A bit ironic that you say Nathaniel was shooting like Davy Crockett when he covers the courier. Both would have been shooting handmade flintlock rifles which were quite capable of that level of accuracy.
Magua's French being bad doesn't bother me because it is his second language. That makes English his third language because he uses it as 007 among the British. A lot of natives were probably bi-or-trilingual back then in order to communicate between the empires.
As someone who grew up on the poorest reservation in the United States of America, I appreciate you taking the time to explain we were not simple people or savages or noble humans free from sin. Just people doomed to live on as lost souls
These histories are so poorly taught. Much of what I've learned comes from compiling my own family history. Both sides were among the earliest settlers--were helped and had extensive commercial relationships with native tribes when setting the CT river valley, yet fought them bitterly in King Philips War, same again as portrayed in the movie while living on the frontier below the lakes in NY. On my mothers side, my 4x grandfather was the brother of James Galloway who had long friendship with Tecumseh on the Ohio frontier--on my fathers side my 3x grandfather married a "settled Shawnee" woman after his wife died of fever in Ohio. Tragedy and complexity. Best to you.
@@Morgue12free My IRL namesake landed with Winthrop in 1629. I'm technically the "VI". Mother's direct line in 1705. Both families were on the NY frontier during the F&I
I thoroughly enjoyed your review, as well as most of the comments. This was/is a great movie depicting a neglected but still facinating period in our history. I'm obviously not an expert and don't pretend to be, but I love the period here, and how Michael Mann depicted it, historically accurate or not. Thanks for an interesting 1/2 hour.
Not only did I thoroughly enjoy this learned review, but I also very much enjoyed the comments & the give and take that came after! So often the comments section is full of ignorant if not illiterate comments, but not here by a long shot! Thank you to all who participated, exposing me to so much, and in such depth!
Well done. You are quite right that the F&I is the understudied war that really shaped the future of the Continent. If you have not already, you might want to find a copy of Edward Dodge's "Relief is Greatly Wanted" regarding the siege of FWH. Am personally connected via my 5x grandfather who was among the militia mustered to Ft. Edward during the siege, marched to fort after the massacre and fought several other more minor skirmishes along the lakes. That experience over the ground served him well when he served (along with his son) under Col. John McCrea in the Saratoga campaign. Ironically, the character of Cora is allegedly based on Col. McCrea's sister, Jane who was engaged to a young British officer and when trying to get to him in the British lines north or Saratoga was allegedly murdered by a Wyandot Huron. Though the movie took a lot of deviations from Cooper's story---thought that it did capture the feel of events at the time and certainly portrayed the realpolitik of the tribes more accurately than I've seen in cinema. The frontier was a very complicated place.
Having read Last of The Mohicans, I was disappointed by the white casting of Munro's younger daughter. She was (half) black in the book. I view this as a missed opportunity to make a social comment. I like the historical review however.
@@wilfbentley6738 Unfortunately in the reordering of Cooper's story line it would not have worked for "message" Mann was trying to convey. But I understand Mann's dilemma since the text is so layered that even coming up with a coherent feature length movie was a challenge. Same problem that was successfully solved turning Tom Wolfe's "pointillist" writing style in "The Right Stuff" into compact visuals. For all the grief Cooper has garnered over the years it was admirable that he even broached the topic. My own family was married into the "settled" Shawnee in the Ohio territory in the early 1800s. But "marry 'em and/or kill 'em" is a complex topic.
one of my favorite movies and to hear the producers, director and actors tell it, there was a serious attempt to stay close to historical accuracy. Daniel Day Lewis did that method acting thing that he always does and prepared well for this role. He had wilderness and military advisors training him, how to use weapons, how to track, how to fight, how to run. I just watched it again for the fourth or fifth time and what occurred to me was that it was a very good Hollywood style romance. Lewis turned himself into a robust alfa male, long hair, a muscular and exposed chest with the ability to kick anyone's ass but also to be thoughtful, introspective, understanding and a perfect mate for a proper english woman who has no idea about existing in a North American wilderness. That thing he does with Cora behind the waterfall where he tells her to tolerate any and all mistreatment, stay alive and wait for him to come get her...damn! And then he jumps more than a hundred feet down into the center of a waterfall maelstrom. That's romance. I am jealous of "Hawkeye". Russell Means and Dennis Banks star in the movie...I hadn't noticed that before. A couple of guys I remember from the seventies and the American Indian Movement. Living in the area where this story occurs, I know that there is no place from Albany to Lake George where this movie could have been filmed. It's all suburban sprawl nowadays. The terrain looked familiar and having driven through the mountains of southwestern NC. it turns out that was where the movie was filmed. Beautiful country. Not at all like the Adirondacks though. Still it would be nice if there would be an attempt to decide how accurate the movie The Robe is. That movie about Indians and the European colonization of the northeaster part of North America strikes me as accurate.
It was filmed in North Carolina, which has (or at least *had*) a robust film industry. Did you notice how, in the canoe escape sequence, at one point, Cora takes up a paddle and commences paddling, while Alice simply rides in terror? I think this was an important detail in Cora's development into a woman who could face the realities of frontier life. We're ALL jealous of Hawkeye - just sayin'...
It's not beautiful anymore, and there seems to be an epidemic of crime. A lot of people go missing. And for some reason it now attracts all the radical wing nuts. Looks pretty but what lies beneath? Seems that DELIVERANCE is becoming a self fulfilling prophecy.
Thanks for doing this. LOTM is one of my favorite movies, and I'm getting ready to watch it with my teenage boys. Your video will help me separate fact from fiction for this fantastic film.
Sorry to nit-pick your nit-pick but Schuylerville was named after the Schuyler family and not specifically for the revolutionary war general. The Schuyler family were dutch settlers and came to the area around Fort Saratoga in 1691. Also, the British marched from Albany to Fort Edward (Webb's 60th Foot) and Fort William Henry (35th Foot). The movie was not trying to say that Albany and Fort Edward are in the same place. While 15 miles might not seem a long distance to modern people. It was a full day's march for 18th Century infantry formations. Moreover, in the rugged terrain of colonial upstate New York, it probably would've taken two days for the infantry formation with baggage and kit to travel that distance.
Interesting. The novel last of the Mohicans also drifts from real history. You might want to check into Montcalm's actions at Fort Ontario BEFORE the events of this movie took place. Montcalm was responsible for a massacre there too and he even used it as a threat to get the troops at Fort William Henry to surrender.
Darling, you keep saying Iowa, when you may mean Ohio (e.g. when you showed a map including Ohio, and you mentioned the Iowa Valley,) am I completely wrong? I've been wrong often.
I get what you're trying to say but it is IN FACT a FICTIONAL story....... yes, it was based on SOME historical moments but was mostly a fictional story. TY for taking the time though!
I agree is is fiction which tries to keep things simple. History is more complicated and for me interesting too. So I respect and admire this informed analysis which I like.
I have seen this movie a couple times, and I always thought the French commander came off very well. My interpretation of the scene you rant about was always that Malcolm was venting his frustration about the fact that the British would not keep up their end of the bargain, and he'd have to fight these men again. At no point did he give Magua the order to attack the surrendered British or their allies. He simply couldn't stop it from happening.
If I understand what you're saying, I disagree. Montcalm said to Magua that he feared that, after releasing the English per their agreement, he would only find himself facing them in battle again, as they would not honor the terms of the surrender. This communicated to Magua that he was free to wreak his revenge upon the English, as he *wanted* to, with his "French father"'s blessing, without saying it explicitly. Magua clearly understood what Montcalm was intimating - as did we viewers as well.
It is interesting to get your Quebecois perspective! However, Iowa is referenced a couple times, when you might actually mean Ohio. Thanks for mentioning that the story is set in the present New York State, as you correctly indicate when talking about the forts involved in the story.
Much appreciate your historical insight with regard to the French and their First Nation allies as well as the point about the historical inaccuracy about use of rockets to light up the sky.
Spot on fella! I checked your friends other video now it makes some sense. Some is for debate but at least your doing some good for historians of the future! Bravo
Historical inaccuracies aside, this movie succeeded in garnering much new interest in this period of American history. And it's true that the French & Indian War definitely set the stage for the American revolution a few short years later. Also, the role played by native Americans was admirably displayed in the movie; another key to the movie's stature.
Having read the book, I was disappointed by the white casting of Munro's younger daughter. She was black in the book. I view this as a missed opportunity to make a social comment.
Just because the Brits created light infantry doesn't mean they employed them well. Witness Breed's Hill and the Concord retreat 18 years later with large forces having poor security to front and flanks. The opening march to Ft Henry by a small force emphasizing speed was entirely realistic. Also worth mentioning is Quebec had sufficient affinity with American colonists to provide them two regiments in the Rev War, as did the Mohican, Wappinger and Munsee tribes as part of the Stockbridge Militia. Last, Hawkeye used his party's rifles during the courier overwatch scene, not muskets, although the level of precision shown using a rifle sighted in by someone else isn't realistic.
You stated the Mohawk language is no longer spoken, that is untrue. There are still many Mohawk people throughout out the U.S. and Canada and there are many speakers of the language and it is offered online learning formats as well.
I am referring to 'some' native Languages that are extinct. I make reference and speak some Kanien'keha in the video. As I mention in the video, I work on a Mohawk Reservation and know full well that certain native languages are alive and well. I hear them every day and speak a little bit of what I have learnt. Nia:wen.
I read a review of the book quite a while back. That review noted that the author of the book got the Connecticut Mohegan tribe mixed up with a smaller NY (Mohican?) tribe that had a similar name. Have you guys read anything about that?
The Mohicans were in New York/ The Mohegans lived in CT and still do. They allied with the English to try and Wipeout the Pequots. Interestingly both tribes now run casinos in CT, Foxwoods (Pequots) and the Mohegan Sun. 2 of the largest casinos in the US.
Back in the early 1970s I had an emeritus professor in a class on Modern Middle Eastern History. He had gone to live in Turkey as a young and recent college graduate in the early 1920s. He married the daughter of the President of Roberts College and became a member of the expat upper crust. He moved in the circles one step removed from Crown Prince Edward both before and after Wallace Simpson. He returned to Istanbul after WW2, where he remained through the early 60s. All of this is to establish his credentials for a frequent refrain: What actually happened is often not nearly as important as what people think happened. Historical fiction, be it on film or in print, tells the story more people believe or can accept. What is known for fact is relevant only to the scholar. He would illustrate this in debate with my fellow students (a couple of whom were in fact children of Holocaust survivers). His stated opinion (possibly for sake of argument?) was that maybe 5 million Jews died in the Holocaust not the commonly accepted 6 million. Imagine the uproar. There, he would say, is just my point. This is my introduction to your website. I'm very impressed. Have you done my favorite of all time Lawrence of Arabia?
My channel was originally more "general history", but now I have confined it to the asia-pacific war. As far as historical Film reviews go though, I have done: Last of the Mohicans, The Opium War, The Warlords and When the Last Sword is Drawn (last 2 coming soon). Lawrence of Arabia is a masterpiece and I would look to do it, but the most famous Historical Film Reviewer has made a video on it (History Buff's).
The infamous fact of General Webb not relieving Monro at Fort William Henry had a lot to do with a captured French Canadian militia officer lying to Webb about Montcalm having 11,000 men. Webb surmised that he couldn’t risk being ambushed in the forest by the most adept, and terrifying, guerrillas in the known world - Red Indians. Webb had 5,000 men, but only a few Redcoats, few Indians and a lot of untrained colonial militia. The reason for the paucity of good professional soldiers was that Lord Loudoun, the senior British Army commander in North America, had stripped New York colony of British regulars for the aborted assault on far away Louisburg in present day Nova Scotia. Webb had absolutely no intelligence of Montcalm’s military strength. Webb was conscious that his force was all there was to defend New York colony (later to be the state). A primary source of intelligence was from Indians and he didn’t have many, but the French certainly did. The rocket flare you ascribe to being a Congreve rocket. WRONG! Illumination devices were used for illumination purposes in European sieges. The Congreve rocket was used to actually kill and more importantly, disrupt, enemies - particularly against cavalry. In Europe rockets were also used in the same year at the Battle of Chioggia - that's as far back as 1380! North American academic standards are notorious. Don't worry, they're ruining Europe's education at industrial charged rates. You're irresponsible because you lack wisdom - a prime requirement for those who purport to judge and comment on history. The statement of legitimate grievances of the Indians is simply outrageous! The Indians were genuine savages. You're such a coward to not be clear about this. You've done a decent amount of reading, but you slide off from being explicit. The Indians were simply terrifying enemies. It was a salient factor in this war and used as a psychological weapon as much as real weapons. Context and perspective and even basic facts are wanting here.
I enjoyed your presentation...one small nit-pick. You used the word "Iowa" when you meant "Ohio". I grew up in Iowa and we had a self-deprecating T-shirt that read, "The University of Iowa, Idaho Falls, Ohio."
it occurs to me that a film covering the Beaver wars would be interesting. a war between the Iroquois and the Wabanki including the the Huron would be interesting i fell
@@ThePacificWarChannel being a brit i never did Canadian history and have yet to find any good books on this particular subject. on a side note i find calling the amercan theatre of the 7 years war the french and indian war a little odd as in truth it was the 5th "French and Indian war" going all the way back to king Williams war in the 1690s but whatever
You have great knowledge, but I have a nitpick. Please do not put large amounts of text when you are also speaking, its better if you leave them at the end of the video when you are not speaking, as sort of outro.
I am a direct descendant of Gilbert Shankland, how does all this tie in with my family? Can you suggest a book on how this ties in with my family? I've seen the movie and only been told that its based on my distant family
I do not specialize in this field of History, but there does seem to be a link between the "Shankland" family and the author of the book "last of the mohicans", James Fenimore Cooper. The link below sheds some light on readings, particularly on the NewYork Shankland family. shankland.one-name.net/articles/distrib/dis_ShanklandsComeToAmerica.html
Mt questions: 1). Were all colonials forced to fight with the British? 2.) Also, did the actually war between the French and British end once they took Quebec in the year 1760 (I believe), or was there still huge battles up until the Treaty of Paris?
Technically "colonials" could refer to a large amount of non british nor french peoples (like Swed's/ Germans etc) so I guess you can say not all were forced. As for 1760-1763, there was really sporadic and smaller scale battles, nothing to significant. Like most wars, there were those "holding out" as it were. The natives were an entire other story.
NBS History thank you for responding. Here is another question if you don’t mind: Were the “colonials” who were of English descent allowed to live in the French territories before and during the French and Indian war?
@@karianne9518 Hmmm a bit tricky to answer honestly. If you pull out a map of what Nouvelle France controlled, you immediately realize they never could properly defend nor administer the area (population was extremely small). Particularly in the Ohio valley or Mississippi region, the native allies dominated these lands and dictated who could live/trade there. I bring this up because it was a point of contention when French came to Ohio before the French Indian war to find out the natives were trading and mingling with the English. in all likelihood English settlers were probably allowed to live anywhere in Nouvelle France because everyone was trading. The Hudson Bay area is a great example of how intertwined France/England was in North America.
Cool, so rare to get a French inspired input on the events bc as usual most of the history is a British narrative. Btw Fort Edward no longer exists and just has a marker, yes probably certainly could hear the engagement from there. The book Crucible of War describes the diversity of the native units at the battle which was heterogeneous not all one tribe or group and had warriors from as far away as the Chippewa on Lake Superior. Also it’s the Ohio valley not the Iowa.
Actually, Fun Fact! There is only one line in Cherokee and it was only spoken because Wes Studi forgot his line in the other language and improvised using his own Native language (Cherokee). It’s towards the end of the film! My grandmother used to point it out when watched it together.
Nothing like taking the entertainment value from this wonderful movie. I think most care not for the "nitpicking" about historical fact being blurred. If you want the historical account, then read it. Otherwise leave the qualities of this fine story told in a beautiful setting alone. Compared to the crap hollywood produces today, this is a first rate classic.
Sorry, too many careless mistakes. The epilogue is the ending not beginning of the move. Didn’t Hawkeye go from orphan to frontier fighter and not the other way around? And why doesn’t anyone give James Cooper his due and mention the book was based on the real events of Daniel Boone’s daughters being captured and rescued?
@@johnbarb8344 ah! Shé:kon! I hope this video was of some interest. Before me and the UA-cam "History Clarified" made it together, I was not even aware of the links it had to the community. It was a large learning experience for me.
During the French Indian War, the Iroquois confederacy was the strongest. Overall in the north eastern front, most native groups were displaced by the Iroquois who themselves were being displaced by European forces.
@@ThePacificWarChannel The Native Peoples were obviously great fighters who adapted the weapons from the euros (even winchesters in the wild west) so how did they end up losing the war, so to speak? What were the key factors in whites prevailing? Some say the Native Americans culture wasn't adapted for long sustained campaigns and would run out of food. Whereas whites could sustain long supply lines and continued reinforcements. What do you think?
@@moranplano Depends on what time period and what region, but to try and find the major points. Disease whipped out most of the native population. Of those who survived the Columbus exchange, many traded, allied, fought different groups of European settlers. A lot of people like to think it was "guns", but the truth is until repeating rifles/revolvers were created in 19th century, many groups of natives were still thriving and defeating european settlers. Take for example the Comanche empire. Its not a simple question because different native groups had vastly different experiences.
My biggest beef with this movie is that Monro's younger daughter is supposed to be black (in the book). I view this as a tragically missed opportunity to make a social statement.
@@tecumseh821 There were many differences from the book and the two movies. Hawkeye and Chingachgook were the same age and regarded each other as brothers and Uncas was much younger. Uncas had a romantic relationship with Cora, not Alice.
NBS History We can forgive a friend from Canada, PS..please accept my profound apologies for Donald Trump and his views on Canada (I didn't vote for the mentally unbalanced son of a bitch)
You wrote a 100 percent great script for this video. But I have a couple nitpicks. You have a tendency to add upwards inflections to the end of up to three quarters or more of every sentences you spoke. You also smack your lips a lot, and I mean A LOT. Both are very distracting, and take away from the excellent knowledge you are trying to impart upon your viewers.
Haha well said. I am definitely not comfortable with how I present myself yet. Still learning, recently changed from my film camera mic to my pc mic, thanks for telling me, will change this!
As far as I understand this is a discussion of the historical background not a declaration that the story is true. What are you going to write if someone discusses the historical background of A Tale of Two cities , Romeo and Juliet etc.?I guess you can be forgiven for your opinion,hopefully the same can be extended to me for perhaps overreacting..
Ever since I took a history degree, I cannot watch L o M, as it skips over the plantation systems that was present at that time. The film suggests that the British and French empires made there vast wealth from trading furs beads and cabbages on the side roads when in fact it was by Sugar, cotton, and tobbaco cultivated and grown the forced labour of enslaved African people. This film is as bad as the Patriot.
I only made it 3/4 of the way through your video before i had to stop, and have several nitpicks of my own. In the beginning, you keep referring to Hawkeye as a Mohican, but in reality he's white. In the book he's referred to as the half-brother of Chingachook, whereas in the movie he's adpoted by him. I understand the movie opens up with something like, " 3 of the last kind", but he is white. You mention about them saying they were trading with the Dutch in Schuylerville, which is pronounced "skylerville" and not "schoolerville", but that may just be your pronunciation. The town was not named after Gen Schuyler, but the Schuyler family who settled the area in the late 1600's. Gen Schuyler was never at the Battle of Saratoga as he had been relieved by Gen Gates just before the battle for his lack in holding Fort Ticonderago against the British. And, the battle occurred in 1777 and not 1779. You talked about the British formations, commenting that "redcoats need to look stupid in American films". You do talk about the change in using light companies and rangers, but tactics of line formations were in use well after the Civil War, and even in the forested colonies, both the French, British and even later the Americans would still use line formations.
I remember watching this movie as a kid and thinking Wes Studi plays such an enthralling character. He is still one of my favorite actors.
LOVE Wes Studi
I think the first character who comes to mind for pretty much everyone who has seen this film is Magua.
A bit ironic that you say Nathaniel was shooting like Davy Crockett when he covers the courier. Both would have been shooting handmade flintlock rifles which were quite capable of that level of accuracy.
Magua's French being bad doesn't bother me because it is his second language. That makes English his third language because he uses it as 007 among the British. A lot of natives were probably bi-or-trilingual back then in order to communicate between the empires.
As someone who grew up on the poorest reservation in the United States of America, I appreciate you taking the time to explain we were not simple people or savages or noble humans free from sin. Just people doomed to live on as lost souls
These histories are so poorly taught. Much of what I've learned comes from compiling my own family history. Both sides were among the earliest settlers--were helped and had extensive commercial relationships with native tribes when setting the CT river valley, yet fought them bitterly in King Philips War, same again as portrayed in the movie while living on the frontier below the lakes in NY. On my mothers side, my 4x grandfather was the brother of James Galloway who had long friendship with Tecumseh on the Ohio frontier--on my fathers side my 3x grandfather married a "settled Shawnee" woman after his wife died of fever in Ohio. Tragedy and complexity. Best to you.
@@samueladams3746 How far back does your family history go as settlers?
@@Morgue12free My IRL namesake landed with Winthrop in 1629. I'm technically the "VI". Mother's direct line in 1705. Both families were on the NY frontier during the F&I
I thoroughly enjoyed your review, as well as most of the comments. This was/is a great movie depicting a neglected but still facinating period in our history. I'm obviously not an expert and don't pretend to be, but I love the period here, and how Michael Mann depicted it, historically accurate or not. Thanks for an interesting 1/2 hour.
Someone in the internet comments admitting they are not an expert and not pretending to be? You deserve an upvote.
Not only did I thoroughly enjoy this learned review, but I also very much enjoyed the comments & the give and take that came after! So often the comments section is full of ignorant if not illiterate comments, but not here by a long shot! Thank you to all who participated, exposing me to so much, and in such depth!
Haha your welcome, this video is a really interesting one. History Clarified's video is amazing so I hope you saw it as well!
Absolutely did, and I left a comment there too, where I mentioned even more sources on UA-cam for insight into the roots beneath this classic film.
Well done. You are quite right that the F&I is the understudied war that really shaped the future of the Continent. If you have not already, you might want to find a copy of Edward Dodge's "Relief is Greatly Wanted" regarding the siege of FWH. Am personally connected via my 5x grandfather who was among the militia mustered to Ft. Edward during the siege, marched to fort after the massacre and fought several other more minor skirmishes along the lakes. That experience over the ground served him well when he served (along with his son) under Col. John McCrea in the Saratoga campaign. Ironically, the character of Cora is allegedly based on Col. McCrea's sister, Jane who was engaged to a young British officer and when trying to get to him in the British lines north or Saratoga was allegedly murdered by a Wyandot Huron. Though the movie took a lot of deviations from Cooper's story---thought that it did capture the feel of events at the time and certainly portrayed the realpolitik of the tribes more accurately than I've seen in cinema. The frontier was a very complicated place.
Having read Last of The Mohicans, I was disappointed by the white casting of Munro's younger daughter. She was (half) black in the book. I view this as a missed opportunity to make a social comment.
I like the historical review however.
@@wilfbentley6738 Unfortunately in the reordering of Cooper's story line it would not have worked for "message" Mann was trying to convey. But I understand Mann's dilemma since the text is so layered that even coming up with a coherent feature length movie was a challenge. Same problem that was successfully solved turning Tom Wolfe's "pointillist" writing style in "The Right Stuff" into compact visuals. For all the grief Cooper has garnered over the years it was admirable that he even broached the topic. My own family was married into the "settled" Shawnee in the Ohio territory in the early 1800s. But "marry 'em and/or kill 'em" is a complex topic.
one of my favorite movies and to hear the producers, director and actors tell it, there was a serious attempt to stay close to historical accuracy. Daniel Day Lewis did that method acting thing that he always does and prepared well for this role. He had wilderness and military advisors training him, how to use weapons, how to track, how to fight, how to run. I just watched it again for the fourth or fifth time and what occurred to me was that it was a very good Hollywood style romance. Lewis turned himself into a robust alfa male, long hair, a muscular and exposed chest with the ability to kick anyone's ass but also to be thoughtful, introspective, understanding and a perfect mate for a proper english woman who has no idea about existing in a North American wilderness.
That thing he does with Cora behind the waterfall where he tells her to tolerate any and all mistreatment, stay alive and wait for him to come get her...damn! And then he jumps more than a hundred feet down into the center of a waterfall maelstrom. That's romance.
I am jealous of "Hawkeye".
Russell Means and Dennis Banks star in the movie...I hadn't noticed that before. A couple of guys I remember from the seventies and the American Indian Movement.
Living in the area where this story occurs, I know that there is no place from Albany to Lake George where this movie could have been filmed. It's all suburban sprawl nowadays. The terrain looked familiar and having driven through the mountains of southwestern NC. it turns out that was where the movie was filmed. Beautiful country. Not at all like the Adirondacks though.
Still it would be nice if there would be an attempt to decide how accurate the movie The Robe is. That movie about Indians and the European colonization of the northeaster part of North America strikes me as accurate.
It was filmed in North Carolina, which has (or at least *had*) a robust film industry. Did you notice how, in the canoe escape sequence, at one point, Cora takes up a paddle and commences paddling, while Alice simply rides in terror? I think this was an important detail in Cora's development into a woman who could face the realities of frontier life. We're ALL jealous of Hawkeye - just sayin'...
It's not beautiful anymore, and there seems to be an epidemic of crime. A lot of people go missing. And for some reason it now attracts all the radical wing nuts. Looks pretty but what lies beneath? Seems that DELIVERANCE is becoming a self fulfilling prophecy.
Thanks for doing this. LOTM is one of my favorite movies, and I'm getting ready to watch it with my teenage boys. Your video will help me separate fact from fiction for this fantastic film.
Sorry to nit-pick your nit-pick but Schuylerville was named after the Schuyler family and not specifically for the revolutionary war general. The Schuyler family were dutch settlers and came to the area around Fort Saratoga in 1691.
Also, the British marched from Albany to Fort Edward (Webb's 60th Foot) and Fort William Henry (35th Foot). The movie was not trying to say that Albany and Fort Edward are in the same place. While 15 miles might not seem a long distance to modern people. It was a full day's march for 18th Century infantry formations. Moreover, in the rugged terrain of colonial upstate New York, it probably would've taken two days for the infantry formation with baggage and kit to travel that distance.
Interesting. The novel last of the Mohicans also drifts from real history. You might want to check into Montcalm's actions at Fort Ontario BEFORE the events of this movie took place. Montcalm was responsible for a massacre there too and he even used it as a threat to get the troops at Fort William Henry to surrender.
RIP Maurice Roeves (Col Munroe) who died in 2020 at the age of 83
Darling, you keep saying Iowa, when you may mean Ohio (e.g. when you showed a map including Ohio, and you mentioned the Iowa Valley,) am I completely wrong? I've been wrong often.
You're not wrong. The Ohio Valley is important in the expansion west of the Appalachians but Iowa and the prairies are still a long way off.
I get what you're trying to say but it is IN FACT a FICTIONAL story....... yes, it was based on SOME historical moments but was mostly a fictional story. TY for taking the time though!
I agree is is fiction which tries to keep things simple. History is more complicated and for me interesting too. So I respect and admire this informed analysis which I like.
I have seen this movie a couple times, and I always thought the French commander came off very well. My interpretation of the scene you rant about was always that Malcolm was venting his frustration about the fact that the British would not keep up their end of the bargain, and he'd have to fight these men again. At no point did he give Magua the order to attack the surrendered British or their allies. He simply couldn't stop it from happening.
If I understand what you're saying, I disagree. Montcalm said to Magua that he feared that, after releasing the English per their agreement, he would only find himself facing them in battle again, as they would not honor the terms of the surrender. This communicated to Magua that he was free to wreak his revenge upon the English, as he *wanted* to, with his "French father"'s blessing, without saying it explicitly. Magua clearly understood what Montcalm was intimating - as did we viewers as well.
It is interesting to get your Quebecois perspective! However, Iowa is referenced a couple times, when you might actually mean Ohio. Thanks for mentioning that the story is set in the present New York State, as you correctly indicate when talking about the forts involved in the story.
Kathryn Leroux Agreed, I'm sure Ohio was intended
@@randycarey7487 what a moron you are randy...
Regarding 3:06, Hawkeye's English name is Nathaniel Bumppo. Regarding 8:04, Cora Munro is a quadroon whereas her half-sister Alice Munro is white.
Bumppo? 🤨
Much appreciate your historical insight with regard to the French and their First Nation allies as well as the point about the historical inaccuracy about use of rockets to light up the sky.
Spot on fella! I checked your friends other video now it makes some sense. Some is for debate but at least your doing some good for historians of the future! Bravo
My great great grandmother was captured in Nova Scotia and traded back. That's how I know..
2:55 A correction: the Seven years war began in 1756, the movie takes place in 1757, so there's no way for it to be the 3rd year of the war
Historical inaccuracies aside, this movie succeeded in garnering much new interest in this period of American history. And it's true that the French & Indian War definitely set the stage for the American revolution a few short years later. Also, the role played by native Americans was admirably displayed in the movie; another key to the movie's stature.
Having read the book, I was disappointed by the white casting of Munro's younger daughter. She was black in the book. I view this as a missed opportunity to make a social comment.
Just because the Brits created light infantry doesn't mean they employed them well. Witness Breed's Hill and the Concord retreat 18 years later with large forces having poor security to front and flanks. The opening march to Ft Henry by a small force emphasizing speed was entirely realistic. Also worth mentioning is Quebec had sufficient affinity with American colonists to provide them two regiments in the Rev War, as did the Mohican, Wappinger and Munsee tribes as part of the Stockbridge Militia. Last, Hawkeye used his party's rifles during the courier overwatch scene, not muskets, although the level of precision shown using a rifle sighted in by someone else isn't realistic.
Check out History Clarified's review by clicking here:
ua-cam.com/video/LNp5ynjZmfk/v-deo.html
You stated the Mohawk language is no longer spoken, that is untrue. There are still many Mohawk people throughout out the U.S. and Canada and there are many speakers of the language and it is offered online learning formats as well.
I am referring to 'some' native Languages that are extinct. I make reference and speak some Kanien'keha in the video. As I mention in the video, I work on a Mohawk Reservation and know full well that certain native languages are alive and well. I hear them every day and speak a little bit of what I have learnt. Nia:wen.
I read a review of the book quite a while back. That review noted that the author of the book got the Connecticut Mohegan tribe mixed up with a smaller NY (Mohican?) tribe that had a similar name. Have you guys read anything about that?
The Mohicans were in New York/ The Mohegans lived in CT and still do. They allied with the English to try and Wipeout the Pequots. Interestingly both tribes now run casinos in CT, Foxwoods (Pequots) and the Mohegan Sun. 2 of the largest casinos in the US.
Back in the early 1970s I had an emeritus professor in a class on Modern Middle Eastern History. He had gone to live in Turkey as a young and recent college graduate in the early 1920s. He married the daughter of the President of Roberts College and became a member of the expat upper crust. He moved in the circles one step removed from Crown Prince Edward both before and after Wallace Simpson. He returned to Istanbul after WW2, where he remained through the early 60s. All of this is to establish his credentials for a frequent refrain: What actually happened is often not nearly as important as what people think happened. Historical fiction, be it on film or in print, tells the story more people believe or can accept. What is known for fact is relevant only to the scholar. He would illustrate this in debate with my fellow students (a couple of whom were in fact children of Holocaust survivers). His stated opinion (possibly for sake of argument?) was that maybe 5 million Jews died in the Holocaust not the commonly accepted 6 million. Imagine the uproar. There, he would say, is just my point.
This is my introduction to your website. I'm very impressed. Have you done my favorite of all time Lawrence of Arabia?
My channel was originally more "general history", but now I have confined it to the asia-pacific war. As far as historical Film reviews go though, I have done: Last of the Mohicans, The Opium War, The Warlords and When the Last Sword is Drawn (last 2 coming soon). Lawrence of Arabia is a masterpiece and I would look to do it, but the most famous Historical Film Reviewer has made a video on it (History Buff's).
The infamous fact of General Webb not relieving Monro at Fort William Henry had a lot to do with a captured French Canadian militia officer lying to Webb about Montcalm having 11,000 men. Webb surmised that he couldn’t risk being ambushed in the forest by the most adept, and terrifying, guerrillas in the known world - Red Indians. Webb had 5,000 men, but only a few Redcoats, few Indians and a lot of untrained colonial militia. The reason for the paucity of good professional soldiers was that Lord Loudoun, the senior British Army commander in North America, had stripped New York colony of British regulars for the aborted assault on far away Louisburg in present day Nova Scotia. Webb had absolutely no intelligence of Montcalm’s military strength. Webb was conscious that his force was all there was to defend New York colony (later to be the state). A primary source of intelligence was from Indians and he didn’t have many, but the French certainly did.
The rocket flare you ascribe to being a Congreve rocket. WRONG! Illumination devices were used for illumination purposes in European sieges. The Congreve rocket was used to actually kill and more importantly, disrupt, enemies - particularly against cavalry. In Europe rockets were also used in the same year at the Battle of Chioggia - that's as far back as 1380! North American academic standards are notorious. Don't worry, they're ruining Europe's education at industrial charged rates. You're irresponsible because you lack wisdom - a prime requirement for those who purport to judge and comment on history.
The statement of legitimate grievances of the Indians is simply outrageous! The Indians were genuine savages. You're such a coward to not be clear about this. You've done a decent amount of reading, but you slide off from being explicit. The Indians were simply terrifying enemies. It was a salient factor in this war and used as a psychological weapon as much as real weapons. Context and perspective and even basic facts are wanting here.
I enjoyed your presentation...one small nit-pick. You used the word "Iowa" when you meant "Ohio". I grew up in Iowa and we had a self-deprecating T-shirt that read, "The University of Iowa, Idaho Falls, Ohio."
To continue an earlier thought, the Director's Cut cuts short Chingachgook's final monologue, which is a crime.
Also, make sure you get the version that includes the music from Clannad: ua-cam.com/video/G0np-5xbkus/v-deo.html
it occurs to me that a film covering the Beaver wars would be interesting. a war between the Iroquois and the Wabanki including the the Huron would be interesting i fell
That really would be interesting! Brings me back to high school Canadian history class XP
@@ThePacificWarChannel being a brit i never did Canadian history and have yet to find any good books on this particular subject. on a side note i find calling the amercan theatre of the 7 years war the french and indian war a little odd as in truth it was the 5th "French and Indian war" going all the way back to king Williams war in the 1690s but whatever
Who care..great film..yes , I know the background. Read a lot. History classes.
Not an historical story nor movie. it's a fictional story written so by James Fenimore Cooper. Just pointing out.
You have great knowledge, but I have a nitpick. Please do not put large amounts of text when you are also speaking, its better if you leave them at the end of the video when you are not speaking, as sort of outro.
Good point, thank you!
How I wish this were subtitled!
I am a direct descendant of Gilbert Shankland, how does all this tie in with my family? Can you suggest a book on how this ties in with my family? I've seen the movie and only been told that its based on my distant family
I do not specialize in this field of History, but there does seem to be a link between the "Shankland" family and the author of the book "last of the mohicans", James Fenimore Cooper.
The link below sheds some light on readings, particularly on the NewYork Shankland family.
shankland.one-name.net/articles/distrib/dis_ShanklandsComeToAmerica.html
@@ThePacificWarChannel Thank you. I do know this much.
Mt questions:
1). Were all colonials forced to fight with the British?
2.) Also, did the actually war between the French and British end once they took Quebec in the year 1760 (I believe), or was there still huge battles up until the Treaty of Paris?
Technically "colonials" could refer to a large amount of non british nor french peoples (like Swed's/ Germans etc) so I guess you can say not all were forced. As for 1760-1763, there was really sporadic and smaller scale battles, nothing to significant. Like most wars, there were those "holding out" as it were. The natives were an entire other story.
NBS History thank you for responding.
Here is another question if you don’t mind: Were the “colonials” who were of English descent allowed to live in the French territories before and during the French and Indian war?
@@karianne9518 Hmmm a bit tricky to answer honestly. If you pull out a map of what Nouvelle France controlled, you immediately realize they never could properly defend nor administer the area (population was extremely small). Particularly in the Ohio valley or Mississippi region, the native allies dominated these lands and dictated who could live/trade there. I bring this up because it was a point of contention when French came to Ohio before the French Indian war to find out the natives were trading and mingling with the English.
in all likelihood English settlers were probably allowed to live anywhere in Nouvelle France because everyone was trading. The Hudson Bay area is a great example of how intertwined France/England was in North America.
NBS History You made an excellent point, and thank you so much for the info!
Cool, so rare to get a French inspired input on the events bc as usual most of the history is a British narrative. Btw Fort Edward no longer exists and just has a marker, yes probably certainly could hear the engagement from there. The book Crucible of War describes the diversity of the native units at the battle which was heterogeneous not all one tribe or group and had warriors from as far away as the Chippewa on Lake Superior. Also it’s the Ohio valley not the Iowa.
Excellent to hear from a historian. Thank you.
ITs strange to me that they used Cherokee for Huron, I thought that Cherokee was a Iroquoian language.
Actually, Fun Fact! There is only one line in Cherokee and it was only spoken because Wes Studi forgot his line in the other language and improvised using his own Native language (Cherokee). It’s towards the end of the film! My grandmother used to point it out when watched it together.
Nothing like taking the entertainment value from this wonderful movie. I think most care not for the "nitpicking" about historical fact being blurred. If you want the historical account, then read it. Otherwise leave the qualities of this fine story told in a beautiful setting alone. Compared to the crap hollywood produces today, this is a first rate classic.
@Cegeshthen stop reviewing movies.
I've learned a shit load from your channel man, pardon language uy keep em coming
Thank you so much!
Wampum reminds me of bottle caps from Fallout.
Sorry, too many careless mistakes. The epilogue is the ending not beginning of the move. Didn’t Hawkeye go from orphan to frontier fighter and not the other way around? And why doesn’t anyone give James Cooper his due and mention the book was based on the real events of Daniel Boone’s daughters being captured and rescued?
What do you in kahnawake?
I work in education.
NBS History oh okay because I live in kahnawake
@@johnbarb8344 ah! Shé:kon! I hope this video was of some interest. Before me and the UA-cam "History Clarified" made it together, I was not even aware of the links it had to the community. It was a large learning experience for me.
NBS History yeah it’s one of my favourite movies and the history behind it is so cool
Well done
Who were the stronger tribe Iroquois or some other tribe?
During the French Indian War, the Iroquois confederacy was the strongest. Overall in the north eastern front, most native groups were displaced by the Iroquois who themselves were being displaced by European forces.
@@ThePacificWarChannel The Native Peoples were obviously great fighters who adapted the weapons from the euros (even winchesters in the wild west) so how did they end up losing the war, so to speak? What were the key factors in whites prevailing? Some say the Native Americans culture wasn't adapted for long sustained campaigns and would run out of food. Whereas whites could sustain long supply lines and continued reinforcements. What do you think?
@@moranplano Depends on what time period and what region, but to try and find the major points. Disease whipped out most of the native population. Of those who survived the Columbus exchange, many traded, allied, fought different groups of European settlers. A lot of people like to think it was "guns", but the truth is until repeating rifles/revolvers were created in 19th century, many groups of natives were still thriving and defeating european settlers. Take for example the Comanche empire. Its not a simple question because different native groups had vastly different experiences.
@@ThePacificWarChannel Thank you...
@ 6:04 Ohio /oʊˈhaɪoʊ/ not Iowa which is 669 miles east. Not trying to be a wise guy I still say quebec instead of Ka-Beck.
Poor old Patrice snuffed it in 2013
When you say Ohio valley it sounds like you’re saying Iowa valley. It’s nitpicking but since it’s a historical review, accuracy is important.
RIP Russel means
My biggest beef with this movie is that Monro's younger daughter is supposed to be black (in the book). I view this as a tragically missed opportunity to make a social statement.
Fuck social statements.
Its because the 1992 film as stated by michael mann is not based off of the book. I think he never read it. Its a remake of the 1930s film.
@@tecumseh821 There were many differences from the book and the two movies. Hawkeye and Chingachgook were the same age and regarded each other as brothers and Uncas was much younger. Uncas had a romantic relationship with Cora, not Alice.
Don't you mean, the Ohio Valley? Not the Iowa Valley, right?
Yes I think I made a mistake with Ohio and Iowa!
NBS History We can forgive a friend from Canada, PS..please accept my profound apologies for Donald Trump and his views on Canada (I didn't vote for the mentally unbalanced son of a bitch)
You wrote a 100 percent great script for this video. But I have a couple nitpicks. You have a tendency to add upwards inflections to the end of up to three quarters or more of every sentences you spoke. You also smack your lips a lot, and I mean A LOT. Both are very distracting, and take away from the excellent knowledge you are trying to impart upon your viewers.
Haha well said. I am definitely not comfortable with how I present myself yet. Still learning, recently changed from my film camera mic to my pc mic, thanks for telling me, will change this!
I'm actually part mohican.
LIAR! James Fenimore Cooper wrote off that tribe more than 100 years ago 😝
Actually I’m intrigued that any Mohicans still survive.
War is always fought as noble, honourable..what a flippin joke.
This kind of movie is gonna being back Capitalism
Reeeeeee RedCoat bad!
Up the video production have to go
Forgive me for saying this, the book by James Fenimore Cooper is fiction. 🤦♂️
As far as I understand this is a discussion of the historical background not a declaration that the story is true. What are you going to write if someone discusses the historical background of A Tale of Two cities , Romeo and Juliet etc.?I guess you can be forgiven for your opinion,hopefully the same can be extended to me for perhaps overreacting..
Louis du Plessis there’s a difference between opinions and facts.
I think he was excellent at speaking French. Very irrelevant anyway .
Ever since I took a history degree, I cannot watch L o M, as it skips over the plantation systems that was present at that time. The film suggests that the British and French empires made there vast wealth from trading furs beads and cabbages on the side roads when in fact it was by Sugar, cotton, and tobbaco cultivated and grown the forced labour of enslaved African people. This film is as bad as the Patriot.
Need action, otherwise no one will watch. Shut up
I only made it 3/4 of the way through your video before i had to stop, and have several nitpicks of my own. In the beginning, you keep referring to Hawkeye as a Mohican, but in reality he's white. In the book he's referred to as the half-brother of Chingachook, whereas in the movie he's adpoted by him. I understand the movie opens up with something like, " 3 of the last kind", but he is white. You mention about them saying they were trading with the Dutch in Schuylerville, which is pronounced "skylerville" and not "schoolerville", but that may just be your pronunciation. The town was not named after Gen Schuyler, but the Schuyler family who settled the area in the late 1600's. Gen Schuyler was never at the Battle of Saratoga as he had been relieved by Gen Gates just before the battle for his lack in holding Fort Ticonderago against the British. And, the battle occurred in 1777 and not 1779. You talked about the British formations, commenting that "redcoats need to look stupid in American films". You do talk about the change in using light companies and rangers, but tactics of line formations were in use well after the Civil War, and even in the forested colonies, both the French, British and even later the Americans would still use line formations.