I might not build one, but would love to see it exist. The experiments on this channel are always full of little lessons I can apply to my own more mundane printing!
Wow! Amazing 🤩 you can truly pront 24/7 with a machine like this. I am super excited about this project! DO IT! I'd love to build one someday and see your progress as you go through designing a new one!
I don't usually comment, but this is exactly what I've been searching for! I've been keeping an eye on the vertigo 3d printer (former voronoff), but I'm still not sure if their project will be open source. I'd love to see, build and maybe even contribute to a project like yours!
Impressive! Keep working on this! Most of the shortcomings of the current design, you already addressed in the video. If you can truly take this automated corexy design and make as fast as a Voron, I'm sold!
So I was hungry and couldn't wait to get dinner...then I saw this video and delayed food until I could watch it! This is an awesome project, and I would LOVE to make one! Heck, I would also like to incorporate parts of it into another diy monstrosity I've been making for a while. I hope your project keeps moving forward and you get to release it publicly.
You kept this for so long, and it looks very interesting. i`m trilled to se that much similarities with the project that we are working on for more than 1 year. keep the good work and lets see what's next.
Keep the project going because there can never me enough innovation. For me the main aspects for a new version would be: - better space efficiency at a 180mm bed size. (Micron 180 for comparison) - keep the linear rods for cost efficiency - look at the Voroff design to maybe avoid complicated belts - heated and filtered chamber - open toolhead design so everybody can choose their own hotend + extruder combo (dragon burner like design) - 3D printed frame is interesting but it's annoying to have to reprint a frame piece for a simply modification. I advocate for aluminium extrusion, best case scenario is to reuse an existing frame kit for another printer you can get on aliexpress.
Amazing work, I have also used threaded rods to reenforce plastics in my designs. But i fuse the rod/bolt/screw into the parts. I put a cross onto one end so i can use a philips bit on a drill to drive it in to a hole slightly smaller, the heat generated both makes it easier to drive in after you start it and then locks it in. Both securing it and re-enforcing the two materials against each other. If i were to make the bed with automatic doors i would have made the actions mechanical. The bed could have a pin sticking out that when it reaches the bottom presses a switch witch then energizes both the bed to move and doors to swing open. The circuit could run on a timed relay so that it doesn't run forever. As for part clear checking.. idk, i just thought of this
I've never had a conveyor belt 3D printer but I've been interested in the concept. I think I'd keep the conveyor stationary and use a flying gantry coreXY system, but for the products that I print, it's generally sufficient to use a 300 x 300 mm bed and sequentially print as many parts as possible, and manually empty the print bed once a day. Before slicers supported sequential printing, I would slice the part every location I wanted to print it and I'd concatenate those files with custom G code to move to each successive part. Slant 3D has a simple solution for batch printing. Gabe designed the front of the print head with a little bulldozer blade. At the end of the print, the bed cools to release the part and G code moves the print head behind the part and pushes it off the build plate before printing the next part. The preferred method is determined by part geometry. For printing a lot of small parts, a continuous conveyor would work well. Advance the belt enough to make room for the next part and print. The front of the conveyor could be unheated so the parts naturally release. I generally prefer sequential printing to improve part quality, particularly for the TPU parts that we manufacture where stringing between parts would ruin part quality.
This would be very cool to see as a full release. You might also be able to sell hardware kits either on your own or with a partner that has logistics figured out. Could be a very cool printer for small businesses
I consider aluminum etrusions to be a "vitamin" at this point, just like screws, linear rods, leadscrews. etc. I understand there are certain advantages (and cool factor) to printing the frame, but given how inexpensive and ubiqutious aluminum extrusions have become, and the fact that a printed frame still requires other hardware to fasten it together, I don't see major incentives in avoiding aluminum extrusions for frame components (at least from a performance perspective). Not everything can be reprapped with FDM printing, and maybe not everything should.
I just don't see the reason to use aluminium extrusion for any bits that move as while not their intended use, linear rails and rods are both more than strong enough on their own. As for their use in construction, I reckon that the need to align things is a big detractor and would much rather large sheets of steel, laser cut or machined with some bracing. Sure it might be slightly more expensive but given what people spend on these enthusiast printers anyways, I see it as easily worth it vs all the needless assembling and adjusting.
@@BeefIngot My point regarding aluminum extrusions for the frame is that I consider them a "reprap vitamin", just like fasteners, linear rods, or other hardware, not that they are the best option for every use-case . They are off-the-shelf parts that have become common and inexpensive. In the early days of reprap, people used things like threaded rods for the frames, linear rods salvaged from inkjet printers/copiers because "vitamins" like aluminum extrusions and linear rods were not common and were expensive. Here, Albert is still using threaded rods and fasteners, so his printed frame still requires "vitamins". My point is, I don't think the incentives for using a printed frame (looks cool, can be printed, can be customized) that still requires other hardware outwiegh the modularity, rigidty, and strength oferred by what I consider to be standardized hardware at this point, or "vitamins" (aluminum extrusions). Laser cut/machined frames are obviously not standardized or off-the-shelf parts
8:30 For a printer made at home, I don't give a crap about seeing the fasteners. Would making them visible make the frame stronger and the assembly easier? Then I would much prefer that. This is a made at home printer. You can put easily removable printed caps or covers over socket head cap screw counterbores where the hardware would be. Make it super strong, easy and rigid. Also, would a 220x220 or a 245x245 build volume for printing the printer make it so that it could be printed in less pieces? A standard ender 3 style build volume is more common and it is most likely what most people would be printing the pieces for this printer on. make the frame around that design instead of the A1mini. :) Keep up the great work.
I think you should consider to Work together with Matt use the t250 as a Base an Implement the bed and Doors from your build. This might be an awesome Combination
Cool project! I would be interested in build plate with a roller that can be added to e.g a Bambu A1 or A1 mini. In this way you would just focus on fhe build plate and not having to worry about the 3d printer. It would also be cheaper to develop.
Since the 247's goal is to print continuously, I would suggest having space inside of the enclosure to keep the roll of filament. First, it would keep the filament in an dryer place than outside the enclosure. Second, it would preheat the filament so the printing head wouldn't need to dump as much heat in it and the use of the heat from the enclosure would be free, so more efficiency and a maybe a more even melting so maybe allowing to push the speed higher. And third it would increase the thermal mass of the printer and reduce the temperature swing from when the doors open. Since the electronics are making some heat and probably wouldn't mind being kept at even 70C, dump the heat inside of the enclosure, it's free heating and if you you allows for routing the cables from the side you can also allow for the printer to be right against a wall without fear of blocking ventilation. For the style of the frame, I really think the vertical seams are ugly maybe have cover cover plates that can snap in place to add a gribble look Also for the fastening methods and structural integrity of the frame. Have you thought about pouring concrete inside of the printed parts like Chris Borge did on his projects ? You already have a rebar/pre-tensioner adding some concrete (from portland cement or epoxy) is the logical next step. It would add a lot of rigidity thanks to the tensioning bars pulling the concrete together, and it would add some sound/vibration deadening.
You definitely SHOULD, this would be a printer I would invest my time into building for my store to streamline the time between orders received and printing the parts needed for assembly.
I like the idea overall! But it definitely needs a more ridged bed and most likely aluminum extrusions in the frame parts to get decent stiffness. Higher voltage and aircooling for the motors is a must have. Style wise I can't stand the big gaps between the printed frame parts, but it's overall shape is nice! And since it's a machine for mass production with its belt bed and automatic doors (great idea btw) it should have a quick way of swapping filaments. Like 2 would be enough for color markings or support. But that will overcomplicate it most likely :\
I almost think designing with constraints makes the project more streamlined and beautiful. It almost comes out as a piece of functional art designed for your specifications
Brilliant! I would be interested in building one. I love the doors! Have you thought about talking with the voron team, maybe it could be incorporated, then there will be a lot of support. Thanks for sharing.
I see the main adavantage in your printer in the belt mechanism. If you can get it right it would be great to see it as a voron belt mod, or if you manage to get rid of the current weaknesses of your current printer as a new version of the 247. Keep it up :)
I "would" like to see you look into and integrate the injet cartridge mod that tech tips just showcased, it will make your project really stand out as conveyor belts are a niche market for farms that the average hobbyist does not care about.
Giving the constructive criticism you requested: Personally the frame gives off an appearance that doesn't look rigid. Namely, the beams forming each edge of the printer are split into multiple parts. I'm not sure how you would easily fix this given your requirement that it must be able to print parts for itself. But maybe more parts with more seams is the answer??? At the very least, I recommend getting rid of 180 and 90 degree seams. I.E. Do seams that interlock with each other. This way bending loads have a more difficult winding path. Further "beefing" up the edges would be good for rigidity. Make each edge-beam a large triangular cross sectioned tube. (Mostly hollow with thick perimeters.) Maybe 50mm across the shorter lengths? Essentially, scale up the outside dimensions of a 20x20 extrusion up by what ever factor the weakest link in the 3D printed assembly would be. For example: 6061 aluminum has a ultimate tensile strength around 290 MPa and PLA+ might achieve around 58 MPa. Keeping the same 3.2mm wall thickness you would have to scale the beam up by (290/58=) 5 times. 100x100 might be a bit large for each edge-beam of the frame so you could do 50x50 with somewhere around 8mm thick walls. Or keep the 100x100 size and thicken the walls to get insane strength and rigidity for 3D printed parts. ;) Also, as a mechanic, I prefer maintenance friendliness 10/10 times over seamless appearance. Besides, slots and holes with flush mounted socket cap screws look sexy! For inspiration, here is a link to a 3D printed design with amazing aesthetics: www.printables.com/model/537888-mmu3-ultimulti-printable-parts Lastly, I think what Prusa has done with their newly released CORE One design makes a lot of sense. Specifically the enclosure being very close to the printbed and the print bed being lifted on all 4 corners. Or like a Voron 2.4. I think you should make an improved version and I wish you the best!
You should definitely continue this project it could become something like a maker version of prusas AFS system. I have a suggestion for a future upgrade: a filament splicer / MMU upgrade so it can truly run 24/7 at those higher speeds by automatically switching to a new spool once the filament runs out.
Awesome video and even cooler machine! You could print the frame much larger pieces on the V-Core 4 500 and eliminate the need for so many joints. Looking forward for a first public release, would rhis be an open source project?
I did some patent research a while ago and as far is I could find, the automated build platform by makerbot (now bought by stratasis) was not filed outside the US (anyone who knows better: please correct me .... Patent research is not my strong side). Im pretty exited about building a conveyer system, like you have myself. I even thought about buying a IR3V2 just for the powder coated PEI stainless steel belt. So further development into the carbon fiber belt system and a release would be greatly appreciated. But Im not so sure about the fully 3d printed frame. Even with fancy and expensive PPA-CF you dont even get a senventh of the stiffness of aluminum. And to a way higher price. Im sure you can make a great looking machine with black anodized aluminum extrusions screwed together invisibly from the inside of some big printed angle brackets from PPA-CF. Getting a lasercut Stainless steel sheet for the core XY frame would also not be that expensive. Guestimating from my last order about as mutch as half a kg of PPA-CF (in Germany). So ... Please make a released version especially from the build platform, but Im afraid you will significantly limit your performance, when going with the fully printed frame.
pretty cool project. suggestion do away with the ramp and rotate the doors from vertically to horizontally and use the lower door as the ramp. a bigger build volume would be nice looks like there is a lot of wasted space.
Awesome project, truly exceptional. Can you print the frame lengths in one go rather than 3 using the belt to print long sections? Perhaps a longer printable belt platform would help - just long enough for the frame length plus some extra. An automated printer has one huge bottleneck- the measly roll of filament. If you seek unattended printing you either need to use a massive roll so few filment changes or a cms with rolls of the same filament or even better, use pellets with a huge hopper.
I’d like to see how the Input Shaper graphs look with Klipper and then decide what could/should be improved. 😁 A suitable hotend is already in planning.😉
The issue i think people will struggle with it's keeping parts flat unless it's made from all pla. When they go to assemble it with a bunch of parts that are warped the frame will not be good. I think it helps that there are a bunch of small parts, but that presents challenges too. I've printed an enclosure from petg and it took 4 rolls of scrapped parts and redesign before i could get parts that were flat enough. I think it's hard to justify vs. some extrusions, but the advantage is that the user can make it. However there are hundreds of ways for the user to screw up the parts vs. buying extrusions, and not everyone has another printer to make the parts. This does not take away from your design, it's just thoughts i have.
i would l love to see this continued this is so fascinating i would definitely get one if you ever sell one or build one if you release a build guide either way this is a great printer
I always think "What feature could make for the subsequent generation of printers?" Heated Bed, Steel Sheets, Filament Runout Sensor, Automated Bed Leveling, Nose-cell Bed Leveling, Endless Print Surface, IDEX, Core-XY, Multicolor, Toolchangers, have all been incorporated into market products. Maybe automated doors is *The* *Next* *Big* *Thing* ?
It's a great project. The symmetry is aesthetic, but with an asymmetric tool head it seems like the bed is undersized on the right, or the linear axis too long. It would also be interesting to weigh the advantages of laser cut acrylic windows adding structural support or alignment to the frame rather than only insulation. Similar logic, printing expensive filament parts negates advantages over an aluminium extrusion, also widely available cut to size.
Would be nice if you adapt the belt bed system to a voron zero, for those who dont mind a small bed area but want to print faster than the 247’s fully printed frame and round rods would allow
@@247printing in general I like the shape of it and all the clear panels. Obviously still a prototype but I think the potential is there and you should keep working on it.
Servus. Cooles Projekt. Die automatik Türen finde ich irgendwie total cool. Das da noch keiner drauf gekommen ist. Und seih es nur per auf/zu Button am Panel.
Really cool project! This occupies such an interesting niche, I think it could be very interesting for some even professional applications. One criticism that I have is, that the printer seems very large compared to the build volume. Even if the goal is increasing the build space to 180x180, it would be great if the footprint could be reduced nevertheless.
If you want a stiff printed frame, it's hard to beat PLA. Yes, it poorly handles high temperatures, but it's VERY stiff among thermoplastics. PET has a close stiffness too
Like others have mentioned using aluminum for the frame is probably better. I was thinking of doing something similar to an SOVOL SV08. Unfurtunatly I do not have the time in the moment. The fixed base and flying gantry should make this relatively straight forward. As a bonus selling upgrade kits for voron 2.4 designs gives you a large market off the bat. You could even call it the 2.4 to 24.7 upgrade.
A frame printed out of PPA-CF would almost certainly be more expensive than a metal frame, right? I also don't think you'll be able to achieve the same print quality at speed as the bambu printers either, because a plastic frame isn't stiff enough. I like the conveyor bed so maybe it would be interesting to replace the bed of a bambu p1p to make it fully automated.
Theres a lot of good ideas, but in the spirit of the brutal honesty requested, the biggest problem I see, is one of the requirements; that it must be 3d printed. This results in a frame that isn't that rigid or precise, looks very throw together and limits your creativity. I feel as if the use of now more commonly accessible methods such as laser cut steel plate and even some cnc parts from services that are more accessible and affordable than ever could both make this look significantly sharper while offering you more freedom in design, precision, temperature resistance and potentially even allowing for more build area per the outer area. I even imagine that with some nice larger scale resin prints you could have injection mold quality parts for the interfaces. I have another thought about the idea of the belt. I personally don't see much reason to have a complete belt. I imagine a system that had a belt or simply highly flexible plate double the length of the build volume would be enough to eject any possible print as there is no need to have a continuous belt for a printer that has a 90 degree printing angle. Witb this change to the bed I think you could really enhance the build volume and simplify the bed, allowing for a wider range of materials, larger bed and less complexity as you could even just have a flat bed and use lead screws or some other simple but powerful mechanism to remove prints 9nce the bed is cool. As for the toolhead, I think a reliable nozzle based system that gets the nozzle clean every time is important, and I reckon for ease of use and repairability, using a linear rail rather than rod specifically for the x beam would greatly help and allow you to modify things without needing to undo so much. As a final though I really have thought that I've for a while thought that H bot printers really have excellent properties in terms of simplicity and high speed and have the one great big flaw of skew in the motion system. I reckon that by using for example 2 wide carriages on a linear rail, and cnc parts, the rigidity gained could allow for the negative to be removed letting the benefits of Hbot such as enhanced space efficiency and simpler routing and repair shine through. Overall I find this project very interesting and would love to see it go further.
The combination of twisting the wires, magnet at the end of the wire and that alu foil improved it, yes. But it’s still unreliable and it can fail at some point.
For the panels i would go with almost no frame simply having the side with the hinge having the printed part and these are only mounted at the side of the panel with glue.
My ears🫠 the music in the beginning was way too loud But great video as always! Guten Rutsch❤ Ps: This video is an addition to "Tell me you're a professional engineer without saying it."😂🫰🏻
Let me preface this by saying I think that this is really cool and and would love to see it developed further and sold as a kit. My concern with this project is that the belt bed is still patented with the patent not expiring until 2030 according to google patents. My fear is that because of the patent people who build one could get sued by Stratasys who now owns Makerbot. Here in the USA to my knowledge we don't have any exemptions to be able to make a patented object for personal use.
Very nice project! Will this project become open source ? Edit: nevermind, I commented a bit bofre the end of the video. Well, I hope other people will be as excited as I am, because it would be so nice to be able to make one!
The concept is cool, but the printer is full or crazy systems. IMO we don't need yet another DIY printer platform for this, but it would be more useful to work on the ejection system specifically as a bolt in mod for existing printers like the trident that people already have.
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Imagine combining a THE100 with a 247 making it "THE24700"
You should ABSOLUTELY keep this project going and get it to a full release version, I'd love to build one!
Absolutely agree!! I am totally flashed 🤩
100% I would almost prefer to build this over a Voron
I might not build one, but would love to see it exist. The experiments on this channel are always full of little lessons I can apply to my own more mundane printing!
Hey Jeff, thanks for the goosebumps you just created for me! And thanks for commenting 😍
Albert, congratulations on this release!
Suddenly everything makes sense... You're truly 24/7 3d printing! #THE247
It's a good day when 247 drops a video
Definitely need a released version
I love that finally name voron 247 makes sense, because this printer can print 24/7
Wow! Amazing 🤩 you can truly pront 24/7 with a machine like this. I am super excited about this project! DO IT! I'd love to build one someday and see your progress as you go through designing a new one!
Great job Albert! I hope you move forward with the project!
AMAZING! love its mostly printed !!!! NICE !
Very cool! Good on you for reviving this concept for younger generation 👌
Thx Josef, nice to see you in the comments 🍻
@@247printing Happy holidays!
@@thejosefprusa You, too! Happy battery charging (hopefully!) :-)
I don't usually comment, but this is exactly what I've been searching for!
I've been keeping an eye on the vertigo 3d printer (former voronoff), but I'm still not sure if their project will be open source.
I'd love to see, build and maybe even contribute to a project like yours!
How much does the parts cost ? Oh and i think that this type of conveyor belt printing is much better than a CR-30.
Back then it was a guesstimated 500-600 bucks, without those cameras ☺️
Impressive! Keep working on this! Most of the shortcomings of the current design, you already addressed in the video. If you can truly take this automated corexy design and make as fast as a Voron, I'm sold!
So I was hungry and couldn't wait to get dinner...then I saw this video and delayed food until I could watch it! This is an awesome project, and I would LOVE to make one! Heck, I would also like to incorporate parts of it into another diy monstrosity I've been making for a while. I hope your project keeps moving forward and you get to release it publicly.
You kept this for so long, and it looks very interesting. i`m trilled to se that much similarities with the project that we are working on for more than 1 year. keep the good work and lets see what's next.
Keep the project going because there can never me enough innovation.
For me the main aspects for a new version would be:
- better space efficiency at a 180mm bed size. (Micron 180 for comparison)
- keep the linear rods for cost efficiency
- look at the Voroff design to maybe avoid complicated belts
- heated and filtered chamber
- open toolhead design so everybody can choose their own hotend + extruder combo (dragon burner like design)
- 3D printed frame is interesting but it's annoying to have to reprint a frame piece for a simply modification.
I advocate for aluminium extrusion, best case scenario is to reuse an existing frame kit for another printer you can get on aliexpress.
Amazing work, I have also used threaded rods to reenforce plastics in my designs. But i fuse the rod/bolt/screw into the parts. I put a cross onto one end so i can use a philips bit on a drill to drive it in to a hole slightly smaller, the heat generated both makes it easier to drive in after you start it and then locks it in. Both securing it and re-enforcing the two materials against each other.
If i were to make the bed with automatic doors i would have made the actions mechanical. The bed could have a pin sticking out that when it reaches the bottom presses a switch witch then energizes both the bed to move and doors to swing open. The circuit could run on a timed relay so that it doesn't run forever. As for part clear checking.. idk, i just thought of this
I've never had a conveyor belt 3D printer but I've been interested in the concept. I think I'd keep the conveyor stationary and use a flying gantry coreXY system, but for the products that I print, it's generally sufficient to use a 300 x 300 mm bed and sequentially print as many parts as possible, and manually empty the print bed once a day. Before slicers supported sequential printing, I would slice the part every location I wanted to print it and I'd concatenate those files with custom G code to move to each successive part.
Slant 3D has a simple solution for batch printing. Gabe designed the front of the print head with a little bulldozer blade. At the end of the print, the bed cools to release the part and G code moves the print head behind the part and pushes it off the build plate before printing the next part.
The preferred method is determined by part geometry. For printing a lot of small parts, a continuous conveyor would work well. Advance the belt enough to make room for the next part and print. The front of the conveyor could be unheated so the parts naturally release. I generally prefer sequential printing to improve part quality, particularly for the TPU parts that we manufacture where stringing between parts would ruin part quality.
You need to get LDO Jason’s attention. This would make a killer kit for LDO.
Your projects are truly pushing the limits of 3d printing, love to see it
This would be very cool to see as a full release. You might also be able to sell hardware kits either on your own or with a partner that has logistics figured out. Could be a very cool printer for small businesses
Me being brutally honest:
Pls release this project build to the public with idiot's guide style of build videos. 😢
It's gor-jas! 🥰
Finally a real (fully) printed 3d printer 🎉🎉🎉 love the idea and concept!!
I really love this. I would even love to build one even as is and modify it as I go.
I consider aluminum etrusions to be a "vitamin" at this point, just like screws, linear rods, leadscrews. etc. I understand there are certain advantages (and cool factor) to printing the frame, but given how inexpensive and ubiqutious aluminum extrusions have become, and the fact that a printed frame still requires other hardware to fasten it together, I don't see major incentives in avoiding aluminum extrusions for frame components (at least from a performance perspective). Not everything can be reprapped with FDM printing, and maybe not everything should.
I just don't see the reason to use aluminium extrusion for any bits that move as while not their intended use, linear rails and rods are both more than strong enough on their own.
As for their use in construction, I reckon that the need to align things is a big detractor and would much rather large sheets of steel, laser cut or machined with some bracing. Sure it might be slightly more expensive but given what people spend on these enthusiast printers anyways, I see it as easily worth it vs all the needless assembling and adjusting.
@@BeefIngot My point regarding aluminum extrusions for the frame is that I consider them a "reprap vitamin", just like fasteners, linear rods, or other hardware, not that they are the best option for every use-case . They are off-the-shelf parts that have become common and inexpensive. In the early days of reprap, people used things like threaded rods for the frames, linear rods salvaged from inkjet printers/copiers because "vitamins" like aluminum extrusions and linear rods were not common and were expensive. Here, Albert is still using threaded rods and fasteners, so his printed frame still requires "vitamins". My point is, I don't think the incentives for using a printed frame (looks cool, can be printed, can be customized) that still requires other hardware outwiegh the modularity, rigidty, and strength oferred by what I consider to be standardized hardware at this point, or "vitamins" (aluminum extrusions). Laser cut/machined frames are obviously not standardized or off-the-shelf parts
For getting light weight prints off the slope you could probably use the fans on the head and just change their directions to blow it off
🎉 @247printing frame with out any fastener visible is great! I would love to see you keep going with the project!
I need one in my workshop! I love your project from the very first time ❤
You are a great designer! Good premise and execution, as well as a good path for the future improvements. Inspiring stuff 😊
I was with your partner on the lighting until you showed all the functions. Especially the progress bar. That's brilliant!
I say keep working at it! It looks like you have incorporated a lot of very cool features and if nothing else i am sure others could learn from them!
24/7 is the holy grail of 3d printing
Hi Albert, Great job on the project! Keep up the great work!
Awesome.
YOU are awesome 😍
8:30 For a printer made at home, I don't give a crap about seeing the fasteners. Would making them visible make the frame stronger and the assembly easier? Then I would much prefer that. This is a made at home printer. You can put easily removable printed caps or covers over socket head cap screw counterbores where the hardware would be. Make it super strong, easy and rigid. Also, would a 220x220 or a 245x245 build volume for printing the printer make it so that it could be printed in less pieces? A standard ender 3 style build volume is more common and it is most likely what most people would be printing the pieces for this printer on. make the frame around that design instead of the A1mini. :) Keep up the great work.
great to see you back again!
I think you should consider to Work together with Matt use the t250 as a Base an Implement the bed and Doors from your build. This might be an awesome Combination
Ugh the T100 is mediocre, the T235 won't be much better. Any half decent Ender 3 mods (under 200usd+printer total) are faster than a T100.
I really love the idea of the belt bed. 100% want to see a full released version
amazing, I look forward to seeing what you do next 👌
Cool project!
I would be interested in build plate with a roller that can be added to e.g a Bambu A1 or A1 mini.
In this way you would just focus on fhe build plate and not having to worry about the 3d printer. It would also be cheaper to develop.
Since the 247's goal is to print continuously, I would suggest having space inside of the enclosure to keep the roll of filament.
First, it would keep the filament in an dryer place than outside the enclosure.
Second, it would preheat the filament so the printing head wouldn't need to dump as much heat in it and the use of the heat from the enclosure would be free, so more efficiency and a maybe a more even melting so maybe allowing to push the speed higher.
And third it would increase the thermal mass of the printer and reduce the temperature swing from when the doors open.
Since the electronics are making some heat and probably wouldn't mind being kept at even 70C, dump the heat inside of the enclosure, it's free heating and if you you allows for routing the cables from the side you can also allow for the printer to be right against a wall without fear of blocking ventilation.
For the style of the frame, I really think the vertical seams are ugly maybe have cover cover plates that can snap in place to add a gribble look
Also for the fastening methods and structural integrity of the frame. Have you thought about pouring concrete inside of the printed parts like Chris Borge did on his projects ? You already have a rebar/pre-tensioner adding some concrete (from portland cement or epoxy) is the logical next step. It would add a lot of rigidity thanks to the tensioning bars pulling the concrete together, and it would add some sound/vibration deadening.
I am very interested in THE247!
Very nice desigh Albert! Really love the doors too!
You definitely SHOULD, this would be a printer I would invest my time into building for my store to streamline the time between orders received and printing the parts needed for assembly.
I like the idea overall!
But it definitely needs a more ridged bed and most likely aluminum extrusions in the frame parts to get decent stiffness. Higher voltage and aircooling for the motors is a must have.
Style wise I can't stand the big gaps between the printed frame parts, but it's overall shape is nice! And since it's a machine for mass production with its belt bed and automatic doors (great idea btw) it should have a quick way of swapping filaments. Like 2 would be enough for color markings or support. But that will overcomplicate it most likely :\
That conveyor bed is such a nicer solution for farms than cooling the bed down and pushing parts of
I 'would' love to see the 247 developed further! What an awesome "old" printer.
I almost think designing with constraints makes the project more streamlined and beautiful. It almost comes out as a piece of functional art designed for your specifications
Automatic doors... I feel like such a barbarian with my P1S now.
Great video as always, nicely done!!
Amazing man 😊keep going with this !
Brilliant! I would be interested in building one. I love the doors! Have you thought about talking with the voron team, maybe it could be incorporated, then there will be a lot of support. Thanks for sharing.
This has so much potential! If you opensource the design and make the frame use aluminium extrusions it would be an amazing work 3d printer
Would love to see a series of you doing some of the upgrades you mentioned
I see the main adavantage in your printer in the belt mechanism. If you can get it right it would be great to see it as a voron belt mod, or if you manage to get rid of the current weaknesses of your current printer as a new version of the 247. Keep it up :)
I "would" like to see you look into and integrate the injet cartridge mod that tech tips just showcased, it will make your project really stand out as conveyor belts are a niche market for farms that the average hobbyist does not care about.
Giving the constructive criticism you requested:
Personally the frame gives off an appearance that doesn't look rigid. Namely, the beams forming each edge of the printer are split into multiple parts. I'm not sure how you would easily fix this given your requirement that it must be able to print parts for itself. But maybe more parts with more seams is the answer??? At the very least, I recommend getting rid of 180 and 90 degree seams. I.E. Do seams that interlock with each other. This way bending loads have a more difficult winding path.
Further "beefing" up the edges would be good for rigidity. Make each edge-beam a large triangular cross sectioned tube. (Mostly hollow with thick perimeters.) Maybe 50mm across the shorter lengths? Essentially, scale up the outside dimensions of a 20x20 extrusion up by what ever factor the weakest link in the 3D printed assembly would be. For example: 6061 aluminum has a ultimate tensile strength around 290 MPa and PLA+ might achieve around 58 MPa. Keeping the same 3.2mm wall thickness you would have to scale the beam up by (290/58=) 5 times. 100x100 might be a bit large for each edge-beam of the frame so you could do 50x50 with somewhere around 8mm thick walls. Or keep the 100x100 size and thicken the walls to get insane strength and rigidity for 3D printed parts. ;)
Also, as a mechanic, I prefer maintenance friendliness 10/10 times over seamless appearance. Besides, slots and holes with flush mounted socket cap screws look sexy! For inspiration, here is a link to a 3D printed design with amazing aesthetics: www.printables.com/model/537888-mmu3-ultimulti-printable-parts
Lastly, I think what Prusa has done with their newly released CORE One design makes a lot of sense. Specifically the enclosure being very close to the printbed and the print bed being lifted on all 4 corners. Or like a Voron 2.4.
I think you should make an improved version and I wish you the best!
Waiting for V3! Can't wait to see those Klipper speeds and acceleration!
You should definitely continue this project it could become something like a maker version of prusas AFS system.
I have a suggestion for a future upgrade: a filament splicer / MMU upgrade so it can truly run 24/7 at those higher speeds by automatically switching to a new spool once the filament runs out.
Awesome video and even cooler machine! You could print the frame much larger pieces on the V-Core 4 500 and eliminate the need for so many joints. Looking forward for a first public release, would rhis be an open source project?
I did some patent research a while ago and as far is I could find, the automated build platform by makerbot (now bought by stratasis) was not filed outside the US (anyone who knows better: please correct me .... Patent research is not my strong side). Im pretty exited about building a conveyer system, like you have myself. I even thought about buying a IR3V2 just for the powder coated PEI stainless steel belt. So further development into the carbon fiber belt system and a release would be greatly appreciated. But Im not so sure about the fully 3d printed frame. Even with fancy and expensive PPA-CF you dont even get a senventh of the stiffness of aluminum. And to a way higher price. Im sure you can make a great looking machine with black anodized aluminum extrusions screwed together invisibly from the inside of some big printed angle brackets from PPA-CF. Getting a lasercut Stainless steel sheet for the core XY frame would also not be that expensive. Guestimating from my last order about as mutch as half a kg of PPA-CF (in Germany). So ... Please make a released version especially from the build platform, but Im afraid you will significantly limit your performance, when going with the fully printed frame.
good work! One question do you have some issue with X axis input shape result (1e3)? if yes can explain the reason
its a joy to watch it spits out parts.. imagine metal parts and heated enclosure 😲
what gantry fods u use?,i have 13mm in my kingroon v2 230 and its very stable,it supriced me!
Awesome concept. Print farm expansion, if I had a print farm... LOL
pretty cool project. suggestion do away with the ramp and rotate the doors from vertically to horizontally and use the lower door as the ramp. a bigger build volume would be nice looks like there is a lot of wasted space.
Awesome project, truly exceptional. Can you print the frame lengths in one go rather than 3 using the belt to print long sections? Perhaps a longer printable belt platform would help - just long enough for the frame length plus some extra. An automated printer has one huge bottleneck- the measly roll of filament. If you seek unattended printing you either need to use a massive roll so few filment changes or a cms with rolls of the same filament or even better, use pellets with a huge hopper.
Hope this is as fast as the 24/7 Super V0
I’d like to see how the Input Shaper graphs look with Klipper and then decide what could/should be improved. 😁
A suitable hotend is already in planning.😉
@@n1_3d_print when’s that hotend finally reality 🤌?
@@247printing ask not me but i get soon some sampels i'll let you know :D
The issue i think people will struggle with it's keeping parts flat unless it's made from all pla. When they go to assemble it with a bunch of parts that are warped the frame will not be good.
I think it helps that there are a bunch of small parts, but that presents challenges too. I've printed an enclosure from petg and it took 4 rolls of scrapped parts and redesign before i could get parts that were flat enough.
I think it's hard to justify vs. some extrusions, but the advantage is that the user can make it. However there are hundreds of ways for the user to screw up the parts vs. buying extrusions, and not everyone has another printer to make the parts.
This does not take away from your design, it's just thoughts i have.
i would l love to see this continued this is so fascinating i would definitely get one if you ever sell one or build one if you release a build guide either way this is a great printer
Make a kickstarter project.
I always think "What feature could make for the subsequent generation of printers?"
Heated Bed, Steel Sheets, Filament Runout Sensor, Automated Bed Leveling, Nose-cell Bed Leveling, Endless Print Surface, IDEX, Core-XY, Multicolor, Toolchangers, have all been incorporated into market products.
Maybe automated doors is *The* *Next* *Big* *Thing* ?
It's a great project. The symmetry is aesthetic, but with an asymmetric tool head it seems like the bed is undersized on the right, or the linear axis too long. It would also be interesting to weigh the advantages of laser cut acrylic windows adding structural support or alignment to the frame rather than only insulation. Similar logic, printing expensive filament parts negates advantages over an aluminium extrusion, also widely available cut to size.
Would be nice if you adapt the belt bed system to a voron zero, for those who dont mind a small bed area but want to print faster than the 247’s fully printed frame and round rods would allow
I do think it's a good looking printer with the exception of the very prominent seams in the middle of each crossbar.
I double that!
@@247printing in general I like the shape of it and all the clear panels. Obviously still a prototype but I think the potential is there and you should keep working on it.
Servus. Cooles Projekt. Die automatik Türen finde ich irgendwie total cool. Das da noch keiner drauf gekommen ist. Und seih es nur per auf/zu Button am Panel.
No visible fasteners look indeed cool!
Hmm i do wonder if one could do the frame in a way that clicks in with some sort of lock for a dove tail.
Really cool project!
This occupies such an interesting niche, I think it could be very interesting for some even professional applications.
One criticism that I have is, that the printer seems very large compared to the build volume. Even if the goal is increasing the build space to 180x180, it would be great if the footprint could be reduced nevertheless.
If you want a stiff printed frame, it's hard to beat PLA. Yes, it poorly handles high temperatures, but it's VERY stiff among thermoplastics. PET has a close stiffness too
Like others have mentioned using aluminum for the frame is probably better. I was thinking of doing something similar to an SOVOL SV08. Unfurtunatly I do not have the time in the moment. The fixed base and flying gantry should make this relatively straight forward. As a bonus selling upgrade kits for voron 2.4 designs gives you a large market off the bat. You could even call it the 2.4 to 24.7 upgrade.
Bravo, good work.
A frame printed out of PPA-CF would almost certainly be more expensive than a metal frame, right? I also don't think you'll be able to achieve the same print quality at speed as the bambu printers either, because a plastic frame isn't stiff enough. I like the conveyor bed so maybe it would be interesting to replace the bed of a bambu p1p to make it fully automated.
What are the specs of the attic spider?
Very nice design!!
Brilliant, please keep it up
Theres a lot of good ideas, but in the spirit of the brutal honesty requested, the biggest problem I see, is one of the requirements; that it must be 3d printed.
This results in a frame that isn't that rigid or precise, looks very throw together and limits your creativity.
I feel as if the use of now more commonly accessible methods such as laser cut steel plate and even some cnc parts from services that are more accessible and affordable than ever could both make this look significantly sharper while offering you more freedom in design, precision, temperature resistance and potentially even allowing for more build area per the outer area. I even imagine that with some nice larger scale resin prints you could have injection mold quality parts for the interfaces.
I have another thought about the idea of the belt. I personally don't see much reason to have a complete belt.
I imagine a system that had a belt or simply highly flexible plate double the length of the build volume would be enough to eject any possible print as there is no need to have a continuous belt for a printer that has a 90 degree printing angle.
Witb this change to the bed I think you could really enhance the build volume and simplify the bed, allowing for a wider range of materials, larger bed and less complexity as you could even just have a flat bed and use lead screws or some other simple but powerful mechanism to remove prints 9nce the bed is cool.
As for the toolhead, I think a reliable nozzle based system that gets the nozzle clean every time is important, and I reckon for ease of use and repairability, using a linear rail rather than rod specifically for the x beam would greatly help and allow you to modify things without needing to undo so much.
As a final though I really have thought that I've for a while thought that H bot printers really have excellent properties in terms of simplicity and high speed and have the one great big flaw of skew in the motion system. I reckon that by using for example 2 wide carriages on a linear rail, and cnc parts, the rigidity gained could allow for the negative to be removed letting the benefits of Hbot such as enhanced space efficiency and simpler routing and repair shine through.
Overall I find this project very interesting and would love to see it go further.
I know the video isn't about that but, did that tin foil trick help with the bl-touch?
The combination of twisting the wires, magnet at the end of the wire and that alu foil improved it, yes. But it’s still unreliable and it can fail at some point.
there's a magnet at the end? didn't even see that. ^^
@@aracon9721 check out the clip of the electronics department
For the panels i would go with almost no frame simply having the side with the hinge having the printed part and these are only mounted at the side of the panel with glue.
My ears🫠 the music in the beginning was way too loud
But great video as always!
Guten Rutsch❤
Ps: This video is an addition to "Tell me you're a professional engineer without saying it."😂🫰🏻
Sorry und danke, dir auch 🎉
Oh man I would love to work on that belt system now that i am done with my further education!
Switch the Firmware to Klipper, but seeing this Maschine is awesome. Maybe i build one in the future
I'm in the 1st 30sec of the video and I need this printer!
Let me preface this by saying I think that this is really cool and and would love to see it developed further and sold as a kit. My concern with this project is that the belt bed is still patented with the patent not expiring until 2030 according to google patents. My fear is that because of the patent people who build one could get sued by Stratasys who now owns Makerbot. Here in the USA to my knowledge we don't have any exemptions to be able to make a patented object for personal use.
I would love if you did this project. I still need yo finish your 247Zero beta 2 but would definitely build this one yoo 💯
Very nice project!
Will this project become open source ?
Edit:
nevermind, I commented a bit bofre the end of the video.
Well, I hope other people will be as excited as I am, because it would be so nice to be able to make one!
That would've been awseome as a bambulab add on.
The concept is cool, but the printer is full or crazy systems. IMO we don't need yet another DIY printer platform for this, but it would be more useful to work on the ejection system specifically as a bolt in mod for existing printers like the trident that people already have.
bed slinger that pops off the entire print surface seems more practical.