Elite Capture in Pakistan I Are Elites really that bad? I اشرافیہ کا قبضہ؟
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- Опубліковано 10 лис 2023
- #Elite has been defined in different ways, especially in the developing and under-developed world. Rich is often confused with “elite”. Furthermore, income inequality brews constant hate against the elite, even if it is white money. The gap between the common populace and elites (whichever way they are conceived) is widening. What can be done in this regard? How can this gap be bridged?
- How do we define elites?
- What do we mean by the term #EliteCapture?
- Review and identify the process and tools of elite capture.
- Are elites really that bad? Are most of the positive changes not led by elites?
- Is elite capture not inevitable? In fact, is the state not defined and regulated by the elite in all countries and through history.
- Is this just to voice the “absence of #merit?’ Why is merit missing in #Pakistan?
Panelist:
MR HABIB AKRAM
Senior Journalist & Political Analyst, SUNO News
MR SAAD RASOOL Partner, SR-Law
MS NASIM ZEHRA
Senior Journalist & Writer
DR NADEEM UL HAQUE (Moderator)
Vice Chancellor, Pakistan Institute of Development Economics - PIDE
EconFest Website: econfest.pide.org.pk/
For Further Details Please Visit:
@PIDEOfficial
www.pide.org.pk
/ pideofficial
/ pidepk
/ pideislamabad
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/ pidepk
"Democracy without Meritocracy is just an Aristocracy."
Pm is selected by Army
What will merit do?
When the meritorious person has no power & get orders from rawalpindi
Isn’t this conversation taking place amongst the elites? How many in the audience represent the commoners? None in the audience seems to be oppressed enough to rebel against the capture. The debate needs to be taken to the people in Urdu Punjabi, saraiki, Sindhi, potohari, pushto, Baluchi and other regional languages. Those are the people that need to be made aware of how their rights and interests are made subservient to the elites. My two cents!
I second you.
💯
Definition of Elite by Habib Akram is very right
Naseem zhara disappointed us but Saad and Habib came with solid arguments
I Have never seen so much sophisticated debate with excellent tolerance. It is full of knowledge.
Good programme by Pride
wonderful discourse ! pleasantly surprised to listen to some very articulate speakers and that too in pakistan. love from india 🇮🇳…
Habib Akram won the show and made my day…what an articulate person he is!
What a session. Loved how habib akram summed up in last sentences. Our state discipline has evaporated. the reason? corrupt and incompetent people installed who are used by army. If only our bureaucracy had spine to stand against dictations. things would've been different.
First ask this lady to wear a Hijab/burkha and ask the men on the pannel to grow beard. How can Pakistan call itself an Islamic nation without even following basic Islamic rules? This is the reason why Allah is angry on Pakistan and Pakistan is going thorough difficult times.
I appropriated you people explanation very well❤
Thank you Saad Rasool and Habib Akram . You both said it all and said it brilliantly ❤
Punjabi elite either in military, civil bureaucracy, traders, writers etc etc captured whole Pakistan.
Don't spread lasanit and tasub
Thank you Jinnah 🙏
Yehi h jinnah ka Pakistan
😂wah wah wah, interesting definition of elite by Habib🎉 I am left with no choice but to agree 😅
شکر ہے آپ نے یوتھ کہا
یوتھئے نہیں کہا!!
Thats a really good one, thanks for brining it up.
Politicians, Judges, Army Generals and Beaurocracy are responsible for Pakistan situation
Don't forget to include Media
Also add our ulma
In Pakistani textiles there is seth system where labour are left at the mercy of Thekedars and deprived of basic rights while these seths are getting huge benefits from government. Even on educational institites so called eiltes and exaple is " Karachi Public School" where teachers are not given appointment letter, transportation, gratuity, even teachers are forced to pay for the water they drink. I dont know how British Council allowed such institites to work.
Great discourse, much appreciated
Good as always.This is a good show of our media elite.This event enables us to assess their thought Pattern and intellectuals capabilities up to some extent.Thanks you Dr sahib and all participants. Well done.
Saad rasul sir, love from multan
v good debate
Saad sir is so much sophisticated
Amazing discussion
All those fellow sitting on the Dias contributed to the current state of Pakistan, asking them solutions is like asking butcher to save the goat . If these ppl has any productive thing to do they would have left Pakistan
Habib Akram summed up beautifully.
This system can't be changed, due to upper absolute power.
The original definition of "Elite" was actually intellectual
You can't escape the role of Army in the politics and economy 👍
Thanks sir
For providing such platform with informative information.
Social media popularity not only tool of success its reality, saad & habib approach not fair if they talk as free analysts then its best arguments zehra maam well said all institutions work own domain
Majority are confused it is not the time of Elite or non Elite .
In my opinion elite capture affects the society where there is little Justice and weak law enforcement. Then a few become powerful and define the way of working
Candid discussion.
Ashrafia brings positive change. While Badmashia destroyed the country.
Saad Rasool well said 👍🏼👍🏼
Great
Now is the right time this and such intellect platforms should evolve public opinion to the need of absolute free and fair elections in Pakistan.
Societal resilience thrives when power and expertise are distributed inclusively rather than concentrated in an elite few.
ہم کھڑے نہیں ہیں
ہم تو دلدل یہ شاید کیچڑ میں دھنسے ہوئے ہیں
stimulating discussion...
however, it would have been a lot better, if they could have first defined which "elite" they wish to deliberate on....
Combatting elite capture in Pakistan requires comprehensive reforms, including strengthened institutions, anti-corruption measures, and enhanced transparency to ensure equitable resource distribution!!!
Absence of a fair level playing field is one tragic product of elite control
In the world leadership grow from local governments councilors to local committee head to mayors MPA to MNA to PM . But in case of Pakistan Generals manipulating politicians from top to bottom regardless of criminal record .
Waffling , these guys just did not know what they are talking about . Should have had a one member panel of Unzair Younis he would have done a better job than all four . This was a case of DIAS CAPTURE .
Habib sb & Rasool sb brilliant analysis 👌 👏
Need " University of Political Science,, Financial Fairness & International Affairs., " Social Justice, Welfare for all .
Nice to watch some sensible talk, more to say , Mr Habib Akram seems better prepared for the subject & his Remarks or comments are more appealing & revealing as well , any way others contributions or not neglectable also , should be consider this forum as prelude to independent Think-Tanks ?
It is high time to have local government bringing the youth into this arena and keep those born between 1940s to 1970s out of the process. Mistakes will be made by the youth, but the youth will learn provided they follow Principles of Management, Justice and Morality.
Good effert but need more discuse.
In the case of the Pakistan pyramid of Elite is - judiciary, executive and legislator. This pyramid is called a state and institutions constitute a state. The state is unavailable to perform its due role. One of the basic onus of the state is to create equal opportunities for its citizens but here there is an inadequacy in this regard. The only way forward is "The pillars of state - judiciary, legislature and executive ( Elite) should perform its Constitutional role. "The Just political system" is the panacea.
Army controls judiciary executive legislators
In today's era, reforms can be made when we come out of the digital marketing and soft skills bubble created by the world. I found this distracts the upcoming generation from being an intellectual to a skilled worker. Running a channel and digital marketing should be a hobby, but Pakistan's generation has made them their full flash career. We need intellectuals who sufficiently know the core of their subject instead of rote learning. WE Need Education first.
First define elite. In Pakistani context there is nobody elite. Being rich doesn't mean being elite. Being rich also doesn't mean being respectable. Elite means being rich as well as respectable. In our case rich are holders of wealth given to them by British Raj or accumulated by many through unfair and wicked means. They created money by loot, stealing and undue advantages and persecution of the masses and inflicting loss to national kitty. The practice of these leeches is equivalent to capture which we tend to wrongly call elite capture.
What will happen if corrupt politicians, corrupt generals, corrupt judges, corrupt civil and military bureaucracy, and big landowners don't pay any tax? Tax evader businessmen, that have captured the whole country. true leadership can handle this problem but the main hurdle is the will of the masses to change this corrupt system and rule of law with the sanctity of the constitution.
Only rule of law- transparency, merit and competition can merge the real elite and that elite capture would be a blessing for the society. Without rule of law, elite capture would be nauserbazi
Jb tk election k Liye har candidate ko jalsy jaloos arrange karny parain gy tb tk change mumkin NAHI. Govt. Ko chahiye k wo tmam media houses ko paband karain k free main rozana ki base par 3 sy 4 minute ka advertisement ka slot siyasi parties ko dain ta k wo awam tk apna manshoor aur apni bat pohncha sakain ta k unko jalsy jaloos karny ki zarorat na ho. Aur har new govt is bat ki paband ho k wo aty Sath he aik 2 mahiny main local bodies election Karwa k unhain activate kar dain.
plz improve ur Channel Sound System for Loud & Clear
شکر ہے کہ ایڈیٹ فورس نہیں سمجھے
Great discussion after this every one can easily understand the elite are important for the development of society. And also understand what is elite culture?
I request Madam to talk based on figures through analysis.
ھم ووٹ اس شخصیت کو دیں گے جس نے یھودیوں کے گھر میں کھڑے ھو کر کہا تھا حضرت محمد صلی اللّٰہ علیہ وسلم ھمارے دلوں میں بستے ہیں❤️❤️
❤ 46:37 46:38
سید رسول
Elite se upr ek chiz h jiske bare me baat karne ki himmat inme nhin h.
O dear...
Ours is a Non-Elite Capture' ... Please mind it Opportunists can hardly be called Elites
AoA, selective application of the law is a symptom and catalyst of elite capture
❤❤❤ زبردست لاجواب ماشآء اللہ ❤❤❤
لیکن ہر وقت بلوچستان کو مایوس رکھا گیا ہیں۔۔سرفراز بگٹی انوار الحق بلوچستان سے نہ سہی لیکن آئینی قانونی حقوق تو دے دیا کریں۔۔شکریہ❤❤❤
Thanks for the feedback, stay tuned for such knowledgeable discussions & debates.
You will be next Afghanistan Inshallaha
No doubt we need stability and economic revival in country but its depend our efforts, honesty and our approach. No need to blame generations we simple need rule of law and justice, Its implementation & all institutions work in own domain
Pakistani intellectuals, for the first time it seems, started raising relevant questions which are, deemed to be a great beginning to take the society towards a developmental path.
Call it British Punjabi elite as they were rewarded for their services to British Crown. Pashtun and Baloch have suffered because they have always resisted colonial rule.
So you mean British army did not give Jageer to Pukhton khans and Baloch Nawab?
Bhai apky tribes k sardar b Elite m e aty hen.
پختون اور بلوچوں نے کیا تکلیفیں اٹھائیں جناب؟ سچ بتاؤں؟ لیکن سچ ہضم کرنا مشکل ہوتا ہے۔ ہر ضلع میں بس دو برٹش گورے مالیہ لینے آیا کرتے تھے (جو یقین نہیں تو اپنے ضلع کا 1866کا بندوبستی ریکارڈ چیک کر لیں، چاہے آپ پاکستان انڈیا کے جس ضلع کے بھی ہیں)... اچھا دو گورے برٹش آیا کرتے تھے تو پورے ضلع کے نواب، خان، ملک، چوہدری، پٹیل، چانڈیو، مری، بگٹی لمبے لیٹ جایا کرتے تھے۔ کوئی صاحب بہادر کو گھوڑے کا تحفہ دیتے تھے کوئی دیسی شراب۔۔۔ کیا یہ جھوٹ ہے؟؟
پھر وہ مالیہ اکھٹا کر کے ساتھ لے جاتے تھے ۔ تو تکلیف تو انگریزوں نے اٹھائی جو مالیہ لے جانے کا بندوبست کرتے تھے ۔ جو لمبا لیٹ گیا اس نے کیا تکلیف اٹھانی ہے؟
Whatsapp university se history prh k esy coments koi bari baat nhi
Dear Ayub was pashtoon, musharaf & zia were muhajir it seems like all is in hand of army chief regardless of punjabi , baloch , pashtoon or sindhi . Asim is punjabi and now killing the punjabies or any other group for his power lust
Best in between u who is honest meaning akhlas akhlaq we needed beginning from family's change mind set powers or something else should be Gain by respect and kind Way mind set is u Gain power only by stealing honest people is stupid and no smart or mean fools this all happened in honest son daughter's and who honest thanks
جب تک پارلیمانی سسٹم کو ختم کرکے ہر عہدہ کے لئے عوام کے براہ راست ووٹنگ بہت ضروری ہے
Pakistan Army Zindabad
Military dictator zindabad
Marshal law zindabad
Very dangerous for Pakistan existence
The host himself when he asked for questions, he had chosen people already and named them to ask questions. He might have a good information but not a behaviour. Same as colonial mindset or elitism.
Only talking political side of elite (either good elite or bad) but not discussing the elite which may / must evolved from society's intelligentsia, who are , may be social reformers / religious scholars/ writers / trainers etc. which must be evolved from society itself on thier own talent basis. Although better word for such elite is "intelligentsia" who doesn't "capture" but influence the society through "education." , Here, the journalists' panel has tilted the later discussion on political side, while elite capture is not a political term in itself. Thus , the conversation at the beginning was more relevant.
Elite capture may be seen in our family system too, like wise in our society . It is inherent in our society
With due apology I totally disagree with the topic. I would like to be captured by elite, if there is one. Elite of yesteryear included Jinnah (politics), Iqbal (poetry), and PERHAPS Dawuds, Saigols and Habibs (business).
My source of frustration is; what we are captured by is not elite. They are gangsters from real estate, tax evaders from business and the corrupt criminals from politics.
A parallel comment is that many of the logos on your stage backdrop represent business elite. This type of elite is primarily consisting of tax evaders.
In conclusion this session is also captured by elite.
If repetition of a name in a written or spoken dialogue is also a type of elite, do you include NS, AZ, SS in elite? If you do, that is THE problem!
Be happy for collecting money from your sponsors (the business elite) PIDE!!!
When natural selection, meritocracy and competition is killed by power i.e dictatorship we see black sheep in the elites and thereby all institutions and walks of life
Who will bell the cat?
Stuck with Brown Sahab terminology 😢
Is this was a last option for u to bought nestle water and why ....u must think
Over all debate was appreciable
Miliraty is the big problem for pakistan. Suadi ambassor is military man. how can they run diplomacy in the present age whihc is so important
Lack of diversity and uniform society , picking candidates from the same barrel .
Yes they really are that bad, in fact, they're worse, next question
اخلاقیات کی شدید کمی
Ellite capture is USA for pakistan through establishment
Sindh main local government functional hain iss time, Saad making argument on LG and sad to hear he didnt know this,
میرے خیال میں ایلیڈ دو قسم ھے ایک قسم کا ایلیڈ قوموں کو بنا تھا ھے اور دوسری قسم کا ایلیڈ اپنے آپ کو بناتے ھیں ۔
Pakistan Foj ke generals pe lanat
There is nothing that Pakistani state will enact and the rest of the world hasn't. It's only a debate where the original 99% Pakistanis are somehow convincing the colonial inherited 1% elite to direct their self-interest oriented pursuits from minority upper strata to majority lower strata. Elites are so entrenched with their various forms of confiscating power structures (logically understandable because of colonial ossification), that elite is not going anywhere in foreseeable.
Why don't you expand the kinds of educational practices that the top tier gets to every localized community, peoples in one decade or two, will speak to you what is their plural non-eliteness through their innovativeness and recreationality. Pakistanis fear God, work hard, and are culturally amiable peoples. Hamid Dabashi in Can non-Europeans Think? rejects colonial classification based on the point that 'they have not been exposed to'. the Subaltern can not 'think' and 'speak' because the majority relations in our nation-state does not want them to 'think' or 'speak'. To the majority lower strata, it costs their early youthful Years of life to 'know the difficult unknown' many forms of stubborn JHOOT.
'ELite ne Hamare ird gird itne JHOOT create kr die hain, k jinko identify krne k lie zindagi ka aik hissa darkaar hota hai, or is doran ELITES frictionless progress krte hain. It's only 0.00000001% of non-elite common people who rise to that status of 'competent or meritorious Elite' (as mentioned), still they need patronage links. Democracy, plurality, inclusivity jese labels bhi Elites ki set definition pe practice hote hain, Elites are so non-Pakistanis (because they do not fear God, and are oblivious of our Sufist espiritu). At least they should dissolve their colonially adopted elitness.
کاش آپ اپنی انتہائی اہمیت کی حامل بات اپنی زبان میں کرتے تو پاکستانی سو فیصد سمجھ سکتے ۔۔۔ اور شاید کچھ سماجی شعور میں اصافہ بھی 😢
پاکستان نے ملاؤں میں خوب ترقی کی ہےُ ُ
اور یہ لوگ پاستان پر چھا گے ہیں
اور آپس میں پھر بھی متفق نہیں ہیں یہ افسوس کی بات ہے
معافی کے ساتھ
Really?😂 This can only happen to a country which never underwent a socialist reform.
Habib sb plz not confused example of Afghanistan
Here we hv big mafia they hv own Elites Class some are structured and some are un structural face
Need to separate this symbol
This term mix used in our country
Simple is that army is big trouble Creator in Pakistan Duffer's rush to work as Duffer's like politicians , judge and bearucrates
God wanted to create an example as to ,"How not to create and run a country, so that future generations can learn," and thus Pakistan was created.
Perhaps we need a leader who realises that Pakistan needs to curtail state expenditures and increase revenues and expend state money on priority schemes on merit.
Leader is in jail. Elete has captured him and awam is helpless.
@@mujahidhussain6264 yeah the same leader who promised to go to office on bicycle but used helicopter for four years incurring crores of rupees to exchequer.
معذرت !نسیم زھراء صاحبہ ایک بات یا خیال ختم کیے بغیر آگے آگے کیوں بڑھ جاتی ہیں کیا یہ بھی کوئی elite approach تو نہیں جو ہم جیسوں کی سمجھ سے باہر ہو ۔
Saad Rasool and Habib Akram on the panel ?
The sum total of credibility between the both of them is zero.
Nasim thinks that functions like medical corps of military or engineering corps can be labelled as examples of delivery, a gravely misplaced idea, true test of the army lies in the battle field, we all what has been delivered when called for.
Different religions have different morality and ethics . Once you exclude them and there is uniformity like in Pakistan . Then you cannot succeed unfortunately
This lawyer does not know the meaning of democracy . It is simply not voting . It involves justice . Safety of citizens , education fairness in the country . In democracy where is blasphemy law
Genuine elite in Pakistan on basis of talent are as rare as hens teeth . The guy was struggling to come with name . So sad and pathetic
عبدالقادر ہیلتھ منسٹر اس ملک میں رہ چکے ہیں