I really appreciate your channel man, you offer the most comprehensive breakdowns of drawing tablet/display technology that can't be found anywhere else. Great stuff!
I can only agree. This is the most professional and informative youtube channel for a neutral technical analysis and opinion about pen/ display tablets. Excellent!
@@thesevenpens "Reviewers" are quite often not art professionals or come from related industries such as photo retouching or tech journalism. They probably wouldn't notice or recognise lag or think to look for it. You might get "the drawing experience feels nice".... Manufacturers tend to avoid this kind of data. They tend to believe that a) it confuses the general public and b) it doesn't help to sell the product. For tablets / pen displays the only number we seem to see is levels of pressure sensitivity. IMHO this is about as useful as judging a camera by how many mega pixels its sensor has.
Excellent video. I am a digital sculptor and I recently tried to work with a Huion Kamvas 24 Plus, after years of iPad Pro and my old Wacom Bamboo. The lag completely destroys my flow. It feels heavy. Since I'm still on time, I'm going to send the Huion back.
Brilliant video I knew that Im not the only person whos annoyed by the input lag! You did an excellent research and gave a look at how laggy they actually are. Let us know if you find something better than cintiq pro 27
Thanks so much! Really clear and informative. I'm looking all over the internet for opinions on display tablet lag, and you're the only one that seem to take this issue seriously. Lag is for me the most important criterion to consider when buying a display tablet, and I find it crazy that so few people seem to take interest in this... I have a couple questions if you don't mind : - Do you think your pc specs could have an impact on the lag you show here? And do you think a better pc could have "virtually no lag"? Or does it come from the tablet itself? - You mentioned display tablets that could have less lag than the ones you tested. Do you have the name so I can research them?
1 - PC specs could in theory have an affect on pointer lag. But think the effect is incredibly small. I've used pen displays on old laptops (8GB RAM, 2 cores) and a 128GB 16 core machine and get the same exact pointer lag. Now brush lag with an app like Krita or Clip Studio Paint will be more affected by the PC specs. 2 - That model was a Cintiq 13HD (DTK-1301). I tested with the Wacom driver and OpenTabletDriver and I think it has pointer lag between that of a Cintiq Pro 27 and Wacom One - which means it still had noticeable pointer lag. It wasn't even close to the iPad Pro I use but it was better than average for a pen display.
Nice video! I wonder if the intuos having the least amount of lag is just a matter of not having a layer of glass between the pen tip and the digitizer. That would make sense as to why the Pro 27 still has that much lag.
it would be interesting to see how much pointer lag there is btween old intuos 3/4/5 the new '' intuos pro'' line, the new cheap ''intuos'' that replaced bamboo and huion / xp pen. on the screenless tablets.
Thanks for the video! I was wondering, if you use a display like a pen tablet, i.e. mapping it to a different screen/disabling the native display, does it still have the same amount of pointer lag? Probably an obscure situation but I'm curious for a particular setup idea.
The lag will still be there - but of course it will be visually "scaled" down to fit the dimensions of the screen. For example, you can see this effect for example with small pen displays (13") vs larger ones (24").
you need something to push the pen at a constant velocity in a line, a camera to record it (high fps60++), then count the frames it takes the pointer to catch up at the end. the time should be the same for each test (a to B) you will then get a number of frames that you can science.
Oh my goodness thank you for your work, I thought I had something wrong with my pen display (xp-pen artist 13th 2nd), I also noticed a lower pen lag on the video of the wacom cintiq drawing demonstration, turns out it wasn't my imagination.
The best advice it can give is to use a system with a Good CPU, a GPU that made high-end graphics and high ram. I and used tables for 20 years and I find the larger image and finer the detail on high-end systems the more the lags. I have put my stylus down and watch the screen continue to draw. Most tables connect by USB but for newer one use Bluetooth. Most US are USB 1 or 2 but not the higher end 3 or 3.1. I have used but PC desk top and laptops. On laptop, I always use one with dedicated graphic cards with their own ram. My last one was a ASUS G73 JH that was a gaming laptop. There was little lagging till it went into extreme size drawings. (over 100"X100") and drawing at one pixel's range in Painter and PS. Background apps. Control what is on. here are tons of things that can slow your pen talking to your tablets. Assign port access to the USB or learn to kill any app that is sharing RAM and GPU/CPU time. I worked from win 98 till current win 10. My current system is a gaming system. 32 gb of ram high-end graphic card a AMD 5500TX AMD CPU My tables re are Then the Wacom tablets Intuos 4 extra large 12x18 and just added a Intuos 5 large. Drawing with painter and PS CS6 zero lags as long as there is nothing drawing the system's resources.
@@Departageance yes I am using Wacom nibs not mental and surface cover are ones made for the Wacom tablet and work fine with the drawing and all functions.
Glad you are enjoying it. I just do a lot of research! Some information has been pretty hard to find. Also I've run into a few others who are tablet enthusiasts and they have taught me a lot.
Can tell you something about lag, as I made apps with almost no lag more than 20 years ago on bw pocket assistant :-) All you need is to work directly with ports and draw accessing video memory :-) Source of present input lag is....high level of abstractions during software writing. Sometimes you can have 4-5 layers of abstractions even on driver level. Add to this painting app. If you'll be working with USB / Bluetooth data pockets and write using fast API made for games - you can cut input lag a lot. But this is with simple painting brushes, of course. As now almost all delay is caused by this.
i love your channel, pentablet pens are very niche things i appreciate you love them as much as i do , i suggest a video idea which i am very curious about too is how does wacom intuos pro compares to the non pro models in pure measurable performance and not how many extra buttons you have like all the UA-camrs show and to its alternatives like xp-pen deco-pro lineup where they copied exactly the same wacom pro pen shape and gave it like 16k sensitivity
Thank you! That is a great idea. I do want to make a video that talks about performance in as measurable a way as possible. Interesting you mention that new XP-Pen shape. I just started using it and lost it for a few hours. It was right in front me on the desk but I thought it was a Wacom Pro Pen 2 :-)
I really appreciate your channel man, you offer the most comprehensive breakdowns of drawing tablet/display technology that can't be found anywhere else. Great stuff!
I appreciate the comment! Thank you! Glad you are enjoying the videos.
Your UA-cam is more detailed and professional than any other video. I love it
Such a kind comment! Thank you!
I can only agree. This is the most professional and informative youtube channel for a neutral technical analysis and opinion about pen/ display tablets. Excellent!
@@zadrazil87 Thank you!!!
finally someone adressing this!. This is the main reason i cant enjoy fast sketching on cintiq like devices.
Thank you! I'm surprised how little attention lag gets from reviewers and manufacturers.
@@thesevenpens "Reviewers" are quite often not art professionals or come from related industries such as photo retouching or tech journalism. They probably wouldn't notice or recognise lag or think to look for it. You might get "the drawing experience feels nice"....
Manufacturers tend to avoid this kind of data. They tend to believe that a) it confuses the general public and b) it doesn't help to sell the product.
For tablets / pen displays the only number we seem to see is levels of pressure sensitivity. IMHO this is about as useful as judging a camera by how many mega pixels its sensor has.
@@tested211 That "pressure levels / mega pixels" is a great analogy!
I was searching for someone doing this investigation. Thank you very much for your time and your amazing content!
Great video! Lots of great information in an easily digestible and enjoyable format
Thank you!!!
Man, you NEED TO POST EVERY VIDEO YOU PROMISED
please :DDDD
this is literally the most proper channel
Thank you!! I will make them all, I promise! I've should get back on track with with videos soon.
Excellent video. I am a digital sculptor and I recently tried to work with a Huion Kamvas 24 Plus, after years of iPad Pro and my old Wacom Bamboo. The lag completely destroys my flow. It feels heavy. Since I'm still on time, I'm going to send the Huion back.
Brilliant video I knew that Im not the only person whos annoyed by the input lag! You did an excellent research and gave a look at how laggy they actually are. Let us know if you find something better than cintiq pro 27
Thanks for the nice comment! If I find something better than the Cintiq Pro 27 in terms of lag I will definitely share it.
Thanks so much! Really clear and informative.
I'm looking all over the internet for opinions on display tablet lag, and you're the only one that seem to take this issue seriously.
Lag is for me the most important criterion to consider when buying a display tablet, and I find it crazy that so few people seem to take interest in this...
I have a couple questions if you don't mind :
- Do you think your pc specs could have an impact on the lag you show here? And do you think a better pc could have "virtually no lag"? Or does it come from the tablet itself?
- You mentioned display tablets that could have less lag than the ones you tested. Do you have the name so I can research them?
1 - PC specs could in theory have an affect on pointer lag. But think the effect is incredibly small. I've used pen displays on old laptops (8GB RAM, 2 cores) and a 128GB 16 core machine and get the same exact pointer lag. Now brush lag with an app like Krita or Clip Studio Paint will be more affected by the PC specs.
2 - That model was a Cintiq 13HD (DTK-1301). I tested with the Wacom driver and OpenTabletDriver and I think it has pointer lag between that of a Cintiq Pro 27 and Wacom One - which means it still had noticeable pointer lag. It wasn't even close to the iPad Pro I use but it was better than average for a pen display.
Nice video! I wonder if the intuos having the least amount of lag is just a matter of not having a layer of glass between the pen tip and the digitizer. That would make sense as to why the Pro 27 still has that much lag.
That's got to be a bit part of it!
it would be interesting to see how much pointer lag there is btween old intuos 3/4/5 the new '' intuos pro'' line, the new cheap ''intuos'' that replaced bamboo and huion / xp pen. on the screenless tablets.
I'll see if I can do a comparison video across those tablets. I expect the intuos pro line will have consistently little lag.
Thanks for your comment on reddit! amazing video
Thanks for the video! I was wondering, if you use a display like a pen tablet, i.e. mapping it to a different screen/disabling the native display, does it still have the same amount of pointer lag? Probably an obscure situation but I'm curious for a particular setup idea.
The lag will still be there - but of course it will be visually "scaled" down to fit the dimensions of the screen. For example, you can see this effect for example with small pen displays (13") vs larger ones (24").
you need something to push the pen at a constant velocity in a line, a camera to record it (high fps60++), then count the frames it takes the pointer to catch up at the end.
the time should be the same for each test (a to B) you will then get a number of frames that you can science.
Oh my goodness thank you for your work, I thought I had something wrong with my pen display (xp-pen artist 13th 2nd), I also noticed a lower pen lag on the video of the wacom cintiq drawing demonstration, turns out it wasn't my imagination.
The best advice it can give is to use a system with a Good CPU, a GPU that made high-end graphics and high ram. I and used tables for 20 years and I find the larger image and finer the detail on high-end systems the more the lags. I have put my stylus down and watch the screen continue to draw. Most tables connect by USB but for newer one use Bluetooth. Most US are USB 1 or 2 but not the higher end 3 or 3.1. I have used but PC desk top and laptops. On laptop, I always use one with dedicated graphic cards with their own ram. My last one was a ASUS G73 JH that was a gaming laptop. There was little lagging till it went into extreme size drawings. (over 100"X100") and drawing at one pixel's range in Painter and PS. Background apps. Control what is on. here are tons of things that can slow your pen talking to your tablets. Assign port access to the USB or learn to kill any app that is sharing RAM and GPU/CPU time. I worked from win 98 till current win 10. My current system is a gaming system. 32 gb of ram high-end graphic card a AMD 5500TX AMD CPU My tables re are Then the Wacom tablets Intuos 4 extra large 12x18 and just added a Intuos 5 large. Drawing with painter and PS CS6 zero lags as long as there is nothing drawing the system's resources.
Did you test your current config with a display tablet?
@@Departageance yes I am using Wacom nibs not mental and surface cover are ones made for the Wacom tablet and work fine with the drawing and all functions.
Oh my god ive been looking for materials on brush smoothing for months thank you!!! Could you tell us where you've learned this stuff?
Glad you are enjoying it. I just do a lot of research! Some information has been pretty hard to find. Also I've run into a few others who are tablet enthusiasts and they have taught me a lot.
I'm really waiting for your video on how to reduce anti glare sparkle... its gonna influence some tough decisions
Coming this weekend!
Nice video. Do you have any experience with the hs611 and rtp 700 from huion? Looking to buy one of them. Do have any idea?
I put a few notes on them here: docs.thesevenpens.com/drawtab/7p-notes/huion
@@thesevenpens ended up going for the rtp 700. Thank you for your inputs.
Can tell you something about lag, as I made apps with almost no lag more than 20 years ago on bw pocket assistant :-) All you need is to work directly with ports and draw accessing video memory :-)
Source of present input lag is....high level of abstractions during software writing. Sometimes you can have 4-5 layers of abstractions even on driver level. Add to this painting app.
If you'll be working with USB / Bluetooth data pockets and write using fast API made for games - you can cut input lag a lot. But this is with simple painting brushes, of course. As now almost all delay is caused by this.
i love your channel, pentablet pens are very niche things i appreciate you love them as much as i do , i suggest a video idea which i am very curious about too is how does wacom intuos pro compares to the non pro models in pure measurable performance and not how many extra buttons you have like all the UA-camrs show and to its alternatives like xp-pen deco-pro lineup where they copied exactly the same wacom pro pen shape and gave it like 16k sensitivity
Thank you! That is a great idea. I do want to make a video that talks about performance in as measurable a way as possible. Interesting you mention that new XP-Pen shape. I just started using it and lost it for a few hours. It was right in front me on the desk but I thought it was a Wacom Pro Pen 2 :-)
Thanks mate, i was about to throw my pen out and now i know its natural