When Digital Foundry released their review for PS5 Pro, I have wrote a comment similar to yours. PS5 Pro is nothing else but a PS5 PSSR Edition, meaning it uses similar number of CUs for rendering (only 30% performance uplift), while the rest of CUs (around 20) are used for PSSR
@@Thuner67776 They are you clown learn how AI ml works it will keep getting better as it is used in more games. Also games with issues are because of lazy devs using old sdk.
Can't believe im here this early just wanted to take the chance and say i've been a follower since 7k and your are my fav content creator, no bs just straight up information and a hit of humor time to time love owen thank you for all the education you gave us
"Cause PSSR still new, games need patch from dev, bla bla bla." Then why you buy it now and not wait for PS6 when probably PSSR already better implemented within the game? Sony fanboys really amaze me sometimes with the way their thinking
You're right. It should have looked better on release, but because it's trained on AI, I actually do think it will get better over time. There is no excuse for releasing it in it's current state, tho. Release an unfinished product/tech, and fix it later. It's the way the industry has been for YEARS now
Reminds me of another group that are fans of certain PC hardware. They are always going on about how in the future their features will be as good as the competitors was 2 years ago.
Upscalers should always be optional imho... I don't like the idea that a Playstation enables pssr by default and I have to live with visual artefacts etc.
These consoles seem to be solely based on upscaling. Can they do much more then low 1440p if they don't have any? Would be interesting to see what they are capable of without upscaling. What do they get native 1080p and up
It never was optional with this console generation, almost every game except for low performance impact indies is running either dynamic resolution scaling or FSR both in quality and performance mode. Because that's how this console can get to 4k using a GPU that in the PC space would be considered a solidly 1080p card.
@@stevenbrasier2728they would be overkill for native 1080p. We know basically what hardware goes into a ps5 pro and can figure out equivalent amd or nvidia hardware. The ps5 pro has roughly an Rx 6800 which is comfortably a native 1440p gpu. U clearly don’t know what ur talking about on this topic, just do a little bit of research before commenting
@Will-zi6fn i said it would be interesting to see what they can do without uoscaling. I have a 6700xt system. Some games I can do native most I have to do upcaling for 1440p, I haven't tried at 1080p though. So your comment isn't based off of knowledge but just attack? Sure maybe they would be overkill as you are leading up to believe but we don't automatically know that because of what they would be based on
Im quite excited for Sony to enter the upscaling world for games. They make Sony TVs that already have frame generation, upscaling and black frame insertion on their mid/high tier TVs. I hope they will lend that technology to playstation going forward
TBF, Sony has the best upscaling on TV, so people expected good thing from them, turns out TV upscaling experience doesn't translate to realtime upscaling.
It’s the 3rd party devs they haven’t got a clue how to implement it properly. Which is understandable as its brand new sony needs to send engineers to help these devs out because it’s not a good look. Obviously it’s not the PSSR has all Sony first party games it looks fantastic not that far behind DLSS
Man, we have a PiS party in Poland and they are all good with it because their voting groups have no idea as they don't learn any foreign languages. It's a populist party that calls itself "right-wing", but they have nationalists, socialists and all losers, zero-charisma folks and Moscow spies to top of it all. In reality, they are authoritarian socialists with poor economic and development understanding and a traitor's hideout.
Koralsky seems to be saying quite a lot for being under NDA. For example they said they can't talk about "how many iterations are available" but have themselves at least counted 3 versions for us. They also ended up mentioning "improvements" by saying the newer versions give better results compared to TSR and FSR. They are also talking about UE 5.5, which literally got released just now, and we are years away from seeing games made using 5.5 feature set. We also see that FF7R, Star Wars Jedi Survivor, Hogwarts Legacy are UE4 titles while Silent Hill 2 is a UE5 title, but FF7R looks pretty good and SH2 doesn't. Hogwarts Legacy also looks fine. This too doesn't add up.
UE4 was semi- idiot proof. UE5 takes the training wheels off and requires devs to actually know more and put more effort into optimization. This is why SH2 looks like ass. It also means that Jedi and Hogwarts don't really look any better than something like Outer Worlds. I.e. looking last gen.
@@Lurch-Bot I would say SH2 and Jedi Survivor and even Alan Wake 2 suffer from the same shimmering, which would be a PSSR specific thing. The three games mentioned above use UE5, UE4 and Custom Northlight engine. You might be right about UE4 vs UE5 ease of use, but what we are seeing here is probably a PSSR weakness with some content, an older model of it, or some misconfiguration by three independent developers. The leaker suggests it's tied to UE version, which seems suspicious as SH2 is a UE5 game.
The biggest issue with pssr in my opinion is it's frame time cost. Digital Foundrys testing found that its 30-40 percent more demanding that fsr or taau from the same base resolution. The pro being 40 percent faster than the base lets it use pssr for better image quality in some games while keeping the same frame rate. DLAA is typically 5 percent slower or faster than TAA with the same base resolution. Sometimes it's more demanding, sometimes less demanding. So PSSR has less of q performance increase than XeSS on a non Intel card. I'm glad Sony put time and money into moving this direction as TAA just cant hold up in modern games. Filter based temporal image reconstruction doesnt work with modern detail and poly counts. And an AI solution is much better than sticking with the dates folter based system.
@@DragonOfTheMortalKombat it's hit and miss. Nothing to be excited about now. Def not a reason to buy the Pro. But it shows and effort and continued support of moving away from temporal image reconstruction and towards AI Super Sampling. I can get behind that. TAA can't cut it with modern poly counts and detail level.
imagine buying a "premium" console and play at native 600p and 800p with lower ray tracing quality than low settings on PC, and also the "magical" upscaler is broken, (reminds me of the PS5's SSD, same bs marketing) But playstation fanboys will defend this
Who said that? All I've seen so far is PC gamers flooded to these PS5 Pro videos making claims. PC gamers familiar with PC hardware. When I was on PS4/PS4 Pro/PS5, I had no idea what a 3090 or a Ti or a souper, or a XT or XTX... or any of that. Now that I'm a PC gamer, I got to say, most people on PS5 Pro media seem to be PC Gamers. Why are they so angry at a console refresh is what I'm wondering.
@@Mcnooblet Don't know what you read, but none of the PC gamer comments I've seen sounded like they are angry at anything. I think people are just memeing on the fact that many console players are clueless and believe their system is superior to a PC in performance/visuals, which it is not.
@@Boss_Fight_Index_muki no lmao, quality mode doesn't look the same and in some games runs a lot worse than 60FPS. What are you ? Sony marketing bot lol
@@DragonOfTheMortalKombat why does stating something in reality make someone biased? iirc, both original modes are selectable right there in options. and where did i say 60 fps in all games?
Crazy, I was told by a “reliable” pc leaker that this was similar to a 4070 and had the best performance for its price. Man that was an incredibly stupid statement.
@ Even when years ago it was basically confirmed to be 10-15% because realistically that’s the capability with the lagging evolution of AMD hardware that wasn’t on the CPU side.
@@Rachit0904 Yeah in there but putting that on a R5 3600 power level that’s then underclock is asking for a shitshow, on top of that making developers used a inferior upscaling system for what will end up being a 5-8% percent of the entire system population. It’s insane
lets talk about the fact that DigitalFoundry spotted Jedi Survivor scaling even from below 720p! and they are saying that the pro is like a rx 6800... hilarious! 🤣
The GPU in the Pro is pretty much identical to the RX 6800. Not sure why it's necessary to act so arrogant over a console you probably think is beneath you. Jedi Survivor is just horribly optimized and it's performance has been covered on this channel before.
@@Jack-pc9sp It's not at all identical to an RX 6800, in Elden Ring testing (which is a really good testbed because it runs like shit on console and PC alike) with graphics settings matched it's 15-20% weaker, aka. an RX 6800 equipped but otherwise hardware matched PC can almost run stable 60 fps, while the PS5 Pro still struggles to keep that but at least it now can stay within VRR range. And sure that's one game but we're only seeing a rough 20-30% uplift in most games that were GPU limited on the PS5. Which means that it's roughly equal to a 6750 XT, the 6800 would be another similar jump from there when looking at practical performance.
@@syncmonismIt doesnt matter that they are using earlier versions of pssr. The fact is that ps5 pro owners have to WAIT for what they were promised, even after buying the console. If they have to wait for the features, then what is the point of buying a ps5 pro when the ps6 is already getting close?
PSSR might get better but who the f thought it would be good to release such patches to consumers? They thought that people would not notice the shimmer fest?
No one has came right out the gates with a great upscaler. It is a new upscaler. It is going to take time, especially in combination with RT and noise. So far PSSR has looked pretty good in non RT games vs FSR.
Yeah FSR 4 is separate from PSSR. That is why Sony said they went their own way for upscaling from AMD. Also shows how AI upscaling is pointless. FSR Algorithm is better than AI clearly from the video's shown. PSSR barely beats FSR 1 lmao.
they could be related since Sony are using AMD hardware but you'd expect AMD's implementation to be better since they have way more experience with this
All new games are beta copies. In the 90s beta games were free. Now you pay for a broken beta game, and wait 4 years for them to finish polishing the game. When they finally finish patching the game no one cares. Tekken 7!
You can recommend whatever up scaler you want. I got a 12gb card and I still have to turn off every alphabet soup mode before my games feel right. I'll be buying my next card on real fpd (frames per dollar) and nothing else.
You obviously do not have dlss and are not informed in its quality. FSR looks mildly better than just dropping resolution. Dlss looks better than native a lot of the time and even performance upscaling and barely noticeable. Literally guarantee in a blind test with people that aren't enthusiast gamers.. most would not notice the difference in native and performance dlss. But fsr is stupid obvious.
@@christophermullins7163 Internet experts. Most their tech xp comes from a compressed YT streamed video. Unfortunately those are often the ones who think they know it all, while having 0 xp themselves to experience, and know for sure. It's pretty normal at this point, and the reason no one takes social media comments seriously.
@@christophermullins7163 DLSS never looks better than native, but it is far better than fsr. DLAA looks better than native, but dlss has artifacts that are not present in native.
Sony did their faithful customers wrong by overpricing and selling them the idea of prestige. And, their customers drank the coolaid because they simply didnt know any better. It's like I'm watching PC gamers' nightmare all over again with Sony and its customers. As a PC owner myself, I have to be honest and simply say that Nvidia's and AMD's GPU's are crap today because the focus is no longer on the engine but making sure the twin turbos do all the work but still charge as if it is a collector's item V12 car. PC gamers allowed that to happen and now we are all stuck in this overpriced nightmare for crappy products that just sell the idea of grandeur. I mean the 4090 can barely do 60 fps 4K on high demanding titles at native resolution. So, without its twin turbos (DLSS & FG), it fails. And now, we are seeing this all over again with Sony and the PS5 Pro and its loyal die hard customers. Is the PS5 Pro great feat in console technology? Yes as no one denies that at all but is it worth $699 base? Nope and let alone $900. But, no matter what, it is still selling and Sony will hit its end of year sales goals and hopefully make a dent in its half a billion loss disaster by investing in the wrong gaming companies. I'll wait till next year then the PS5 Pro will be cheaper and all updated even with all the PSSR updates to make the PS5 Pro then worth buying assuming the price is fair. I never buy today's tech because it's never worth it. I always buy a year or two later and one generation behind when the tech is all updated to work properly and priced properly. Unless your tech pays the bills, no need to get on the band wagon of false grandeur by always getting the latest tech. And, never be a fan of any companies, always be ready to constructively criticize them to always get the best products, and remind them without customers they do not exist. PC gamers learned a valuable lesson in the PC world and Sony loyal customers are about to as well. We all got played people. Best be smarter in 2025.
Then how would you market the PS5 Pro then? They're obviously not going to market all the flaws in the system just like Intel AMD and Nvidia sugarcoating all their new CPU/GPU products presentations every year. I didn't get a Pro because I already have a PS5 and there's nothing wrong with it and I currently don't want "More" out of the PS5 experience. As for Pro it's just as advertised, and it has flaws and certainly not targeting people like me, so I'd just move on.
@barebarekun161 Your question is easy to answer as Sony for many years already had the proper marketing strategy: "Innovative and affordable". They lost that and because of that, their loyal customers are getting played. It's happened in the PC world and I never thought I'd see it ever in the console world, but, it has happened. The last console I own is the PS2 as the most innovative of them all in my thoughts.
4090 is years old, software doesn't slow down for hardware. Hardware catches up. Too many think software should stay at a stand still until they personally decide to upgrade their hardware. It isn't even realistic. I own a 4090 and the problem with "4k" is you are talking about native 4k, when often times the majority doesn't even refer to 4k as native 4k, but upscaled 4k. 4k native max settings with RT is what you are talking about, and 60fps for that is actually an impressive feat, especially for hardware years old now for the latest titles.
@@barebarekun161 It sure gets a lot of attention from people not even interested in it though, that part is weird. I think most just need hardware powerful enough to load up their social media so they can complain about things they weren't even interested in, or were going to buy themselves. It's part of this sheep like culture of trying to dictate what everyone elses actions are, based on something they don't personally like.
@@Mcnooblet Great points you bring in and I hear what you say. I always bring the point of how the 1080 Ti was built compared to today's GPU cards. Whether Nvidia made a mistake or built the GOAT, we will never know. I still own the 1080 Ti and use it daily along with my other high desktop/midtier laptop. To me, the 1080 Ti was all horsepower which today still is a beloved card that can still keep up especially after Nvidia's upscaling updates. But of course with time, all tech fall behind. After that, I believe all other GPUs from Nvidia no longer were well built. I truly believe if the PC community simply said these cards suck and we're not buying any, we would either have better GPUs that would have taken longer to make which is fine or simply better pricings for new techs every year it seems now. We all got played in the PC world but everyone is entitled to do whatever they want with their money. I always wait and then acquire what I want at 30% to 50% off brand new at the proper time and to me personally, I feel better with my investment then because I always want the best bang for the buck.
Even if PSSR is fixed the performance gain it's disappointing, just by looking at games like Blackmyth or Silent Hill 2, a few frames for nothing. Plus, if the SDK thing is completely true I think a lot of people will be disappointed because I've seen a lot of comment here on UA-cam, X and many other websites that PSSR can be updated on console level affecting all games that uses PSSR
Unreal Engine 5 has been a bane to all gaming. Unless you have massive overhead to mitigate problems, like the 4080 or 4090, you are going to eat shit in any UE5 title
Kind reminds me of how Cyberpunk 2077's FIRST Path tracing looked when added into the game, before they fixed it and added ray reconstruction! (Not that ps5 pro is using path tracing in games) just reminds me how it looked, it too had that weird noisy sizzling look for some reason.
These days Quality Control no longer exists. Everything new has issues. And clearly 9-12 months is like early development, and to save time, let’s people spent over £700 to test our beta product. Or I woo say even alpha at this point. So they are promised Great Visuals, but they meant after few years beginning from 7th of November. Welcome in the group beta testers. Lest test it together! Nevertheless, “I believe UE5 games will look better”… thankfully Alan Wake 2 isn’t a UE5.. wait the second 🙈
I fear AMD will have to put out a early/bad version of FSR4. They can't make the same mistake like with FSR 3 where they announce it and then say nothing for like a year again. Putting FSR out early will def result in bad press but the data from all the ppl trying it out any prolly using it could give the needed help to make FSR4 better. If AMD can't pull out some magic out of thier hat, they will most likel, have a even harder time until they hopefully can catch up a bit again to Nvidia.
I have one and it’s been a game changer for so many of my games ..I’m running it on a Sony Bravia tv with VRR with hdmi 3.1 at 120hz.. I havee red no issues like you are showing … you said you don’t have a ps5 pro once you begin the video … it’s NOT apparent on my set up … so maybe a Sony tv with a pro produces perfection. go buy one and find out instead of making a video of a product you don’t even know personally.
As a 4090 owner and a Sony game lover I think I’ll just stick with the regular ps5 at this point and wait for Sony games to come to pc. Luckily us pc owners are getting more and more Sony content now. I do hope this tech gets better for console users.
its the denoisers from the RTX ambient occlasions you can turn them off on pc, they need to update it to take it off for the pssr. simple update should fix it, but probably is there for stability. this is why ray recontruction became important unfortunately everyone is kind of behind nvidia. tbh they should just stick to traditional FSR
Probably not the denoisers, they have probably screwed up the implementation by having it render at something like half rez but haven't told the game if rendering at 50% don't half the rez of the GI. This used to happen alot when dlss and fsr first existed it ended up making reflections render at 1/4 Res instead of half.
PSSR still very new, my bet is AI most likely is learning and we seen this before so games are going to need to be patched by dev, but once more for me this proves native visuals are better and given cost of PS5 PRO for extra cost you should not need to upscale to get good visual and 60fps
And here's the kicker for those who own a Pro they have been complaining about Sony and Game Devs not given the option to use the standard PS5 version after patches or something. If that's the case and I had a Pro I would be sending it back for a full refund, because why spend £700 on a console if I'm having to wish I could play the standard version of games like a PS5 Base does What Sony have done is release PSSR beta and the testers just paid £700 to enter the test
Well they hardly consumer friendly at moment the uk 🇬🇧 suing them for scalping prices on customers and taking away movies and shows and even games and not get me started on Xbox with their constant crashes and bad launches and lots issues with saving a game you think in 2024 they would have game saves sorted etc I’m switching to pc fed up with the consoles and paying subscription etc for online
Did we even need a PS5 Pro with barely better performance? Sony gives gamers a product most don't want, at a price they don't want, and it's worse than the regular version. *slow clap*
Considering the way they marketed the Pro, I'd say no but hey let's just assume the second that PS5 Pro came out they suddenly stopped selling regular PS5, that's like their console for most audiences lol. Those "We" would better be of sticking to their so called "far superior" PC and living shouting their superiority complex every time they opened their wallet for GPU upgrade each year.
@@barebarekun161 It doesn't even have to be one or the other. I have a 4090 PC. I upgraded from a PS5 because the 60fps modes looked terrible. I absolutely am going to buy a PS5 Pro when I get on the road soon. My PC is great for unemployment, but I'm not lugging it around as it is heavy as heck. I think too many are focused on these couple RT games, where the hardware still isn't good for RT. 36 CUs to 60 CUs isn't "barely better performance" for raster, but it also depends on how that extra compute is being utilized. I wouldn't utilize it for RT, but some developers are choosing to, and that's what linear minds are focusing on. 2-3x better RT performance on PS5 Pro sounds good in marketing until you realize the PS5 was so awful at RT, that it needs much much more than 2-3x to broadly implement.
I watched it on my 4K monitor and the difference is still relatively minor. Go watch the original videos! The difference is pretty huge, actually. UA-cam compression filters out all the artifacts and even the flickering here, it's crazy.
Very interesting. I guess game studios use it despite the image degradation in order to take advantage of the AI capabilities for better framerates. I applaud the decision if so. The console audience for single player games is trending older, and therefore is more aware of what makes a game feel fluid and snappy.
I am looking forward to seeing how it improves, Digital Foundry and some other dudes on YT also commented on this. PSSR is in stage one (PSSR 1.0) it will improve question is how much…
I think this is simply games not build with it in mind. Or so I hope. Hopefully games build from the ground up to keep PSSR in mind can do better. This just seems tacked on.
Id bet this is why some of the sony games dont use pssr. Also thats really bad if pssr cant be updated, if the game sdk version isnt up to date, thats a huge setback.
Silent Hill hasn't received a pro patch. It's still on patch 1.05, and Star Wars has had issues since its debut. Dragon Age: Veilguard, God of War, and a few others are great examples of PSSR. People need to go back and look at DLSS on Metro Exodus when it first released... the same with BFV. DLSS was bad, but now it's amazing.
DLSS1 was a completely different technology that didn't work out. DLSS2 launched in March 2020 and has been pretty good since then. For me 2.5.1 was a huge milestone since they finally removed the awful sharpening filter that caused artifacts.
@remowind1578 look up to? This isn't a kid looking up to their father. These are two different technologies. It hasn't even been a month. And just because some devs suck at implementing it doesn't mean it's bad. Also, there are recent games that came out where DLSS still had issues due to poor developer implementation.
Not a single car was good on launch either. Doesn't mean if you buy a car now that can't go above 10 mph and breaks down after 50 milles. you can just be like oh well.
I mean it can be turned off and ran like a normal ps5 right?? Surely Sony wouldn't have forced everyone to only new stuff without an option to turn things off right?? A 700 plus dollar console should have all these options so I'm more than sure the options are there.
@DragonOfTheMortalKombat man. W such an expensive console, I was hoping for options. Oh well. I cant say my phat ps5 has really let me down yet so I'll keep on truckin.
One thing I want to know about is why does PSSR have input labels that only XeSS uses? That would almost imply that it was based on XeSS in some way. That would also explain why it's better than FSR when implemented correctly.
Speculating about potential SDK kits, patches from the developer, or what the PSSR version is, and the developer may be using misses the forest for the trees. The story should be about Sony releasing an unfinished product whose chief selling point is broken. I've yet to see a single person hold Sony to task, or rest this buck at Sony's feet. It's Remedy's fault, it's EA's fault, it's Silent Hill's fault, its the PSSR version, it's AMD'S fault, it's everything and everyone but Sony who is at fault, but when you boot up your PS5, it's Sony's logo you see. Do you think if Nvidia botched the 50 series launch, we'd be blaming game developers?
NOOOOOOOO How im going to play my exclusive ™️ Lego Horizon ™️ (also available for Nintendo switch) on my 700$ console (stand sold separately) NOW??!!??
Im happy with pretty much any upscaling because I'm so blind to details that it took me about a minute and a half of staring at the comparison still DLSS avd native images of the car in front of the wall to notice the difference in how the lines on the wall appear and then about another 30s to notice the difference in the colour and pattern in the gold area running across the top of the wall. These technologies are designed for the visually unobservant like me I guess. Im happy with more frames and a blind to subtle (and not so subtle, apparently) graphical artifacts.... 😅
@kenshinhimura6280 blind to detail my friend, but smooth motion is another story... at least up to a point. I'm also old and have bad gamer reflexes. So, basically, I'm happy with anything over about 50 fps because I ain't playing competitive FPS games anyway. I'm more of the DIablo, Skyrim, Witcher, Civilization kind of player, with some Horizon, and other similar games that are forgiving of my old man (51) reflexes... I'm easy to keep happy, I just finally upgraded from a 5700xt that I've had since 2019 to a 7900GRE, and that was mostly for the benefit of my teenager who plays way more on the computer than me (and to finally match up better to the 5800x3d that I bought about a year ago because I thought my 3600X was failing).
A developer came out and said PSSR works much better in more recent versions and these patches are using the initial PSSR tech. Supposedly the newer version produces much higher image quality. I’m not concerned long term. Tons of beautiful games on the Pro currently.
Frame interpolation is a strange beast. I can't get my head around the fact that Samsung TV's from 2005/2006 achieved it to near perfection but in 2024 both Nvidia and AMD can't fix the screen artifacts. I had an old Samsung plasma that cost me £600 in 2014 that had frame interpolation/smooth motion. Fantastic for films but hit and miss with gaming. On occasion a game would work perfectly, feel like 60fps with minimal artifacting and this was handled by the cheap TV and not a ridiculously over priced GPU or console. Just a thought.
Yes the games that have this issue with PSSR also has it in the base console too but not to such an extreme. It seem PSSR is not resolving the issue. Zoom in on the base PS5 version in high resolution and you can see the shimmering too. Not all games are doing this and PSSR makes a lot of games look better but unstable images can still look bad with PSSR. I've seen DLSS do the same things on some games with unstable images. One game I noticed in particular on PC is Robocop. The RT is very unstable in that game and shimmers on the road when walking in the city and DLSS still looks bad. TSR however seems to somewhat make it look more stable. Of course though, DLSS right now is better than PSSR but it still has it's issues with some games.
A lot of people forgot that the first version of Nvidia DLSS was really bad. I remember a comparison test with DLSS 1.0 where they were comparing a native 1440p image upscaled to 4K with DLSS and a native 1440p image just displayed normally on a 4K screen scaled up by the display. The DLSS image was quite blurry and looked a lot worse than the image without DLSS. Ai upscalers need a lot of data and training to improve and the reason DLSS is so good now is that Nvidia put so much time into it. Its not easy to compete with DLSS because it has many years headstart in training its AI model and improving it. PSSR will improve over time as well and we hope that Sony has some kind of collaboration with AMD, otherwise its really likely that FSR 4 will start off weak as well.
Just my honest opinion, but I feel people put way too much weight behind upscaling when making their buying decision. Personally, I switched from Nvidia to a 7800xt for £480, very good price/performance with 16GB VRAM, I have never had to use upscaling at 1440p high settings. My top priorities are buying in the correct performance class and VRAM. There's an argument if you game at higher resolutions, or care about ray tracing, but lets face it, higher resolutions and ray tracing are irrelevant if you run out of VRAM or you have concerns this will be an issue further down the line. Apart from that, I view upscaling as a handy tool that may be helpful in a few years as the card ages to squeeze extra performance out of it, by which point I couldn't really care less if there's slight differences in quality because I'll most likely be upgrading in the not so distant future. It is a great feature, but it wouldn't sway my decision to buy one GPU over another for a feature I'm likely not going to use for a few years, especially if the other card has more VRAM.
Jedi Survivors fault looks more related to ray tracing / denoising issues rather than the upscaling itself, it is visible in the pc footage as well (to a lesser degree probably due to higher ray counts)
tbf, it's a "nature of the beast" issue with any Ai upscalers. All upscalers must goes thru years of post-data refinement. The implementation has to start at sometime.
@@Boss_Fight_Index_muki People are dumb. I think that's all this shows on the numerous posts of comparing a new upscaler with a years optimized upscaler. Their linear minds can't think beyond a simple binary 1= good, 0= not good. It's either a 1 or 0, no other variables will enter their minds.
I feel like ray tracing was either an inside job to force better hardware to be sold as graphics start to plateau, OR just an overly ambitious mistake that was implemented way before it was ready. Either way, it's a disaster for the console market.
It was Implemented 1st by Nvidia on 20 series cards for PC i do not think it was ever intended for consoles AMD basically slapped it in there just to say here you go it has "ray Tracing" even tough the hardware cannot handle it and those resources are better used for other things. Ray tracing is the future but it will be quite a few more years before it can replace standard techniques... think its main advantage is actually for developers to not have to bake lights etc not just consumers looking at pretty lights/reflections/shadows.
Let’s all just hope it’s Sony’s fault and not AMD’s. Gosh, I wish Intel hadn’t failed this bad and had their GPU game running, they made top notch upscalers (close to DLSS) pretty good hardware and their drivers are fixed.
Even as an early adopter of the ps5 pro.. I’m not sure why pssr is a thing versus utilizing AMD FSR 3.0. Just another thing for devs to sort out in a never ending list of things they already struggle with.
Somehow almost everyone forgets that it took several years for DLSS to get as good as it is. As an ex-owner of 2080ti I remember how much of a joke it was in the beginning, not worth using at all.
Another thing all those games have in common is that, unlike Sony first party games, they are all upscaling from resolutions lower than 1080p. PSSR issued might still be present in other games, but somewhat masked by the higher internal resolution.
My question would be, if you want to play with a console, shouldn't you be running games with a large TV, are these image quality things an issue with a large TV too, or just if you are pixel peeping with some small monitor?
It needs more work and better integration. With any new device especially consoles, early adopters are like beta testers. Personally I haven’t noticed any shimmering or issues with any game especially Alan wake 2. I haven’t tried silent hill 2 or Jedi survivor so I’ve had a great experience in the games that I have played.
I'm not surprised. This is PSSR 1.0 there is no way they would come out and be killing it just like that. It needs time and that's why I always wait when a new product comes out and see the results.
so after watching whole video, what I get is this: The Silent Hill devs are using some old SDK (which is strange as thats not old game...) and used old version of PSSR - than saw the disgusting results and were like - "OK, good to go"
My experience of the PS5 Pro is mixed. The dynamic res and performance boost in lesser optimised PS5 games is nice to have and makes them more enjoyable to play. However, the actual PS5 Pro enhanced patches have been hugely variable with the first-party games faring better than the third-party games. Sony obviously want their own games to look good on the Pro but it seems that the third-party developers are less bothered. Star Wars Jedi: Survivor and Silent Hill 2 look awful, despite being great games, so very disappointed with those. I find it a bit ironic though that the best looking games on the Pro are Horizon Zero Dawn and Horizon Forbidden West but neither of those games use PSSR... make of that what you will...
You need dev / editor will and pass the long console patch process to get an update not a version "swapper" app like on pc. That’s why multiple update for pssr new version will be the exception more than the rule for most games
"PS5 Pro using AI upscaling instead of real power is such a letdown. Backgrounds look worse than the regular PS5 in some games. Feels like they’re cutting corners and relying on marketing buzz. Just give us actual hardware upgrades, not tricks!"
I love how Sony Ponies where hyping up the PS5 Pro like it was even better than an RTX 4090 but in reality it's even worse than a base PS5 in a lot of cases lmao😂
When will they make hardware that's good enough for native resolution and one that actually looks crystal clear like old games did with native higher res+ msaa/ ssaa?
In the age of AI based hardware for games, AI denoisers should become a standard. Ray Reconstruction proves that it increases the quality of the picture and even runs faster than standard denoisers.
Sounds like bullshit cope. Why would an upscaler released in 2024 have any different implementation on an older version of UE? XeSS, DLSS, and FSR don't have this property, and they actually were developed alongside the transition from UE4 to UE5. Doesn't make any sense. Alan Wake 2 had similar issues, and that isn't UE at all. It's likely just bad developer decisions with respect to specific aspects of implementation like AO, RTGI, reflections etc. But this convenient excuse makes no sense.
Have you seen the sh*tty implementation of FSR3 on CP2077 vs other FSR3 implementation? It dev that needed to make sure the upscaler works properly. sure you can drop in new version but you need dev to do QC or it will be shit. most of the game that have shitty PSSR are Nvidia sponsored "surprised"?
There is potential but without proper implementation it will fall flat as FG did at first. Even Intel has offered better upscaling solutions in a fraction of the time.
They need that ray reconstruction tech to reduce the ray tracing shimmer. I don't know if I buy the UE4 PSSR SDK9 theory. According to that logic, Final Fantasy 7 Rebirth is a UE4 game and therefore should have had the bad/early PSSR implementation. But in reality FF7R is perhaps the game with the most uplift from it's PSSR implementation.
f_ck i had so much high hope for the PSSR :( ya i know its first try but its first after DLSS paved the way, its not like they need to invent it or the next step, they only need to match and its way way easier. at that point i think NV R&D is just from another planet, same with RT... sony claimed X4 RT over RDNA2 yet with the same settings 4070 just killed the PS5 PRO, and the RT on alan wake was cut back quite a bit, and if u compare what DLSS + RR looks like vs the PS5 pro its mind boggling and sad.
This is the fault of certain developers who release terrible patches for PS5 Pro, it is not the fault of the console or PSSR, although the developers are not obliged to do so either, if the game has already gone on sale and they are not paid extra for the patches to PS5 Pro, Sony's own developers are obliged to release good patches.
I thought UE5 is crap, but after playing Metro Awakening, which is optimized to the point of hurting the game, its clear to me that the developers just dont care about optimization.
Im almost certain this is why the Callisto Protocols pro patch is delayed. It's unreal 4 and has heavy use of reytracing. I suspect they aren't happy with how the image is resolving. Hmm
On Silent Hill 2 I played it on my PS5 Slim. And James kind of jiggled right at the beginning of the game. And occasionally off and on for the rest of the game.
30% increased horsepower is not doing anything to a lowres Image. You can stabilize your current framerate with that additionl GPU-performance. PS4 PRO got +125% and still some people complained, they could not spot a difference (which about i disagreed). That is the huge problem of the PRO5-Series. No good PSSR-Implentation in a title means game over. Still funny they sell this +30% horsepower for a 67% higher price tag in germany. From 550€ up to 920€ (discversion)
PSSR and to some extent XESS don't play well with the RT denoising pass. The "boiling" visual artefact can be lessen by upping the quality of upsampling or by upping the quality of RT (more samples per pixel) to reduce noice.
One could say PSSR is going through what DLSS 1.0 and FSR 1.0 went through. They were massive trash heaps at first as well. Then one could ask themselves, why didn't they take everyones first attempts to heart and make their first impression at least somewhat decent. Yucky
So basically people are paying $700 to train PSSR so it eventually works correctly on the PS6
No they aren’t training the model at all. Smh. You are just running the pretrained model on your ps5 pro.
When Digital Foundry released their review for PS5 Pro, I have wrote a comment similar to yours.
PS5 Pro is nothing else but a PS5 PSSR Edition, meaning it uses similar number of CUs for rendering (only 30% performance uplift), while the rest of CUs (around 20) are used for PSSR
@@bogdanursache501 Yeah lmao, Sony loves half assed remasters so much that they remastered PS5 lol
@@bogdanursache501Rather it's murdered by CPU. On pc 6800xt is over double of 6700 perf. Elden hasn't got pisser and it's still below 6800
@@Thuner67776 They are you clown learn how AI ml works it will keep getting better as it is used in more games. Also games with issues are because of lazy devs using old sdk.
Can't believe im here this early just wanted to take the chance and say i've been a follower since 7k and your are my fav content creator, no bs just straight up information and a hit of humor time to time love owen thank you for all the education you gave us
"Cause PSSR still new, games need patch from dev, bla bla bla." Then why you buy it now and not wait for PS6 when probably PSSR already better implemented within the game? Sony fanboys really amaze me sometimes with the way their thinking
You're right. It should have looked better on release, but because it's trained on AI, I actually do think it will get better over time. There is no excuse for releasing it in it's current state, tho. Release an unfinished product/tech, and fix it later. It's the way the industry has been for YEARS now
Reminds me of another group that are fans of certain PC hardware. They are always going on about how in the future their features will be as good as the competitors was 2 years ago.
True, just like we should wait for AMD 9000 instead of 8000 since FSR4 is gonna be better implemented on AMD 9000 GPUs.
These people enable this "Ship first and fix later" mentality that ruined gaming.
tbf, the majority of ps players dont even care about image quality... they see Cloud and go "woop woop money goes poof" with anything "new".
Upscalers should always be optional imho... I don't like the idea that a Playstation enables pssr by default and I have to live with visual artefacts etc.
These consoles seem to be solely based on upscaling. Can they do much more then low 1440p if they don't have any? Would be interesting to see what they are capable of without upscaling. What do they get native 1080p and up
It never was optional with this console generation, almost every game except for low performance impact indies is running either dynamic resolution scaling or FSR both in quality and performance mode. Because that's how this console can get to 4k using a GPU that in the PC space would be considered a solidly 1080p card.
The console experience in a nuttshell
@@stevenbrasier2728they would be overkill for native 1080p. We know basically what hardware goes into a ps5 pro and can figure out equivalent amd or nvidia hardware. The ps5 pro has roughly an Rx 6800 which is comfortably a native 1440p gpu. U clearly don’t know what ur talking about on this topic, just do a little bit of research before commenting
@Will-zi6fn i said it would be interesting to see what they can do without uoscaling. I have a 6700xt system. Some games I can do native most I have to do upcaling for 1440p, I haven't tried at 1080p though. So your comment isn't based off of knowledge but just attack? Sure maybe they would be overkill as you are leading up to believe but we don't automatically know that because of what they would be based on
Who would have guessed that years of good algorithms would beat some hastily trained AI
Im quite excited for Sony to enter the upscaling world for games. They make Sony TVs that already have frame generation, upscaling and black frame insertion on their mid/high tier TVs. I hope they will lend that technology to playstation going forward
TBF, Sony has the best upscaling on TV, so people expected good thing from them, turns out TV upscaling experience doesn't translate to realtime upscaling.
This is more like practicing for the PS6. Charging money for it in its current state is crazy though.
@@meejmuas8686without it, the ps5 pro is so weak it wont be able to run new games well
Who would've guessed that PSSR is over 4 years old
I mean if they be calling it PSSR as their upscaling name, ill not be surprised if it was piss poor performing. 😂
PISSR is real
It’s the 3rd party devs they haven’t got a clue how to implement it properly. Which is understandable as its brand new sony needs to send engineers to help these devs out because it’s not a good look. Obviously it’s not the PSSR has all Sony first party games it looks fantastic not that far behind DLSS
800 smackaroos down the toilet
Man, we have a PiS party in Poland and they are all good with it because their voting groups have no idea as they don't learn any foreign languages.
It's a populist party that calls itself "right-wing", but they have nationalists, socialists and all losers, zero-charisma folks and Moscow spies to top of it all.
In reality, they are authoritarian socialists with poor economic and development understanding and a traitor's hideout.
The way we got PSSR and XESS, it's definitely on purpose. Xbox gonna have XXXSR I guarantee it 😭
Koralsky seems to be saying quite a lot for being under NDA. For example they said they can't talk about "how many iterations are available" but have themselves at least counted 3 versions for us. They also ended up mentioning "improvements" by saying the newer versions give better results compared to TSR and FSR. They are also talking about UE 5.5, which literally got released just now, and we are years away from seeing games made using 5.5 feature set.
We also see that FF7R, Star Wars Jedi Survivor, Hogwarts Legacy are UE4 titles while Silent Hill 2 is a UE5 title, but FF7R looks pretty good and SH2 doesn't. Hogwarts Legacy also looks fine. This too doesn't add up.
UE4 was semi- idiot proof. UE5 takes the training wheels off and requires devs to actually know more and put more effort into optimization. This is why SH2 looks like ass. It also means that Jedi and Hogwarts don't really look any better than something like Outer Worlds. I.e. looking last gen.
@@Lurch-Bot I would say SH2 and Jedi Survivor and even Alan Wake 2 suffer from the same shimmering, which would be a PSSR specific thing. The three games mentioned above use UE5, UE4 and Custom Northlight engine.
You might be right about UE4 vs UE5 ease of use, but what we are seeing here is probably a PSSR weakness with some content, an older model of it, or some misconfiguration by three independent developers.
The leaker suggests it's tied to UE version, which seems suspicious as SH2 is a UE5 game.
In other words, Console gamers can't win & nothing has changed.
I see this as a win for me because I was able to grab a base version for 300€. This is the only good thing about the pro release
@@sleepenjoyer-on2dr LMFAO agreed.
700 dollars to test out pssr for Sony before ps6 releases.
You are not testing anything. This comment shows that you didn't understand the concept of machine learning.
800 euros, even more.
3:50 lol they removed Ambient occlusion in the PRO version :) notice how the grass is missing the shading beneath it. Cool update
The biggest issue with pssr in my opinion is it's frame time cost. Digital Foundrys testing found that its 30-40 percent more demanding that fsr or taau from the same base resolution. The pro being 40 percent faster than the base lets it use pssr for better image quality in some games while keeping the same frame rate. DLAA is typically 5 percent slower or faster than TAA with the same base resolution. Sometimes it's more demanding, sometimes less demanding.
So PSSR has less of q performance increase than XeSS on a non Intel card. I'm glad Sony put time and money into moving this direction as TAA just cant hold up in modern games. Filter based temporal image reconstruction doesnt work with modern detail and poly counts. And an AI solution is much better than sticking with the dates folter based system.
Yeah 2ms is a very heavy cost. 60 fps is 16.6ms. Adding 2ms to that is 18.67ms. That's 53.5 fps. Huge loss in performance.
So it's more demanding and looks bad at the same time. Great job sony.
@@DragonOfTheMortalKombat it's hit and miss. Nothing to be excited about now. Def not a reason to buy the Pro. But it shows and effort and continued support of moving away from temporal image reconstruction and towards AI Super Sampling. I can get behind that. TAA can't cut it with modern poly counts and detail level.
imagine buying a "premium" console and play at native 600p and 800p with lower ray tracing quality than low settings on PC, and also the "magical" upscaler is broken, (reminds me of the PS5's SSD, same bs marketing)
But playstation fanboys will defend this
They already are in this comment section.
Seriously, they hyped the ssd so much, now this PISSER, pathetic people.
The SSD is kinda goated tho.
wait until they put 8K 120fps on the Box of the PS6
Vegetarey you’re an ironic hypocrite
It looks like FSR1 Performance mode, buy Mfrs will swear they $800 console beats a 4090
Doesn't even beat 3070 in RT and rtx 5000 is around the corner. Sony you are drunk go home
Who said that? All I've seen so far is PC gamers flooded to these PS5 Pro videos making claims. PC gamers familiar with PC hardware. When I was on PS4/PS4 Pro/PS5, I had no idea what a 3090 or a Ti or a souper, or a XT or XTX... or any of that. Now that I'm a PC gamer, I got to say, most people on PS5 Pro media seem to be PC Gamers. Why are they so angry at a console refresh is what I'm wondering.
@@Mcnooblet Don't know what you read, but none of the PC gamer comments I've seen sounded like they are angry at anything. I think people are just memeing on the fact that many console players are clueless and believe their system is superior to a PC in performance/visuals, which it is not.
@@gameison4813 computer scientist here (looks at spiderman 2, that uses half the tops) yeah it does LOL
It's PISSER
PISSER, ENHANCE!!
@@GeminionRay 😆
They just should left PS5 settings as an option for all PS5 Pro games
iirc, they did, players can still select the default performance or quality modes, just the quality mode looks the same but at 60fps on the pro.
@@Boss_Fight_Index_muki no lmao, quality mode doesn't look the same and in some games runs a lot worse than 60FPS. What are you ? Sony marketing bot lol
@@DragonOfTheMortalKombat he is delusional fanboy.
wouldnt that defeat the point of the ps5 pro
@@DragonOfTheMortalKombat why does stating something in reality make someone biased? iirc, both original modes are selectable right there in options. and where did i say 60 fps in all games?
Crazy, I was told by a “reliable” pc leaker that this was similar to a 4070 and had the best performance for its price. Man that was an incredibly stupid statement.
Remember when Moores Law is Dead said the PS5 Pro would be 67 teraflops? Insanity
@ Even when years ago it was basically confirmed to be 10-15% because realistically that’s the capability with the lagging evolution of AMD hardware that wasn’t on the CPU side.
they say the same about the new intel cards, seems 4070 is the benchmark.
Yeah it’s more like an RX 6800.
It’s cheaper than an equivalent PC of course, but it’s not magic.
@@Rachit0904 Yeah in there but putting that on a R5 3600 power level that’s then underclock is asking for a shitshow, on top of that making developers used a inferior upscaling system for what will end up being a 5-8% percent of the entire system population. It’s insane
lets talk about the fact that DigitalFoundry spotted Jedi Survivor scaling even from below 720p! and they are saying that the pro is like a rx 6800... hilarious! 🤣
Consoles can do more with lesser hardware
@@BlackJesus8463With less ram not really with less hardware in general. Everything is just scaling down native resolution and draw distance.
@@BlackJesus8463 thats not how it works really
The GPU in the Pro is pretty much identical to the RX 6800. Not sure why it's necessary to act so arrogant over a console you probably think is beneath you. Jedi Survivor is just horribly optimized and it's performance has been covered on this channel before.
@@Jack-pc9sp It's not at all identical to an RX 6800, in Elden Ring testing (which is a really good testbed because it runs like shit on console and PC alike) with graphics settings matched it's 15-20% weaker, aka. an RX 6800 equipped but otherwise hardware matched PC can almost run stable 60 fps, while the PS5 Pro still struggles to keep that but at least it now can stay within VRR range. And sure that's one game but we're only seeing a rough 20-30% uplift in most games that were GPU limited on the PS5. Which means that it's roughly equal to a 6750 XT, the 6800 would be another similar jump from there when looking at practical performance.
PSSR looks worse than base version which probably used FSR2, bruh
Joke of a console. Took them years to make a DLSS equivalent and it’s crap.
You didn't watch the whole video obviously
@@gorillagroddgaming You obviously didn't watch the whole video
@@syncmonismIt doesnt matter that they are using earlier versions of pssr. The fact is that ps5 pro owners have to WAIT for what they were promised, even after buying the console. If they have to wait for the features, then what is the point of buying a ps5 pro when the ps6 is already getting close?
@@Yes917what about the people who bought 20 series gpus cause dlss was ass back then
Just the way ai upscaling works
You know you're in for a rough time when the thumbnail has the same expression as my PFP.
PSSR might get better but who the f thought it would be good to release such patches to consumers? They thought that people would not notice the shimmer fest?
If they already sold you the console they already got the money fanbois will wait for all the fixes and praise how good it is either way.
No one has came right out the gates with a great upscaler. It is a new upscaler. It is going to take time, especially in combination with RT and noise. So far PSSR has looked pretty good in non RT games vs FSR.
@@Mcnooblet but it doesnt justify destroying games;) they all knew how it looks. They should leave it for internal tests.
A Sony developed AI upscaler being terrible means absolutely nothing for an AMD developed FSR 4.
Wouldn't Sony have more people using their a.i than AMD?
Yeah FSR 4 is separate from PSSR. That is why Sony said they went their own way for upscaling from AMD. Also shows how AI upscaling is pointless. FSR Algorithm is better than AI clearly from the video's shown. PSSR barely beats FSR 1 lmao.
Hmm dlss is excellent and is a ai upscaler@@SemperValor
they could be related since Sony are using AMD hardware but you'd expect AMD's implementation to be better since they have way more experience with this
@@SemperValor AI upscaling is not pointless.... Hence them using it for FSR 4....
This is probably the first time consoles are beta testing features for pc
All new games are beta copies. In the 90s beta games were free. Now you pay for a broken beta game, and wait 4 years for them to finish polishing the game. When they finally finish patching the game no one cares. Tekken 7!
You can recommend whatever up scaler you want. I got a 12gb card and I still have to turn off every alphabet soup mode before my games feel right. I'll be buying my next card on real fpd (frames per dollar) and nothing else.
You obviously do not have dlss and are not informed in its quality. FSR looks mildly better than just dropping resolution. Dlss looks better than native a lot of the time and even performance upscaling and barely noticeable. Literally guarantee in a blind test with people that aren't enthusiast gamers.. most would not notice the difference in native and performance dlss. But fsr is stupid obvious.
@@christophermullins7163 Internet experts. Most their tech xp comes from a compressed YT streamed video. Unfortunately those are often the ones who think they know it all, while having 0 xp themselves to experience, and know for sure. It's pretty normal at this point, and the reason no one takes social media comments seriously.
@@christophermullins7163 DLSS never looks better than native, but it is far better than fsr. DLAA looks better than native, but dlss has artifacts that are not present in native.
@@christophermullins7163 I do have dlss and I don't care what my game looks like when it feels like shit. You obviously don't have standards.
DLSS quality looks just the same as native in most games. I use it all the time.
Sony did their faithful customers wrong by overpricing and selling them the idea of prestige. And, their customers drank the coolaid because they simply didnt know any better. It's like I'm watching PC gamers' nightmare all over again with Sony and its customers. As a PC owner myself, I have to be honest and simply say that Nvidia's and AMD's GPU's are crap today because the focus is no longer on the engine but making sure the twin turbos do all the work but still charge as if it is a collector's item V12 car. PC gamers allowed that to happen and now we are all stuck in this overpriced nightmare for crappy products that just sell the idea of grandeur. I mean the 4090 can barely do 60 fps 4K on high demanding titles at native resolution. So, without its twin turbos (DLSS & FG), it fails. And now, we are seeing this all over again with Sony and the PS5 Pro and its loyal die hard customers.
Is the PS5 Pro great feat in console technology? Yes as no one denies that at all but is it worth $699 base? Nope and let alone $900. But, no matter what, it is still selling and Sony will hit its end of year sales goals and hopefully make a dent in its half a billion loss disaster by investing in the wrong gaming companies.
I'll wait till next year then the PS5 Pro will be cheaper and all updated even with all the PSSR updates to make the PS5 Pro then worth buying assuming the price is fair. I never buy today's tech because it's never worth it. I always buy a year or two later and one generation behind when the tech is all updated to work properly and priced properly. Unless your tech pays the bills, no need to get on the band wagon of false grandeur by always getting the latest tech. And, never be a fan of any companies, always be ready to constructively criticize them to always get the best products, and remind them without customers they do not exist. PC gamers learned a valuable lesson in the PC world and Sony loyal customers are about to as well. We all got played people. Best be smarter in 2025.
Then how would you market the PS5 Pro then?
They're obviously not going to market all the flaws in the system just like Intel AMD and Nvidia sugarcoating all their new CPU/GPU products presentations every year.
I didn't get a Pro because I already have a PS5 and there's nothing wrong with it and I currently don't want "More" out of the PS5 experience.
As for Pro it's just as advertised, and it has flaws and certainly not targeting people like me, so I'd just move on.
@barebarekun161 Your question is easy to answer as Sony for many years already had the proper marketing strategy: "Innovative and affordable".
They lost that and because of that, their loyal customers are getting played. It's happened in the PC world and I never thought I'd see it ever in the console world, but, it has happened. The last console I own is the PS2 as the most innovative of them all in my thoughts.
4090 is years old, software doesn't slow down for hardware. Hardware catches up. Too many think software should stay at a stand still until they personally decide to upgrade their hardware. It isn't even realistic. I own a 4090 and the problem with "4k" is you are talking about native 4k, when often times the majority doesn't even refer to 4k as native 4k, but upscaled 4k. 4k native max settings with RT is what you are talking about, and 60fps for that is actually an impressive feat, especially for hardware years old now for the latest titles.
@@barebarekun161 It sure gets a lot of attention from people not even interested in it though, that part is weird. I think most just need hardware powerful enough to load up their social media so they can complain about things they weren't even interested in, or were going to buy themselves. It's part of this sheep like culture of trying to dictate what everyone elses actions are, based on something they don't personally like.
@@Mcnooblet Great points you bring in and I hear what you say. I always bring the point of how the 1080 Ti was built compared to today's GPU cards. Whether Nvidia made a mistake or built the GOAT, we will never know. I still own the 1080 Ti and use it daily along with my other high desktop/midtier laptop. To me, the 1080 Ti was all horsepower which today still is a beloved card that can still keep up especially after Nvidia's upscaling updates. But of course with time, all tech fall behind. After that, I believe all other GPUs from Nvidia no longer were well built. I truly believe if the PC community simply said these cards suck and we're not buying any, we would either have better GPUs that would have taken longer to make which is fine or simply better pricings for new techs every year it seems now.
We all got played in the PC world but everyone is entitled to do whatever they want with their money. I always wait and then acquire what I want at 30% to 50% off brand new at the proper time and to me personally, I feel better with my investment then because I always want the best bang for the buck.
Even if PSSR is fixed the performance gain it's disappointing, just by looking at games like Blackmyth or Silent Hill 2, a few frames for nothing.
Plus, if the SDK thing is completely true I think a lot of people will be disappointed because I've seen a lot of comment here on UA-cam, X and many other websites that PSSR can be updated on console level affecting all games that uses PSSR
Unreal Engine 5 has been a bane to all gaming. Unless you have massive overhead to mitigate problems, like the 4080 or 4090, you are going to eat shit in any UE5 title
Kind reminds me of how Cyberpunk 2077's FIRST Path tracing looked when added into the game, before they fixed it and added ray reconstruction! (Not that ps5 pro is using path tracing in games) just reminds me how it looked, it too had that weird noisy sizzling look for some reason.
These days Quality Control no longer exists. Everything new has issues. And clearly 9-12 months is like early development, and to save time, let’s people spent over £700 to test our beta product. Or I woo say even alpha at this point. So they are promised Great Visuals, but they meant after few years beginning from 7th of November.
Welcome in the group beta testers. Lest test it together!
Nevertheless, “I believe UE5 games will look better”… thankfully Alan Wake 2 isn’t a UE5.. wait the second 🙈
The 9-12 months was for AMD’s team not PS5 Pro
I fear AMD will have to put out a early/bad version of FSR4. They can't make the same mistake like with FSR 3 where they announce it and then say nothing for like a year again. Putting FSR out early will def result in bad press but the data from all the ppl trying it out any prolly using it could give the needed help to make FSR4 better. If AMD can't pull out some magic out of thier hat, they will most likel, have a even harder time until they hopefully can catch up a bit again to Nvidia.
I have one and it’s been a game changer for so many of my games ..I’m running it on a Sony Bravia tv with VRR with hdmi 3.1 at 120hz.. I havee red no issues like you are showing … you said you don’t have a ps5 pro once you begin the video … it’s NOT apparent on my set up … so maybe a Sony tv with a pro produces perfection. go buy one and find out instead of making a video of a product you don’t even know personally.
They generally made these new consoles (XBoxS X/S, PS5/Pro) like PCs with all the problems included.
I love your videos so much, always so educational.
As a 4090 owner and a Sony game lover I think I’ll just stick with the regular ps5 at this point and wait for Sony games to come to pc. Luckily us pc owners are getting more and more Sony content now. I do hope this tech gets better for console users.
its the denoisers from the RTX ambient occlasions you can turn them off on pc, they need to update it to take it off for the pssr. simple update should fix it, but probably is there for stability. this is why ray recontruction became important unfortunately everyone is kind of behind nvidia. tbh they should just stick to traditional FSR
Probably not the denoisers, they have probably screwed up the implementation by having it render at something like half rez but haven't told the game if rendering at 50% don't half the rez of the GI. This used to happen alot when dlss and fsr first existed it ended up making reflections render at 1/4 Res instead of half.
I always saw PSSR as a prototype pf what FSR4 will achieve. I think AMD will surprise us next year (at least I hope so)
This is a Very good analysis of the problem.
PSSR still very new, my bet is AI most likely is learning and we seen this before so games are going to need to be patched by dev, but once more for me this proves native visuals are better and given cost of PS5 PRO for extra cost you should not need to upscale to get good visual and 60fps
And here's the kicker for those who own a Pro they have been complaining about Sony and Game Devs not given the option to use the standard PS5 version after patches or something. If that's the case and I had a Pro I would be sending it back for a full refund, because why spend £700 on a console if I'm having to wish I could play the standard version of games like a PS5 Base does
What Sony have done is release PSSR beta and the testers just paid £700 to enter the test
Well they hardly consumer friendly at moment the uk 🇬🇧 suing them for scalping prices on customers and taking away movies and shows and even games and not get me started on Xbox with their constant crashes and bad launches and lots issues with saving a game you think in 2024 they would have game saves sorted etc I’m switching to pc fed up with the consoles and paying subscription etc for online
Did we even need a PS5 Pro with barely better performance?
Sony gives gamers a product most don't want, at a price they don't want, and it's worse than the regular version. *slow clap*
Considering the way they marketed the Pro, I'd say no but hey let's just assume the second that PS5 Pro came out they suddenly stopped selling regular PS5, that's like their console for most audiences lol.
Those "We" would better be of sticking to their so called "far superior" PC and living shouting their superiority complex every time they opened their wallet for GPU upgrade each year.
@@barebarekun161 It doesn't even have to be one or the other. I have a 4090 PC. I upgraded from a PS5 because the 60fps modes looked terrible. I absolutely am going to buy a PS5 Pro when I get on the road soon. My PC is great for unemployment, but I'm not lugging it around as it is heavy as heck. I think too many are focused on these couple RT games, where the hardware still isn't good for RT. 36 CUs to 60 CUs isn't "barely better performance" for raster, but it also depends on how that extra compute is being utilized. I wouldn't utilize it for RT, but some developers are choosing to, and that's what linear minds are focusing on. 2-3x better RT performance on PS5 Pro sounds good in marketing until you realize the PS5 was so awful at RT, that it needs much much more than 2-3x to broadly implement.
Honestly, I can’t see a difference.
…probably because I’m watching this video on my tiny phone screen. So don’t listen to me.
I watched it on my 4K monitor and the difference is still relatively minor. Go watch the original videos! The difference is pretty huge, actually. UA-cam compression filters out all the artifacts and even the flickering here, it's crazy.
Who gives a F about blurry ghosting mess uoscalers.
Always play on native resolutions.
Very interesting. I guess game studios use it despite the image degradation in order to take advantage of the AI capabilities for better framerates. I applaud the decision if so. The console audience for single player games is trending older, and therefore is more aware of what makes a game feel fluid and snappy.
I am looking forward to seeing how it improves, Digital Foundry and some other dudes on YT also commented on this. PSSR is in stage one (PSSR 1.0) it will improve question is how much…
I think this is simply games not build with it in mind. Or so I hope. Hopefully games build from the ground up to keep PSSR in mind can do better. This just seems tacked on.
Id bet this is why some of the sony games dont use pssr. Also thats really bad if pssr cant be updated, if the game sdk version isnt up to date, thats a huge setback.
Silent Hill hasn't received a pro patch. It's still on patch 1.05, and Star Wars has had issues since its debut. Dragon Age: Veilguard, God of War, and a few others are great examples of PSSR. People need to go back and look at DLSS on Metro Exodus when it first released... the same with BFV. DLSS was bad, but now it's amazing.
100%
Digital foundry has confirmed that silent hill has recieved a patch
DLSS1 was a completely different technology that didn't work out. DLSS2 launched in March 2020 and has been pretty good since then. For me 2.5.1 was a huge milestone since they finally removed the awful sharpening filter that caused artifacts.
Dlss was the first upscaling technique to release, they didn't have anyone to look up to. PSSR is a joke being released in 2024.
@remowind1578 look up to? This isn't a kid looking up to their father. These are two different technologies. It hasn't even been a month. And just because some devs suck at implementing it doesn't mean it's bad. Also, there are recent games that came out where DLSS still had issues due to poor developer implementation.
I dont get the fuss not a single upscaling solution was good on launch who thought this would be any different
The people who spent $800 on the PS5 pro, maybe 😂
You know there’s some idiot out there that really thought Pissr was gonna be revolutionary.
Intel XeSS?
Xess was
Not a single car was good on launch either. Doesn't mean if you buy a car now that can't go above 10 mph and breaks down after 50 milles. you can just be like oh well.
I mean it can be turned off and ran like a normal ps5 right?? Surely Sony wouldn't have forced everyone to only new stuff without an option to turn things off right?? A 700 plus dollar console should have all these options so I'm more than sure the options are there.
I think on Silent Hill 2 you can't deactivate PSSR
@MrKutKuGaruga96 oh nooo! I'll bet they'll fix it on up though. Fear not! I can't afford one so I'm gonna make due w ps5 phat
Lmao consoles and options are like 4 parallel universes apart.
@DragonOfTheMortalKombat man. W such an expensive console, I was hoping for options. Oh well. I cant say my phat ps5 has really let me down yet so I'll keep on truckin.
@DragonOfTheMortalKombat btw I love you screenname. It's all the dragon n of the symbol we grew up w. Rock n roll, man!
the ps5 pro caught up to dlss1.0
that was like 6 years ago. take care by.
One thing I want to know about is why does PSSR have input labels that only XeSS uses? That would almost imply that it was based on XeSS in some way. That would also explain why it's better than FSR when implemented correctly.
Speculating about potential SDK kits, patches from the developer, or what the PSSR version is, and the developer may be using misses the forest for the trees.
The story should be about Sony releasing an unfinished product whose chief selling point is broken.
I've yet to see a single person hold Sony to task, or rest this buck at Sony's feet.
It's Remedy's fault, it's EA's fault, it's Silent Hill's fault, its the PSSR version, it's AMD'S fault, it's everything and everyone but Sony who is at fault, but when you boot up your PS5, it's Sony's logo you see.
Do you think if Nvidia botched the 50 series launch, we'd be blaming game developers?
NOOOOOOOO How im going to play my exclusive ™️ Lego Horizon ™️ (also available for Nintendo switch) on my 700$ console (stand sold separately) NOW??!!??
😂
Im happy with pretty much any upscaling because I'm so blind to details that it took me about a minute and a half of staring at the comparison still DLSS avd native images of the car in front of the wall to notice the difference in how the lines on the wall appear and then about another 30s to notice the difference in the colour and pattern in the gold area running across the top of the wall. These technologies are designed for the visually unobservant like me I guess. Im happy with more frames and a blind to subtle (and not so subtle, apparently) graphical artifacts.... 😅
If you are so blind, how can you notice more or less frames then? 😂
@kenshinhimura6280 blind to detail my friend, but smooth motion is another story... at least up to a point. I'm also old and have bad gamer reflexes. So, basically, I'm happy with anything over about 50 fps because I ain't playing competitive FPS games anyway. I'm more of the DIablo, Skyrim, Witcher, Civilization kind of player, with some Horizon, and other similar games that are forgiving of my old man (51) reflexes... I'm easy to keep happy, I just finally upgraded from a 5700xt that I've had since 2019 to a 7900GRE, and that was mostly for the benefit of my teenager who plays way more on the computer than me (and to finally match up better to the 5800x3d that I bought about a year ago because I thought my 3600X was failing).
That’s probably cause they used a pre-release version, Last of Us Part I and Part II are using the latest PSSR version and looks much better.
A developer came out and said PSSR works much better in more recent versions and these patches are using the initial PSSR tech. Supposedly the newer version produces much higher image quality. I’m not concerned long term. Tons of beautiful games on the Pro currently.
Say it, say again you have all sources in description, god damn it!
Frame interpolation is a strange beast.
I can't get my head around the fact that Samsung TV's from 2005/2006 achieved it to near perfection but in 2024 both Nvidia and AMD can't fix the screen artifacts.
I had an old Samsung plasma that cost me £600 in 2014 that had frame interpolation/smooth motion.
Fantastic for films but hit and miss with gaming.
On occasion a game would work perfectly, feel like 60fps with minimal artifacting and this was handled by the cheap TV and not a ridiculously over priced GPU or console.
Just a thought.
Yes the games that have this issue with PSSR also has it in the base console too but not to such an extreme. It seem PSSR is not resolving the issue. Zoom in on the base PS5 version in high resolution and you can see the shimmering too. Not all games are doing this and PSSR makes a lot of games look better but unstable images can still look bad with PSSR. I've seen DLSS do the same things on some games with unstable images. One game I noticed in particular on PC is Robocop. The RT is very unstable in that game and shimmers on the road when walking in the city and DLSS still looks bad. TSR however seems to somewhat make it look more stable. Of course though, DLSS right now is better than PSSR but it still has it's issues with some games.
A lot of people forgot that the first version of Nvidia DLSS was really bad. I remember a comparison test with DLSS 1.0 where they were comparing a native 1440p image upscaled to 4K with DLSS and a native 1440p image just displayed normally on a 4K screen scaled up by the display. The DLSS image was quite blurry and looked a lot worse than the image without DLSS.
Ai upscalers need a lot of data and training to improve and the reason DLSS is so good now is that Nvidia put so much time into it.
Its not easy to compete with DLSS because it has many years headstart in training its AI model and improving it.
PSSR will improve over time as well and we hope that Sony has some kind of collaboration with AMD, otherwise its really likely that FSR 4 will start off weak as well.
Just my honest opinion, but I feel people put way too much weight behind upscaling when making their buying decision. Personally, I switched from Nvidia to a 7800xt for £480, very good price/performance with 16GB VRAM, I have never had to use upscaling at 1440p high settings. My top priorities are buying in the correct performance class and VRAM. There's an argument if you game at higher resolutions, or care about ray tracing, but lets face it, higher resolutions and ray tracing are irrelevant if you run out of VRAM or you have concerns this will be an issue further down the line. Apart from that, I view upscaling as a handy tool that may be helpful in a few years as the card ages to squeeze extra performance out of it, by which point I couldn't really care less if there's slight differences in quality because I'll most likely be upgrading in the not so distant future. It is a great feature, but it wouldn't sway my decision to buy one GPU over another for a feature I'm likely not going to use for a few years, especially if the other card has more VRAM.
Jedi Survivors fault looks more related to ray tracing / denoising issues rather than the upscaling itself, it is visible in the pc footage as well (to a lesser degree probably due to higher ray counts)
After reading some comments, the phrase that sums it all up is: making a storm in a teacup.
Can we use PSSR being garbage to give Nividia some props for DLSS
Its obvious you can't just "add AI" and it magically becomes good
tbf, it's a "nature of the beast" issue with any Ai upscalers. All upscalers must goes thru years of post-data refinement. The implementation has to start at sometime.
Its PSSR version 1. Lets not pretend that the first DLSS wasn’t dog shit.
@@Boss_Fight_Index_muki People are dumb. I think that's all this shows on the numerous posts of comparing a new upscaler with a years optimized upscaler. Their linear minds can't think beyond a simple binary 1= good, 0= not good. It's either a 1 or 0, no other variables will enter their minds.
I feel like ray tracing was either an inside job to force better hardware to be sold as graphics start to plateau, OR just an overly ambitious mistake that was implemented way before it was ready. Either way, it's a disaster for the console market.
It was Implemented 1st by Nvidia on 20 series cards for PC i do not think it was ever intended for consoles AMD basically slapped it in there just to say here you go it has "ray Tracing" even tough the hardware cannot handle it and those resources are better used for other things. Ray tracing is the future but it will be quite a few more years before it can replace standard techniques... think its main advantage is actually for developers to not have to bake lights etc not just consumers looking at pretty lights/reflections/shadows.
Let’s all just hope it’s Sony’s fault and not AMD’s. Gosh, I wish Intel hadn’t failed this bad and had their GPU game running, they made top notch upscalers (close to DLSS) pretty good hardware and their drivers are fixed.
9:12 Stellar Blade is also an UE4 game, and PSSR looks fantastic in it (just got my Pro today--haven't done much testing).
Even as an early adopter of the ps5 pro.. I’m not sure why pssr is a thing versus utilizing AMD FSR 3.0. Just another thing for devs to sort out in a never ending list of things they already struggle with.
Aint no way, I opened the channel just when new video was uploaded.
Somehow almost everyone forgets that it took several years for DLSS to get as good as it is. As an ex-owner of 2080ti I remember how much of a joke it was in the beginning, not worth using at all.
Another thing all those games have in common is that, unlike Sony first party games, they are all upscaling from resolutions lower than 1080p. PSSR issued might still be present in other games, but somewhat masked by the higher internal resolution.
My question would be, if you want to play with a console, shouldn't you be running games with a large TV, are these image quality things an issue with a large TV too, or just if you are pixel peeping with some small monitor?
It needs more work and better integration. With any new device especially consoles, early adopters are like beta testers. Personally I haven’t noticed any shimmering or issues with any game especially Alan wake 2. I haven’t tried silent hill 2 or Jedi survivor so I’ve had a great experience in the games that I have played.
I'm not surprised. This is PSSR 1.0 there is no way they would come out and be killing it just like that. It needs time and that's why I always wait when a new product comes out and see the results.
I love how people crapping on people for buying a 700$ console are the same ones spending 700$ on just a graphics card.
The card is a better deal
@@thetechnosaiyan Is it?
PSSR IS not the problem. Is the game, in Silent Hill 2 FSR 3.1 is a shit, but FSR 3.1 in Wukong is wonderfull
so after watching whole video, what I get is this: The Silent Hill devs are using some old SDK (which is strange as thats not old game...) and used old version of PSSR - than saw the disgusting results and were like - "OK, good to go"
My experience of the PS5 Pro is mixed.
The dynamic res and performance boost in lesser optimised PS5 games is nice to have and makes them more enjoyable to play. However, the actual PS5 Pro enhanced patches have been hugely variable with the first-party games faring better than the third-party games. Sony obviously want their own games to look good on the Pro but it seems that the third-party developers are less bothered. Star Wars Jedi: Survivor and Silent Hill 2 look awful, despite being great games, so very disappointed with those.
I find it a bit ironic though that the best looking games on the Pro are Horizon Zero Dawn and Horizon Forbidden West but neither of those games use PSSR... make of that what you will...
You need dev / editor will and pass the long console patch process to get an update not a version "swapper" app like on pc. That’s why multiple update for pssr new version will be the exception more than the rule for most games
"PS5 Pro using AI upscaling instead of real power is such a letdown. Backgrounds look worse than the regular PS5 in some games. Feels like they’re cutting corners and relying on marketing buzz. Just give us actual hardware upgrades, not tricks!"
FSR ain't so bad now huh lol
I love how Sony Ponies where hyping up the PS5 Pro like it was even better than an RTX 4090 but in reality it's even worse than a base PS5 in a lot of cases lmao😂
Playstation 6 have a great chance to sell consoles with GTA 6, they are both 6 it could be nice marketing
When will they make hardware that's good enough for native resolution and one that actually looks crystal clear like old games did with native higher res+ msaa/ ssaa?
In the age of AI based hardware for games, AI denoisers should become a standard. Ray Reconstruction proves that it increases the quality of the picture and even runs faster than standard denoisers.
It has the exact same issues that FSR 3 has. I presume PSSR is just the current version of FSR and will be updated once fsr 4 comes around.
thought PSSR was supposed to be as good as DLSS? Guess they missed the mark.
How can FSR4 compete with PSSR? FSR is software. PSSR is hardware, like DLSS.
Sounds like bullshit cope. Why would an upscaler released in 2024 have any different implementation on an older version of UE? XeSS, DLSS, and FSR don't have this property, and they actually were developed alongside the transition from UE4 to UE5. Doesn't make any sense. Alan Wake 2 had similar issues, and that isn't UE at all. It's likely just bad developer decisions with respect to specific aspects of implementation like AO, RTGI, reflections etc. But this convenient excuse makes no sense.
Have you seen the sh*tty implementation of FSR3 on CP2077 vs other FSR3 implementation? It dev that needed to make sure the upscaler works properly. sure you can drop in new version but you need dev to do QC or it will be shit. most of the game that have shitty PSSR are Nvidia sponsored "surprised"?
There is potential but without proper implementation it will fall flat as FG did at first. Even Intel has offered better upscaling solutions in a fraction of the time.
They need that ray reconstruction tech to reduce the ray tracing shimmer.
I don't know if I buy the UE4 PSSR SDK9 theory. According to that logic, Final Fantasy 7 Rebirth is a UE4 game and therefore should have had the bad/early PSSR implementation. But in reality FF7R is perhaps the game with the most uplift from it's PSSR implementation.
f_ck i had so much high hope for the PSSR :(
ya i know its first try but its first after DLSS paved the way, its not like they need to invent it or the next step, they only need to match and its way way easier.
at that point i think NV R&D is just from another planet, same with RT...
sony claimed X4 RT over RDNA2 yet with the same settings 4070 just killed the PS5 PRO, and the RT on alan wake was cut back quite a bit, and if u compare what DLSS + RR looks like vs the PS5 pro its mind boggling and sad.
Considering silent hill shipped with a very outdated version of dlss, i wouldn’t be surprised if the same was true for pssr
This is the fault of certain developers who release terrible patches for PS5 Pro, it is not the fault of the console or PSSR, although the developers are not obliged to do so either, if the game has already gone on sale and they are not paid extra for the patches to PS5 Pro, Sony's own developers are obliged to release good patches.
this PSSR thingy feels like the "end of PS3 era" gaming. Games looked kind of like this by the end of PS3 life.
I thought UE5 is crap, but after playing Metro Awakening, which is optimized to the point of hurting the game, its clear to me that the developers just dont care about optimization.
Im almost certain this is why the Callisto Protocols pro patch is delayed. It's unreal 4 and has heavy use of reytracing. I suspect they aren't happy with how the image is resolving. Hmm
On Silent Hill 2 I played it on my PS5 Slim. And James kind of jiggled right at the beginning of the game. And occasionally off and on for the rest of the game.
30% increased horsepower is not doing anything to a lowres Image. You can stabilize your current framerate with that additionl GPU-performance. PS4 PRO got +125% and still some people complained, they could not spot a difference (which about i disagreed).
That is the huge problem of the PRO5-Series. No good PSSR-Implentation in a title means game over. Still funny they sell this +30% horsepower for a 67% higher price tag in germany. From 550€ up to 920€ (discversion)
really hoping they do something with fsr4 fast, I'm really tempted by a 50xx series for monster hunter wilds at this point ( coming from a 7900XT )
PSSR and to some extent XESS don't play well with the RT denoising pass. The "boiling" visual artefact can be lessen by upping the quality of upsampling or by upping the quality of RT (more samples per pixel) to reduce noice.
One could say PSSR is going through what DLSS 1.0 and FSR 1.0 went through. They were massive trash heaps at first as well. Then one could ask themselves, why didn't they take everyones first attempts to heart and make their first impression at least somewhat decent.
Yucky