From the Japanese interview メスメルは本編には登場せず、語られなかったマリカの子供のひとりです。本編におけるルーンの王たちと同格の存在になります。彼がなぜ語られていないのかというところも含めて、DLCで判明することになります。Miyazaki said Messmer is one of Marika's children that wasn't mentioned in the base game and we will find out in the DLC why he was not talked about in the base game
@@mattbradley408 I think he's just a new character that is going to become all of our favorites just like Gael. No one expected Gael, we didn't know we needed Gael until Miyazaki gave us a big spoonful He looks very evil but in an interview Miyazaki referred to him as a hero?? We'll have to see
@@mattbradley408 Maybe we are, but I like to consider that 'mesmer' means 'hypnosis' and that is in line with dreams (Trina) and manipulating people through love (Miquella). Either way it's interesting to think about
If you pause the video of the "Omen Lion" boss, you'll see it's actually TWO people! One sitting on the shoulders of the other in an exact mimicry of the traditional Lion Dance of Chinese New Year celebrations. I am not kidding, that boss is the Eastern equivalent of 'three gnomes in a trenchcoat'
Pinwheel's revenge.... it's gonna be tough as it seems. A nice thing to note that i could see from this trailer, is the teeth form. There are 2 types of teeth formations, the inner part is erbivore, the outer part is carnivore. I wonder if there are two people as you say, what that might translate into. Maybe 2 siamese twins one the opposite of the other? Very cool boss
Miquella - Nascent Butterfly Malenia - Aeonian Butterfly Mesmer - Smoldering Butterfly Mesmer could be a demigod deliberately forgotten like the Nameless King in Dark Souls
The pinned comment under this video has a japanese translation of Miyazaki saying Messmer is a child of Marika and has been purposefully forgotten. I can’t wait to die to him 🙂
His cape has a Rune on the back. The gold eyes and red hair make it seem he could be Radagon and Marika's third child, not to mention the fire butterfly could be representing him like aeonian and nascent butterflies represent Miquella and Malenia, as well as them having this first letter in their name, which in Elden Ring references familial bonds.
I actually think the DLC area used to be in the center of the map, between all the divine towers. The veil over the sky in the land of shadow is "Cloaking" the land and removing it from the rest of the lands between. Miyazaki implies in the interview that the land of shadow was once connected to the lands between, but some story event lead it to become disconnected. It would also make sense why this seemingly entire different land has stuff that is nonetheless connected to the lands between. If i were to further speculate, Marika probably did this, maybe in order to trap that Messmer guy inside.
Another piece to add to that theory is Malenia’s Isolated Tower. The other towers all form a semi-circle on the continent, except hers, which just sits in the middle of the ocean. Given the position of most of the continent relative to the sea level, I highly doubt Marika would’ve had that tower built that far out in the sea, unless it was originally connected to the continent. It’s possible the Land of Shadow will have an area with a massive hole where that tower used to be, and perhaps that’s where we find the red dancer given the blue dancer’s connection to Rot.
You might be absolutely correct. The piece of land missing in the center of the map is slightly larger than limgrave (the dlc size), and the Erdtree sits in the ocean as a projection. What we see in this trailer might be the actual, real Erdtree.
29:05 Messmer's snake shoulders remind me of Zahhāk from the Shahnameh ("The Book of Kings", an epic poem about the mythical past of the Persian Empire), an evil king who had snakes growing from his shoulders due to a demon's curse. Of note: Wikipedia also mentions other versions of the myth in which the character is named Aži Dahāka, was a monster rather than a cursed human, and/or is said to have possessed all possible sins and evil influences - possibly relevant, considering what other commenters (such as @tenpei7530) have noticed about his design.
Im Persian.. and yeah.. its not a curse its more like a deal with devil somehow and Azi Dhaka in old Persian means Dragon! also in soulsgames Snakes are incomplete dragons! and Messmer has a dragon eye..
11:52 might be an Archimedes' screw! it looks like it's drawing the lava up to a higher level, and may coincide to the ancient technology found across the lands between. 18:23 Messmer's weapon is similar to the spears impaling the thorn covered giant corpses in the mountaintops, and the staff of the guilty, in that they all have a trident formation and feature a helix design. this coincides with Messmer's weilding of thorn sorceries. thorn sorcerers gouge their eyes out and Messmer's left eye is closed...
His design reminds me a bit of Zahhak the Dragon King. An evil tyrant and dark sorcerer from persian mythology, who was known for two snakes, emerging from each of his shoulders.
Exactly, i think hes the one that stabbed all those spears through the giants, hence his title of "impaler." Theres not even a good reason for those spears to exist in the base game otherwise, unless you believe the thorn sorcerers made all of them (which seems a bit far-fetched for the sheer size and number of spears)
I think he's an allusion to Lucifer. After the Giants campaign, he was tempted by the power of the Sun/Blood Star/Fell God/Formless Mother and banished to the Shadow Lands by mommy and daddy.
The screw drawing in lava is super cool and could have been a tool to create the Divine Towers, since the towers are so large and even completely whole they may have been just molded with raw lava by giants.
36:40 The seal to the right of the spear could be the seal for miquella, Its two braided circles, the core component of miquella's design is his braided hair and it could represent the unified world miquella is seeking.
The ships/boats we see behind the Red Dancer are actually shown in-game. They’re shown on reliefs on the steles we light to fight the Ancestor Spirits, as well as in the Grand Cloister. Tarnished Archaeologist briefly suggested that he’s making a video on how these reliefs depict the arrival of the Numen in the Lands Between, and considering the DLC synopsis says that this Land of Shadow is where “Marika first set foot,” this could be a glimpse of the distant past. Also, I think that Messmer’s spear is much more similar in design to Mohg’s. It’s messing two of its points and the obsidian, but the lower arc below the tips are virtually identical. Going back to this area being a reflection of the time where Marika first came to the Lands Between, I think that we can actually see the Crucible in this trailer. The golden amber leaking from the tree seems to be collected by a large structure off in the distance, as if it’s collecting all that life energy in one place
I think the dlc will have something to do with the divine towers. They said this land is where marika first set foot. Maybe the baldichin veil is draped over all of the divine towers hiding this place which could explain the weird shape of the map in the base game. Also the boats in the blue area could be the boats that the numen arrived in. Would line up with the boat images in siofra river
I think Messmer may have something to do with the Exiled Soldiers present in Stormveil Castle and Castle Sol. They have those Red Capes that resemble his look, their armor underneath also resemble his armor. With a scale look to it. Also, they are linked to the thorns and a unknown sin underneath the Stormveil. We assume it is the Godwin corpse, but maybe it's something else. Briars of sin and Punishment talk about exiled criminals and how they were blinded by thorns and discovered the Blood Star. Blindness is associated with the flame of frenzy, so there is fire associated which also links to Messmer.
Uhhhh THE CASTLE SOL ECLIPSE!!! IT HAS TO BE SOMETHING TO DO WITH IT!! That's where you get the left side of the Haligtree Medalion! And the Eclipse Shotel references a dreadful awe, which links to the the Exiled who discovered the Blood Star. That is where the Shadow Realm comes from!! I can feel it! MESSMER IS GRIFFITH!!!!!!
@lucascarpanzano2576 Maybe that explains why we never actually see the celestial body of the sun in Elden Ring's skybox. It is literally banished from the sky and is vilified/used to connote sin now. Lucifer is known as the Morning Star, and as the story goes, was cast out from the heights to hell below. Makes the serpent stuff pretty relevant.
@@bigmeatswangin5837 uhhhh never thought of that! The Lucifer connection also links Mogh and Rykard. I think that maybe Messmer and what happened back during the war against the Giants is the missing link connecting a lot of different factions in Elden Ring. Each of them looking at fire and death and the end of the Gods from different directions.
Loads of the iconography (or very similar) from Mohgwyn palace's appears. Like the circles which are in the floor in the lion boss, and the "stories" showing people, on the walls of the new castle
On the last dialogue in the trailer, what really stuck out to me is that the voice had a Welsh accent, which is specific to the Carians! The usage of the different accents of the British isles in the base game was something I never really forgot, because it helped define the factions of the game very quickly in my mind lol. If the Rico character is reintroduced, and they're part of the Carians, it's a chance it could be them with an accent to match the rest of the Carian Royal Family.
Also messmer's armor is vaguely similar to roman centurion armor, very pontius pilate vibes. And the 'mimic horseman' makes me think of albinaurics. Same weapon, legs are disappearing, horse's legs are disappearing - plus there's the connection between albinaurics and seeking the haligtree
11:50 I think that could be what's known as and "Archimedes Screw", a kind of pump that has a rotating spiral inside of a tube, and can lift liquids up if positioned at an incline. It can also be used to generate power if the liquid flows down it, but based on the brief shot of it we get here I'm pretty sure it's lifting it up. Probably mean this is in some kind of forge or something similar. Oh like three other people already commented that
The man in the painting at 1:03 in the trailer, his cloak looks like the one Morgott wears. His appearance at 2:22 reminds me of Morgott's shriveled body after you defeat him. Interestingly we get to see Morgott return to the Erdtree when he dissipates in Godfreys arms, unlike most bosses who kind of poof when the fight ends. The skeletal creature riding the melted horse at 2:20 reminds me of the gargoyles mended with corpse wax, especially with the cavernous background, similar to the gargoyle duo fight.
13:58 the "wicker man" has a belt (?) that has red-haired giant masks (or skinned faces?), and peeking around his left hip I see a dragon head. Interesting mix of iconography with the omen horns and twisted thorns.
11:00 - I assume this is Shabriri, based on the yellow tint, the yellow robes, the eyes on his clasp, and him pulling the sword out of his head. When the player chooses the Frenzied Flame ending their head disappears in place of the flame, so it would be thematically consistent if he's pulling his head off as he draws that weapon.
@@jhank0cean As a bodyswapper in the main world. We haven’t seen their actual corporeal form, only the possessed version of the dude with the big steel hat. That doesn’t exclude them from existing within Miquella’s dream, where Shadow takes place.
Also the sword he’s pulling out is just the Great Rune, which feels a bit more symbolic, like I think it’s some “Erdtree faithful” being punished in an ironic way
At 19:52 odd when the trailer resumes it looks as if the black plumes resemble the branches of the Erdtree burning. They don't move with the red flames. Rykard has a painting of the Erdtree burning, and Melina refers to it as the "cardinal sin", so I'm getting the vibe that it was a prophetic dream of Marika's the tree would burn, and it's a perfect explaination to leave Messmer where he is.
@35:40 the symbol you're trying to see is on the book cover. The right symbol in the circle is on the same as on Commander Niall's cloak from Castle Sol (I'm getting 2 snakes forming an eclipse) and the left symbol is dragonfire incantation vibes (incantations of those who hunted dragons). Gives me a sense that these two factions joined together would bring about the end of the light of the Erdtree.
in the very last scene, miquella seems to have a warming stone aura. The warming stone description says that the erdtree was once warm as the gentle sun and healed all those who bathed in its rays. scene ends with miquella looking up at the tree which suggests something similar is going on here, maybe related to the sun as well
To me, Miquella's ring emote looks just like the bright symbol of light coming from the grass somewhere in the first half of the trailer. The same ring (hands) and a line (body) piercing it at the right side. Also, if I remember correctly, Miquella's model has a hidden ring on his hand hanging out of the cocoon, and the ring's motif is reminiscent of that double helix ring we see on Messmer's cape emblem
I love the veil, I'm getting as above so below vibes with the veiled imagery because I don't think the death ending in game has the same veil. What if there's another side to the erdtree of the fingers, where you have to ruin another country with a Doo Doo leech tree for the tree back in the lands between to flourish, or like what if horah loux and the tarnished were sent to sabotage the erdtree that became the shadow tree
Quelag i rly wanna point out the cathedral they showed like 4 times in the trailer. They panned over it in the very beginning and it looks similar to the broken cathedral of manus celes. However, the geography kinda suggests that this cathedral is in east liurnia as opposed to our cathedral being in west liurnia. This makes me question if perhaps this is where we can find miquella's or maybe essmer's fingers if esmer turns out to be another empyrean.
The Marais set also says that children in that family are born sick, and Maleigh reveres rot/Malenia. I think that all supports a Marais connection in the swampy area. They also just stand out for me for having so many M names.
Wanted to chip in - the melting horse rider reminds me a LOT of The Nuckelavee. Its a creature from Scottish folklore which brought pestilence and destruction upon islands it appeared on. Its almost 1:1 with the trailer enemy - a skeletal, fleshy rider fused to its steed. I wouldnt be surprised if the boss encounter was full of either dead blight or some other type of poison.
11:55 I think this huge contraption is an Archimedes screw, a system to ferry water up the tube using an infinite screw principle. In this one second of animation we can see a single arm of an helix rotating in it. Cool way to carry lava up an incline.
a few things extra I found: - the lion guy seems to be a pretty straight representation of chinese dragon dancers. the hands and legs under the cloth holding up this leonine face, all covered in crucible imagery. this is potentially a grafted guardian AGAINST the omen curse. all the sin, omen, and crucible imagery seems to me that this land fell in the age of the crucible. where they tried to fight back the omen / crucible curse. - the grey lady in the nox-like environment had a collar reminiscent of the tail feathers of a cuckoo bird. this combined with all the birdcages, and the ties we already suspected between the nox people and the carians of today. she really seems to be a missing link to that story, and clearly part of the cuckoo - the pale rider's horse ties him in with the those who live in death and godwyn: they are obvioulsy death themed, but the horse reminds me of a hippocampus from mythology. a half horse half fish creature. this is interesting as godwyn seems to also have grown fish imagery after his death, including the tail like this decaying hippocampus - along with the crucible imagery, a lot of architecture and armor is ancient antiquity inspired. this clearly harkens to a past age, one of godfrey and crucible, however this doesn't have to be the past per se. I am pretty convinced it just went to shit in that age, and we find the remnants of it. - I think this might be Miquella's dreamscape thing, just like how we entered godwyn to fight the lichdragon. the baldichin also reinforces this belief of mine, along with the twin twisted trees (miquella being malenia's other half) - oh yeah I forgot to mention this, but messmer is inspired by berserk grunbeld probably. inforcing the dragon knight vibe we're getting. - the wickerman is also an inspiration from berserk, the same inspiration that spawned DS2's the rotten
Ah yes beserk, the origin of all fantasy and European mythology… You know wickermen is a famous tradition and even has a film about it well before the comic
@@joesheridan9451 im talking about the specifics of that giant walking cage being an instrument to punish sinners by putting them in and it burning eternally. if you would look into the specifics of the three designs you can see its not just a generic interpretation of a wickerman, but a specific one. Miyazaki is widely known for his direct adaptation of some berserk designs because he loved that manga so much.
May just be my background, but the horse creature reminds me way more of a Nuckelavee, from Orcadian folklore. Also sea dwelling creatures that are described as a horse with a man's torso attached, pretty similar to the creature shown. They're heavily associated with pestilence, death of livestock and such
Quelaag you're a mad lad for your insane spiral analysis live stream after the premiere (we love you for it) AND a now summary vid? Amazing. What an amazing day.
People got so distracted by the badass martial arts at 21:30 that they didn't see that the twinblade the knight wields is the same one the tarnished uses at the end 29:45. The crucible knight wings are the weapons ash of war!
1) The Melty-horse looks to be a Nuckalavee: a _very_ malevolent Orkadian spirit of ill omen, pestilence and death, that only has one description of its appearance recorded that states it looked like a giant decaying corpse riding a flayed/rotting horse. 2) The sword/candle tree stabbed through the man's head looks to be made of amber 3) Messmer's flame seems to produce black writing before bursting into what appears to be blood flame then Golden Grace 4) I can't help but see the Shadow Tree as 2 lovers embracing, especially from Miquella's point of view at the end of the trailer. 5) I realised that there is one _massive_ assumption that we've all been making about the lore: We've assumed this whole time that Marika existed before or at the same time as Radagon, as Marika brought with her the Age of the Erdtree and with it Golden Grace to the Lands Between, putting an end to the Age of the Crucible then some time after that Radagon appeared seemingly out of nowhere, but the Lionel Misbegotten are described in the game files as "Radagon's Children" and Radagon shares his red hair with the Fire Giants suggesting that his lineage is from well before the Age of the Erdtree. So what if Radagon existed _before_ Marika? What if Marika first setting foot in the Lands of Shadow was in fact Radagon gaining Marika as a second aspect instead, leading to them being selected as an Empyrean? What if Radagon had found a way to create the Erdtree, but the process of doing so split him into the Red King and the White Queen aspects we see throughout the rest of the story?
there's a nice possible reference to Messmer at the Church of Pilgrimage. There's a spirit outside saying "O Marika. Queen Eternal. He is your unwanted child." could be about Messmer.
I was completely off the Evil Miquella hype train, but the trailer actually made me consider it for the first time. I have a feeling this emphasis on "Kind Miquella" in the trailer, shown glowing with divine light at the end of the trailer might be a red herring, and that Messmer is the Fallen/Luciferian/Unseelie Fay/Vampiric (the Impaler clearly parallels Vlad the Impaler a.k.a. Dracula) version to the traditional Angelic, Seelie-Fay version of Miquella. And the name Messmer practically means "hypnotism or a compelling attraction and fascination", which makes me think of the Bewitching Branch. Also the description that we are following in the footsteps of Miquella makes me think he is not here for interactions with the player, and the description of Miquella who "Divested himself of his flesh, his strength, his lineage. Of all things Golden. And now Miquella awaits the return of his promised Lord." could be read that he stripped himself of everything that made him Miquella, and waits now for the Tarnished as a boss And two things can be true at the same time, the two versions could coexist, be an alter ego, or perhaps a corrupted version that exists as a separate entity, while the spiritual good Miquella might still be a helper.
@@AsAugustSleeps haha, thanks. On one hand, I would like to be validated about Messmers true identity, on the other, I am still hoping for good Miquella as a questgiver. But... knowing Myazaki and Elden Ring, its highly possible we could have both at the same time
Mesmer looks to me like a wild mix of every Party that stands against the golden order. Dragon Stuff, Snake Stuff, godskin stuff etc. Like he united all opponent partys. I really think it is miquela. And I think moghs bad influence has something to do with it. Maybe the Search for for a solution for Godwyn made her mad and he/she got crazy. Divesting himself of his flesh, his strength, his lineage. Of all things Golden.
Miquella becoming Mesmer Is also so FromSoft (also reeks of Grrm), to have the promised saviour succumb to some sort of "evil" and become corrupted on their path. FromSoft love doing the Icarus thing e.g. Slave knight Gael, Artorias, Blooddrunk hunters, genichiro etc.
@@quelaagmaybe the shadowlands are set in the past. And like back to the future he wants to change the present :O :D And now it’s getting weird :D What if she/he does the bohemian rhapsody Move. I don’t want to die, but sometimes I wish I would never be born at all. Look at him and godwyn and Malenia. They all suffer. And he finds no way of ending that suffer. Not for the Rot and not for godwins Dead. So why not killing Marika in the past, before all the suffer is happening, before Marika became a god, to stop all that Suffer. Maybe we have to save Marika and not Miquela. Maybe the blond girl on torrent is young Marika. Second Idea. Or it is a nightmare. He slumbers and moghs influence turned it into an nightmare. And we must awake him.
I think all of what you said makes sense but I would probably take out Mogh's part from it, just because Mogh has an outer god and this supposed alter ego of Miquela seems to give no fucks about gods at all. or maybe it's Mogh influence AND all the rest, since he was probably pissed off about being in the short end of all the outer gods plans, so he just embraced pure chaos and all the powers of everyone, even the crucible (his last attack in the vid). the only thing we didn't see on him was maybe madness
In the Japanese interview with IGN Miyazaki confirmed it was a third child from Marika and Radagon that was never talked about, and we’ll learn why in the DLC
My guess is that Miquella's runes are the DLC's sites of grace, because of what Miyazaki said in the interview about following Miquella's footstep as we followed Marika's guidance in the base game.
marika was absolutely stabbed by the elden beast during her crucifixion, it’s pierced thru her womb so she can never have any more children as part of her punishment for the shattering
11:50 I didn't notice it at first until you mentioned the spinning, but if that is spinning inside then that could be some sort of pump. There are pumps with a corkscrew like design. They are pumping the molten lava up that pipe
I think Messmer might have been mentioned in the game. In Castle Sol where you find the second half of the haligtree medallion, there's a ghost npc that says "Forgive me, Lord Miquella. The sun has not been swallowed, our prayers were lacking. Your comrade remains soulless." There's a mausoleum with a dead demigod's corpse just outside Castle Sol. A demigod that was Miquella's comrade. Was that him maybe? Of course, the soulless mentioned there could very well be Godwyn, but there's the mausoleum just outside Castle Sol which doesn't seem to be a coincidence, and it's kinda odd that the ghost would refer to someone as important and esteemed as Godwyn just as "comrade". Also, we don't know yet if a soulless demigod can be alive in the shadow realm (maybe their souls go there?).
Perhaps Mesmer is Marika's first born, from the Dragon age, or from the Crucible age. Remember Crucible knights also have a red tinge to their gold, so red is associated with the crucible in some way. I think he is her first or certainly one of the older children. This realm seems to be where the unwanted go, kind of hidden in the shadow, and we know that Miquella shielded the unwanted by his Halig tree. Perhaps here he wanted to heal those who were shunned by the golder order but due to interruption by Mohg he is not present to do so
The twinblade at 29:25 is the same one the knight is using at 21:29! Assuming it drops form him I don’t think it’s the twinblade of abundance and decay.
The Land of Shadow is where things that the Golden Order would rather have forgotten get sent to. The wickermen are particularly brutal weapons, a Demigod with ties to snakes/opposing the Erdtree (who may have been heavily involved with the war with the giants given the “Impaler” imagery), omen creatures from cultures outside the Lands Between, etc
Elden Ring always fascinated me with it's use of nature and so when I saw the veil coming off the trees I saw something else that I see in nature sometimes. I saw the giant version of the web of a field spider. Sometimes in fields or even in yards in the city these little spiders will spin these webs that look like very thin sheets & they can cover grass & plants in what look like little veils. I imagine if I was small enough that standing under one would look like being under that skybox. All this reminds me of Miquella's abilities as a weaver, the making of his own cocoon as well as the cocoons filled with Albinurics & such you see throughout the Haligtree speak to his web spinning powers. It seems the entire shadow realm that we experience could be a creation of Miquella's, or at least under their direct influence & that the "baldachin" as well as the fabrics covering the city could be either representations or the direct results of Miquella's weavings throughout this realm.
I think the Wormface is actually a LampreyFace. It has what look like gill openings along it's flank, and the ocean imagery ties quite neatly with Godwyn's transformation
I feel like the lion boss thing has to have something to do with Godwyn, Lion representation of the golden lineage, Golden Hair, Golden lightning which seems very specific as the vid gives off no other lightning vibes. I don’t what relation to Godwyn exactly, but I really think there has to be something :p hopefully we get a cool golden lightning spell out of it:))
Miyazaki said in one of the famitsu interviews that the "Dance Beast" is related to the culture that existed before Marika rose to godhood. it predates Godwyn.
@@tylerhawksmoor9601 it predates Godwyn… just like the birth of the golden lineage. We don’t know all the secrets of the lineage. As far as we know now, it is entirely built off a lie (Hoarah Louxs fake persona). Who’s to say there aren’t more secrets?
35:42 It´s really cute to see Quelaag wondering how the rune of Messmer might look like if you can clearly see the same rune on the box left, of the collectors editiom hardpack.
Is it possible that the gloam-eyed queen was Marika's other half before Radagon? Messmer and Melina could be children of the gloam-eyed queen yet still be offspring of Marika. There is a lot of history in the lands between that we don't get know, and Marika slaying gods and the like to become the sole goddess of the lands between before having that "alter ego" destroyed could be possible. She would also likely get rid of any evidence including hiding any children from that time. A lot of speculation on my part, but I wanted to chime in with a different angle Edit: Also, if Melina and Messmer are siblings by nature of both being children of the gloam-eyed queen, then Messmer's flame could be the flame Melina walks beside
The castle at 12:00 is actually Farum Azula before it was destroyed, same trees around the area, same rock at the base, and the stones falling apart at the tip of the castle is the beginning of it's destruction
Have you checked out The Tarnished Archaeologist yet? He goes into great detail about the architectural elements and how they relate to the real-world cultures that inspired the games. He's not always right about things but he explains the spinning lava tube (Archimedes' Screw) among other things. And sometimes he is shockingly spot-on.
The candleholder Weapons in the trailer and the Thing that is stuck through the old man/yellow king have the shape of a kind of Spruce/ fir trees. Saw in older lore videos Things about the Great Tree that was before the erdtree. And I think it has the same shape.
23:30 If the land we're treading on is in the center of The Lands Between then the sea border on the East side would be a good candidate for finding ships that accidentally sailed "over the edge" of what's been veiled. If i remember correctly there's a waterfall around the eastern edge that you can see from the east coast of Caelid
Hi Quelaag! Lovely video, I've been having such a blast hearing everyone's takes and theories about all the incredible stuff shown in the trailer! (One small thing though! I am audio engineer irl and I highly recommend utilizing a de-esser for your microphone as S's are extremely shrill in the audio this time around
Hey, I don't know if you noticed @ 15:02 of your video. You can see the lion thing is actually 2 people you can see the lion head dude standing on top of the other ones back. On the BANDAI NAMCO Europe ELDEN RING Shadow of the Erdtree | Official Gameplay Reveal Trailer. you can see it at 1:27.
The shield in the Messmer fight is inspired by the longshield, a real weapon that was used in duel situations (like trial by combat) in Europe in the 15th century. It also reminds me of something else, an earlier occurrence of two-handed shields used in sanctioned fights, but I can't remember it clearly.
23:44 Me and my brother got some Alabaster/Onyx Lord-vibes here, Definetly star-related considering the similarities to Radahn, the gravity tools, Fallingstar, Ruins Greatsword etc. And oh boyy I got No clue about this boomerang-thing.. Very excited about you drawing the yellow dude, he looks Soo cool!!!
I'm not sure why Fia isn't talked about here, she is a deathbed companion who has a dream as well, maybe one of the bosses in the DLC might have a relation to her such as that lion who maybe could be Godwyn, also without a doubt that Messmer is Miquella, Miquella traveled in the Lands of Shadow to find out how Marika became a god, he found out how and got corrupted by it so he became a god as well, as for the giant dude with flames he could be a relation to dung eater since it does have a sun symbol on its cage and as we all know Dung eater wants to corrupt the future and perhaps that giant is the first root of it all. St Trina might be in this DLC as well.
@@quelaag Wouldn't that be great, really hope the DLC bosses are as hard or harder then Malenia, would love to post boss videos for DLC also good job on the observation, I can never pick out small details like how you do.
22:35 Well the Erd Tree has the Elden Ring and the Elden Beast. It stands to reason the Crucible may have had its own beast within it... Perhaps the true final boss of the DLC? 👀
The shot of the landscape and the tree specifically at 5:30 reminds me a lot of the Dark Sign at the ending of DS3, and the way it was styled after a crucible being poured. If you look at the golden sap coming from the tree, the perspective seems to intentionally line up to where it's flowing down into the top of the U shaped structure
The trailer description states that the shadow land is "where the goddess Marika first set foot". I wonder if the woman in the picture could be Marika's mother or even Marika itself. Messmer has been confirmed to be Marika's child and the red hair points to Radagon, but could it be possible that Marika had a child in the land of shadow before becoming a goddess and marrying Godfrey? That could explain why there's no mention of Messmer anywhere in the Lands Between.
23:30 Hmm interesting comparison w the background being the opposite color.. And while I don't fully see it, Very fascinating if we could get some more about boats!! I also like how you mention Lance and the others, it's so cool to see you community big-shots come together!! You should do like a stream together!!
30:38 look how the text of the dlc appears on screen, it looks to me like something rising up out of water or maybe fog, it looks different from the animation of the elden ring text above.
Is this the same dreamscape for which we find Fortissax? It would make sense for there to be a connection between the deathbed companions and Miquella through the themes of sleep and dreams. Crunchy talked in one of this videos about a spirit realm. Maybe this is it. This is a metaphysical realm, where people don’t bring their bodies, but instead their spirits. We might find a lot of ancestral spirits in some of these dlc areas.
To me, the spinning pipe thing at 11:58 looks like an Archimedes screw. It's used to move liquids and such up inclines. Basically just a big spinning screw that scoops and lifts stuff up the inside of the tube.
10:21 To me, this interesting ruin, mired in what looks like a deathblight swamp, reminds me of the ruins just before you reach the Lake of Rot, Ainsel River, where you encounter the Baleful Shadow and cheese it in the elevator hallway to the right of the area because you stubbornly refuse to level up Vigor. They always stood out as somewhat of an oddball set of ruins in the depths of the Ainsel, almost sealing away the Lake of Rot below.
Up close at 26:38, the yellow along the sword or whatever looks a lot like the wax seals on the buildings in Leyndell. This is definitely my favorite scene from the trailer, what a cool visual
From the Japanese interview メスメルは本編には登場せず、語られなかったマリカの子供のひとりです。本編におけるルーンの王たちと同格の存在になります。彼がなぜ語られていないのかというところも含めて、DLCで判明することになります。Miyazaki said Messmer is one of Marika's children that wasn't mentioned in the base game and we will find out in the DLC why he was not talked about in the base game
Awesome! Do you have a link to the full interview?
I’d love to know where he gave this interview!!
jp.ign.com/elden-ring-shadow-of-the-erdtree/73569/interview/elden-ring-shadow-of-the-erdtree@@tksm97 @billkowalsky
I believe its this one!
@@quelaag yes this one I couldn’t link it probably because of UA-cam
@@quelaag There's also another interview by Famitsu which gives a bit more detail about some things like the lion in the trailer.
Seems like Messmer has a piece of everything that is a "Sin". Dragon eyes, Snakes, Godskin gloves... Idk
Plus thorns.
Totally! He's all over the place, black flame, bloodflame, exile attire
@@mattbradley408 I think he's just a new character that is going to become all of our favorites just like Gael. No one expected Gael, we didn't know we needed Gael until Miyazaki gave us a big spoonful
He looks very evil but in an interview Miyazaki referred to him as a hero?? We'll have to see
@@mattbradley408 Could very well be. The name Trina does mean "three" - Miquella 1, Trina 2, and (?) 3
@@mattbradley408 Maybe we are, but I like to consider that 'mesmer' means 'hypnosis' and that is in line with dreams (Trina) and manipulating people through love (Miquella). Either way it's interesting to think about
If you pause the video of the "Omen Lion" boss, you'll see it's actually TWO people! One sitting on the shoulders of the other in an exact mimicry of the traditional Lion Dance of Chinese New Year celebrations.
I am not kidding, that boss is the Eastern equivalent of 'three gnomes in a trenchcoat'
you can even see the hands on the lion's chin
Or just serosh / Godfrey
Pinwheel's revenge.... it's gonna be tough as it seems. A nice thing to note that i could see from this trailer, is the teeth form. There are 2 types of teeth formations, the inner part is erbivore, the outer part is carnivore. I wonder if there are two people as you say, what that might translate into. Maybe 2 siamese twins one the opposite of the other? Very cool boss
i thought that too lol but I think it's just grafted, the same way godrick and morgott were
It's just Godrick in a lion suit
Miquella - Nascent Butterfly
Malenia - Aeonian Butterfly
Mesmer - Smoldering Butterfly
Mesmer could be a demigod deliberately forgotten like the Nameless King in Dark Souls
Or he is a demigod child of another empyrian like the gloam eyed queen and therefore he is a godskin apostle and also fits the title of demigod.
Could be the translation but in Miyazakis interview he says "Messmer and Marikas other children" as if to confirm it. @@TheSUGA1202
Messmer is Miquella. Its Mesmer's withered arm you touch.
Ever closer to that Lies of P crossover!
The pinned comment under this video has a japanese translation of Miyazaki saying Messmer is a child of Marika and has been purposefully forgotten. I can’t wait to die to him 🙂
His cape has a Rune on the back. The gold eyes and red hair make it seem he could be Radagon and Marika's third child, not to mention the fire butterfly could be representing him like aeonian and nascent butterflies represent Miquella and Malenia, as well as them having this first letter in their name, which in Elden Ring references familial bonds.
Miyazaki already confirmed he is an Empyrean
Melina's child is a possibility
Destined death, affinity for fire, connection to volcano manor
Marika is the GEQ confirmed. Not really. But my fingers are crossed
Exactly everything she guessed in this video 😮💨😮💨
I thought the fire butterfly represented melina
I actually think the DLC area used to be in the center of the map, between all the divine towers. The veil over the sky in the land of shadow is "Cloaking" the land and removing it from the rest of the lands between. Miyazaki implies in the interview that the land of shadow was once connected to the lands between, but some story event lead it to become disconnected. It would also make sense why this seemingly entire different land has stuff that is nonetheless connected to the lands between. If i were to further speculate, Marika probably did this, maybe in order to trap that Messmer guy inside.
holy shit i love this idea, im going with this for a prediction
Another piece to add to that theory is Malenia’s Isolated Tower. The other towers all form a semi-circle on the continent, except hers, which just sits in the middle of the ocean. Given the position of most of the continent relative to the sea level, I highly doubt Marika would’ve had that tower built that far out in the sea, unless it was originally connected to the continent. It’s possible the Land of Shadow will have an area with a massive hole where that tower used to be, and perhaps that’s where we find the red dancer given the blue dancer’s connection to Rot.
You might be absolutely correct. The piece of land missing in the center of the map is slightly larger than limgrave (the dlc size), and the Erdtree sits in the ocean as a projection. What we see in this trailer might be the actual, real Erdtree.
Agreed, the veil in the background is very strange!
kinda makes me think of the Mimic Veil, also called "Marika's Mischief"
29:05 Messmer's snake shoulders remind me of Zahhāk from the Shahnameh ("The Book of Kings", an epic poem about the mythical past of the Persian Empire), an evil king who had snakes growing from his shoulders due to a demon's curse.
Of note: Wikipedia also mentions other versions of the myth in which the character is named Aži Dahāka, was a monster rather than a cursed human, and/or is said to have possessed all possible sins and evil influences - possibly relevant, considering what other commenters (such as @tenpei7530) have noticed about his design.
I've always wanted to fight Johnny Snake-Shoulders!!🎉🎉
Im Persian..
and yeah..
its not a curse its more like a deal with devil somehow
and Azi Dhaka in old Persian means Dragon!
also in soulsgames Snakes are incomplete dragons!
and Messmer has a dragon eye..
11:52 might be an Archimedes' screw! it looks like it's drawing the lava up to a higher level, and may coincide to the ancient technology found across the lands between.
18:23 Messmer's weapon is similar to the spears impaling the thorn covered giant corpses in the mountaintops, and the staff of the guilty, in that they all have a trident formation and feature a helix design. this coincides with Messmer's weilding of thorn sorceries. thorn sorcerers gouge their eyes out and Messmer's left eye is closed...
His design reminds me a bit of Zahhak the Dragon King.
An evil tyrant and dark sorcerer from persian mythology,
who was known for two snakes, emerging from each of his shoulders.
Exactly, i think hes the one that stabbed all those spears through the giants, hence his title of "impaler." Theres not even a good reason for those spears to exist in the base game otherwise, unless you believe the thorn sorcerers made all of them (which seems a bit far-fetched for the sheer size and number of spears)
I think he's an allusion to Lucifer. After the Giants campaign, he was tempted by the power of the Sun/Blood Star/Fell God/Formless Mother and banished to the Shadow Lands by mommy and daddy.
@@bigmeatswangin5837that makes satan number 3 in Elden Ring. God I hope
The screw drawing in lava is super cool and could have been a tool to create the Divine Towers, since the towers are so large and even completely whole they may have been just molded with raw lava by giants.
36:40 The seal to the right of the spear could be the seal for miquella, Its two braided circles, the core component of miquella's design is his braided hair and it could represent the unified world miquella is seeking.
It reminded me immediately of the crown of the Haligtree soldier and knight helms
@@DLAsmashif looked at from above it would symbolize the ring around the soldiers helms perfectly
The ships/boats we see behind the Red Dancer are actually shown in-game. They’re shown on reliefs on the steles we light to fight the Ancestor Spirits, as well as in the Grand Cloister. Tarnished Archaeologist briefly suggested that he’s making a video on how these reliefs depict the arrival of the Numen in the Lands Between, and considering the DLC synopsis says that this Land of Shadow is where “Marika first set foot,” this could be a glimpse of the distant past.
Also, I think that Messmer’s spear is much more similar in design to Mohg’s. It’s messing two of its points and the obsidian, but the lower arc below the tips are virtually identical.
Going back to this area being a reflection of the time where Marika first came to the Lands Between, I think that we can actually see the Crucible in this trailer. The golden amber leaking from the tree seems to be collected by a large structure off in the distance, as if it’s collecting all that life energy in one place
I think the dlc will have something to do with the divine towers. They said this land is where marika first set foot. Maybe the baldichin veil is draped over all of the divine towers hiding this place which could explain the weird shape of the map in the base game. Also the boats in the blue area could be the boats that the numen arrived in. Would line up with the boat images in siofra river
I think Messmer may have something to do with the Exiled Soldiers present in Stormveil Castle and Castle Sol.
They have those Red Capes that resemble his look, their armor underneath also resemble his armor. With a scale look to it.
Also, they are linked to the thorns and a unknown sin underneath the Stormveil. We assume it is the Godwin corpse, but maybe it's something else.
Briars of sin and Punishment talk about exiled criminals and how they were blinded by thorns and discovered the Blood Star.
Blindness is associated with the flame of frenzy, so there is fire associated which also links to Messmer.
There is also the Thorn Sorcerers that accompany the Fire Monks!
They also reference exile!
Uhhhh THE CASTLE SOL ECLIPSE!!! IT HAS TO BE SOMETHING TO DO WITH IT!!
That's where you get the left side of the Haligtree Medalion!
And the Eclipse Shotel references a dreadful awe, which links to the the Exiled who discovered the Blood Star.
That is where the Shadow Realm comes from!! I can feel it!
MESSMER IS GRIFFITH!!!!!!
@lucascarpanzano2576 Maybe that explains why we never actually see the celestial body of the sun in Elden Ring's skybox. It is literally banished from the sky and is vilified/used to connote sin now. Lucifer is known as the Morning Star, and as the story goes, was cast out from the heights to hell below. Makes the serpent stuff pretty relevant.
They also drop Fire Butterflies!
@@bigmeatswangin5837 uhhhh never thought of that! The Lucifer connection also links Mogh and Rykard.
I think that maybe Messmer and what happened back during the war against the Giants is the missing link connecting a lot of different factions in Elden Ring. Each of them looking at fire and death and the end of the Gods from different directions.
i do always love that they use the raging wolf set for the tarnished in limelight. Such a cool set.
Loads of the iconography (or very similar) from Mohgwyn palace's appears. Like the circles which are in the floor in the lion boss, and the "stories" showing people, on the walls of the new castle
Yes! It's the same as on the walls of the Grand Cloister!
Is it Uhl dynasty?
On the last dialogue in the trailer, what really stuck out to me is that the voice had a Welsh accent, which is specific to the Carians! The usage of the different accents of the British isles in the base game was something I never really forgot, because it helped define the factions of the game very quickly in my mind lol. If the Rico character is reintroduced, and they're part of the Carians, it's a chance it could be them with an accent to match the rest of the Carian Royal Family.
Also messmer's armor is vaguely similar to roman centurion armor, very pontius pilate vibes. And the 'mimic horseman' makes me think of albinaurics. Same weapon, legs are disappearing, horse's legs are disappearing - plus there's the connection between albinaurics and seeking the haligtree
11:50 I think that could be what's known as and "Archimedes Screw", a kind of pump that has a rotating spiral inside of a tube, and can lift liquids up if positioned at an incline. It can also be used to generate power if the liquid flows down it, but based on the brief shot of it we get here I'm pretty sure it's lifting it up. Probably mean this is in some kind of forge or something similar.
Oh like three other people already commented that
I just noticed the snakes hanging off Mesmer have wings attached to them, which we've seen at Volocano Manor location as statues
The man in the painting at 1:03 in the trailer, his cloak looks like the one Morgott wears. His appearance at 2:22 reminds me of Morgott's shriveled body after you defeat him. Interestingly we get to see Morgott return to the Erdtree when he dissipates in Godfreys arms, unlike most bosses who kind of poof when the fight ends.
The skeletal creature riding the melted horse at 2:20 reminds me of the gargoyles mended with corpse wax, especially with the cavernous background, similar to the gargoyle duo fight.
13:58 the "wicker man" has a belt (?) that has red-haired giant masks (or skinned faces?), and peeking around his left hip I see a dragon head. Interesting mix of iconography with the omen horns and twisted thorns.
11:00 - I assume this is Shabriri, based on the yellow tint, the yellow robes, the eyes on his clasp, and him pulling the sword out of his head. When the player chooses the Frenzied Flame ending their head disappears in place of the flame, so it would be thematically consistent if he's pulling his head off as he draws that weapon.
Shabriri is already a character...
@@jhank0cean As a bodyswapper in the main world. We haven’t seen their actual corporeal form, only the possessed version of the dude with the big steel hat. That doesn’t exclude them from existing within Miquella’s dream, where Shadow takes place.
@@hollandscottthomas I like this theory, but this new character doesn't bear much of a resemblance to the face on the Shabriri's Woe talisman
@@七百七十七 The talisman does look like a much younger version of him for sure, but they might still be the same person.
Also the sword he’s pulling out is just the Great Rune, which feels a bit more symbolic, like I think it’s some “Erdtree faithful” being punished in an ironic way
At 19:52 odd when the trailer resumes it looks as if the black plumes resemble the branches of the Erdtree burning. They don't move with the red flames. Rykard has a painting of the Erdtree burning, and Melina refers to it as the "cardinal sin", so I'm getting the vibe that it was a prophetic dream of Marika's the tree would burn, and it's a perfect explaination to leave Messmer where he is.
I'm thinking of how satisfying it must be for these amazing artists to see these amazing analysis of their work (: thank you!
Yeah quelag really is one of the only creators analyzing the small details like that.
@35:40 the symbol you're trying to see is on the book cover. The right symbol in the circle is on the same as on Commander Niall's cloak from Castle Sol (I'm getting 2 snakes forming an eclipse) and the left symbol is dragonfire incantation vibes (incantations of those who hunted dragons). Gives me a sense that these two factions joined together would bring about the end of the light of the Erdtree.
in the very last scene, miquella seems to have a warming stone aura. The warming stone description says that the erdtree was once warm as the gentle sun and healed all those who bathed in its rays. scene ends with miquella looking up at the tree which suggests something similar is going on here, maybe related to the sun as well
To me, Miquella's ring emote looks just like the bright symbol of light coming from the grass somewhere in the first half of the trailer. The same ring (hands) and a line (body) piercing it at the right side. Also, if I remember correctly, Miquella's model has a hidden ring on his hand hanging out of the cocoon, and the ring's motif is reminiscent of that double helix ring we see on Messmer's cape emblem
maybe that's miquella's great rune
Miquella's hair is braided in a double helix right from the first cutscene
around 1:00 of the dlc video, that looks like an archimedes screw for magma
I love the veil, I'm getting as above so below vibes with the veiled imagery because I don't think the death ending in game has the same veil. What if there's another side to the erdtree of the fingers, where you have to ruin another country with a Doo Doo leech tree for the tree back in the lands between to flourish, or like what if horah loux and the tarnished were sent to sabotage the erdtree that became the shadow tree
Quelag i rly wanna point out the cathedral they showed like 4 times in the trailer. They panned over it in the very beginning and it looks similar to the broken cathedral of manus celes. However, the geography kinda suggests that this cathedral is in east liurnia as opposed to our cathedral being in west liurnia. This makes me question if perhaps this is where we can find miquella's or maybe essmer's fingers if esmer turns out to be another empyrean.
The Marais set also says that children in that family are born sick, and Maleigh reveres rot/Malenia. I think that all supports a Marais connection in the swampy area. They also just stand out for me for having so many M names.
I could totally be wrong but iirc Marais is a French word for swamp or marshland
@@Mari-Malady-Magneti can confirm: Marais equals swamp in french
Wanted to chip in - the melting horse rider reminds me a LOT of The Nuckelavee. Its a creature from Scottish folklore which brought pestilence and destruction upon islands it appeared on. Its almost 1:1 with the trailer enemy - a skeletal, fleshy rider fused to its steed. I wouldnt be surprised if the boss encounter was full of either dead blight or some other type of poison.
11:55 I think this huge contraption is an Archimedes screw, a system to ferry water up the tube using an infinite screw principle. In this one second of animation we can see a single arm of an helix rotating in it. Cool way to carry lava up an incline.
a few things extra I found:
- the lion guy seems to be a pretty straight representation of chinese dragon dancers. the hands and legs under the cloth holding up this leonine face, all covered in crucible imagery. this is potentially a grafted guardian AGAINST the omen curse. all the sin, omen, and crucible imagery seems to me that this land fell in the age of the crucible. where they tried to fight back the omen / crucible curse.
- the grey lady in the nox-like environment had a collar reminiscent of the tail feathers of a cuckoo bird. this combined with all the birdcages, and the ties we already suspected between the nox people and the carians of today. she really seems to be a missing link to that story, and clearly part of the cuckoo
- the pale rider's horse ties him in with the those who live in death and godwyn: they are obvioulsy death themed, but the horse reminds me of a hippocampus from mythology. a half horse half fish creature. this is interesting as godwyn seems to also have grown fish imagery after his death, including the tail like this decaying hippocampus
- along with the crucible imagery, a lot of architecture and armor is ancient antiquity inspired. this clearly harkens to a past age, one of godfrey and crucible, however this doesn't have to be the past per se. I am pretty convinced it just went to shit in that age, and we find the remnants of it.
- I think this might be Miquella's dreamscape thing, just like how we entered godwyn to fight the lichdragon. the baldichin also reinforces this belief of mine, along with the twin twisted trees (miquella being malenia's other half)
- oh yeah I forgot to mention this, but messmer is inspired by berserk grunbeld probably. inforcing the dragon knight vibe we're getting.
- the wickerman is also an inspiration from berserk, the same inspiration that spawned DS2's the rotten
Ah yes beserk, the origin of all fantasy and European mythology… You know wickermen is a famous tradition and even has a film about it well before the comic
@@joesheridan9451 im talking about the specifics of that giant walking cage being an instrument to punish sinners by putting them in and it burning eternally. if you would look into the specifics of the three designs you can see its not just a generic interpretation of a wickerman, but a specific one. Miyazaki is widely known for his direct adaptation of some berserk designs because he loved that manga so much.
May just be my background, but the horse creature reminds me way more of a Nuckelavee, from Orcadian folklore. Also sea dwelling creatures that are described as a horse with a man's torso attached, pretty similar to the creature shown. They're heavily associated with pestilence, death of livestock and such
@@stranger3852 oh wow! I had no idea about this, im gonna look into this folklore. thank you so much for sharing!
The lion dancer doesn't appear to be grafted. I have a screenshot available that does show a dude standing on the back of another dude.
Quelaag you're a mad lad for your insane spiral analysis live stream after the premiere (we love you for it) AND a now summary vid? Amazing. What an amazing day.
People got so distracted by the badass martial arts at 21:30 that they didn't see that the twinblade the knight wields is the same one the tarnished uses at the end 29:45. The crucible knight wings are the weapons ash of war!
1) The Melty-horse looks to be a Nuckalavee: a _very_ malevolent Orkadian spirit of ill omen, pestilence and death, that only has one description of its appearance recorded that states it looked like a giant decaying corpse riding a flayed/rotting horse.
2) The sword/candle tree stabbed through the man's head looks to be made of amber
3) Messmer's flame seems to produce black writing before bursting into what appears to be blood flame then Golden Grace
4) I can't help but see the Shadow Tree as 2 lovers embracing, especially from Miquella's point of view at the end of the trailer.
5) I realised that there is one _massive_ assumption that we've all been making about the lore: We've assumed this whole time that Marika existed before or at the same time as Radagon, as Marika brought with her the Age of the Erdtree and with it Golden Grace to the Lands Between, putting an end to the Age of the Crucible then some time after that Radagon appeared seemingly out of nowhere, but the Lionel Misbegotten are described in the game files as "Radagon's Children" and Radagon shares his red hair with the Fire Giants suggesting that his lineage is from well before the Age of the Erdtree.
So what if Radagon existed _before_ Marika? What if Marika first setting foot in the Lands of Shadow was in fact Radagon gaining Marika as a second aspect instead, leading to them being selected as an Empyrean? What if Radagon had found a way to create the Erdtree, but the process of doing so split him into the Red King and the White Queen aspects we see throughout the rest of the story?
there's a nice possible reference to Messmer at the Church of Pilgrimage. There's a spirit outside saying "O Marika. Queen Eternal. He is your unwanted child." could be about Messmer.
nah, that's just referring to the soulless demigod in the wandering mausoleum
Isn't he also near the IMPALERS catacombs?
Ooooh, that's a really good catch
The "gladiator" set reminds me of Bernahl sets pants, same roman design. Another link to the volcano manor maybe ?
I was completely off the Evil Miquella hype train, but the trailer actually made me consider it for the first time.
I have a feeling this emphasis on "Kind Miquella" in the trailer, shown glowing with divine light at the end of the trailer might be a red herring, and that Messmer is the Fallen/Luciferian/Unseelie Fay/Vampiric (the Impaler clearly parallels Vlad the Impaler a.k.a. Dracula) version to the traditional Angelic, Seelie-Fay version of Miquella. And the name Messmer practically means "hypnotism or a compelling attraction and fascination", which makes me think of the Bewitching Branch.
Also the description that we are following in the footsteps of Miquella makes me think he is not here for interactions with the player, and the description of Miquella who "Divested himself of his flesh, his strength, his lineage. Of all things Golden. And now Miquella awaits the return of his promised Lord." could be read that he stripped himself of everything that made him Miquella, and waits now for the Tarnished as a boss
And two things can be true at the same time, the two versions could coexist, be an alter ego, or perhaps a corrupted version that exists as a separate entity, while the spiritual good Miquella might still be a helper.
It’s said the Miquella has a seductive nature. I definitely got that vibe from Messmer.
@@AsAugustSleeps Literally. And Masmers name implies hypnotism. Its like Miquella, but gone wrong. Ofc, I could be completely wrong 😁
@@Alex-mn1fbI definitely think you’re right.
@@AsAugustSleeps haha, thanks. On one hand, I would like to be validated about Messmers true identity, on the other, I am still hoping for good Miquella as a questgiver. But... knowing Myazaki and Elden Ring, its highly possible we could have both at the same time
I want you to know I REALLY enjoyed this. Love how you break down lore! Thanks again!
Mesmer looks to me like a wild mix of every Party that stands against the golden order. Dragon Stuff, Snake Stuff, godskin stuff etc. Like he united all opponent partys. I really think it is miquela. And I think moghs bad influence has something to do with it.
Maybe the Search for for a solution for Godwyn made her mad and he/she got crazy.
Divesting himself of his flesh, his strength, his lineage.
Of all things Golden.
Miquella becoming Mesmer Is also so FromSoft (also reeks of Grrm), to have the promised saviour succumb to some sort of "evil" and become corrupted on their path. FromSoft love doing the Icarus thing e.g. Slave knight Gael, Artorias, Blooddrunk hunters, genichiro etc.
Maybe HE is the reason that all of those individual things are outlawed :O
@@quelaagmaybe the shadowlands are set in the past. And like back to the future he wants to change the present :O :D
And now it’s getting weird :D What if she/he does the bohemian rhapsody Move. I don’t want to die, but sometimes I wish I would never be born at all. Look at him and godwyn and Malenia. They all suffer. And he finds no way of ending that suffer. Not for the Rot and not for godwins Dead. So why not killing Marika in the past, before all the suffer is happening, before Marika became a god, to stop all that Suffer. Maybe we have to save Marika and not Miquela. Maybe the blond girl on torrent is young Marika.
Second Idea.
Or it is a nightmare. He slumbers and moghs influence turned it into an nightmare. And we must awake him.
I think all of what you said makes sense but I would probably take out Mogh's part from it, just because Mogh has an outer god and this supposed alter ego of Miquela seems to give no fucks about gods at all. or maybe it's Mogh influence AND all the rest, since he was probably pissed off about being in the short end of all the outer gods plans, so he just embraced pure chaos and all the powers of everyone, even the crucible (his last attack in the vid). the only thing we didn't see on him was maybe madness
In the Japanese interview with IGN Miyazaki confirmed it was a third child from Marika and Radagon that was never talked about, and we’ll learn why in the DLC
My guess is that Miquella's runes are the DLC's sites of grace, because of what Miyazaki said in the interview about following Miquella's footstep as we followed Marika's guidance in the base game.
marika was absolutely stabbed by the elden beast during her crucifixion, it’s pierced thru her womb so she can never have any more children as part of her punishment for the shattering
11:50 I didn't notice it at first until you mentioned the spinning, but if that is spinning inside then that could be some sort of pump. There are pumps with a corkscrew like design. They are pumping the molten lava up that pipe
I think Messmer might have been mentioned in the game.
In Castle Sol where you find the second half of the haligtree medallion, there's a ghost npc that says "Forgive me, Lord Miquella. The sun has not been swallowed, our prayers were lacking. Your comrade remains soulless." There's a mausoleum with a dead demigod's corpse just outside Castle Sol. A demigod that was Miquella's comrade. Was that him maybe?
Of course, the soulless mentioned there could very well be Godwyn, but there's the mausoleum just outside Castle Sol which doesn't seem to be a coincidence, and it's kinda odd that the ghost would refer to someone as important and esteemed as Godwyn just as "comrade". Also, we don't know yet if a soulless demigod can be alive in the shadow realm (maybe their souls go there?).
At 20:26 the candles look similar the spine that the old man tries to pull out his face.
Perhaps Mesmer is Marika's first born, from the Dragon age, or from the Crucible age. Remember Crucible knights also have a red tinge to their gold, so red is associated with the crucible in some way. I think he is her first or certainly one of the older children. This realm seems to be where the unwanted go, kind of hidden in the shadow, and we know that Miquella shielded the unwanted by his Halig tree. Perhaps here he wanted to heal those who were shunned by the golder order but due to interruption by Mohg he is not present to do so
I really feel like I can see tiny fingerprints of the frenzied flame on the melted part of the spearhead on Messmers weapon
The twinblade at 29:25 is the same one the knight is using at 21:29! Assuming it drops form him I don’t think it’s the twinblade of abundance and decay.
The Land of Shadow is where things that the Golden Order would rather have forgotten get sent to. The wickermen are particularly brutal weapons, a Demigod with ties to snakes/opposing the Erdtree (who may have been heavily involved with the war with the giants given the “Impaler” imagery), omen creatures from cultures outside the Lands Between, etc
24:45 Nuckelavee from celtic mythology
Imo, link to the undead.. purple and skeleton like mariners
Very interesting
Elden Ring always fascinated me with it's use of nature and so when I saw the veil coming off the trees I saw something else that I see in nature sometimes. I saw the giant version of the web of a field spider. Sometimes in fields or even in yards in the city these little spiders will spin these webs that look like very thin sheets & they can cover grass & plants in what look like little veils. I imagine if I was small enough that standing under one would look like being under that skybox.
All this reminds me of Miquella's abilities as a weaver, the making of his own cocoon as well as the cocoons filled with Albinurics & such you see throughout the Haligtree speak to his web spinning powers. It seems the entire shadow realm that we experience could be a creation of Miquella's, or at least under their direct influence & that the "baldachin" as well as the fabrics covering the city could be either representations or the direct results of Miquella's weavings throughout this realm.
that clip of the old man removing that unalloyed needle looking thing is giving end of DLC boss cutscene
I feel like he's raising the hilt just enough so a bigger boss can use him as a sword...🤷🤣
@@thewhistler6537 wouldn’t be the first in the game ahha
@@jai249 Imagine him screaming as he's whipped around. 🤣
The best analysis and in depth reasoning I've seen so far for the dlc
I think the Wormface is actually a LampreyFace. It has what look like gill openings along it's flank, and the ocean imagery ties quite neatly with Godwyn's transformation
Those boats you point out at 23:39 I really believe are the ones depicted on the Obelisks in Siofra River Well area. The coming of the Numen.
That would make sense because they said this place is where marika first set foot and we know marika is a numen.
You came ready with the whole spread sheet and photos for reference, mad respect. Idk why you don’t have more subs
I feel like the lion boss thing has to have something to do with Godwyn, Lion representation of the golden lineage, Golden Hair, Golden lightning which seems very specific as the vid gives off no other lightning vibes. I don’t what relation to Godwyn exactly, but I really think there has to be something :p hopefully we get a cool golden lightning spell out of it:))
Miyazaki said in one of the famitsu interviews that the "Dance Beast" is related to the culture that existed before Marika rose to godhood. it predates Godwyn.
@@tylerhawksmoor9601 it predates Godwyn… just like the birth of the golden lineage.
We don’t know all the secrets of the lineage. As far as we know now, it is entirely built off a lie (Hoarah Louxs fake persona). Who’s to say there aren’t more secrets?
35:42 It´s really cute to see Quelaag wondering how the rune of Messmer might look like if you can clearly see the same rune on the box left, of the collectors editiom hardpack.
Is it possible that the gloam-eyed queen was Marika's other half before Radagon? Messmer and Melina could be children of the gloam-eyed queen yet still be offspring of Marika. There is a lot of history in the lands between that we don't get know, and Marika slaying gods and the like to become the sole goddess of the lands between before having that "alter ego" destroyed could be possible. She would also likely get rid of any evidence including hiding any children from that time.
A lot of speculation on my part, but I wanted to chime in with a different angle
Edit: Also, if Melina and Messmer are siblings by nature of both being children of the gloam-eyed queen, then Messmer's flame could be the flame Melina walks beside
something that caught my eye: the wickerman has fire giant heads(?) or imagery on its legs. not sure what that means but cool detail
19:30 it looks like blood flame to me.
The castle at 12:00 is actually Farum Azula before it was destroyed, same trees around the area, same rock at the base, and the stones falling apart at the tip of the castle is the beginning of it's destruction
isnt farum azula before desctruction just the Placiusax arena
also bc farum azula is a "temple in the sky"
Have you checked out The Tarnished Archaeologist yet? He goes into great detail about the architectural elements and how they relate to the real-world cultures that inspired the games. He's not always right about things but he explains the spinning lava tube (Archimedes' Screw) among other things. And sometimes he is shockingly spot-on.
this was the breakdown video I was waiting for....great stuff
Still praying for the bossfight "Royal Architect Dectus and Liftbuilder Rold" in the DLC.
30:47 the tree also appears to be frozen in time, the fragments under it don't fall.
24:45 the melting horse minotaur thing reminds me of a concept boss from one of Vaati's art competitions
The candleholder Weapons in the trailer and the Thing that is stuck through the old man/yellow king have the shape of a kind of Spruce/ fir trees. Saw in older lore videos Things about the Great Tree that was before the erdtree. And I think it has the same shape.
23:30
If the land we're treading on is in the center of The Lands Between then the sea border on the East side would be a good candidate for finding ships that accidentally sailed "over the edge" of what's been veiled. If i remember correctly there's a waterfall around the eastern edge that you can see from the east coast of Caelid
the one castle at 12:15 has spiral pillars at the bottom of the stairs that look suspiciously like the envoys horn
Hi Quelaag! Lovely video, I've been having such a blast hearing everyone's takes and theories about all the incredible stuff shown in the trailer! (One small thing though! I am audio engineer irl and I highly recommend utilizing a de-esser for your microphone as S's are extremely shrill in the audio this time around
I dabble in audio engineering and I can tell you the average person doesn’t notice these things even though you are right
Hey, I don't know if you noticed @ 15:02 of your video. You can see the lion thing is actually 2 people you can see the lion head dude standing on top of the other ones back. On the BANDAI NAMCO Europe ELDEN RING Shadow of the Erdtree | Official Gameplay Reveal Trailer. you can see it at 1:27.
Maybe mesmer is the father of the godskins? The godskins have serpent like features.
the canopy is the formless mother, im calling it now.
You're a gem for doing this summary. I joined the stream late and 4 hours is a lot of content to go through LOL
You can see the swirling cloth behind the statue that is common to Marika's statue in the main game so it probably is Marika.
The shield in the Messmer fight is inspired by the longshield, a real weapon that was used in duel situations (like trial by combat) in Europe in the 15th century.
It also reminds me of something else, an earlier occurrence of two-handed shields used in sanctioned fights, but I can't remember it clearly.
You've shown a relief in your Elden Ring Map video and I swear it looks just like the grafted enemy 14:25
26:24 kinda looks like the noble gold mask, or the guy from stormveil castle gostoc
23:44 Me and my brother got some Alabaster/Onyx Lord-vibes here, Definetly star-related considering the similarities to Radahn, the gravity tools, Fallingstar, Ruins Greatsword etc.
And oh boyy I got No clue about this boomerang-thing.. Very excited about you drawing the yellow dude, he looks Soo cool!!!
There is the "Impaler's catacombs" maybe that's referencing him
I'm not sure why Fia isn't talked about here, she is a deathbed companion who has a dream as well, maybe one of the bosses in the DLC might have a relation to her such as that lion who maybe could be Godwyn, also without a doubt that Messmer is Miquella, Miquella traveled in the Lands of Shadow to find out how Marika became a god, he found out how and got corrupted by it so he became a god as well, as for the giant dude with flames he could be a relation to dung eater since it does have a sun symbol on its cage and as we all know Dung eater wants to corrupt the future and perhaps that giant is the first root of it all. St Trina might be in this DLC as well.
There is a deathroot type enemy (the horse guy) who has a black mass inside of him - Id be willing to bet we'll get some extra!
@@quelaag Wouldn't that be great, really hope the DLC bosses are as hard or harder then Malenia, would love to post boss videos for DLC also good job on the observation, I can never pick out small details like how you do.
22:35 Well the Erd Tree has the Elden Ring and the Elden Beast. It stands to reason the Crucible may have had its own beast within it... Perhaps the true final boss of the DLC? 👀
the spinning thing in lava at 11:55 is most likely an Archimedes' screw, used to transport the lava upwards
The shot of the landscape and the tree specifically at 5:30 reminds me a lot of the Dark Sign at the ending of DS3, and the way it was styled after a crucible being poured. If you look at the golden sap coming from the tree, the perspective seems to intentionally line up to where it's flowing down into the top of the U shaped structure
There is 2 Fire Giant heads hanging at the brazier boss waist at around 13:00
The trailer description states that the shadow land is "where the goddess Marika first set foot". I wonder if the woman in the picture could be Marika's mother or even Marika itself. Messmer has been confirmed to be Marika's child and the red hair points to Radagon, but could it be possible that Marika had a child in the land of shadow before becoming a goddess and marrying Godfrey? That could explain why there's no mention of Messmer anywhere in the Lands Between.
23:30 Hmm interesting comparison w the background being the opposite color.. And while I don't fully see it, Very fascinating if we could get some more about boats!!
I also like how you mention Lance and the others, it's so cool to see you community big-shots come together!! You should do like a stream together!!
30:38 look how the text of the dlc appears on screen, it looks to me like something rising up out of water or maybe fog, it looks different from the animation of the elden ring text above.
Is this the same dreamscape for which we find Fortissax?
It would make sense for there to be a connection between the deathbed companions and Miquella through the themes of sleep and dreams.
Crunchy talked in one of this videos about a spirit realm. Maybe this is it. This is a metaphysical realm, where people don’t bring their bodies, but instead their spirits. We might find a lot of ancestral spirits in some of these dlc areas.
12:07 The gate of that castle looks like the Dynasty Obelisks underground.
Do you think there could just be a direct connection between Messmer and Melina? Since they are both kinda kept ambiguous
11:53 I would bet that this is a screw pump or archimedes screw. Propably lifts the lava upwards
11:59 an archimedes screw? Bringing magma up to somewhere?
The lava tube at 11:57 is an archimedes screw! It's carrying lava up somewhere.
11:32 jars on chains, being lowered to fertilise the roots of a tree?
To me, the spinning pipe thing at 11:58 looks like an Archimedes screw. It's used to move liquids and such up inclines. Basically just a big spinning screw that scoops and lifts stuff up the inside of the tube.
10:21 To me, this interesting ruin, mired in what looks like a deathblight swamp, reminds me of the ruins just before you reach the Lake of Rot, Ainsel River, where you encounter the Baleful Shadow and cheese it in the elevator hallway to the right of the area because you stubbornly refuse to level up Vigor. They always stood out as somewhat of an oddball set of ruins in the depths of the Ainsel, almost sealing away the Lake of Rot below.
Up close at 26:38, the yellow along the sword or whatever looks a lot like the wax seals on the buildings in Leyndell. This is definitely my favorite scene from the trailer, what a cool visual