Live from the Table: The Israel-Hamas War and a Vision for the Future with Ambassador Michael Oren

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  • Опубліковано 2 лют 2025

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  • @abhatti17
    @abhatti17 5 днів тому +3

    Great interview Noam.

  • @guitarsandbongos
    @guitarsandbongos 6 днів тому +3

    Fantastic discussion!

  • @YOGAthletica
    @YOGAthletica 7 днів тому +4

    Thank you for this conversation. Assumptions like “a completely peaceful Palestinian state” are no more viable than pet unicorns who poop rainbow cotton candy.🍭 Also…keep in mind that biblical also means historical. The Torah is an ancient documentation of the historical connection of the Jewish people to our homeland. And it has never broken since. 🇮🇱

    • @HusseinDoha
      @HusseinDoha День тому

      Palestinians will not obey the unjust martial laws. How dare they?

  • @joncygardner
    @joncygardner 10 днів тому +10

    Great interview

    • @haraldisdead
      @haraldisdead 10 днів тому

      It was sheer lies and propaganda

  • @dantebenedetti2889
    @dantebenedetti2889 7 днів тому +3

    Michael said that the calamity of 10/7 resulted from a military failure & political failure. not quite:
    there were obvious military, security & intel failures. no dispute there.
    political failure? only in the sense that the the PM followed the unanimous advice of the military, security & intel chiefs. if one can show that the PM rejected or ignored their advice, one might have a case of govt culpability.
    "happened on his watch" is one of the most obtuse locutions ever coined, followed by "bring them home" (shouted angrily at the govt).

  • @taleiran
    @taleiran 10 днів тому +4

    Fantastic interview, like any interview with Michael Oren-thank you!
    To paraphrase the venerable Thomas Friedman (who sometimes asks good questions but rarely gives good answers): “Are Palestinians the way they are because of Hamas/PA, or are Hamas and the PA the way they are because of who the majority of Palestinians are?”
    If the answer is that Hamas and PA leadership duly reflect the character and aspirations of the majority of Palestinian Arabs, then perhaps the answer to Michael Oren’s question about the nature of a Palestinian state becomes obvious: the current generation of Palestinians, given half a chance, would likely create another failed state.
    Moreover, people older than, say, teenagers are unlikely to be educated differently than what they were taught in kindergarten and school. Therefore, a new generation of Palestinians-one not taught to hate Jews-needs to become a force in Palestinian society before an independent state, or any alternative, could be considered.
    Until then, there is no need to say, “Of course, every one of the killed Palestinians is a tragedy.” None of the approximately 17,000 Hamas terrorists killed is a tragedy.

  • @danthemanshuman
    @danthemanshuman 10 днів тому +3

    I hope Periel interrupts all my future conversations on Israel and the Middle East with a well placed “Hims” ad.

    • @izzykhach
      @izzykhach 9 днів тому

      From chewable hard mints...

  • @josephdevasia3921
    @josephdevasia3921 7 днів тому +7

    What is judicial system that puts children on administrative detention. They call this democracy???

    • @dantebenedetti2889
      @dantebenedetti2889 7 днів тому +2

      what "children"? a 16 yr old carrying an rpg should not be detained? is that your argument, buttercup? fool!

    • @mikeharper3459
      @mikeharper3459 День тому

      @@dantebenedetti2889errr…I think the comment is more focused on the kids who throw rocks at tanks in the streets and get placed in administrative detention without charges or a trial. In light of your comment, perhaps you’d be kind enough to enlighten us about the precise number of 16 year olds were held in administrative detention? Then again, you’re probably cool with Palestinians being raped in Israel’s prisons…

  • @Confused999
    @Confused999 10 днів тому +22

    This is so insane...the way they talk about Israel morality, kindness and their "spirit" and care for human life that is superior to all other nations and ...esp at the end of the video is HLARIOUS and seriously seriously DISGUSTING.
    Refer back to the tens of thousands of dead children.
    Gotta say, Noam delivers again.

    • @yvyvyv1
      @yvyvyv1 10 днів тому

      This is so insane…thinking Israel is the cause of Palestines children’s death instead of putting the blame on the real perpetrators who started unnecessary war and sacrificed them in the name of jihadi ideology

    • @jg5050
      @jg5050 10 днів тому

      That's kind of what happens in a war and in a war where the genocidal death cults wages destruction behind the bodies of its people.

    • @joge2468
      @joge2468 10 днів тому +4

      First, 10s of thousands is nonsense. 22K total civilians have been demised - men, women and children. Second, every single one of those was 100% avoidable. Hummus could have simply not invaded its neighbor. Or, they could have provided shelters. Or, they could have worn uniforms. Or they could have not militarized the entire Strip. Your moral confusion is painful.

    • @SuperKripke
      @SuperKripke 10 днів тому

      ​@@joge2468when Gaza opens up folks like you will be pivoting once again despite the extent of Israel's atrocities. You will have the benefit of anonymity. Noam and his fellow genocide deniers won't have that benefit.

    • @jonfoxtrot5135
      @jonfoxtrot5135 9 днів тому

      ​@@joge2468You are the kool-aid.

  • @haraldisdead
    @haraldisdead 10 днів тому +8

    "'We are fighting human animals.' I thought that was an insult to animals."
    Can you imagine if anybody else said that about anyone?

    • @joge2468
      @joge2468 9 днів тому +3

      To call Hummus “animals” after what they did on 10:07?? I personally prefer “barbarians,” but “monsters” works as well. Btw, Mlims call all Js “rats,” “pigs,” and “cancerous” with no condemnation.

    • @noahghost4476
      @noahghost4476 9 днів тому +2

      I don't have to imagine, because I would say it all day long. In fact I will tomorrow.

    • @sam-x2q1v
      @sam-x2q1v 9 днів тому +3

      people say it about Japanese
      Germans
      Islam amassed an empire of
      5 million sq miles over the course of 14 centuries millions of indigenous people were slaughtered to obtain the land of the indigenous
      The Muslims’ long martial experience molded them into a culture and people that admire the scimitar and sword and the art of war and slaughter.
      The Jews during the same time did not have experiences that led to the development of a culture of war.
      If a distraught person finds his family members slaughtered they could be forgiven for cursing the murderers as being animals
      A cry of anguish cursing your butchers is normal is human

    • @haraldisdead
      @haraldisdead 9 днів тому

      @sam-x2q1v well we're not talking about "Islam" 1300 years ago. We were discussing Israel/Palestine.

    • @zeebs5668
      @zeebs5668 9 днів тому

      yes i can imagine, just turn on any arab news network and you will very quickly hear what they call Jews and Christians alike....trust me, it's a lot worse than animals

  • @zaradaneshvar3904
    @zaradaneshvar3904 10 днів тому +3

    But it’s not true that Russians didn’t care about Iran and were willing to let Israel do the “dirty work” for them. The Russians and the Islamic republic have had this symbiotic relationship that has been useful for both of them. Don’t forget Russia’s using the Iranian drones to fight Ukraine as we speak!
    I also totally agree that nothing gets resolved in the Middle East unless the Islamic republic is being dealt with. I’m saying this as an Iranian diaspora.

  • @mahad4088
    @mahad4088 8 днів тому +3

    I always admire Jews people their strength and courage and the love ❤️ for each other
    Arab here for Jews
    Long live Israel 🇮🇱

    • @letXeqX
      @letXeqX Годину тому

      Shukran!

  • @haraldisdead
    @haraldisdead 10 днів тому +17

    He just admits that Israel is out to steal and settle all of "greater Israel," and they don't say A WORD.

    • @joge2468
      @joge2468 9 днів тому +7

      Really? That’s what you got from this? He said: 1.) Legally, the WB has been part of Izzz since 1967. 2.) In every other instance, we understand that starting a wore and being defeated has territorial consequences, eg 35% of Germany was given to Poland after WWII. 3.) The failure to exact territorial losses is a huge part of the Pian attempts to annihilate Izzz again and again.

    • @joge2468
      @joge2468 9 днів тому

      Btw, the “Greater Izzz” conspiracy theory asserts that Izzz is intent on annexing all of Jordan and Lebanon, and parts of Syria, Iraq, Saudi Arabia, and Egypt. Annexing Judea and Samarea is hardly that.

    • @noahghost4476
      @noahghost4476 9 днів тому

      ​@@joge2468anti-zionists can't read that much, man. Just ask him who he thinks the land is being stolen from.

  • @mxewris2355
    @mxewris2355 9 днів тому +4

    1:03:00 "We are a society that cares about one another...passionately, completely. They are a society that doesn't care about one another. Not only did H@m@s not care about how many palestinians are killed, THE WAY PALESTINIANS STEAL FOOD FROM ONE ANOTHER THERE. There is not a lot of mutual compassion."
    What a disgusting thing to say. After the government and military he speaks in defense of has tried to starve out the society, he dares to degrade the people for fighting for their survival in this hell. Im let down by Noam and disturbed by how these supremacist views can again and again be voiced without ANY pushback on this podcast. But I increasingly get the idea that Noam and the others are simply not capable of understanding this vile racism, cause he seems to share some of these views.

  • @haraldisdead
    @haraldisdead 10 днів тому +10

    "You gotta give war a chance."
    These people are not human.

  • @stevendoran4790
    @stevendoran4790 9 днів тому +10

    I haven't listened in awhile can't believe you guys have went full psycho since. Pretty unhinged conversation by a supremacist.

  • @YOGAthletica
    @YOGAthletica 7 днів тому +1

    Noam, amazing that you are going to Poland! I can’t wait to hear about that experience 🙏😭

  • @Mitchellogic
    @Mitchellogic 10 днів тому +3

    Great conversation as always. Hoping many people will see this

  • @moomoo1200
    @moomoo1200 10 днів тому +12

    hostages if they are israeli, prisoners if they are palestinian, you could make the argument that alot of those prisoners are not criminals and are simply being held hostage

    • @stevenjm12
      @stevenjm12 10 днів тому +3

      Proof?

    • @jacobvandijk2184
      @jacobvandijk2184 10 днів тому +7

      Hostages were kidnapped from a music festival and/or homes. Prisoners are arrested and jailed for committing crimes.

    • @harrison3859
      @harrison3859 10 днів тому

      @@jacobvandijk2184with no trial, no evidence and martial law is some corrupt shit

    • @AlexPinkowish-z3q
      @AlexPinkowish-z3q 10 днів тому

      @@jacobvandijk2184 many are held for years in "administrative detention" without ever being charged with or even accused of an official crime, due to administrative detention being able to be renewed indefinitely and without reason. this includes young adults and children of both genders, and there are many corroborating reports and testimonies of rampant physical and sexual abuse within these facilities against criminals and the arbitrarily detained alike, of all ages. so, you are wrong.

    • @Yogesh-jq9jj
      @Yogesh-jq9jj 10 днів тому +2

      ​@@stevenjm12 Just look at the hostage deal. Israel has agreed to release 1300 Palestinians NOT involved in Oct 7 attack. They were detained from Gaza. The Israeli officials have earlier admitted that they were being kept in detention for an exchange: they are hostages by definition.

  • @ai_com
    @ai_com 10 днів тому +12

    Disgraceful commentary. Complete lack of awareness coupled with numerous instances of dishonesty.

    • @noahghost4476
      @noahghost4476 9 днів тому +5

      Why comment with a claim you're not going to substantiate?

  • @haraldisdead
    @haraldisdead 10 днів тому +5

    This is like listening to an interview of Herman Goering.

  • @TheShacharZiv
    @TheShacharZiv 10 днів тому +1

    7:43 That's a weird assumption:"Next time there would be no hostages".
    Why assume that in the next conflict hostages would not be successfully taken?
    If you live here and have your eyes open, you know it is highly likely hostages will be taken in the beginning of the next conflict, perhaps less and perhaps more than in Oct.7.
    The logic here is similar to assuming an alchoholic will not take the first drink again next time...

    • @joge2468
      @joge2468 9 днів тому +2

      The assumption is that Izzzz will no longer let its guard down or underestimate its enemies.

    • @AkZeal76
      @AkZeal76 9 днів тому

      Don't try and find logic in people defending this deal I looked its doesn't exist. Its all emotional and delusions

    • @aviodenheimer4090
      @aviodenheimer4090 9 днів тому

      There will be increased attempts to take Israeli hostages while they are visiting other countries. Just the idea that they can take totally innocent hostages and we are expected to negotiate is a very bad president to set.

  • @MarkAbramsContentsatYoutv
    @MarkAbramsContentsatYoutv 9 днів тому +1

    Disappointed to hear Oren's presentation on Amalek in Judaism (and Noam's lack of understanding). Ask any orthodox Jew (and both know plenty). There are 613 commands in Judaism. 1 of them is to destroy the nation of Amalek. But Judaism is absolutely clear that that is no longer possible since 400 BC or so when tribes of the area assimiliated. There is no debate. So, any reference to it is gesture but not the actual religion which is strictly about doing the commandments (aka the "mitzvot").

  • @joge2468
    @joge2468 9 днів тому

    56:12 I’m confused by this line of reasoning. The current owner’s rights don’t always supersede those of the original owner, eg art stolen by the knottsies is handled differently in different countries. I think you could make a good faith argument that the statute of limitations on ownership shouldn’t commence until the original owner is actually in a position to demand its return. In any event, I think this is the wrong framework to view the “ownership” of the WB. Natasha Hausdorff cites the same legal argument for possession of the WB as Oren. She does a very good job explaining the case.

    • @haraldisdead
      @haraldisdead 9 днів тому

      His argument is "Yea but we want it."

  • @orhutubeli5332
    @orhutubeli5332 9 днів тому

    Even if we didn't get one hostage out it wouldn't effect enlisting into the army because we don't have a choice but to have a strong military.
    So what's the logic behind the deal, not emotions but logic.

    • @AkZeal76
      @AkZeal76 9 днів тому +2

      there is none but they would never admit this. This is pure emotional sentimentality by old fools

    • @haraldisdead
      @haraldisdead 7 днів тому

      @@orhutubeli5332 you do have a choice. Stop waging war against all your neighbors.

  • @Hadeed20
    @Hadeed20 9 днів тому +3

    Man can he talk out of both sides of his mouth. He says there’s the bigatory of no expectations that western powers believe that Arabs are savages that kill each other. Then he points to Assad and Syria and says look how these savages kill each other 😂. No one ever mentions peaceful Arab countries like , always former colonial countries like Syria, iraq and Yemen .
    Arabs AND Jews were Palestinian citizens under the British mandate. Arabs asked for a reduction in Jewish immigration in the 30s because the Jews would replace them and lo and behold here we are today.

    • @sam-x2q1v
      @sam-x2q1v 9 днів тому

      The Jews did not come with weapons the Ottomans and the Brit’s had a legal system that regulated the purchase of land. Some Arabs actually favored Jews fortifying the Land . But this positive narrative was crushed by Arabs like Husseni who indoctrinated his followers to loathe the Jews and oppose them in every way
      We need a narrative that imagines the people lovingly joining to do good things.
      Is that too wimpy not swashbuckling enough for a culture of glorious warriors whose caliphate sits astride the planet?

  • @joge2468
    @joge2468 9 днів тому

    47:03 This is a very strange and ahistorical thing to say. Js didn’t have a shared culture? I’m sorry, but wtf do you call Judism? You could argue there were two subsets - Ashkenazi & Sephardi - but they shared the most important aspect of an ancient culture. In addition, though it wasn’t a commonly spoken language, these disparate communities were able to communicate in Hebrew, and they did, even before its “revival.”

  • @nishantkamat
    @nishantkamat 10 днів тому +7

    I wish Noam would push back more forcefully on the issues he and the guest clearly disagree on - the settlements and biblical claims of land - instead of shying away in order to not offend him. Lot of deflection from the guest. The non-existence of a Palestinian state before the zionist movement is completely irrelevant here. Most states that exist today have a very recent history of statehood/nationhood. Refusing to say the people who have lived there for centuries have an equal right to the land shows the unwillingness to empathize with the other side.
    And what's with the repeated talking point of converting deaths to the proportion of population to say 1200 deaths on Oct 7 is like 44,000 american deaths, as if you're converting shekels to dollars? Blatant attempt to exaggerate the scale of the attack.1200 deaths is 1200 deaths. If 1200 people die in Venezuela I don't see their total population size and calculate how sad i should feel.

    • @usbconnections
      @usbconnections 10 днів тому +4

      Proportionality gives context and is important. We do it naturally with everything. Like depending on proportionality, losing one brain cell can either be a non-story or a tragic one

    • @lamegalectora
      @lamegalectora 10 днів тому +1

      The point is that when all those new states you mention were created, millions of people were displaced. About 700,000 of them were Arabs from the Protectorate of Palestine and they (their descendants) are the only ones that call themselves refugees to this day. All the others (including about 900,000 jews kicked out of various Arab countries) made new lives in the land they ended up in and became its citizens. Being as the Arabs from the Protectorate weee first and foremost Arabs with an arab language, religion and culture, they could have made new hones in any of the numerous Arab countries nearby.

    • @joge2468
      @joge2468 10 днів тому

      35% of Germany was given to Poland after WWII, and tens of millions of ethnic Germans, Poles, and Ukrainians were “forcibly transferred” (“ethnically cleansed”) to within their new borders. In other words, there were consequences for starting and losing a wore.
      Over the last 75 years, the UN and its agencies have spent tens of billions of dollars on Pian refugees, but not a cent on the Jish Refugees. And since 1949 the UN has passed more than a hundred resolutions on Pian refugees and not a single one on Jish refugees from MENA countries.
      All of these people managed to move on. Only the Pians have been allowed perpetual victimhood and zero accountability.

    • @joncygardner
      @joncygardner 10 днів тому

      12 hundred dead in Israel is the mental equivalent of the number of soldiers killed in one of Israel's wars and has significant psychological effects on Israel.
      About claiming the entire land of the West Bank. These Arabs have never declared themselves a state and in the absence of such a state from a legal point of view, the only state of the space between Jordan river and Mediterranean sea is Israel. Israel has Turkish and British cadastre and is the only one who inherited the public lands of this land.The other side absolutely refuses to declare itself a state because in their minds all the pedant west of the Jordan is theirs.

    • @aviodenheimer4090
      @aviodenheimer4090 10 днів тому

      I think he was making the "no prior state" from a legal point of view and that is actually important. Since they are using Geneva convention as a legal argument then it is important all the conditions for a legal argument apply.
      In terms of the scale I agree with that it is strange. What they should say is that there were almost no People in Israel that did not know someone killed, kidnapped or badly injured in the oct. 7 invasion. It is an attempt to make people outside of Israel understand how momentous of disaster it was.

  • @doniphandiatribes
    @doniphandiatribes 10 днів тому

    Thanks as usual. How come there’s no Subscribe button?

  • @joseroshe1059
    @joseroshe1059 10 днів тому

    That is an interesting point. There actually ARE two states.

    • @joge2468
      @joge2468 9 днів тому

      When Izzz “abandoned” the territory of AzaG in 2005, it de facto became its own state. Izzz declared its release of interest to the UN, which then legally afforded AzaG a right of self-determination. So far as I can tell, the reasons AzaG didn’t declare statehood are: 1.) The inhabitants would no longer be considered refugees and thus not entitled to UNRWA aid; 2.) The elected government would have been obligated to perform the functions of a state; and 3.) The inhabitants would no longer be able to carry the mantle of “resistance,” thereby exposing their maximalist position against the existence of Izzz.

    • @joseroshe1059
      @joseroshe1059 9 днів тому

      @@joge2468 Valid points. You didn't type out the actual names because TY censors them?

    • @joge2468
      @joge2468 9 днів тому

      @@joseroshe1059 I’m censored like crazy. I’ve counted like 40 words I’m not allowed to use. Meanwhile, the J-haters on YT are permitted to write all kinds of crazy s#%t.

  • @noahghost4476
    @noahghost4476 9 днів тому

    How accurate is it when he says nobody knows who the Gaza Health Ministry is? Or the Palestinian health authority, I think they are the same.
    I can search and find names, so maybe he didn't literally mean that nobody knows the names of the people who run it.
    I'm interested in this because it might be helpful as a way to wake friends up about the truth of the situation. If there's a lot of mystery surrounding the Gaza health ministry.

  • @harrison3859
    @harrison3859 10 днів тому +11

    This is some racist ass shit

  • @haraldisdead
    @haraldisdead 10 днів тому +4

    Yes, Israel destroyed Al Ahli hospital.

  • @haraldisdead
    @haraldisdead 10 днів тому +2

    "This is what they do to each other. Look at Syria. Look at Lebanon.
    It's a medieval, middle eastern way of waging war."
    This is shockingly racist, particularly considering what Israel has done to all of those people.

    • @joge2468
      @joge2468 9 днів тому

      I don’t recall him saying anything along the lines of, “These people are inherently barbaric. It’s in their DNA” - as opposed to what you’ll read people saying about Js in these comments. It is a fact that Mlims in MENA have did not experience the Enlightenment. Their culture is medieval in significant ways.

    • @AkZeal76
      @AkZeal76 9 днів тому +2

      if you think that facts are racist youre just revealing your own racism. What was written is true, if you think its because of their race then that's on you. There are many other explanations, economic, cultural, political... youre choosing to view it through this lens

  • @haraldisdead
    @haraldisdead 10 днів тому +1

    When he says "up north," he means Lebanon.
    They're coming for it, so he doesn't call it was it is.

  • @haraldisdead
    @haraldisdead 10 днів тому +4

    The Palestinians didn't go to war in 1948. They were already suffering extermination for a year by then.

    • @benjamintillis3952
      @benjamintillis3952 10 днів тому +1

      After Israel accepted a partition plan?

    • @Toichen
      @Toichen 9 днів тому +2

      Correction: they were already engaged in trying to exterminate another people for a year before then

    • @joge2468
      @joge2468 9 днів тому +1

      You mean, “They had already started a civil wore.”

    • @sam-x2q1v
      @sam-x2q1v 9 днів тому

      Beginning In the 1800s Arabs were already attacking Jews .
      see book Ghosts of a Holy War

    • @haraldisdead
      @haraldisdead 4 дні тому

      @benjamintillis3952 except they didn't. They were already trying to seize the entire territory for a year before it was passed by the UN.

  • @haraldisdead
    @haraldisdead 10 днів тому +2

    These three Chosen People, one of whom is a former US AMBASSADOR, throwing around "We," "us," "our," in reference to a foreign country.
    Swear to God, this country owes Ilhan Omar a huge apology.

    • @joge2468
      @joge2468 9 днів тому

      “We” refers to Js, not Izzzis. Unlike the woke left, we don’t kid ourselves that gee hadists are only anti-Izzz. As the Houthi flag says, “Deth to Izzz. Curse on the Js.”

    • @joge2468
      @joge2468 9 днів тому

      Also, it’s common parlance to refer to one’s side or team as “we.” This usage is ubiquitous among sports fans despite not actually being on the team.

    • @AmosBetser
      @AmosBetser 9 днів тому +1

      He was the ISRAELI ambassador to the US. You are an idiot.

    • @heat8534
      @heat8534 9 днів тому

      End Islamist settler colonialism to the US

  • @jacobvandijk2184
    @jacobvandijk2184 10 днів тому +2

    Wow, do better with your segues from Peace Deal to ED commercial!!!

  • @haraldisdead
    @haraldisdead 10 днів тому

    "They fatten them up. It's evil and satanic."
    Lol they fed their hostages. How evil.

  • @haraldisdead
    @haraldisdead 10 днів тому

    "We know that's not possible," talking about Palestinian independence.

  • @Hassan-lx5kj
    @Hassan-lx5kj 10 днів тому +4

    FREE PALESTINE PEOPLE HOSTAGE FROM ISRAEL JAIL

  • @haraldisdead
    @haraldisdead 10 днів тому +2

    They really believe that voicemail was real?

  • @haraldisdead
    @haraldisdead 10 днів тому +1

    "Anyone who's not ambivalent is not being honest."
    No. We're plenty happy to see peace.
    You just might be the aggressor in this situation.
    Free Palestine 🇵🇸

    • @joge2468
      @joge2468 9 днів тому +1

      🤣🤣🤣

  • @dharshinithurairajah7124
    @dharshinithurairajah7124 6 днів тому

    Forty eight minutes in and I'm shocked, have vommitted twice and don't know if I have the verve to go on.

  • @dantebenedetti2889
    @dantebenedetti2889 7 днів тому

    Michael said that the calamity of 10/7 resulted from a military failure & political failure. not quite:
    there were obvious military, security & intel failures. no dispute there.
    political failure? only in the sense that the the PM followed the unanimous advice of the military, security & intel chiefs. if one can show that the PM rejected or ignored their advice, one might have a case of govt culpability.
    "happened on his watch" is one of the most obtuse locutions ever coined, followed by "bring them home" (shouted angrily at the govt).