When you're avidly watching a man describe shots of coffee as tasting more or less conical than each other, you have to ask yourself, am I too far down the rabbit hole?
For me it’s less of a rabbit hole and more of rabbit dungeon where only occasionally do I come up to see the light when I go make a sandwhich or pick up my mail or whatnot.
Aside from that leather pad that curls up at the corners, this is a gorgeous piece of equipment. My butler can barely contain his excitement as he waits for it to be delivered.
No kidding. The one detail that has a cheap look, and it's so obvious! And I'm really confused why it's set under the support piece. For that price, you'd expect a square of embossed leather with some patina, inset flush to the base.
Webber responded and explained that if you dunk it in lukewarm water for 2 seconds and let it dry with a book on top of it, it will become flat and stiff. I personally love how it looks after it’s treated.
Me: I will literally never ever ever pay that amount of money for a grinder. Also me: I will watch every second of this video regardless, as if ready to purchase immediately.
And I might have no use whatsoever for this but damn me if by the end I didn't ponder the idea of buying one. I'd like TV a lot more if ads were this informative and aesthetically pleasing.
@@BlairdBlaird yes it would be nice if TV had advertising for well crafted things rather than rapidly produced "we can get away with that" quality builds.
I’d prefer, over the leather, two pieces of wood that match the brush handle and jigsaw together around the central stand. That would provide a similar aesthetic but lay nice and flat. The only thing that looks odd to me is how the leather doesn’t sit perfectly flat, given how perfect the rest of the machine looks and presumably feels. A stunningly beautiful machine though to be sure.
Webber responded and explained that if you dunk it in lukewarm water for 2 seconds and let it dry with a book on top of it, it will become flat and stiff. I personally love how it looks after it’s treated.
@@VexChoccyMilk Wouldn't be surprised if it's basically impossible to ship it in a way that keeps it flat: it's the sort of thing that would easily warp if the humidity wasn't exactly right. So then there's the counter-counterpoint that they should use appropriate materials so that it's perfect from the factory, if it costs $1650.
The grind numbering reminded me of an aperture ring on a Leica lens - which is no bad thing. In fact the overall aesthetic is very photographic - I thought at first you were reviewing a darkroom enlarger... PS - nice review as always, although i'm very happy with my Commandante!
I must admit that your videos are kind of a therapy for me. There is much to enjoy when watching them: - beautiful editing - excellent choice of music - great macro shots - I don't know much about lighting, but it all looks put well together - the hair (no further comment needed) - the calming voice - the British accent - coffee - tech-stuff - the jokes I could go on and on, but I need my therapy now.
As a long time HG-1 user, this is a great review. The jumping while grinding is certainly a learning curve. I remember being rather disappointed when I first got mine. But after some time, and further seasoning of the burr set, I never have that issue regardless of roast level. In fact, most coffees can be ground without holding the support handle. The gear set on the HG-2 is cool. I counted 50 rotations for James to grind 18g of coffee. That goes down in time. My HG-1 has the TiN burr set as well, and currently grinds ~1g of coffee per rotation. So usually I dose 20.5 g and takes me 22 rotations to clear the burrs. At the end of the day, this grinder isn't for most people. But I absolutely love mine and am so happy to use it many times a day.
I really just *like* this man. I've been drinking espresso for most of my life ((and i'm old)), and he's gotten me into an entirely new realm of home ((and out)) coffee experiences. What a great, informative, and fun way to learn! James is excellent!
Just spent 18min learning about a product I can neither afford nor could justify if I could afford it...but, it was worth it for two reasons...always enjoy James at his best AND the double spoon comment, classic :) always a pleasure James!
I have the HG-1, the tumbler that isn't magnetic and I have the brush standalone. I've had them for some years now. Your leather mat looks really bad compared to mine. I think you must have gotten a bad batch of it. Mine looks darker with no white spots and it doesn't curl at all. I'm really really pleased with my leather. After each grind I lift the upper ring up and I brush the burrs while the wheel is doing its spin, so every piece falls through the grinder, literally zero retention. I'm very pleased with my grinder. It can be a bit hard to grind light roast, and I mean nordic light, light, so I just press the wheel down and back up reversed the same way. So I go half a clock on repeat instead of a full clock. It doesn't grind the beans when going reverse and the only hard part is grinding upwards, which I eliminate. It's cool to finally see you review the HG grinder, even though it is the second and not first.
Absolutely adore Umeshiso and Umeko-such a great company, and Umeko’s a really wonderful person who clearly cares about customers and accessibility in the industry overall! Really excited to see the representation here!
I like how every criticism starts with 'ignoring the absurd price', but then descends into intense and specific nitpicks. For my 2 cents, as a left hander, I can't get behind this. At $1650, it should have been ambidextrous, or designed so it can be assembled as a mirror image, maybe with a couple of minor part swaps so the burrs still turn the correct way. At least with 'peppermill' style hand grinders, you can still use them ambidextrously, even if it is slightly less comfortable rotation in the other hand. I really don't see the issue with the price though. This is a sculpture that grinds coffee, not an exercise in building the volksgrinder.
@@tommymaddox6785 No you can’t. There is a handle on one side to keep it steady that you won’t be able to access. And the handle will turn the least comfortable way. For $1650 I don’t want any half assed solution.
@@nicbrownable that's fair. You could hold the gearbox body as well, but at the price premium it's definitely one of a few oversights in the design stage.
I like your comment and I'll use the term volksgrinder pretty soon. :-D I'm also leftie so this nitpick is important part of high-level design that should be part of such a pricy object.
Bonk alignment. Honestly I like that they released the HG-2 as it has some innovative things built into the grinder. I like how they are putting the user experience first and would expect nothing less from ex-Apple folks. This is a nice counterpoint from other grinder manufacturers in this high-end grinding space. I have the HG-1 and think that it is a great grinder and easy to use. I think if people want that Weber experience, just wait for people to offload their HG-1s after the Key starts shipping. Should be able to get those for half price on the used market with ton of life left in the burrs.
@@js-nk4sd there was a graphic that they had for key grinder or hg2 where they showed a wooden mallet that you could use to hit the shaft to help with alignment. This is because the long shaft would be prone to misalignment because of the strength of the materials and design is not enough to maintain perfect alignment
Electric motors are over rated. Ride a bike where an electric motor bike is superfluous unless you are replacing a car, not replacing a bike. Gears do it. Even educated fleas do it.
@@shinybaldy Just playing with the comment til I rhymed with a Cole Porter old song lyric by accident and toyed with a riff. The idea was that something was easy to do, so "let's do it" and then there are lines that add who else does it "even educated fleas do it."
Have loved every day grinding with the HG1 for years now with manual machine just like James recommends. No one in the house wants to grind and make coffee manually, and I love that. I think it’s super pleasing to use no electricity/motors in the morning. But, definitely a unique process that most probably won’t enjoy if they need push-button coffee. Manual extraction has a steep learning curve as well and requires patience to get the results you want. Also, I made my own leather mat which looks way better than the saddle leather mat they have there - super easy to make and looks better. Love the little brush holder on this new version!
It's absurd, but this really does appeal to me. I currently use a more standard hand grinder, and there is something special about that direct relationship with the coffee as you grind it. And you're right, I would absolutely would want to use this with a lever machine. There's just something enchanting and artisanal about making espresso entirely by hand.
There's a UK company that makes a much cheaper countertop grinder that's also super cool. Can't remember the name. 1500usd is just silly, but it's a nice object for sure.
James, been watching your channel for years now after reading your first book (born and bred in Melbourne and just a lover of good coffee). Just realised that you’re about to hit a million subs - unreal mate. Honestly you’ve hit your stride and it’s just so lovely to hear someone properly geek out about coffee. Very deserving of all the success that has come your way.
Been using it for the last 12 months.. everyday is a joy .A Micro workout and make one appreciate what goes into grinding beans ...before liquid gold flows out from decent XXL. looking forward to the Key grinder indeed. Thank you for making the video. Big Fan .
I like the idea of 'slow coffee' - a ritual/celebration/treat, rather than a physiological function that this grinder brings, and yes - a lever express machine would be perfect for it😍
Ok...so. Another great video from James, to be honest, James could read me the manual for a toaster and I would like it. Subscribed for the Coffee conversation, stayed for James style, tone and comments like..."Now such a fancy, fancy grinder...."
I was one of the first backers of the KEY Grinder and I can’t wait until I get it. Would’ve also loved a comparison to the EG-1, which is even more expensive.
I just want to say , thank you for teaching so well! As I watch your videos , I’m constantly asking myself questions, and you always deliver an answer.
I actually enjoy hand grinding. I used to have a somewhat cheap ceramic burrs hand grinder that was unpleasant to use but then I upgraded to the 1zpresso jx-pro and honestly it's a joy to use. I really like grinding my coffee with it every morning
Seeing a fancy man do manual labor is very entertaining, lol. Like the other comment mentions I didnt skip ahead. And also I normally watch these videos at 2x speed, but i watched the grinding at normal speed, lol. Thank you James!
I work in IT, and I tend to automate everything. I'll shove an Arduino into devices at the drop of a hat. But there's something about coffee that just feels right to me being manual. This needs a lever machines, certainly, but I can see myself weighing beans on a manual scale, carefully placing 18.5gm of small weights to one side and adding beans until it levels. It just seems that would be ever so satisfying.
No. No way will I let it get to the point where I’m taking 3 beans of one size out and putting 2 of another size in. When I see that behaviour looming it’s time to be wild and grind 17.8g or 18.6g. I grind 18g, your 18.5g marks you as a barbarian. How can we even talk!
I don't have an espresso machine and have no intentions of purchasing one yet I've been watching this channel for over a year now, to what end I do not know.
Honestly I do love to grind my coffee in the morning. For me it's part of the ritual as James mentioned, and the workout helps to wake me up as well. I'm sure I'd love to use the HG2, but I'll never splurge that much. Fingers crossed for the Patreon raffle!
We have a HG-1 and upgraded the original Mazzer steel burrs to a set of SSP coated in Red Speed. The decision to supply the HG-2 with coated burrs (and they claimed seasoned) as standard is wise as who would really fork out this kind of coin and not go SSP? And James is spot on that it makes a fine pair with a lever machine - we have the new, dual-spring, 3-PID La San Marco-equipped ACS Vesuvius Evo Leva. They make an incredible paring because they both do their jobs exceedingly well. Where it matters most, is the superb depth, mouth-filling and ultra-long finish shots they put out every single time. It's as if they are made for each other. After admiring this incredible piece of artwork upon unboxing, my wife and I actually ground our medium dark roast for exactly one week by hand, then looked at each other and said - "let's motorize it". We did and never looked back. We are not weaklings and as committed as we are to the art of pulling great shots as the reward for our devotion, even the rather easy dark roast wore us down. I can only imagine light roasts for the additional grunt required. In our very humble opinion, the gearbox on the HG-2 is a necessity for those who fancy light roasts much more than a clever design evolution.
I finished my review with the HG-2 about a month ago. I haven't published it yet, just due to a busy schedule. My impressions generally mirror @JamesHoffmann's for the most part. I'll add that the new Magic Tumbler does make for a cleaner work area, containing everything well. I found the added brush to be made much nicer quality wise than previous iterations. The brass is thick, the fitment smooth and tight, the overall quality of it quite high. I think folks with very (extreme end of the population) may want for more length to the crank arm handle. My hand just barely fit and the side of my palm extends just past the edge. Also, I'd prefer for the inner rim of the dosing ring that sits above the burrs to be rounded more, to ease pouring the beans in better. On a previous iteration of the HG-1, they made a ring that had this curve to it, it made for easier dosing into the grinder.
Another great video. I have been looking to get a Weber workshop grinder for a long time and I am very much looking forward to your review of the Key grinder. I would love to see a comparison between the HG-2, EG-1 and the Key grinder, I think a lot of people would appreciate a video like that. I love your videos and can`t wait for the next one.
I personally have never had trouble grinding by hand but then again I'm a big guy that grew up on a small farm. I like the tactile feedback of a hand grinder. Nothing against folks that prefer electric but I find it lazy. LOL Go throw some hay bales James. Seriously though love your videos. This is the best and most informative coffee channel on UA-cam in my opinion.
This is my favorite form-factor for a coffee grinder. It’s why I bought the ROK grinder. I love the stationary, manual grinder, with the crank off to the side. Nothing in the world feels more right than grinding coffee this way, by hand. I hope to have a grinder of this quality someday. For now, I’ll be using the ROK.
Here again. Can’t believe how much difference that new tumbler makes. I got one for my “old” (2014) HG-1. Somehow makes it feel like a new grinder. It is fascinating that this relatively small change makes the grinder so much better. Less parts to keep clean, easier to clean because better access to the burrs, better grinds distribution, _and_ removes the extra whisking/stirring step and the tool. It looks much better too. This is what good design can do.
I laughed at cost of 300$ manual grinders but having one i can say grind quality is there. 1600 for one that flops around the table is a bad joke. It should have come with sticky feet or better yet a nice clamp system for this kind of money, if they can't make it heavy enough.
The only reason it flops around the table is because of bad technique. It is a really heavy grinder. I would not want it heavier or a clamp system, because I push it in on the bench when I am done. Like James' opinion: it's a very good and nice grinder that feels premium, no matter what mind you're gonna make up to justify your $300 cost for your grinder.
I replaced the stock rubber feet on my HG-2 with 4 sorbothane pads. I didn't have a huge problem with the grinder scooting around my countertop but I just didn't like the movement. I don't think it really makes sense to make sorbothane pads a stock option as it's inconvenient to move the grinder once it's stuck to a countertop.. I rarely move my grinder so they work great for me; in fact I enjoy using the grinder far, far more now. It's damn near immovable while grinding, and it also provides a pleasant cushioning effect while the grinder is in use which also makes it marginally quieter and (I believe) lowers the pitch a bit.
I have the Big Dipper and Little Dipper in rose gold since I prepped for the first world cupping tasting. Big Dipper is great for skimming whilst Little Dipper has more heft and bowl depth.
I've had an HG-1 for about a year now (just used it to grind some Sweetshop!) and can sum it up pretty much as follows: Pros: Looks great Grinds really well for both espresso and filter / pour-over Great build quality + feel Grind size goes all the way from "boulders" to "atomic dust". Pretty much zero retention Cons: Grinding lighter roasts is a nightmare (looks like the gearing on the HG-2 makes this a bit easier) Heavy Too tall to fit under standard kitchen cabinets You have to know your way around a grinder to perform maintenance and cleaning Likely to arrive mis-aligned (see above) I had a few issues with bolts + screws coming loose, thus destroying my grind settings between brews The whole thing rocks around like crazy - ideally you'd want to clamp it down The grinding experience isn't particularly pleasant (especially once the novelty wears off) Making more than 1-2 coffees gets tiring (if you have people round) I think this is definitely the grinder for someone who doesn't plan on making coffee for friends. I particularly appreciate its ability to produce great espresso and filter grinds, but the experience of grinding lighter roasts and all the rocking around makes it less than pleasant to use on a daily basis (nice to look at though!)
Got my HG2 back in June - very happy - James hits the issues - leather mat ……hmmm - grinding jumps around a bit - paired with a lever? - does a emulated Londinium via Decent count?? - works a treat in the morning
Update Dec 22 as the video popped on my feed - some updated parts from Weber to address the early batch qa/qc issues and HG2 is now seasoned and has been running for past six months a blue mountain blend - it’s a physical analogue experience - the opposite of my Decent for the digital brewing emulation - regrets? - no quite happy would like EG1 but then that really would be extravagance.
Whew, that's a damn well expensive handgrinder, but that stirrer is such a lovely idea. On the topic of in the morning exercise, I've recently bought the 1zpresso JX Pro, and I'm actually really like grinding coffee. It really feels satisfying turning around the wooden hand grip in such a smooth motion, I'm a fan of handgrinding! If that's down to me never owning an electrical grinder, I don't know, but I enjoy the process
As a non-native speaker after several weeks of these videos: Inside coffee shop - sophisticated, eloquent connoisseur In the streets - caveman with a stroke The highbrow-monobrow-dilemma ...
Look at that smile when James shows off the spoons - so bashful and pleased. Also James, in the 3 years I’ve been watching this channel, today is the first time I’ve heard anything of grinder seasoning. I feel quite mislead after all those grinder comparisons and espresso tutorials and temperature checks and water filter experiments. When is the seasoning tutorial coming out eh?
The leather had want to be burnished on the edge, and actually retained to the machine somehow (tiny magnets would be easy) at this price point. I'm concerned by the instability, too.
It's just a bad batch of leather. My mat doesn't have any whiter spots and it's completely straight and lays perfectly in place. I'm super pleased with mine and it looks good.
Light roasts require more effort some considerably more plus the fact that the height of the grinder relative to his height diminishes the downward pressure he's able to apply to the static handle.
The leather piece on the base looks awfully executed, especially considering the price. Some locator/retaining recessed magnets in the corner could have really helped it sit flat and stable.
Yes and no, I think it doesn't look great aesthetically but I also think it's supposed to feel like a modular piece easy to take out, clean, and put back in. But I can see why it's dividing opinions
@@lucioledizerot196 My suggestion is that the leather still sits on top of the base...I think the fact it sits proud and not recessed would still make it feel detachable... just flat not raised in the corners
Great video. I’m obviously one of those guys. Have an HG-1 and a lever machine. Always get a little movement on the grinder when using especially with light beans. Also lug it around when I need it. Yup it’s heavy but it’s ok. Like the improvements they have made with this but actually prefer the step less grind adjustment in the HG-1. Also find its great for my pour overs.
Totally get the appeal of electric grinders for time saving, but if I'm honest I do actually love the exercise aspect of manually grinding coffee, and it's actually part of why I started drinking it in the first place - I love the smell of it and even the sound of grinding coffee manually, but it really just feels like a good movement and part of the overall ritual of making coffee. I'm not sure I'd like a grinder that's fixed in place though - part of what I like about the hand grinder I have is that it's easy to swap which hand I'm turning with. On the other hand, I do really like the idea of having gears; are there any smaller grinders that have that feature?
Jim is one hell of a reviewer. For real, objective and technical but also insanely good at breaking down objective elements into the parts that subjectively appeal to individuals. Raw fucking talent that is so much harder to achieve than he makes it look.
It's interesting that now days we are paying more for to have tactile and manual experiences even though we have electronic/easier solutions that are cheaper and better. Manual transmissions in high end sports cars, mechanical watches instead of quartz, and hand grinders instead of electronic. Humans are interesting haha
@@duyman8198 well its interesting because it is backwards! Haha. It's like we've made all this progress and yet we still have some sort of yearning for the past. It's intrinsic for us. I think probably because it's hard to "connect" with something you can't fully visualize. Like the electrical internals of a computer are hard to feel an emotion towards even though it is amazing what is going on in them.
I'd say it's a lot of things, for some people preferring the more mechanical is about greater control. For some it may be concerns about repairability, if an electric motor burns out the manufacturer doesn't exist you are kind of SoL, but finding a replacement burr set will probably be less of a pain. Others it may just be that they don't want to rely on/use electricity. I could see this as a great option for some wealthy business type who has a cabin in the woods to decompress. But also, it is nice when you have a power outage for a few days and you can still get your coffee and espresso (happened to me earlier this year, and the fact that I have a hand grinder and french press meant my family still had coffee). And some of it may just be the because you just want to be the eccentric, and nothing says eccentric as someone who spends 1.5k on a hand grinder for coffee. (I say this as someone who is the mythical middle ground Hoffman said probably didn't exist, I find this product interesting for some of the reasons listed above but at that price might as well buy a Niche.)
My HG-2 recently arrived. I think James does an excellent job (as always) describing this grinder - and the "fluffiness" of the grounds. When I ordered the HG-2, I wasn't sure I was going to keep it, since I already own a ROK grinder. But once it showed up and I used it...and then tasted my first shot pulled, it was over! It's also noticeably quieter than the ROK. My ROK also tends to make a squeaky noice on really fine grind settings, which is annoying. I do wish the HG-2 had some sort of adhesive on the bottom, like the ROK. The occasional tilting/rocking while grinding gets to be annoying.
I would be fascinated to see if James could discern the difference between the grinders in a blind test. 8 shots, same beans, 4 from the Niche 4 from the Weber. And James has to try and divide them based on Taste. Or we could make it easier, 4 from the Niche and 4 from a flat burr grinder. Repeating this test several times would only add data as you would expect him to improve if there really is an ‘appreciable’ difference. I'd be interested to see if a Coffee expert with a pallet trained for years can actually discern the differences between grinders or if these differences only manifest on the tongue after the brain has a chance to attach various biases and associations. I do wonder sometimes if the flavour effect of grinder types is widely overstated. Please forgive my genuine curiosity is in it sounds like blasphemy. Edit: I would like to note my question is not one of skeptiscm that is any difference, only that maybe these differences might be so small that unless you are 'looking for them' they might be functionally impossible for a layman to detect without a prompt. Just because you can't see something in the distance until someone points it out doesn't mean it's not there, but it might be so hard to see that without the 'point' to give you a clue, it might as well be.
@@jameshoffmann I was actually slightly worried that saying this would be taboo so I'm somewhat relieved by your response. I love your content for many reasons but a big one of them is how you bridge the proffesional perspective with the layman. I feel an excercise like this like this could be a good way to get perspective on the extent to which certain differences are actually appreciable in day to day scenarios as with that information we can better assess the real value of features to different types of consumer.
You will almost certainly need to use more than 8 shots for statistical significance of the results, but it depends on how much of a true difference in taste there really is (greater difference = smaller acceptable sample size). A double blind experimental design is also a must. And if you have more than one barista pulling the shots, be sure to rotate them to avoid a barista “fixed effect”. As an aside, I won a bet at work by doing exactly this exercise with Diet Coke vs. Coke Zero (28 out of 30 correctly identified, it is a much easier task but taste fatigue got me towards the end). Not quite on the same level as what James is suggesting here. But it was a slow day & we were all stats nerds, so it was a lot of fun.
Now you’ve got me all curious about burr geometry, but I only have one conical burr grinder so I can’t really test my hypothesis. Is there a difference in “steepness” between large conical burrs and smaller conical burrs? Like, are the 83mm conical burrs of Weber’s HG series “flatter” than the burrs of a hand grinder or the Niche or the Sette? That could have some impact on why the HG-2 produces “hybrid” tasting shots. I’m definitely more inclined to believe it’s burr geometry than the de-clumper because after shaking the grounds bin into the portafilter and WDT there’s shouldn’t be a significant difference in puck quality. I’d love to see what other people think (or what you can find out O.o)
Do you think you would ever do an ultimate lever machine comparison? I know you've done lots of individual reviews, but it's hard to tell because you say very different things depending on the mindset with which you're looking at a product.
Superb review as always. And I've gotta say, reasoning towards the end is picking up on some really solid points of *why* you'd want a manual grinder, such as the experience, the connection, etc. But I've gotta add on a bit, that the next "wave" of luxury things is going to be (and in some ways already are) analog living. Yeap. It's going to be hip to not use electronic devices. Since everything and it's mother(board) is getting a chip and battery slapped into it, becoming a commodity, we're seeing an increase in demand of people who wish to get away from all that. Call it digital detoxing, call it not wanting to update the firmware in your lightbulbs; people are buying desolate cottages with little or no power, and furnishing them with every other modern necessity and luxury available. Just to get away from all the downsides of everything being connected and available 24/7. Like, I'll be 100% honest. I work in tech/IT consulting. I genuinely love it. But I also love the idea of waking up on a Saturday, only hearing the wind and birds outside, not a single electronic whirring/buzzing... And then hand-grinding my coffee on something of this caliber, while the water boils on the wood-fired stove? I'll take that over a superyacht any day.
Let's be honest. No one skipped ahead. We all watched you do the whole manual grind.
Some of us watched it at 0.5x speed :D
@@KNURKonesur I watched it at x0.5 with Barry White playing in the background
Hahah ! I am sure no one skipped.
Not that there were any of the promised timestamps/chapter markers anyway!
@@AdamJRichardson no one even noticed 🤣
When you're avidly watching a man describe shots of coffee as tasting more or less conical than each other, you have to ask yourself, am I too far down the rabbit hole?
Oh yes we are, and let's move on.
No mortar overtones and pestle aftertaste.
My wife feels I'm WAAAYYYYY down that rabbit hole!
For me it’s less of a rabbit hole and more of rabbit dungeon where only occasionally do I come up to see the light when I go make a sandwhich or pick up my mail or whatnot.
I'm definitely too far down the rabbit hole, as I've now watched many videos on this channel and I don't drink or like coffee.
Aside from that leather pad that curls up at the corners, this is a gorgeous piece of equipment. My butler can barely contain his excitement as he waits for it to be delivered.
At first glance I thought it was a cardboard and I wonder why is it even there.
No kidding. The one detail that has a cheap look, and it's so obvious! And I'm really confused why it's set under the support piece. For that price, you'd expect a square of embossed leather with some patina, inset flush to the base.
Webber responded and explained that if you dunk it in lukewarm water for 2 seconds and let it dry with a book on top of it, it will become flat and stiff. I personally love how it looks after it’s treated.
@@adrianscarry shouldn't they do it themselves?
Yes! The curled up pad bothered me for the whole video. It looks like someone just forgot to take all the packaging off.
I’m not sure if I’m disappointed or glad that James did his own grinding rather than recruit a butler this time.
I honestly missed him.
Maybe the butler even loves hand grinding. Too much fun might spoil his kind.
@@dushk0 😄😄
Both. Just...both.
The money for the butler went into the machine. 😄
James has finally acknowledged he is a fancy man...
Did he not do that with his spoons a while back 😀
Girl he already knew that before he was born
James Hoffmann: fancy man.
Already said this many videos ago
Originally acknowledged during the world's largest coffee tasting. "This is known." 😉
Me: I will literally never ever ever pay that amount of money for a grinder.
Also me: I will watch every second of this video regardless, as if ready to purchase immediately.
And I might have no use whatsoever for this but damn me if by the end I didn't ponder the idea of buying one.
I'd like TV a lot more if ads were this informative and aesthetically pleasing.
i dont even drink coffee and.. here i am
@@BlairdBlaird yes it would be nice if TV had advertising for well crafted things rather than rapidly produced "we can get away with that" quality builds.
Me: hmm, shall I buy a 89€ or a 222€ guitar, hmm
Also me: watches a video about 1500€ coffee grinder while having a 50€ coffee machine
Won't you? Hear hear
I’d prefer, over the leather, two pieces of wood that match the brush handle and jigsaw together around the central stand. That would provide a similar aesthetic but lay nice and flat. The only thing that looks odd to me is how the leather doesn’t sit perfectly flat, given how perfect the rest of the machine looks and presumably feels. A stunningly beautiful machine though to be sure.
Webber responded and explained that if you dunk it in lukewarm water for 2 seconds and let it dry with a book on top of it, it will become flat and stiff. I personally love how it looks after it’s treated.
@@adrianscarry Do you work for Webber PR?
@@adrianscarry Counterpoint: It should come flat from the factory if it costs 1,650.
Love to try one.
@@VexChoccyMilk Wouldn't be surprised if it's basically impossible to ship it in a way that keeps it flat: it's the sort of thing that would easily warp if the humidity wasn't exactly right. So then there's the counter-counterpoint that they should use appropriate materials so that it's perfect from the factory, if it costs $1650.
The grind numbering reminded me of an aperture ring on a Leica lens - which is no bad thing. In fact the overall aesthetic is very photographic - I thought at first you were reviewing a darkroom enlarger... PS - nice review as always, although i'm very happy with my Commandante!
Agreed. When I saw this on my UA-cam recommended, I thought it was for piece of photography gear rather than a James Hoffman video.
Gordon, seems like you upgraded from the Porlex to a Commandante? That must have been nice
Yep jxpro is pretty good for me
Worlds collide! Love your channel, Gordon!
I was thinking that the last time I saw anything like this grinder I was printing my own prints.
"This one doesn't taste more conical".
What a funny hobby we have.
I'm almost as annoyed when my coffee tastes conical as I am when my grounds aren't fluffy.
I must admit that your videos are kind of a therapy for me. There is much to enjoy when watching them:
- beautiful editing
- excellent choice of music
- great macro shots
- I don't know much about lighting, but it all looks put well together
- the hair (no further comment needed)
- the calming voice
- the British accent
- coffee
- tech-stuff
- the jokes
I could go on and on, but I need my therapy now.
"I like electricity, especially in the morning."
- James, totally not a robot
Especially him who grinds 1 kg of coffee every day 😂
As a long time HG-1 user, this is a great review. The jumping while grinding is certainly a learning curve. I remember being rather disappointed when I first got mine. But after some time, and further seasoning of the burr set, I never have that issue regardless of roast level. In fact, most coffees can be ground without holding the support handle. The gear set on the HG-2 is cool. I counted 50 rotations for James to grind 18g of coffee. That goes down in time. My HG-1 has the TiN burr set as well, and currently grinds ~1g of coffee per rotation. So usually I dose 20.5 g and takes me 22 rotations to clear the burrs.
At the end of the day, this grinder isn't for most people. But I absolutely love mine and am so happy to use it many times a day.
Is the step between notch good ? Also can it go turkish fine ? I grind extremly fine for espresso with smaller dose usally
I really just *like* this man. I've been drinking espresso for most of my life ((and i'm old)), and he's gotten me into an entirely new realm of home ((and out)) coffee experiences. What a great, informative, and fun way to learn! James is excellent!
Easily one of the most charming and interesting youtubers
The soothing white noise of James hand grinding coffee.
Just a matter of time until a 10 hour edit is made 😴
Yeah I literally heard that and thought "oh, I could fall asleep to the sound of this grinder."
Just spent 18min learning about a product I can neither afford nor could justify if I could afford it...but, it was worth it for two reasons...always enjoy James at his best AND the double spoon comment, classic :) always a pleasure James!
I have the HG-1, the tumbler that isn't magnetic and I have the brush standalone. I've had them for some years now.
Your leather mat looks really bad compared to mine. I think you must have gotten a bad batch of it. Mine looks darker with no white spots and it doesn't curl at all. I'm really really pleased with my leather. After each grind I lift the upper ring up and I brush the burrs while the wheel is doing its spin, so every piece falls through the grinder, literally zero retention. I'm very pleased with my grinder. It can be a bit hard to grind light roast, and I mean nordic light, light, so I just press the wheel down and back up reversed the same way. So I go half a clock on repeat instead of a full clock. It doesn't grind the beans when going reverse and the only hard part is grinding upwards, which I eliminate. It's cool to finally see you review the HG grinder, even though it is the second and not first.
Absolutely adore Umeshiso and Umeko-such a great company, and Umeko’s a really wonderful person who clearly cares about customers and accessibility in the industry overall! Really excited to see the representation here!
I watched this man slurp, bripe, and now grind an entire espresso dose. I’m remarkably pleased with myself
The perfect grinder to prepare your beans for the bripe.
@@Zraknul only the best for such a prestigious coffee brewer
As the old saying goes: "People who like this sort of thing will find this the sort of thing they like."
Poetic
Profound
Борода, это во первых примитивно, а во вторых совсем не по существу.
Amazing review James. Thank you, and love the new studio!
It brought my morning a bit of joy the way James introduced those spoons.
I like how every criticism starts with 'ignoring the absurd price', but then descends into intense and specific nitpicks. For my 2 cents, as a left hander, I can't get behind this. At $1650, it should have been ambidextrous, or designed so it can be assembled as a mirror image, maybe with a couple of minor part swaps so the burrs still turn the correct way. At least with 'peppermill' style hand grinders, you can still use them ambidextrously, even if it is slightly less comfortable rotation in the other hand. I really don't see the issue with the price though. This is a sculpture that grinds coffee, not an exercise in building the volksgrinder.
Uhhh, you can just rotate the whole grinder 180 degrees to crank it with your other hand. Lol.
@@tommymaddox6785 No you can’t. There is a handle on one side to keep it steady that you won’t be able to access. And the handle will turn the least comfortable way. For $1650 I don’t want any half assed solution.
@@nicbrownable that's fair. You could hold the gearbox body as well, but at the price premium it's definitely one of a few oversights in the design stage.
I like your comment and I'll use the term volksgrinder pretty soon. :-D
I'm also leftie so this nitpick is important part of high-level design that should be part of such a pricy object.
Just curious: does the "You feel like conical burr sets in espresso have typically skewed towards texture." t-shirt come in a slim large?
Can someone please make this happen! I’ll take a medium, please
Would that a size Slarge?
Bonk alignment. Honestly I like that they released the HG-2 as it has some innovative things built into the grinder. I like how they are putting the user experience first and would expect nothing less from ex-Apple folks. This is a nice counterpoint from other grinder manufacturers in this high-end grinding space. I have the HG-1 and think that it is a great grinder and easy to use. I think if people want that Weber experience, just wait for people to offload their HG-1s after the Key starts shipping. Should be able to get those for half price on the used market with ton of life left in the burrs.
What does bonk mean in this context?
@@js-nk4sd there was a graphic that they had for key grinder or hg2 where they showed a wooden mallet that you could use to hit the shaft to help with alignment. This is because the long shaft would be prone to misalignment because of the strength of the materials and design is not enough to maintain perfect alignment
As a lover of manual coffee grinding, thank you for giving me a new goal for saving my money and irresponsibly spending it.
lmaoooo, bro get a motorcycle licence with that money. Save again 2x and get a bike.
This is a great grinder for someone who lives amongst the Pennsylvania Dutch.
Electric motors are over rated. Ride a bike where an electric motor bike is superfluous unless you are replacing a car, not replacing a bike. Gears do it. Even educated fleas do it.
@@Ma_Ba huh?
@@shinybaldy Just playing with the comment til I rhymed with a Cole Porter old song lyric by accident and toyed with a riff. The idea was that something was easy to do, so "let's do it" and then there are lines that add who else does it "even educated fleas do it."
@@Ma_Ba ok.
Haha. I grew up Amish, and I love the grinder! Maybe those two facts are related.
Long time subscriber here (back when you were below 10,000 subs) and just noticing that you are nearing the 1 million subscriber mark! Well done!
Same! It’s awesome to see his page grow and build a greater following.
I was thinking exactly, lever machine.
Thank you for your grace and elegance, we are suffering such a lack in the states.
"I like electricity to help me do the jobs I don't want to do." Aptly spoken James. 😅
Have loved every day grinding with the HG1 for years now with manual machine just like James recommends. No one in the house wants to grind and make coffee manually, and I love that. I think it’s super pleasing to use no electricity/motors in the morning. But, definitely a unique process that most probably won’t enjoy if they need push-button coffee. Manual extraction has a steep learning curve as well and requires patience to get the results you want. Also, I made my own leather mat which looks way better than the saddle leather mat they have there - super easy to make and looks better. Love the little brush holder on this new version!
It's absurd, but this really does appeal to me. I currently use a more standard hand grinder, and there is something special about that direct relationship with the coffee as you grind it. And you're right, I would absolutely would want to use this with a lever machine. There's just something enchanting and artisanal about making espresso entirely by hand.
There's a UK company that makes a much cheaper countertop grinder that's also super cool. Can't remember the name. 1500usd is just silly, but it's a nice object for sure.
James, been watching your channel for years now after reading your first book (born and bred in Melbourne and just a lover of good coffee). Just realised that you’re about to hit a million subs - unreal mate. Honestly you’ve hit your stride and it’s just so lovely to hear someone properly geek out about coffee. Very deserving of all the success that has come your way.
New studio is beautiful! And also loved the review on this grinder, took me off the fence on it 😄
Been using it for the last 12 months.. everyday is a joy .A Micro workout and make one appreciate what goes into grinding beans ...before liquid gold flows out from decent XXL. looking forward to the Key grinder indeed. Thank you for making the video. Big Fan .
I like the idea of 'slow coffee' - a ritual/celebration/treat, rather than a physiological function that this grinder brings, and yes - a lever express machine would be perfect for it😍
Ok...so. Another great video from James, to be honest, James could read me the manual for a toaster and I would like it. Subscribed for the Coffee conversation, stayed for James style, tone and comments like..."Now such a fancy, fancy grinder...."
I was one of the first backers of the KEY Grinder and I can’t wait until I get it. Would’ve also loved a comparison to the EG-1, which is even more expensive.
I just want to say , thank you for teaching so well! As I watch your videos , I’m constantly asking myself questions, and you always deliver an answer.
I actually enjoy hand grinding. I used to have a somewhat cheap ceramic burrs hand grinder that was unpleasant to use but then I upgraded to the 1zpresso jx-pro and honestly it's a joy to use. I really like grinding my coffee with it every morning
Seeing a fancy man do manual labor is very entertaining, lol. Like the other comment mentions I didnt skip ahead. And also I normally watch these videos at 2x speed, but i watched the grinding at normal speed, lol. Thank you James!
I work in IT, and I tend to automate everything. I'll shove an Arduino into devices at the drop of a hat. But there's something about coffee that just feels right to me being manual. This needs a lever machines, certainly, but I can see myself weighing beans on a manual scale, carefully placing 18.5gm of small weights to one side and adding beans until it levels. It just seems that would be ever so satisfying.
No. No way will I let it get to the point where I’m taking 3 beans of one size out and putting 2 of another size in. When I see that behaviour looming it’s time to be wild and grind 17.8g or 18.6g. I grind 18g, your 18.5g marks you as a barbarian. How can we even talk!
Very happy to see your video again!!
“I’m a fancy man. Oh so fancy.” --James Hoffmann
I don't have an espresso machine and have no intentions of purchasing one yet I've been watching this channel for over a year now, to what end I do not know.
Honestly I do love to grind my coffee in the morning. For me it's part of the ritual as James mentioned, and the workout helps to wake me up as well.
I'm sure I'd love to use the HG2, but I'll never splurge that much. Fingers crossed for the Patreon raffle!
We have a HG-1 and upgraded the original Mazzer steel burrs to a set of SSP coated in Red Speed. The decision to supply the HG-2 with coated burrs (and they claimed seasoned) as standard is wise as who would really fork out this kind of coin and not go SSP? And James is spot on that it makes a fine pair with a lever machine - we have the new, dual-spring, 3-PID La San Marco-equipped ACS Vesuvius Evo Leva.
They make an incredible paring because they both do their jobs exceedingly well. Where it matters most, is the superb depth, mouth-filling and ultra-long finish shots they put out every single time. It's as if they are made for each other.
After admiring this incredible piece of artwork upon unboxing, my wife and I actually ground our medium dark roast for exactly one week by hand, then looked at each other and said - "let's motorize it". We did and never looked back. We are not weaklings and as committed as we are to the art of pulling great shots as the reward for our devotion, even the rather easy dark roast wore us down. I can only imagine light roasts for the additional grunt required.
In our very humble opinion, the gearbox on the HG-2 is a necessity for those who fancy light roasts much more than a clever design evolution.
I finished my review with the HG-2 about a month ago. I haven't published it yet, just due to a busy schedule. My impressions generally mirror @JamesHoffmann's for the most part. I'll add that the new Magic Tumbler does make for a cleaner work area, containing everything well. I found the added brush to be made much nicer quality wise than previous iterations. The brass is thick, the fitment smooth and tight, the overall quality of it quite high.
I think folks with very (extreme end of the population) may want for more length to the crank arm handle. My hand just barely fit and the side of my palm extends just past the edge. Also, I'd prefer for the inner rim of the dosing ring that sits above the burrs to be rounded more, to ease pouring the beans in better. On a previous iteration of the HG-1, they made a ring that had this curve to it, it made for easier dosing into the grinder.
Have an MKII. Solves almost the workflow issues mentioned here. Can’t complain!
I am very interested in the new version. Does it require RDT?
Another great video.
I have been looking to get a Weber workshop grinder for a long time and I am very much looking forward to your review of the Key grinder. I would love to see a comparison between the HG-2, EG-1 and the Key grinder, I think a lot of people would appreciate a video like that. I love your videos and can`t wait for the next one.
A joyful feeling cannot be described after watching most episode of this channel...
He's back! The ultimate return of the king!
I personally have never had trouble grinding by hand but then again I'm a big guy that grew up on a small farm. I like the tactile feedback of a hand grinder. Nothing against folks that prefer electric but I find it lazy. LOL Go throw some hay bales James. Seriously though love your videos. This is the best and most informative coffee channel on UA-cam in my opinion.
This is my favorite form-factor for a coffee grinder. It’s why I bought the ROK grinder. I love the stationary, manual grinder, with the crank off to the side. Nothing in the world feels more right than grinding coffee this way, by hand.
I hope to have a grinder of this quality someday. For now, I’ll be using the ROK.
Fantastic. I was just about to revisit his ROK grinder review from back in the day!
Also have the ROK grinder and have been loving it
Totally agree, I have the ROK grinder and I feel like HG-2 was built for me once I can afford it XD
Fellow ROK grinder owner and loving it.Agree it’s a great experience
Here again. Can’t believe how much difference that new tumbler makes. I got one for my “old” (2014) HG-1. Somehow makes it feel like a new grinder. It is fascinating that this relatively small change makes the grinder so much better. Less parts to keep clean, easier to clean because better access to the burrs, better grinds distribution, _and_ removes the extra whisking/stirring step and the tool.
It looks much better too. This is what good design can do.
The excitement on James’ face while grinding 😂
Didn’t think I would watch the whole video about a manual grinder that I would never buy but it was a damn good video and I watched it all
Great work mate. Thank you for comparing it to the Niche!
I loved the video. It’s not for me but I found the design and your hands-in demo fascinating.
I laughed at cost of 300$ manual grinders but having one i can say grind quality is there. 1600 for one that flops around the table is a bad joke. It should have come with sticky feet or better yet a nice clamp system for this kind of money, if they can't make it heavy enough.
The only reason it flops around the table is because of bad technique. It is a really heavy grinder. I would not want it heavier or a clamp system, because I push it in on the bench when I am done. Like James' opinion: it's a very good and nice grinder that feels premium, no matter what mind you're gonna make up to justify your $300 cost for your grinder.
I replaced the stock rubber feet on my HG-2 with 4 sorbothane pads. I didn't have a huge problem with the grinder scooting around my countertop but I just didn't like the movement. I don't think it really makes sense to make sorbothane pads a stock option as it's inconvenient to move the grinder once it's stuck to a countertop.. I rarely move my grinder so they work great for me; in fact I enjoy using the grinder far, far more now. It's damn near immovable while grinding, and it also provides a pleasant cushioning effect while the grinder is in use which also makes it marginally quieter and (I believe) lowers the pitch a bit.
"And I'm a fancy man." Yes, sir, yes you are. Don't ever change, James!
I ordered my spoon set; time to impatiently check my mailbox until they arrive.
I have the Big Dipper and Little Dipper in rose gold since I prepped for the first world cupping tasting. Big Dipper is great for skimming whilst Little Dipper has more heft and bowl depth.
I had low grade anxiety over preordering the Key, until this review. Thank you James for your honest, thorough, and use-case filled reviews!
I mean if it were bad it was all on you for preordering a big hand grinder for 1.6k lmao
I know that James prepares for these videos with a manicure. Look at how smooth and tidy his nails and cuticles are!
That manual grind sounded so satisfying. I loved the movement as well
I've had an HG-1 for about a year now (just used it to grind some Sweetshop!) and can sum it up pretty much as follows:
Pros:
Looks great
Grinds really well for both espresso and filter / pour-over
Great build quality + feel
Grind size goes all the way from "boulders" to "atomic dust".
Pretty much zero retention
Cons:
Grinding lighter roasts is a nightmare (looks like the gearing on the HG-2 makes this a bit easier)
Heavy
Too tall to fit under standard kitchen cabinets
You have to know your way around a grinder to perform maintenance and cleaning
Likely to arrive mis-aligned (see above)
I had a few issues with bolts + screws coming loose, thus destroying my grind settings between brews
The whole thing rocks around like crazy - ideally you'd want to clamp it down
The grinding experience isn't particularly pleasant (especially once the novelty wears off)
Making more than 1-2 coffees gets tiring (if you have people round)
I think this is definitely the grinder for someone who doesn't plan on making coffee for friends. I particularly appreciate its ability to produce great espresso and filter grinds, but the experience of grinding lighter roasts and all the rocking around makes it less than pleasant to use on a daily basis (nice to look at though!)
Got my HG2 back in June - very happy - James hits the issues - leather mat ……hmmm - grinding jumps around a bit - paired with a lever? - does a emulated Londinium via Decent count?? - works a treat in the morning
What grinding setting do you use for the londinium profile
@@منصورالقويعي-ل7ق last time I calibrated and that’s important as it can slip And depending on the bean type for a 18g
Update Dec 22 as the video popped on my feed - some updated parts from Weber to address the early batch qa/qc issues and HG2 is now seasoned and has been running for past six months a blue mountain blend - it’s a physical analogue experience - the opposite of my Decent for the digital brewing emulation - regrets? - no quite happy would like EG1 but then that really would be extravagance.
11:00 the Monolith MC4 seems to be also a pointer toward more clarity without being on the flat burr spectrum. Any chance a test is incoming? :)
Whew, that's a damn well expensive handgrinder, but that stirrer is such a lovely idea.
On the topic of in the morning exercise, I've recently bought the 1zpresso JX Pro, and I'm actually really like grinding coffee. It really feels satisfying turning around the wooden hand grip in such a smooth motion, I'm a fan of handgrinding!
If that's down to me never owning an electrical grinder, I don't know, but I enjoy the process
As a non-native speaker after several weeks of these videos:
Inside coffee shop - sophisticated, eloquent connoisseur
In the streets - caveman with a stroke
The highbrow-monobrow-dilemma ...
If only every product was reviewed with this level of intrigue.
Look at that smile when James shows off the spoons - so bashful and pleased.
Also James, in the 3 years I’ve been watching this channel, today is the first time I’ve heard anything of grinder seasoning. I feel quite mislead after all those grinder comparisons and espresso tutorials and temperature checks and water filter experiments. When is the seasoning tutorial coming out eh?
i really enjoy manual coffee grinding and have been seriously considering upgrading my ROK GC grinder to the HG-2. Cheers James!
The leather had want to be burnished on the edge, and actually retained to the machine somehow (tiny magnets would be easy) at this price point. I'm concerned by the instability, too.
It's just a bad batch of leather. My mat doesn't have any whiter spots and it's completely straight and lays perfectly in place. I'm super pleased with mine and it looks good.
Light roasts require more effort some considerably more plus the fact that the height of the grinder relative to his height diminishes the downward pressure he's able to apply to the static handle.
I just ordered my UMESHISO rainbow spoons! My espresso will taste so much better! Thank you!
The leather piece on the base looks awfully executed, especially considering the price. Some locator/retaining recessed magnets in the corner could have really helped it sit flat and stable.
Yes and no, I think it doesn't look great aesthetically but I also think it's supposed to feel like a modular piece easy to take out, clean, and put back in. But I can see why it's dividing opinions
@@lucioledizerot196 My suggestion is that the leather still sits on top of the base...I think the fact it sits proud and not recessed would still make it feel detachable... just flat not raised in the corners
My fancy spoons turned up this morning and wow are they fancy! They really do make the whole coffee experience better 😆
After I grind my coffee in this grinder, I can brew it in my $20.00 Mr. Coffee drip brewer.
Great video. I’m obviously one of those guys. Have an HG-1 and a lever machine. Always get a little movement on the grinder when using especially with light beans. Also lug it around when I need it. Yup it’s heavy but it’s ok. Like the improvements they have made with this but actually prefer the step less grind adjustment in the HG-1. Also find its great for my pour overs.
Totally get the appeal of electric grinders for time saving, but if I'm honest I do actually love the exercise aspect of manually grinding coffee, and it's actually part of why I started drinking it in the first place - I love the smell of it and even the sound of grinding coffee manually, but it really just feels like a good movement and part of the overall ritual of making coffee. I'm not sure I'd like a grinder that's fixed in place though - part of what I like about the hand grinder I have is that it's easy to swap which hand I'm turning with. On the other hand, I do really like the idea of having gears; are there any smaller grinders that have that feature?
I don't even drink coffee but love your videos for some reason. Top guy.
Jim is one hell of a reviewer. For real, objective and technical but also insanely good at breaking down objective elements into the parts that subjectively appeal to individuals. Raw fucking talent that is so much harder to achieve than he makes it look.
I love this channel so much. Thanks for the high-quality, informational, and entertaining content, James!
Now I can grind my coffee and my tears
Thank you for changing the way I make and enjoy coffee. Great videos.
Fancy grinder, fancy spoon, fancy man ✨
Today I learned the term "popcorning issues". That alone was worth the day. ❤️
I love my arm excerices in the morning with my normcore v2, makes me think I've earned my cup! 🤣🤣
It's interesting that now days we are paying more for to have tactile and manual experiences even though we have electronic/easier solutions that are cheaper and better. Manual transmissions in high end sports cars, mechanical watches instead of quartz, and hand grinders instead of electronic. Humans are interesting haha
"Interesting"? I think you meant backward :)
@@duyman8198 well its interesting because it is backwards! Haha. It's like we've made all this progress and yet we still have some sort of yearning for the past. It's intrinsic for us. I think probably because it's hard to "connect" with something you can't fully visualize. Like the electrical internals of a computer are hard to feel an emotion towards even though it is amazing what is going on in them.
I'd say it's a lot of things, for some people preferring the more mechanical is about greater control. For some it may be concerns about repairability, if an electric motor burns out the manufacturer doesn't exist you are kind of SoL, but finding a replacement burr set will probably be less of a pain. Others it may just be that they don't want to rely on/use electricity. I could see this as a great option for some wealthy business type who has a cabin in the woods to decompress. But also, it is nice when you have a power outage for a few days and you can still get your coffee and espresso (happened to me earlier this year, and the fact that I have a hand grinder and french press meant my family still had coffee). And some of it may just be the because you just want to be the eccentric, and nothing says eccentric as someone who spends 1.5k on a hand grinder for coffee. (I say this as someone who is the mythical middle ground Hoffman said probably didn't exist, I find this product interesting for some of the reasons listed above but at that price might as well buy a Niche.)
You can read The Revenge of Analog by David Sax, it’s interesting
Kodak 2.0 anyone ?
My HG-2 recently arrived. I think James does an excellent job (as always) describing this grinder - and the "fluffiness" of the grounds. When I ordered the HG-2, I wasn't sure I was going to keep it, since I already own a ROK grinder. But once it showed up and I used it...and then tasted my first shot pulled, it was over! It's also noticeably quieter than the ROK. My ROK also tends to make a squeaky noice on really fine grind settings, which is annoying. I do wish the HG-2 had some sort of adhesive on the bottom, like the ROK. The occasional tilting/rocking while grinding gets to be annoying.
Try sorbothane pads, they make a world of difference.
5:42 "Yes!". (I then immediately move to my not so expensive coffee corner to pull a shot). #cheers
Love the "Weird Coffee Person" print in the background, it's amazing.
I would be fascinated to see if James could discern the difference between the grinders in a blind test.
8 shots, same beans, 4 from the Niche 4 from the Weber. And James has to try and divide them based on Taste. Or we could make it easier, 4 from the Niche and 4 from a flat burr grinder.
Repeating this test several times would only add data as you would expect him to improve if there really is an ‘appreciable’ difference.
I'd be interested to see if a Coffee expert with a pallet trained for years can actually discern the differences between grinders or if these differences only manifest on the tongue after the brain has a chance to attach various biases and associations.
I do wonder sometimes if the flavour effect of grinder types is widely overstated. Please forgive my genuine curiosity is in it sounds like blasphemy.
Edit: I would like to note my question is not one of skeptiscm that is any difference, only that maybe these differences might be so small that unless you are 'looking for them' they might be functionally impossible for a layman to detect without a prompt. Just because you can't see something in the distance until someone points it out doesn't mean it's not there, but it might be so hard to see that without the 'point' to give you a clue, it might as well be.
I like this idea. I might rope in some very capable people to pull some shots for me to put me to the test!
@@jameshoffmann I was actually slightly worried that saying this would be taboo so I'm somewhat relieved by your response. I love your content for many reasons but a big one of them is how you bridge the proffesional perspective with the layman.
I feel an excercise like this like this could be a good way to get perspective on the extent to which certain differences are actually appreciable in day to day scenarios as with that information we can better assess the real value of features to different types of consumer.
@@hotdog4260 He's posh, not a snob :) Refreshing for sure
Palate*. Not pallet. A pallet is the bottom of a wooden crate.
You will almost certainly need to use more than 8 shots for statistical significance of the results, but it depends on how much of a true difference in taste there really is (greater difference = smaller acceptable sample size). A double blind experimental design is also a must. And if you have more than one barista pulling the shots, be sure to rotate them to avoid a barista “fixed effect”.
As an aside, I won a bet at work by doing exactly this exercise with Diet Coke vs. Coke Zero (28 out of 30 correctly identified, it is a much easier task but taste fatigue got me towards the end). Not quite on the same level as what James is suggesting here. But it was a slow day & we were all stats nerds, so it was a lot of fun.
I started pushing on the toilet right as you started grinding in the video. I felt we were one in spirit
Now you’ve got me all curious about burr geometry, but I only have one conical burr grinder so I can’t really test my hypothesis. Is there a difference in “steepness” between large conical burrs and smaller conical burrs? Like, are the 83mm conical burrs of Weber’s HG series “flatter” than the burrs of a hand grinder or the Niche or the Sette? That could have some impact on why the HG-2 produces “hybrid” tasting shots. I’m definitely more inclined to believe it’s burr geometry than the de-clumper because after shaking the grounds bin into the portafilter and WDT there’s shouldn’t be a significant difference in puck quality. I’d love to see what other people think (or what you can find out O.o)
Depending on what grinder you have, you might be able to buy a flat burr set and change it out for a side by side
The seriousness with which you made that fancy man comment literally made me choke up tear of laughter lol.
Do you think you would ever do an ultimate lever machine comparison? I know you've done lots of individual reviews, but it's hard to tell because you say very different things depending on the mindset with which you're looking at a product.
This video was a 'pleasent textural experience'.. Nice one 👍
I feel like the HG-2 belongs next to a Streitman, the Key next to a Cremina, and the EG next to a Decent, GS-3, or Slayer.
Superb review as always. And I've gotta say, reasoning towards the end is picking up on some really solid points of *why* you'd want a manual grinder, such as the experience, the connection, etc.
But I've gotta add on a bit, that the next "wave" of luxury things is going to be (and in some ways already are) analog living. Yeap. It's going to be hip to not use electronic devices. Since everything and it's mother(board) is getting a chip and battery slapped into it, becoming a commodity, we're seeing an increase in demand of people who wish to get away from all that.
Call it digital detoxing, call it not wanting to update the firmware in your lightbulbs; people are buying desolate cottages with little or no power, and furnishing them with every other modern necessity and luxury available. Just to get away from all the downsides of everything being connected and available 24/7.
Like, I'll be 100% honest. I work in tech/IT consulting. I genuinely love it. But I also love the idea of waking up on a Saturday, only hearing the wind and birds outside, not a single electronic whirring/buzzing... And then hand-grinding my coffee on something of this caliber, while the water boils on the wood-fired stove? I'll take that over a superyacht any day.
Maybe should have shown the transferring process form the magic tumbler to the portafilter.
Exactly. I also would use Cafelat Robot of smaller specs than a 58.