I don’t prefer one over the other personally. Machines help to isolate better than free weights when targeting a certain area. For example I prefer machines over free weights when targeting my triceps. Both are great though
True. Hypertrophy only bros say that any extra fatigue and muscle involvement is bad when it's possible to master the technique of the movement, adapt and make it perfectly stable. This will in turn make you more skilled and functional. Same goes for the barbell row
To be fair big advanced lifters can put so much weight on the bar that the fatigue can really be an issue. Not much of an issue but a feature for a beginner who lifts 100lbs / 40kg for example
I think it also depends on you program. If you are doing a full body workout and you've already got squats and pull-ups on the menu as compound exercises, maybe giving yourself a break with seated shoulder press isn't such a bad idea.
I agree. I think the body needs to be strong everywhere and in every direction to be truly safe from training injuries. Compound movements are generally the best all round in my opinion.
Depends on goals. Yeah, for most people you are spot on. I am a person, who wants to maximize muscle growth, with the goal of one day (multiple years from now) to compete in a natural bodybuilding show. So for me, doing overhead press would cause to much fatique, compared to the ammount of muscle build. Also, my core being a limiting factor, would mean less muscle being build in my shoulders. Therfore, isolating the shoulders and core on different excersices is better for me
Having strong shoulders is completely underrated nowadays, from a hypertrophy standpoint point you don’t have to do ohp but from a strength standpoint yes you have to do some sort of vertical press if you want strong shoulders, doing lateral raises isn’t going to get you super humanly strong shoulders, neither is benching, the only Way to get strong shoulders that can press a lot of weight overhead is to press a lot of weight overhead.
@@JROB447 To get stronger, more capable and have more growth in other parts (as well), it's great to implement the ohp, without being seated on the bench
I’m aiming to be able to do a handstand push up so overhead press is a must! Once I can push 70% of my body weight for about 8 reps I should have enough power to do it. I’m at about 55% right now hopefully in about 4-6months I’ll be there
I’ve been training to do handstand pushups aswell but I’ve only been doing dips, handstands, push ups and pike pushups to train for it. Do you think the overhead press would be a good addition?
@@jesseanthonyvanderwegeni would say so since they work the most similar motion and are simpler and easier to overload than the pike push-ups, though i wouldnt ditch those too i think doing handstands and pike pu's for technique and specifity and ohp to be sure you have the raw strenght for it would be best
I’ve been doing a reverse pyramid for OHP. Do 6, drop the weight 10%, do 8 and drop the weight another 10% and do 10. It’s worked well for increasing the weight as, as soon as I can get 8 from the first set I put the weight up 2.5kg… I’m at 70% BW for my first set of 6 at the moment, aiming to be able to lift BW overhead.
Definitely, the problem I see with overhead press is that it's easy to suffer from injury. It's definitely an excercise to go lighter than you can on, and carry out with perfect form.
If you're purely bodybuilding, then sit down. But for the rest of us concerned with total body health, stability, and overall real life function, then standing is hands down better.
Okay but name 1 scenario in real life where you’re ever pressing more than 10lbs over your head on a regular basis. Even if you’re working in a warehouse and lifting boxes, very unlikely that you’re ever going to need to be able to OHP more than 50lbs in your every day life…
@@havenless3551 NAme one scenario? I live next to a warehouse buying and selling grains and fertilizer. Workers there regularly lift 25-50 kg sacks most days.
It’s all about what your goals are. 1) do you want the best stimulus for your shoulder muscles for hypertrophy/strength -seated Or 2) do you want a more fatiguing compound movement that targets not only the shoulders but the core as well along with raising the heart rate a little more. -standing
Exactly. If you do some intense sets of OHP it will generate a lot of fatigue, which might decrease the efficiency of the remaining workout, or if you do it at the end you might not have the energy left to fully max out on OHP. As a bodybuilder who wants to train muscles which as much intensity as possible, this just wastes and requires a lot of energy that could be spent elsewhere instead, but for other people this might work really well for their goals
It’s all about goals. If your goal is functional strength and mobility, then yes forcing yourself to stabilize will train your core and shoulders better. But if your goal is bodybuilding, then doing a variation that requires you to stabilize your core brings some of the focus and attention out of your shoulders and hinders your ability to target those muscles.
Standing military press is a staple in my shoulder training. I especially like being able to cheat a few reps at the end using my legs to initiate the drive.
@ it’s a press, they’re not completely different. If you improve your OHP you’ll improve your overall pressing movements. Bench press gets boring after years of doing it…
My OHP is 80% my bench for same reps so pretty slanted in that direction, and I find taking more than maybe 4 days off bench, my bench drops quickly. Sure, I have a pretty stable form on bench, the shoulders help in that regard, but pecs still need that direct stimulus.
@@manmoth4 OHP will always be lower than BP, you don’t have anything supporting your back to help you push more. If you’re losing strength after 4 days, you’re definitely doing something wrong.
I don't do this very often now, but back in the day, I'd find a weight that I could dumbbell OHP for about 8 reps, then do my standing OHP directly in front of an high Incline bench. When you hit like 2 RIR for the standing OHP, immediately sit down on the bench and continue pressing until you match your standing number. That's one set. By the end of three or four, your front delts should be pretty cooked, but you kinda get the benefits of both positions while getting the additional volume that you would get from the seated OHP.
To be fair big advanced lifters can put so much weight on the bar that the fatigue can really be an issue. Not much of an issue but a feature for a beginner who lifts 100lbs / 40kg for example
I'm not that advanced, do 90kg for 6, but still find it wipes me out. Knees trembling after first set, need to sit down, every other exercise afterwards drops a rep immediately lol. But it does get better once I've done a certain weight for a while and acclimatised.
I think the biggest criticism of the shoulder press is that a developed front delt won’t add that much to your physique and it’s also hit a ton through regular pressing that you’re already doing
i reccomend implementing both. because you want your shoulder to get fatigued first, so they grow. but strengthening your core isn’t a bad thing either
As dr Mike would say; no wrong answers, only different applications If you’re training solely for shoulder hypertrophy, the standing OHP is not optimal If you care about literally anything else - functional strength, etc. then it’s a great exercise
Just stick to the basics of training. Squats, Deadlifts, Presses, Rows, Pull-Ups, Dips. It's that simple. Isolation is incredibly overrated. And if you want for the main lifts Squat, Bench, and Deadlift you can even throw in some of their variations to your routine as well. Most importantly go heavy. 3-6 reps for all your exercises. You will progress way faster, get stronger, and you will build a lot of muscle. If you want a lean, strong, and pretty jacked body that is functional then do this.
I absolutely love the OH press, i am not the strongest at it, but it's sometimes my favourite movement. Sometimes when i feel poor to workout, some OH press reps get everything going, its an impressive looking movement too. Don't skip the OH press boys, it's a great movement
For beginners in the gym I would say to start with standing, just to build up that core along with your shoulders and triceps as this sets you up for success in other movements
The overhead press is a superior workout is all I heard from this: core activation total body stability etc . Seated press is fine if you want sore muscles 💪
Doing overhead press is the most manly alpha lift you can do. Nobody does them and even if you're not strong you'll still look badass doing them and your shoulders will grow very fast!
I love overheads and the stability it requires so i do it. I hate squats and the stability they require so i do them in the smith to just get the stimulus. Do what makes your workout enjoyable so you keep showing up.
I always train major lifts both ways. I like to emphasize strength and explosiveness on unsupported movements like standing presses, squats etc, and focus more on contracting specific muscle groups with seated presses, leg presses etc.
Depends on your objective. If you want to build stability the standing overhead press is better since you'll also be building your delts. For just delts, use a bench
All about goals imo: if you don’t care about core stability, and just want growth, go seated; if you want core stability or Generally more functionality, standing or even Z-press
I do it seated. Massive gains over the last 4 years. Only been doing this and rear delta. 2 exercises are enough when you do serious progressive overload
Don't know about being stable after a couple of weeks. If you constantly fatigue your whole body throughout your workout, you won't push your core near failure much when you target it. I think this is a great mindset when you've already exercised your core for 4-6 months with targeted exercise. Before that, you might not have the general energy to sustain a workout like that. Though you might reach that ability faster if you start training from an already very active lifestyle. That's something that's generally the other way around with other muscle groups, where targeting becomes more important the more advanced you are. But the core generally is really behind for beginners, doesn't take very long to make progress on, and really wears you out while it's weak, so it's a great example for an exception there. Along with arms, which you don't want to target and fatigue all the time before you've done your chest/back workouts, because you wouldn't be able to push your chest/back to failure anymore if your arms are already dying after three reps. Same with your core exhausting your nervous system. Personally I like the balance of switching it up 50:50. One workout rotation starting with arm and core-heavy compound exercises, then the next rotation starting the workout with my pure chest/back muscles so I can target them without fatigue.
It all depends on your goals IMO. Barbell OHP is probably your best bet for overall fitness and strength. If you specifically want to isolate/target the front delts, then a seated variant with back support is better.
I use the sitting overhead sholder press machine. It hits the sholder for sure, but I've never felt it test my core. Will have to try this with some free weights.
If you feel like your front delts are already weakened after push and they’re strong enough to support all your chest exercises, that’s a reasonable concern
Depends on the application you’re training for. If it’s hypertrophy and maximum muscle activation, specifically the shoulder, then sitting with support better But usually for power lifting I see a lot of em do standing Warning: this isn’t factual and is based on my own personal experience with the exercise
I had similar thout crossing my mind in regads to a dumbell overhead french press. I have weak and unstable shoulders, so its really hard for me to push this exerisese hard, but i know that this exerisese alone could strenghen my serratus and imrove my shoulder stability over time, hopefully one day I will be able to perform that exersise as efficently as possible, to make my puny triceps finally grow 😂
Like with many things in the fitness community it’s more an issue only at like heavier weights and if you’re purely going for working on strength/muscle. For general fitness it’s just fine to do them standing but for the more niche cases you may not be able to push the muscle as much and you increase risk of injury in one more way which can be a detriment to body builders. TLDR: at least 90% of people are better off doing it standing
Both are great exercises, how you apply them is what matters. Sure the standing press is a great movement, but what if you have an injury on the lower body that needs to heal? What if you have a broken leg. There is no such thing as THE BEST exercise, its more so about what fits best for the person doing it.
I find that this exercise stresses my lower lats too much and I only find out later when I'm trying to say move large objects at home. It's had spasms a couple of times after performing overhead press and my back and core are athlete strong so it's clear that this exercise is not for everybody
Another criticism of over head pressing is that it’s not needed , if your doing bench press and dips which is already targeting front delts , how do you feel about that?
You could make the same argument for chest flyes since your chest is already hit on all compound chest exercises enough, chest isolation is significantly more ridiculous to do. Also that’s mainly because too many guys have a bench press obsession and do way too much bench press and other chest volume, you don’t have to do 4 different chest exercises in one workout, that’s overkill. if people did as much rowing as they did benching overdeveloped rear delts would be a thing.
Which is why you do Behind the neck, you get more side delt, slot of the times it's not my front delt that's failing, plus you get more upper back stimulus and if don't feel like it's going deep enough, use a cambered or let the bar ride down into more of a low bar position(which I use for warming up) I take 1.25 shoulder width, I also found the movement curve awkward for OHP but BTN it's a straight line
@@thiagobp0159 I think if you’re trying to hammer your Side delts and upper back at the same time then Lu raises are better, a lot less fatigue for a lot more side delt stimulus. They’re also a great for overhead mobility and shoulder health.
If you could lift more by sitting than standing, then you are leaving gains on the table. If you want to train core then train core. While full body compound exercises are not ideal for hypertrophy, they are useful for saving time and increasing strength. It all depends on your goals and priorities!
you get enough core stimulus with direct core work, plus compounds like DLs and back squats. this shouldn't be a factor for whether or not you do seated or standing. if you care about standing OHP numbers, then do it standing. it's the same argument as machine vs. free weights.
Both you guys are usually mostly correct. But, bottoming out an ohp, so that the weight is hanging on the joint, not the muscle. Less than average. Try a slower eccentric and a pause, just before the bottom. You can thank me later.👍🏻
I do that with Pike Push ups but I think its too much cuz I got wide Ring Rows, Ring Push ups and Ring pull ups I think its too much volume for the traps.. any opinion??
I have the mobility but my shoulders have started clicking and feeling inflamed. I bring it right down to clavicle though, maybe I should limit ROM a bit
OHP trains your side delts loads, and even your rear delts quite a bit. Seated, especially at an angle, doesn’t so much. OHP is king for shoulder development
@ not enough to be the sole exercise, but if you are doing OHP, and your head is actually upright, your rear delts are under stress. The studies show it receives less stimulus but the fact you can lift so much weight with the OHP means that small stimulus is relatively decent
@@unbabunga229So true. Standing Military Press where you push your head through at the top and fully extend your arms overhead is the best way to train your shoulders
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If you train to be able to move in health and strength, do standing ofc.
Agreed
I'd rather be able to bench 500lbs and get gassed when stacking the dishwasher
@@Luke-wz9wc also gotta take roids despite being an office clerk sitting at a computer all day.
@@Luke-wz9wc not getting gassed when stacking the dishwasher is not what's limiting you from benching 500 lbs.
And when do you need that?
This is why I always prefer free weights over machines. The entire body is working to stabilize and as a result you get stronger in every way.
I mean not always
Agreed
I don’t prefer one over the other personally. Machines help to isolate better than free weights when targeting a certain area. For example I prefer machines over free weights when targeting my triceps.
Both are great though
@@dmoon7818for the triceps I agree, I can never hit them well with free weights and always prefer machines or cables
True. Hypertrophy only bros say that any extra fatigue and muscle involvement is bad when it's possible to master the technique of the movement, adapt and make it perfectly stable. This will in turn make you more skilled and functional. Same goes for the barbell row
To be fair big advanced lifters can put so much weight on the bar that the fatigue can really be an issue. Not much of an issue but a feature for a beginner who lifts 100lbs / 40kg for example
@@wojtekimbier Agreed. I think when you start to exceed your bodyweight it might become unstable but most criticisers of the OHP aren't that strong
Your Heisenberg
I think it also depends on you program. If you are doing a full body workout and you've already got squats and pull-ups on the menu as compound exercises, maybe giving yourself a break with seated shoulder press isn't such a bad idea.
@@alaron5698 I agree with squats and deadlifts but pull ups not so much
I have no choice but to sit. I train in a basement and the ceiling is too low to do it standing 😄
Yep same, I like sitting on the floor actually even better
You still train the core with OHP while sitting, as long as you're not leaning against any support. But you don't train legs, obviously.
Do kneeling
@ hurts lower back
Yeah, you can “stand” on your knees! That way you still get functional movement with your toes tucked or untucked
Mario rios would be proud
Lololol
now change "proud" with "touched"
@@petznassloukas7124now replace "touched" with "get money"
Lol yea cause he sure made it popular to do the OHP
He’s a 🛎️end
Fatigue in the core is a feature, not a problem with the standing overhead press.
Rather save that fatigue for squats and deadlifts. Of course depends on your goals and programming
@ do squats and deadlifts first
You guys know that there's more than one day in a week right? I did squats and deads today and tomorrow I'm doing OHP. See how easy that was?
@@AlgernonBrosplitz 🤓
I'd rather have my shoulders be the limiting factor than my core if I'm doing a shoulder exercise.
One of the greatest lifts
one of the most underrated lifts
@marck10ish and one of my favorites
So right, isolation is overated, our body needs to work in harmony.
i totally agree
I agree. I think the body needs to be strong everywhere and in every direction to be truly safe from training injuries. Compound movements are generally the best all round in my opinion.
Depends on goals. Yeah, for most people you are spot on. I am a person, who wants to maximize muscle growth, with the goal of one day (multiple years from now) to compete in a natural bodybuilding show.
So for me, doing overhead press would cause to much fatique, compared to the ammount of muscle build. Also, my core being a limiting factor, would mean less muscle being build in my shoulders.
Therfore, isolating the shoulders and core on different excersices is better for me
@@jonaspetersen3072 only isolation work i do is side delts and upper traps. but given that bodybuilding isnt a sport, i agree.
Always great to do both 👍🏾 I work the same muscles twice a week so I rather the different varieties.
I built abs from only doing overhead press. This guy is right
Oh come on now. 😂 You build Abs by doing a calorie deficit. Nothing more nothing less. Stop the bs😂
@ So abs have zero response to stimulus even training 5x a day? You listen to too many influencers bro
@@onaroad2riches736 calorie deficit is the key. Again, nothing more nothing less. Stop spreading fake news in this world.
@@kapitantutan69 there's a difference between how strong your abs are and whether they are visible or not. you are speaking about the latter
@@kapitantutan69 to correct someone with laughing emojis while being completely wrong yourself is incredible work
Mario rios is somewhere happy rn
Having strong shoulders is completely underrated nowadays, from a hypertrophy standpoint point you don’t have to do ohp but from a strength standpoint yes you have to do some sort of vertical press if you want strong shoulders, doing lateral raises isn’t going to get you super humanly strong shoulders, neither is benching, the only
Way to get strong shoulders that can press a lot of weight overhead is to press a lot of weight overhead.
I bite my shoulders and they get stronger 💪🏻💪🏻💪🏻💪🏻💪🏻💪🏻
@@wargreymon2024I bite my pillow to work the glutes
You don’t need to do that standing though
@@JROB447 To get stronger, more capable and have more growth in other parts (as well), it's great to implement the ohp, without being seated on the bench
Humans virtually never have any call to lift anything overhead with straight arms in the manner of an overhead press
I’m aiming to be able to do a handstand push up so overhead press is a must! Once I can push 70% of my body weight for about 8 reps I should have enough power to do it. I’m at about 55% right now hopefully in about 4-6months I’ll be there
I’ve been training to do handstand pushups aswell but I’ve only been doing dips, handstands, push ups and pike pushups to train for it. Do you think the overhead press would be a good addition?
@jesseanthonyvanderwegen you gotta incorporate progressive overload,otherwise there's no point in training to get stronger for those goals.
@@jesseanthonyvanderwegeni would say so since they work the most similar motion and are simpler and easier to overload than the pike push-ups, though i wouldnt ditch those too
i think doing handstands and pike pu's for technique and specifity and ohp to be sure you have the raw strenght for it would be best
I’ve been doing a reverse pyramid for OHP. Do 6, drop the weight 10%, do 8 and drop the weight another 10% and do 10. It’s worked well for increasing the weight as, as soon as I can get 8 from the first set I put the weight up 2.5kg… I’m at 70% BW for my first set of 6 at the moment, aiming to be able to lift BW overhead.
@@jesseanthonyvanderwegenyes because you can progressively overloading better
Definitely, the problem I see with overhead press is that it's easy to suffer from injury. It's definitely an excercise to go lighter than you can on, and carry out with perfect form.
If you're purely bodybuilding, then sit down. But for the rest of us concerned with total body health, stability, and overall real life function, then standing is hands down better.
Okay but name 1 scenario in real life where you’re ever pressing more than 10lbs over your head on a regular basis. Even if you’re working in a warehouse and lifting boxes, very unlikely that you’re ever going to need to be able to OHP more than 50lbs in your every day life…
@@havenless3551 NAme one scenario? I live next to a warehouse buying and selling grains and fertilizer. Workers there regularly lift 25-50 kg sacks most days.
@@havenless3551any type of construction job. I used to work at a solar company and we would two man overhead press panels into place.
@@havenless3551WHOS GONNA CARRY THE BOATS?
Especially because all of your other exercises are already on point for hypertrophy. There's no need to do your ohp seated.
It’s all about what your goals are.
1) do you want the best stimulus for your shoulder muscles for hypertrophy/strength
-seated
Or
2) do you want a more fatiguing compound movement that targets not only the shoulders but the core as well along with raising the heart rate a little more.
-standing
Exactly. If you do some intense sets of OHP it will generate a lot of fatigue, which might decrease the efficiency of the remaining workout, or if you do it at the end you might not have the energy left to fully max out on OHP. As a bodybuilder who wants to train muscles which as much intensity as possible, this just wastes and requires a lot of energy that could be spent elsewhere instead, but for other people this might work really well for their goals
It’s all about goals. If your goal is functional strength and mobility, then yes forcing yourself to stabilize will train your core and shoulders better. But if your goal is bodybuilding, then doing a variation that requires you to stabilize your core brings some of the focus and attention out of your shoulders and hinders your ability to target those muscles.
Standing military press is a staple in my shoulder training. I especially like being able to cheat a few reps at the end using my legs to initiate the drive.
I started doing OHP to improve my bench press and I’ve stoped doing bench press because I enjoy doing OHP far more!
They're completely different exercises what you mean you stopped bench press cause of OHP?
@ it’s a press, they’re not completely different. If you improve your OHP you’ll improve your overall pressing movements.
Bench press gets boring after years of doing it…
My OHP is 80% my bench for same reps so pretty slanted in that direction, and I find taking more than maybe 4 days off bench, my bench drops quickly. Sure, I have a pretty stable form on bench, the shoulders help in that regard, but pecs still need that direct stimulus.
@@manmoth4 OHP will always be lower than BP, you don’t have anything supporting your back to help you push more. If you’re losing strength after 4 days, you’re definitely doing something wrong.
I don't do this very often now, but back in the day, I'd find a weight that I could dumbbell OHP for about 8 reps, then do my standing OHP directly in front of an high Incline bench. When you hit like 2 RIR for the standing OHP, immediately sit down on the bench and continue pressing until you match your standing number. That's one set. By the end of three or four, your front delts should be pretty cooked, but you kinda get the benefits of both positions while getting the additional volume that you would get from the seated OHP.
To be fair big advanced lifters can put so much weight on the bar that the fatigue can really be an issue. Not much of an issue but a feature for a beginner who lifts 100lbs / 40kg for example
You’d have to be super advanced
I'm not that advanced, do 90kg for 6, but still find it wipes me out. Knees trembling after first set, need to sit down, every other exercise afterwards drops a rep immediately lol. But it does get better once I've done a certain weight for a while and acclimatised.
Military Press was what made my shoulders really grow
I think the biggest criticism of the shoulder press is that a developed front delt won’t add that much to your physique and it’s also hit a ton through regular pressing that you’re already doing
i feel like youtube is slowly moving towards understandig how human bodies work. great job!
i reccomend implementing both. because you want your shoulder to get fatigued first, so they grow. but strengthening your core isn’t a bad thing either
I feel like my back will snap in half
Agree full body activation is better rather than Isolation
Start with the overhead press, then go to the machine to fully tax the muscle without having to worry about form or stability.
As dr Mike would say; no wrong answers, only different applications
If you’re training solely for shoulder hypertrophy, the standing OHP is not optimal
If you care about literally anything else - functional strength, etc. then it’s a great exercise
different goals, different training. i dont like the standing overheard but i'm definitely looking for the muscle hypertrophy aspect in that exercise.
I love overhead press. It's one of those exercises that is simply fun. 🤷♂️
More people need to hear this!
Just stick to the basics of training. Squats, Deadlifts, Presses, Rows, Pull-Ups, Dips. It's that simple. Isolation is incredibly overrated. And if you want for the main lifts Squat, Bench, and Deadlift you can even throw in some of their variations to your routine as well. Most importantly go heavy. 3-6 reps for all your exercises. You will progress way faster, get stronger, and you will build a lot of muscle. If you want a lean, strong, and pretty jacked body that is functional then do this.
I absolutely love the OH press, i am not the strongest at it, but it's sometimes my favourite movement. Sometimes when i feel poor to workout, some OH press reps get everything going, its an impressive looking movement too. Don't skip the OH press boys, it's a great movement
They all critisize Mario..but at the end of the day... Everyone knows he is right
For beginners in the gym I would say to start with standing, just to build up that core along with your shoulders and triceps as this sets you up for success in other movements
The issue with overhead press isn’t that it’s fatiguing, it’s that it’s redundant for most lifters
That too, but fatigue is also an issue, not just with this but with many compound lifts
The overhead press is a superior workout is all I heard from this: core activation total body stability etc . Seated press is fine if you want sore muscles 💪
Never felt my shoulders before I started doing the overhead press
Thanks for all your helpful tips for all these times!!
Doing overhead press is the most manly alpha lift you can do. Nobody does them and even if you're not strong you'll still look badass doing them and your shoulders will grow very fast!
I love overheads and the stability it requires so i do it. I hate squats and the stability they require so i do them in the smith to just get the stimulus. Do what makes your workout enjoyable so you keep showing up.
I always train major lifts both ways. I like to emphasize strength and explosiveness on unsupported movements like standing presses, squats etc, and focus more on contracting specific muscle groups with seated presses, leg presses etc.
the collab i didn't know i needed
Depends on your objective. If you want to build stability the standing overhead press is better since you'll also be building your delts. For just delts, use a bench
If I wanted to strengthen my core, I’d focus on core exercises. Adding stability in an exercise is just wise and time efficient
people in my gym criticize me for doing standing dumbell press, i just want a strong core mannn
I hit core/low back enough with squats, deads, front squats and dedicated core work. I do all my overhead work seated right now
For those with any back issue, the loading on the spine isn't all too ideal either.
All about goals imo: if you don’t care about core stability, and just want growth, go seated; if you want core stability or Generally more functionality, standing or even Z-press
From a body builder, this is the worst of all shoulder exercises if u want to build muscle. C tier
Hang clean and press is my favorite lift. Taxing, but makes you strong AF.
It just depends on what ya want. Optimizing hypertrophy you may want to sit. For athletics or general health stand.
Yeah. Totally agree.
I do it seated. Massive gains over the last 4 years. Only been doing this and rear delta. 2 exercises are enough when you do serious progressive overload
Don't know about being stable after a couple of weeks. If you constantly fatigue your whole body throughout your workout, you won't push your core near failure much when you target it. I think this is a great mindset when you've already exercised your core for 4-6 months with targeted exercise. Before that, you might not have the general energy to sustain a workout like that. Though you might reach that ability faster if you start training from an already very active lifestyle.
That's something that's generally the other way around with other muscle groups, where targeting becomes more important the more advanced you are. But the core generally is really behind for beginners, doesn't take very long to make progress on, and really wears you out while it's weak, so it's a great example for an exception there. Along with arms, which you don't want to target and fatigue all the time before you've done your chest/back workouts, because you wouldn't be able to push your chest/back to failure anymore if your arms are already dying after three reps. Same with your core exhausting your nervous system.
Personally I like the balance of switching it up 50:50. One workout rotation starting with arm and core-heavy compound exercises, then the next rotation starting the workout with my pure chest/back muscles so I can target them without fatigue.
Mario rios is smiling rn
mind blowing concept- do both
wall assisted handstand push ups are a great variation, give em a try
It all depends on your goals IMO. Barbell OHP is probably your best bet for overall fitness and strength. If you specifically want to isolate/target the front delts, then a seated variant with back support is better.
I’m here for FitnessFAQ headband guy.
Love over head press but my left shoulder is injured rite now have to wait to heal
Military pressing fatigues me more than heavy deadlifts. But there is no better feeling than an overhead pb!
Well explained 👏 thanks
And pretty high risk of injury in relation to other similar exercises. If ur going for strictly hypertrophy, overhead press isn’t your best option
I use the sitting overhead sholder press machine. It hits the sholder for sure, but I've never felt it test my core. Will have to try this with some free weights.
im not sure if i should stop doing this exercise cuz the front delts are already getting a lot of work from push exercises
If you feel like your front delts are already weakened after push and they’re strong enough to support all your chest exercises, that’s a reasonable concern
I view it like the biceps in a row. Yeah, it helps, but need a primary movement for them
Bro is doing philosophy about shoulders
Depends on the application you’re training for. If it’s hypertrophy and maximum muscle activation, specifically the shoulder, then sitting with support better
But usually for power lifting I see a lot of em do standing
Warning: this isn’t factual and is based on my own personal experience with the exercise
I had similar thout crossing my mind in regads to a dumbell overhead french press. I have weak and unstable shoulders, so its really hard for me to push this exerisese hard, but i know that this exerisese alone could strenghen my serratus and imrove my shoulder stability over time, hopefully one day I will be able to perform that exersise as efficently as possible, to make my puny triceps finally grow 😂
FACTS. 100. RESPECT.
Like with many things in the fitness community it’s more an issue only at like heavier weights and if you’re purely going for working on strength/muscle.
For general fitness it’s just fine to do them standing but for the more niche cases you may not be able to push the muscle as much and you increase risk of injury in one more way which can be a detriment to body builders.
TLDR: at least 90% of people are better off doing it standing
I started doing overhead presses again a couple weeks ago like I used to oh my early 20s and I forgot how much I loved the results
Both are great exercises, how you apply them is what matters. Sure the standing press is a great movement, but what if you have an injury on the lower body that needs to heal? What if you have a broken leg. There is no such thing as THE BEST exercise, its more so about what fits best for the person doing it.
Looking like Prison Mike with that bandana on😂 Love it guys
Can this be replaced with handstand pushup?
Could also do it on a smith machine - less core engagement required especially if you have issues that prevent you from engaging your core like I do.
what issues do you have that prevent you from engaging your core?
With the standing variation you can use leg drive when fatigued and still get a good controlled eccentric on the way down.
I love this duo
I hate seated shoulder movements. I've only ever done the OHP for front delts and it's the most goated movement imo.
Exactly I do squats and thrusters for my core work out
I find that this exercise stresses my lower lats too much and I only find out later when I'm trying to say move large objects at home. It's had spasms a couple of times after performing overhead press and my back and core are athlete strong so it's clear that this exercise is not for everybody
Overhead press is such a goated exercise
Another criticism of over head pressing is that it’s not needed , if your doing bench press and dips which is already targeting front delts , how do you feel about that?
You could make the same argument for chest flyes since your chest is already hit on all compound chest exercises enough, chest isolation is significantly more ridiculous to do. Also that’s mainly because too many guys have a bench press obsession and do way too much bench press and other chest volume, you don’t have to do 4 different chest exercises in one workout, that’s overkill. if people did as much rowing as they did benching overdeveloped rear delts would be a thing.
Which is why you do Behind the neck, you get more side delt, slot of the times it's not my front delt that's failing, plus you get more upper back stimulus and if don't feel like it's going deep enough, use a cambered or let the bar ride down into more of a low bar position(which I use for warming up) I take 1.25 shoulder width, I also found the movement curve awkward for OHP but BTN it's a straight line
@@thiagobp0159 I think if you’re trying to hammer your Side delts and upper back at the same time then Lu raises are better, a lot less fatigue for a lot more side delt stimulus. They’re also a great for overhead mobility and shoulder health.
@William1683BT agreed I used to use them as a shoulder opener exercise, or now warming up for bench
They really be saying getting tired while an exercise is a bad thing
If you could lift more by sitting than standing, then you are leaving gains on the table. If you want to train core then train core. While full body compound exercises are not ideal for hypertrophy, they are useful for saving time and increasing strength. It all depends on your goals and priorities!
Everyone says don't do overhead press as front delts are overstimulated from chest work anyway
you get enough core stimulus with direct core work, plus compounds like DLs and back squats. this shouldn't be a factor for whether or not you do seated or standing. if you care about standing OHP numbers, then do it standing. it's the same argument as machine vs. free weights.
I prefer ohp. Can make up the lack of range of motion by going heavier
Both you guys are usually mostly correct. But, bottoming out an ohp, so that the weight is hanging on the joint, not the muscle.
Less than average.
Try a slower eccentric and a pause, just before the bottom.
You can thank me later.👍🏻
If fatigue is a problem for you, it's easy to solve. Just watch more videos and stop training. :D
The main criticism of ohp is that it targets only front delts
Not correct
Exactly my thinking. Give it time the strength will come. No need to isolate. You won't be isolating saving someone in the real world 😜
Barbell OHP gives me a crick in my neck/shoulder blade for like a whole week every single time
But the strength you gain from BB Stand OhP is absolutely worth
Same applies to bent over row.
"don't do that, you'll work more muscles", "soo, why is this a problem?"
I do that with Pike Push ups but I think its too much cuz I got wide Ring Rows, Ring Push ups and Ring pull ups I think its too much volume for the traps.. any opinion??
The problem with the barbell OHP is that it requires a level of shoulder mobility that some people (me) don't have.
what do you do instead?
@@patrickjulius7352I use kettlebells or dumbbells, as they allow more flexibility
I have the mobility but my shoulders have started clicking and feeling inflamed. I bring it right down to clavicle though, maybe I should limit ROM a bit
OHP trains your side delts loads, and even your rear delts quite a bit.
Seated, especially at an angle, doesn’t so much. OHP is king for shoulder development
I didn’t know it worked the rear delts
@ not enough to be the sole exercise, but if you are doing OHP, and your head is actually upright, your rear delts are under stress.
The studies show it receives less stimulus but the fact you can lift so much weight with the OHP means that small stimulus is relatively decent
@@unbabunga229So true. Standing Military Press where you push your head through at the top and fully extend your arms overhead is the best way to train your shoulders
@@MartinJohnsonIIIit doesn’t
@@vytas5584 didn’t think so but read above comments ^