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The GANDALF Empire Build | Empire vs Khorne - Total War Warhammer 3
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- Опубліковано 19 сер 2022
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My favorite part of LOTR was when Gandalf opened a Vortex to the Pit and killed 50 little Balrogs
It's Ganbin time
Don't spoil the Amazon show for the rest of us.
Funny thing is, Gandalf probably actually did that in the First Age. First Age stuff is strangely very comparable to warhammer...
Shit, did I read a different version of LOTR then? That sounds rad as hell! The one I read people sat in bushes and wanked over how amazing salt is!
@@Count.Saruman Gandalf didn't arrive in Middle Earth until the third age.
The new game mode is about objectives. The Empire's objective was to murder every foul demon. Khorne was probably impressed.
if they would have brought ratlinggunteams from their skaven allies they could have done it with more style and faster
@@thanquolrattenherz9665 what are you talking about? Skaven don't exist. No such thing. Yes Witch Hunter, this person right here
This battle was thematic as hell. The bloodthirsty warriors of Khorne rushing past the objectives to crash against the disciplined defensive lines of the Empire, nearly overrunning the position before being blasted apart by the gunpowder of Nuln.
THE EMPIRE STANDS
Love how you're still rooting for the empire, even if you play against it.
"Look for my coming, at 1st light on the 5th day. At dawn, pray to Sigmar, because I'm bringing the Sunmaker." -Gandalf the Grey 2.0
Seeing empire knights finally doing well makes me a happy boy.
this makes me happy for you c:
YEEEE SIGMARS HORSES FINALLY MOVE AT REAL SPEEDS
@@AidsTiger They aren't supposed to be this fast...
glory for the empire! I think Gelt and Final transmutation might have good play in domination to clear objectives from all these wide builds. Sure, pit of shades will be better at dealing with large blobs and elite units but I think FT covers most (all?) of the objective area
Final trans is ok, Ive tested it and the biggest issue it has is that since the game is on ultra unit size (rather than large like in game 2) most direct damage spells are a bit underwhelming. Final trans does mediocre but not terrible damage to infantry and decent damage to cav, it is good at killing squishy SEMs tho. Its other biggest issue is that it is super expensive for what it does. You have to get really really good casts for it to do well, and a competent opponent wont let you do that.
The mad man did it. The midnight video.
Hell yeah!
Seeing Empire Knights charging always gives me the full chub, love seeing that speed buff on them.
It's a buff that doesn't make sense, even lore wise
@@lucacharpagne2067 what? Horses should be fast, armor wouldn't slow them down that much.
@@LuzikArbuzik77 except it does. But that's not the issue. People are mad that fully barded EMP Knights are faster than BRT Knights who in the lore are better and just as fast as HE Knights who use Mithril barding and should have the same speed as Light Cav.
@@LuzikArbuzik77 then buff brett and elven cav, they are supposed to be faster
@@LuzikArbuzik77 heavier horses who can take heavily armored knights and full barding slower. Even for a horse another 50+ kilos of weight directly on it spine isn't nothing and it will tire quickly.
Khorne just as vampire counts wants to get into melee as soon as possible.
Empire stood back and used their fire power here, took objectives later.
Hold your posts! Men of the Empire do not retreat!
I'm sure others noted it, and it's obviously late for this comment to make an impact, but I am always impressed by willingness to cover defeats when it provides valuable learning information. Obviously, the era of total rush dominance and Pit Punching is at least somewhat over, but providing novel strategies for a watching player is always nice.
They really need to add the value counter for replays!
The Khorne threat has been vanquished. For the Empire! For Sigmar!
Sure, I'll watch a new Turin video at 2am. Why not?
this is my go to "eating food while watching" channel. Thank you
FEAST!
So looking forward to playing a Morathi campaign with little Ms. Pit of Shades.
At least before they nerf it. Not trying to argue if it should or not, but as it stands especially in MP it probably will get one.
What do you think for the rework of magic that instead of damage nerf to magic they tacked on like a second or two to the cast time before let's say pit of shades goes off? Giving the player time to react even if a unit is engaged in a fight currently.
I personally think don’t think it was a change which did much. Most of the time vortex stuff is being used when someone is clearly either not looking at a stationary unit or more often when they’re in combat. And when they’re mixed into combat the odds that you can move them out of range are slim.
I think this map is my favorite. Having the shorter distance to engagement means faster action, I enjoy this style of domination the most, I hope they add more maps like this in future.
"he's just waiting here with a full chub". Turin, your commentary always kills me😂
Nurgle gave me the covid for the 3. time (despite taking shallya's vaccine), it's nice to be able to watch these "guide-like" let's play's :)
Looking forward to tuesday.
And on the midnight of the fifth day, look to the subscription box. Thanks for the upload.
I think the best way to balance magic is to lower the armor piercing damage of most spells. That way elite infantry can be powerful and it should discourage the extremely boring wide builds that swarm objectives. Also spells should have a much large wind up time like what they did the the Usabti summon. It used to be fine in land battles, but with domination there is often simply too much going on to dodge the spell effectively if your units speed is 30 or below.
Been saying the exact same thing about the sun maker since you guys started streaming IE content. Glad to see we agree on the thing =) great video!
As a vampire coast lover in pvp. I dont see why queen bess isnt auto picked every game. It shoots at a nice angle with no obstructions and decimates infantry. Will be like the sun maker.
Last time I heard it was bugged for infinite ammo. Be kinda weird if that was still the case two days before release tho
ua-cam.com/video/fj5dhqLUd7k/v-deo.html
To be honest, Bess seems like its AOE isn't nearly as potent as the Sunmaker, two salvos can heavily damage multiple infantry units, whereas Bess' low splash will only really wreck one unit at a time.
@@seannowlan4389 queen bess can 2 tap most units with 1 hit going over haf hp in TW2 atleast. The sunmaker has more splash but less dmg overall so in TW2 atleast queen bess is better.
that is why domination, mode is the best multiplayer experience even for newbies because a lot of different builds can be done, and in land battle it’s other lvl, and same meta and units that we like that don’t have use on land battles, but in domination we can try lots of different units.
I can't wait for players to learn to not send single units into combat to be defeated in detail. Wait until you can advance a formation and then engage and attack. It's driving me nuts that this is the best Strategic gamemode for Total War but advanced Warhammer players keep committing the biggest strategic blunder that every commander of any Army in history has always tried to avoid since the beginning of time.
I just played a Domination game as Cathay where I only advanced units in divisions that held formation together and wiped the floor of Khorne. Because I only advanced or retreated units in groups. Never singularly. Stop uses units as individuals and use them in teams.
Wonderful match. For some time I have been wondering about your views on builds, and perhaps by being an elite(or simply higher tier) player may be influencing you. Always remember COMBINED ARMS! Empire, Vampire Coast, all Elven factions, Tomb Kings, Lizardmen, Skaven, and Greenskins have their greatest strengths not in their Legendary Lords, not in their Lores of Magic, but in their variety and adaptability. The ability to combine various forms of violence together in order to best overcome the enemy is among the most impactful skills you could hone in this game! I look forward to your next video.
Idk how I feel about magic, it's definitely OP but magic kinda should be very strong. I think the best way to balance some spells is cooldowns, time for the spell to cast and maybe Area decrease (only if it's insanely OP tho). Spells like Comet of Casandorra, imo are super balanced since game 1. Super strong and can wipe units, but it's got a huge cast time and high magic cost.
This empire play is giving me a full Chub.
Love the play style from Empire here. Would love to see more wide Hero/Caster builds
Every match with Empire
Turin: This colour scheme is very similar/different to my table top scheme
Feel like you could bring a more mobility focused build with a line of cheap melee as the empire. Just grab yourself 4 state spears, 2 empire knights, 2 grenadiers, and 2 huntsman. You don't really need the front to hold anymore because you can't really go toe to toe with demons of khorne or nurgle. You should focus on mobility and range. have a front that will hold long enough and a back that will withstand furies and you'll be able to retake everything
Turin, you say this a lot in this video: what on earth do you mean by "instead of bringing a Lord?" You literally must bring a lord on the campaign map for a battle.
I also prefer stronger magic myself, so I hope Pit of Shades is given something like less pull and more cast time or something instead of a straight damage nerf. Maybe make overcasting more dangerous too, or something similar.
I'd also like Heroes to be given more capture weight, so we actually see people taking something other than mages.
Yeah I hope they focus on dodge-ability. Nobody would say Comet or Slicing shards are OP... They delete units, but you have so much time to dodge it's really your fault if it hits.
All that does is make slow units worse then. Magic needs more risk and counterplay. Adding in wizard level, expanding miscasting, and adding a one-use dispell scroll like tabletop would be a big improvement imo.
I think Milkandcookies mentioned it's going to get a wind up time increase so it's actually dodgeable.
It’s weird that Valkia isn’t a demon, I thought in the lore she ascended to daemonhood and physically she no longer resembles a human being, she has hooves, horns and wings.
its s bit nitpicky but i think in the lore khorne resurrected her and rebuild her body to be a better combatant, but didn't actually do the ascension to daemonhood bit. so she is a mutated (technically) mortal lord. kinda the khorne version of sigvald
@@darchensol5112 She's definitely considered a daemon princess and not a mutated mortal. It's more explicit in her novel, when she was slain and resurrected by Khorne the first time, that was her ascension.
Technically she's a daemon princess, not a daemon. Mortals who become creatures of Chaos like daemons while retaining their mental faculties are referred to as princes/princesses. It's kind of a quibbling distinction but that's the jargon.
The problem is TT and army book lore > novels, and it just so happens GW didn't agree or felt she should be ascended to be a daemon princess, so that's how it is. Whether it be cause of balance reasons for TT or their vision of her to be a mortal, dunno.
Imo I feel it's silly, being a daemon doesn't change a whole lot in the grand scheme of things when she's already at the level of one and looks like one, and it just makes more sense. She's Khorne favorite, even goes by the title of consort and bride, so much so that she's the only one Khorne has outright resurrected after dying.
Why then recreate her as a mortal again so she can die again? Perhaps Khorne likes his poetry and the fragility of mortals more than his daemons, but you'd think one of Khorne's most favored mortals, who's done so much for him and even has a special task as a valkyrie, would be granted the highest befitting position as a daemon and immortal.
@@prinstyrio0 Well Daemons are apart of Khorne, so making Valkia, his waifu, part of himself would be like. Selfcest.
great video. And interesting theory
Wouldn’t just taking an exalted bloodthirster or Skaevrand counter the grey Wizard type builds? Since they wouldn’t really have much to counter large armored monsters unless they brought a bunch of arty?
Not really, 3 units of huntsmen/handgunners in a killbox would kill a bloodthirster/Skarbrand within about 2 minutes and as a single entity, he'd only be able to attack 1 of them at a time OR the grey wizard. You'd be trading 2000 gold for a 600 gold unit.
The only large units the empire field is Cavalry so Khorne Doesn't need to go super heavy into a massive duellist character, I'd be happy to bring 2 elite units of chaos cavalry and some flesh hounds. They would dumpster the Empire cavalry in a single engagement while also being able to flank and pressure all the missile units at the same time + they are so heavily armoured that huntsmen arrows wouldn't hurt them much AND I think even a unit of furies would kill a grey wizard, they are very weak heroes in melee, you don't need a massive monster, furies are faster too to catch him on his horse.
I'd only bring an Exalted bloodthirster in a land battle where Karl/Boris are very likely to show up and the battle doesn't last very long so your lords HP pool doesn't get whittled down by extended engagements.
That's what Pit of Shades is for in the case of elite infantry, skaarbrand would be dragged down by the huntsmen fire they brought as well
I'm just excited to fight chaos with ol' Balthazar. Rain that silvery doom from the skies like no tomorrow.
Might have to finally play multiplayer with Immortal Empires coming out.
I think the factions with weaker lords are deffo going to start going lordless. I much prefer to run a Hidden Stonehorn Mounted Hunter as my 'lord'. You get so much more mass on the board.
Grey wizards should have a bonus vs large as a hint towards Gandalf's fight with the Balrog.
I see this as a demonstration that marauder horsemen, while providing useful poke and anti-air, can't fulfill Khorne's core functions as well as going wider with Flesh Hounds and Furies
While he thought the world was sleeping he uploaded. Little did he know that his fanbase is full of people with bad sleep schedules
Well it's 8am over here in the UK so waking up to a Turin video is always nice.
@@fallenhero4550 well, now I know that the UK is about 6 hours away from US Central time
GG. Spells are just another form of artillery. They do damage at a distance within an area of effect. The question is: should some spells be way more powerful than the best real artillery?
Pit of shades would have been absolutely horrific on anything except Khorne/Dwarves with their magic resist
Going cheap and wide suits the empire so well! They got to use a lot of their more vulnerable troops and also were able to protect their ranged troops enough to get ahead! Here's hoping they climb up the tier list.
Honestly I was surprised how well they held the line. State troops are better than people typically think but against khorne I just expected them to get stomped.
Would the Black Lion War Wagon also be good for the maps that The Sun Maker wouldn't get good line of sight? Since it also can get good value but runs out of ammo fast
Oppa Gandalf Style!
I did not expect the empire to completely table Khorne
This is why I hope there will be a total war age of sigmar, magic in that is meant to be busted but it's not exactly always on your side even if you are the one who casted it. Would make for some very creative, interesting and wild mechanics.
Can you make a video about your tabletop armies? I'd be super interested to see what they look like :)
Pretty sure Gandalf would be a Light wizard... even as the grey
what's that sound effect that starts at 4:13 and happens again around 6:42? it seems to happen in khorne replays. i hope thats a glitch that gets taken out upon release of immortal empires.
I think Valkia would have been a good option to take out the Sunmaker, maybe her wind spell or just use her invulnerability
In retrospect, i think if you used valkia more aggressive on the artillery piece and wizard you might have had a better chance. I dont think there was anything on the field that the empire could have used to counter and kill Valkia.
What do people think about Hellstorm compared to Fire Rain?
Magic seems to be more out of control when it's high armour piercing damage coupled with short cast speed. You can't avoid it and it kills even the most high armoured elite target. Pit of shade seems broken because instead of taking 10 seconds for it to do damage like all the other elite killing spells it only has a 5 second cast time. I'm guessing it's balanced around counterplays (5 second cast time but deals its damage over time) but there's nothing to counter it with. Beside healing spells there's nothing much to do when your unit gets locked down. Most defensive spells aren't usefull against spell damage and those that are don't give enough counterpunch so that it nets out a loss for the initial caster. Therefore it's better to counter with your own damage spells. The dwarfs got a rune for granting a unit ward save which could in theory be good but since casting one rune causes all your runes to go on cooldown it's hard to use them to save something from damage. In general all proactive spells outperforms reactive spells so there's no point in using the reactive spells when you could instead use the proactive, damage dealing spell to greater effect.
Valkia! You! Shall not! Pass!
WoM needs to be part of army building. Factions with magic should have a base amount of WoM and the ability to buy maybe 20 more tops, while factions without magic should start with a WoM penalty for the opposing army, which they could also invest in, while also upgrading their Spell Resist from 25% to 35% because let's face it, 25% does next to nothing, feel free to test it.
I hate to say it, but the domination meta seems to be going in the direction of tier 1 units. Before, it was bad enough that elites were risky at best and a throw at worst. Now, even legendary lords are being replaced regularly by no name wizards (and sometimes by random units like Chaos Spawn!). An army of sweaty peasants lead by Jade Wizard Jerry being a better pick than Karl Franz flying over great swords and demigryphs is a sin against Sigmar. I know that wasn't what Turin is suggesting, but after watching so many playthroughs, it appears that low tier vanguard with a cheap spellcaster outvalues many mid-tier and most elite units with powerful lords in domination.
If they rework magic a bit, it will be fine. It's the same in land battles, elites get karate chopped by magic generally! We saw super elite lizard monsters destroying on stream the other day, there is hope!
I definitely think leadership roles should not be taken up by unbreakable units, unless it is a lord character. Otherwise it makes inflicting leadership losses on the other side more difficult than it should be.
@@turinRTS The way capture weight works alone is going to make tier 1 units more favorable for what you want. Would need it to be based on gold cost or something like that to really make taking expensive units worth it.
I sorta wish they buffed empire knights with melee defence or weapon strength or something - Having exceptionally heavily armoured - comparatively tough but slow cavalry felt like it's sorta Empire's deal. What sets Empire knights apart from Bretonnian knights.
What sets empire knights apart from bretonnian is their inferiority
@@lberghaus In the base game, though I think ideally what *should* set them apart should be being notably tougher but notably slower.
Which is why I think they should have buffed their melee defence or weapon strength or something instead of speed, rather than not buffing anything.
so ridiculous seeing empire knights faster than bret cav and fast as elven steeds...
Alllgoorrrrttthhhyyymmmm Gods.
even after this game empire still need buff
I wonder if this is just an indication that a factions LL needs buffs.
Fantastic video
I didn't need sleep
Is mortal empires released ?
Yea pushing into your opponents side of the map is generally a pretty bad idea. You are effectively ceding the fight. Fighting on your opponents side generates a bad trade for you.
How good is Valkia's spear against arty crews?
It's very narrow and doesn't deal very much damage.
It would struggle to hit most of the crew and she would be forced to pop her invincibility to even make it worth the trade since she would be shot by gunners on her advance.
Wouldn't Spear of Sleipnir just 1 shot the sunmaker crew?
Sunmaker has AP now?
why do I feel like I can hear a phone ringing in the background? 6:50
can someone please link me a discord sever for WH3 PVP for beginners? I'm so interested in this.
Huh didn’t know you could just not bring a lord interesting
GG well played
Maybe if you brought the other lord, you could of done a fire breath attack while flying on the arty squad.
Missile abilities target artillery models instead of crew, so it couldn't have done more than 1/4 damage. I don't think it's worth it
GG
I want a real total war lord of the rings with base building :( lie bfme from CA
Tier 3 infantry and cavalry should have more capture weight.
Hold on, you can just not bring a lord now? How long has this been a thing?
He has to be in reserve, but yes, main army can bring hero/unit as a lord
I've been saying this since wh 1, magic is too safe and reliable.
It seems that valkia's landing attack is bugged.
I hope they don’t nerf magic, it’s so important in this universe that if they nerf magic purely for multiplayer games it takes away from people who just enjoy to play the game solo which is what the game is meant to prioritise
I don't like watching domination mode
feels like domination mode is just about cheap numbers. only going off what ive observed from everyones videos
Love your content man, but in all honesty domination battles have become very boring to watch. I wish you would do more land battles.
that is why domination, mode is the best multiplayer experience even for newbies because a lot of different builds can be done, and in land battle it’s other lvl, and same meta and units that we like that don’t have use on land battles, but in domination we can try lots of different units.