You critize her for not understanding an 800 page book while you can't even do basic reading comprehension It's not a "review" it's a "rant" it says right in the title
@@nicolassalamanca8051 I tried to read Twilight but I had already read Anne Rice. The latter is a proverbial wolf hunt while Twilight is warm puppy chow by comparison...
@@TacticalBunnyCA I tried to read twilight, and I saw the movie, then I discovered underworld. Give me Kate Beckensale in that outfit with guns over Bella any day. But then again no one hates working on those movies more than Kristen Stewart and Robert Pattinson
@@tgiacin435 Honestly I don’t rate Undeworld much higher then Twilight. Yes vampires should be sexy but Underworld the film (i don’t know if there’s a book) tried way too hard to be the Matrix. There should always be something dark an ominous about vampires. And in my “humble” opinion a “vampire” that does not prey on humans means the writer needed an excuse for the character to be gothic and sexy with superpowers.
Paul isn't the chosen one. The Bene Gesserit are shown in the book to manipulate cultures and religions for their own purposes. They are the ones who introduced the messiah myth to Dune. So from the perspective of the book Paul is only the chosen one because of manipulation and myth seeding. I've read all 6 of the original Dune books and manipulation from those who hold power is pretty much the only constant. If anything Dune is a story that turns the chosen one thing on its head since even the good guys use and take advantage of manipulation on a cosmic scale.
Yes but I don't agree with the chosen one part. I think he is portrayed as the chosen one because it's not just the manipulation of the Bene Gesserit on Arrakis which formed the view of Paul as the messiah but he really is the chosen one in some way. The Bene Gesserit myth seeding on Arrakis was for protecting the endproduct of their breeding program, the Kwisatz Haderach if he ever gets in trouble with his Bene Gesserit mother on Arrakis so they have the Fremen to protect them. So the thing is not that they had this myth seeding which lead to a view on Paul as a Messiah while he didn't was but he was one because he was the Kwisatz Haderach and had all the abilities to look over time and so on. Maybe I also just didn't get the point of the chosen one, I think he is one but as a negative form of the chosen one which shows the dark sides of the chosen one but it doesn't mean that he isn't the chosen one. Please don't understand me wrong, I really love the books and can't agree with the video, I'm just also not agreeing with your explanation why she's wrong.
@@anubisgod23 Ah okay no I get what is meant by that. My answer is not 100% correct but also the father of the chosen one is very special and not just because of myth seeding. It's just that what I wanted to point out, Paul is very special and not just in the myths and threw manipulation. That's the way I understood the first comment
Respect for reading the whole book before giving an opinion! At least you gave it a try. I love Dune, and the philosophical aspects but it's not for everybody.
so i’m reading it and have no idea what i’m reading can you explain to me just what this is about and everything? no need to be careful of spoilers cause i don’t care if it gets spoiled.
@@derekpeele1131 if you are still confused I would recommend the channel Quinn’s ideas. He knows a lot about dune and has lots of videos about the books
I tried to read Dune when i was 20. Nope. Way too tedious and loooonnnngggg. Read about half and then just gave up. Read it again at 31. Holy fucking shit. This is epic.
I still have hope. I’m 24 and I finished dune last week. And I hated it. 2/5. So boring. I’m hoping that when I’m older I’ll enjoy it more. Because I’m sure I’ll like different things at some point.
I'm reading it now at the same age and I couldn't read past the first 2 pages. Kinda tried to figure out why I dont then I compared it to Sherlock Holmes and Moby Dick, and yeah...you're getting thrown details and people with full dialogue exchanges a couple of lines in....you don't know who or what they're talking about or why any of it is important but none of it was built on like the books I mentioned
I read the thing a month ago and absolutely loved it. And tbh I can see if the start of the novel threw you off. The way Herbert writes is very different from the standard mystery/crime novel way of relaying information. Essentially, in any given scene in Dune you can get in the minds of any single person and know exactly what they are thinking. As for the other major thing that can throw you off, it is of course the constant use of unknown to the reader terms. The copy I found online had an entire codex at the back of the book for all the jargon that Herbert uses. It also had quite some text about the history of the world and the factions at play. It is certainly more than enough to cover you for the book but another, faster way to do it is to simply have the wiki at hand in order to search for some stuff. If you don't want any spoilers through that though I would suggest that you avoid reading anything about the Benne Gesserit/prescience/spice from there for reasons you will understand if you read the book. All in all, for some reason I loved the writing. To the point where I found people criticizing it delusional. Tbh, it is understandable and I believe that I liked it more than the average person would just because it hit a niece in me. But yeah, I suggest getting around 50-100 pages in before you decide to leave it.
I’m 14 and trying to read it and it makes no sense whatsoever. Herbert just blasts you with all these characters and terms and so much stuff happens with very little explanation. I’m sure the book gets better later on but right now this book is so unbelievably boring.
@@8OBO8 No. DUNE is 412 pages. Not 200 of 600, but 412. In DUNE, the 1st book, not the DUNE SERIES..as she only read book 1, PAUL is portrayed as a messiah. PERIOD. So, her understanding is on par, however Liminality's reference ot :"it makes it pretty clear early on" is NOT accurate. You do not realize Paul is a stepping stone until Children of Dune. So, since she read dune, and only dune,(Thats the Shoenherr cover, so it's the large print version, double the pages) she would have no idea Paul is STILL not the "chosen one" or however she put it, unless she read 2 more books... Now, you said 200 pages per book...I gotta say, I think you;'ve confused the Sci Fi show and an assumption, with the books.
@@iLightbulb How would i know? Her book is Dune. Not Dune messiah, Not children of dune, not dune heretics, god-emperor...etc...It;s Dune. Paul is the "messiah" or as she calls it "Chosen 1" from page 1 to page 797 (409 if your reading the standard print size). There is no declaration, implication, or subtle nuancing, that Paul is one in a long line of whatever, BEYOND the Bene Gesserit breeding program, WHICH conveys ominous tones, as she disobeyed and gave birth to a male and not a female, leading you to follow the narrative that HER action inadvertently created the sleeper/messiah/chosen one...I am pretty sure Herbert had no idea where he was going after book 2. If you READ and comprehend what is there, it seems pretty unmistakable that the tone was to end at book 2, with the messiah fading into the sun as he enters the desert. To him Paul WAS the end all. That was also blatant in Books 1 and 2 as well :) I think a LOT of people have read the books, forgotten bits and pieces, then watched the Scifi series or the Lynch movie , and allowed a little of this and that to alter what they read as they remember. Because YOU and Spinhoeza both made declarations that make no sense at all as they are empaticly incorrect
He is not a chosen one, he was written specifically by Frank Herbert from the beginning to be a warning toward fanaticism. I would encourage you to read the rest of the dune books. Things go downhill, and Paul must face serious consequences that set the stage for the entire Saga.
Why should anyone care about Paul facing consequences? Why should anyone care about Paul period? He's just another random rich kid with a dead dad and superpowers. Oh, it turns out he was a bad guy? When was he ever a good guy? What one good thing did he ever do that wasn't just self interest? When did he ever have a relatable emotion for me to empathize with? Who cares if he was recontextualized if he was painfully boring to begin with? That only works with well written characters that people actually have strong feelings towards, but my only feeling towards Paul is that he is aggressively boring and the writing behind him was aggressively mediocre.
@@scipioamericanus6711 He wasn't recontextualized Herbert set out from the beginning to make him an example of what happens when fanaticism goes too far and most readers fell for it when the book came out. “Privilege becomes arrogance. Arrogance promotes injustice. The seeds of ruin blossom."
@@MdGuardian1032 I was just using the OP's language when I said recontextualized, but yes, Herbert uses visions and princess excerpts to repeatedly bludgeon us with Paul becoming a dark and fanatical force in the world right from the beginning. That said no, my criticism is not that Paul becomes a Tyrant, it's that he isn't a believable character. He has no consistency whatsoever. He goes on a lifelong crusade against the people who killed his father, but he casually considers murdering his mother for no reason. He's extremely mature when the plot requires it, then nearly throws a fit and jeopardizes his and Jessica's lives when the Fremen don't respect him enough on first meeting him. His powers are achieved through no effort of his own and are poorly foreshadowed, and they only serve to make him less relatable as a character. In fact, we never see him doing anything relatable period. He doesn't feel love or loss in a human way, even before he gets weird visions, and we don't see any strong likes, dislikes, or personality traits. Paul doesn't show us how an ordinary man can become the focal point of religious devotion and fanaticism, he shows us how an emotionless superpowered prescient emotionless machine child can assemble an army of ridiculously overpowered desert people into a revenge army with almost no effort (side note, the entire living in the desert makes the fremen the greatest warriors ever plot point is beyond stupid. Desert survival =/= man to man combat ability, they're at best highly specialized terrain specific troops, and would likely fair poorly in urban, jungle, or cold weather warfare). It would be interesting to see an ordinary young man having his mind warped by grief and buying into his own cult of personality, and it would be interesting to see how a cult develops around such an individual as good intentions give way to fanaticism. Unfortunately Herbert appears to have been incapable of writing normal humans of any kind, much less showing how they can change for the worse under religious intoxication. I never implied that I read the sequels, and indeed, I don't intend to. If Tolkien or Orwell can convince me of their merit in a single novel (and Dune was not a short novel), then Herbert should have been able to do the same. If his story needed multiple novels worth of space to breath, then he should have built in more interesting sub plots. Besides, his prose is awful. Most of his character interactions are strictly tell don't show, with each character describing how they feel about themselves, those around them, and their situation in their thoughts rather than demonstrating them through actions and dialogue. It's frankly amateurish, and I refuse to call it a product of its time after seeing how much better written 1984 was over a decade earlier. From a technical perspective it's a terrible novel, and I honestly don't know how it's been shielded from criticism so well thus far.
@@scipioamericanus6711 I agree with all of this. And I read all 6 books because I thought maybe it'll get better. Spoiler: it didn't. Leto II is even worse than Paul. Duncan Idaho is the only character that was even slightly interesting until you realise he's just a Gary Sue and a blank slate so that we can project into him. This book has plenty of great ideas and concepts and themes, no doubt about it but it's not a good piece of fiction. If I were to compare it to anything it would be Tolkiens works like you already said. LOTR had huge themes and ideas but it wasn't just that. I don't know why people say these books are so epic. I felt disappointed tbh. And the new trailer has come out for Dune and I just feel disappointed all over again lol.
@@aishaarshadalam3412 Ouch, sorry for your time lost. I think people compare it to Tolkien because of its heavy themes and worldbuilding, but miss the fact that people actually generally love Tolkien's characters, songs, and action scenes just as much as his world, and while some have difficulty getting into his prose, my own experience with it, and that of everyone I know who read LOTR, is that it is different, but once you find the rhythm in it it's actually very enjoyable. Of course The Hobbit is just an easy breezy joy to read, but then it is more of a children's book. Even Herbert's fans generally criticize his prose and characters, and attribute the shortcomings to being dated, but when The Iliad and the Old Testament are more readable, I really don't think that excuses it. Honestly I'm not sure how to feel about the trailer. The new movie at least won't have to suffer under Herbert's awful prose, and hopefully the actors can bring some actual life to the characters, so it may be able to become decent, though to be honest the way Hollywood is in general these days I'm not super optimistic. At least it will be much, much shorter.
1 Paul isn’t “the chosen one” he’s the product of a genetic breeding program and a cautionary warning about charismatic leaders. I think you missed a lot of the political, ecological and religious commentary. Like seriously you said you can’t see what the point of the story is ... it has multiple themes such as charismatic leaders being dangerous. The idea of an economy revolving around once resource. Read “ spice “ as “ oil”. Ahhhh I could go on for ages 😂😂😂 .
@@turk3067 I dont mean this in any kind of mean way, but i think youre absolutely right. I think if you choose to devote your actual attention to it it becomes a much more pleasant read. I too took months to read it, but each time i picked it up i restarted it. the final time i went all the way through i got it done in about 3 days, and that final time it was a delight.
I think she read it hoping it would be more akin to a young adult adventure sci-fi rather then a philosophical piece told through the lens of a sci-fi epic that it actuallyis
@@colinmclaughlin4104 in the context of the story he is kind of the chosen one, but that's the point. The whole story is Herbert critiquing that kind of narrative
Dune the book is so much more than a story, it is a study of the “human” condition and how we are all imperfect and internally flawed. The science-fiction was groundbreaking when first written. There is a power struggle which typifies all human societies both in the past and even to this day.
@@Bipolar_Weasellol clearly this applies to you as well. Trying to sound intelligent over a science fiction novel. you're just a butt-hurt fanboy at the end of the day
@@HyabusaAbdel You jumping in to defend her "rant" while using phrases like (fan boy) clearly dictates that you have the same problem as her. Publishing a crummy video on UA-cam in an attempt to justify your low IQ while simultaneously getting views is pathetic. The best part is when people like you try to defend this type of utterly useless content. People like you and her should probably stick to books with pictures.
@@crimsongrimstone jeez forgot about this video. I wouldn't call it a jump as more of a step, lol. And I assume that you are the high IQ genius huh. Honestly the only thing that's pathetic here is (dare I say it?) FANBOYS who are so salty that someone dared say something that isn't praise about what they like. But I'll tell you what the next time I go to the bookstore I'll take a detour into the kids section and look for picture-book about whiny little bitch-ass fanboys like you ♥️.
"If you dont know about this book, I don't know if I can explain it..." The book touches on so many different analogies. Maybe that was what made it unpleasant for you? That it tried to be relevant in too many ways? Tyrannical governments, the spice being analogous to fossil fuels, special interests behind the scenes pulling the strings (the Spacing Guild, Benne Gesserit, etc), the danger of eugenics, ecology and the environment. There is a lot going on. Ultimately what it is about is the danger in trusting a charismatic leader. Paul wasn't granted special powers, he had been the result of centuries of genetic manipulation. And, because the bene gesserit placed a prophecy with the Fremen, Paul was able to fulfill it, regardless of whether it was what he wanted. In the end, the movement that he ends up creating becomes far bigger than himself, and he cannot stop the coming war. The book is a cautionary tale.
Thank you. You were the first kind person to explain this that I've read so far. I always felt really bad for Paul actually. He's very angry with his mother He didn't want to be their savior, and ended up doing it out of self-preservation, only to gain so much clarity that he was terrified of the impending blood. Not every charismatic leader is a bad person and some do do great things, albeit imperfectly and it usually works better when there's a group of like minded people so long as the power doesn't corrupt the majority of them. And him being this good is rare for somebody who does drown the world and blood. Usually it's a crippling addiction to power while pretending it's all for a good cause. I really liked the book even if I felt it could be pretentious at times and certainly the next two books got far too blatant and long winded, admittedly I actually just watch the mini series now for those two now, though there are good things, certainly. I really enjoyed God Emperor and so on, however.
It's very hard to define what Dune is about or put it into a genre because it has just so much going on. War, politics, prophesies, economics, world-building, love, etc. I used to joke and say it cheats at being a book because it's got so much in it.
In other news, Walt Whitman was a sap, Citizen Kane is too self-important, Kurt Vonnegut is too sarcastic, the Beatles were too... British... and cheetahs are too fast for their own good. Why are they in such a damn hurry?!
@@fagelhd I first read the Butlerian Jihad, it has more action and interesting things going on, and includes the origins of the space warp technology of the spacing guild. “Holtzman” worked on the science behind it.
Bought dune last summer and tried to get through it, read like 100 pages and just forgot about it. A couple months later I was substitute teaching and I brought it with me for my break period and got lost in it for an hour or so. Forgot about it again until I got called up for national guard duties and brought it along due to its length. 3rd times the charm I couldn’t put the book down and somehow read through the whole thing in 4 days
@Rory O'Connor and it's an idiot plot of the highest order. I can't stand Dune because many of the machinations lead nowhere, and the entire enterprise on making a messiah and how it is made seem ridiculous. So, idiot plot.
I have found there to be no real depth to Dune at all. All the main characters have the emotional maturity of a toddler getting emotional for absolutely no reason, and conversations doesn't hold water (eyyy). Characters introspect a lot and there is a lot of "quotations" of philosophy which leads nowhere other than maybe facebook status. Also, the protagonist is in my opinion one of the most unlikable. I mean he is basically the son of God or something. His "chosen one" status makes Harry Potter look like a prophecy made by a magic 8 ball. Great setting and imaginative world, but damn...it could have used a lot more time in the oven.
It's my favourite book, and Dune is by far my favourite "universe". That said, when it comes to Dune, there are only really two opinions. You either become utterly obsessed with it, or you find it boring and tedious. So don't worry, there are plenty of people who agree with you, even if I don't. It should also be pointed out that Dune is very much a series of books. But if you didn't enjoy Dune, you almost certainly will not enjoy the rest of the books. Oh, also. The Brian Herbert/Kevin Anderson Dune books are utter rubbish. Please don't read those!
My brother actually wasn’t hooked from the first page like my, but he kept reading the second book cause I bought it any way and the third book and he got to the big pay off and than he became completely obsessed, and we ended up reading all of them, (including all of the prequels….) And we have this thing when if we both want to read the same book we take turn on which one is gonna read it first and than spend than next weak or few days waiting so he could talk about it with the other- so we have read all of dunes books like that (including the short stories).
Agree with the Brian & Kevin statement, but I know of a lot of people who are in the inbetween area. Not quite obsessed, but not bored either. It's easy to say that on a lot of polarizing topics, but there's always a middle ground out there if you look for it. Whether it's a big middle ground or not is uncertain.
@@shahar_maz I'm open to the Brian & Kevin books being good within their own standards, but I've heard enough evidence to suggest that they straight up contradict the original saga's implied history, laws, and universe in general.
Ehh, I think reading Dune is pretty tedious, but it's thankfully always engaging before it gets to a point where I'd rather stop. The movie does an alright job keeping the politics mostly to the background.
I have to remind myself that not everyone likes Dune, and that’s perfectly alright, but I’d hate for someone to be put off reading it because of this video. To me, Dune was the most captivating, nuanced and imaginative piece of literature I’ve ever experienced. While book 2 can kind of feel like a slog sometimes, I’d say it was necessary to the story. No hate
@@thrash208 absolutely. I read the first book many times in my youth 20 plus years ago but always got annoyed thinking it was cut short somehow, but I never did read the second book for one reason or another. currently reading the whole series when I'm not messed up by life distractions and work and that nagging sensation was finally dispelled. It was like a prolonged epilogue to the first book. Could have left it there happily but now I've picked up the third book and know I won't be puttting the rest off now.
@@Indrea13 tldr Paul shows the danger of fanatism by becoming a cruel evil dictator who starts a jihad (but mostly its hinted at and only explored in the 2nd book)
Imagine this chick reading the Illiad. "I mean what's the point of the story stuff just happens" The irony is alot of the books on her channel are pointless YA crap.
respectfully, you're probably someone who only consumes black coffee and (and makes damn sure EVERYBODY knows it, especially those chicks who drink inferior starbucks sugar water) in other words...let people enjoy things. some books are pure entertainment, and that's ok. you don't need to have a life-changing experience to enjoy a good ol' Y.A.
I had Dune recommend to me by a friend who shared my taste in books and on the first read I stopped reading after 200 pages felt it was drag and had too much politics but when I re-read it after like 5 years it was the best novel I read in my life and I asked myself why I hated it on the first go may be because I wasn't mature enough so just come back to it when Ur bit more matured
I found this comment odd because I feel the maturity level of the book isn't that mature. It's boring. CHaracters succuessfully shove aside emotions to deal with the situation at hand and the result is mechanical and dry. I mean, how do you make a book with psychic benet gesseret witches, sand worms and harkonenn and STILL be bored to death? I don't think you need more maturity to appreciate Dune. I think it's simply an overrated series at best.
@@tailong9548this is not a mature assessment of the book. Try again. Maturity required for the book is that of the ability to read subtext and understand context.
@@WallyWakeUp To a point, I would typically agree with your statement. However, I disagree that my statement is immature. Here's why. Let's remember a film scene from the movie "The Story of Us" The author's lit agent leads him to the city skyline window and asks him to look down, describe what he sees. He then goes into a brief monologue about how all these ppl are living their little lives, busily scurrying about, rushing to do things they don't always want to do because they're all going to die one day and they all know it. He then explains this makes the people regard their time as precious. Claiming some sort of intellectual and mature elitism regarding a reading of Dune is counterproductive and simply nonsensical. The book was not published as a literary work. It was published as commercial fiction. Before it was even finished, as far as I've read, the author was contacted by media execs interested in the property, right? I could take what you're selling with a grain of salt but it simply doesn't work. Selling commercial fiction as lit fiction won't draw a crowd. It will draw a cult following, which it has, which sports a supreme 'superiority' in extracting subtext and hidden meaning from otherwise seeming boring circumstances. I get it. However, it may be more mature and beneficial to just admit to yourself that you enjoyed the work, you were able to get something from it other readers did not and that that is ok. As an author, I have to decide if I want my readers to revel in the intelligent subtext and underlying things I don't say or do I want to tell a story. If the former is the case, perhaps a sprawling action saga could include - well, I suppose - a bit more action. Action can also be mature and contain subtext and theme. It's practically baked in if we practice conscious, mature, responsible writing. The fact that you come at me with the accusation of being too immature to appreciate the material is just silly. I don't care if you're Moses. If you can go on for three hundred pages weaving intricate, boring subtext, the only people appreciating that are not overly mature. They're simply very much into the prose, the theme and the material at large. And that's ok. Please don't try to posture a faux elitism of super maturity and intellectual prowess to try and snub critics of the work. That in itself is a bit immature. Cite some real examples, show me exactly how I'm wrong. Clearly, by my response, I must be a bit more mature than you accuse me of. I think I'm mature enough. Fact of the matter is, I DID save this material until later in life when I was much more mature as a reader and while I found the subtext and the cont3extual thematics interesting, I did not find them compelling enough to care about the characters to investigate what happened to them. I guess it also doesn't help that the entire tale is already spoiled but I typically can still discover something by reading old material anyway. Simply wasn't my tea. Extra emphasis on world-building, great texture, shallow character dev (from the get-go, I understand it goes deeper later) and the lack of a hook were simply enough for me to invest my time elsewhere. In fact, the greatest hook was the opening scene of the whole series. Always has been. Too bad the rest of the thing could not keep up that sort of intensity. Also, it doesn't help that the entire arc for the characters is tropey and unoriginal. The entire decade was filled with the same trope so I guess it already had a rough hill to climb. I'm glad you enjoyed but some of us did not. That doesn't mean we're immature or intellectually inferior. Just means different strokes for different folks. Cheers.
@@WallyWakeUp Also realized you may be referring to the occult analogy of the entire story. Yes, I am very much aware of how organized religion has been used to steer the species 'homo homo sapien' throughout the millenia and that the hebrew god is the same as the egyptian deity ra and that the final abomination of the god worm in herbert's work references the demi-urge. Is this the lack of maturity you're talking about? I have spent my entire life learning about the great mystery. Imo, it's the only thing that actually matters. Still feel this series could have told the tale in possibly 3 books with a lot more action and a lot more interesting prose. If this was not what you are referring to, simply disregard. You failed to specify so I'm simply inferring at this point.
@@tailong9548 what a load of pretentious waffle lol. Proving my point. Which was that *your assessment* was immature. No one said anything about Dune being the highest possible quality art with the deepest philosophical viewpoint of reality. The point is, reducing a work that has, whatever one's personal level of enjoyment, reached *millions* over decades is enough to justify someone qualifying it as "mature" and enough to question some pretentious twaddle saying it's "immature". He had something very mature to say about the messiah complex in human nature. The only question is whether he did a good job making his point or not. Awards, sales and decades of appreciation later, the logical answer is *yes, he did*. Not, 'what an immature book'. Dumb.
Guys stop trashing this poor girl, she's allowed to not like a book for whatever reason she wants and she even admitted that she loved the spice and the sand worms which I think most of us would agree are some of the best parts of the book
I didn't get the point of Dune until I read the second installment. It gets into the idea of heros and religion in a really interesting, thoughtful way. Which is weird, because most Dune fans told me it would ruin the experience.
"book without structure" inspires decades worth of sci-fi. Fails to understand Paul being the chosen one is a critical commentary against cult of personality. Basically....the failure to understand a massively popular and influential book series isn't the fault of the author. 0/10 review cred.
It's ok I understand your frustration. I didn't start to fully comprehend and enjoy the book until my third time reading it. Herbert was way ahead of his time and the universe he created is difficult to comprehend on your first read. I first read it in 7th grade and it was too much for me. I Just read it for the 6th time some months back and it definitely deserves the title of "Science Fiction's Supreme Masterpiece"...you'll get there one day too.
I love the book AND the entire series (including the expanded universe). However, I get it. It is not going to be for everybody. I would say, though, that part of the meaning comes out more with subsequent books. I also agree with a previous poster who suggested hearing the audio book instead. Considering the director, I'm betting you'll still love the movie (although the first movie is just the first half of the first book).
I kinda understand where this person is coming from because I had a similar reaction when I tried to read James Joyce for the first time and I just couldn't understand anything of what I was reading. But I realized it wasn't the book that was bad, it was me not having the knowledge and maturity to comprehend the text because of my age and literature experience at the time. I don't think everyone can appreciate the genius of Frank Herbert and the masterpiece that is Dune without having some decent literature experience inside but also outside the sci-fi genre. Having said that, I don't judge anyone for not understanding Dune. But I would encourage anyone who is struggling with it to put it aside for a few years and give it another try at a later stage in life. The book is absolutely mind-blowing once you can understand the themes it sets to explore.
god- what an awful ratio. avid dune fan here but there's no reason for you to have received all the hate here!! my friends have had the exact reaction to the novel- everyone likes what they like-simple as that! happy reading!!!
For me the outrage is because the rant itself doesn't make a point. It is a book about religious zealotry and the economy of power. It's not really a character drama, each character stands for a larger piece of society. If you don't follow the big ideas and only follow the characters then you will miss the point every time. It is a rather superficial read of the book, and honestly, it's a bit of a shame.
Tbf why couldn't that apply to a video also? People like wat youtube videos they like also, and it just so happens that relatively not a lot of people like her views on Dune
Dune is the book that taught me how to read fiction. It forced me to think about what the themes and what the author was trying to say more than any other book. Early on in the book it says something along the lines of “Part of the reason Paul was so effective is that early on he was taught that he could learn things and that there was something to learn from everything.” I think this was a hint from the author not to overlook anything. You probably aren’t interested but I have PDFs of a bunch of literary criticisms of the book that illustrate how much is going on. But you can also find a lot of those things and discussions online. I first read the book sort of aware of some of the themes already which helped me understand some of the others. If I hadn’t then I probably wouldn’t have enjoyed it very much either. One of my favorite things about the book that I never see ANYONE talk about is how the first 3rd of the book the reader knows everything that’s going to happen. You know there’s a traitor and who it is, but the characters don’t and so you watch them trying to figure it out. As the reader you basically can tell the future of the characters. But after that Paul gets the ability to see the future, and from that point on the reader DOESN’T know the future. Paul is always super vague about what it is that he sees. The author shows you what that’s like before reversing it.
This is the type of book, where if you are having trouble understanding it or getting into it, what you need to do is listen to the audiobook. This is my favourite series and I adore this book, it’s one of my all time favourites. But it isn’t gonna be for everyone, and sometimes how you consume something can also have a huge effect. I personally suggest a reread, but with the audiobook instead. What is especially beneficial about the audiobook, is they have voice actors and a great narrator. It is extremely immersive and that is often so much more helpful for first readers from my experience. As for the film, watching that as well will also be helpful in understanding the plot a bit better. But keep in mind it’s just the first half. But here are some pointers that might be helpful: Paul isn’t actually a Chosen One, the whole prophecy is fake and that is a point reiterated over and over, however he IS someone with special powers, but that had to with biology and environment, not prophecy. Which is why the Count is so important at the end of the book. Essentially Paul embarks on a revenge quest after the royal feuding causes his father’s death and him and his mother’s exile. Through this, they meet the Fremen and they use the fake prophecy made by the Bene Gesserit to ensure their survival. A religious cult begins to form around Paul, as he tries to avoid a fate where he leads a religious war across the universe. But in his actions, he begins to loose touch in his humanity. Which is why at the end of the book, when he has made himself Emperor, he realizes he has only just started that dark path and hasn’t avoided it at all. Dune is a story about charismatic leaders and the dangers they pose. Paul is set up to seem as though he is the Chosen One, hero type, but in reality he grows to become a galactic dictator. His arc in this first novel can be most easily summed up as an anti-hero’s arc. After this first book a expansive galactic history begins, influenced by Paul’s actions. This deals with philosophy and political and ecological issues. Such as how humanity effects the environment and how likewise the environment effects humanity. The ways religion and power can corrupt, the way humanity is not separated by good and bad but instead our choices are grounded in morally complex decisions that can have infinite possibilities. This can definitely be a difficult first read for some people, so it’s understandable. Which is why I again suggest the audiobook. It’s seriously a whole other experience.
We'll put. Couldn't agree more. The underlying psychological and philosophical themes of this book is what really sells it to me. It's a lot to take in and first time it's really hard to fully appreciate all the nuance in the book. I've listened to the audiobook 4 times and each time I uncover a new layer. I'm definitely going to listen to it again and the following two books are also fantastic.
I just recently finished dune for the first time. Like you said it is beautifully written. That did make it difficult for me at times to paint the picture in my head Frank Herbert was trying to paint. In terms of not seeing a story, it's hidden behind symbolisms and analogies. It's definitely not a simple, fun, escapism read. My favorite point taken from the book is "validate your premise." Jessica's premise was Dr. Yueh was trustworthy because he had the imperial conditioning. Thufir Hawat's premises were paul was dead, jessica was the saboteur, and he could easily defeat Baron so there was no need to fight him. There are other examples but those were my favorite. I'm reading through it a second time right now to squeeze more out of it. I can't remember the exact quote but at one point a character is talking about how Hawat is already defeated because he assumes an easy victory over Baron so he doesn't even try. That really hit home with me. There are times where I assume victory so I don't try or I assume failure so I don't try. My biggest weakness in general is I act on assumptions of future results. I should spend less time make premises. I hope you give it another chance at some point. While I definitely see Dune as a masterpiece of world building than I do story telling, it does have some big ideas to present about how we treat our planet, how we make decisions, and questioning who we should trust as leaders. Maybe watch some explanation or review videos before you tackle it a second time so you have a little help!
Guys it's her opinion, it's not that serious. You clicked this video because you wanted to be mad and I KNOW half of you are grown men--go mow the lawn, harold. This video isn't for you.
People, you do not have to click on a video where you know she has a harmless opinion that is different to yours and throw petty insults thinking they make you superior and her inferior. The world is not your echo chamber where everyone has to be in agreement. The point of art is different things resonate with different people. Its ok she does not like it. And the suggestions to give it another try are plain snobbery. Life's short, read what you enjoy, why re-read something you didn't enjoy in the first place.
@@clownfucker She criticises the narrative for being unnecessarily detailed/too long. She's missed the point entirely. The reason this is the all-time best selling sci-fi novel is precisely because it doesn't insult the reader and speaks to complex political realities. Life basically. Not to mention it's a captivating story. You should go and see Villeneuve's film, it's clearly produced for the Marvel film franchise viewership. You get all the action and none of that boring exposition this girl complains about. ;)
@@fabiendecodts2584 So she asked to be insulted because she thought that the book was too detailed? That's a bit ridiculous lol. That was just how she felt about the book, it's not like she insulted everyone who enjoyed reading it. She just didn't understand it's message, and she made that clear by saying so. I hope Villeneuve gets to adapt all of the books, would love to see Leto II get turned into a giant worm
I just finished dune and came here to spout my 2 cents. It is a slow-paces book. I feel like this first one is just meant to establish a groundwork for the entire series. Paul is an admirable protagonist but sometimes I feel like I can't distinguish where his admiration for religion coincides with his leadership traits, as in which one does he prefer to do? Lead or follow religion? Or both equally? The conversations between character is written so beautifully. The convos are always my favorite part, and I also liked how Herbert consistently describes what these characters are thinking between their spoken words. It was hard for me to get invested into the bad guys plot(s), as I just wanted to read about Paul and Jessica and Chani the whole time. It definitely begs a re-read for me, or research into plot points i missed. Overall I'd say 3.5/5 personally. I really appreciate his eloquent writing but damn this story took so long to progress. OP was right in saying the worms and spice were the coolest parts, along with the few fights/duels which caught my attention the most. I'm really excited for the movie, the casting looks amazing and I think I'll start the 2nd book soon to see how it holds up.
Listening to her opinion on Dune is as listening to someone who has never left their home town in the midwest explaining how stupid it is that they went to Spain and everyone was so rude by only speaking Spanish.
@@Bipolar_Weasel No. She has "Spain" in her hand. She can clearly see what she sees. I think your childish simile shows you to be one of those idiots who think he is the smartest person in the room, without realizing he is par or worse. I think the intelligent thought you expected her to apply, is lacking in your minor dissection of her review. You whine, cry, sniffle a little bit, lash out, and do not bother reflecting on the "why" or "how" of the review. Ah, to be young and stupid again :) Try that in the future. Your 1st reaction gets typed out, but do not post it. Then sit back and ask why/how and see how you change...or keep being a fanboi reacting from feeling rather than thought, pointing fingers at someone and being the same...:) later gator
„He is the chosen One, you know how this Storyline usually goes.“ Nah you don’t, until you have read the next chapters. Dune is one of the only series, that does actually something very interesting whith that kind of a Story Device. But I can understand that you did not like it, it’s really not a easy Reading Experience, however the first 4 Books of the Series are my favorite books of all Time.
It's a shame you didn't you didn't enjoy it ,I would definitely recommend the audiobook, having voice actor play different roles and hearing the ambient music in between chapters really helped in getting a sense of the characters and a feel for the universe. It is a confusing story at times and the writing style can be a bit overwhelming but I think the mystery of the story and the way it deconstructs the hero's journey makes it quite worthwhile in the end but then again, I only started the audiobooks after seeing the film so I already had a vague idea of what was going on 😄.
Been forever since I read it but I remember reading and not being too impressed with his writing when it came to the dialogues and drama. Don't get me wrong, it is a must read and it is a work of a genius(should be on school reading lists). However, towards the end I remember it would jump around too much and didn't flow right. Got too slow and meandered too much. Can't remember but there was stuff that also seemed silly and pretentious. I enjoyed more the overall ideas like the planet ecology, cultures, neo feudalism/mercantilism/monopolism etc b/c it was like a history book written in the future-that is the part he absolutely nailed. I think he tried to put too much in one book. I put him up there with Philip K. Dick (my favorite) who also has big flaws
What's it about: Psychologically: How might people function cognitively after tens of thousands of additional years of human evolution? Sociologically: How do people make and destroy their own prophets? Philosophically: Can people be somehow connected across vast space and time? The plot doesn't fit concisely into a single book, but think of Dune merely as a prophet's origin story. Then the subsequent books are much more enjoyable.
Listening to the audio book makes it much easier to understand and digest. In between listening to chapters I’ll research them to make sure I’m fully aware of what’s going on. I suggest you listen on audio if you were to attempt this again.
Yes Terrie I agree. Listening to a story engages other aspects of the mind and provides quite a different experience. Listening is the primal and original intake of stories. Books are relatively new. I don't think you can look down on readers or listeners. Or I guess (film) watchers. Different strokes for different folks. We are not all the same.
I mean I don't blame you for not understanding it. People who are making fun of you or getting angry to you back for being completely lost of the book needs to learn to put themselves in your shoes! Not everybody's gonna understand a single book. You can't expect everybody to get the whole plot of it. I just saw the movie adaptation part 1 and the conflicts were all over the place talking about Paul's visions, places they went, the royalty, etc. Miranda, ignore the haters, I understand what you are feeling.
omg yeah i bought dune when the movie was being made and read it at work and a lot of guys were excited that i was reading it and wanted to talk to me about it but i just didn’t like it that much. i saw someone say it was a white savior story and that kind of makes sense, a white dude going to another planet and becoming the ruler, and it’s just such a colonizer mindset to me, not to mention the whole planet is in a drought and water is this precious resource that everyone fights over and it’s just never really a problem that they have to deal with (unless i’m forgetting something, it’s been a while) like they have the suits and 2 gallons of water and that feels kind of off too and paul has all these visions about the future and how he’s going to become this great ruler and he doesn’t want it to happen but it happens… like what’s the point! i see what you mean about not knowing what it’s about. there were some elements of the world building i found interesting that i wished were expanded on more but weren’t, too, which is probably a hot take because there’s so much world building but i wish it focused on different things i guess but i completely agree i wish i liked it as much as other people seem to lol
OK, It took me several attempts, over the course of my first marriage to finally finish reading Dune. And then I devoured the rest of the series that was available in 2000. Dune really is a tough read, but it is ultimately just to set up the universe and lay the foundations for the rest of the books, there were meant to be 7 total, but when his son split the plot of the last one into 2 books, so there's a total of 8. and they cover just under 5000 years of human history, though there are some significant time jumps (IE The end of Children of Dune is roughly 3500 years before the start of God Emperor of Dune which ends roughly 1500 years before the start of the final 4 books of the series). I'd say try to read it again in a couple of years. I honestly read the main books at least every couple of years (the ones written by Frank). But I really do love the story and I always find new things about it that I missed the last time around.
I don't think Dune made just to set up the sequels in the saga. I don't think Frank Herbert planned on making sequels at all to be frank (no pun intended). Dune is a well crafted narrative that stands on it's own (though it has its flaws). The sequels however, do not stand on their own given the nature of sequels. You can make the argument that Paul's arc isn't complete without Dune Messiah, in which case I might agree with you, but that doesn't mean that the first book is dependent on Dune Messiah for completion as a narrative.
Dune is the result of “imagination diarrhea” it’s what happens when you decide to take a bunch of good ideas from different genres and crap them all together. It’s the most ridiculously overly complicated set of stories for no other reason than “just cuz” The way it’s praised, at least to me is undeserving. I think people lie to themselves when they act as though Dune is this amazing story. It’s not…They’re poorly imagined stories that try to deceive the reader by adding more and more parts that the reader has to try and understand and somehow gullible fools think that makes a story meaningful and deep and well written. It doesn’t…Dune, is a contrived, lazy and shallow. It’s easy to just keep making up words and names and places to throw into your story. Like constantly adding ingredients into a stew. Not because they go well together, but because they look good to you. That’s what the Dune series feels like to me. A giant stew that although isn’t bad, doesn’t need so many ingredients. It’s overwhelming for absolutely no reason!
The central metaphor of the book is that it's a commentary on our reliance on oil, and how the Western countries have exploited the Middle Eastern countries in their need for oil to power their economies. The other central concept is not to trust charismatic leaders, to always question their true intentions... (Ok next bit needs a spoiler alert, but I'm guessing you'll not be reading any of the sequels) Paul goes on to start a Galactic jihad, killing billions in the process, and making entire planets uninhabitable... Paul is not meant to be the hero of the story, he's intended to be a warning.
Personally, I love Dune, but I understand where she's coming from. Everyone tells you that a book is an amazing classic and how influential it is, and then you read the book, and you think "meh, I just don't see the greatness, it kinda sucks". That's how I feel about _On the Road_ by Jack Kerouac. When I finished _On the Road_ , all I could think was "how can such a small book be so boring."
I don't understand the confusion. The story in a nutshell is that, in a universe where politics has devolved into a feudal structure, Paul is a 15-year old Gary-Stu whose father is a Duke. The Duke is given a fief by the Emperor on the planet Dune, a desert planet that is rich in a commodity called Spice that is vital to the Imperial economy. But the gift to the Duke is a trick and he is betrayed and killed. Paul and his mom, escape the assassins and must use their knowledge and wits to trick the locals into following them to raise an army to overthrow the emperor and get revenge for Paul's Dad. In the midst of all the worldbuilding, that is basically the plot. I would never say that you have to like the book or rate it highly as these things are subjective and it seems this didn't entertain you, but the plot wasn't that confusing.
There is a ton of symbolism in Dune, and if you’re not being an “active reader” (only focusing on what you’re reading) you’re going to miss how everything connects together beautifully. It’s an amazing book that maybe given a bit of time and researching some of the issues you took with the book could warrant another try. The audiobook is excellent, by the way, if you like those. Given time, of course.
I absolutely second the audiobooks! They are excellent and can be found on UA-cam a lot of the time. That’s how I am reading the series. It also helps to read the summary/analysis from sparknotes. It’s not the most complex analysis, but it helps you to grasp the basic concepts.
Absolutely. I’m not a reader at all but I just came through the subject Butlerian Jihad. I searched and end up understanding the imaginations of Herbert in a short review about Dune. I understand that He imagined a world about lazy humans controlled by machine thinking and artificial intelligence. Now I’m super interested and curious about to know his speculations but same time I don’t want to read that essay like novel I’m may be lazy.
@@jazz5931 I think you would like the books then, the world is a direct consequence of the butlerian Jihad (though many many generations after) with certain humans trying to unlock their inner potential and utilise this instead of relying on machines. But humans are still human so some humans become mere contraptions for powers that be to reach an end goal, ideals and myths become vehicles for control and other humans are treated no better than the old AI. The mass population is still essentially lazy in thought and will and now submit to the control of computer like humans with vast messianic or "messianic" goals(Depending on who you ask or which characters thoughts the writer is exposing). It's essentially about fighting the tryany of complacent thoughts.
I'd suggest trying again when you're older (mid-30s?) where the "ten pages of nothing" suddenly have a lot more meaning. I read so many things while growing up that, upon re-reading later in life, seem to draw upon my life experiences much more. Regarding the point or message of the book... does it need one? Especially knowing that it's the first of a six-part saga. There are several messages throughout the saga but they're not immediately apparent from just the first book.
Setting aside what disagreements we undoubtedly share relative to the merits of this book, props to you for posting your reaction to the first installation of a series with an almost rabid following. You must’ve known you’d be mocked and skewered and, frankly, it took some serious cojones to earnestly and unflinchingly invite that reaction. That said, while I can’t fault you for failing to understand its underlying concepts, I became disappointed when I heard you express regret for having read even its first page. I understand that was likely a hyperbolic characterization of your experience, but if there’s one thing I urge you to reconsider, it’s that takeaway in particular. There’s a reason this book is cherished by so many who have read its pages and your efforts to do the same has exposed your mind to what forms the basis for why we cherish it. Even if not consciously realized at present, they may become so with experience. I assure you that if you return to this novel later in life your reaction then will impress upon you the worthwhile nature of the endeavor you should be proud to have pursued.
I love Dune but it's always good to hear other people's ideas. I HATED Chapterhouse: Dune (6th book). I had a similar experience in forcing myself to read through it, though it was out of completionism or respect for the author/series. I tried to watch the Dune movie from the 1980s. I just could not get into it. My interpretation of Dune is far better than what little I saw of that movie. I've pretty much sworn off seeing other movies based on it.
Dear reader, Dune is likely far too hard for you. It’s ok. It’s too hard for most people. But, if you persevere, reread, ponder... it will change you. It will awaken a perspective change in who you are, and as we all know... being forced to change is painful. These days, who tolerates having to work for entertainment?
I disagree that Dune is a difficult book. Also a book being easy or difficult to read vs good or bad are two different criteria. A book can be difficult and excellent or it can be difficult and a bad read. Dune was just not for me I can say doubtlessly, though I finished the whole novel and understood all that happened. Its ok that its not for everyone. Going a step further in my opinions the novel Dune is not for most people. And thats ok because you love it. And no one should or can take that away from you. Discussing the book with others is already a blessing.
You just don’t understand - it’s a story as old as humanity. Messiah fights back and creates a new empire by overthrowing the old order. However the new order quickly corrupts itself and recreates what it aimed to replace.
Just finished it, I honestly thought it was the best piece of fiction I've read since childhood, and I'm in my mid-twenties. I had similar thoughts about the world building and the character development being spectacular, but what really hooked me were just how many underlying philosophical elements were present in the book. I also liked the pacing of the book overall, I like that it started slowly and allowed time to build the world from the ground up. The pace gradually kept getting faster throughout the story though. It's cool to see how people can have such different opinions about the same book, thanks for reviewing it!
I just wanted to thank you for posting this rant/review. I'm currently struggling to read Dune, and came to UA-cam to watch some reviews that would help me understand if I should continue or not. I felt so understood! And curiously your review and its comments, much more than other gushing reviews, is what gave me the push to keep going. Like you, I don't think I'll enjoy it, but it seems like it's something interesting to explore anyway.
Dune can easily overwhelm you. It takes a while to understand the world and the jargon. Sometimes you need to give it a fresh start. I know it sat on my bookshelf for a few years in high school before I actually tried to read it.
Hey I get DUNE’s a tough read, but I highly recommend giving it a re read or listen with an audiobook. I’m a seventeen year old dude who’s greatest literary accomplishment is reading thru the eye of minds by James dashner (ugh), so DUNE was a big surprise for me as a reader! Was it hard to get sometimes? Yes. But on second reading and since I know what’s happening already and why, I think you’ll enjoy it a lot more! Also, a thing people forget about DUNE is that even though it is a novel, it’s not technically supposed to be the typical sci fi thriller blah blah lol. It’s like you said-beautiful world building. It’s like Frank Herbert wanted to make a novelized history book/psychology documentary, so it can be a tough read. But I loved it all the same, and listening to the audiobook made it ten times more interesting and exciting. Can’t wait for the movie!!!
thank you so much for this feedback!! i think i'll probably take a break and let out more steam before picking this book back up again, but your comment makes me want to give it a second try! thank you! :)
People do not love Dune because it’s “beautiful” with a pretty setting and prose. People love it because they can analyze and debate over this book and its themes 50 years on. You’ve completely missed the point and embarrassed yourself on this. I’m honestly embarrassed for you that you lack such basic analytical skills to believe by the end of the novel Paul is still “your textbook chosen one”, the entirety of the book and the series as a whole is that charismatic leaders like him usually are not what is really good for you. Literature is all about analysis, that’s most people’s favorite part. Sorry if that is a bit much for you.
@@RangerDanger224 Their “opinion” of the reason why people love Dune is wrong. That’s my claim dummy. She can have everything else, but she’s wrong on that part man.
Cause it's not an easy book? I mean... Even the author was annoyed at how many people and fans weren't understanding his first book, that he had to wrote a 2nd book to make it more clear. That shows how it's not for everyone
I don't get why some people in the comments are being so mean to you hahah. As a HUGE fan of the novel, I know that it's not an easy read because it's so cerebral. But the world building and the characters was what brought me into it aswell and if you just invest a little more time in the lore of the book, i bet you will like it in the future. Dune is that kind of book where you constantly read about things without getting the hang of the meaning of certain events, because it's included in the lore built for the book itself. Therefore, it requires the reader to look up these certain things which is a huge turn off by first time readers. I recommend checking out the channel "Quinn's Ideas" here on youtube, he explains it all very pedagogically. I would give everything to experience this book for the first time again because when you finally start to get the hang of it, you're obsessed.
I read four of these books cause my husband is super into the series. Second book was a little better… third book was okay. I hate the fourth book. And I am back to just hating the series as a whole. I feel you.
Just because she expressed her opinion on not liking the book, which is against your opinion doesn’t make her wrong...she didn’t enjoy it, she said it.
Of course a book that is more than half a century old is going to be a bit boring and includes a lot of tropes that are done to death today. You understand that, but Dune is a book that really doesn't stand well on its own and has to be in context of Messiah, Children of Dune, etc. Especially Children of Dune, is often seen as the defining book. Frank Herbert is pulling things out in such a bore, as it is planned to be part of the whole. But I get you and I hope the movie will do better at giving it a proper narrative that respects telling a contained dramatic story and not just "read the whole series n00b"
This was a great vid. Sorry you didn’t love it, I adore this book and the rest of the series myself. Highly recommend you tubers Quinn’s Ideas and ComicBook Girl 19, they both have a bunch of great videos breaking down these books. A common joke in the fandom is “it gets enjoyable about half way through your second read.”
Maybe you should listen to the audiobook... and just enjoy it. All those post it notes make it clear you approached it as a study manual instead of a story to just enjoy. It’s not a text book, its not a headline or a video game, it’s a story. Trust me, listen to the audiobook. Yes, it’s complicated- or maybe very in depth.... But only the first time you read it (listen to it) It’s most definitely worth your time
My interpretation about Dune is it is ultimately about ecology. All the factions play their part Harkonnens, Atreides Freeman and others, but the Planet itself is the main focus point.
God Emperor (he is a sandworm, btw) is my absolute fav. The first book is a basic story. It is meant to be a Messiah origins story (with the commentary that the Messiah was 'set up', but was born before it was supposed to happen, with also Paul lamenting his destiny). it gets better, imo. First book is mostly just a set up for the universe's future.The second book kinda throws Paul out of the savior tropes. I guess my point is the first book alone isn't much a 'story'... Or perhaps it is the most 'story' like of all of them as it takes you on Paul's journey with him, as Messiah stories do. Also, keep in mind Herbert loved to drop acid as he wrote. And I am not saying, "go read all other books now!". Hahah Just justifying how I spent so much time with the series I suppose.
Omg so many dislikes! I didn't think that this review would warrant so much dislike 😅 Never read this book, I definitely will (read or listen) in the future but I don't appreciate cult following of anything. Hope you didn't get too much hate along with the dislikes! 😊
Your eagerness to have a discussion on this book is encouraging. I would strongly recommend re-reading this book in 5 to 10 years and come back to this video and comment. I think you’ll be rather embarrassed. I tried reading this book when I was 13 and ended up doing a quick skim and did not enjoy it or understand it. I read it again in my 20s and was blown away.
I've never seen someone make so many notes while reading but still not get the main jist or it.
I mean no disrespect to her but its almost like she just skimmed through it and then threw some post its through out.
I know, all those post-it notes to try to make it look like she was 'studying' it. Funny...
She spent several months (trying to) read(ing) it too!
In her defense, it is a dense dry but sweetheart, I really want to explain so much
i wanna know what notes she took. She mustve taken notes on everything outside of what the book is about.
Then she Proceeds to give twilight novel 10/10
You critize her for not understanding an 800 page book while you can't even do basic reading comprehension
It's not a "review" it's a "rant" it says right in the title
@@nicolassalamanca8051 calm down vampire fanboy its a joke
@@nicolassalamanca8051 I tried to read Twilight but I had already read Anne Rice. The latter is a proverbial wolf hunt while Twilight is warm puppy chow by comparison...
@@TacticalBunnyCA I tried to read twilight, and I saw the movie, then I discovered underworld. Give me Kate Beckensale in that outfit with guns over Bella any day. But then again no one hates working on those movies more than Kristen Stewart and Robert Pattinson
@@tgiacin435 Honestly I don’t rate Undeworld much higher then Twilight. Yes vampires should be sexy but Underworld the film (i don’t know if there’s a book) tried way too hard to be the Matrix. There should always be something dark an ominous about vampires. And in my “humble” opinion a “vampire” that does not prey on humans means the writer needed an excuse for the character to be gothic and sexy with superpowers.
Paul isn't the chosen one. The Bene Gesserit are shown in the book to manipulate cultures and religions for their own purposes. They are the ones who introduced the messiah myth to Dune. So from the perspective of the book Paul is only the chosen one because of manipulation and myth seeding.
I've read all 6 of the original Dune books and manipulation from those who hold power is pretty much the only constant. If anything Dune is a story that turns the chosen one thing on its head since even the good guys use and take advantage of manipulation on a cosmic scale.
Yes but I don't agree with the chosen one part. I think he is portrayed as the chosen one because it's not just the manipulation of the Bene Gesserit on Arrakis which formed the view of Paul as the messiah but he really is the chosen one in some way. The Bene Gesserit myth seeding on Arrakis was for protecting the endproduct of their breeding program, the Kwisatz Haderach if he ever gets in trouble with his Bene Gesserit mother on Arrakis so they have the Fremen to protect them.
So the thing is not that they had this myth seeding which lead to a view on Paul as a Messiah while he didn't was but he was one because he was the Kwisatz Haderach and had all the abilities to look over time and so on.
Maybe I also just didn't get the point of the chosen one, I think he is one but as a negative form of the chosen one which shows the dark sides of the chosen one but it doesn't mean that he isn't the chosen one.
Please don't understand me wrong, I really love the books and can't agree with the video, I'm just also not agreeing with your explanation why she's wrong.
@@thomasagelidakis2062 No he isn't. His son is the chosen one
@@anubisgod23 Ah okay no I get what is meant by that. My answer is not 100% correct but also the father of the chosen one is very special and not just because of myth seeding. It's just that what I wanted to point out, Paul is very special and not just in the myths and threw manipulation. That's the way I understood the first comment
Respect for reading the whole book before giving an opinion! At least you gave it a try. I love Dune, and the philosophical aspects but it's not for everybody.
so i’m reading it and have no idea what i’m reading can you explain to me just what this is about and everything? no need to be careful of spoilers cause i don’t care if it gets spoiled.
@@derekpeele1131 if you are still confused I would recommend the channel Quinn’s ideas. He knows a lot about dune and has lots of videos about the books
Slow down. If your having a hard time pretend like the book is made of beef jerky, whereas Dr Seuss is mashed potatoes.
@@debacofzomb9889 yeah when I was reading it the first time I reread many sentences so I could make sure I got it before i moved on
@@derekpeele1131 spice spice spice spice spice
I tried to read Dune when i was 20. Nope. Way too tedious and loooonnnngggg. Read about half and then just gave up.
Read it again at 31. Holy fucking shit. This is epic.
I still have hope. I’m 24 and I finished dune last week. And I hated it. 2/5. So boring. I’m hoping that when I’m older I’ll enjoy it more. Because I’m sure I’ll like different things at some point.
I'm reading it now at the same age and I couldn't read past the first 2 pages. Kinda tried to figure out why I dont then I compared it to Sherlock Holmes and Moby Dick, and yeah...you're getting thrown details and people with full dialogue exchanges a couple of lines in....you don't know who or what they're talking about or why any of it is important but none of it was built on like the books I mentioned
I read the thing a month ago and absolutely loved it. And tbh I can see if the start of the novel threw you off. The way Herbert writes is very different from the standard mystery/crime novel way of relaying information. Essentially, in any given scene in Dune you can get in the minds of any single person and know exactly what they are thinking.
As for the other major thing that can throw you off, it is of course the constant use of unknown to the reader terms. The copy I found online had an entire codex at the back of the book for all the jargon that Herbert uses. It also had quite some text about the history of the world and the factions at play. It is certainly more than enough to cover you for the book but another, faster way to do it is to simply have the wiki at hand in order to search for some stuff. If you don't want any spoilers through that though I would suggest that you avoid reading anything about the Benne Gesserit/prescience/spice from there for reasons you will understand if you read the book.
All in all, for some reason I loved the writing. To the point where I found people criticizing it delusional. Tbh, it is understandable and I believe that I liked it more than the average person would just because it hit a niece in me. But yeah, I suggest getting around 50-100 pages in before you decide to leave it.
same. just 15 and 38 . epic . holy fucking shit.
I’m 14 and trying to read it and it makes no sense whatsoever. Herbert just blasts you with all these characters and terms and so much stuff happens with very little explanation. I’m sure the book gets better later on but right now this book is so unbelievably boring.
Paul definitely isn't the chosen one, quite the opposite actually. That's established pretty early on
Actually? No it is not. You need to re-read bud. You're confusing elements of Book 2 and 3, with someone reading book 1 by itself
@@iLightbulb I think he means book 1 of three in the original novel. Dune is split into 3 roughly 200 page parts.
This moment when they compare Paul with Luke Skywalker
@@8OBO8 No. DUNE is 412 pages. Not 200 of 600, but 412. In DUNE, the 1st book, not the DUNE SERIES..as she only read book 1, PAUL is portrayed as a messiah. PERIOD. So, her understanding is on par, however Liminality's reference ot :"it makes it pretty clear early on" is NOT accurate. You do not realize Paul is a stepping stone until Children of Dune. So, since she read dune, and only dune,(Thats the Shoenherr cover, so it's the large print version, double the pages) she would have no idea Paul is STILL not the "chosen one" or however she put it, unless she read 2 more books... Now, you said 200 pages per book...I gotta say, I think you;'ve confused the Sci Fi show and an assumption, with the books.
@@iLightbulb How would i know? Her book is Dune. Not Dune messiah, Not children of dune, not dune heretics, god-emperor...etc...It;s Dune. Paul is the "messiah" or as she calls it "Chosen 1" from page 1 to page 797 (409 if your reading the standard print size). There is no declaration, implication, or subtle nuancing, that Paul is one in a long line of whatever, BEYOND the Bene Gesserit breeding program, WHICH conveys ominous tones, as she disobeyed and gave birth to a male and not a female, leading you to follow the narrative that HER action inadvertently created the sleeper/messiah/chosen one...I am pretty sure Herbert had no idea where he was going after book 2. If you READ and comprehend what is there, it seems pretty unmistakable that the tone was to end at book 2, with the messiah fading into the sun as he enters the desert. To him Paul WAS the end all. That was also blatant in Books 1 and 2 as well :) I think a LOT of people have read the books, forgotten bits and pieces, then watched the Scifi series or the Lynch movie , and allowed a little of this and that to alter what they read as they remember. Because YOU and Spinhoeza both made declarations that make no sense at all as they are empaticly incorrect
I weep for Humanity.
"Is it called a glossary" 😭
Don't worry Miranda; your IQ is so low that your opinion is unimportant.
Also; the book story isn't slow: you are.
Someone has a different opinion, what should we do?
@@kablamo9999 Lol...you actually have to be intelligent to have an opinion...🤣🤣🤣
You can use the pages from Dune to wipe out your tears, and your self-inflated nerd arse too by the way.
He is not a chosen one, he was written specifically by Frank Herbert from the beginning to be a warning toward fanaticism. I would encourage you to read the rest of the dune books. Things go downhill, and Paul must face serious consequences that set the stage for the entire Saga.
Why should anyone care about Paul facing consequences? Why should anyone care about Paul period? He's just another random rich kid with a dead dad and superpowers. Oh, it turns out he was a bad guy? When was he ever a good guy? What one good thing did he ever do that wasn't just self interest? When did he ever have a relatable emotion for me to empathize with?
Who cares if he was recontextualized if he was painfully boring to begin with? That only works with well written characters that people actually have strong feelings towards, but my only feeling towards Paul is that he is aggressively boring and the writing behind him was aggressively mediocre.
@@scipioamericanus6711 He wasn't recontextualized Herbert set out from the beginning to make him an example of what happens when fanaticism goes too far and most readers fell for it when the book came out. “Privilege becomes arrogance. Arrogance promotes injustice. The seeds of ruin blossom."
@@MdGuardian1032 I was just using the OP's language when I said recontextualized, but yes, Herbert uses visions and princess excerpts to repeatedly bludgeon us with Paul becoming a dark and fanatical force in the world right from the beginning. That said no, my criticism is not that Paul becomes a Tyrant, it's that he isn't a believable character. He has no consistency whatsoever. He goes on a lifelong crusade against the people who killed his father, but he casually considers murdering his mother for no reason. He's extremely mature when the plot requires it, then nearly throws a fit and jeopardizes his and Jessica's lives when the Fremen don't respect him enough on first meeting him. His powers are achieved through no effort of his own and are poorly foreshadowed, and they only serve to make him less relatable as a character. In fact, we never see him doing anything relatable period. He doesn't feel love or loss in a human way, even before he gets weird visions, and we don't see any strong likes, dislikes, or personality traits.
Paul doesn't show us how an ordinary man can become the focal point of religious devotion and fanaticism, he shows us how an emotionless superpowered prescient emotionless machine child can assemble an army of ridiculously overpowered desert people into a revenge army with almost no effort (side note, the entire living in the desert makes the fremen the greatest warriors ever plot point is beyond stupid. Desert survival =/= man to man combat ability, they're at best highly specialized terrain specific troops, and would likely fair poorly in urban, jungle, or cold weather warfare).
It would be interesting to see an ordinary young man having his mind warped by grief and buying into his own cult of personality, and it would be interesting to see how a cult develops around such an individual as good intentions give way to fanaticism. Unfortunately Herbert appears to have been incapable of writing normal humans of any kind, much less showing how they can change for the worse under religious intoxication.
I never implied that I read the sequels, and indeed, I don't intend to. If Tolkien or Orwell can convince me of their merit in a single novel (and Dune was not a short novel), then Herbert should have been able to do the same. If his story needed multiple novels worth of space to breath, then he should have built in more interesting sub plots. Besides, his prose is awful. Most of his character interactions are strictly tell don't show, with each character describing how they feel about themselves, those around them, and their situation in their thoughts rather than demonstrating them through actions and dialogue. It's frankly amateurish, and I refuse to call it a product of its time after seeing how much better written 1984 was over a decade earlier. From a technical perspective it's a terrible novel, and I honestly don't know how it's been shielded from criticism so well thus far.
@@scipioamericanus6711 I agree with all of this. And I read all 6 books because I thought maybe it'll get better. Spoiler: it didn't. Leto II is even worse than Paul. Duncan Idaho is the only character that was even slightly interesting until you realise he's just a Gary Sue and a blank slate so that we can project into him. This book has plenty of great ideas and concepts and themes, no doubt about it but it's not a good piece of fiction. If I were to compare it to anything it would be Tolkiens works like you already said. LOTR had huge themes and ideas but it wasn't just that. I don't know why people say these books are so epic. I felt disappointed tbh. And the new trailer has come out for Dune and I just feel disappointed all over again lol.
@@aishaarshadalam3412 Ouch, sorry for your time lost. I think people compare it to Tolkien because of its heavy themes and worldbuilding, but miss the fact that people actually generally love Tolkien's characters, songs, and action scenes just as much as his world, and while some have difficulty getting into his prose, my own experience with it, and that of everyone I know who read LOTR, is that it is different, but once you find the rhythm in it it's actually very enjoyable. Of course The Hobbit is just an easy breezy joy to read, but then it is more of a children's book. Even Herbert's fans generally criticize his prose and characters, and attribute the shortcomings to being dated, but when The Iliad and the Old Testament are more readable, I really don't think that excuses it.
Honestly I'm not sure how to feel about the trailer. The new movie at least won't have to suffer under Herbert's awful prose, and hopefully the actors can bring some actual life to the characters, so it may be able to become decent, though to be honest the way Hollywood is in general these days I'm not super optimistic. At least it will be much, much shorter.
1 Paul isn’t “the chosen one” he’s the product of a genetic breeding program and a cautionary warning about charismatic leaders.
I think you missed a lot of the political, ecological and religious commentary. Like seriously you said you can’t see what the point of the story is ... it has multiple themes such as charismatic leaders being dangerous. The idea of an economy revolving around once resource. Read “ spice “ as “ oil”. Ahhhh I could go on for ages 😂😂😂
.
That’s just “the chosen one” with extra steps!!! -Morty voice
@@turk3067 I dont mean this in any kind of mean way, but i think youre absolutely right. I think if you choose to devote your actual attention to it it becomes a much more pleasant read. I too took months to read it, but each time i picked it up i restarted it. the final time i went all the way through i got it done in about 3 days, and that final time it was a delight.
I think she read it hoping it would be more akin to a young adult adventure sci-fi rather then a philosophical piece told through the lens of a sci-fi epic that it actuallyis
@@colinmclaughlin4104 in the context of the story he is kind of the chosen one, but that's the point. The whole story is Herbert critiquing that kind of narrative
its like watching a 6th grade book review
I blame the schools.
I'll stick to Reading Rainbow over this disingenuous millennial valley girl bullshit.
It’s a really good review. Don’t get butthurt.
@@DanielNyong
Its very amusing i give that, but good is hardly an adjective which fits this video.
@@DanielNyong I hope she sees this, bro.
Dune the book is so much more than a story, it is a study of the “human” condition and how we are all imperfect and internally flawed.
The science-fiction was groundbreaking when first written.
There is a power struggle which typifies all human societies both in the past and even to this day.
Coming on camera and telling everybody you don’t understand nuanced politics and philosophy isn’t exactly a review.
Nick very well said!
It literally says book rant...she didn't enjoy the book
@@Bipolar_Weasellol clearly this applies to you as well. Trying to sound intelligent over a science fiction novel. you're just a butt-hurt fanboy at the end of the day
@@HyabusaAbdel You jumping in to defend her "rant" while using phrases like (fan boy) clearly dictates that you have the same problem as her. Publishing a crummy video on UA-cam in an attempt to justify your low IQ while simultaneously getting views is pathetic. The best part is when people like you try to defend this type of utterly useless content. People like you and her should probably stick to books with pictures.
@@crimsongrimstone jeez forgot about this video. I wouldn't call it a jump as more of a step, lol. And I assume that you are the high IQ genius huh. Honestly the only thing that's pathetic here is (dare I say it?) FANBOYS who are so salty that someone dared say something that isn't praise about what they like. But I'll tell you what the next time I go to the bookstore I'll take a detour into the kids section and look for picture-book about whiny little bitch-ass fanboys like you ♥️.
"If you dont know about this book, I don't know if I can explain it..."
The book touches on so many different analogies. Maybe that was what made it unpleasant for you? That it tried to be relevant in too many ways? Tyrannical governments, the spice being analogous to fossil fuels, special interests behind the scenes pulling the strings (the Spacing Guild, Benne Gesserit, etc), the danger of eugenics, ecology and the environment. There is a lot going on.
Ultimately what it is about is the danger in trusting a charismatic leader. Paul wasn't granted special powers, he had been the result of centuries of genetic manipulation. And, because the bene gesserit placed a prophecy with the Fremen, Paul was able to fulfill it, regardless of whether it was what he wanted. In the end, the movement that he ends up creating becomes far bigger than himself, and he cannot stop the coming war. The book is a cautionary tale.
Thank you. You were the first kind person to explain this that I've read so far. I always felt really bad for Paul actually. He's very angry with his mother He didn't want to be their savior, and ended up doing it out of self-preservation, only to gain so much clarity that he was terrified of the impending blood. Not every charismatic leader is a bad person and some do do great things, albeit imperfectly and it usually works better when there's a group of like minded people so long as the power doesn't corrupt the majority of them. And him being this good is rare for somebody who does drown the world and blood. Usually it's a crippling addiction to power while pretending it's all for a good cause. I really liked the book even if I felt it could be pretentious at times and certainly the next two books got far too blatant and long winded, admittedly I actually just watch the mini series now for those two now, though there are good things, certainly. I really enjoyed God Emperor and so on, however.
It's very hard to define what Dune is about or put it into a genre because it has just so much going on. War, politics, prophesies, economics, world-building, love, etc. I used to joke and say it cheats at being a book because it's got so much in it.
In other news, Walt Whitman was a sap, Citizen Kane is too self-important, Kurt Vonnegut is too sarcastic, the Beatles were too... British... and cheetahs are too fast for their own good. Why are they in such a damn hurry?!
Lol!!!🤣😂
Lmfao this was hilarious to read
Preach...
An honest criticism of cheetahs and their....um.......speediness
this review pains me
Don't feel too bad, come back to it in a couple of decades. Great books often need years of life experience to unlock all their secrets.
yes for some.. for her life time wont be enough
Yeah, don’t feel bad! I loved dune but no one has to like a book. Your opinions are valid.
I mean: Come on. I'm 19. I love it.
Dune is super clever, but not super hard to understand.
@@fagelhd I first read the Butlerian Jihad, it has more action and interesting things going on, and includes the origins of the space warp technology of the spacing guild. “Holtzman” worked on the science behind it.
to be fair you have to have a very high iq to understand rick and morty
Bought dune last summer and tried to get through it, read like 100 pages and just forgot about it. A couple months later I was substitute teaching and I brought it with me for my break period and got lost in it for an hour or so. Forgot about it again until I got called up for national guard duties and brought it along due to its length. 3rd times the charm I couldn’t put the book down and somehow read through the whole thing in 4 days
Dune is like a filter to separate those looking for popcorn entertainment from those looking for something with depth.
@Rory O'Connor and it's an idiot plot of the highest order. I can't stand Dune because many of the machinations lead nowhere, and the entire enterprise on making a messiah and how it is made seem ridiculous. So, idiot plot.
Yes, those who are looking for depth wouldn't like Dune
I have found there to be no real depth to Dune at all. All the main characters have the emotional maturity of a toddler getting emotional for absolutely no reason, and conversations doesn't hold water (eyyy). Characters introspect a lot and there is a lot of "quotations" of philosophy which leads nowhere other than maybe facebook status. Also, the protagonist is in my opinion one of the most unlikable. I mean he is basically the son of God or something. His "chosen one" status makes Harry Potter look like a prophecy made by a magic 8 ball.
Great setting and imaginative world, but damn...it could have used a lot more time in the oven.
@@roryoconnor79 Lolz xD
@@konstantinriumin2657 Extra looolllllzzz xD
It's my favourite book, and Dune is by far my favourite "universe".
That said, when it comes to Dune, there are only really two opinions. You either become utterly obsessed with it, or you find it boring and tedious.
So don't worry, there are plenty of people who agree with you, even if I don't. It should also be pointed out that Dune is very much a series of books. But if you didn't enjoy Dune, you almost certainly will not enjoy the rest of the books.
Oh, also. The Brian Herbert/Kevin Anderson Dune books are utter rubbish. Please don't read those!
My brother actually wasn’t hooked from the first page like my, but he kept reading the second book cause I bought it any way and the third book and he got to the big pay off and than he became completely obsessed, and we ended up reading all of them, (including all of the prequels….)
And we have this thing when if we both want to read the same book we take turn on which one is gonna read it first and than spend than next weak or few days waiting so he could talk about it with the other- so we have read all of dunes books like that (including the short stories).
@@shahar_maz Cudos to your brother for sticking through
Agree with the Brian & Kevin statement, but I know of a lot of people who are in the inbetween area. Not quite obsessed, but not bored either. It's easy to say that on a lot of polarizing topics, but there's always a middle ground out there if you look for it. Whether it's a big middle ground or not is uncertain.
@@shahar_maz I'm open to the Brian & Kevin books being good within their own standards, but I've heard enough evidence to suggest that they straight up contradict the original saga's implied history, laws, and universe in general.
Ehh, I think reading Dune is pretty tedious, but it's thankfully always engaging before it gets to a point where I'd rather stop. The movie does an alright job keeping the politics mostly to the background.
I have to remind myself that not everyone likes Dune, and that’s perfectly alright, but I’d hate for someone to be put off reading it because of this video. To me, Dune was the most captivating, nuanced and imaginative piece of literature I’ve ever experienced. While book 2 can kind of feel like a slog sometimes, I’d say it was necessary to the story. No hate
Dune sucks dude
@@edsonsouzaneto6251 A very in-depth response! I applaud you sir! Excellent evaluation.
Yeah you really do have to read Messiah or the first book is incomplete
@@thrash208 absolutely. I read the first book many times in my youth 20 plus years ago but always got annoyed thinking it was cut short somehow, but I never did read the second book for one reason or another. currently reading the whole series when I'm not messed up by life distractions and work and that nagging sensation was finally dispelled. It was like a prolonged epilogue to the first book. Could have left it there happily but now I've picked up the third book and know I won't be puttting the rest off now.
@@edsonsouzaneto6251 ehh I can think of plenty of folks who disagree with you. Respect the opinion but what exactly did you not like about it?
"you know how that usually goes" HA you obviously don't. You have an amazingly surface level understanding of this book
Please explain then
@@Indrea13 is he supsposed to explain the whole book or sum
@@Indrea13 tldr Paul shows the danger of fanatism by becoming a cruel evil dictator who starts a jihad (but mostly its hinted at and only explored in the 2nd book)
"Maybe it's my fault." - yes.
🤣
Imagine this chick reading the Illiad. "I mean what's the point of the story stuff just happens"
The irony is alot of the books on her channel are pointless YA crap.
ew bro just ew
respectfully, you're probably someone who only consumes black coffee and (and makes damn sure EVERYBODY knows it, especially those chicks who drink inferior starbucks sugar water)
in other words...let people enjoy things. some books are pure entertainment, and that's ok. you don't need to have a life-changing experience to enjoy a good ol' Y.A.
I had Dune recommend to me by a friend who shared my taste in books and on the first read I stopped reading after 200 pages felt it was drag and had too much politics but when I re-read it after like 5 years it was the best novel I read in my life and I asked myself why I hated it on the first go may be because I wasn't mature enough so just come back to it when Ur bit more matured
I found this comment odd because I feel the maturity level of the book isn't that mature.
It's boring. CHaracters succuessfully shove aside emotions to deal with the situation at hand and the result is mechanical and dry. I mean, how do you make a book with psychic benet gesseret witches, sand worms and harkonenn and STILL be bored to death?
I don't think you need more maturity to appreciate Dune. I think it's simply an overrated series at best.
@@tailong9548this is not a mature assessment of the book. Try again. Maturity required for the book is that of the ability to read subtext and understand context.
@@WallyWakeUp
To a point, I would typically agree with your statement.
However, I disagree that my statement is immature.
Here's why.
Let's remember a film scene from the movie "The Story of Us"
The author's lit agent leads him to the city skyline window and asks him to look down, describe what he sees.
He then goes into a brief monologue about how all these ppl are living their little lives, busily scurrying about, rushing to do things they don't always want to do because they're all going to die one day and they all know it.
He then explains this makes the people regard their time as precious.
Claiming some sort of intellectual and mature elitism regarding a reading of Dune is counterproductive and simply nonsensical.
The book was not published as a literary work. It was published as commercial fiction. Before it was even finished, as far as I've read, the author was contacted by media execs interested in the property, right?
I could take what you're selling with a grain of salt but it simply doesn't work.
Selling commercial fiction as lit fiction won't draw a crowd. It will draw a cult following, which it has, which sports a supreme 'superiority' in extracting subtext and hidden meaning from otherwise seeming boring circumstances.
I get it.
However, it may be more mature and beneficial to just admit to yourself that you enjoyed the work, you were able to get something from it other readers did not and that that is ok.
As an author, I have to decide if I want my readers to revel in the intelligent subtext and underlying things I don't say or do I want to tell a story.
If the former is the case, perhaps a sprawling action saga could include - well, I suppose - a bit more action. Action can also be mature and contain subtext and theme. It's practically baked in if we practice conscious, mature, responsible writing.
The fact that you come at me with the accusation of being too immature to appreciate the material is just silly.
I don't care if you're Moses. If you can go on for three hundred pages weaving intricate, boring subtext, the only people appreciating that are not overly mature. They're simply very much into the prose, the theme and the material at large.
And that's ok.
Please don't try to posture a faux elitism of super maturity and intellectual prowess to try and snub critics of the work.
That in itself is a bit immature. Cite some real examples, show me exactly how I'm wrong.
Clearly, by my response, I must be a bit more mature than you accuse me of.
I think I'm mature enough.
Fact of the matter is, I DID save this material until later in life when I was much more mature as a reader and while I found the subtext and the cont3extual thematics interesting, I did not find them compelling enough to care about the characters to investigate what happened to them.
I guess it also doesn't help that the entire tale is already spoiled but I typically can still discover something by reading old material anyway.
Simply wasn't my tea. Extra emphasis on world-building, great texture, shallow character dev (from the get-go, I understand it goes deeper later) and the lack of a hook were simply enough for me to invest my time elsewhere.
In fact, the greatest hook was the opening scene of the whole series. Always has been. Too bad the rest of the thing could not keep up that sort of intensity.
Also, it doesn't help that the entire arc for the characters is tropey and unoriginal. The entire decade was filled with the same trope so I guess it already had a rough hill to climb.
I'm glad you enjoyed but some of us did not. That doesn't mean we're immature or intellectually inferior. Just means different strokes for different folks.
Cheers.
@@WallyWakeUp
Also realized you may be referring to the occult analogy of the entire story.
Yes, I am very much aware of how organized religion has been used to steer the species 'homo homo sapien' throughout the millenia and that the hebrew god is the same as the egyptian deity ra and that the final abomination of the god worm in herbert's work references the demi-urge.
Is this the lack of maturity you're talking about?
I have spent my entire life learning about the great mystery. Imo, it's the only thing that actually matters.
Still feel this series could have told the tale in possibly 3 books with a lot more action and a lot more interesting prose.
If this was not what you are referring to, simply disregard.
You failed to specify so I'm simply inferring at this point.
@@tailong9548 what a load of pretentious waffle lol. Proving my point. Which was that *your assessment* was immature. No one said anything about Dune being the highest possible quality art with the deepest philosophical viewpoint of reality. The point is, reducing a work that has, whatever one's personal level of enjoyment, reached *millions* over decades is enough to justify someone qualifying it as "mature" and enough to question some pretentious twaddle saying it's "immature". He had something very mature to say about the messiah complex in human nature. The only question is whether he did a good job making his point or not. Awards, sales and decades of appreciation later, the logical answer is *yes, he did*. Not, 'what an immature book'. Dumb.
Guys stop trashing this poor girl, she's allowed to not like a book for whatever reason she wants and she even admitted that she loved the spice and the sand worms which I think most of us would agree are some of the best parts of the book
I didn't get the point of Dune until I read the second installment. It gets into the idea of heros and religion in a really interesting, thoughtful way. Which is weird, because most Dune fans told me it would ruin the experience.
"I wasn't confused" clearly, you were.
this is not how you disagree
The book - - - - >
Your head (* - *)
Lol
"book without structure" inspires decades worth of sci-fi. Fails to understand Paul being the chosen one is a critical commentary against cult of personality. Basically....the failure to understand a massively popular and influential book series isn't the fault of the author. 0/10 review cred.
It's ok I understand your frustration. I didn't start to fully comprehend and enjoy the book until my third time reading it. Herbert was way ahead of his time and the universe he created is difficult to comprehend on your first read. I first read it in 7th grade and it was too much for me. I Just read it for the 6th time some months back and it definitely deserves the title of "Science Fiction's Supreme Masterpiece"...you'll get there one day too.
Must be something about this book... It's only the best selling scifi book of all time!
The way she said it like AIRIKISS I was like oh no💀💀💀
Dune. Desert planet. AIRIKISS.
"Dune is super sandy"...best analysis ever
@@crazykev5 oh don't worry i live in the desert. i LOVE sand.
I love the book AND the entire series (including the expanded universe). However, I get it. It is not going to be for everybody. I would say, though, that part of the meaning comes out more with subsequent books. I also agree with a previous poster who suggested hearing the audio book instead.
Considering the director, I'm betting you'll still love the movie (although the first movie is just the first half of the first book).
Which movie? They made a movie in 1984, a miniseries/TV movie in 2000, and a movie in 2021.
think of it as a philosophical dissertation on government, religion, and human nature, disguised as a sci-fi novel.
@@m.x.2442 ha ha ha well said
I kinda understand where this person is coming from because I had a similar reaction when I tried to read James Joyce for the first time and I just couldn't understand anything of what I was reading. But I realized it wasn't the book that was bad, it was me not having the knowledge and maturity to comprehend the text because of my age and literature experience at the time. I don't think everyone can appreciate the genius of Frank Herbert and the masterpiece that is Dune without having some decent literature experience inside but also outside the sci-fi genre. Having said that, I don't judge anyone for not understanding Dune. But I would encourage anyone who is struggling with it to put it aside for a few years and give it another try at a later stage in life. The book is absolutely mind-blowing once you can understand the themes it sets to explore.
god- what an awful ratio. avid dune fan here but there's no reason for you to have received all the hate here!! my friends have had the exact reaction to the novel- everyone likes what they like-simple as that! happy reading!!!
Thank you, Dune isn't for everyone, it is a bit deep. People who love philosophy and the human condition get it.
For me the outrage is because the rant itself doesn't make a point. It is a book about religious zealotry and the economy of power. It's not really a character drama, each character stands for a larger piece of society. If you don't follow the big ideas and only follow the characters then you will miss the point every time. It is a rather superficial read of the book, and honestly, it's a bit of a shame.
Tbf why couldn't that apply to a video also? People like wat youtube videos they like also, and it just so happens that relatively not a lot of people like her views on Dune
Dune is the book that taught me how to read fiction. It forced me to think about what the themes and what the author was trying to say more than any other book. Early on in the book it says something along the lines of “Part of the reason Paul was so effective is that early on he was taught that he could learn things and that there was something to learn from everything.” I think this was a hint from the author not to overlook anything. You probably aren’t interested but I have PDFs of a bunch of literary criticisms of the book that illustrate how much is going on. But you can also find a lot of those things and discussions online. I first read the book sort of aware of some of the themes already which helped me understand some of the others. If I hadn’t then I probably wouldn’t have enjoyed it very much either. One of my favorite things about the book that I never see ANYONE talk about is how the first 3rd of the book the reader knows everything that’s going to happen. You know there’s a traitor and who it is, but the characters don’t and so you watch them trying to figure it out. As the reader you basically can tell the future of the characters. But after that Paul gets the ability to see the future, and from that point on the reader DOESN’T know the future. Paul is always super vague about what it is that he sees. The author shows you what that’s like before reversing it.
Why do people get mad at people who don't like what they like. We should get to the point where we are okay if someone doesn't like what we like.
I don’t get it either. People like things and don’t like things that’s life lol
This is the type of book, where if you are having trouble understanding it or getting into it, what you need to do is listen to the audiobook. This is my favourite series and I adore this book, it’s one of my all time favourites. But it isn’t gonna be for everyone, and sometimes how you consume something can also have a huge effect. I personally suggest a reread, but with the audiobook instead. What is especially beneficial about the audiobook, is they have voice actors and a great narrator. It is extremely immersive and that is often so much more helpful for first readers from my experience.
As for the film, watching that as well will also be helpful in understanding the plot a bit better. But keep in mind it’s just the first half.
But here are some pointers that might be helpful:
Paul isn’t actually a Chosen One, the whole prophecy is fake and that is a point reiterated over and over, however he IS someone with special powers, but that had to with biology and environment, not prophecy. Which is why the Count is so important at the end of the book.
Essentially Paul embarks on a revenge quest after the royal feuding causes his father’s death and him and his mother’s exile. Through this, they meet the Fremen and they use the fake prophecy made by the Bene Gesserit to ensure their survival. A religious cult begins to form around Paul, as he tries to avoid a fate where he leads a religious war across the universe. But in his actions, he begins to loose touch in his humanity.
Which is why at the end of the book, when he has made himself Emperor, he realizes he has only just started that dark path and hasn’t avoided it at all.
Dune is a story about charismatic leaders and the dangers they pose. Paul is set up to seem as though he is the Chosen One, hero type, but in reality he grows to become a galactic dictator. His arc in this first novel can be most easily summed up as an anti-hero’s arc.
After this first book a expansive galactic history begins, influenced by Paul’s actions.
This deals with philosophy and political and ecological issues. Such as how humanity effects the environment and how likewise the environment effects humanity. The ways religion and power can corrupt, the way humanity is not separated by good and bad but instead our choices are grounded in morally complex decisions that can have infinite possibilities.
This can definitely be a difficult first read for some people, so it’s understandable. Which is why I again suggest the audiobook. It’s seriously a whole other experience.
We'll put. Couldn't agree more. The underlying psychological and philosophical themes of this book is what really sells it to me. It's a lot to take in and first time it's really hard to fully appreciate all the nuance in the book. I've listened to the audiobook 4 times and each time I uncover a new layer. I'm definitely going to listen to it again and the following two books are also fantastic.
Flawless
Fantastic
I just recently finished dune for the first time. Like you said it is beautifully written. That did make it difficult for me at times to paint the picture in my head Frank Herbert was trying to paint. In terms of not seeing a story, it's hidden behind symbolisms and analogies. It's definitely not a simple, fun, escapism read. My favorite point taken from the book is "validate your premise." Jessica's premise was Dr. Yueh was trustworthy because he had the imperial conditioning. Thufir Hawat's premises were paul was dead, jessica was the saboteur, and he could easily defeat Baron so there was no need to fight him. There are other examples but those were my favorite. I'm reading through it a second time right now to squeeze more out of it. I can't remember the exact quote but at one point a character is talking about how Hawat is already defeated because he assumes an easy victory over Baron so he doesn't even try. That really hit home with me. There are times where I assume victory so I don't try or I assume failure so I don't try. My biggest weakness in general is I act on assumptions of future results. I should spend less time make premises.
I hope you give it another chance at some point. While I definitely see Dune as a masterpiece of world building than I do story telling, it does have some big ideas to present about how we treat our planet, how we make decisions, and questioning who we should trust as leaders. Maybe watch some explanation or review videos before you tackle it a second time so you have a little help!
Guys it's her opinion, it's not that serious. You clicked this video because you wanted to be mad and I KNOW half of you are grown men--go mow the lawn, harold. This video isn't for you.
Thank you
are you assuming????
People, you do not have to click on a video where you know she has a harmless opinion that is different to yours and throw petty insults thinking they make you superior and her inferior. The world is not your echo chamber where everyone has to be in agreement. The point of art is different things resonate with different people. Its ok she does not like it. And the suggestions to give it another try are plain snobbery. Life's short, read what you enjoy, why re-read something you didn't enjoy in the first place.
No, she's just actually stupid.
She asked for it. Trashing the all-time best selling sci-fi novel for clicks. Please!
@@fabiendecodts2584 How is she trashing it LOL, she was just saying that she didn't get the message of the book
@@clownfucker She criticises the narrative for being unnecessarily detailed/too long. She's missed the point entirely. The reason this is the all-time best selling sci-fi novel is precisely because it doesn't insult the reader and speaks to complex political realities. Life basically. Not to mention it's a captivating story.
You should go and see Villeneuve's film, it's clearly produced for the Marvel film franchise viewership. You get all the action and none of that boring exposition this girl complains about. ;)
@@fabiendecodts2584 So she asked to be insulted because she thought that the book was too detailed? That's a bit ridiculous lol. That was just how she felt about the book, it's not like she insulted everyone who enjoyed reading it. She just didn't understand it's message, and she made that clear by saying so.
I hope Villeneuve gets to adapt all of the books, would love to see Leto II get turned into a giant worm
I just finished dune and came here to spout my 2 cents.
It is a slow-paces book. I feel like this first one is just meant to establish a groundwork for the entire series. Paul is an admirable protagonist but sometimes I feel like I can't distinguish where his admiration for religion coincides with his leadership traits, as in which one does he prefer to do? Lead or follow religion? Or both equally? The conversations between character is written so beautifully. The convos are always my favorite part, and I also liked how Herbert consistently describes what these characters are thinking between their spoken words. It was hard for me to get invested into the bad guys plot(s), as I just wanted to read about Paul and Jessica and Chani the whole time. It definitely begs a re-read for me, or research into plot points i missed. Overall I'd say 3.5/5 personally. I really appreciate his eloquent writing but damn this story took so long to progress. OP was right in saying the worms and spice were the coolest parts, along with the few fights/duels which caught my attention the most. I'm really excited for the movie, the casting looks amazing and I think I'll start the 2nd book soon to see how it holds up.
Self awareness devoid Dune fanatics: "ITS A WARNING AGAINST FANATICISM! HOW CAN YOU NOT GET THAT?"
As a Dune fan,I don't think you guys have to be so rude, not everybody will like the book and she's just giving her opinion
Listening to her opinion on Dune is as listening to someone who has never left their home town in the midwest explaining how stupid it is that they went to Spain and everyone was so rude by only speaking Spanish.
@@Bipolar_Weasel No. She has "Spain" in her hand. She can clearly see what she sees. I think your childish simile shows you to be one of those idiots who think he is the smartest person in the room, without realizing he is par or worse. I think the intelligent thought you expected her to apply, is lacking in your minor dissection of her review. You whine, cry, sniffle a little bit, lash out, and do not bother reflecting on the "why" or "how" of the review. Ah, to be young and stupid again :) Try that in the future. Your 1st reaction gets typed out, but do not post it. Then sit back and ask why/how and see how you change...or keep being a fanboi reacting from feeling rather than thought, pointing fingers at someone and being the same...:) later gator
@@LigitandMeyers - oh kiddo, stop trying to white knight. She isn't going to message you for a hookup.
„He is the chosen One, you know how this Storyline usually goes.“ Nah you don’t, until you have read the next chapters. Dune is one of the only series, that does actually something very interesting whith that kind of a Story Device. But I can understand that you did not like it, it’s really not a easy Reading Experience, however the first 4 Books of the Series are my favorite books of all Time.
I see I'm not the only one who was less impressed with Heretics and Chapterhouse. Thank you.
thanks for being honest..i hate people that pander to their audience, everyone has different opinions, and that's the beauty of being an individual.
It's a shame you didn't you didn't enjoy it ,I would definitely recommend the audiobook, having voice actor play different roles and hearing the ambient music in between chapters really helped in getting a sense of the characters and a feel for the universe. It is a confusing story at times and the writing style can be a bit overwhelming but I think the mystery of the story and the way it deconstructs the hero's journey makes it quite worthwhile in the end but then again, I only started the audiobooks after seeing the film so I already had a vague idea of what was going on 😄.
Been forever since I read it but I remember reading and not being too impressed with his writing when it came to the dialogues and drama. Don't get me wrong, it is a must read and it is a work of a genius(should be on school reading lists). However, towards the end I remember it would jump around too much and didn't flow right. Got too slow and meandered too much. Can't remember but there was stuff that also seemed silly and pretentious. I enjoyed more the overall ideas like the planet ecology, cultures, neo feudalism/mercantilism/monopolism etc b/c it was like a history book written in the future-that is the part he absolutely nailed. I think he tried to put too much in one book. I put him up there with Philip K. Dick (my favorite) who also has big flaws
YOU GO BACK AND READ IT AGAIN.... AND YOU ENJOY IT! dammit!
What's it about:
Psychologically: How might people function cognitively after tens of thousands of additional years of human evolution?
Sociologically: How do people make and destroy their own prophets?
Philosophically: Can people be somehow connected across vast space and time?
The plot doesn't fit concisely into a single book, but think of Dune merely as a prophet's origin story. Then the subsequent books are much more enjoyable.
Damn I am starting the second one! I am so hooked up! It’s not your taste lady, no big deal
Those who says this book is not for everyone are just afraid of the fact that they have some piss poor taste
Listening to the audio book makes it much easier to understand and digest. In between listening to chapters I’ll research them to make sure I’m fully aware of what’s going on. I suggest you listen on audio if you were to attempt this again.
Yes Terrie I agree. Listening to a story engages other aspects of the mind and provides quite a different experience. Listening is the primal and original intake of stories. Books are relatively new. I don't think you can look down on readers or listeners. Or I guess (film) watchers. Different strokes for different folks. We are not all the same.
I mean I don't blame you for not understanding it. People who are making fun of you or getting angry to you back for being completely lost of the book needs to learn to put themselves in your shoes! Not everybody's gonna understand a single book. You can't expect everybody to get the whole plot of it. I just saw the movie adaptation part 1 and the conflicts were all over the place talking about Paul's visions, places they went, the royalty, etc. Miranda, ignore the haters, I understand what you are feeling.
Kudos for reading it. To each their own.
I have the same problem with Tolkien. After reading him, I couldn't understand the hype.
omg yeah i bought dune when the movie was being made and read it at work and a lot of guys were excited that i was reading it and wanted to talk to me about it but i just didn’t like it that much.
i saw someone say it was a white savior story and that kind of makes sense, a white dude going to another planet and becoming the ruler, and it’s just such a colonizer mindset to me, not to mention the whole planet is in a drought and water is this precious resource that everyone fights over and it’s just never really a problem that they have to deal with (unless i’m forgetting something, it’s been a while) like they have the suits and 2 gallons of water and that feels kind of off too
and paul has all these visions about the future and how he’s going to become this great ruler and he doesn’t want it to happen but it happens… like what’s the point! i see what you mean about not knowing what it’s about. there were some elements of the world building i found interesting that i wished were expanded on more but weren’t, too, which is probably a hot take because there’s so much world building but i wish it focused on different things i guess
but i completely agree i wish i liked it as much as other people seem to lol
Some people just don't understand Dune. . .
And some people understand it and dont like it.
@@m.x.2442 That's a weird confession. I dont care that you are, its fine.
"Paul, who is the chosen one." Yeahhh, she didn't get it lol.
OK, It took me several attempts, over the course of my first marriage to finally finish reading Dune. And then I devoured the rest of the series that was available in 2000. Dune really is a tough read, but it is ultimately just to set up the universe and lay the foundations for the rest of the books, there were meant to be 7 total, but when his son split the plot of the last one into 2 books, so there's a total of 8. and they cover just under 5000 years of human history, though there are some significant time jumps (IE The end of Children of Dune is roughly 3500 years before the start of God Emperor of Dune which ends roughly 1500 years before the start of the final 4 books of the series). I'd say try to read it again in a couple of years. I honestly read the main books at least every couple of years (the ones written by Frank). But I really do love the story and I always find new things about it that I missed the last time around.
I don't think Dune made just to set up the sequels in the saga. I don't think Frank Herbert planned on making sequels at all to be frank (no pun intended). Dune is a well crafted narrative that stands on it's own (though it has its flaws). The sequels however, do not stand on their own given the nature of sequels. You can make the argument that Paul's arc isn't complete without Dune Messiah, in which case I might agree with you, but that doesn't mean that the first book is dependent on Dune Messiah for completion as a narrative.
If this is a hard read stay with Dr Seuss
Dune is the result of “imagination diarrhea” it’s what happens when you decide to take a bunch of good ideas from different genres and crap them all together. It’s the most ridiculously overly complicated set of stories for no other reason than “just cuz” The way it’s praised, at least to me is undeserving. I think people lie to themselves when they act as though Dune is this amazing story. It’s not…They’re poorly imagined stories that try to deceive the reader by adding more and more parts that the reader has to try and understand and somehow gullible fools think that makes a story meaningful and deep and well written. It doesn’t…Dune, is a contrived, lazy and shallow. It’s easy to just keep making up words and names and places to throw into your story. Like constantly adding ingredients into a stew. Not because they go well together, but because they look good to you. That’s what the Dune series feels like to me. A giant stew that although isn’t bad, doesn’t need so many ingredients. It’s overwhelming for absolutely no reason!
The central metaphor of the book is that it's a commentary on our reliance on oil, and how the Western countries have exploited the Middle Eastern countries in their need for oil to power their economies.
The other central concept is not to trust charismatic leaders, to always question their true intentions... (Ok next bit needs a spoiler alert, but I'm guessing you'll not be reading any of the sequels) Paul goes on to start a Galactic jihad, killing billions in the process, and making entire planets uninhabitable... Paul is not meant to be the hero of the story, he's intended to be a warning.
I believe the continuation of the story is necessary to see the big picture.
Personally, I love Dune, but I understand where she's coming from. Everyone tells you that a book is an amazing classic and how influential it is, and then you read the book, and you think "meh, I just don't see the greatness, it kinda sucks". That's how I feel about _On the Road_ by Jack Kerouac. When I finished _On the Road_ , all I could think was "how can such a small book be so boring."
That reminds me of how disappointing and st.p.. Pulp Fiction is.
I don't understand the confusion. The story in a nutshell is that, in a universe where politics has devolved into a feudal structure, Paul is a 15-year old Gary-Stu whose father is a Duke. The Duke is given a fief by the Emperor on the planet Dune, a desert planet that is rich in a commodity called Spice that is vital to the Imperial economy. But the gift to the Duke is a trick and he is betrayed and killed. Paul and his mom, escape the assassins and must use their knowledge and wits to trick the locals into following them to raise an army to overthrow the emperor and get revenge for Paul's Dad. In the midst of all the worldbuilding, that is basically the plot.
I would never say that you have to like the book or rate it highly as these things are subjective and it seems this didn't entertain you, but the plot wasn't that confusing.
There is a ton of symbolism in Dune, and if you’re not being an “active reader” (only focusing on what you’re reading) you’re going to miss how everything connects together beautifully. It’s an amazing book that maybe given a bit of time and researching some of the issues you took with the book could warrant another try.
The audiobook is excellent, by the way, if you like those. Given time, of course.
I absolutely second the audiobooks! They are excellent and can be found on UA-cam a lot of the time. That’s how I am reading the series. It also helps to read the summary/analysis from sparknotes. It’s not the most complex analysis, but it helps you to grasp the basic concepts.
Absolutely. I’m not a reader at all but I just came through the subject Butlerian Jihad. I searched and end up understanding the imaginations of Herbert in a short review about Dune. I understand that He imagined a world about lazy humans controlled by machine thinking and artificial intelligence. Now I’m super interested and curious about to know his speculations but same time I don’t want to read that essay like novel I’m may be lazy.
@@jazz5931 I think you would like the books then, the world is a direct consequence of the butlerian Jihad (though many many generations after) with certain humans trying to unlock their inner potential and utilise this instead of relying on machines. But humans are still human so some humans become mere contraptions for powers that be to reach an end goal, ideals and myths become vehicles for control and other humans are treated no better than the old AI. The mass population is still essentially lazy in thought and will and now submit to the control of computer like humans with vast messianic or "messianic" goals(Depending on who you ask or which characters thoughts the writer is exposing). It's essentially about fighting the tryany of complacent thoughts.
I'd suggest trying again when you're older (mid-30s?) where the "ten pages of nothing" suddenly have a lot more meaning. I read so many things while growing up that, upon re-reading later in life, seem to draw upon my life experiences much more. Regarding the point or message of the book... does it need one? Especially knowing that it's the first of a six-part saga. There are several messages throughout the saga but they're not immediately apparent from just the first book.
Setting aside what disagreements we undoubtedly share relative to the merits of this book, props to you for posting your reaction to the first installation of a series with an almost rabid following. You must’ve known you’d be mocked and skewered and, frankly, it took some serious cojones to earnestly and unflinchingly invite that reaction.
That said, while I can’t fault you for failing to understand its underlying concepts, I became disappointed when I heard you express regret for having read even its first page. I understand that was likely a hyperbolic characterization of your experience, but if there’s one thing I urge you to reconsider, it’s that takeaway in particular.
There’s a reason this book is cherished by so many who have read its pages and your efforts to do the same has exposed your mind to what forms the basis for why we cherish it. Even if not consciously realized at present, they may become so with experience. I assure you that if you return to this novel later in life your reaction then will impress upon you the worthwhile nature of the endeavor you should be proud to have pursued.
I love Dune but it's always good to hear other people's ideas.
I HATED Chapterhouse: Dune (6th book). I had a similar experience in forcing myself to read through it, though it was out of completionism or respect for the author/series.
I tried to watch the Dune movie from the 1980s. I just could not get into it. My interpretation of Dune is far better than what little I saw of that movie. I've pretty much sworn off seeing other movies based on it.
The whole point of the book is about dismantling the chosen one template! On a second read, you might pick up on the themes better.
Anyone who thinks that Twilight and the Hunger games is deep....then Dune is NOT for you
Dear reader, Dune is likely far too hard for you. It’s ok. It’s too hard for most people.
But, if you persevere, reread, ponder... it will change you. It will awaken a perspective change in who you are, and as we all know... being forced to change is painful.
These days, who tolerates having to work for entertainment?
I disagree that Dune is a difficult book. Also a book being easy or difficult to read vs good or bad are two different criteria. A book can be difficult and excellent or it can be difficult and a bad read. Dune was just not for me I can say doubtlessly, though I finished the whole novel and understood all that happened. Its ok that its not for everyone. Going a step further in my opinions the novel Dune is not for most people. And thats ok because you love it. And no one should or can take that away from you. Discussing the book with others is already a blessing.
You just don’t understand - it’s a story as old as humanity. Messiah fights back and creates a new empire by overthrowing the old order. However the new order quickly corrupts itself and recreates what it aimed to replace.
Half of that isn't in the original first book.
I read Dune in high school when it was first released, I loved it.
thats awesome! have you seen the new movie?
@@triggeredbeetle5370 No, I will probably wait until it is on the internet or disc for obvious reasons.
@@olsonspeed got it, its an amazing experience in the theater though.
I totally feel what you’re saying about it being boring, and while the world building was nice (and the Bene gesserit) but I also didn’t get it
I read Dune in three days and I will NEVER get those three days of my life back.
Just finished it, I honestly thought it was the best piece of fiction I've read since childhood, and I'm in my mid-twenties. I had similar thoughts about the world building and the character development being spectacular, but what really hooked me were just how many underlying philosophical elements were present in the book. I also liked the pacing of the book overall, I like that it started slowly and allowed time to build the world from the ground up. The pace gradually kept getting faster throughout the story though. It's cool to see how people can have such different opinions about the same book, thanks for reviewing it!
I just wanted to thank you for posting this rant/review. I'm currently struggling to read Dune, and came to UA-cam to watch some reviews that would help me understand if I should continue or not. I felt so understood! And curiously your review and its comments, much more than other gushing reviews, is what gave me the push to keep going. Like you, I don't think I'll enjoy it, but it seems like it's something interesting to explore anyway.
Dune can easily overwhelm you. It takes a while to understand the world and the jargon. Sometimes you need to give it a fresh start. I know it sat on my bookshelf for a few years in high school before I actually tried to read it.
Hey I get DUNE’s a tough read, but I highly recommend giving it a re read or listen with an audiobook. I’m a seventeen year old dude who’s greatest literary accomplishment is reading thru the eye of minds by James dashner (ugh), so DUNE was a big surprise for me as a reader! Was it hard to get sometimes? Yes. But on second reading and since I know what’s happening already and why, I think you’ll enjoy it a lot more! Also, a thing people forget about DUNE is that even though it is a novel, it’s not technically supposed to be the typical sci fi thriller blah blah lol. It’s like you said-beautiful world building. It’s like Frank Herbert wanted to make a novelized history book/psychology documentary, so it can be a tough read. But I loved it all the same, and listening to the audiobook made it ten times more interesting and exciting. Can’t wait for the movie!!!
thank you so much for this feedback!! i think i'll probably take a break and let out more steam before picking this book back up again, but your comment makes me want to give it a second try! thank you! :)
Miranda’s Universe absolutely! Just started dune messiah! Lit lit lit
@@mirandas_universe try watching the Sci fi channel miniseries and skip the badly done movies
People do not love Dune because it’s “beautiful” with a pretty setting and prose. People love it because they can analyze and debate over this book and its themes 50 years on. You’ve completely missed the point and embarrassed yourself on this. I’m honestly embarrassed for you that you lack such basic analytical skills to believe by the end of the novel Paul is still “your textbook chosen one”, the entirety of the book and the series as a whole is that charismatic leaders like him usually are not what is really good for you. Literature is all about analysis, that’s most people’s favorite part. Sorry if that is a bit much for you.
Wow. Just let someone have their own opinion.
@@RangerDanger224 Their “opinion” of the reason why people love Dune is wrong. That’s my claim dummy. She can have everything else, but she’s wrong on that part man.
@@SpongeXtermiat0r94 opinion vs fact dummy. People like dune for many reasons. I find the debate part to be awkward.
@@RangerDanger224 Good for you. Nothing you said has anything to do with anything dummy. Stop responding and leave me to my opinion of her’s.
@@SpongeXtermiat0r94 *hers
Stop thinking of Paul as the "Hero". He is a young Thanos basically. Read the rest of the series.
Actually not a bad analogy
1:29 "I do not know what this book is about" happy face
How do you not know what a book is about after reading the whole thing?
Cause it's not an easy book?
I mean...
Even the author was annoyed at how many people and fans weren't understanding his first book, that he had to wrote a 2nd book to make it more clear.
That shows how it's not for everyone
I don't get why some people in the comments are being so mean to you hahah. As a HUGE fan of the novel, I know that it's not an easy read because it's so cerebral. But the world building and the characters was what brought me into it aswell and if you just invest a little more time in the lore of the book, i bet you will like it in the future.
Dune is that kind of book where you constantly read about things without getting the hang of the meaning of certain events, because it's included in the lore built for the book itself. Therefore, it requires the reader to look up these certain things which is a huge turn off by first time readers. I recommend checking out the channel "Quinn's Ideas" here on youtube, he explains it all very pedagogically. I would give everything to experience this book for the first time again because when you finally start to get the hang of it, you're obsessed.
The way to get to like Dune, is to read the rest of the Frank Herbert Dune novels, then read them all a second time.
I think you are lying about reading the book.
I read four of these books cause my husband is super into the series. Second book was a little better… third book was okay. I hate the fourth book. And I am back to just hating the series as a whole. I feel you.
Just because she expressed her opinion on not liking the book, which is against your opinion doesn’t make her wrong...she didn’t enjoy it, she said it.
Of course a book that is more than half a century old is going to be a bit boring and includes a lot of tropes that are done to death today. You understand that, but Dune is a book that really doesn't stand well on its own and has to be in context of Messiah, Children of Dune, etc. Especially Children of Dune, is often seen as the defining book. Frank Herbert is pulling things out in such a bore, as it is planned to be part of the whole.
But I get you and I hope the movie will do better at giving it a proper narrative that respects telling a contained dramatic story and not just "read the whole series n00b"
This was a great vid. Sorry you didn’t love it, I adore this book and the rest of the series myself. Highly recommend you tubers Quinn’s Ideas and ComicBook Girl 19, they both have a bunch of great videos breaking down these books. A common joke in the fandom is “it gets enjoyable about half way through your second read.”
🤔🤔🤔 yes, timing is about right.👍
Granted, lotr was a bit similar too.
Quinn's ideas ❤️👍!
She didn’t read it to hard for her
Maybe you should listen to the audiobook... and just enjoy it.
All those post it notes make it clear you approached it as a study manual instead of a story to just enjoy.
It’s not a text book, its not a headline or a video game, it’s a story.
Trust me, listen to the audiobook.
Yes, it’s complicated- or maybe very in depth....
But only the first time you read it (listen to it)
It’s most definitely worth your time
Lolll the comment section is so mad that you didn’t like this book
The sheer number of sticky tabs is embarrassing and a pretty good sign she can’t review anything for shit.
My interpretation about Dune is it is ultimately about ecology. All the factions play their part Harkonnens, Atreides Freeman and others, but the Planet itself is the main focus point.
God Emperor (he is a sandworm, btw) is my absolute fav. The first book is a basic story. It is meant to be a Messiah origins story (with the commentary that the Messiah was 'set up', but was born before it was supposed to happen, with also Paul lamenting his destiny). it gets better, imo. First book is mostly just a set up for the universe's future.The second book kinda throws Paul out of the savior tropes. I guess my point is the first book alone isn't much a 'story'... Or perhaps it is the most 'story' like of all of them as it takes you on Paul's journey with him, as Messiah stories do.
Also, keep in mind Herbert loved to drop acid as he wrote. And I am not saying, "go read all other books now!". Hahah Just justifying how I spent so much time with the series I suppose.
I have exactly the same feelings on Tolkien's LOTR...
So did I.... reading Fellowship, I however can't put The Two Towers down lol. It picks up steam and I'm loving it.
Omg so many dislikes! I didn't think that this review would warrant so much dislike 😅
Never read this book, I definitely will (read or listen) in the future but I don't appreciate cult following of anything. Hope you didn't get too much hate along with the dislikes! 😊
Your eagerness to have a discussion on this book is encouraging. I would strongly recommend re-reading this book in 5 to 10 years and come back to this video and comment. I think you’ll be rather embarrassed. I tried reading this book when I was 13 and ended up doing a quick skim and did not enjoy it or understand it. I read it again in my 20s and was blown away.
Haha Dune is my favourite book
The book was written for intelligent people.
As a person whose read and seen everything except the brain herbert books...its not that deep.
Oh god, I'm getting flashbacks of the idiot who said, "You need to have a high IQ to understand Rick and Morty"
@@arekmg0003 ya know...that is a spot on description of this comment section. Well done.