This is a very meaningful and insightful interview and I think it hits on a lot of important things that are becoming increasingly relevant to Saints these days. Here's the thing, I'm an active, faithful member of the Church, but still have questions and concerns about certain things that I learn about for the first time. The truth is, I believe whole-heartedly that church members need to be taught about the dark side of history along with the light. In my opinion, doing so would not only increase faithful retention in the church, but assist in decreasing anxiety, depression, fear, and worry among young missionaries as they set out to preach the Gospel to the world. In addition, I completely agree with the fact that members of the church need to be more accommodating to those who are having a faith crisis. There need to be more people that can have conversations like this without being at each other's throats.
I think that what would help both sides is, to see, take and treat things for what they are.. On one side you do get people that made bad experiences within the church, mayby even with leaders in charge, and the moment we only come with the argument that this cant be possible, since the church is true in all its aspects and senses, is the moment we bend things to make it feel better for ouselves. If we want to build bridges, at least how I see it, we need to be willing to admit to things that have been wrong, whether that be in the past or now.. On the other hand though, seeing, taking and treating things for what they are, people also need to look at what the church and the individual faith actually does for many people, that is has changed peoples lifes for the goood... and if each side is willing to allow room for other experienced realities, we come close to the golden rule that Jesus was teaching. And I agree so much. Even as a teen I thought that it wouold do the church good to be open about church history, about Prophets being just human, because in the end, that would add to the faith... Simply being honest about how things are, not being afraid of truth in any regard, for in the end it will always be the truth, that truly makes us free.... and especially with so many religious groups trying all they can to prove how Mormonism is not Christian, presenting the worst and most ridicules kind of Mormonism, this would bless the lifes of so many that simply want to make sense of it all. Great episode and conversation :)
Simply, thank you from my heart to both of you - thank you for your extension of grace. I am active LDS. I gained so much from the wisdom of your authenticity and genuine love.
Thank you so much! I know so many that have left the church and I have been at a loss as to what to say or anything ! This is so inspired! I love this perspective! Very touching-to the core!
Faith in Jesus Christ crisis. Trust Jehovah or not. I can see myself in my pre-earth life hearing the Father's Plan presented. My strong impression is that the whole thing was scary for me. I believe what I must have been thinking was that my Older Brother, Jehovah had already earned my complete and total trust. If He promised to do what He said He would do, then I was willing to come here. I must have trusted Him then, so I am going to trust Him now even if there are some squirrely things that happened in Church history. He has promised to make everything right. I believe Him. His covenant path, or nothing.
Casey and Nick! Thank you so much for doing this interview. This is exactly the kind of conversations that the LDS and Ex-mo communities need in order for us to get along. Not everyone is ready to have these kinds of conversations, and that's totally fine. But there are a lot of us who do and want to figure out what the future can look like. Mixed faith families are becoming (if not already) the norm in LDS culture and I appreciate the way you handled this.
There's sooooooooo much to say on response to this gentleman. I'd love to know what specifically led to him leaving the church, since thus far, everything he had concerns with has a logical answer. His points are good! One point that I would take issue with is that members of the church have only one emulator (as one of your previous guests pointed out), and that is Jesus Christ. Not the prophets, not Joseph Smith, not bishops or stake presidents. Just Jesus Christ. As such, everyone else is part of a gorgeous, albeit very imperfect, Divine tapestry. ❤
10 minutes in and I really dig Casey. Would love to share a meal. I agree it’s hard to hate up close. 1:14:19 - listen. Wow. Nearly tearing imaging what it would be like to really be listened to. To not be shut down. A plaque of gratitude. What an idea. Thank you for being part of our tribe. Instead it in official shaming and shunning. - Chris Voss has really helped through this process. Casey if you’re ever in SLC I’d love to buy you lunch.
1:26:13 ok. How do I balance thinking I’m close to gratitude for first have while recognizing I would absolutely choose differently had I had informed consent in my youth.
@@rtharalsonit takes time but letting go is the ultimate spiritual journey. Understanding that people tried to do the best they knew, choosing to keep what was good, letting go things you wouldn’t do and finding the gift in the process. It warrants a longer convo that I would be willing to have.
This was beautifully done. Thank you both for sharing your thoughts and feelings, and sharing so many truths in such a short time. I've had a hard time staying while so many of my peers leave, and haven't known how to navigate so many conversations and I feel like I know how to approach this topic with both confidence as well as love.
This was great. For the past few months I have been thinking about the relationship between understanding another person and the ability to love them. In this video your guest talks about this relationship I think, at least implicitly. The idea in my mind is that as our understanding of another increases, so does our potential to love them. Of course we have to choose to love, but our potential increases with understanding. Perhaps this is one among many reasons God loves us perfectly...he understands us perfectly. Perhaps I'm wrong, but it is something I have been thinking about, and your video hit on this several times.
We speak of people leaving the church. We should also speak of the church leaving the church. As I study church history I see significant fluctuation in doctrine, practice, and even world views. I envision the church, and people on varying long spirals. Sometimes they align and sometimes they cross paths. God can work with each individual during every part of the spiral journey. regardless of whether we are born in the church, or some other faith tradition, it is the same.
I really agtee that the church should come out and say it. Yes Joseph Smith did this , and the church did this and get it out of the way. If we all know , then the people against the church would have nothing more to say. There will be not subject for them to keep doing podcast against the church. Yes, the youth need to know the true, just like your guest said it. He did this but also did this wonderful things. And I also would like to know the true. P,ease somebody, come out a d say it directly, with no excuses or making it look not that bad. We all need to know the true, and I believe more people will stay. Please have a podcast about it.
These days, anti lds are all over the place so transparency is critical. Our church past is ugly, there's no doubt about it. I have made every detail I know very clear to my children so they don't feel like they've been "betrayed". That way nothing huge is a surprise. I have been honest in regards to owning our ugly past and not dwelling on it. We've had plenty of good, detailed conversations. I'm hoping that'll give them enough information that satisfies their curiosity. I have also gone over the anti lds channels, how to identify them and why it's important we understand how satan tempts us.
These conversations are so incredibly needed. As some one who has multiple siblings leaving the church and hanging on to my faith with everything I can muster I needed to hear this. Empathy and grace can absolutely change the world if we let it. Thank you for doing this interview. I didn't think I was going to sit through the whole two hours but I am so glad I did. I got so many amazing things out of this.
Joseph Smith was sealed to a 14 year old girl. He never once had relations with her. She wrote three fantastic books on her experience and stated that her and the prophet never once spent a moment alone. The point of the sealing was because her father wanted to be in Joseph's family line.
I am currently a bishop and I feel like listening to this I am being attacked because ‘I never say the right thing’. If I would only would said this…that I would be able to keep someone from leaving. It sounds like you are giving the people who leave the church an excuse that it’s the leaders fault and you have no responsibility for your own actions. That idea of giving someone a plaque when they leave seems so patronizing and condescending. I don’t know how I feel listening to this, I feel angry and also scared that maybe it’s my fault that someone left the church because of something I didn’t do. I am trying to wrap my mind around this whole conversation.
I’m a member of the church and married someone from a different religion and feel this is a generation issue. All religions have this going on because peoples loyalty was so serious. It’s a cultural thing. 🤍🤍🤍🤍🤍🤍🤍
Dang I can see where you're coming from. I hope you know that you won't always say the right thing or make the right decision but I can feel your desire to really serve the people. And I'm sure Heavenly Father knows and feels that too, "the Lord loves effort". Thank you for sharing your thoughts and feelings, as I didn't see it like that.
I heard them say bishops do a lot of good things too, but yeah sometimes not the most helpful thing is said, I know I never say the right thing. I think the point is to try to be more understanding.
I give heed to everyone about Casey, he is a great guy, he speaks VERY truthful things, and I love him as a brethren. But his teachings CAN be dangerous. Your example of the horse shoe is beautiful; all the more to help you understand why I give heed. *The horse shoe is unchanging:* This horseshoe has been established since the dawn of religious separation. Written in stone one could say. But succeeding in making this bridge from one end of the horse shoe to the other CAN be extremely dangerous. This bridge was not written in stone, this bridge is not doctrine. Have the knowledge that this isn't God's Plan. This is Casey's Plan. *The bridge is flawed:* Now, this horseshoe appears to be conflicting, but that is the nature of it. There has always been this conflict from extremist faithful, all the way to anti. You can't convert anyone through this bridge, unfortunately. It just doesn't work, and is improbable. There's already a process and it shouldn't be tampered with. You need to walk the path of the horse shoe. There are no shortcuts, and there are no loopholes. The church is handling this conversion and understanding with its own means (missionaries, general conference, bishops). Some efforts/people aren't perfect. True, but who is? *Casey speaks truth, but be aware:* Casey has good intentions, and speaks a lot of truthful things. But he acts differently than other podcasts. He acts almost as if he wants people to listen to him rather than the church entirely. It's so subtle since he speaks with humbled love and removes bias from the situation entirely. Which is great, but his discontent with the church and trying to make a new sense of it is dangerous as he tries to teach people his own ideas. That is not the same podcast that tries to improve people's understanding of the church and it's scriptures. But phenomenal job Faith in Focus for the questions. You are fascinating to watch!
Blessed are the peacemakers.
This is a very meaningful and insightful interview and I think it hits on a lot of important things that are becoming increasingly relevant to Saints these days. Here's the thing, I'm an active, faithful member of the Church, but still have questions and concerns about certain things that I learn about for the first time. The truth is, I believe whole-heartedly that church members need to be taught about the dark side of history along with the light. In my opinion, doing so would not only increase faithful retention in the church, but assist in decreasing anxiety, depression, fear, and worry among young missionaries as they set out to preach the Gospel to the world. In addition, I completely agree with the fact that members of the church need to be more accommodating to those who are having a faith crisis. There need to be more people that can have conversations like this without being at each other's throats.
Thank you so much for this! This brought a peace to my heart for when I talk to inactive siblings in a way I didn’t know I needed.
Steven E Snow was my mission president. Your experience with him is consistent with how he treated us.
I’m trying be like Jesus. All of this conversation is helping me be educated in sitting at the table!! Listening! Understanding!!
I think that what would help both sides is, to see, take and treat things for what they are..
On one side you do get people that made bad experiences within the church, mayby even with leaders in charge, and the moment we only come with the argument that this cant be possible, since the church is true in all its aspects and senses, is the moment we bend things to make it feel better for ouselves. If we want to build bridges, at least how I see it, we need to be willing to admit to things that have been wrong, whether that be in the past or now.. On the other hand though, seeing, taking and treating things for what they are, people also need to look at what the church and the individual faith actually does for many people, that is has changed peoples lifes for the goood... and if each side is willing to allow room for other experienced realities, we come close to the golden rule that Jesus was teaching.
And I agree so much. Even as a teen I thought that it wouold do the church good to be open about church history, about Prophets being just human, because in the end, that would add to the faith... Simply being honest about how things are, not being afraid of truth in any regard, for in the end it will always be the truth, that truly makes us free.... and especially with so many religious groups trying all they can to prove how Mormonism is not Christian, presenting the worst and most ridicules kind of Mormonism, this would bless the lifes of so many that simply want to make sense of it all.
Great episode and conversation :)
Simply, thank you from my heart to both of you - thank you for your extension of grace. I am active LDS. I gained so much from the wisdom of your authenticity and genuine love.
Thank you so much! I know so many that have left the church and I have been at a loss as to what to say or anything ! This is so inspired! I love this perspective! Very touching-to the core!
Loved this podcast! I've known Casey for 20 years. He and his wife are good friends. Casey is a friend to all...love his goodness.
Faith in Jesus Christ crisis. Trust Jehovah or not. I can see myself in my pre-earth life hearing the Father's Plan presented. My strong impression is that the whole thing was scary for me. I believe what I must have been thinking was that my Older Brother, Jehovah had already earned my complete and total trust. If He promised to do what He said He would do, then I was willing to come here. I must have trusted Him then, so I am going to trust Him now even if there are some squirrely things that happened in Church history. He has promised to make everything right. I believe Him. His covenant path, or nothing.
Casey and Nick! Thank you so much for doing this interview. This is exactly the kind of conversations that the LDS and Ex-mo communities need in order for us to get along. Not everyone is ready to have these kinds of conversations, and that's totally fine. But there are a lot of us who do and want to figure out what the future can look like. Mixed faith families are becoming (if not already) the norm in LDS culture and I appreciate the way you handled this.
There's sooooooooo much to say on response to this gentleman. I'd love to know what specifically led to him leaving the church, since thus far, everything he had concerns with has a logical answer. His points are good! One point that I would take issue with is that members of the church have only one emulator (as one of your previous guests pointed out), and that is Jesus Christ. Not the prophets, not Joseph Smith, not bishops or stake presidents. Just Jesus Christ. As such, everyone else is part of a gorgeous, albeit very imperfect, Divine tapestry. ❤
This was fabulous!
10 minutes in and I really dig Casey. Would love to share a meal. I agree it’s hard to hate up close.
1:14:19 - listen. Wow. Nearly tearing imaging what it would be like to really be listened to. To not be shut down. A plaque of gratitude. What an idea. Thank you for being part of our tribe. Instead it in official shaming and shunning. - Chris Voss has really helped through this process.
Casey if you’re ever in SLC I’d love to buy you lunch.
1:26:13 ok. How do I balance thinking I’m close to gratitude for first have while recognizing I would absolutely choose differently had I had informed consent in my youth.
@@rtharalsonit takes time but letting go is the ultimate spiritual journey. Understanding that people tried to do the best they knew, choosing to keep what was good, letting go things you wouldn’t do and finding the gift in the process. It warrants a longer convo that I would be willing to have.
@@caseymcfarland8459 How do I PM you
This was beautifully done. Thank you both for sharing your thoughts and feelings, and sharing so many truths in such a short time. I've had a hard time staying while so many of my peers leave, and haven't known how to navigate so many conversations and I feel like I know how to approach this topic with both confidence as well as love.
This was great. For the past few months I have been thinking about the relationship between understanding another person and the ability to love them. In this video your guest talks about this relationship I think, at least implicitly. The idea in my mind is that as our understanding of another increases, so does our potential to love them. Of course we have to choose to love, but our potential increases with understanding. Perhaps this is one among many reasons God loves us perfectly...he understands us perfectly. Perhaps I'm wrong, but it is something I have been thinking about, and your video hit on this several times.
My dad left the church at several stages in his life but always came back stronger.
We speak of people leaving the church. We should also speak of the church leaving the church. As I study church history I see significant fluctuation in doctrine, practice, and even world views. I envision the church, and people on varying long spirals. Sometimes they align and sometimes they cross paths. God can work with each individual during every part of the spiral journey. regardless of whether we are born in the church, or some other faith tradition, it is the same.
Tell me more❤
I really agtee that the church should come out and say it. Yes Joseph Smith did this , and the church did this and get it out of the way. If we all know , then the people against the church would have nothing more to say. There will be not subject for them to keep doing podcast against the church. Yes, the youth need to know the true, just like your guest said it. He did this but also did this wonderful things. And I also would like to know the true. P,ease somebody, come out a d say it directly, with no excuses or making it look not that bad. We all need to know the true, and I believe more people will stay. Please have a podcast about it.
These days, anti lds are all over the place so transparency is critical. Our church past is ugly, there's no doubt about it. I have made every detail I know very clear to my children so they don't feel like they've been "betrayed". That way nothing huge is a surprise. I have been honest in regards to owning our ugly past and not dwelling on it. We've had plenty of good, detailed conversations. I'm hoping that'll give them enough information that satisfies their curiosity. I have also gone over the anti lds channels, how to identify them and why it's important we understand how satan tempts us.
Well, I wouldn’t say our church’s past is ugly. Maybe untidy 😂
These conversations are so incredibly needed. As some one who has multiple siblings leaving the church and hanging on to my faith with everything I can muster I needed to hear this. Empathy and grace can absolutely change the world if we let it. Thank you for doing this interview. I didn't think I was going to sit through the whole two hours but I am so glad I did. I got so many amazing things out of this.
Joseph Smith was sealed to a 14 year old girl. He never once had relations with her. She wrote three fantastic books on her experience and stated that her and the prophet never once spent a moment alone. The point of the sealing was because her father wanted to be in Joseph's family line.
🤍🤍🤍🤍🤍🤍🤍
I am currently a bishop and I feel like listening to this I am being attacked because ‘I never say the right thing’. If I would only would said this…that I would be able to keep someone from leaving. It sounds like you are giving the people who leave the church an excuse that it’s the leaders fault and you have no responsibility for your own actions. That idea of giving someone a plaque when they leave seems so patronizing and condescending. I don’t know how I feel listening to this, I feel angry and also scared that maybe it’s my fault that someone left the church because of something I didn’t do. I am trying to wrap my mind around this whole conversation.
I’m a member of the church and married someone from a different religion and feel this is a generation issue. All religions have this going on because peoples loyalty was so serious. It’s a cultural thing. 🤍🤍🤍🤍🤍🤍🤍
Dang I can see where you're coming from. I hope you know that you won't always say the right thing or make the right decision but I can feel your desire to really serve the people. And I'm sure Heavenly Father knows and feels that too, "the Lord loves effort". Thank you for sharing your thoughts and feelings, as I didn't see it like that.
I heard them say bishops do a lot of good things too, but yeah sometimes not the most helpful thing is said, I know I never say the right thing. I think the point is to try to be more understanding.
I give heed to everyone about Casey, he is a great guy, he speaks VERY truthful things, and I love him as a brethren. But his teachings CAN be dangerous. Your example of the horse shoe is beautiful; all the more to help you understand why I give heed.
*The horse shoe is unchanging:*
This horseshoe has been established since the dawn of religious separation. Written in stone one could say. But succeeding in making this bridge from one end of the horse shoe to the other CAN be extremely dangerous. This bridge was not written in stone, this bridge is not doctrine. Have the knowledge that this isn't God's Plan. This is Casey's Plan.
*The bridge is flawed:*
Now, this horseshoe appears to be conflicting, but that is the nature of it. There has always been this conflict from extremist faithful, all the way to anti. You can't convert anyone through this bridge, unfortunately. It just doesn't work, and is improbable. There's already a process and it shouldn't be tampered with. You need to walk the path of the horse shoe. There are no shortcuts, and there are no loopholes. The church is handling this conversion and understanding with its own means (missionaries, general conference, bishops). Some efforts/people aren't perfect. True, but who is?
*Casey speaks truth, but be aware:*
Casey has good intentions, and speaks a lot of truthful things. But he acts differently than other podcasts. He acts almost as if he wants people to listen to him rather than the church entirely. It's so subtle since he speaks with humbled love and removes bias from the situation entirely. Which is great, but his discontent with the church and trying to make a new sense of it is dangerous as he tries to teach people his own ideas. That is not the same podcast that tries to improve people's understanding of the church and it's scriptures.
But phenomenal job Faith in Focus for the questions. You are fascinating to watch!