A Disney Villains Retrospective Part 7: Brer Fox and Brer Bear
Вставка
- Опубліковано 8 січ 2021
- In this entry, we are looking at Brer Fox and Brer Bear from Song of the South, and their legacy beyond the film. From their animated appearances, to their many comic book escapades, to Splash Mountain, these two lovable rogues will never give up on trying to catch Brer Rabbit.
VIDEO SOURCES:
FANTASMIC FOOTAGE
• The Complete Fantasmic...
• Fantasmic Dec 10 1998
MICKEY MOUSE'S BIRTHDAY PARTY
• Mickey Mouse's Birthda...
THE MICKEY MOUSE REVUE
• ミッキーマウス・レビュー The Micke...
DISNEYLAND SPLASH MOUNTAIN
• [2020] Splash Mountain...
• (Night POV) Splash Mou...
WALT DISNEY WORLD SPLASH MOUNTAIN
• Splash Mountain Magic ...
• [4K] Splash Mountain F...
TOKYO DISNEY SPLASH MOUNTAIN
• [4K] Splash Mountain L...
MICKEY NO TOKYO DISNEYLAND DAIBOUKEN
• Mickey no Tokyo Disney...
KINECT DISNEYLAND ADVENTURES
• Disneyland Adventures ...
• Disneyland Adventures ...
WALT DISNEY WORLD QUEST MAGIC RACING ADVENTURE
• Walt Disney World Ques... - Фільми й анімація
Nick Stewart died in 2000 well after the Disney World version of Splash Mountain opened
Thank you for the correction. I hate to put misinformation in videos, and I've been working on double-checking all my sources and information, but clearly I need to work even harder on that.
@@ColinLooksBack Willie The Giant was originally voiced by Billy gilbert who also voiced Sneezy in Snow White.
@@ColinLooksBack where can I watch "the emerald cities version of brer rabbit"?
@@angelicadeleon8517 I found it on Dailymotion under "Brer Rabbit Tales." The description lists the company as Emerald Hill Productions.
www.dailymotion.com/video/x2ifdev
@@ColinLooksBack I've heard that Nick Stewart also did voicework for one of the crows in Dumbo? Out of curiosity did you come across anything in your research to verify that as well?
To this day James Baskett’s Honorary Oscar for Uncle Ramus officially makes him the first and only actor to win an Oscar for a voice acting performance as he voiced Brer Fox.
Also first black actor to win an oscar
Those guys are too likable to be forgotten.
I can agree
Agreed!
right!!
honestly I kinda wish they made the film be just the brer rabbit stories, yeah its origin is still kinda questionable and some of the racism still made it into those stories, but it would've been much less awkward than the sugar coated reconstruction period.
Agreed.
Never realized it before but Br'er Fox and Br'er Rabbit have almost a Joker/Batman dynamic to them-they're foes, but they kinda need each other!
I have always thought of Brer Fox as the Riddler, they are both very intelligent and do evil things to demonstrate their intellectual superiority over their rival.
i think their kind of more like tom and jerry
All of the positive portrayals of Br'er Bear by himself almost makes him feel like the Harley Quinn!
Great villains
It amazes me that two characters from such a controversial movie have managed to become such a staple of Disney. Here's hoping that the future is bright for them.
it would be interesting if they get there on show alongside the 3 little pigs and the wolf like in the comics, with other characters like little red riding hood and peter from peter and the wolf
@@detectivewobbuffet2778 Zeke Wolf, that is, though they call him Brer Wolf.
@@kevinlee7678 Zeke wolf and brer wolf are different characters
Actually something like that almost happened for The Disney Afternoon as one show was meant to be themed to Critter County.
Tbh I’m in my mid twenties and I’ve never heard of these characters. I would argue they are being forgotten to an extent. I’ve also never seen Song of the South either, though. I do like Zipadee Do Da, though.
James Baskett is technically the only actor to get an Oscar for a voice acting performance.
I can't help thinking James Baskett had more fun playing Br'er Fox than he did playing Uncle Remus.
Have you noticed that Foxes seem to be a neutral animal in Disney films as they can be either evil or bad like John FowlFollow from Pincochio , Brer Fox here or Foxy Loxy from Chicken Little or fully good like Robin Hood , Todd from Fox and the Hound or Nick Wilde from Zootopia
Good observation I didn’t even think of that.
The same could also be said of lions and bears.
Well in fairness in cases of Pinocchio and Chicken little, those evil foxes were in the original fairy tales/stories.
@@brandonlyon730 This also applies to non Disney works such as Bad : Farley Charlotte's Web 2 and Swiper Dora the Explora or Good: Girl Fox Skunk Fu and Boy Fox Franklin.
I was just thinking of when this episode would show up.
This is a cute movie, if anything. It deserves to be watched and released now just for context, rather than be erasing history. Especially since James Basket is simply wonderful.
It's a shame that the characters are kind of left on the side nowadays.
I know how to get around this.
Its kinda sad, sure its a rather ignorant period piece...but I feel its innocente ignorance of showing black and white childrening happily playing together, sitting down to hear old remuses story's, and how the characters moatly seem to have positive disposition and interactions with each other, feel like a overly optimistic look of what could have been a era of friendship and healing that sadly wasn't the case
honestly I think we have a better chance if we ditch the live action segments, they're ungodly boring shit and the white washed sugar coated real life setting is understandably unacceptable, the animated segments were by far the better parts of the film, and they wouldn't suffer the lack of live action segments, but I doubt that'll ever happen due to negative association.
seriously tho, I hate those live action segments, and I say this as someone who loves films without real confluct that are all about characters meandering around like Winnie the Pooh or my neighbor Totoro, but in this movie they're still really bad and boring.
@@maverickdarkrath4780 I dunno I think it's fair to not really commercialize that kind of thing anymore, I mean it's like if they made a similar thing about concentration camps in Nazi Germany.
@@maverickdarkrath4780 Not to mention publishing these ideas back then wasn't exactly something people would like you for
10:15 most likely due to the "George and Lenny" dynamic. One big guy who's strong but stupid, one small smart guy who's weak balance each other out. Classic dynamic.
Even Tex Avery himself knows this.
It may also had been due to Br'er Wolf being too vicious accriding to Wikipedia's description of the character. Plus, having 2 characters of similar species may not have worked artisticallly
I call it “Pate and Creighton” as a homage to Dark Souls 2.
Pate is smart but his fighting is limited to self-defense, while Creighton is fierce but incredibly stupid.
You know, I could probably imagine the trio kind of maybe being good material for characters and stuff in an Epic Mickey game, even if the series kind of was already dead and buried at this point.
I can probably even imagine a bit of clever dialogue kind of making a jab at how much Song or the South's reputation, essentially kind of caused them to arguably be unfairly shafted and left in obscurity, as a result.
Brer Fox and Brer Bear joining the heroes even though they are villains, that's what happens when you make your villains more cute and cuddly instead of creepy and menacing like the Big Bad Wolf for example.
Br'er Fox is legitimately my favorite Disney character and I hope that he, along with Br'er Rabbit and Br'er Bear, can somehow manage to stick around even if for something small. I feel better though, knowing that Splash Mountain will remain as is in Tokyo and they can still live strong over there. :)
Also the two hugging the guests in the Disneyland game is too cute!!
These characters need to come back.
Wow what an amazing showcase of my favorite characters! Brer Fox in particular! This is a really comprehensive catalogue of everything they have been in! Splash Mountain is the reason I go to Disneyland, because it's my favorite ride!
@@brerfox3694 yup
I dunno about that...
@@Combes_ honestly the brer rabbit segments were the least controversial part of the film, as well as the more entertaining by far, and even if it was written by a white guy profiting off black folklore it at least introduced their culture to others, without the sugar coated reconstruction period southern setting the film would be much less awkward and inappropriate from a cultural stand point, but alas they just had to have those boring shitty live action segments.
@@ginogatash4030 So you're unable to benefit off promoting other cutlures folklores? A. Isn't that unfair discrimination? and B. Wouldn't that be good for other cultures? C. How is not sugar coating history awkward or inappropriate?
Like seriously, only awkward because you don't want opposition from people that hold a prejudiced grudge against Song of the South because "oh history" god forbid if we have something historically accurate during a rough time period that has to do with race, sex, or religion.
Like literally, canceling all these "inappropriate" things having to do with different cultures literally kills all knowledge people can have from the spreading of that culture... it's quite ironic that these people that don't want "culturally inappropriate" things in the process also kills all spreading of that culture, killing the promotion of that culture, killing our knowledge of it.
If I could post it, I would, but it's a video of a Scottish dude speaking about how some people are anti - Americans or other nations celebrating Scottish culture etc when they aren't even from Scotland... but goes onto explaining how some of these Americans have a bigger claims to being Scottish than some of the people living in Scotland due to their heritage (family line). It's quite ironic how prejudiced people can be while also calling other people prejudiced or inappropriate by doing something.
Are we able to embrace promotion of culture nomatter who's promoting it? Or are we still discriminatory and prejudiced?
Thanks for pointing out that the vernacular in the Remus stories was meant to be an endeavor towards authenticity rather than mockery as many people think.
It's nothing short of a crime that these characters will be all but erased. I played Brer Bear at Disneyland and he's one of my faves. Thanks for this vid.
If you're trying to do a period piece, it's typically more respectful to get things as accurate as possible. It may offend some of our sensibilities later on, but it's worse to forget.
Finally, someone who gets it. I'm so tired of people saying the voices are intended to be a mockery of black Americans when they're not.
@@Skibidi-Doo-Dah Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery last I checked.
@@Skibidi-Doo-Dah...and the kicker is that the majority of people who offer commentary on this film haven't even seen it. Nor have they even bothered to read the Joel Chandler Harris book.
@@opinian1068 I agree, it's so infuriating when people don't bother to do some reading beforehand. I have the complete book and it's an incredibly interesting read.
In 2007 I took a Film History class, and our online homework assignments entailed answering multiple choice questions. One of those questions was "Which of these feature-length films was the first to blend animation with live-action?" Song of the South was the "correct" answer but I told my FH teacher that Three Caballeros technically qualifies since it came out two years before 1946's Song of the South. I don't recall if it was in the multiple choice questions, but my teacher just shrugged it off when I pointed that out to him. Side note: no, we did not watch Song of the South, but we did have to watch D.W. Griffith's The Birth of a Nation (1915), a film that makes Song of the South seem tame by comparison in terms of controversy and backlash. Not even joking on that one.
Funny thing is, the book that "Birth of a Nation" is based on actually condemns the Klan. Sorta like how the movie "M" condemns the Nazis, but the real Nazis liked the film seriously and didn't realize it was satire. Talk about missing the point...
it's a shame the Birth of a Nation is unavoidable in film history classes. It's incredibly slow paced and of course laughably racist, but because it was the first big break out film the put a bunch of techniques on full display it has to be shown!
Jazz Singer is another terrible one in both racism and writing but it was the first movie with sound so it has to be shown!
Bro, I have seen a few clips of song of the south and do not see what's racist about the movie at all. Some people said that the ex slaves apparently miss the old days of slavery? Like ok that is realy bad. But not sure where to find info about that. Birth of a nation is the most racist movie I have ever seen and it shows how some fictional movies can actualy affect people in real life. Even if its a racist person's fantasy. Find it even crazy how they got the KKK to promote the movie
@BigBoomer101 the thing at the core of Song of the South is a friendship between two characters of different races where an old black man acts as a surrogate father/best friend with a young white kid. Not to mention the other poor white kids actually LISTEN to Uncle Remus when he tells them to do something. I honestly don't see where people find that racist
I couldn’t agree more with hoping they don’t get phased out completely. Although the source material is problematic (even the original Uncle Remus stories), Disney’s takes on these characters are genuinely well done and charming to the point that it distances itself from it imo. It’d be a shame if the songs and characters aren’t used in some way or form in the future.
it would be interesting if they get there on show alongside the 3 little pigs and the wolf like in the comics, with other characters like little red riding hood and peter from peter and the wolf
@Philip Kippel Can’t tell if this is a joke or not but if it isn’t, it’s not a hoax and it is very much happening. Though I’ll take Splash Mountain as is over the retheme, I trust that imagineers will put together a replacement which holds a candle to the current version.
@@andrewcb9255 It's been 2 years since this supposed change is going to happen. I highly doubt it's happening at all anytime soon
"Song of the South" is the "forbidden fruit" in the Disney lexicon
“Song of the South” Pill, if you will.
Once you take it, you follow where the rabbit hole goes.
@@MatthewChenault Yeah, that Rabbit Hole that a fox and bear try to catch with.
@@SammySesame, it actually leads to George Fitzhugh.
After finding more media about these characters, I feel both Brer Bear and Brer Fox feel like Warner Brother characters in Disney clothing. Also I heard in production they would have thought of adapting more shorts from the source material. Glad you note that Brer Bear in the original myths wasn't as affiliated with Brer Fox. It just shows once again even in their lesser material Disney can still influence how they see a project. And in the comics, the Big Bad World is often seen with the Brer Gang because he's a good stand in for Brer Wolf and is even called that.
I really hope Disney never forgets these guys, because again they are rooted in long traditions of folklore that we shouldn't forget. And I admit I am kind of furry for Brer Fox.
I doubt they will do that. Even with what’s going on.
Furry?? Get a life
@@demonboy619 rude much
Br'er Fox is kinda hot lol
Are we not all at least a little bit Furry for Brer Fox?
You know ,the presence of animals as metaphors for humans,the rabbit as a the trickster ,arrongant but also easily fooled hero, really remind me of certain traditional african stories i once read. The " tar baby" trick is really the same,only in that case it was a hare rather than a rabbit. The slaves must have brought and adapted their folklore to the new fauna and land,and the passing of certain stories may be used to trace the geographical origin of a certain groups of slaves rather than other.
I think the song "Zip-a-dee-doo-dah" seems to live strong. We sang it in choir in public school (disney medley) and I hear it in many disney specials/events (instrumental and vocal numbers)
With the revamp, I dont know if the song will still be used by Disney.
It's already been removed in Disneyland unfortunately
@@screwmysisterleon that's upsetting. As much as I like Princess and the Frog, no song in the Disney canon is quite as purely joy filled as Zip a De Do da. You hear that, you're in a good mood.
@@screwmysisterleon wait what?
@@alpyki2588 it's replaced with the princess and the frog
You acknowledged this movie exists. Disney would like to know your location
A man who wishes to tell the stories of another does him the highest honor by telling his tales as he has told them.
I loved Splash Mountain as a kid. I went on that ride at least four times. These characters are truly endearing on a certain level. I too hope that they live on for a long time. You do a wonderful job with these retrospectives.
As a Finn, I know the Br'er characters from the Donald Duck comics, which have been part of our childhood since the 50's. Not only do these characters live in the same forest as the Big Bad wolf and the three pigs, that forest is canonically close to Duckburg, hence why Br'er Fox is sometimes seen stealing chickens from 'Ma Duck. Madam Mim lives there too nowadays.
Honestly, if not for the song 'How Do You Do' being on a Disney Sing Along Song home video I had as a kid, I would never have realised that Song of South even existed.
That was my initial exposure to these characters, myself.
Really, not "Zip A De Do Da"
@@ColinLooksBack Same here. As a matter of fact, those Sing Along videos were my gateways to many Disney movies.
I love Brer Fox. He's my favorite character from Song of the South, and I love his animation.
honestly kinda wish the animated segments were the whole movie, yeah there would be some controversy around the tar baby thing, but that's not even half as bad as the whole live action setting.
@@ginogatash4030 I would have said the same thing as a child if I would have known about Song of the South before I finally noticed the name of the film when I was 10 and I got to see it for the first time when I was 13. You reminded me of when I was very little.
Nick 'Nicodemus' Stewart later became known as Lightin, the dim-witted janitor, in the equally controversial Amos N' Andy 1950s series, which like Song of the South would eventually be banned from distribution for years. It should be noted, though, that Stewart used the funds from these projects to found the Ebony Showcase Theater, and the short-lived Ebony Showcase Presents series, which granted opportunities for black actors to do serious dramatic parts beyond playing servants. Among those who benefited included Eartha Kitt, Gladys Knight, John Amos, B. B. King, The Platters, Nichelle Nichols, and Isabel Sanford, just to name a few. Unfortunately, the Stewarts lost the title to the Showcase Theatre in 1992, and it was later demolished in 1998, which is pretty heartbreaking. But for what Stewart was able to accomplish is truly remarkable, given that it meant having to take roles he knew to be demeaning and which he knew his own community would criticize him for taking. For that sacrifice, he deserves to be remembered fondly
It's good to know that he took a situation that wasn't particularly fair, and gave a step up to others so that they could succeed. How often all of us forget these days, that we stand upon the shoulders of those that came before us. It's nice to learn about the individuals that allow us too.
Wow
Before you get to "The Adventures of Ichabod and Mr. Toad" villains, I just thought you would find it interesting to know that a comic starring Toad and friends titled "A Christmas Present for Mr. Toad" features Honest John, Gideon, and the Coachman, who plot to steal Santa's sleigh to use as an attraction on Pleasure Island.
I absolutely need this comic in my life, holy crap.
People have always said the Coachman looks like an evil Santa, so it figures he'd try to capitalize on that some day.
I so glad that you mentioned Tales of the Okefenokee,it's a very obscure ride for six flags history and you don't hear that ride often,still nice that you included the ride.
Before COPPA blocked the comments on a recording of the Disneyland Character Training VHS featuring the Brer characters, I wrote a comment on that video saying that it would be better if Disney+ made a mini series á la The Mini Adventures of Winnie the Pooh called "Splash Mountain Tales" (as most people know the Brer gang due to that ride), that would show the animated Song of the South segments excluding obviously the Tar Baby one. Disney nowadays, obviously, doesn't even want to mention the Brer gang again.
You mean... Only 2 segments?
The tar baby one can be edited or censored, maybe changing his name to "tar dummy" or "sticky man".
Not great loss there, as the live action segments are not only controversial but also boring as heck. The 3 characters can even get a reboot miniseries akin to "Legend of the Three Caballeros".
@@Alejandroigarabide A reboot obviously has bigger potential. Good idea!
@@elchanchopato9601 Well thanks! Have you seen Legend of the Three Caballeros? It not only revitalizes the iconic trio but also forgotten characters like Humpfrey the bear and the Aracuan bird.
@@Alejandroigarabide Well, I've only seen a few clips, but it really shows a lot of potential.
@@elchanchopato9601 You should check it out. Believe me: the clips are a small sample of its awesomeness.
There's condoning the negative/ignorance and then there's flat-out pretending it doesn't exist. You can acknowledge the downsides but that doesn't mean you condone it.
Warner Brothers warns (or used to) in the beginning of their cartoon collections that many of them are products of their time and while they don't condone the attitudes of those eras, it's a far bigger problem to pretend they never existed. You sanitize history that way and that's a very thin line to cross.
Agreed
Warnings are for wimps.
@@steakdriven and prior to warnings, a lot of people either received Darwin Awards or just made themselves out to stupid, ignorant, or both.
@@25Erix nobody ever won a darwin award by watching a movie. And you know God damn well I wasn't talking about that kind of warning.
The Brers appeared in the 2008 Tokyo Disneyland Parade Jubilation in the “Forest Friends” float alongside Winnie the Pooh, Tigger, Pocahontas, Meeko and The Spring Sprite.
23:08 Oh, me heart.. it can't hold against the overwhelming wholesomeness...! >.
One thing I really love about these characters is how, despite being for all intents and purposes basically people in animal bodies, they still kinda act like the animals they're supposed to be. Brer Bear being lumbering and mostly docile, but nonetheless a hulking force of nature you definitely don't want to be on the business end of; Brer Rabbit having a very casual hop rather than a typical walk and being kind of gullible (real foxes and stoats have been known to sometimes catch rabbits by doing a weird, spastic kind of leaping "performance(?)" that leaves the rabbits a bit too confused and transfixed to notice the predators steadily leaping closer til they catch 'em); and *especially* Brer Fox being really speedy in every aspect, and even his laugh kind of sounding like actual fox gekkering (even though I'm positive the laugh sounding like a real fox's was absolutely not on purpose).
I just really like my animal characters, no matter how anthro, to come with reminders that they are indeed animals is all 😁
Having recently tracked down the movie to judge for myself, the animated segments are indeed far and away the best part of it. I'm glad we got to have these characters for so long, even with their problematic source material, and I'm glad I got to ride Disneyland's Splash Mountain on my very first visit earlier this year. These guys are just too great 🥰
As for the movie itself, I know it probably won't happen anytime soon, but I do think it should be made publicly available because it's a movie very much worth talking about. Something we can learn from rather than something to bury. Besides, it was James Baskett's last movie before his untimely early death; _Song of the South_ as it is may have been a mistake, but James Baskett and the Brers were *not* mistakes.
Until now, I hadn't seen Br'er Fox's kid... And again, this might seem off-topic but gosh darn it if that isn't the most adorable little Disney character ever... lol
What I would like to see, if Disney ever acknowledges the original film, is a documentary ABOUT the controversy that includes the animated segments in their entirety. Accepting it in their "hall of shame" while celebrating the legacy of the stories and their impact on Disney merchandising and expanded materials.
They shouldn't be ignored or forgotten- and the poorly conceived film's live action sections can make a great lesson about stereotyping, sugar-coating history, and choosing their sources carefully.
Weird fun fact and the only reason I've ever seen any footage of Song of the South:
The Zip-A-Dee-Doo-Dah song sequence and the first animated section of Song of the South were featured alongside other Disney scenes and shorts as well as original live action footage in an hour-long TV broadcast that mainly functioned as a Coca-Cola ad in the 1950s, and this whole TV special was in the bonus features of a particular release of Alice in Wonderland on DVD that I happen to own a copy of. This is likely the only time any footage of Song of the South was released on American home media.
The funny thing about the “dialectic” controversy is that these dialects were true dialects. A notable example of this can be read in the 1882 publication of John Jasper’s “The Sun Do Move” sermon, which is written in a dialect not dissimilar to what we often view as “stereotypical.”
John Jasper was a pastor who, prior to the war and during the war, was a slave who lived in Richmond, Virginia that also happened to be literate and had become a pastor. During the war, he would often be called upon to conduct sermons for wounded troops - often a mix of Union and Confederate troops - at the city’s many hospitals (something that eventually led to the Confederate Government compensating him for his services). After the war, he’d go on to found a church for the freedmen of the city and would eventually draft a sermon dubbed “The Sun Do Move,” which was a sermon regarding the importance of faith through the usage of the flat-earth conceptualization.
In the 1882 print, you can notice the heavy usage of dialectic language; something that is transcribed directly from his sermon. The most notable aspect is the substitution of “was” and “were” for “war,” which suggests a stronger pronunciation of “r” and the dropping of softer vowels at the end of a sentence. In fact, the dropping of the last letter of sentences is something that is still common among the general southern population, both black and white.
So, instead of saying “We were coming to be with the Lord,” he would instead have said “We war comin’ to be whit de Lord.”
This is something we still see today within the general southern dialectic group. Dropping the last letter of a word is something commonplace within the southern dialect. The most common example of letter dropping is dropping the “g” in “ing,” which changes the pronunciation from “ee-n-ge” to “ee-n.” This softens the end of the word, which makes it easier to transition to the next while speeding up the sentence.
In other words, what you often read from the dialectics presented in older works isn’t made up to be derogatory. On the contrary, it’s closer to the reality of how people at that time and place spoke. The issue is it has been _made_ into a joke by the Northern playwrights of the time and, later, by northern elites seeking to project a negative stereotype of the average southerner as being ignorant, uncultured, and uneducated. Most important of all, this isn’t exclusively reserved for blacks either. Whites also spoke in similar dialectics, which we again see in some of the post-war material written by southerners (the lyrics to “I’m a Good Ol’ Rebel” work best when spoken with a southern dialect).
So, if anything, it’s more us projecting onto the past our own preconceived notions and biases rather than taking the time to honestly learn about the period in question and how things were not as they are now.
I think the issue is more the fact a white man profited off of black folklore when black authors couldn't do so themselves rather than the use of dialect itself, had racial relations been better no one would give a fuck as it would be like writing an English accent or something, but because there's no equality, especially back in the day, it feels like they're taking advantage and making fun of them, which was often pretty true, this author was better than most in that regard but even he didn't fully escape racial prejudice, which you can't blame him for too much since he lived in a time where no one would give you shit for having such ideas.
There’s definitely an element of the 3 stooges with them, obviously not the inspiration but something that could be mold around them, and that’s probably why they are more forgivable than the other villains
Wow what an amazing showcase of my favorite characters! Brer Fox in particular! This is a really comprehensive catalogue of everything they have been in! Splash Mountain is the reason I go to Disneyland, because it's my favorite ride!
Shoutout to the poor animators that had to sync up James Baskett’s vocal performance of Brer Fox. Hope they were paid well as that wouldn’t have been easy to do back then.
Now I know that uncle Phil was b'rer bear that makes me like splash mountain even more than I already do
I have watched this film and while it does have a rose-tinted view of a not rosy time, this kid with no father figure gains wisdom and laughter from the tales of an older African American gentleman. This man acts as a father figure when his own up and leaves and it is his storytelling that not only helps him learn to cope with life, but also rouses him from the bull induced coma at the end. A MOVIE FROM THE USA IN 1940'S SHOWED THE BLACK GUY AS A HERO AND AN AMAZING FATHER FIGURE! And I doubt, nay, I challenge the allegedly aware and supposedly talented writers to make a remake of this that can match this Academy Award winning actor's role as the hero period.
I wonder if Brer Rabbit was an inspiration for Bugs Bunny. Yes, I know Bugs Bunny's first appearance was before this film's release, I'm wondering if the original story's Brer Rabbit was an inspiration.
I am not sure the exact character inspired bugs but The trope of a rabbit with great wits and smarts is shared.
There are a lot of trickster rabbits in various mythologies and folklore, an example would be Central Africa's Kalulu
@@TinyToonStar Yeah but brer Rabbit was one of the earliest I suppose.
@@RobertEOSPEEDWAGON1 Not sure about that. But the odds of Bugs Bunny being inspired by Brer Rabbit are pretty slim. Otherwise, wouldn't it have just made sense to do a Brer Rabbit short? They probably needed another animal to the roster of other crazy animals that made up the Looney Tunes and they decided on a rabbit
@@TinyToonStar Fair but brer rabbit is kinda an old story so its gotta be somewhat early
Well. These are loveable characters and I think it's a bit unfair for them to be tied to all the controversy of song of the south.
Looking at them, putting aside everything else, they fit right in with Disney toons.
Poor guys.
Heaven forbid an author try to write an accent he had heard from people he became friends with. Oh the in-humanity of it.
I'll agree that the guy wasn't malicious in his intent, but it is still kinda shitty when you consider he's profiting off black folklore by publishing their stories while there's absolutely no chance that a publishing company, at least at the time, would let black people to do it and profit themselves from their own tales.
Better then their folklore being forgotten or not very well known, no?
@@crazyfire9470 it isn't all that well known outside for its association with the song of the south film tho.
@Gino Gatash so? At least it is known
@@crazyfire9470 not really, they know the infamous film with the sugar coated reconstruction era plantation way more than anything about the folklore in the film.
I love the animated segments and music of Song Of The South. They've used these characters for decades, no one complained regardless of the controversy of the movie.
I would hate to never hear Zip-A-Dee-Doo-Dah or see the Br'er characters walking around the park all because people are too sensitive and want to condemn everything as guilty by association.
As a kid in the 1980s, I had a large collection of picture book versions of most of the Disney movies that existed at the time, along with audio cassette tapes. One of the books/tapes in that collection was "Brer Rabbit and the Tar Baby". It was one of my favorites, and only featured that single story. I was unaware that it was part of a larger movie until I was much older. Eventually, as an adult, I was able to watch the whole film online, and actually really liked it. Granted, it badly over-idealized the situation of the sharecroppers in the post-bellum South (Disney over-idealizing something? Shocker!), but the overall story was charming, and all the animated characters were very loveable. Also, if viewed alongside the depictions of black people in 1940s media from other companies, such as Warner Brothers, Disney's depictions are far more respectful (albeit still stereotypical and disrespectful enough to be offensive to modern audiences). Personally, I think Disney should make the film available, along with appropriate disclaimers about past standards and errors, the way Warner Brothers has done with their old controversial cartoons.
I was able to find one view of this argument from the subject is question, since it's rather odd it's mostly whites that mostly talk about this controversy, you never hear what the African Americans have to say. Except this one:ua-cam.com/video/G4nQHXCCHqQ/v-deo.html
Plus it's fun to see how online you can find a lot of storyboard art by Bill Peet and Mary Blair online.
I love those two bumbling buffoon
James Baskett has to be my favourite actor in the film. In fact, Br'er Fox influenced me to make characters just like him.
I’ve recently watched The Adventures of Brer Rabbit, a 2006 movie based on the Uncle Remus tales. It’s nothing to write home about but it’s a decent kid’s flick with decent animation, and a solid cast of black celebrities. It was interesting to see how the characters would be characterized there compared to the Disney version. Brer Rabbit (Nick Cannon) is pretty similar to his Disney counterpart, but Brer Fox (D. L. Hughley) is depicted as more of a typical haughty fox (akin to Mr. Tod) who always tries to look upper class (complete with a bolo tie and walking cane) compared to the other animals that dress like simple country folk. Brer Bear (Gary Anthony Williams) is a neutral character here who always has his nose stuck in a book and is friendly with Brer Rabbit. Brer Wolf (Wayne Brady), on the other hand, is a lot more similar to Disney’s Brer Bear, here shown as another slow-witted dolt of an antagonist (but much more even-tempered), and during the “Tar Baby” segment, he teams up with Brer Fox to catch Brer Rabbit, further highlighting the similarities.
In the weekly Donald Duck comics, Brer Rabbit and the Big Bad Wolf (called Midas in the Netherlands) both had their own segments, and since they took place in the same forest, Brer Fox and Brer Bear were pretty much guaranteed to show up at least once every week.
In some American comics, but mostly in the Netherlands, Br'er Weasel, Br'er Buzzard, the Big Bad Wolf, Br'er Fox, and Br'er Bear are part of a club called 'The Foul-Fellows Club' where they attempt to commit mostly petty crimes and are usually caught by the sheriff. When not doing that, they are usually being lazy in their clubhouse
Fun fact: Disney regular J, Pat O, Mally was considered to voice Brer Fox but later got to voice him in promotional material.
Somehow I doubt that Disney will truly get rid of them from the parks as they have always been there and they will probably still make occasional appearances.
Oof. This aged badly.
@@bigboomer1013 You know my Mom did say that it's still not ruled out. In fact she thinks there is still a chance after the ride opens, comparing it to how Max didn't appear at Studios for awhile until after Runaway Railway was opened.... and after the pandemic. So there is still a chance. Unexpected things have happened.
@@disneyboy3030 I mean I defenitly doubt that they would retheam splash mountain into princess and the frog, and then remove the brand new theam they just made including the animatronics and exterior cosmetics to turn it back to the clasic splash mountain from the ground up.
@@bigboomer1013 I mean meet and greets.
Man, seeing that water ride caught me off guard
I remember riding that ride when I was a little kid, and I especially remember that moment where Brer Fox was holding the Rabbit
Thanks for the great video and for the unexpected memories
:)
G'day
Would like to see a show with these Brere characters
I'm loving these Disney villain retrospectives, and I think you tackled the Song of the South characters as smartly and respectfully as possible. The way you summed it up really put to words my own mixed feelings toward the matter- We shouldn't ignore or condone this film's deeply problematic legacy, and in truth, although I have a lot of nostalgic fondness for Splash Mountain, retheming it to Princess and the Frog is ultimately for the best (it'll actually be really fitting since it's a log flume ride with a lot of forest & swamp aesthetic, and PatF is set largely in the Bayou), the characters of Brer Rabbit, Brer Fox, and Brer Bear, are still extremely charming and lovable, and I'd be sad to see them disappear from the Disney roster completely. It's difficult to say what a tasteful way to tell modern stories involving the characters would be, if at all, but I'd like to hope it could be done someday.
I disagree it's for the best
I dunno if it’s a better alternative. I mean, while it may not be as dated as “Song of the South”, “The Princess and the Frog” has certain elements that haven’t aged well either, such as Prince Nevine’s vague ethnicity so that he can be paired with Tiana and also the film’s unflattering depiction of the Voodoo religion. I have no doubt those elements will be criticized when the ride is retirement to feature those elements.
It's so frustrating to see Disney trying to erase such a great trio of characters. There's just something so fascinating about their origins as African folklore characters, not unlike the fables of Anansi the Spider. I would love to see them brought back in their own cartoon someday, but it seems Disney wants nothing to do with them anymore. :(
Not all is lost. Br'er Bear's hat made a cameo in the recent Chip 'n' Dale: Rescue Rangers film. Not the bear himself sadly, but Disney hasn't completely forgotten about the Br'ers.
Otherwise, I wholeheartedly agree. I understand why Disney wants to pretend Song of the South never existed, but:
A. Sweeping such a problematic film under the rug and pretending like it never existed is Disney basically refusing to acknowledge their past. And we all know what happens to people who forget the past...
B. It's erasing an important part of black American history. James Baskett was the first black man to win an Academy Award for his role as Uncle Remus. That's huge! To pretend like Song of the South never existed means pretending James Baskett's accomplishments never existed either.
C. Like Colin said, most of SotS's issues have little to do with the Br'er characters themselves. Disney can sidestep the bothersome live-action stuff if they want, but why punish the Br'ers for it?
D. The families of the original actors are NOT happy about Splash Mountain being done away with. They agree that it's removing their families' legacies and accomplishments. It reminds me of when Pearl Milling Company removed Aunt Jemima as their mascot. The family of the woman who played Aunt Jemima felt insulted that her legacy was being erased.
Etc.
I hope a creator who understands the importance of the Uncle Remus stories for black American culture can revive the characters in a tasteful and respectful way. I'd truly hate to see Uncle Remus and the Br'ers be shut out of Disney entirely. All the actors, animators, musicians, etc., who worked on the original film deserve better than for their work to be outright erased from history.
PS. I like how you brought up Anansi the Spider considering he's what eventually morphed into Br'er Rabbit amongst the descendants of the original slaves:
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anansi#Relationship_between_Anansi_and_Br'er_Rabbit
@@sirhenrymorgan1187 Love this comment, I wholeheartedly agree with everything!
My grandmother gave me a bunch of books that had a lot of these stories and they had a lot more characters like Brer wolf, Brer Tortoise and such.
One thing I kind of laugh at in retrospect is that when Brer Bear is first seen, he’s walking along with his club over his shoulder, and how that ties in with an old idiom “if all you have is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail.”
Brer Bear isn’t even carrying the club like he’s going purposely somewhere to use it, he’s carrying it like it’s something that’s as much a part of his every day life as his clothes.
Why cant we all just love and enjoy these kinds of stories? the missinterpertation comes from lack of understanding, nothing else, i havent seen alot of this at all, but from what i have seen, i think its cute and wholesome. Its a genuine shame, that some people cant just, not be offended by everything they see…..
what a bunch of sissies! being offended by a grossly sugar coated histirical setting, next they'll say we can't make animated kid movies set in the Titanic with talking animals where nobody dies, or a film about 9/11 where also no one dies, or even films concentration camps of nazi Germany where we whitewash the fuck out of nazis, clearly they're the unreasonable ones for demanding their horrible historic tragedies to not be white washed, how dare they not find the sugar coated (all but in name) slave camps wholesome?
I'm sure you'd agree with me 100% if we were talking about a sugar coated concentration camp film right? after all it's their fault for getting offended.
Fr lol, as a historian myself, I was kinda shocked to see a more lighthearted story of the Reconstruction era and I genuinely don't see any malice with the movie's direction. Plus, Disney isn't necessarily the most faithful company when it comes to adaptations
@@PeruvianPotato it's one thing to adapt a fairy tail and it's quite another to adapt real history, I'm pretty sure the Jewish community wouldn't appreciate a light hearted story of the holocaust so I don't see why black people should be seen as unreasonable for not welcoming a whitewashed retelling of their history, good intentions or not, you don't just take something like tienemem square and say something like: "and then the tanks stopped in front of the man and everyone lived happily ever after" that's just gross, good intentions or not.
@@ginogatash4030 Dude, this is literally set during the Reconstruction era, aka when slaves were already emancipated 3 years ago. You honestly gotta make a pretty big stretch to make a comparison like that. Also I really don't think Disney will make any movies on the Tiananmen Square massacre given their direct collaboration with the Chinese government so I really don't see your point with the latter argument.
@@PeruvianPotato emancipated uh? So we're all forgetting how the South still ran its plantations and people went as far as forming the kukluks klan, which recaptured their freed slaves back completely ignoring the abolishment of slavery which wasn't seriously enforced in the south for many years after slavery was officially abolished? You know the infamous kkk propaganda movie "birth of a nation", that film is based exactly on the same time period Song of the South was, and it's unfortunately much more accurate to what would've happened back in the day, Not to mention that slaves or not black people still didn't have civil rights, so it was hardly a period of emancipation.
the point of the Tiananmen square argument is to just a hypothetical thing to make you think of how fucked something like that would be, I didn't need you to tell me it won't ever happen.
It makes me sad that these two have largely been forgotten because while I don’t like the movie they came from I don’t think it should be erased.
I remember my grandfather having a VHS with the briar patch short on it and it was always one of my favorites. I never knew until a few years ago that there was an entire film around it or all the controversy about it.
I which I could see this movie and judge it for myself.
I always look forward to your videos! I’m always impressed with the amount of research and care you put into your work!
Yay I am so glad your back with this series. I look forward to the next villains retrospective.
I just wanna say I’m glad I discovered you last year. Your videos are just so chill, entertaining, and very informative with neat trivia. Your channel is a genuine gem.
This video is very well done also Brer Rabbit Brer fox and Brer bear are my favorite Disney characters also I have a old song of the south poster used in a cinema in 1972
Just binged watched your whole Disney Villain series. Can't wait for the next episode!
Grew up watching song of the south and loved Br'er bear and fox ❤
always loved the looney tunes slapstick of brer rabbit's shorts(would've loved to seen more as i read some of the comics/short stories.) and honestly would love to see it be mixed with the princess and the frog when it's revamped.(be cool seeing brer rabbit help tiana and naveen maybe against the frog hunters or a cameo of him with brer fox/bear:3)
I would've liked to see the animated segments of Song of the South repackaged as their own thing, with a name like, says, "Tales from Splash Mountain".
Also, YO, I didn't know Uncle Phil voiced Brer Bear at one point!
I love this series
I was lucky enough to get hold of one of the rare video tape releases of "Song of the South" you mentioned. And it was well worthwhile. And this is great work, taking all their appearances, however brief, into account. I even remember going on the Disneyworld ride. Though, I honestly had no idea that Joel Chandler Harris was white. Plus, I never knew that James Baskett took over Brer Rabbit's voice for the final animated sequence.
I feel like if this movie just animated the only controversy would have been just tar baby
I just love this guys videos
I never understood why people think this film is 'racist' and gives it so much hate, its a criminally underrated movie as a wholw and easily Disney's most underrated movie that they've produced
If you actually want an answer, my understanding is the issue is to do with the depiction of a happy slave who just loves his masters and what he does so much that he stays with them even after being free. Which I believe that did happen but it was not to do with how much they loved their life as slaves, rather lack of opportunities and places to go.
bruh song of the south employed so many black actors and had a. black man as a lead in a film of that time. as a black person i think its amazing and would love to see the film honestly because we don't ever talk about that period to much and after being slaves i would assume that they would be happy no matter the hardships.
Despite never having a full movie release, the Friend Like Me Sing Along has the song _How Do You Do_ on it from _Song of the South_ on it.
Even though splash mountain will be re-themed these three will continue there chase
You can take away splash mountain but ya can't take away the duo
Edit: even a year later this comment still holds up one thing I find interesting about this video and that I agree with is that despite the movie they came from despite all the backlash these characters have stayed afloat and heck even become beloved by guests especially for the ride, no I'm not trying to say that this is propaganda for the movie I am just saying that these characters were given a second chance and they nailed it.
This video is the best of the retrospective imo.
While both Brer Rabbit , Bugs Bunny and Peter Rabbit are rabbits that like to cause trouble and outwit others like Brer Fox , Elmer Fudd and Farmer John. Another rabbit stereotype is the rabbit that's like order and rules and has some kind of OCD , Rabbit from Winnie the Pooh, Mr. Herriman from Fosters and Dave from Harvey Beaks . These three rabbits are more rule followers but are surrounded by people who like mischief and think lowly of rules , Tigger, Bloo and Fee and Foo.
Very Nice!
I see you've included some images from that Big Golden Book "Uncle Remus Stories." I still have my old copy.
One interesting little tidbit--I came across a Disney-published picture book of Brer Rabbit from the 1970s in a used bookstore. It was a mashup of the Tar Baby story and one or two others...but the interesting thing was, instead of a tar baby, Brer Fox's bait was a stuffed rabbit coated in sticky glue. I guess even by the seventies, Disney was getting a little skittish about the racial implications of the phrase "tar baby"...
I remember seeing the "glue baby" book. I think the decision to replace it with honey was a good movie for Splash Mountain.
Happy Anniversary, Song of the South.🐰🦊🐻🐸🐦🌞🌳🌲🍂🍁🎼🎵🎶
I LOVE THESE THREE SO MUCH!!! ❤😭😭😭❤
I wasn't born when this movie came out or when it was came out again and I do not own vsh of it but I've look for 6 hours and I found it I have ways
Here is a link archive.org/details/SongOfTheSouthHD
Jess Harnell currently voices all 3 Brer roles
I know that nick stewart (original Brer Bear voice actor) reprised his role for splash mountain and is the only original voice actor for the movie to reprise their roles.
I remember never actually seeing SONG OF THE SOUTH. Instead, I read and listened to Disney's recorded storybook adaptation of it, called "Br'er Rabbit and the Tar Baby." Uncle Remus never appears, although the narrator telling the story does use some of his speech patterns. So I thought of SONG OF THE SOUTH, which I called either "Br'er Rabbit and the Tar Baby" or "Zip-a-Dee-Doo-Dah," as just another cartoon, and didn't learn about the live-action portion of it until a few years later.
It also should be pointed out that "The Tar Baby" is ultimately inspired by a folktale from southern Africa, and that the rabbit character in the original tale is a wicked trickster, and deserves everything he gets. A similar (but probably unrelated) and far less satisfying version can be found in European folklore: here a cat is the trickster, and not only does she NOT get punished, but when the mouse she has cheated scolds her for her selfishness, the cat eats her just to get her to shut up!
While all the negatives song of the south has it does have a few positives
1. Beautiful animation
2. Great acting from Stewart and baskett
3. Charming animated characters
Most of these are from br’er fox and br’er bear
That just tells you how great they are
I love meeting them in the Parks
While I've never seen the movie, as a kid I had a storybook titled "Brer Rabbit and the Tar Baby". I took the title at face value, just being a fake person made out of literal tar. It wasn't until I was an adult that I learned what a tar baby really was.
No, James Avery is best known as Shredder on the TMNT (1987) series.
He'll knock Brer Rabbit's head clean off and eat him with a side of turtle soup and tiny onions!
The Animated Version was also cancelled due to World War II (because all of Disney's movies in production (with an exception of Bambi) were put on hold)
As a European french speaker, I only saw those characters in the Littl' Bad Wolf's comics and they have different names since the 50's to distance themselves from their movie.
Then, almost 20 years later, after I bought the Disneyland Adventures on Steam that I came across those three again and they left me with a strange sense of "déjà vu". Only after, I searched aboout their origin and all.
It's something new and fresher than our old fairytales that have been revisited time and time again and we've been dying to have Splash Mountain in Paris!
So thank you for showing us those characters who we forget too easily! (sorry for my english, i'm not that good yet)
If there was a cartoon show of song of the south.
Voice Cast idea
Jess Harnell as Br'er Rabbit
Dee Bradley Baker as Br'er Fox
Kevin Michael Richardson as Br'er Bear
Think they’d all be up for it?