video.
My pleasure!
It is so odd to see material from EA Italia outside of Italy xD thank you for giving me a well needed giggle
Your video commentaries are superb!
Glad you like them! ❤
Taash aka T(r)aash.
This to was a demand of the qun
I disagree with the Iron bull. Simply because Iron Bull was the symptom of the beginning of the end for Bioware and Dragon Age.
I felt it extremely even when I was a dumb kid playing the game, that Iron Bull made zero sense and just wasn't a fun character to get to know, unpopular opinion as it is.
Simply because the character of Iron Bull and the Ben Hassrath being secret police just makes it extremely, I guess, on the nose, if I have to say it, and you know where the devs headspace is at.
Hear me out, going by Inquisition itself, the Ben Hassrath became secret police, okay, so why is the Bull a part of it? I remember some conversation where he said he was chosen caused he thinks differently or something, could be wrong since he was so forgettable, I forgot about most of the things about him, but I believe that was the case, which is a terrible person to choose for Ben Hassrath. You are now in a role where you are supposed to "reeducate" and fulfil spy activities and whatnot, but you don't think of the collective and at the drop of a hat, would actually change sides?
Like, think about this, why would the Ben Hassrath choose people who "think differently" and would maybe question the Qun and send them out into the rest of the world where they would potentially formed lifelong bonds with people, which could caused problems for them?
Even if the "think differently" thing was just me misremembering, it still doesn't make sense why the Ben Hassrath especially is not trained and "indoctrinated"(again, I hate how the Qun is made to be this malevolent force which has to resort to USSR, Stalin tactics to make the citizens compliant, even though previous interaction with the Qunari doesn't show they would do such a thing) to such a point where they would not be able to divorce themselves from any outside simulation like any good spies.
Why have someone be like the Bull and have potentially dozens upon dozens of traitors ready to turn. It is just all so stupid. On the other hand, the Arishok in DA2 was the perfect Qunari and gave us more insights into Qunari culture and ways teases by Sten. And I bring this up because especially with how Qunari culture is, it makes no sense why like 99.999% of the Qun in both Inquisition and and Veilguard isn't like Sten and the Arishok. Like, really, if they weren't, they would have long since left and became Tal-Vashoth or something like that. Not staying in the Qun and being allowed to act as they are and not being forced to conform.
And don't get me started on Tash or Taash or whatever her name is. Dumbest character ever. If you are a Quanri with the Qun, born and raised in Qunari society, where apparently secret police exists, how would you be able to develop into you yourself? These people never lived under a true state where it acts like funny moustache man Germany and Stalin USSR. The people who grew up and lived there with the knowledge of what they've been indoctrinated with, think so much more differently than an American from California. Hence why this dumb nut as a character existing whatsoever, and being as openly 21st century American from California, all it does is show how bad of a writer all these jokers are.
So next video is Leliana and Harding right? Right? Just asking for a friend.
Yes, it is 🤭
Taash just sounds like talking to American HR word police
Taash is a poor attempt of combining Iron Bull with his "wild" sexuality and making you feel comfortable. The "bitchyness" of Jack that you dislike but same time you feel like you can relate to her anger, once you know her backstory. Then with Dorian on his sexuality not being accepted by family, and where he comes from from some expectations pushed onto you.
Lucanis feels like a poor combination of BlackWall as a visual base. Trying to get the charm of Dorian of his poshness, and then Anders conflict with Justice that you see in Dragon Age 2, but you actually don't see that struggle that he has.
Bellara is like a weird mixture of Tali from Mass Effect with her quirkiness and innocent attitude, but you see her backstory and actually understand why she's so upbeat, then becoming more serious as well, with family drama, along with her people. Also you see her tinkering properly in the Mass Effect universe, not just "poof" it works. Then throw in some Merrill because elf and weird quirkiness.
Neve is like a weird combination of Aveline from DA2 and Garrus from Mass Effect.
I couldn't care to look up the others, patience was lost.
But this is how I saw these characters "personalities" and stories was made and inspired by.
Bioware cant even stop to copy old Bioware. They cant maintaing a narrative cohesion
As I wrote in my Steam review, which I am not sure is even up anymore due to censorship of differing opinions, I have come to the conclusion that every companion is a racist/ethnist stereotype.
Neve is the Middle Eastern man-turned-woman who has to hide it. (The game doesn't say it, but look up Neve's voice actor.) Bellara is the smart annoying Asian. Lucanis is the soft-hearted Mafioso. Emmrich is the genteel older gentleman with a dark secret. Davrin is the tough Black athlete. And Taash is the acting-out teenager with an overprotective parent.
The devs have spectacularly failed their own "inclusivity" tests.
@@ginacirelli1581what do you mean about Neve voice actor? She's not trans?
12:10 assigned? no. observed.
Taash annoyed me so much during my first playthrough. It seemed like every other dialogue with her was either about her identity, being upset at her mother, or being pissed off about the Qun/other qunari, and her comapnion quest constantly has those teams pushed into your face as well. I only added her to my team when my "friendship" with her was falling far behind compeared to the others. Having said that however, I did get some new/different dialogue from taking her along during my second playthrough, so she isn't as grating, but her cut scene focused moments are still the only ones I speed past/skip forward in, and she's still by far the companion I bring along the least, and the one who's companion quest I only get to when there's nothing else to pick.
All in all, Krem is Krem. Krem didn't focus on the gender aspect, but rather what the difference in gender meant in terms of a ever growing morality and practices of members withing the Qun. It is an opportunity to reveal more about the other characters and their opinions of individuality and traditions. It all goes to make the world feel more complicated, evolving, and bigger. In Dragon Age Veilgaurd, it is 100% hyperfixated on Taash and Taash's experiences. The tunnel vision makes Taash's side story feel self-absorbed, because it doesn't even have any interest in the opinions of others, seemingly dismissing any other opinions, and in continuously hits the same surface level information about feeling out of placed over and over without visually showing the player outside of their relationship with their mother (which is avoidable given that the mother was originally accepting of the idea under a different Quinari term). It makes it a shallow and boring. Because it is all about Taash, and Taash is already a surface level character. Once the game has explored all they can with Taash's experience, it goes in circles, as it doesn't give a f*ck about exploring how that relates to the world around them.
Thank you Nuhre I couldn’t have said it better myself.
When we studied gender in anthropology the professor had to take time to explain to us that gender is a social construct but its difficult to determine gender when valuable remains and contexts aren't available. So we have to base it on what we have and what we know and that means learning gender roles and items of those times. So we ended up associating gender to items, roles, and duties. Some people adhere to strict duties and roles and occasionally we would find people who associated with mixed roles and items. When I learned about Taash I was excited to see if the Qunari would associate gender like that, with roles and duties and what that means to someone who can and will do both or neither.
Anyways I was pretty disappointed by Taash's story
They should just hire you. Problem solved.
Buen video Doña Barbara, keep up the great work!!
Thank you, I will
Why does everyone in Veilguard not holding a weapon have their hands/fists on their hips when talking? Either that or crossed in front of them.
I come more for this than anything else. Me gustaria mas videos asi en el futuro para usarlo de referencia
One thing I've often found amusing since the days of DA:O is how the Qun more or less openly looks at males and goes "Yeah, nah, you're too dumb to work the crafts. Off to war you go!" 😂
I always loved the honesty in that
Didn't finish watching yet, but IMO, even Iron Bull was already kind of a shitty qunari... with all his lecturing us(Even somewhat scolding us if we bring it up again outside of cutscene) about how Krem is totally a man by the Qun standards(Which goes directly against what Sten says, and doesn't fit Qunari ideology which discourages any kind of individuality at all). Iron Bull can be likeable though, which is why some people mistakenly consider him much better than T(r)aash, but in actuality he only is marginally so, because he is written to be likeable(Which might highlight difference between David Gaider and Patrick Weekes as writers... though Gaider got a lot more deranged in past few years, so I guess Iron Bull was an effect of his brainrot beginning to take hold), but at the same time he is a big walking retcon of qunari lore for the sake of modern political pandering. Once I realized that about him, I never felt bad about having him just sacrifice the chargers for Qunari alliance, and then get killed by Inquisitor in Trespasser.
The arishok is what qunari should seek the be
I just wish we could disagree, challenge and even insult someone's beliefs, not just take their stuff and let the dialogue end
Very nice video! A question regarding content creation: I noticed you are using the music from the Dragon Age games in the video. Are you able to still monetize the video or does it get copyright claimed?
You can use any video game soundtrack (not Nintendo's though) and you won't get copyright striked. That's because there's too many gameplays on UA-cam and Twitch, and if they strike everyone, they won't make money 🤭
@@nuhre That's very helpful. Thank you very much :)
well said, I like these kinds of videos of your more, while I don't like Bull's character to much he did have depth to him, Tash is....missing an R in her name, Sten had interesting interactions with his own worldview which does come to a head
So we had Sten a devote memeber of the Quin.
Ironbull, A voluntary member of the quin that (depending on the player) can either stay as part of the Quin and fullfill his role or abandon his role and the quin.
And now... Taash who was raised outside of the Quin. Her mother and taash are Tal-vashosh, people that have rejected the Quin and ghe Quanri and these two groups do not like eachother.
So again. One loyal. One walking a tight rope that could go either way. And one that has been completely removed from that society.
So if Iron Bull was about making a personal choice.
And Taash is suppose to respresent "freedom" then why boil everything down to taash and her gender identity????
This is our FIRST time recruiting a tal-vassoth so HOW do they live? What does it look like for a group of Quanri who have left the Quin and their teachings look like???
This could have opened up this area of the world that players havent seen yet and it would have been a GENUINELY interesting story point.
Image visiting an area where other Quanri have formed a little community and you get to see this seperate society and how it differs from the Quanri that everyone is fimilair with.
Also on dragon age inquestion if you play as a Qunari you are a apart of a tal-vassoth mercenary group. (I think it was mixed raced but the point stands)
So they have some sort of structure.
Are there hidden communities? Where do they live? How do they live? What makes taash question herself when they have the FREEDOM to do whatever they want???
Do they want to join the Quin? Or is it something else????
Anyway. Sorry for the book report but there was a bunch of different directions to go woth this one and they picked the worst one on the list.
You put more effort into this video than anyone did at bioware When they were creating that character
This is such a wonderful video essay exploring why Vanguard did not work. Thank you so much.
You're very welcome!
Now that is what I call a return to form. I missed the lore videos. Thank you ☺
More to come!
@@nuhre I look forward to it :)
Great video. Well put.
Thanks for watching
the same character that is non-binary goes around saying that dragons can't have kings, only queens. she's quite the biggot, what if a female dragon identifies as a male?
You put it all very well into words!
While taash was controversial for a lot of things. There is one line that i cannot forgive and will forever damn that character for....
"Who doesn't like dragons?"
...... for real?