Comparing Fender Strat Tremolo Springs - Vintage vs. Aftermarket Springs
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- Опубліковано 15 лис 2019
- In this video, I propose that the type of tremolo spring you use can affect the tone of your Stratocaster. I experienced this first hand several years ago when I bought a Nash S-HX68 Strat with a Gotoh tremolo assembly with very tight springs. The wang bar was very difficult to move so I decided to install a set of vintage tension correct Raw Vintage springs. The tone drastically improved on the Nash. That opened my eyes to how much difference a spring can make. I had seen a quote from Eric Johnson where he had switched his springs and his Strat sounded bad to him. So, he immediately dug the old springs out of the trash and put them back on.
Another goal here was to match springs that I inadvertently mixed up over the years. I wanted to be sure I had all of the vintage springs on my 1962 Strat. I devised a simple tension tester so I could determine the difference in spring tension. I used a cheap, digital fish scale for the job.
In the chart below, I used a different test method to compensate for the slight length difference between a 39 loop spring and a 41 loop spring (approx. 2mm). I stretched each type of spring 1" and recorded the tension. They are an average except for the Candy Apple Red Strat which had a mixture of tensions. Interesting discovery was the pitch of the spring was directly related to the tension of the spring. The difference in pitch between an 10.4# spring and a 11.6# spring is 1 whole step (Ab-Bb)
Callaham springs = 16# (lbs)
Gotoh springs = 15#
1964 Vintage = 11.6#
Raw Vintage = 10.4#
C.A.R. Strat (red) = 13.5#
16.0# (1/2 step higher pitch)
13.7#
16.0# (1/2 step higher pitch)
14.2#
Fender American Vintage = 14.2 # (added 7/11/2020)
Raw Vintage springs -rawvintage.com/eng/item_spring...
I have not tried a set of Fender springs but for less cost, you can give them a try -
but I guess they may be on the higher tension side of the spectrum www.musiciansfriend.com/acces...
shop.fender.com/en-US/parts/b...
www.callahamguitars.com/strat...
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The bro science is strong in this video
I'm a bodybuilder. I live my life based on bro science
Really technical well-done video, thanks a bunch for sharing! Very gorgeous video, full of infos, also about how they ring and how soft they are, thanks a bunch!
Great video and research. I bought them and they have improved the function and tone of my strat. I float the trem and have solved my problem! Stays in tune because I use sewing machine oil on all string contact points.
Thanks for this great video Millstap explaining the importance of springs. I’ve got a great 60’s player Strat that has a floating bridge at 3/32 with 5 Fender vintage springs that sounds great but am now interested in the Raw Vintage Springs and yes there is a reverb effect from springs!
This is a great & insightful video, thanks for doing this, after hearing the green Strat springs, it sounds exactly like the garbage springs that I've had in most of guitars for the last 25+yrs. I'm getting a set of raw vintage.
Good deal. The Raw Vintage springs are, I think, the only vintage correct springs available.
I like the scientific with known goods, baselines and quantifiable numbers. Nicely done. 👍
Once again, thank you sir, amazing content as usual, love the secrets to excellent tone. I've spent countless hours on my nash t-57 tinkering trying to achieve better tone so I can relate
I immediately bought a set of raw vintage springs after watching this video. Thanks for the info!
Daniel, I think you will love them.
The best video i've seen about the subject. You got my attention when you said :"The springs are like a small reverb on the back ..." ... as a matter of fact, the twangy strat sound is a reverb tone affected by springs. I recorded my strat tone unplugged, the mod i did to it made a more vibrating instrument, therefore, a louder unplugged tone. The tone is ... twangy ... and the thing is .... unplugged !!! .... . Let me demonstrate this: i was fixing issues with some srv audio files that i downloaded from youtube in my daw. I was erasing glitches and other bugs. Then i decided to slow the track down enough to learn some fast licks from the man. When i heard the first notes ... pure strat tone, no drums or bass, i heard the reverb the way it is on a guitar signal (lower than 60 % speed) and that sounded familiar, like my unplugged strat .... but why ???? . I searched for my recorded unplugged strat tone audio file in my HDD and compared both audio files at the same slow and normal speed and the twangy tone was in there. SRV's tone was full on reverb and my unplugged strat tone had the "same" fx. Of course, i had to amplify my audio file to a higher level in my daw to get a good comparison. The affected signal at super slow speed is " TA TA TA TA TA TA TA ....", that is because of springs are working withe signal and IT'S quite annoyng, that is because the springs are part of a fundamental tone on a Fender Strat guitar/spring tank reverb .. but at normal speed ... oh! ... we appreciate that effect in our signal !. It's make sense. See how a spring tank reverb works on a fender amp ..... mixing a clean signal with another signal that runs throughout the long springs of the tank.
The "portable unit reverb" on a Strat is a great invention of mr. Leo fender. The twangy tones come from springs adding their mojo to the vibes that come and go throughout the entire instrument, of course, if it has no sustain leaks in all the sustain path. Just the way You've demonstraded in your video ! .
Remember folks ... strong vibrations means more sustain and louder volume. I friend of mine from MIT wrote in my channel some time ago " Water, electricity and vibrations ALWAYS find the path with lesser resistance "
... if you want to know more about springs, mod's and other great ideas on how to get more sustain, just let me know : ua-cam.com/video/62OUykJmfoY/v-deo.html
This is more about feel than "sound". Other than the ring/dull (or muting/not muting of the spring.) Some players hate that ringing sound and others don't.
My story is this. I buy,repair and customize Casio PG 380 MIDI synth guitars (made 1988 only) A high end Strat with a body full of electronics (built in synth)
I bought mine new in 1989. A few years ago I bought one off ebay played it and it felt very dead and dull compared to mine.
Put new strings on it,no difference. When I took it apart to fix the electronics I noticed someone had painted a heavy layer of conductive paint in the cavity.
These are made with a light layer sprayed on.
Nice work and effort showing what you discovered here. Will be looking further at your other videos.
I can see it coming now...Six tuned to pitch springs sales "pitch" ?
I find it very interesting going over fine details like this can inspire other things. Thank you.
You are either completely insane or genius. And l thought I was obsessive.
GReat , great great... thanks for all your videos are very interesting
You're welcome Macauley. Springs really do add a resonance to your Strat and it can be a bad resonance if you are not aware of it.
Man you are legend. The best video on youtube by far!
The springs are definitely a part of the Strat sound. That is why I'm not sure why there are people out there that prefer the hardtail Strat. It doesn't sound like a Strat to me but it does have its own unique sound.
@@millstap I know everything by myself I have years of experience but you perfectly explain everything on camera !
I can't believe after watching this video that you didn't actually play the guitars (as opposed to 'playing' the springs) to illustrate the tonal difference between 3 high tension springs, and 5 vintage tension springs!
And sang!
i guess that part's up to us. i would've liked that too but truth is there are so many factors at play, like the trem block material, saddles material, nut material... experimentation is key for reaching our own personal best tone. to satisfy my own obsession i will try a mix of gotoh PSPs, RV, Fender originals, and a Tremmory.
Inorite. In the end that's all that matters.
I did that myself. Years ago I got a Wilkinson trem to replace the stock trem on my Highway One Strat. I used the stock springs that came with the Wilkinson, and eventually they got mixed in with the Fenders and I lost track of them in the wake of other guitars bought and trem springs swapped back and forth. So this video was just what I needed. I took off the Wilkinson last year, so last night I went back to three of my Strats to find the 4 springs that came with the Wilkinson so I could remove them and keep them with the now-unused Wilkinson. I removed all the steel springs from those three guitars, counted coils and measured coil diameters. Turns out there were 4 with 39 coils but the coil diameter was just a little narrower than the others--those have to be the Wilkinsons. Anyway, if you got this far, thank you for the methods you show in this video. I got a lot out of it, and I was able to solve a problem I had avoided tackling before. Now all my Strats have matched springs and I'm happy.
Good deal. The tension test works well too if you ever buy a fish scale. I still have somewhat of a mystery going but then I never ever checked any of the springs when I originally bought them. I assumed at the time they were all original and most were but I think I might have a couple of oddball replacements mixed in. I think when someone buys a vintage Strat with only three springs on it then you would have to replace the missing two and that could happen a lot.
@@millstap Yes I agree, the fish scale works great in your video, and I want to try it. I think that will be the final verification that the four springs are the Wilkinsons.
Very interesting. I particularly liked the way that you demonstrate the tension in three different ways - the scale, the pitch of the plucked spring, and the gap between winds. Between them, that takes a lot of the guesswork out of it. My own feeling is that the mass of the springs may vary. If it does, the heavier springs might sound a little different, probably lower in pitch on the pluck test, if everything else is kept the same.
Paul, I just added a tension chart in the video description that is interesting. Today, I did a different test where I stretched each spring 1" to compensate for the slight length difference between the 39 loop and 41 loop springs. Interestingly, the spring's pitch is directly related to the springs tension. Lower tension is a lower pitch just like on a string. The difference between a 10.4# spring and a 11.6# spring is one whole step, from Ab to Bb. The difference between a 13.5# spring and a 16# spring is 1/2 step. There may be another factor like metal mass since you would think there would be a larger pitch difference between 13.5# and 16#. Surprisingly, the Raw Vintage springs have the least tension of all of the springs. My Strat is sounding much better with a very nice ring from from wound strings.
After watching this video I installed Raw Vintage springs. Instantly, every problem my Strat (American Original 60s) had vanished. I just could not get the thing setup properly since I bought it. Always too much tension on the strings and relieving it introduced buzzing. I know how to setup a guitar and went through the setup process over and over but couldn't get this playing better, except for a shim because the neck pitched forward, even when the truss was backbowed.
Well I must say thank you because these springs fixed everything and the guitar plays great. It's the first time to understand how great Strats are.
This is so cool to hear. I'm even considering changing my 1964 spring to RV since they are a little tighter than the RV springs. The 1964 Strat is the only Strat I have that doesn't have RV springs in it. The neck pocket issue is a little more concerning to me. Has that changed at all since you installed the springs? It is kind of sad how Fender puts out these supposedly vintage correct Strats that aren't close to vintage specs, especially the springs. You would think they would just get a contract with Xotic to supply the springs for their builds. I think they are in California too. I just installed two Musikraft necks on my 1964 Strat and a Nash left handed Strat. Both were just screw on and play. I didn't even have to adjust the truss rod so I'm thinking maybe the neck heel or the neck pocket on the body may be off a little. If it was the neck heel, I would consider getting a new neck. This is just me thinking of what I would do. I'm sure you've got it working perfectly now and just want to keep playing. I just don't like shims because of the air gap they create. I would consider using a full pocket maple shim from StewMac but they have to be sanded some to make them super thin (closer to the headstock) in the pocket and I have never attempted that. Just ideas. Fender put shims in a lot of their Strats and I'm not exactly sure why. Must have been compensating for a misfit. I ended up removing them all and the sustain was a little better. Even Joe Glaser in Nashville put one in my vintage Strat. Used a business card which is not optimal. I removed it too.
Hi man, can I use a raw vintage set on my american deluxe with two point tremolo bridge ? I actually have three black original springs and with the 0.11 gauge strings the bridge stay very high. I like floating tremolo and have some problems with stay in tune. I just ordered the raw vintage before ask to you if I can use on this kind of guitar. 😅
Late to the party here, obviously, but this is just where I'm at with my latest Strat shaped object. Getting the Raw Vintage set of 5 next payday.
Thank you for reminding me of fish scales young man!
I have 4 generic springs with the Floyd/ESP trem bump stop in the middle slot of my HH Super Tele, still need to apply some sorcery to that one.
Lol. That fish scale has been pretty handy. Works great for culling out the tight springs. Raw Vintage springs are one of the cheapest great upgrades you can do to your Strat. I will be very interested to see how the "vintage correct" Mark Foley springs compare.
The plated springs sold by Fender are actually soft too. The black oxide ones are to be avoided if you use 5 springs.
There’s a reason Fender went to heavier springs in the 80’s. You don’t have to stuff TP or foam in the back cavity to stop unwanted noise.
Both setups have their advantages. Less heavier springs for high gain music, more lighter springs for more dynamic, lower gain music.
For the music we like, 5 soft springs is the way to go.
There are several versions of the Fender springs so I would end up having to buy two or three different ones to be sure. After reading the review, a lot of the reviewers said they were tight and did the trick just like they needed and could not find anywhere where Fender says they are vintage spec or anything. They just name them "vintage" springs. I am going to go do a different measurement method that will compensate for the length differences and put a little chart in the description. I will pull each each string a 1/2"-1" as accurately as I can and mark down the scale reading for each spring. That might show that the 1964 springs are even closer to the Raw Vintage strings tension wise.
I respectfully disagree , just for sake of discussion I think the more energy you can get out of a bridge is gonna sound better in any kind of music?
dezionlion When using a high gain amp, the tremolo springs come through the pickups. That’s why fender switched to those stiff black oxide coated springs in the 80’s. The overtones can be heard without even being plugged in.
Try it if you have softer springs.
millstap for sure, the black oxide coated springs are too stiff. The Fender plated springs I bought were very similar to the Raw Vintage springs. I wish they would tell you the tension ratings. It would be great to figure out which ones are softer because they’re dirt cheap compared to the Raw Vintage springs.
Hell yeah! Fish and guitars, my 2 favorite things
Exactly, and when I go fishing (whenever that may be) I'll have a nice fish scale for the big ones. It goes up to 110 lbs.
I've seen this video quite a few times in the past and yet have never given much thought about it. Was just interested in watching some tone chasing rabbit hole stuff. Today I observed my strat and one of the 2 springs (yes I only use 2) is touching the ground wire, and it doesn't ring obviously. I taped it to the body and the spring rings freely. I swear to god the strings on the higher end came to life more compared to before, and I do trust my hearing very much because I have perfect pitch. Of course anybody can dismiss my claim, but I just want to put it out here. Thanks for this video!
See. Those must be two super tight springs to be able to only need two. You should try the soft Raw Vintage and put at least four and maybe five on. The more you couple the string block to the body, the more sustain and tone from the body. Thanks for your input. Everything matters. I had a spring claw that had been painted during a refinish and when I finally scraped all of the paint off, the guitar sounded a little better.
@@millstap By the way, they are old Gotoh high tension springs which came from my old guitar. I love the feel and response compared to lighter springs I've tried in the past, and I only use light gauge strings (9s or 8s in most cases). I would love to try 5 raw vintage springs in the future, but I have been using these springs for 12 years now (and literally on 2 guitars). Still loving it!
@@sibike1 Yeah, you should try putting 5 of those Gotoh springs on. Just kidding. That is what was on my Nash Strat when I got it and I could barely move the tremolo. That is the experiment when I realized how much different the softer, vintage correct springs sounded. Now I know why could use just two.
Gold video bro !
I just scratched my springs and noticed they aren't all making the same ringing noise pitch. I also saw that they weren't all the same size and some made the guitar more resonate than others.... hmm i bought 3 more packs today. They say Raw vintage springs fatten up the tone of the guitar would you say that's true?
I have a new squire cyclone. Mustang like body, jag switches and slanted strat pups.. my strings keep going sharp after I use the vibrato bar. I'll tune and with the strat style bridge and The high E doesnt go sharp much but from each string up they're more sharp just resting. I could understand if they were flat but why are they all going sharp like that? I've tighten the spring screws and used different combos
Fender designed it for the gauge of stings used in the period they had more tension....if you read the fender set up manual it gives you the thickness of the shim to chock the bridge to to get a correct fulcrum ...
Interesting. I’ve never seen that. Where does the shim go?
11:10 One more spring we'd have Millstap playing on both sides of the guitar! 😎
I recently did a small experiment of my own. I found that the black fender springs have less tension than the raw vintage. Both are great and MUCH better than any of the generic stiffer springs. For me using 4 springs of either the black or raw vintage is perfect on a floating tremolo with 9's. The black Fender springs cost must less than the raw vintage. By the way give the AxLabs Tone Claw a try, it makes a difference as well.
I had forgotten about the Tone Claw but it kind of proves my point that more mass equals more sustain and possibly more transfer to vibrations to the wood body. I was a little reluctant to get such a heavy duty claw because I was concerned it would change the tone too much from the tradition Strat sound. I wouldn't mind trying one but they are pretty expensive. Right now, I'm hearing great results from the Mark Foley vintage correct blocks (I just did a video on them), the Highwood saddles and a set of Raw Vintage springs. The RV springs even sound better that some stiffer mid '60's vintage springs I had on one of my Strats. But the Highwood saddles are my favorite, then the MF block, then the RV springs which are absolutely necessary (if you use 5 springs) to get the trem to float at all with 10-38 strings tuned to Eb.
Very interesting.. thanks for the clip
Great video. I was watching your video on tremolo blocks. I got to thinking? Hey what about springs? Squires only have 3 springs. I look down at the suggested videos and there is this video. Perfect, and great work. I'm going to convert my squire to a 5 spring system, and hear if there's a difference. It only makes sense. Subscribed and liked.
Be sure to use the Raw Vintage springs otherwise it will be too tight.
Not particularly a Strat guy here, but I do have an Ibby Superstrat guitar, got from a guy almost new (he was getting rid of some of his guitars) and it has three springs (they resonate low, at F#, whatever that signifies). I've left them be -- got the claw down to the wood for stability (I don't use the tremolo bar). All that said, I can see where springs would affect the tone of the guitar somewhat, because everything in the guitar is part of the whole. Some changes may be a lot more noticeable than others, but any change can make a slight difference.
Hey millstap. Good to see you back brother I love your videos.
Have you ever played an Epiphone les Paul guitar and what are your thoughts on them?. I’ve heard they’re better than Gibsons. Thanks
Hey Millstap, I noticed on my strat I have 3 springs but the guitar set up wise is perfect - action , feel etc. By switching to the 5 raw vintage springs, would the set up need a tweak?
Well, if it is perfect to you, then I wouldn't mess with it. But for me personally, I always like to try new things and sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. The good thing is you can always go back to what you like if it doesn't work out. I think 5 springs could give you a little more sustain and volume. The most it would cost you is $30. Just note down all your settings that you like, i.e. neck relief, string height, pickup height before you make any changes. With 5 springs, you really should only have to adjust the spring claw and most likely have to back the two claw screws out a little to compensate for the extra tension and to get your bridge floating at the exact spot you had it before.
Would you happen to know if there are longer springs too? I'm looking for the stiff feel of 4-5 springs, but when I do that with normal springs, the claw on my charvel is too far forward!
I'm not sure I understood your situation, but no, all of the springs I know of are approximately the same length and only vary by 2-3 loops (39-42 loops). When you saw forward, is that the claw being closer to the neck or the bridge in the spring cavity?
Why do some people put foam strips in the springs to purposely keep them from chiming?
Millstap,
GFS came out with a “soft” spring set with tension that enables you to use five. ($5.00 a set)
I put some in a three spring import Strat and had to “loosen” the claw farther out”, so I don’t think they’re a soft as RV’s. Four springs are probably closer to RV tension. Maybe they need a “break in” period IDK?
But it does feel like a discernible but ever so slight improvement in the action and sound.
I’ll probably end up using Four for the best results with GFS soft springs in import guitars.
But RV’s go in all my personal Strats.
Oh, and another thing.
Some people will angle the claw like this / to compensate perceived string tension. But they’ve got it backwards.
The higher strings have the most tension because they are tuned to higher pitches. It’s true. Put 6 wound .48 strings on a your acoustic guitar and tune to standard. The bridge will always rip out starting from the high E side. (That could be a good myth busting video!)
So this \ would actually be the angle they would want if they are excessively anal about tone. (Can you believe there really are people out there like that! It’s crazy!)
Thank you for this video!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Love your content. Very interesting Bb vs Ab fundamental on vintage vs RV springs. Would you consider doing a RV vs '64 springs vid? In the black guitar?
Thanks. Probably not. I just recently replaced my vintage 1966 springs on the CAR Strat and it sounded better. The CAR Strat springs got mixed up somewhere down the road and may have been that way when I bought it. They were tighter all around as it shows in this video.
Well, I put a foam strip through the center of each of my Strat trem springs on my two Strat's with floating trems, as many players do, because I actually use the trem and don't want any extraneous spring noise, overtones, and sympathetic vibrations interfering with my pure string tone. I would have liked to hear a sonic demonstration of how that green guitar sounded before and after he made the spring change. I use the stock American Standard black springs that came with my Strats, and the stock American Standard trem block with the tapered lower half.
FYI my genuine fender custom shop strat bridge came with springs with 39 loops, that feel around the same as raw vintage springs to me although I haven’t actually tested tension.
What are those brass inserts you had in the back of your tremolo block? What are they called and what do they do?
There are no brass inserts. The block is solid steel. Oh, I see. You are referring to the brass pieces that are sticking up. Those are the Fender Bullet strings and the bullets are longer than the depth of the string holes in the block. There are some blocks that have deeper holes and the Bullets fit in them nicely and don't stick out.
Hello Millstap, one thing you should try is take the springs from the other guitar and put them in the benchmark guitar (1964). Reason because the steel block could be a factor. The blocks also have resonate properties. The steel blocks could have different metal molucular structures.
Good point. The Green and Black guitars both have Callaham blocks, the Red is the original Fender block, and the White is the Gotoh block that is came with. Switching blocks is a chore as you probably know. Here I am mainly focusing on spring tension. As far as the block goes, I've done spring swaps on the same guitar in the past and the tone change was a real eye opener. That was what started me on this quest for the correct or optimal (vintage) spring tension.
It's hard being the only sensible person in a world full of nonsense, isn't it? And then they say YOU are the crazy one!
Subbed!
Brilliant!
I love Mad Scientists ! Very informative ! thanks
Best news on the web.
Thank you for sharing your wisdom with us.
You're welcome Mr. Finom.
Hi there Millstap! I've tried to get any Fenders or Raw Vintages over here but I have the unfortune to live in Argentine... Here I can only get Di Marzio springs, do you have any idea about these or if they are at least better than Gotoh ones? Thanks bro!
Hey Obi. I have no idea about the Dimarzio springs. I've never seen them around here. I guess they are made for the Floyd Rose type tremolo more than a Fender. I'm surprised you can't get the RV springs down there. You could easily order them but I guess the shipping costs must make them too expensive, correct? I'm surprised you cannot also get Fender springs. Try anything else just to see. The Fender springs are cheap too.
@@millstap Yeah, you're totally right. I could buy them through eBay or to StewMac but i'm in the shitty third world, so with shipping and distorted taxes would be better to buy here a new entire guitar.... Anyway I'll keep checking around, because my strats springs are the same and sound the same to your green in the beggining, and don't like me at all! Thanks for your answer bro! 💪😎✌
@@TheForce_Productions Sounds like you need to move up here. Shitty third world sounds pretty bad. I just posted a tension chart in the description above so maybe you can get a cheap fish scale, take your device around to the music stores and see if they will let you test the tension. You might be able to find some decent ones down there but I kind of doubt it. It seems like most of them are high tension now. Check out in the description how I did the new test this morning.
@@millstap Thanks a lot Millstap! You are a nice guy and rocks! I'll check it up and see what can I find... Cheers!
@@millstap that was helful sir, really important historical information taken directly from a legendary 60'...I don't know if there are books with this kind of info, well you have a new suscriber now :) and from Argentina too haha.
I was thinking on buying the Dimarzio's springs (only ones in market over here, most likely high tension) and slowly stretch them to the point they reach the correct tension at the 1'' mark...it seems difficult to achieve because perhaps once stretched they lose all ability to consistently "regain their shape" but...it is the only option for this part of the world...you know: necessity is the mother of invention!, thanks again for your priceless work, it's really appreciated.
Thank you very much 😎🎸🎶☮️
Hi, I don't understand English, I ask with a translator, which springs are the softest for a Fender Americana, the ones I have are hard. Thanks.
Raw Vintage, rawvintage.com/japan/item_springs.php
Can't go wrong with Callaham Highwood or RV although I haven't tried RV yet but general consensus seems to say Into the rabbit hole again lol 😁 Good luck fellows and Thanks Mils
Yes, but luckily it is a rather inexpensive rabbit hole, lol.
I had Callaham blocks in two AVRI Strats but switched back to the stock Fenders because I thought they changed the tone. They resonated more acoustically which was impressive, but I thought they sounded way too bright when I plugged into my amps clean.
Exactly. I just switched to Mark Foley blocks from the Isle of Wight. They are the best IMO. I put on two and just ordered a left handed version and it is being shipped now. They are that good. It must be the material. I did this video recently on them, actually a couple of videos, ua-cam.com/video/kDx5HvuXXFI/v-deo.html, ua-cam.com/video/uDsTHC_pOgM/v-deo.html.
You definitely got a point here ! Springs must be pulled so there is a gap in each coil! Very important! And 5 springs is more mass which gives more bell tone ! I use Callham block on my Rosewood strats and pure vintage on the maple ones as the 55 and my 56. And all of them have pat.pend saddles those have a different tone as well! What I'm seeking is very bright crisp tone ! Because I'm use 0.12-0.56 and 0.11-0.58 strings to push and drive the tone plus they might hold because I eat strings bad ! I dont have vintage springs on any of my guitars who go on the road. And on my 55-56 I'm tight them so hard bridge dont float at all because I dont use the tremolo on them. My 1959 float 1 full tone as my 1963 the same ! The 59 is a Ash body the 63 is a Adler body. Big difference in tone. I prefer Ash because it have different snapp to it. New Ash body are often low frequency but as they dry up after year. They become crisp and sounds in my ears way better. The 55 I got is Ash the 56 is Adler why I chose those they combined just perfect and every one have there own strong points. But those vintage springs I have are counter clockwise!
And they softer then new aftermarket ones. I use Jackson springs on one they half soft and I have Callham on one pure Fender on one and for the last one no clue of brand. But they ring as you scratch them at a higher tone ! My point of say after see this video.
Björn, you have a very good ear and a very nice collection of Strats. You have this down to a science. Are those all vintage guitars or some re-issues? An interesting point was brought up by you and another commenter, that Fender springs were not always wound in the counter-clockwise direction. I did find a photo here that has one spring that is clockwise wound, www.premierguitar.com/articles/23668-guitar-shop---decking-a-stratocaster-trem. I never was aware of that. The oldest springs I have are 1964 so Fender must have made the change sometime before that. I am going to post a chart in the description of the force it take to move each spring probably 1" and I will add the two other spring types that I am pretty sure are Callaham and Gotoh. The Seafoam Green Strat definitely has a rounder/fuller (?) sound to the wound strings with the Raw Vintage springs. It is sounding very good.
@@millstap
Oh they are not fully stock but close to ! My 55 Stevie Ray Vaughn playd in 87 have some photos. I know him from 84-90 play his number one red and Charley. No is RI giutars they are made 55 - 56 - 59 -63 my dad was working giutar player travel the world ! He buy like 10-20 at the time mostly for parts back then ! I play them to on the road and it's the blues who catch me as I'm meet Stevie! Before I was more rock player !
Hey man just an observation: (I don't know if you have told this before here on the comments section) but I think the sheet of paper has moved a little bit; secure the sheet of paper with a little bit of masking tape or something so it doesn't move. Think I saw it moving... Could be causing different readings.
Cool video, thanks for the info! Like+sub...
I got after market springs
They were high tension..
Not by choice...
Put them on and the mid/mid highs. On the guitar
Was boosted.
Enough to cut through the mix...with out a pedal...
Crazy..
Great vid...
It is another science bro.
You put the Raw Vintage springs on and got those results?
@@millstap they were no name pattern springs
Very high tension..
And so my spring experiments started..
Interestingly the EVH stripes series only have 2 springs on.
Still experimenting
@@Mr75044 you’ll love the Raw Vintage Springs with all 5.
@@millstap yeah definitely
Thanks for the shout.
So you prefer the raw vintage to actual pre-cbs originals?
I would always prefer the originals but RV are the next best thing. Most springs are so tight that is why people just use 3 or 4 springs because it is the only way to loosen up the tension. I always like to use 5 springs. I've never priced original springs but I'm sure they want way too much for them. They are not worth it when you have a good, current production replacement.
@milstrap did you try the crazyparts springs/bridge?
No, but I have been looking at their stuff recently. I'm not sure what tension their springs have. I think I would have to contact them. I just recommended them to a subscriber for aged plastic parts for Strats. They look pretty authentic. If I needed another complete Strat tremolo bridge, theirs is the one I would try.
Thanks @@millstap. What is your opinion regarding the Callaham/Gotoh/Fender reissue blocks vs the original block?
@@dudicoco They are good. I think I have three of them on my guitars. At least two.
Do you also feel like back cover affect tone? I notice you take yours off i keep mine on....just looks better cosmetically to me
I've always taken mine off because it's so much easier to adjust everything and " tinker " 👍
@@Dad-Gad Yes, especially when you break a string. I've got so many marks on my old plates from trying to fish out a piece of string with a screw driver or some other sharp object.
You know, it just might. It will definitely reflect the vibrations back into the body so maybe there is an audible change. I'm sure Leo hated it when everyone started taking them off but when you break a string, it was almost impossible to get it out because it would almost always get stuck to the side of the plate hole. Then you had to dig in there with something sharp. I used to break so many strings that it really wasn't an option for me to keep it on. But, if it doesn't hinder any string operation for you, keep it on. I think it might give a little more spring ring because the vibrations won't be deadened by your shirt. I will put mine back on for a while just to see. I know some guitarist will actually hit the springs while they are playing but that's just a gimmick although I think it does make a strange sound.
great video, I just switched from 3 old original springs to 5, adding 2 new ones, let's see what happens... 🙂
If you use you whammy bar a lot and need less tension, the Raw Vintage springs are the best. I think they are even better than vintage springs because they have less tension than most vintage springs.
So are the fender vintage american springs you can buy online super high tension or medium tension?
Unfortunately I have not tested them yet. Could you please send me the link to the springs you are referring to? I have a hard time finding the American vintage ones. I need to test them because those are the springs that should be vintage correct if any are, but I suspect they are not. I would guess they are tight but I am curious so I will buy some to check.
www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/0031643049--fender-american-vintage-tremolo-tension-springs-5pc?mrkgadid=3331287977&mrkgcl=28&mrkgen=gpla&mrkgbflag=0&mrkgcat=guitars&&acctid=21700000001645388&dskeywordid=92700046938598207&lid=92700046938598207&ds_s_kwgid=58700005283398284&ds_s_inventory_feed_id=97700000007215323&dsproductgroupid=523156528048&product_id=0031643049&prodctry=US&prodlang=en&channel=online&storeid=%7Bproduct_store_id%7D&device=m&network=g&matchtype=&locationid=%7Bloc_phyiscal_ms%7D&creative=332063179644&targetid=pla-523156528048&campaignid=1708733951&gclid=CjwKCAjwvtX0BRAFEiwAGWJyZF1mwXOQ22yb9hK_EO_8kZ64HSspSgGJF8k4wSjH8zn3aoJS0oVhsxoC0jMQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds
@@mrlevinielsen Thanks. I have them on order so I will do a spring tension update video once I get them.
I appreciate this video, as I too am adjusting several Stratocasters. I have one question: you referenced the "Hendrix guage" strings, but then you did not name the actual gauges! Please tell me - what guage did Hendrix use? Thank you for making such a great vid!
Sorry about that. Since this is more of a Hendrix channel, I assume everyone knows the gauges. They are 10-13-15-26-32-38. Here is a great set in round core, either nickel plated or pure nickel: www.curtmangan.com/10-38-round-core-nickel-wound-guitar-strings/, www.curtmangan.com/10-38-round-core-nickel-wound-guitar-strings/.
@@millstap Thank you! I was convinced for years that Hendrix used 13-56 and he had extremely strong hands. Have you ever heard this notion?
Hey Buddy I'm going through this myself now on my 63. There is a new player in town as well bro there is a British guy who has been making dead accurate bridges for years to the in the know crowd he also makes exact repro of the springs they are similar to the Raw Vintage but some say even better (well more like the real) you can acquire them from Mark Foley Guitars or Crazyparts if you are interested. Mark also recons he has the exact recipe for Pre CBS pickups with the correct capacitance and inductance (Paul Reed Smith is chasing the same rabbit this year) I might test the bridge in my 63 as that one is effed. I'm also going to be testing pots as soon as I can get a batch of VIP pots to test, I heard about those from you, did you test them?
I saw that mark Foley made spring's. I just ordered a set of pre cbs pickups from him i think i will order his springs and maybe highwood
I use 3 4 5 springs and blocked tremolo for my 4 strats but its hard to say how much the springs affects the tone. They all sound abit different. My strats with 3 & 4 springs sound best to me. One with callaham n raw vintage springs.
I guess that would be a whole other experiment to see if springs make as much difference when the trem plate is decked. I'm guessing the body will stop some of the energy that would normally transfer to the springs. I used to deck all of my guitars so they would stay in tune if I broke a string. It wasn't until maybe 8 years ago that I decided to start using the tremolo again. That was mainly because I started playing Hendrix music again. At first, I had no problems with my 1964 Strat tremolo. It stayed in prefect tune. Everything was hunky-dorey. Then one day everything went haywire and I went nuts. I could not for the life of me figure out why it changed and started having tuning problems. Then when I bought the Nash, its tremolo was virtually unusable and that was super disappointing. It was at that point that I was determined to figure it out and I feel I finally have it under control again. The Nash is almost by best tremolo now. But I'll stick with 5 soft springs for the extra mass, and Jimi and Stevie did too. You could easily bend or break a whammy bar with 5 stiff springs in it.
That's one of those fish story scales...you pull down on the fish a little until it locks and then walk around with your fish on the scale showin' everyone your fish story catch. 🤣
Exactly, but I did try to be as accurate as possible. The difference in tensions is so obvious I probably could have done the same thing with a thick rubber band.
Made me subscribe
Hello, its been awhile but looking at the video it seems that the surf green guitar had different strings than the others. The other had color code and the surf green guitar did not. Different manufactures have different pound tension . Maybe you got the guitar playing right but just so you know I just noticed that. thanks
Good eye Jim. Those are the D'Addarios with the colored ball ends. The main point is if you want a vintage feel with your tremolo, the Raw Vintage springs are the only spring on the market that I know of that has the lighter tension. That way you can run all five springs without the risk of breaking your whammy bar on severe dive bombs. Plus, I still think five springs sound better.
I use 5 springs on My 74 flush mount strat. And 3 springs on the floating set up on the 57, 63, and 69 strat
Likewise
JONNIE ROCKER take the springs out and use a block of wood and it will sustain way better than five springs
@@AutisticMan78 you will also lose the "tremolo" function. Might as well get a hardtail strat which would sound the best!
Just bought a new Fender Strat HSS. What spings should i put in?
Raw Vintage for sure.
@@millstap lol whats that mean, i guess theres 3, it plays fine i'm just curious though if different would be better.
@@millstap I just googled em and read some reviews, i'm gonna order them. Thanks
@@nobodysreview6137 yes. 5 springs is better and they are not stiff. Vintage tension. rawvintage.com/japan/item_springs.php
Amazing video!
In the end, which springs did you prefer for tone/feel/sustain?
It's hard to beat the original vintage springs but since they aren't around anymore, I will always go with a set of the Raw Vintage springs. I was surprised they have less tension than the vintage springs but the vintage springs still feel softer. I don't know if that is due to use and age or what. I have not tried any of the Fender springs but I have a suspicion that they are also on the tight side even though they label them "vintage."
@Mike Limas That's good to know.
Your measurement system only works if all springs are same length. Did you confirm that?
I actually pointed that out in the ticker at 17:40. For my purposes, it was easy to tell a high tension spring from a lower tension spring. But, the smarter way to do it to compensate for the length would be to stretch each spring the exact same length, let say 1", and then record the fish scale weight. I will do that on each spring and post a little chart in the description.
I actually pointed that out in the ticker at 17:40. For my purposes, it was easy to tell a high tension spring from a lower tension spring. But, the smarter way to do it to compensate for the length would be to stretch each spring the exact same length, let say 1", and then record the fish scale weight. I will do that on each spring and post a little chart in the description.
@@millstap Maybe stretch them all a same distance and measure the force required?
@@blackdotpatrick Yes, that is exactly what I am going to do tomorrow and I will chart it in the video description. I will test the two other sets I had laying around and I am pretty sure one of them is a Callaham set and the Gotoh set.
These spring details are crucial to have right in a setup, especially if you have multiple strats that you expect to play well. Getting this wrong will also make your guitar feel uninspiring or unplayable.
Thanks for the comment. I really am a believer in the Raw Vintage springs. I have them on all but one of my Strats now.
Well glad I am not the only crazy one. I have suhr Strat with gotoh510. The springs have little foam in it to dampen the noise. I first tried raw vintage springs and hear a big difference. Then I took the foams in the gotoh springs out, call me crazy but it make it sounds a bit more straty …. If I dampen the raw vintage springs with foam, the guitar sounds like dead. Without foams, gotoh springs make the guitar a bit brighter and attack is quicker, raw vintage springs sounds mellower.
Interesting. I just had a comment about the need to dampen the springs and I replied that Hendrix and Vaughan never had any type of dampening on their springs. Fender did not design the tremolo with foam. If you use five spring and do a lot of Hendrix type whammy work, you will need the Raw Vintage springs because you will probably break your whammy bar with the newer stiff springs on most Strats today.
@@millstap I do feel that dampening the string take away some of the stratinesss.. I also feel that changing the springs to raw vintage ones removes the suhr typical sound that has a really high top-end zinging. Somehow I feel it has something to do with the stainless steel block used in Suhr. I recently obtained a Don Grosh strat, which uses Gotoh bridge but a zinc block, it is more fendery, meaning more mid-range sound, even unplugged, compared to the Suhr. Then I read online the comments from Don Grosh and James Tyler regarding using zinc block versus stainless steel block. Both of them insisted using zinc block gotoh bridge in their guitars, and saying stainless steel block make the guitar brighter, but not cutting through in a mix as well. They do say stainless steel block help the sustain, but since their guitar has selected neck and body woods that resonates so well already, it is not necessary. John Suhr also said he used stainless steel block mainly due to the enhanced sustain.
Man, the strat sound is a rabbit hole.
Then I thought about another video from a Vintage Les Paul collector in Hongkong, he said to get that old sound, the metal parts, particularly the bridge makes a very big difference.
Endless thinking haha.
I use 2 springs on my Gotoh 510 (floating) on a Suhr strat (which I love) = tremendous tuning stability and return-to-pitch. is there Anything I can do to make it " Even Smoother " - some people mention Nut sauce or 3 in 1 oil ??? Nice info & comparison. Great detail. Appreciate the work then went-into this = phenomenal. Stay Safe.
Nut Sauce is way too expensive. I found this great food grade, clear Teflon grease that stays wherever you put it. I don't lube anything but the top of my saddles. I don't like putting anything on the nut anymore not only because it is not necessary, I feel it may soften the bone. Since my Highwood Contour saddles have grooves in them, the grease stays in the groove. Any tuning instability is the string sticking on top of the saddle when the springs return to equilibrium. I would never use any oil. It will eventually damage the finish and soak into the wood. It's a real mess. This grease is very clean and will not stain anything. Any product made for the guitar is a rip. This one tube will last almost forever. www.ebay.com/i/133001614775?chn=ps&mkevt=1&mkcid=28
Shop around though. I use Super Lube on a lot of stuff now. I put it under my backdoor jam to free up the door some.
@@millstap Thanks. So you spread it right on the actual springs? or just contact points? ( saddle's & nut slot's ) ? I may also try the Raw Vintage Springs? I like very-lite-tension, to do Chord flutters. If trem bar is too hard to bend - sometimes it breaks-off in the trem block cavity.
@@michael_caz_nyc I only put it on the tops of the saddles. It's a little tougher on vintage saddles because there no groove to hold the grease and it wipes off fairly easily with the palm of your hand. That is why I like the grooves. It took me a long time to figure out the only sticking point is really the top of the saddle. Nothing else needs lube although it doesn't hurt to put a little on the string tree. Where the springs contact the claw and block maybe but it is more of a pain than it is worth. I don't think it's necessary. My trems are perfect now.
@@millstap Nice. Me too. My Suhr is perfect. My vintage Fender is just ok. Im a Huge fan of the Gotoh 510. I really appreciate all the work and effort that you put into this. You have helped countless musicians - with this research. ( I love stuff like this ).
The mint green strat springs won't rang cuz there's a foam material underneath the springs. Duh!!
There is no foam. I wish I would have strummed the new Raw Vintage springs. I forgot. They sound great. One of my favorite Strats now.
David Gilmour uses 3 Sounds pretty good too.
I'm sure a lot use just three but it depends on your playing style. With Jimi's stuff, the way he bends the G and then hits the B and E strings all the time, the B and E don't go as flat when bending the G when you use 5 springs. I have to have 5. It stays in tune.
Raw vintage springs on my strat ring at a perfect pitch of E with standard 10's (pyramid pure nickel).
They definitely play a part in the overall harmonics of the guitar.
millstap Can you describe the difference in sound and playability between the vintage springs and the raw vintage springs.
@@voxshall I have never taken all of the vintage springs off and tried a full set of Raw Vintage but I would speculate they are almost exactly the same. As I show in this video, the tension of the RV is even a bit less than the vintage springs which makes dive bombs a little easier on the bar. You can't go wrong with the RV springs.
Must be a Menza member .......this is the type of thing they would do LOL Useless info to me I use a Floating bridge set up anyway not how I setup a strat at all. Thanks for doing the Video ...guitar stuff always interest me
In my experience when you deck the trem (no wood block). The 3 gotoh springs gave my strat more clarity and articulation. When using raw vintage srings. They gave me more bass but I lost the clarity and articulation. So for me I prefer modern springs.
I'd like to add. I tighten the spring to the point the trem stays put. Unless I do a crazy bend. Then it will move just a little.
Yes, it depends on your playing style. I used to deck all of my Strats so when I broke a string at a gig, it stayed in tune. Then when I switched to playing some Hendrix, I had to make it looser or at least float it a little. I found that it stayed in better tune when floated slightly and definitely sounded different. I think with 5 tight springs, you could actually bend if not break a whammy bar on a severe dive bomb. And, I like 5 springs for more mass in the bridge area so I have to use soft spring. My 1964 plays perfectly and stays in amazingly good tune so I use it as a good reference point.
@@firewalker6712 Yes, it used to be annoying when I would bend the G and the B and E strings would go flat. I think having 5 springs helps there too. If you have it too loose, the B and E will go so flat, you can't really play that way. Since that is a lot of my style of playing, I have to be able to do it without going flat so 5 soft springs is a must. But 3 or 4 stiff strings may be the same if the overall spring tension is the same. I just like having more steel connected to the block for extra mass. It's kind of the same thing with the block. The cheaper light weight zinc alloy blocks that Fender started putting in Strats in the '80's sounded really bad. That is why there are so many repro vintage steel blocks available now.
I use 3 Springs on my Suhr Strat with Gotoh 510 = Phenomenal Tuning Stability. I like to do Chord-Flutters vs. Dive Bombs - so I Prefer Less Tension.
I always thought Strats had a rubbery bouncy tone compared to Teles...now I know why!
One of the great accidents in guitar building history.
Exactly. I played a friend's Tele the other night and I couldn't play any Hendrix on it because it felt so weird to me. I tried but Hendrix can only be played on a Strat.
@@millstap Hendrix rejected the telecaster early on in his career. He said it only had ONE good sound.
Hi millstap how you ever owned any vintage 1970s fender Stratocasters
I have not. I skipped that decade. My first Strat was bought in the early '80's.
@@millstap I have a friend who owns several 1973 76 hardtail ,77 walnut brown and a few custom shop Stratocasters what do you think of the custom shop time machine series
@@WOKINTUSD Woah, I see they are very expensive. I would guess they are well made but I would certainly try one out before I spent that much money. I personally don't like hardtails. I don't think hardtail Strats sound like Strats.
@@millstap he did try them before buying there are some good ones and bad ones
Hi Bro. I found out with the bullet strings you have to buy one size lower of what you normaly would use. For example: instead of a 42 set use a 41 or even 38 to get the same tension compared to "normal" springs. But anyway I dont lyk them anymore and now went back to d'addario pure nickel 41/9 or even 38/8. Fantastic feel and sound! Also I use a staggered tremblock for optimal tuning stablity. But thats just me bro and yeah raw vintage all the way!. Thanks for your informative video o. Grtx and all the best. Tom.
I like the feel of low tension springs for sure.
Thanks goodness for Raw Vintage springs. When you are running the 10-38 Hendrix set tuned to Eb, you definitely need the RV springs if you are going to use all five.
@@millstap I actually use the low tension springs from guitar fetish. I've never used pure vintage. Who knows they may be the same. Maybe you could check them out and test and compare them🤷
@@bradleyclosson5042 I may have to do that. I'm kind of the Spring King now, lol. I'll check them out. I like the way they actually describe the tone differences of the different tensions they offer. They certainly are cheap. I don't know how you can sell anything nowadays for $5 and still make a profit. Shipping must be $40, lol. www.guitarfetish.com/SOFT-5-Piece-Tremolo-Spring-Kit_p_36184.html
@@millstap right on. They seem pretty good. I'm a heavy floating trem user. They've been in my numero uno for over a year and haven't worn out yet.
Personally, I prefer to use 4/5 of the standard Fender Vintage springs with pure nickel 10s standard tuning
It really is personal preference and with the tighter Fender spings, they probably work fine with the higher tension tuning and strings. I have tuned down 1/2 step for so many years now and when you switch to the 10-38 Hendrix gauge, the light tension springs are a must if you are going to run all five springs.
I have a Slick SL57 strat and it has everything: sustain, warm fat tone with bit of shimmer, tuning stability even after dive bombing, lots of brass, good neck with rosewood fretboard… but: she does not really sing, she sounds slightly constricted. Beside needing prob 500K pots and 09 strings, because the slightest roll back of volume to 9 cuts all overtones and the nice shimmer on the notes, she lacks brilliance and singing quality.
So I wondered if the ash body is too heavy (guitar fetish states swamp ash, but I tend to doubt it because of high weight, 4 kg whole guitar), or the 3 very stiff but obviously high quality steel springs are not the right ones for this guitar.
I‘ll tinker with spring replacing… I‘ll come back after and report.
Thank you for all the information!👍🏼👏🏼😃
*edit: weight is not 4kg . It is 3,57kg
My lightest vintage Strat is around 3.5 kg and the heaviest around 3.62 kg. What amp are you playing through? I'm not sure how guitarfetish can build a Strat for $269. I would say save your money on investing in upgrading the SL57 and save it for a better Strat. Even on my real Strats and clones like my Nash, I usually change the pots to VIP pots and pickups, maybe bridge saddles, maybe tuners, and the tremolo. Those alone would cost more than $500. This SL57 sounds pretty good though, ua-cam.com/video/6dniAJ_8Z1g/v-deo.html, impressive. Maybe try the springs first. That's a cheap upgrade. An impressive guitar for the price.
@@millstap
The SL is a very good guitar, and for that price (I paid 299€ for the sunburst 2017 in Germany, it was out of stock in the U.S. at that time) even more impressive. Although she does not sound like a genuine strat or a Squier, but that was my reason too choose it. I wasn‘t a strat and trem guy first, but got very interested on that bell like 3-pup single coil sound with a whammy. I also am the cheapo type of guy that likes to modify and work on affordable guitars.
On the SL57 there is not much to replace for an upgrade. The tuners are tight and smooth with bronze gears and brass knobs (more weight is often beneficial), the bridge is made from good hardened steel same as the steel saddles, it has a massive brass sustain block, the pickups are to my liking (warm and fat sounding with pretty loud output, Alnico 5), the frets where perfectly level, the angeled headstock does not need string trees. The grafite nut was perfectly cut, but I’ll put bone later. The finish is very well done, and the overall build feels solid as a tank.
Small minus: the plastic on the knobs and pup- covers look and feel awfully cheap, the pots are turning too stiff, fretboard is not rolled off.
But she only lacks the last bit of brilliance, nothing more. I didn‘t opened her yet, so I don‘t know the values of pots and caps. But first I allways do upgrades for a better unplugged sound. A unplugged poor sounding guitar will never sound good amplified. Replacing the pups, if needed, is almost the last step I do on upgrading.
I call the SL57 „the mule“. I allways had the feel of fighting that stiff and stubborn guitar. So, after listening multiple times unplugged, even knocking all over on the woods holding my ear after strumming on every place of the guitar, I „heard“ that kind of restrained stiffness located on the body. The neck is fine, resonates good. My idea was to reduce body weight, altering it to an offset type and slimmer body. (I‘m a short guy and a strat body feels wide and unconfortable.) Second idea: the springs. Those 3 are very very stiff!
On the review you linked, his Slick sounds basically like mine, but having that bit of sparkle that I miss on mine. Certainly it‘s his way better amp, probably a tube amp. Like I‘m a beginner bedroom noodler my rig is a Line6 POD 2.0 thru a little solid state Marshall 15-CDR set on clean channel. Maybe also the strings: mine are few years old…😏 (but I generally like the sound of old strings- on 5 of my 6 guitars the strings are 4-5 years old, but they have enough heights and sound soft and bluesy.
The most bothers me on my Slick, the total loss of the bit of sparkle when volume rolled to 9.
So I looked up on YT for influence of them on sound. And thanks to your vid, I will start with the springs!
(Sorry for writing a novel…😐)
@@lone-wolf-1 You mentioned the brass block. You might want to try a steel one too. All vintage Strats had cold rolled steel blocks. My 1964 Strat came with a brass block on it and it sounded very dark to me. Once I changed it to steel, it was perfect. They aren't too expensive. A steel block with the 5 Raw Vintage springs may be all you need. The tension on those five springs will still be less than the three stiff springs.
@@millstap
You might be right with the steel block and RV springs. I‘ ll do that.
Thank you a lot for your help, very much appreciated! 😃👍🏼
Stay safe! I like your deliberate flow while playing💪🏼
@@lone-wolf-1 Be sure the block and plate fit together perfectly with no gaps. I recently had a plate that had lips around each of the three screw holes and it formed a gap between the block and plate. I had to order a new plate to get a nice, flush fit. I ground down the lips around the screw holes but that still didn't fix the problem on the bad plate.
haha just did the same thing. mixed up the damn springs.
Hi, Are you sure you have vintage springs on any of the guitars? Looks to me like all youre springs are modern , Moderns are wound clockwise, Vintages were wound counter clockwise. This is the easiest way to tell the difference. Not by thickness or coils wound. Fender would never make/wind modern springs identical to vintage, These things are always changed up.. Always!!~.
The 1964 Strat definitely has the original springs and the 1962 either has 1962 springs or 1966 springs. Fender must have made the change before 1964 and could very well have not switched in 1959. I did find this photo of a newer 1993 Strat that has one spring reverse wound. Where they found one spring is a mystery. I couldn't really find any info on this. I have a friend that has a 1959 Strat but it's no help because it's a hardtail. He also has a 1963 so I will look at it. Actually, Matthew Scott has a 1959 so I will check to see if he has original springs and they are the opposite wind. I don't agree that Fender would make the change so they could tell the difference between modern and vintage. What year do you draw the modern/vintage line? There was no such thing as vintage back then. Vintage didn't really become a "thing" until maybe the late '70's. Guitar values started rising to their inflated prices in the '80's only because Fender was building a lot of crap guitars and amps. If they had stuck with the quality they had before CBS bought them, there would be no such thing as vintage or at least they would not cost near as much. Actually, I think the vintage prices are dropping because there are so many great Strat copies out there now and Fender has also stepped up their game some. The whole point here is that the springs in the older days did not have as much tension as a lot of the modern springs so it is a good thing to consider when you are trying to dial in your tremolo for the best tone and action. www.premierguitar.com/articles/23668-guitar-shop---decking-a-stratocaster-trem. There is a photo in this Premier Guitar article of one oddball spring.
@@millstap Do you know who makes good plastic parts that look like old vintage plastics? Like pickup covers and pickguards. I'm refurbing and old strat and need a pickguard and pickup covers that look right. Mine had been changed before I got it. Thanks in advance and love your video's. I subscribed!
@@HiHello-ku1fl Check this out. It might work for you. crazyparts.de/art-of-aging/index.php
Lol. They're not supposed to be tuned to notes or ring like that.. You want to mute all that. Sympathetic vibrations are no bueno when it comes to trem springs. I'm fighting that issue now, but I've read heatshrink & surgical tubing are great fixes.
It's pretty difficult to argue against Hendrix's and Stevie's spring setup which was always five springs that were never, ever dampened in any way.
@@millstap True! Good point. 👍 Nothing wrong with 5 springs, it's just the spring noise that kind of bugged me on my own strat, but the heatshrink did the trick.. It's perfect now. Great videos, man! Rock on ✌️
@@R3TR0R4V3 But does it stay in tune if you dive bomb it? I would think anything on the springs would keep them from returning to a stable, in tune position.
@@millstap absolutely. No problems whatsoever. The heatshrink isn't super tight.. I made sure to not bind the springs up in any way. I'm using a Super Vee - Bladerunner trem too, so that helps.
I put everything Callaham in my American Standard
And...
@@dezionlion speaks for itself if you know anything about modding bro lol
I'm not so sure about the Callaham springs though. I think I have some of those and they are on the tight side. If you go everything Callaham, it can make your Strat too bright. I've done it and had to back off some and mix and match parts.
@@millstap yea ive heard that so I tried it, the am std pickups orig sounded a bit off, now it seems that this guitar sounds perfect.
@@electricgypsyblues4761 It's a never ending battle. Sometimes you win and sometimes you have to go back to the drawing board.
wow
I've seen your other videos as well as this one, we also have install videos please check us out.
for recordings ,the springs from the green was better !! (i am also a sound engineer)
Interesting. I wonder why?
I don't think RAWVINTAGE SPRINGS are worth the premium, in the U.K. It's £24 for five springs from rawvintage uk suppliers lol, now why lol, you can find springs I. Hardware shops with same tension and for £24 you can get 50 springs, do they sound different yes, but is it better or is it just different lol, it's minimal, fact is you can stick a block in your strat and use no springs and sustain is better than ever FACT, and it's got no springs, a tell has no springs and sounds killer, if springs really affected tone worth a dam I'm sure they would pile them in every guitar lol, exactly.
I also own a' 84 ;-'62 Reissue Fender USA. stratocasters; &a 63 ,,,, HEY; What ABOUT YOUR TREM BLOCK ??? CHANGE IT,BRO IT MAKES A BIG DIFFERENCE, they have BRASS SPRINGS,& DIFFERENT ALLOYS,YES SPRINGS.
ua-cam.com/video/kDx5HvuXXFI/v-deo.html. I use all vintage correct blocks from Mark Foley in the UK. Great blocks. Crazy Parts and a few others have good ones too.
Bro this is like spring reverb...
brrooooooo!!!! NEVER EVEN PLAYS A NOOOOOOTTTEEEEEEE!!!! 😤😤
I'm practically best friends with an old timer I've never met!!
for those that read the comment section before watching the fucken video....
RUN.... SAVE YOURRSEELLVVEESSSS
I have been down the pickup, spring, tremolo block/bridge rabbit hole and I have found absolutely NOT EFFFIN DIFFERENCE. My strat will never sound like a great strat and I think that's the nature of strats for some reason. Even if I put in a great bare knuckle humbucker in the bridge....still sounds worse than a comparable guitar that is not a strat. Maybe they're just not for me.
I think you are correct. You are probably more of a Gibson man. I don’t have any guitars with humbuckers and probably never will unless someone gives me one. It’s all a matter of tonal tastes. But, for Strats, you can improve on them if you start out with a decent one for a solid foundation. That is the beauty of them. I just replaced my vintage 1964 neck with a new roasted maple/rosewood Musikraft neck and there was a big improvement. They are so flexible in that regard.
This is excessive
Ruben, the tension makes a huge difference so give 5 Raw Vintage springs a try. The tension will not be near as much as the modern springs.
@@millstap I bought them after watching your video
@@rubensancheznmn They even have less tension that vintage. I wonder if real vintage springs harden with years of use. Just thinking.