Great video as usual. We as gas engineers know what must be done when installing a boiler and we know in reality what gets done. My neighbour had his boiler installed by a BiG national company, the engineer was in the house for about 4 hrs, I imagine he completed every one of these steps diligently. No, no I’m sure he did!
Just had a Worcester Bosch Greenstar 4000 30kw installed. After finding it was installed on 15mm pipework under the floorboards. I queried this with the installed and they told me, nah it's fine.
There is a great book about doctors called The Anxiety Makers looks like gas boilers are going the same way. Goodness this guy would have us awake all night worrying about our boilers. He's not wrong it just comes across as the industry bumping up a psychological dependency. Best to have a permanent gasman living in the cellar.
I do wish people would stop pushing combi boilers. If you have a house with separate bathroom and shower and 3 or 4 people living in it, a combi may very well not be suitable for your needs. Ive a regualr boiler in a 4 bed house with separate bathroom, shower and 4 sinks. 4 out of 6 local central heating companies wanted to fit a combi in place of the regular boiler and wouldnt quote when I told them I didnt want a combi thank you very much.
Happy New Year Tom, Good overview of what’s currently required. I’ve moved away from complete installs but when balancing I find a Thermal imaging camera saves a bit of time.
Hi Tom. I have been following your channel for some time now and you have some excellent content. I have been retired from a ESP company for 15 years now and I remember well the battles I had with installers regarding meter inlet pressures. I am not sure you were correct when you say the ESP will check the inlet meter working pressure with the boiler on High fire/service/sweep/mode. Plus 50% second appliance. As I read IGEM/G13 and I could be wrong🤔. Section 6 .1 States. If the RGE is on site then the the pressures can be checked with the appliance commissioning mode. Section 6. 6.2 If appliance has already been commissioned (suggesting that no RGE on site) the ESP will Check the working pressure with the appliance working at normal and/or HIGH OPERATING LOAD. Normal load for new un-commissioned appliances would be set to working on Hot water demand to taps or heating demand. APPENDIX 1.1 High operation load. Is the maximum operating load of the entire gas installation It says the combo boiler will be maximum demand with all hot taps running and any other appliances at 50%
Great video from you, the majority of very poor installs I have seen are part of the Eco Grant Scheme, it is as if, they run in, rip the old boiler out, throw the new one on the wall, then run a mile.
That's because any grant scheme is easy money for the cowboys and despite the grant money being quite a lot, I refuse to use any of these schemes and end up with a poor job.
Tom Happy New Year, I've got a couple of questions regarding the video First is that you have installed automatic bypass on the combination boiler and I haven't seen any zones on it and I believe boiler has already installed a bypass, Second one is power flushing and magna cleansing , I've always thought that power flushing comes together with the magna cleansing if the system is dirty to pickup all the debris from the system and the magna cleansing where you doing with the old boiler still connected or using the power flush machine? I hope it's not confusing Thank you
WOW! I need a new boiler, but how can I trust a qualified contractor to do all of this. Was looking at one of the fixed price companies to do the job, but should I? Don't know anyone who can recommend someone.
ty for upload as always. i didnt know about the igem changes did i miss it in gas safe magazine? or was it too much boring reading:P they need to up their game imo. maybe a .............simple breakdown every month on youtube? or another portal? i know i'd pay for that. prv, bs used to tell us run to outside in copper? that changed? nice to see. as you said though run seperate if possible.
There are "cowboy" customers. Just as there are engineers. Unfortunately the price is their main concern. ("can you match joe blogs down the road?") I don't price up heating systems any more. For all the reasons highlighted in your video. Keep up the good work. I'm Retiring in March, after 50 years in the trade.
Once I had 13mbr, then I called cadent, they said it is ok the main gas pipe was under sized,, they would upgrade it when they have time, from my side no comment, so working 13 is ok!!
ahh but what does that oversized rad impact on? its the same principle that heat pumps shouldnt be over or undersized right? the system is loosing efficency? i know im being pendantic. you would set your trv,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,some people dont. maybe you tweak that one down a little on flow and return temp?
Over sized rads waste energy because they continue to put out heat into the room even when the TRVs have closed. The room will then overheat costing money and wasting energy.
All these online firms are advertising a system cleanse! Crazy that they get away with it. Powerflush and a magnet is king. Even magnacleansing is just a dreamt up way to make it easier and faster for engineers but not as good.
Surely it would be better for the condense to be taken up higher. It looks dreadful , And hardly anyone I see takes the right sized condense through the wall
Happy New Year Tom! Excellent video as usual. I need to change my Baxi solo 3 pf (23 years old) for a much more efficient boiler. I wondered if you could give me some advice please. I am thinking of changing my regular system to an Ideal Combi Max 30. I have a 4 bed house with 1 bathroom. My wife and I mainly use the power shower which uses a 1.5 bar pump on the hot and cold and is nice and powerful. The Ideal Max supplies 12.5ltrs a minute of hot water. My Question is would this flow rate be as good as the current power shower. My mains cold water flow rate is 16 ltrs a minute. The mains pressure is 3.6 bar and 3.5 bar when another tap is opened. The shower is an Aqualisa Aquatique. My gas pipe is 22mm. I cannot find this information anywhere on the internet! Thanks again for all your great content!
You won’t be able to run the power shower off a combi boiler. You will need to check the flow rate at your cold tap in the kitchen to see what you would get out of the combi
Hi Tom Thank you for your reply. I understand I would have to take the pump out and link the pipes. My question is would I get a shower as good as the one I have if I have the combi installed. The mains water flow rate is 16 ltres a minute.
@@terrydavis9713 it’s the flow rate through the combi you need to look at and the flow through the new shower. If the flow is greater on the shower obviously you will only get what the combi gives you
so after a day or 2's work fitting a new boiler and you test and find you have a working gas delta difference from the meter to the boiler of 1.5 - 2 mbr. are you telling me your going to condemn the new appliance and now tell them they have to spend a further £ 500 - £ 1000 as they need a new gas supply pipework. ? yer sure you do...
Hello Derek. Valuable video...but I was very disappointed in how little insight you gave to achieving the delta 20 between flow and return. Given that people have now cottoned onto low modulation rates and the need to condense then I would have thought this would have been one of the most important part of installing a combi boiler given that delta 20 is now virtually an industry standard. You make brief reference to it...but then just show testing a rad that only gives a drop of 9 degrees. Surely to achieve delta 20 at the boiler will require delta 20 at every radiator ?. My impression to date is that this delta 20 seems a bit of a Holy Grail..and probably is hardly ever achieved on most installations. I assume one would widen the delta gap by throttling the radiator outlets until the desired temp drop is achieved. (but at what effect on radiator output??)...and also by reducing the flow rate of the pump so that water at 70 degrees isnt just being forced straight through the bottom of the radiator. .Furthermore this delta 20 is surely only be achievable when air and room temps are low (mid winter) ..such that the heat can escape from the rads . The implication of this being that in the early and later heating seasons as air temps rise ..then the delta temps will drop away as heat isnt so readily esacping from the radiators. This implication here being that if you have a boiler flow temp set at 70 in deep winter ..to get a condensing return of 50 degrees ...then as the weather warms and radiators dont release their heat so easily...then the flow rate temps will rise again..and possibly begin to exceed the condensing temp of 52 degrees. The overall impression I have to date of this whole condensing /energy saving thing is that it is far from being as easily achieved and in reality is being oversold
Obviously the industry is not being monitored properly. I often read about these so called Gas Engineers failing to do the job properly, so how can this keep going on? The industry is a shambles and I have no confidence in anyone to fit me a new boiler. How on earth is Jo public supposed to choose one that will do a proper thorough job? It's no wonder some people try DIY even for boiler installs.
The industry/gas safe, sets out the training requirements. When these are shockingly low, what do you expect? Competent engineers, after taking a fast track course? So long as you can answer multiple choice papers, you are OK.
Sorry I can see now that the cleaning is completely different video done on different Boiler and magna cleansing done separately to the power flushing Okay
Great video as usual. We as gas engineers know what must be done when installing a boiler and we know in reality what gets done. My neighbour had his boiler installed by a BiG national company, the engineer was in the house for about 4 hrs, I imagine he completed every one of these steps diligently. No, no I’m sure he did!
Good video, it is not only boiler that heating your house it is whole system.
Tom , you are a credit to our profession! Keep up the informative content.
God god its going to be 11am by the time youv started
Just had a Worcester Bosch Greenstar 4000 30kw installed. After finding it was installed on 15mm pipework under the floorboards. I queried this with the installed and they told me, nah it's fine.
There is a great book about doctors called The Anxiety Makers looks like gas boilers are going the same way. Goodness this guy would have us awake all night worrying about our boilers. He's not wrong it just comes across as the industry bumping up a psychological dependency. Best to have a permanent gasman living in the cellar.
I do wish people would stop pushing combi boilers. If you have a house with separate bathroom and shower and 3 or 4 people living in it, a combi may very well not be suitable for your needs.
Ive a regualr boiler in a 4 bed house with separate bathroom, shower and 4 sinks. 4 out of 6 local central heating companies wanted to fit a combi in place of the regular boiler and wouldnt quote when I told them I didnt want a combi thank you very much.
Happy new year.
Fantastic video thanks for all the effort in making these videos. 👍👍👍🇬🇧
Happy new year
10 out of 10 as always mate,please keep up with those quality videos. Can't wait for the next one.Happy new year to you.Thank you
Happy new year 👍🏻
Happy New Year Tom,
Good overview of what’s currently required. I’ve moved away from complete installs but when balancing I find a Thermal imaging camera saves a bit of time.
Happy new year
Happy new year Tom I love watching your videos I learn a lot Thank you
Happy new year to you too 👍🏻
Please can you tell me any link to see how to calculate a radiators Thanks
Thanks Derek great video 👍
Brilliant video
Excellent information
Ironic when the basics such as preventing the condensation pipe freezing isn't covered by many fitters.
Hi Tom. I have been following your channel for some time now and you have some excellent content.
I have been retired from a ESP company for 15 years now and I remember well the battles I had with installers regarding meter inlet pressures.
I am not sure you were correct when you say the ESP will check the inlet meter working pressure with the boiler on High fire/service/sweep/mode. Plus 50% second appliance.
As I read IGEM/G13 and I could be wrong🤔.
Section 6 .1 States. If the RGE is on site then the the pressures can be checked with the appliance commissioning mode.
Section 6. 6.2 If appliance has already been commissioned (suggesting that no RGE on site) the ESP will Check the working pressure with the appliance working at normal and/or HIGH OPERATING LOAD.
Normal load for new un-commissioned appliances would be set to working on Hot water demand to taps or heating demand.
APPENDIX 1.1 High operation load. Is the maximum operating load of the entire gas installation
It says the combo boiler will be maximum demand with all hot taps running and any other appliances at 50%
The esp guys have been told to turn all the hot taps on in the house but most houses don’t have the water flow rate to do that
Great video from you, the majority of very poor installs I have seen are part of the Eco Grant Scheme, it is as if, they run in, rip the old boiler out, throw the new one on the wall, then run a mile.
That's because any grant scheme is easy money for the cowboys and despite the grant money being quite a lot, I refuse to use any of these schemes and end up with a poor job.
Tom Happy New Year, I've got a couple of questions regarding the video
First is that you have installed automatic bypass on the combination boiler and I haven't seen any zones on it and I believe boiler has already installed a bypass,
Second one is power flushing and magna cleansing , I've always thought that power flushing comes together with the magna cleansing if the system is dirty to pickup all the debris from the system and the magna cleansing where you doing with the old boiler still connected or using the power flush machine?
I hope it's not confusing
Thank you
👍great video again , Thanks
ive set boilers up before only to find lack of circulation when the rads are tweaked down
WOW! I need a new boiler, but how can I trust a qualified contractor to do all of this. Was looking at one of the fixed price companies to do the job, but should I? Don't know anyone who can recommend someone.
Why didn’t you put the same makeand model boiler back in. Would of saved loads of time. Even if you had to cut valves in ect ,,,,
ty for upload as always. i didnt know about the igem changes did i miss it in gas safe magazine? or was it too much boring reading:P they need to up their game imo. maybe a .............simple breakdown every month on youtube? or another portal? i know i'd pay for that.
prv, bs used to tell us run to outside in copper? that changed? nice to see. as you said though run seperate if possible.
Do you think that combi boiler will work fine in Sweden? Now when the electricity is so expensiv. Super good video you are doing......
That’s why they are pushing heat pumps. No competition so they can push the prices up.
Great video that covers every possible test ! What tool are you using to test gas pressures? Seems the old u gauge has been replaced .
I use the Tpi sp620 digital manometer liked to my smart phone
Happy new year to you 🎊 looking forward to seeing another year of great content 😉
Thanks a all the best to you and yours have a great 2023 👍🏻
Hello, what tightness test guage you are used?
There are "cowboy" customers. Just as there are engineers. Unfortunately the price is their main concern. ("can you match joe blogs down the road?") I don't price up heating systems any more. For all the reasons highlighted in your video. Keep up the good work. I'm Retiring in March, after 50 years in the trade.
Good luck in retirement 👍🏻
@@tomkatgastraining thanks, keep up the good work. Training customers as well as trade. All the best.
what boiler have you fitted ?
I need a new boiler & underfloor heating installed……. Can you help
Once I had 13mbr, then I called cadent, they said it is ok the main gas pipe was under sized,, they would upgrade it when they have time, from my side no comment, so working 13 is ok!!
Thanks
Thank you 🙏
Are you working it to minus 1 degrees?
Hi tom , great video as usual 👍👍 . What flue gas analyser are you using ??
Tpi dc 710 and a bluelyzer
thought you couldn't run prv into plastic pipe?
ahh but what does that oversized rad impact on? its the same principle that heat pumps shouldnt be over or undersized right? the system is loosing efficency? i know im being pendantic. you would set your trv,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,some people dont. maybe you tweak that one down a little on flow and return temp?
Over sized rads waste energy because they continue to put out heat into the room even when the TRVs have closed. The room will then overheat costing money and wasting energy.
All these online firms are advertising a system cleanse! Crazy that they get away with it.
Powerflush and a magnet is king.
Even magnacleansing is just a dreamt up way to make it easier and faster for engineers but not as good.
Surely it would be better for the condense to be taken up higher. It looks dreadful , And hardly anyone I see takes the right sized condense through the wall
Happy New Year Tom! Excellent video as usual. I need to change my Baxi solo 3 pf (23 years old) for a much more efficient boiler. I wondered if you could give me some advice please. I am thinking of changing my regular system to an Ideal Combi Max 30. I have a 4 bed house with 1 bathroom. My wife and I mainly use the power shower which uses a 1.5 bar pump on the hot and cold and is nice and powerful. The Ideal Max supplies 12.5ltrs a minute of hot water. My Question is would this flow rate be as good as the current power shower. My mains cold water flow rate is 16 ltrs a minute. The mains pressure is 3.6 bar and 3.5 bar when another tap is opened. The shower is an Aqualisa Aquatique. My gas pipe is 22mm. I cannot find this information anywhere on the internet!
Thanks again for all your great content!
You won’t be able to run the power shower off a combi boiler. You will need to check the flow rate at your cold tap in the kitchen to see what you would get out of the combi
@@tomkatgastraining
Hi Tom Thank you for your reply. I understand I would have to take the pump out and link the pipes. My question is would I get a shower as good as the one I have if I have the combi installed. The mains water flow rate is 16 ltres a minute.
@@terrydavis9713 it’s the flow rate through the combi you need to look at and the flow through the new shower. If the flow is greater on the shower obviously you will only get what the combi gives you
What's the non-contact voltage stick you've got?
It’s just a cheap one from eBay
@@tomkatgastraining
thanks Derek, I'm getting one (or two)!
so after a day or 2's work fitting a new boiler and you test and find you have a working gas delta difference from the meter to the boiler of 1.5 - 2 mbr. are you telling me your going to condemn the new appliance and now tell them they have to spend a further £ 500 - £ 1000 as they need a new gas supply pipework. ? yer sure you do...
Hello Derek. Valuable video...but I was very disappointed in how little insight you gave to achieving the delta 20 between flow and return. Given that people have now cottoned onto low modulation rates and the need to condense then I would have thought this would have been one of the most important part of installing a combi boiler given that delta 20 is now virtually an industry standard. You make brief reference to it...but then just show testing a rad that only gives a drop of 9 degrees. Surely to achieve delta 20 at the boiler will require delta 20 at every radiator ?. My impression to date is that this delta 20 seems a bit of a Holy Grail..and probably is hardly ever achieved on most installations. I assume one would widen the delta gap by throttling the radiator outlets until the desired temp drop is achieved. (but at what effect on radiator output??)...and also by reducing the flow rate of the pump so that water at 70 degrees isnt just being forced straight through the bottom of the radiator. .Furthermore this delta 20 is surely only be achievable when air and room temps are low (mid winter) ..such that the heat can escape from the rads . The implication of this being that in the early and later heating seasons as air temps rise ..then the delta temps will drop away as heat isnt so readily esacping from the radiators. This implication here being that if you have a boiler flow temp set at 70 in deep winter ..to get a condensing return of 50 degrees ...then as the weather warms and radiators dont release their heat so easily...then the flow rate temps will rise again..and possibly begin to exceed the condensing temp of 52 degrees. The overall impression I have to date of this whole condensing /energy saving thing is that it is far from being as easily achieved and in reality is being oversold
Just wondering if you had weather comp' fitted, it would modulate the flow temp down accordingly. Thus, getting closer to the magic condensation temp.
👌👍❤️
More than 4mm on your probes
Obviously the industry is not being monitored properly. I often read about these so called Gas Engineers failing to do the job properly, so how can this keep going on? The industry is a shambles and I have no confidence in anyone to fit me a new boiler. How on earth is Jo public supposed to choose one that will do a proper thorough job? It's no wonder some people try DIY even for boiler installs.
The industry/gas safe, sets out the training requirements. When these are shockingly low, what do you expect? Competent engineers, after taking a fast track course? So long as you can answer multiple choice papers, you are OK.
Expensive gas work doesn’t always mean a good job!!
Correct but cheap is never a good job
@@tomkatgastraining good answer.
Whole industry is full of people whistling through their teeth to bump up the bill. Dentists are another one.
Great video 👍👍
But people wants excellent job for cheap price 🤷♂️
no normal customers are going to change the rads.
Sorry I can see now that the cleaning is completely different video done on different Boiler and magna cleansing done separately to the power flushing
Okay
Comical,
Majority of shoddy gas work I have seen was carried out by fast track engineers,
Which is the sector your in Derick,
Harsh reality but true,
Sorry mate don’t teach fast track courses