I like how emh hulk is characterized. He’s not just a dumb monster or a overly chummy bro that just is hulk at the time. Both hulk and banner are equally interesting characters and seeing them chat in their own mind is so interesting. It makes the character feel more like a character with a real arc of getting a chance to be a better man.
They're like siblings that believe nearly the same thing except when it comes to themselves, one believing he's useless because people shun him, and another that believes if the hulk was the only one to exist out the two, then he'd be the person he wants to be, they literally blame themselves for the others treatment, and the older one takes responsibility for it by sacrificing his time to help clear his brothers name.
Or TAS series. Hulk is essentially a kid with temper problems. It also makes sense due to Banner's traumatic childhood. Hulk persona was inside Bruce psychi the entire time.
Honestly, Hulk laughing and regressing into Banner when Barton seriously tells him that he will put him down was hands down more funnier than any professor hulk/Hulk moment from ragnarok and endgame.
Especially with Banner signaling to Clint to hold on while he got his laughter under control. Just cements how equally hilarious the notion was to both Hulk and Banner.
I think the Hulk relationship with the Avengers deserves a video since EMH did a very different take from the comics. Instead of having the Hulk only for two adventures then leave the group, returning only to be a antagonist or a accidental ally, they kept him on the team and allow Banner and Hulk to develop their dynamics with the other avengers, like Hawkeye.
Definitely my favorite Hulk adaptation. I get the films can’t afford endless CGI animation for Hulk, but EMH actually let the green giant exist as his own character rather than just a rage ball. Also Fred Tatasciore’s Hulk voice is pretty perfect.
@@conradlorgar5508 they can, but that's not the issue. The issue is they don't hold the rights to a Hulk film. They can use him in other characters films but not his own. So his whole story has to be squeezed into already full movies. It would have been great to see what he was upto between infinity war and Endgame but the only possible place for that would have been Endgame, and that film was probably exactly as full as it could have been without being a tiresome mess. And hulks story simply wouldn't have served any purpose other than fan service.
The problem I have with the movie version is that it doesn't feel like the two characters fuse together. None of hulk's childish or stubborness is in him anymore. It feels less likely combined and more like a banner took control of hulk's body.
Well, in the comics, it wasn't just Hulk and Banner. Professor Hulk was Green Hulk's strength and appearance, Banner's intellect, and Joe Fixit's confidence and attitude. I actually liked the 90s hulk cause he felt a bit like an action hero. He was interesting.
In the Immortal Hulk, the Hulk we know isn’t retconned to be another being from hell, they just say that’s where the source of his power comes from. In fact, they go into more detail about his DID, giving his other Hulk personalities like the returning Devil Hulk a reason to exist, stemming from being abused by his father.
This is my favourite version of the Hulk I love the fact that Bruce stops trying to get rid of the Hulk and accepts him as apart of himself and as a living being. It feels like a natural evolution of the character (unlike the comics that constantly reset everything with each new run). And while their compromise is a bit tragic for Bruce, it does lead to Hulk growing as a person and a hero. I liked the brotherly bond between Hulk and Hawkeye, and the respect he develops for Thor, which is represented well when he confronts Ultron after he "kills" Thor. While I am a little disappointed that Hulk didn't rejoin the team full time near the end of S2, It was nice to see Hulk leave on better terms, promising to help If they need him and calling them friends. It was the natural conclusion to his arc finally accepting his role as an Avenger and accepting the others as his friends.
Why do you have to shit on the comics especially with false information? Because I can tell you didn't read immortal hulk, the comics flesh out his character by exploring the mental ramifications on the hulk and banner through the lense of d.i.d while recontextualizing why the hulks exist
Like a lot of other characters, the EMH iteration is my favorite of the Hulk. A lot of people remember that he was a loose cannon at odds with the team, but I remember him more as just as much a tanky backbone as Thor. Remember that he was the first to stick up for Hawkeye when he was accused of being a Skrull, or when he thought Ultron killed Thor he yelled out "I'm going to enjoy this, robot. THIS ONE IS FOR THOR!!!" I also feel as though an entire Hulk cartoon happened before EMH. He fought Wolverine in his show, he has the most villains exclusive to him, he's hit a truce with Banner inside his head, and even background characters working for Ross are interesting. Talbot, Doc Samson, even cowboy-hat guy flying the copter seems like they could've shined in that show.
Josh Fine, one of the show’s producers, has mentioned in the past that EMH grew out of an idea the team had before for a Hulk cartoon - so I feel you’re definitely on to something here! All these characters and backstory which we’re shown were likely holdovers from that never-realised show.
A detail I like about EMH is that the Hulk appears to retain Banners intellect. It has been shown Hulk recognizing useage of Gamma radiation, and has strategized more than a few times. This shows the difference between Banner & the Hulk are more so in temperament opposed to intellect.
the best way to represent his power is to have him being bodied by someone like thor but he gets angrier and eventually overpowers them. That's what makes the hulk so strong: His limitless potential.
Everyone in EMH is the best version of the character. Carol Danvers, Steve Rogers, Hank Pym, Janet, Clint, etc. Even characters with minor appearances felt true to their character, like Doctor Doom for instance.
Honestly, the show doesn’t really need to be congratulated on its characterization of Bruce and the Hulk, it does what most adaptions do of the character. It just seems so fleshed out because the MCU has mishandled and avoided doing so. Congrats on 10k by the way.
I agree - when writing this video my focus was less on an overall evaluation of EMH’s Hulk and more on a closer analysis of that key scene between him and Bruce in the diner. But you’ve got to jazz it up a little for the thumbnail ;) Thanks for the congratulations!
@@PillarofGarbage Yeah, glad your channel’s gotten so successful so quickly. Admittedly the Hulk having more than just the Incredible Hulk movie probably would have helped the characterization…hope Universal Studios’s Hulk Ride is worth it.
There are stories in the comics that imply that the Hulk is actually a childlike personality Banner developed as a coping mechanism for abuse he experienced as a child. Using the Hulk whenever he's scared or angry. This is actually a common way this condition develops in people, too. It just so happens that during the gamma accident this personality manifested as the Hulk we see today. I like this depiction a lot. And I love when Marvel media explores Banner as a man with multiple perspnalities. Thor Ragnarok does this well.
@@Sucmydack That's canonically what the Hulk is. Bruce Banner was abused by his father, causing him to develop a childlike split personality he reverts to in stressful situations as a coping mechanism, this is often how split personalities work irl. When he was hit by the gamma accident, that personality became Hulkified. Hulk acting childish is completely accurate to the character
@@ellie8272 dude i know that, regarsless he was TOO childish, hulk was a gag character in ragnarok when hes got alot more personality traits, its like them making dardevil into a funnt character, theyre taking the worst aspects of comics, its been shown plenty of times hulk can be more than just a stupid character, also taikia waitti is overated af
I like how they treated Hulk and Bruce as two different sides. You can see similarities and differences between those sides. I would have likes to have seen more of the Bruce side. Also after this series got cancelled felt his character was done so dirty with Agents of Smash, took this complex and interesting Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hide and just threw it out. Kinda like how MCU did in Endgame.
EMH Hulk is definitely a superior depiction of Bruce Banner and The Hulk. The Immortal Hulk comic run also made the relationship of Bruce Banner and The Hulks much more interesting and complex. Gotta love it when people do not present The Hulk as just a character for smashing, but rather a person to understand.
Hulk's relationships with the rest of the Avengers definitely deserves a video. Also, I think there were plans for The Incredible Hulk to have a trilogy before it became MCU cannon. It makes me wonder if the character arc of Bruce and Hulk would have gone in a similar direction EMH did.
The transformation of Banner into "smart Hulk" in the MCU was really handled poorly. They should've had Doc Samson and therapy involved with the process like in the comics
It's been an issue since before "smart hulk" I've always felt that in the MCU hulk retains too much self-control. He's rarely ever a liability to the avengers like he is in the comics.
My favorite version of hulk period! I love how he has a actual personality and feelings instead of a mindless monster like the MCU version. You can tell Thor ragnarok tried to replicate this but it honestly just came off as dumb, cringe, and just plain stupid. I also love how he can see banner.
EMH Hulk is the one we should've got in Endgame, he literally knew a form a cosmic radiation that Tony didn't even know, even though he's smart, he wasn't Bruce Banner in a Hulk body. He WAS the Hulk but with knowledge
I do like how EMH shows Banner and Hulk are literally two different people, always sharing one body, and whether they’re at each other’s throats, they always seem to find a way to work together.
I love Hulk in this show as well. We really got to dive into Hulk as his own person instead of what the MCU did where he's just a weapon even on the Avengers. I thought we were going to dive more into who he is Thor 3 but only a small glimpse. I just want to see Hulk let loose but also get to know him as him. Great video man.
I think you really hit the nail on the head for why I love this adaptation of Hulk. An issue I have with a lot of adaptations is that oftentimes Banner and Hulk's character growth is jogging in place. No matter what, the status quo of the Hulk always being on the run from the military will eventually roll back around regardless of the countless lives he'd have saved as an Avenger. See Hulk and Banner come to an understanding and learning to cooperate can help the characters progress. Plus Bruce's insistence that Hulk help the Avengers and Hulk maybe even wanting to just help people regardless gives him more incentive to stick around on the team than the reasoning given in the original comics.
I think that 2003’s Hulk and Banner also reached a similar understanding with each other as by the end of the movie, Banner had no problem transforming into Hulk to protect the people he was caring for
As someone who is plural, the EMH depiction of The Hulk is extremely realistic to someone who experiences DID. It’s very nice to see the writers of EMH use The Hulk as representation for plural people. We also agree that the MCU Hulk is very disappointing, because it felt like they were developing a story for the character that would also be good representation. However, the introduction of Professor Hulk quickly killed that.
I think the most complicated video using this format comparing the MCU with EMH will be Iron Man. Unlike every other character, Iron Man has the most in common with his cinema counterpart, so much so that it honestly feels like they're just snatching up RDJ and putting him in Bronze Age Comics.
I think part of that is due to EMH coming out after the first Iron Man films - it’s interesting to see the beginnings of the MCU impacting on EMH, but nothing else! It would certainly be an interesting one to make :)
Hulk is my favorite character from Avengers EMH. From his first to his last appearance, he was the one I was most invested in and I loved the relationships and dynamics between him and everyone else. Actually, his was the first episode I ever saw.
Great analysis on my favorite character. I think your theory about the Hulk agreeing to work with the avengers because, deep down, he himself wants to do good and be seen as a hero on his own terms, is completely on point. The conversation that Hulk has with Bruce in the episode where the enchantress controls him to attack the avengers pretty much confirms this: Hulk: Everything they have said about me is true. I am a monster… Bruce: It’s only true if you let it be. Walk away now, and it will be. In the comics, the Hulk is usually reluctant to outwardly display his heroism ( especially Gray Hulk/Joe Fixit), because the general perception will always be that he only did it because of Bruce’s influence on him. It serves as a reminder to him that people don’t see him as an individual, and that eventually, for all the good that he does, he will never totally be trusted, and humans will turn on him in the end. So on the show, he has a chance to prove the humans wrong, and he wants that to be his victory alone. Not Bruce’s. Avengers EMH is the best and most layered version of the Hulk outside the comics, and I wish the MCU would takes some cues from it. Their Hulk is always missing the psychological relationship between Bruce and Hulk that makes relatable to so many people. I mean, Bruce’s dissociative identity disorder has never even been discussed or explored on screen at all. To have Bruce and Hulk merge together completely off screen with a hand wave of an explanation is both a missed opportunity and a sin against the characters. Hopefully, when he appears on the She-Hulk Disney plus show, this will be remedied. You should definitely make a separate video exploring Hulk’s friendship with Hawkeye and Captain America, since they’re the team members who made him feel the most accepted, and never viewed him as a monster, even when situations would temp them to believe otherwise. Keep up the great work!
One thing I adore about Earths Mightiest Hero’s is how well they understood and adapted each major character both Hero AND Villian. They aren’t just these 1 dimensional same copy and pasted characters. Mainly for the heroes they gave them their own struggles and challenges for them to overcome and it was so good to see how those things changed and shaped them for the better In my opinion Hulk and Ant-Man/Yellowjacket are standout characters and two of my favourites in the show (aside from Black Panther and Captain America). They couldn’t be more opposite than each other yet they want/wanted the same thing. Peace. And both of them then do a 180. Hank sees that he was wrong and becomes more unhinged and Hulk steps into a more heroic role. Brilliant writing Hulk in the MCU in the other hand is the biggest fumble of a character I’ve ever seen
Hulk in EMH is my favorite version of the character in media. He’s his own character but so is Banner, neither is useless to the team. EMH Bruce Banner feels more like Edward Norton than Mark Ruffalo
I just hate his design. I really don't understand why they couldn't simply go with the comic design. Come to think of it, why didn't the 2003 movie use the comic design? Since him being so green was apparently ang lee trying to mimic the comics.
I think people really sleep on the potential of the Hulk. The MCU havent really been able to go all out with the charecter since the movie rights belonged to universal. But the Hulk has a deeply complex lore featuring a wide rouge gallery, his own fractured psyche and being despised by...well darn near everyone at one point or another.
Not only was this the best Hulk, with the possible exception of agents of S.M.A.S.H. which almost felt like a continuation of this. But I also feel this was the best of the avengers al together. It was possibly the last time the characters were not being shoved into a mold made by the MCU version. Part of what made me like it was it was very much like the point that the two had reached in the Planet Hulk story line. Hulk and Banner had a duality similar to jeckyll and Hyde in League of Extraordinary Gentlemen. One of my favorite moments was a episode that started with Hulk siting around eating a bucket of chicken and Tony walks in having trouble understanding some energy readings his sensors picked up. Hulk glances at it and tells Tony its cosmic radiation which Tony automatically disagrees with only to realize that Hulk was right. This is the two working togther with banner providing his knowledge through Hulk.
It wasa different hulk, but aproviate. Ans agents of smash is very 80s cartoon with morals and talling, which tat fits in. Plus they actually make him funny here. And red hulk, is interesting.
Yeah, I'm torn between this and Planet Hulk (especially as retconned by later comics). Probably the main reason why I like Planet Hulk so much is that Hulk gets a happy ending and a more or less normal life (pretending that World War Hulk never happened).
The big thing I also love about banner is someone I can relate to because of his anger issues. Banner spends so long trying to deal with the hulk by repressing it, but because of this it flares up it the most difficult of times becoming a monster. My anger was like that and when I lost control I had hurt people and I felt awful because of it. I ended up pushing people away and disconnecting with friends because of how scared I was of being that monster. But I learnt that by accepting that anger by understanding it and where it comes from I was able to move forward to be healthy and to have friends again. Which is why I hate mcu hulk because it just removes all that and now he's prof hulk and that happened off screen. Now he's cgi mark ruffalo
I mean, EMH really paid respect to ALL characters adapted, you can hardly find an adaptation that respects all the characters it adapt, sometimes the have to nerf or mischaracterize some characters to tell properly its story, that SUPRISINGLY don't happen in this show, each character(even the smaller roles) gets really well characterized in power & personality
Cartoon Hulk: goes through arc of splitting between Bruce and The Hulk, with Banner agreeing to let the Hulk stay in control so the Hulk can save the world Live Action Hulk: hulk out *dabs*
@@dylansharp8471 You're absolutely right, he did a lot more humiliating character moments in his mcu existence. Like acting and whining like an actual child instead of only having the naivety of of one. Be the butt of jokes, and doing nothing useful the entire movie except wrestle Fanrir the giant wolf for 2 minutes and hit Surtur (Also treated as a joke). And all of that is in Ragnarok alone. His treatment in the mcu after the avengers has been nothing but an insult to the character time and time again.
The Hulk was my favorite comic book hero when I was a kid, so I was naively excited to see him getting more movies and expanding on a universe with him in it. A decade down the line and he’s slowly become someone else entirely in the MCU. He’s played only for jokes nowadays, and we never really saw that character dynamic between Banner and Hulk truly explored. What really got me fed up was when Thanos kicked his ass in less than a minute and THE FREAKIN HULK got scared and ran away. I don’t have to tell anyone here why that fight should have ended very differently, but not enough people talk about that scene and I’m still mad at it years later lol. Great video! Always happy to see Hulk discussions
The problem with the Hulk in the comics was they took his multiple personality disorder too far and gave him too many different identities. While I agree with you that the movies skipped over the Hulk's character development, a huge problem Marvel had was that they could never make a solo Hulk film and there were already too many characters to balance out in the MCU. Also, while EMH is my favorite Hulk, a huge advantage that they had was not only the additional to flesh out the character, but they started from a point that was already pretty health for Banner the first time we meet the Hulk.
Well, bare in mind that The Incredible Hulk is MCU Canon, and at that point Bruce/Hulk were definitely not doing good mentally. Then in the first Avengers movie you can tell he's on edge, like he's doing okay cuz of his circumstances and surroundings but he's nervous and anxious being there cuz he doesn't want to get triggered. Then every movie appearance since then he's gotten more comfortable with the team as he's spent more time with them and had opportunities to exercise his skills. Up until it culminates with Thor:Ragnarok- Infinity War-Endgame, which I'm sure are recent enough to remember.
@@leonardobraynen1524 I am not saying they can't make a good one. I am say the can't period. The Incredible Hulk's IP is owned by Universal Studios so Marvel can't make another solo Hulk film until they buy the rights back.
The best MCU hulk was Edward Norton's Hulk. I'm pretty sure MCU hulk would've stayed character driven had they kept him around, or if they had decided not to make hulk so comedic during and after the avengers movie. I wish we could get his comic stories of tragedy in the big screen again.
Well done, in-depth analysis of ol' Jade jaws psyches (Banner/Hulk). Just wanted to throw in my 2 cents and say I'd love to see your thoughts on Hulk's relationships/interactions with his fellow Avengers. I'll always remember a scene from the comic during one of its reboots when the Avengers decided to reunite to save the world from Morgan LeFey; They were all at Avengers Mansion minus the Hulk (who was by this time still highly antisocial, lol, but fairly intelligent). They got a video transmission from him on their computers where he said, scowling, "Yeah, I heard about yer little pajama party. I don't wanna be bothered. Bother me again...and I come bother YOU. Got it?" Click. And Cap just said "Well now." Lol. I loved it, and it pretty much sums it up. Thanks for all your great vids!
Hulk is my all time favourite fictional character that drew me to Superheroes, monsters, horror & the psychological. I've been disappointed with the MCU version over the past few years but looking back at the EMH depection it's certainly the most heathly Banner/Hulk of any adaptation as both have agreed to a arrangement as well as being a heroic force. If EMH ever continues it would be incredible to see how they evolve, the other personalities coming about like Joe Fixit and Devil Hulk, seeing other Hulk characters coming to the fray like Betty Ross/Red Harpy, Rick Jones etc. Pillar of Garbage I'd be happy to see your Hulk & the Avengers relationship video and thank you for this video.
My only problem with EMH Hulk is that there's way too little Banner. Him never being allowed to come out is extremely sad, he doesn't have a life anymore now. I kept expecting Hulk's development of learning to trust others to eventually lead to them having a fairer deal of who gets to be out, but it just never happened.
I know this was posted months ago but I completely agree. While I love the EMH version of Hulk I felt that the Bruce personality got cheated and I wish we got to see more of him. It’s odd that none of the other avengers found it problematic that Hulk was in control 24/7 and never let poor Banner out but one day a month. I love seeing Bruce fully accepting the hulk and willing to give up his time so Hulk can be seen as a hero but the relationship seems one sided as the Hulk is still not very accepting of Banner. It’s great to see Hulk be Hulk in everyday situations but Bruce shouldn’t be completely denied the ability to enjoy his own life either. They both have a right to exist and I see no reason why the deal couldn’t be to just split their time equally between each other so that both of them get to shine.
Personally I would have atleast wanted more internal dialogues between banner and hulk, but I do like the nice little subversion of having the hulk be the dominant personality that takes the focus (most adaptations usually focus on banner and only bring the hulk out during the battles/tension moments so having sorta the opposite was interesting/allowed the hulk to be a character). But yeah if the show had continued I would have loved for banner and hulk to develop a more balanced relationship
The Immortal Hulk series definitely goes through this same exploration of Banner’s DID and starts a similar coexistence between Hulk, Banner, and the Grey Hulk (who is now red)
The Hulk is usually my favorite Avenger and I like EMH’s portrayal of him and Banner, they have a dark and complex relationship. My biggest complaint about Avengers Assembled is that Hulk is just there for comedic relief and Banner is almost completely nonexistent except for like 1 or 2 episodes.
Glad others feel the same way I do about the MCU Hulk in comparison to EMH. That incarnation of Hulk has always been some sort of golden standard for me when it came to the Hulk-Banner relationship, the fact that the Hulk has gotten such little characterization in the MCU compared to shows like this just baffles me. Hulk being his own personality due to Banner's disorder was always so fascinasting.
...I'll always remember one of my favorite moments of Hulk on-screen, movie or show. "...You're making it very difficult to not turn into the Hulk, and smash you." - Banner to Hawkeye, in an elevator
This is my favourite depiction because we just get to see more of it. I kinda wish Thor: Ragnarok incorporated the communication between each other while in different forms. But instead of Bruce talking to Hulk, it's Hulk talking to Bruce after he changes back (Bruce would have still been suppressed for 2 years)
Banner's fate is kind of tragic in Mightest heroes. Because mostly it is Hulk in there. And he gets only short vacations. Also Hawkeye compares him with his bow, like he doesnt even consider him as part of Avengers
Hey, great stuff you made! Also a really big fan of the Hulk! Everything you said I agreed with other than the Immortal Hulk mention. In that book (specifically the last issue: issue 50), the One Above All tell the Hulk that everyone has a Hulk, just that Banner's manifested due to his childhood and the gamma bomb. With this, the Hulk isn't some otherworldly demon like you claimed, but is exactly what he's always been. I also may have to reread the series and last issue because it HAS been a while since. Keep up the good work!
EMH showed my favorite type of Hulk, the uneasy to cooperative alliance between Hulk and Banner. It also shows that, while anger might make him stronger, the Hulk only can reach the utter peek of his power when he, Banner, and sometimes the other personalities in his head, all agree. That's why his Green Scar form, the one from World War Hulk, was so damned strong and dangerous. They were both equally enraged and wanted revenge, and their cooperation lead to Hulk tapping into his World Breaker power.
I love this, and I wish the movies had done something similar, even just a scene like the one in the diner before getting professor hulk would have been great! I still love hulk in the comics, who at times is given very similar characterizations, but part of the problems with comics is that everything needs to be reset eventually, so any character progression will always be reset
While Immortal Hulk does have the whole “green door” stuff, Bruce definitely still does have DID in it. It delves pretty deep into the nature of his alters.
You should look at the agents of SMASH it’s in the earths mightiest heros universe if I remember correctly, and there was so much more focus on hulk as a person, banner is on the backseat but isn’t necessarily trying to get out of it.
Hi! were part of that .001-1% of people with this disorder who found this video!! We’re happy to see people all around the world start talking more about Dissociative Identity disorder, it’s helped people like us come a long way. It genuinely touches our heart to know that people are starting to understand that alters aren’t something that can just be removed. If anything most systems that come to an understanding Acknowledge their existence as true as their own. We are just consciousness inhabiting the same vessel ^^
The idee fore hulk´s relation with the team is very good + i still now that the hope of the show´s revive is here it gunne be next year i bet 100% i feel it nice vidoe my man
I wonder if we'll get something close to this relationship in the MCU with what we've seen in She-Hulk/The Shang Chi credit scene. Now that Banner is normal, will we see the Hulk revert more to how he used to be?
Historically in the comics Professor Hulk kind of was just a temporary thing that eventually broke up into his base personalities. Basically it was not a cured form but more like a fragile truce between his personalities.
@@kennethsatria6607 I mean that makes sense for the comics. They always undo changes that are permanent. Like in a comic book, no character ever stays dead or has a permanent change. Like Peter in the Civil War comics. He reveals his identity but later sells his soul so everyone forgets, which is something I hope doesn't happen in NWH. I know he'll try to have everyone forget, but it feels cheap.
@@dylansharp8471 To be fair, The way I thought they would just have it where the spell is just complete with MJ, Ned, Happy, and anyone who is close to Peter still knowing while everyone is else forgot. With how they actually did it in NWH is perfect
I noticed you played a 70s show clip Believe it or not but that banner also begins to realize how useful hulk can be One of the best ones was banner gets hit by a car and losses the ability to walk but after having a hulk out he learns that hulk can heal it, of course now he must decide risking the city's safety or be should he be selfish It's actually a great series if you find the right episodes, great vid man
In my marvel universe series when we first see hulk he’s pretty much the angry green rage monster we come to love. But really even in the start we see that it’s something wrong with him. We later find out that during Hulk and Banner’s many mental battles Hulk accidentally peaked just a bit into Bruce’s mind where Hulk would get the complexity of humanity loaded into his brain. While it made him angry the only thing he really cared to think about was realizing the peoples perspective. Realizing how many people probably lost their homes or lives just because of him and how the times he beat up those who where probably the only ones that wanted to be with him. While the hulk is the “regular” hulk (he would take from emh hulk) he doesn’t shout that he’s the strongest there is or insult those who is fighting because he gained that Banner always had…. Perspective. Like imagine him looking into his own fists and imagining how many people lost their homes. It’s thanks to that perspective that kind of pushes him into defeating Thanos during the “Infinity Gauntlet: second snap” arc (pls give it a better name) since he knows how many has suffered thanks to Thanos. By the end of the series Hulk and Bruce’s mind merge into one. This version of hulk is like if you combined Professor Hulk, EMH Hulk, Doc Green and Bruce Banner. But that wouldn’t mean that the hulk is still the hulk that leaves to smash bad guys and gets stronger the angrier he becomes. HULK SMASH!
How the characters are written in the show is part of why this series is so huge among the marvel community, or at least that’s the way it is for me, it’s definitely my most favorite versions of the avengers, I love the MCU and all but I love this series
Geez I remember borrowing various disks of this show from my local dvd store, they were all out of order and I don’t think I’ve seen past season one but I remember really enjoying what I watched, I never seem to hear anyone talk about it so it’s cool to see it here. Also the gamma radiation transformations of the rest of the avengers squad still haunt my dreams.
I’d like to see a fight where Banner and Hulk are so synchronized in their actions that their body constantly changes. Like Banner is allowed to stay active to learn a martial art and there’s a fight where the duo are dealing with a swarm of bad guys, switching between smashing and deflecting. Maybe Banner turns a little green with Hulk influence helping their attacks or Hulk’s hair changes color with Banner influence. Similar to Venom.
Yes I would like to see a video going over The Incredible Hulk's relationship with the other Avengers from Earth's Mightiest Heroes. It's been so long since I've seen that series but I don't remember most of it
Wait, for real? "Hulk vs." is in the EMH continuity? I mean, I had that fun headcanon but I didn't actually think it was real. In any case, EMH definitely has what I think is the best version of the Hulk. All of your points were 100% correct. He's not the dumb "Hulk smash puny human" version people like to joke about in media. And they treated him with a seriousness and dignity that the MCU didn't even try to handle. And that stinks, because EMH shows the potential for the dynamic between Banner and Hulk and it would've been great to see that fully realized. This is actually the first video from you that I saw and a great start all around. I'd love to see you analyze the relationship between Hulk and the rest of the Avengers.
The best versions of the Hulk have humanity. All human flaws. Dr. Banner has cured himself countless times in the comic‘s from his green version, only to crawl back, when trouble is coming. You can not get rid of the Hulk.
100% agree as hulk is my favourite marvel character across the board (MCU needs work) this depiction of him as always been my favourite and warms my heart knowing they can get along
You glossed over SOOOO much of Immortal hulk if 'from another dimension' is what you got out of it. Hulk, as well as every gamma irradiated beings are connected through the one below all. It's really cool and dives into the multiple personalities that reside in the current mind of whoever is 'Hulk' at the given moment.
It was so heartbreaking in the episode where Hulk officially calls himself an Avenger and calls on the team to face Red Hulk, because right after that, Skrull/Captain America talks him down into handling things way differently than how he usually would, only to just completely leave him out to dry This man, who fought beside Hulk, who called him a hero, who trusted him and earned that trust back, utterly betrayed him from his point of view Leaves me with a bad feeling everytime I watch it
Watching your playlist back to back after just finishing the show. Can confirm that Hulk and Banner absolutely remind me of DID as I've experienced it. I also feel like It shows more like that in the MCU following the first couple She-Hulk episodes
I really liked the conversation between Hulk and Captain America in the episode “Hail Hydra”: “Is that why you teamed up with me? To protect people from the monster?” “Stow that talk. I want you to protect civilians from Hydra: they’re the monsters here not you. In my day we had a name for someone like you.” “Yeah? What’s that?” “Hero. I’ve been watching you Hulk: no matter how scared people are of you, no matter how much you’re hounded, you always do the right thing and that makes you a hero in my book.”
The problem I have with MCU's Professor Hulk is that it felt like Banner did it to himself without The Hulk's consent. That Banner took control of Hulk's body, and Hulk didn't have any say. It really should have been a cooperative effort between the two of them, almost like couple's therapy.
If i made a Hulk show, the arc for Banner would be kind if like EMH, him reaching a balance with the Hulk, learning to live with him. But also i would potray the Hulk in his childlike self, but not have him appear only in fight scenes and the five-ten minutes after that. He would get full episodes. But without little of Banner. Their screen time woukd also be in balance. Kind off like a 50/50 approximately. And Hulk would get his own character arc inspired by, and i'm not kidding, Stitch from Lilo & Stitch: A destructive beast who realizes he wants to be loved. And an inspiration from Banner's arc would be the curse storyline from The Owl House: Both are about a fugitive with a beast inside them trying to keep it inside as much as possible only to learn to embrace the Beast and see it not as a burden, but as a living creature that is also trapped in their body.
That's what I love about the Hulk. It's not about a mere monster trying to be a hero but a man having to battle his inner monster always at odds with himself so much so that he doesn't even trust himself
I like how emh hulk is characterized. He’s not just a dumb monster or a overly chummy bro that just is hulk at the time. Both hulk and banner are equally interesting characters and seeing them chat in their own mind is so interesting. It makes the character feel more like a character with a real arc of getting a chance to be a better man.
Hulk saying cosmic radiation threw me off
Yeah, that was definetly a highlight for me from the show.
It's probably joe fixit fused in there somewhere too
They're like siblings that believe nearly the same thing except when it comes to themselves, one believing he's useless because people shun him, and another that believes if the hulk was the only one to exist out the two, then he'd be the person he wants to be, they literally blame themselves for the others treatment, and the older one takes responsibility for it by sacrificing his time to help clear his brothers name.
Or TAS series. Hulk is essentially a kid with temper problems. It also makes sense due to Banner's traumatic childhood. Hulk persona was inside Bruce psychi the entire time.
Honestly, Hulk laughing and regressing into Banner when Barton seriously tells him that he will put him down was hands down more funnier than any professor hulk/Hulk moment from ragnarok and endgame.
Yeah, that scene was hilarious!
@@DavidMartinez-ce3lp This Scene Is Gold!
Feel like that could've been a meme, as neat as the taco one was
Especially with Banner signaling to Clint to hold on while he got his laughter under control. Just cements how equally hilarious the notion was to both Hulk and Banner.
Ragnorak goated fym
I think the Hulk relationship with the Avengers deserves a video since EMH did a very different take from the comics. Instead of having the Hulk only for two adventures then leave the group, returning only to be a antagonist or a accidental ally, they kept him on the team and allow Banner and Hulk to develop their dynamics with the other avengers, like Hawkeye.
Yeah me to.
His friendship with Hawkeye was great.
@@DavidMartinez-ce3lp ikr
I really loved his dynamic with Hawkeye
I think there are some points in the comics where banner is kept as a member of the avengers, but I definitely see your point
Definitely my favorite Hulk adaptation. I get the films can’t afford endless CGI animation for Hulk, but EMH actually let the green giant exist as his own character rather than just a rage ball. Also Fred Tatasciore’s Hulk voice is pretty perfect.
As far as I’m concerned, Fred IS Hulk’s voice!
Same!
They can definitely afford endless cgo
Fred is to Hulk what Steve Blum is to Wolverine, or what Mark Hamill is to Joker, or Kevin Conroy to Batman.
@@conradlorgar5508 they can, but that's not the issue. The issue is they don't hold the rights to a Hulk film. They can use him in other characters films but not his own. So his whole story has to be squeezed into already full movies. It would have been great to see what he was upto between infinity war and Endgame but the only possible place for that would have been Endgame, and that film was probably exactly as full as it could have been without being a tiresome mess. And hulks story simply wouldn't have served any purpose other than fan service.
The problem I have with the movie version is that it doesn't feel like the two characters fuse together. None of hulk's childish or stubborness is in him anymore. It feels less likely combined and more like a banner took control of hulk's body.
Well that is professor hulk from the comics
@@Joeymercury514 then it’s trash
@@Joeymercury514 it's trash
@@Dave102693 yeah most people didn't like professor hulk in the comics either
Well, in the comics, it wasn't just Hulk and Banner. Professor Hulk was Green Hulk's strength and appearance, Banner's intellect, and Joe Fixit's confidence and attitude. I actually liked the 90s hulk cause he felt a bit like an action hero. He was interesting.
In the Immortal Hulk, the Hulk we know isn’t retconned to be another being from hell, they just say that’s where the source of his power comes from. In fact, they go into more detail about his DID, giving his other Hulk personalities like the returning Devil Hulk a reason to exist, stemming from being abused by his father.
Thanks for the clarification!
Immortal Hulk was amazing; it sucks that it ended.
Hes not from hell. He’s the personification of God’s anger or toaa anger. It’s why he has no limit to his strength/anger and why he is so op
That story went on way longer than it should have. Honestly, I didn't get the hype.
Sounds like a needless and pointless change to me.
This is my favourite version of the Hulk I love the fact that Bruce stops trying to get rid of the Hulk and accepts him as apart of himself and as a living being. It feels like a natural evolution of the character (unlike the comics that constantly reset everything with each new run).
And while their compromise is a bit tragic for Bruce, it does lead to Hulk growing as a person and a hero. I liked the brotherly bond between Hulk and Hawkeye, and the respect he develops for Thor, which is represented well when he confronts Ultron after he "kills" Thor.
While I am a little disappointed that Hulk didn't rejoin the team full time near the end of S2, It was nice to see Hulk leave on better terms, promising to help If they need him and calling them friends. It was the natural conclusion to his arc finally accepting his role as an Avenger and accepting the others as his friends.
Spot on!
@@PillarofGarbage my fav live action verison is the one from the 70s tv show
I really enjoy some of hulks comic runs, but yeah, the constant resets are always gonna be a problem of comics in general
Why do you have to shit on the comics especially with false information? Because I can tell you didn't read immortal hulk, the comics flesh out his character by exploring the mental ramifications on the hulk and banner through the lense of d.i.d while recontextualizing why the hulks exist
@@isiahalcindor6278 and also retconned his powers to being from the dark version of the one above all for no reason and then gets reset.
Like a lot of other characters, the EMH iteration is my favorite of the Hulk. A lot of people remember that he was a loose cannon at odds with the team, but I remember him more as just as much a tanky backbone as Thor. Remember that he was the first to stick up for Hawkeye when he was accused of being a Skrull, or when he thought Ultron killed Thor he yelled out "I'm going to enjoy this, robot. THIS ONE IS FOR THOR!!!"
I also feel as though an entire Hulk cartoon happened before EMH. He fought Wolverine in his show, he has the most villains exclusive to him, he's hit a truce with Banner inside his head, and even background characters working for Ross are interesting. Talbot, Doc Samson, even cowboy-hat guy flying the copter seems like they could've shined in that show.
Josh Fine, one of the show’s producers, has mentioned in the past that EMH grew out of an idea the team had before for a Hulk cartoon - so I feel you’re definitely on to something here! All these characters and backstory which we’re shown were likely holdovers from that never-realised show.
@@PillarofGarbage Imagine a universe where we received that Hulk cartoon, and it was great!
@TheGlassesPro How about both!
The hulk in emh is honestly the best version of the character, it not only perfectly represents his dynamic with banner, but also how powerful he is.
A detail I like about EMH is that the Hulk appears to retain Banners intellect. It has been shown Hulk recognizing useage of Gamma radiation, and has strategized more than a few times. This shows the difference between Banner & the Hulk are more so in temperament opposed to intellect.
EMH is the best adaptation of Matvek characters. Period.
the best way to represent his power is to have him being bodied by someone like thor but he gets angrier and eventually overpowers them.
That's what makes the hulk so strong: His limitless potential.
Everyone in EMH is the best version of the character. Carol Danvers, Steve Rogers, Hank Pym, Janet, Clint, etc. Even characters with minor appearances felt true to their character, like Doctor Doom for instance.
Honestly, the show doesn’t really need to be congratulated on its characterization of Bruce and the Hulk, it does what most adaptions do of the character. It just seems so fleshed out because the MCU has mishandled and avoided doing so. Congrats on 10k by the way.
I agree - when writing this video my focus was less on an overall evaluation of EMH’s Hulk and more on a closer analysis of that key scene between him and Bruce in the diner. But you’ve got to jazz it up a little for the thumbnail ;)
Thanks for the congratulations!
@@PillarofGarbage Yeah, glad your channel’s gotten so successful so quickly. Admittedly the Hulk having more than just the Incredible Hulk movie probably would have helped the characterization…hope Universal Studios’s Hulk Ride is worth it.
@@MTV2O2O It is a great roller-coaster, I gotta say
@@nicholasdiaz1925 Yeah, whatever not worth sacrificing the entire Hulk franchise and its characters
@@MTV2O2O well, it seems we’ll be getting more soon, between Shang-Chi’s post-credits scene and the upcoming She-Hulk show.
There are stories in the comics that imply that the Hulk is actually a childlike personality Banner developed as a coping mechanism for abuse he experienced as a child. Using the Hulk whenever he's scared or angry. This is actually a common way this condition develops in people, too. It just so happens that during the gamma accident this personality manifested as the Hulk we see today. I like this depiction a lot. And I love when Marvel media explores Banner as a man with multiple perspnalities. Thor Ragnarok does this well.
Yeah, people with DID tend to develop a protective alter of sorts as a result of their trauma to protect themselves.
Ehhh i disnt like hulk in ragnarok, he felt wayyyy too childish
@@Sucmydack That's canonically what the Hulk is. Bruce Banner was abused by his father, causing him to develop a childlike split personality he reverts to in stressful situations as a coping mechanism, this is often how split personalities work irl. When he was hit by the gamma accident, that personality became Hulkified. Hulk acting childish is completely accurate to the character
@@ellie8272 dude i know that, regarsless he was TOO childish, hulk was a gag character in ragnarok when hes got alot more personality traits, its like them making dardevil into a funnt character, theyre taking the worst aspects of comics, its been shown plenty of times hulk can be more than just a stupid character, also taikia waitti is overated af
@@SucmydackHulk is childish, but he still matures with Banner to a degree, so I can agree a bit
I like how they treated Hulk and Bruce as two different sides. You can see similarities and differences between those sides. I would have likes to have seen more of the Bruce side. Also after this series got cancelled felt his character was done so dirty with Agents of Smash, took this complex and interesting Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hide and just threw it out. Kinda like how MCU did in Endgame.
69 noice
Your point is correct but I strongly urge you to check out Overly sarcastic productions video on jekel and hide
@@Jason_Wilhelm thanks for the recommendation.
EMH Hulk is definitely a superior depiction of Bruce Banner and The Hulk. The Immortal Hulk comic run also made the relationship of Bruce Banner and The Hulks much more interesting and complex. Gotta love it when people do not present The Hulk as just a character for smashing, but rather a person to understand.
Hulk's relationships with the rest of the Avengers definitely deserves a video. Also, I think there were plans for The Incredible Hulk to have a trilogy before it became MCU cannon. It makes me wonder if the character arc of Bruce and Hulk would have gone in a similar direction EMH did.
I think so - that last scene where Banner deliberately transforms in the cabin would suggest a similar trajectory!
Marvel wanted to make a hulk trilogy, but universal studios didn’t allow them to.
Also for the MCU Hulk, it's not even a combination of Hulk and Banner, it's just Banner with Hulk's body. Hulk essentially doesn't exist anymore.
That's Professor Hulk from the comics, though
He might as well be some other dude with super strength as a superpower . The character sucks so bad.
The transformation of Banner into "smart Hulk" in the MCU was really handled poorly. They should've had Doc Samson and therapy involved with the process like in the comics
I agree - especially since more MCU Doc Samson means Ty Burrell returning!
This is why I think the Infinity saga should have been 3 films, similar to the Lord of the rings.
It's been an issue since before "smart hulk" I've always felt that in the MCU hulk retains too much self-control. He's rarely ever a liability to the avengers like he is in the comics.
@@DavidMartinez-ce3lp that wouldn't really work as good as the films have already done.
@@SWDude2710 I think it would be better. Why rush to the end? Cramming everything into one film. Endgame was garbage.
My favorite version of hulk period! I love how he has a actual personality and feelings instead of a mindless monster like the MCU version. You can tell Thor ragnarok tried to replicate this but it honestly just came off as dumb, cringe, and just plain stupid. I also love how he can see banner.
I wouldn't say that.
@@dylansharp8471 good for u lol
EMH Hulk is the one we should've got in Endgame, he literally knew a form a cosmic radiation that Tony didn't even know, even though he's smart, he wasn't Bruce Banner in a Hulk body. He WAS the Hulk but with knowledge
I can stomp MCU with my finger.
I love Leonardos!!!!
I do like how EMH shows Banner and Hulk are literally two different people, always sharing one body, and whether they’re at each other’s throats, they always seem to find a way to work together.
I love Hulk in this show as well. We really got to dive into Hulk as his own person instead of what the MCU did where he's just a weapon even on the Avengers. I thought we were going to dive more into who he is Thor 3 but only a small glimpse. I just want to see Hulk let loose but also get to know him as him. Great video man.
I think you really hit the nail on the head for why I love this adaptation of Hulk. An issue I have with a lot of adaptations is that oftentimes Banner and Hulk's character growth is jogging in place. No matter what, the status quo of the Hulk always being on the run from the military will eventually roll back around regardless of the countless lives he'd have saved as an Avenger. See Hulk and Banner come to an understanding and learning to cooperate can help the characters progress. Plus Bruce's insistence that Hulk help the Avengers and Hulk maybe even wanting to just help people regardless gives him more incentive to stick around on the team than the reasoning given in the original comics.
I think that 2003’s Hulk and Banner also reached a similar understanding with each other as by the end of the movie, Banner had no problem transforming into Hulk to protect the people he was caring for
@applekingen3581fax
Wonderful insights as always!
Best EMH Hulk line: "It's called a distraction smart guy."
Let me guess…
Season 1, Episode 17 -
*”The Man Who Stole Tomorrow”* ?
Imagine writing a more competent character arc in a two season cartoon over a span two years then in a 10 year cinematic universe
As someone who is plural, the EMH depiction of The Hulk is extremely realistic to someone who experiences DID. It’s very nice to see the writers of EMH use The Hulk as representation for plural people. We also agree that the MCU Hulk is very disappointing, because it felt like they were developing a story for the character that would also be good representation. However, the introduction of Professor Hulk quickly killed that.
I think the most complicated video using this format comparing the MCU with EMH will be Iron Man. Unlike every other character, Iron Man has the most in common with his cinema counterpart, so much so that it honestly feels like they're just snatching up RDJ and putting him in Bronze Age Comics.
I think part of that is due to EMH coming out after the first Iron Man films - it’s interesting to see the beginnings of the MCU impacting on EMH, but nothing else! It would certainly be an interesting one to make :)
We really got robbed of such a good show when they cancelled this series. The writing and animation was superb
Hulk is my favorite character from Avengers EMH. From his first to his last appearance, he was the one I was most invested in and I loved the relationships and dynamics between him and everyone else. Actually, his was the first episode I ever saw.
Great analysis on my favorite character. I think your theory about the Hulk agreeing to work with the avengers because, deep down, he himself wants to do good and be seen as a hero on his own terms, is completely on point. The conversation that Hulk has with Bruce in the episode where the enchantress controls him to attack the avengers pretty much confirms this:
Hulk: Everything they have said about me is true. I am a monster…
Bruce: It’s only true if you let it be. Walk away now, and it will be.
In the comics, the Hulk is usually reluctant to outwardly display his heroism ( especially Gray Hulk/Joe Fixit), because the general perception will always be that he only did it because of Bruce’s influence on him. It serves as a reminder to him that people don’t see him as an individual, and that eventually, for all the good that he does, he will never totally be trusted, and humans will turn on him in the end.
So on the show, he has a chance to prove the humans wrong, and he wants that to be his victory alone. Not Bruce’s.
Avengers EMH is the best and most layered version of the Hulk outside the comics, and I wish the MCU would takes some cues from it. Their Hulk is always missing the psychological relationship between Bruce and Hulk that makes relatable to so many people. I mean, Bruce’s dissociative identity disorder has never even been discussed or explored on screen at all. To have Bruce and Hulk merge together completely off screen with a hand wave of an explanation is both a missed opportunity and a sin against the characters. Hopefully, when he appears on the She-Hulk Disney plus show, this will be remedied.
You should definitely make a separate video exploring Hulk’s friendship with Hawkeye and Captain America, since they’re the team members who made him feel the most accepted, and never viewed him as a monster, even when situations would temp them to believe otherwise.
Keep up the great work!
One thing I adore about Earths Mightiest Hero’s is how well they understood and adapted each major character both Hero AND Villian. They aren’t just these 1 dimensional same copy and pasted characters. Mainly for the heroes they gave them their own struggles and challenges for them to overcome and it was so good to see how those things changed and shaped them for the better
In my opinion Hulk and Ant-Man/Yellowjacket are standout characters and two of my favourites in the show (aside from Black Panther and Captain America). They couldn’t be more opposite than each other yet they want/wanted the same thing. Peace. And both of them then do a 180. Hank sees that he was wrong and becomes more unhinged and Hulk steps into a more heroic role. Brilliant writing
Hulk in the MCU in the other hand is the biggest fumble of a character I’ve ever seen
Hulk and Hawkeye’s relationship in this show deserves a deeper dive I think PLEASE DO IT!
Hulk in EMH is my favorite version of the character in media. He’s his own character but so is Banner, neither is useless to the team. EMH Bruce Banner feels more like Edward Norton than Mark Ruffalo
I like how at the end of, The incredible hulk it shows how Bruce was able to control his emotion and to help himself control and accept the hulk.
I just hate his design. I really don't understand why they couldn't simply go with the comic design.
Come to think of it, why didn't the 2003 movie use the comic design? Since him being so green was apparently ang lee trying to mimic the comics.
This show did the Hulk so right. I love the idea of both personalities working together.
I think people really sleep on the potential of the Hulk. The MCU havent really been able to go all out with the charecter since the movie rights belonged to universal.
But the Hulk has a deeply complex lore featuring a wide rouge gallery, his own fractured psyche and being despised by...well darn near everyone at one point or another.
Tell me a character thats
part Jeckill
part Hyde
part oppenhimmer
part Frankestein
Part werewolf
Part Godzilla
Does not have imteresting potential
Not only was this the best Hulk, with the possible exception of agents of S.M.A.S.H. which almost felt like a continuation of this. But I also feel this was the best of the avengers al together. It was possibly the last time the characters were not being shoved into a mold made by the MCU version. Part of what made me like it was it was very much like the point that the two had reached in the Planet Hulk story line. Hulk and Banner had a duality similar to jeckyll and Hyde in League of Extraordinary Gentlemen. One of my favorite moments was a episode that started with Hulk siting around eating a bucket of chicken and Tony walks in having trouble understanding some energy readings his sensors picked up. Hulk glances at it and tells Tony its cosmic radiation which Tony automatically disagrees with only to realize that Hulk was right. This is the two working togther with banner providing his knowledge through Hulk.
It wasa different hulk, but aproviate. Ans agents of smash is very 80s cartoon with morals and talling, which tat fits in. Plus they actually make him funny here. And red hulk, is interesting.
Yeah, I'm torn between this and Planet Hulk (especially as retconned by later comics). Probably the main reason why I like Planet Hulk so much is that Hulk gets a happy ending and a more or less normal life (pretending that World War Hulk never happened).
Basically, the Hulk was learning about radiation thanks to Banner.
The fact that the Hulk Vs animated movie, and that Wolverine & the X-Men take place in the emh universe makes this character even better
The big thing I also love about banner is someone I can relate to because of his anger issues.
Banner spends so long trying to deal with the hulk by repressing it, but because of this it flares up it the most difficult of times becoming a monster.
My anger was like that and when I lost control I had hurt people and I felt awful because of it.
I ended up pushing people away and disconnecting with friends because of how scared I was of being that monster.
But I learnt that by accepting that anger by understanding it and where it comes from I was able to move forward to be healthy and to have friends again.
Which is why I hate mcu hulk because it just removes all that and now he's prof hulk and that happened off screen.
Now he's cgi mark ruffalo
I mean, EMH really paid respect to ALL characters adapted, you can hardly find an adaptation that respects all the characters it adapt, sometimes the have to nerf or mischaracterize some characters to tell properly its story, that SUPRISINGLY don't happen in this show, each character(even the smaller roles) gets really well characterized in power & personality
Cartoon Hulk: goes through arc of splitting between Bruce and The Hulk, with Banner agreeing to let the Hulk stay in control so the Hulk can save the world
Live Action Hulk: hulk out *dabs*
Oh come on, he did more than just a dab. That was like 1 freaking moment.
@@dylansharp8471 You're absolutely right, he did a lot more humiliating character moments in his mcu existence. Like acting and whining like an actual child instead of only having the naivety of of one. Be the butt of jokes, and doing nothing useful the entire movie except wrestle Fanrir the giant wolf for 2 minutes and hit Surtur (Also treated as a joke). And all of that is in Ragnarok alone. His treatment in the mcu after the avengers has been nothing but an insult to the character time and time again.
It is nice to see Banner be a character. As often it feels like the character is completely side lined.
The Hulk was my favorite comic book hero when I was a kid, so I was naively excited to see him getting more movies and expanding on a universe with him in it. A decade down the line and he’s slowly become someone else entirely in the MCU. He’s played only for jokes nowadays, and we never really saw that character dynamic between Banner and Hulk truly explored. What really got me fed up was when Thanos kicked his ass in less than a minute and THE FREAKIN HULK got scared and ran away. I don’t have to tell anyone here why that fight should have ended very differently, but not enough people talk about that scene and I’m still mad at it years later lol. Great video! Always happy to see Hulk discussions
"Statisically speaking, there is probably someone watching this with some form of dissociative identity disorder"
Me: Hey that's us!
The problem with the Hulk in the comics was they took his multiple personality disorder too far and gave him too many different identities. While I agree with you that the movies skipped over the Hulk's character development, a huge problem Marvel had was that they could never make a solo Hulk film and there were already too many characters to balance out in the MCU. Also, while EMH is my favorite Hulk, a huge advantage that they had was not only the additional to flesh out the character, but they started from a point that was already pretty health for Banner the first time we meet the Hulk.
Well, bare in mind that The Incredible Hulk is MCU Canon, and at that point Bruce/Hulk were definitely not doing good mentally.
Then in the first Avengers movie you can tell he's on edge, like he's doing okay cuz of his circumstances and surroundings but he's nervous and anxious being there cuz he doesn't want to get triggered.
Then every movie appearance since then he's gotten more comfortable with the team as he's spent more time with them and had opportunities to exercise his skills.
Up until it culminates with Thor:Ragnarok- Infinity War-Endgame, which I'm sure are recent enough to remember.
INCREDIBLE HULK worked pretty well, Henry
@@leonardobraynen1524 I am not saying they can't make a good one. I am say the can't period. The Incredible Hulk's IP is owned by Universal Studios so Marvel can't make another solo Hulk film until they buy the rights back.
@@henrypeters5291 ok. Thanks for explaining the difference.
Makes sense.
@@leonardobraynen1524 No problem.
Don't forget the moment Hulk drew on knowledge from Bruce by recognizing readings of cosmic energy
Great point!
EMH is so underrated. It's amazing. Too bad they rushed Season 2, but damn I miss that show.
I've never been a huge Hulk fan, but I'm in love with this version.
The best MCU hulk was Edward Norton's Hulk. I'm pretty sure MCU hulk would've stayed character driven had they kept him around, or if they had decided not to make hulk so comedic during and after the avengers movie. I wish we could get his comic stories of tragedy in the big screen again.
Well done, in-depth analysis of ol' Jade jaws psyches (Banner/Hulk). Just wanted to throw in my 2 cents and say I'd love to see your thoughts on Hulk's relationships/interactions with his fellow Avengers. I'll always remember a scene from the comic during one of its reboots when the Avengers decided to reunite to save the world from Morgan LeFey; They were all at Avengers Mansion minus the Hulk (who was by this time still highly antisocial, lol, but fairly intelligent). They got a video transmission from him on their computers where he said, scowling, "Yeah, I heard about yer little pajama party. I don't wanna be bothered. Bother me again...and I come bother YOU. Got it?" Click. And Cap just said "Well now." Lol. I loved it, and it pretty much sums it up. Thanks for all your great vids!
Hulk is my all time favourite fictional character that drew me to Superheroes, monsters, horror & the psychological. I've been disappointed with the MCU version over the past few years but looking back at the EMH depection it's certainly the most heathly Banner/Hulk of any adaptation as both have agreed to a arrangement as well as being a heroic force. If EMH ever continues it would be incredible to see how they evolve, the other personalities coming about like Joe Fixit and Devil Hulk, seeing other Hulk characters coming to the fray like Betty Ross/Red Harpy, Rick Jones etc. Pillar of Garbage I'd be happy to see your Hulk & the Avengers relationship video and thank you for this video.
My only problem with EMH Hulk is that there's way too little Banner. Him never being allowed to come out is extremely sad, he doesn't have a life anymore now. I kept expecting Hulk's development of learning to trust others to eventually lead to them having a fairer deal of who gets to be out, but it just never happened.
I know this was posted months ago but I completely agree. While I love the EMH version of Hulk I felt that the Bruce personality got cheated and I wish we got to see more of him. It’s odd that none of the other avengers found it problematic that Hulk was in control 24/7 and never let poor Banner out but one day a month. I love seeing Bruce fully accepting the hulk and willing to give up his time so Hulk can be seen as a hero but the relationship seems one sided as the Hulk is still not very accepting of Banner. It’s great to see Hulk be Hulk in everyday situations but Bruce shouldn’t be completely denied the ability to enjoy his own life either. They both have a right to exist and I see no reason why the deal couldn’t be to just split their time equally between each other so that both of them get to shine.
Personally I would have atleast wanted more internal dialogues between banner and hulk, but I do like the nice little subversion of having the hulk be the dominant personality that takes the focus (most adaptations usually focus on banner and only bring the hulk out during the battles/tension moments so having sorta the opposite was interesting/allowed the hulk to be a character). But yeah if the show had continued I would have loved for banner and hulk to develop a more balanced relationship
The Immortal Hulk series definitely goes through this same exploration of Banner’s DID and starts a similar coexistence between Hulk, Banner, and the Grey Hulk (who is now red)
Never thought much of Hulk until I started watching EMH. He became a favourite by the end for me.
First ruffalo hulk “I put a bullet in my mouth and the other guy spit it out”
Current ruffalo hulk *dabs*
first ruffalo hulk: "That's my secret cap...I'm always angry."
current ruffalo hulk: *gives taco*
The Hulk is usually my favorite Avenger and I like EMH’s portrayal of him and Banner, they have a dark and complex relationship. My biggest complaint about Avengers Assembled is that Hulk is just there for comedic relief and Banner is almost completely nonexistent except for like 1 or 2 episodes.
Glad others feel the same way I do about the MCU Hulk in comparison to EMH. That incarnation of Hulk has always been some sort of golden standard for me when it came to the Hulk-Banner relationship, the fact that the Hulk has gotten such little characterization in the MCU compared to shows like this just baffles me. Hulk being his own personality due to Banner's disorder was always so fascinasting.
...I'll always remember one of my favorite moments of Hulk on-screen, movie or show.
"...You're making it very difficult to not turn into the Hulk, and smash you." - Banner to Hawkeye, in an elevator
This is my favourite depiction because we just get to see more of it. I kinda wish Thor: Ragnarok incorporated the communication between each other while in different forms. But instead of Bruce talking to Hulk, it's Hulk talking to Bruce after he changes back (Bruce would have still been suppressed for 2 years)
Your videos are the reward I get for finishing EMH
here’s that heart back!
@@PillarofGarbage Thanks! I'll proofread better next time!
Banner's fate is kind of tragic in Mightest heroes. Because mostly it is Hulk in there. And he gets only short vacations. Also Hawkeye compares him with his bow, like he doesnt even consider him as part of Avengers
Hey, great stuff you made! Also a really big fan of the Hulk! Everything you said I agreed with other than the Immortal Hulk mention. In that book (specifically the last issue: issue 50), the One Above All tell the Hulk that everyone has a Hulk, just that Banner's manifested due to his childhood and the gamma bomb. With this, the Hulk isn't some otherworldly demon like you claimed, but is exactly what he's always been. I also may have to reread the series and last issue because it HAS been a while since. Keep up the good work!
EMH showed my favorite type of Hulk, the uneasy to cooperative alliance between Hulk and Banner. It also shows that, while anger might make him stronger, the Hulk only can reach the utter peek of his power when he, Banner, and sometimes the other personalities in his head, all agree. That's why his Green Scar form, the one from World War Hulk, was so damned strong and dangerous. They were both equally enraged and wanted revenge, and their cooperation lead to Hulk tapping into his World Breaker power.
Ah one of the greatest shows ever!!!!! I always catch myself coming back every year
I love this, and I wish the movies had done something similar, even just a scene like the one in the diner before getting professor hulk would have been great!
I still love hulk in the comics, who at times is given very similar characterizations, but part of the problems with comics is that everything needs to be reset eventually, so any character progression will always be reset
While Immortal Hulk does have the whole “green door” stuff, Bruce definitely still does have DID in it. It delves pretty deep into the nature of his alters.
You should look at the agents of SMASH it’s in the earths mightiest heros universe if I remember correctly, and there was so much more focus on hulk as a person, banner is on the backseat but isn’t necessarily trying to get out of it.
Hi! were part of that .001-1% of people with this disorder who found this video!! We’re happy to see people all around the world start talking more about Dissociative Identity disorder, it’s helped people like us come a long way. It genuinely touches our heart to know that people are starting to understand that alters aren’t something that can just be removed. If anything most systems that come to an understanding Acknowledge their existence as true as their own. We are just consciousness inhabiting the same vessel ^^
I really appreciate how much you dive into the Marvel Animation stuff that's worth looking at
The idee fore hulk´s relation with the team is very good + i still now that the hope of the show´s revive is here it gunne be next year i bet 100% i feel it nice vidoe my man
Oh god, I nearly forgot about this show! I remember watching it with my dad when I was young! Truly some of the best moments of my childhood!
I found your channel two days ago. By now I have watched all of your EMH videos, and it’s a shame you only have 10k subs
Hulk is my favorite character ever in fiction. EMH absolutely nailed the hulk and banner dynamic. Great video.
I wonder if we'll get something close to this relationship in the MCU with what we've seen in She-Hulk/The Shang Chi credit scene. Now that Banner is normal, will we see the Hulk revert more to how he used to be?
Anything’s possible!
Historically in the comics Professor Hulk kind of was just a temporary thing that eventually broke up into his base personalities. Basically it was not a cured form but more like a fragile truce between his personalities.
@@kennethsatria6607 I mean that makes sense for the comics. They always undo changes that are permanent. Like in a comic book, no character ever stays dead or has a permanent change. Like Peter in the Civil War comics. He reveals his identity but later sells his soul so everyone forgets, which is something I hope doesn't happen in NWH. I know he'll try to have everyone forget, but it feels cheap.
@@Rebelrose
"which is something I hope doesn't happen in NWH"
Well it didn't entirely.
@@dylansharp8471 To be fair, The way I thought they would just have it where the spell is just complete with MJ, Ned, Happy, and anyone who is close to Peter still knowing while everyone is else forgot. With how they actually did it in NWH is perfect
I like how the hulk and banner no longer fighting each other
Hulk was always my favourite Marvel Character and I find the EMH version more intimidating than the MCU version
I noticed you played a 70s show clip
Believe it or not but that banner also begins to realize how useful hulk can be
One of the best ones was banner gets hit by a car and losses the ability to walk but after having a hulk out he learns that hulk can heal it, of course now he must decide risking the city's safety or be should he be selfish
It's actually a great series if you find the right episodes, great vid man
In my marvel universe series when we first see hulk he’s pretty much the angry green rage monster we come to love. But really even in the start we see that it’s something wrong with him. We later find out that during Hulk and Banner’s many mental battles Hulk accidentally peaked just a bit into Bruce’s mind where Hulk would get the complexity of humanity loaded into his brain. While it made him angry the only thing he really cared to think about was realizing the peoples perspective. Realizing how many people probably lost their homes or lives just because of him and how the times he beat up those who where probably the only ones that wanted to be with him. While the hulk is the “regular” hulk (he would take from emh hulk) he doesn’t shout that he’s the strongest there is or insult those who is fighting because he gained that Banner always had…. Perspective. Like imagine him looking into his own fists and imagining how many people lost their homes. It’s thanks to that perspective that kind of pushes him into defeating Thanos during the “Infinity Gauntlet: second snap” arc (pls give it a better name) since he knows how many has suffered thanks to Thanos. By the end of the series Hulk and Bruce’s mind merge into one. This version of hulk is like if you combined Professor Hulk, EMH Hulk, Doc Green and Bruce Banner. But that wouldn’t mean that the hulk is still the hulk that leaves to smash bad guys and gets stronger the angrier he becomes.
HULK SMASH!
Best presentation of The Hulk I've seen since the 90's cartoon.
How the characters are written in the show is part of why this series is so huge among the marvel community, or at least that’s the way it is for me, it’s definitely my most favorite versions of the avengers, I love the MCU and all but I love this series
Geez I remember borrowing various disks of this show from my local dvd store, they were all out of order and I don’t think I’ve seen past season one but I remember really enjoying what I watched, I never seem to hear anyone talk about it so it’s cool to see it here. Also the gamma radiation transformations of the rest of the avengers squad still haunt my dreams.
I’d like to see a fight where Banner and Hulk are so synchronized in their actions that their body constantly changes. Like Banner is allowed to stay active to learn a martial art and there’s a fight where the duo are dealing with a swarm of bad guys, switching between smashing and deflecting.
Maybe Banner turns a little green with Hulk influence helping their attacks or Hulk’s hair changes color with Banner influence. Similar to Venom.
That sounds like a really cool idea!
Yes I would like to see a video going over The Incredible Hulk's relationship with the other Avengers from Earth's Mightiest Heroes. It's been so long since I've seen that series but I don't remember most of it
Wait, for real? "Hulk vs." is in the EMH continuity? I mean, I had that fun headcanon but I didn't actually think it was real.
In any case, EMH definitely has what I think is the best version of the Hulk. All of your points were 100% correct. He's not the dumb "Hulk smash puny human" version people like to joke about in media. And they treated him with a seriousness and dignity that the MCU didn't even try to handle. And that stinks, because EMH shows the potential for the dynamic between Banner and Hulk and it would've been great to see that fully realized. This is actually the first video from you that I saw and a great start all around. I'd love to see you analyze the relationship between Hulk and the rest of the Avengers.
"that the MCU didn't even try to handle"
Bruh.
@@dylansharp8471 Aside from the first avengers, it really didn’t.
I would like a version of Bruce/Hulk where Hulk isn’t a split personality, but simply is an infinite rage the Bruce has to manage with.
I like the hulk being a split personality but that embodies his rage.
The best versions of the Hulk have humanity. All human flaws. Dr. Banner has cured himself countless times in the comic‘s from his green version, only to crawl back, when trouble is coming. You can not get rid of the Hulk.
Fantastic video your only getting better and better with each video man
100% agree as hulk is my favourite marvel character across the board (MCU needs work) this depiction of him as always been my favourite and warms my heart knowing they can get along
Awesome video. You showed a really interesting part of heroism of this character I was not aware of.
You glossed over SOOOO much of Immortal hulk if 'from another dimension' is what you got out of it.
Hulk, as well as every gamma irradiated beings are connected through the one below all. It's really cool and dives into the multiple personalities that reside in the current mind of whoever is 'Hulk' at the given moment.
Disney She Hulk to Bruce: "I have it so much harder cuz patriarchy"
It was so heartbreaking in the episode where Hulk officially calls himself an Avenger and calls on the team to face Red Hulk, because right after that, Skrull/Captain America talks him down into handling things way differently than how he usually would, only to just completely leave him out to dry
This man, who fought beside Hulk, who called him a hero, who trusted him and earned that trust back, utterly betrayed him from his point of view
Leaves me with a bad feeling everytime I watch it
And then the Avengers leave him there for 10+ episodes… :(
@@PillarofGarbage that's the one thing I wanna curse out the writers for . Hulk is a founding member , and his absence was both stupid and annoying .
Watching your playlist back to back after just finishing the show. Can confirm that Hulk and Banner absolutely remind me of DID as I've experienced it. I also feel like It shows more like that in the MCU following the first couple She-Hulk episodes
I really liked the conversation between Hulk and Captain America in the episode “Hail Hydra”:
“Is that why you teamed up with me? To protect people from the monster?”
“Stow that talk. I want you to protect civilians from Hydra: they’re the monsters here not you. In my day we had a name for someone like you.”
“Yeah? What’s that?”
“Hero. I’ve been watching you Hulk: no matter how scared people are of you, no matter how much you’re hounded, you always do the right thing and that makes you a hero in my book.”
The problem I have with MCU's Professor Hulk is that it felt like Banner did it to himself without The Hulk's consent. That Banner took control of Hulk's body, and Hulk didn't have any say. It really should have been a cooperative effort between the two of them, almost like couple's therapy.
I would like to see a video about the relationship between the Hulk and the rest of the Avengers!
Great job on this one! Keep up the good work 😉!
If i made a Hulk show, the arc for Banner would be kind if like EMH, him reaching a balance with the Hulk, learning to live with him. But also i would potray the Hulk in his childlike self, but not have him appear only in fight scenes and the five-ten minutes after that. He would get full episodes. But without little of Banner. Their screen time woukd also be in balance. Kind off like a 50/50 approximately. And Hulk would get his own character arc inspired by, and i'm not kidding, Stitch from Lilo & Stitch: A destructive beast who realizes he wants to be loved. And an inspiration from Banner's arc would be the curse storyline from The Owl House: Both are about a fugitive with a beast inside them trying to keep it inside as much as possible only to learn to embrace the Beast and see it not as a burden, but as a living creature that is also trapped in their body.
His relationship with the avengers definitely deserves it’s own video
The best animated depiction of the Avengers there has ever been I was really sorry to see it go when it was cancelled
avengers earth's mightiest heroes was the best screen adaptation of the avengers
That's what I love about the Hulk. It's not about a mere monster trying to be a hero but a man having to battle his inner monster always at odds with himself so much so that he doesn't even trust himself
This series was worthy of more than just 2 seasons. Bring it back