Vintage NAD 2200 Power Envelope Audio Amplifier Dyno Test
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- Опубліковано 24 лип 2024
- #AmpDyno #AmpTest #NAD
The 1987 NAD 2200 has some impressive specs. This vintage 2 channel audio amplifier is said to deliver up to 1600 watts bridged at 4 ohms dynamically. Quite an incredible feat for a 100w/ch rated amplifier. Is it possible this 30 plus year old amp can post these kinds of numbers? Or does it show it's age and let out the magic smoke? Only one way to find out...
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I had one of these and I sold it for some reason, and I got a 2600 rated by NAD at 150 watts. Both great amps. Still have the 2600.
I read an article in the 220. They commented, “NAD watts are different from other watts,” referring to difference between their ratings and their output.
I acquired one of these bad boys brand new in 1986 and I still run it today. Pair of Klipsch forte ii, that have been completely gone thru, Denon mp3 player and I had the cops here last summer to turn it down. I be 74 this year and still rockin. 👍👍👍😎 the hippie
This video brought back some good old memories. I used to repair home audio amps and these NAD amps were some of the best ever made that crossed my bench. They always punched above their spec sheets, and the design was so well engineered that a few I worked on with blown channels still functioned but the complaint from the customer was 1 channel was quieter than the other...and on the o-scope the sine wave was still clean even with the blown channel (most other amps actually explode [transistors fracture/short] when the channel blows). Also as you showed in the video with soft clipping off (if you were to watch the sine wave on a o-scope you can see it tries to bend the square wave in to a sine wave during clipping, it is pretty amazing engineering for the time) you do get more power, but with it on, you could actually save your speakers, so it was always a give/take situation, but when you push power in to a load it really does not matter as high wattage loads can take a ton of abuse.
Wow, I didn't know it put out that much! I bought a NAD 2200 and the NAD 1155 Preamp about two weeks ago and hooked them up to a pair of Polk Audio tower speakers -> It sounds amazing. It puts out so much power at about 25-30% volume level. I'm sure my neighbors will hate me if I crank it up to 50% and beyond!!
Thanks for this Vid!
so happy again being owning the proton brother integrated amp from the other video. glad there is finally more info out there. went many years in the dark without knowing any specs.
Damned amazing as old as this amp is! I owned two of these 2200's and several other NAD products. Always found them to be great value equipment with much better than average SQ. Great test, thanks!
+substrate001 thanks! Check out the Proton D1200...it is even more 😲
I currently have a nad 2600 and it is awesome
Big D My dad had these exact amp and preamp back in the 90's with a pair of Klipsch Chorus 2 and OMG it was nooo joke! I now have 2 of these and the Quality is outstanding Thanks for the vid even though its old.
Wish I could send a pic through comments.
I have one of these fully restored, and ive owned many, but this is an absolute monster and tonally its hard to match also. Probably my favorite power amp to date, have owned a few big adcoms, big emotivas and id still take this one over any of the separate amps ive had.
The most powerful NAD amp ever is the 208 THX. Would be interesting if you could test it.
The origins of NAD are fascinating. The brand was built from the ground up based on the demands of distributers. Simple utilitarian aesthetics, ample features and an overbuilt power capability with conservative ratings that punches so far above its weight class that it competed directly with audiophile grade competitors at a far more reasonable price. I think NAD's original mission has been diluted over time, but that vintage line of audio components are legendary.
Solid content my friend. I love the variance of different audio products you show. It keeps us audioaholics coming back for more.
+Kevin Ball thanks for this comment. I like to mix things up and keep it interesting. Well, interesting to some people I hope 🤞
was my 1st stereo system I bought & still have it today and it still hammers sound, even with a 30 yr technology difference
Bought new in '88. No issues whatsoever. My vintage KEF 104/2's (restored a few years ago) still bounce the house with this amp. Crazy power.
Thanks for watching and commenting!
Back in the late 1980s I installed a couple of NAD 2200s in bridge mode driving 2 JBL cabaret series 18" 600w subwoofers at a local night club. It was a great combo, they sounded fantastic night after night and they never missed a bit in quite a heavy duty application. Clean power, no clipping even when pushed hard, no blown speakers ever. Great memories!
Awesome 👏
Thank you! I just dusted off my 2200. Cant wait to rock it out!
I bought this and the 1155 pre amp, new, back in the 80s. I still have it and it still rocks. It has lost channels once in a while. I finally broke down and bought the T777-V3 this year, so I could have a home theater. I am thinking about moving the 2200 into the garage and plug it on out there. This thing is still a beast.
Absolutely 👌
I like nad's old analog amplifiers from the mid-eighties and early 90's best. They have a warmer and more natural sound compared to their analog amplifiers today, which are more cold and clinical in sound.
There was a problem with these amps having cold solder joints though. The problem can be fixed easily enough if you have basic soldering skills and aren't afraid to open up the case and pull the boards out so they can be re-soldered. The soldered connections that are connected to the back panel of the box should all be re-soldered even if they look alright. All of the soldered joints on the power supply (transformer) should be re-soldered and the speaker relays should be replaced. Pretty much all of these amps had this problem and should be re-soldered even if it's working and looks fine. The bad joints in most cases can't be seen by looking at the joints casually but can be seen under magnification. A lot of the bad joints had a dry socket where the outer shell of the soldered joint looks fine but in the center of the joint it didn't solidify and there is a faulting connection that can release the magic smoke.
That aside these are kick ass amps. If you ever get a chance to pick one of these up cheep go for it. But with the age of this amp you should be aware that it will probably be needing a recapping to bring it back to it's original specs. That's just part of the hobby of collecting vintage audio gear.
Ran 2 of these vertically bi-amped into my 1978 AR9s for years - absolutely amazing grip, control and power (the ARs needed lots of juice to make them sit up and perform).
Still have the ARs but now have them relegated to the studio now. Only have one of the 2200s tho - one blew up a few years back and set fire to itself and the curtains and wall. Completely ruined the amp - wall not so bad, curtains blobbed, wife on war path. I intend to restore both the speakers and the remaining amp (one day) - keeping the wife.
Now have Emotiva amps and Golden Ear speakers - happy.
Bought that amp 3 years ago it's an absolute monster paired with polk sda 1 it's a giant killer
Watching this video listening the audio through NAD 2200 :) Phenomenal amp I must say.
Does run hot though.
MSTR-RPTR I don't mind. My amps are well ventilated and I have 110v fans in case things get rough. I can't believe I didn't buy one because I thought the power rating was too low
I bought this amp new in 1988 along with a preamp, a tuner, and a pair of Klipsch KG2's for $1300. I still have them and they still rock. I think I got my money's worth.
Yessir!
That's 20,000W according to my Taiwanese conversion tables.
Very enjoyable to see this NAD do what I suspected for years. I've been using mine daily since around 1988. Still paired with my Pioneer VSX-5000 and Cerwin-Vega D-9's. For me, nothing new even comes close to the sound created by the NAD.
Thanks for watching and commenting!
i remember looking at that beast in a catalogue , i could only afford the 3020e but that was still a lovely little amp
Like the name says. This amp has some nads.
Another great test! Although low-balling power figures was a short-lived fad at the time, amps like this, the Adcom 555 and others represented the peak in the development of the Class AB high power amp. There was nothing to improve after that. Truly a golden age.
Dave Micolichek, I don't recall what it stood for. Brain cells under the bridge.
great fkn amp......
Great video. I enjoyed your excitement at the results. Well done
Incredible!!
Hey BigDWiz! I love everything you do! Hey by any chance can you test any Adcom amps?? I run an Adcom 5802 for my mains as well as 2 of the Adcom 5500's for my subs. These are very solid amps with tons of power! Just curious to see what they can deliver maxed out. Let me know, thanks!
Very cool amp. I was hoping you would open it up. A friend of mine has one of those always wondered what he liked about it now I know. Great video.
he opens the amp at the end of the the video
absolutely LOVE the classic NAD and Proton gear.
FOR THE WIN!!! 😁
+Chris Peterson thanks for watching and commenting 👍
Love those vintage amp test!! Can you try a Carver M 1.0 in the future? Great work as always.
Awesome. I would love to see more on these old home amps and the real power.
Rotel, Parasound, Mcintosh, Krell, Marantz, Yamaha, Harman Kardon to name a few.
Would love to see the mighty 208 THX on the Amp Dyno.
That thing is a monster of an amp. Rated to handle 2000w RMS at 4 ohms bridged.
I have tested one of those back in the day, powering a set of home built tower speakers with a 12" Lightning Audio subwoofer in each of them. It drew so much power that the lights in the house dimmed when I cranked it up to 11.
Also, the smaller 218 THX, or the more modern M3 would be interesting to see tested.
Boom! Nad still killing it 30years later!
+hifivega 🤘😎👍
BigDWiz Beast Mode $$$$
The filter caps are different sizes because they have diifferent working voltages. 63 and 100 volts I believe.
The amp uses an input waveform peak level tracking, split rail supply to acheive high dynamic headroom and slightly increased efficiency.
The two larger filter caps are for the high-voltage rail. They are the burst storage caps. The amp switches to the high voltage rail when burst power is needed through com-mutating diodes. Normally, the two smaller filter caps and low-voltage rail do most of the work.
Awesome test, awesome amp. Yt recommended that video today :)
Thanks for watching and commenting!
Now if only these present day Amp manufacturers could follow NAD with their million watt rated dog Amps!
The NAD 218 is the best amp I have ever owned. It was rated at around 200 watts. I could only imagine what the Dyno would show.
The 218 THX is a great amp. I have owned many of them. But the 208 THX is even more powerful, especially when it comes to dynamic power.
I have an old NAD 2700 THX rated at 150 watts per channel at 8ohm. Would love to see what it really pushes
I have one of these with a 1130 pre amp. We used to use it to run a PA system and blew 2x 600w 12” woofers with it. Only modification we did was point a fan at the top!
A mates dad had a N.A.D system when I was a lad and it kicked ass , tiny speakers for the time 1992ish but the lows were amazing. Great vid Big D .
+Trueenglishgent1 did I pronounce aluminum correctly? 🤷♂️
BigDWiz spot on my friend
goes to show, they don't build em' like they used to, great vid, surprising results xD
How do you account for the consistent differences in channel output of the NAD amplifiers? Perhaps the bias on one channel has drifted slightly?
Nice! i have the 2600 am going to use in my subwoofer
Good video,
A query: I have a NAD 2200 stereo power amplifier and it does not say the word power over is there any difference in its power ?, I have a magnepan model 1.7i 4-ohm speakers, I have not seen on the internet to confirm the RMS of continuous power in 4 ohms of NAD 2200, what is the continuous power of RMS output in 4 ohms if in 8 ohms is 100 RMS?, Thanks for your answer. Regards!
Marco
NAD was one of the amps to have back in the day. Reminder... those specs are probably full range 20hz to 20khz
When you go vintage again,can you review a SAE A501 if you can find one thanks
i feel proud to be owner of this amp after watching this :)
As you should be!
A blast from the past. The monster that hides under the bed. Good old amp right there.
+CHS Miner makes me feel old knowing this amp is over 30 years old 🤔
This is a damn cool vid that benchmark unit u have is cool as. Man I wonder what my Nad 208 puts out on your benchmarks as that unit is about twice the weight of the 2200 and appears to be internally much more complex.
Was curious and had to check for the schematic of it and found it. It’s a bi supply class G (very different from a class AB and way way harder to design). Freaking amazing design especially for the time and even today. The higher voltage outer rails switching on after a certain point and flooding/surging the inner rails is where all the headroom comes from. There’s probably some sort of time delay on the inner rails to keep the higher voltage ones switching ahead of the audio signal like in all Carver’s designs (which are ridiculously complicated).
NAD mentioned this video in their recent 50th anniversary video. Too bad my audio is a bit hot in some of the video 🤦♂️
Good video. Can you test a Rockville home amp ?
That’s one POWERFUL 200 watt amplifier!!
I bought an NAD 2200 several years ago, along with an 1155 pre amp, and a 4225 tuner, and I have a question, (actually 2). First, is mine an early gen 2200? Mine does not say power envelope on front. It does have 3 LEDs on front, the top 2 are red, the bottom one is amber, and it says overload protection soft clipping on the right side of the LEDs. Sound output wise, it's beyond beastly! Is mine any different than the one in the video? Question# 2: As part of a package deal, I got an NAD 916 multi channel amplifier that I have never hooked up, to be used as a backup. Have any of our esteemed NAD-ites ever used one of these as a two channel stereo amplifier? It looks like it was designed for surround sound duty. Thanks so much everyone, and enjoy sharing the volume with your neighbors 3 houses away!
Nice! Keep it up!
It's seriously impressive how massively underrated a lot of these vintage amps are compared to modern ones. Obviously power is nothing without control, but a lot of them excel on that front too. What I'd really love to see is a leaderboard to show how all of the amps you've tested stack up against each other, including how they compare to their rated specs. It would be especially interesting to see modern amps in that leaderboard, to see if any of them can even begin to compare. If you could also include how they actually perform and sound in different frequency ranges, I think what you'd have there is something akin to an amplifier enthusiasts bible.
From Denmark,
Great, I still have my NAD 2200PE, NAD 7600PE, NAD 200 Dolby from 1975, NAD 2100PE, NAD 3300PE, NAD 7240PE, NAD 7250PE, NAD 302, NAD 7020.
And many more
On 30 September 1993 I bought my first NAD, a NAD 302 which I still have.
After that I was so fascinated by NAD that I collected them for many many years and ended up having 109 pieces.
I've had almost everything NAD has made amplifire/power amps, not control and sourround.
But I will say that after they stopped building them with power envelope anymore and they removed their Bass-EQ, my interest disappeared from the newer devices.
today, for me, NAD "the hifi club" has just become a company where you can't buy a cheap good amplifier anymore, it's over.
And that's why I stopped shopping there anymore, unfortunately
I have tested several NAD PE amps and integrated amps. They were very cool back then!
Not bad! I aways laugh when people are quick to get rid of older equipment. Would love to see a Crown Macrotech 5000vz tested.
got my 2400 power envelope...I loves it
I think I need to see my beloved Sansui AU-717 put to the test. What say you sir?
awesome! these are great I had envelope 2200, I plan to buy it back too
+Diablo12369510 basic looking, but there's a beast inside!
BigDWiz hell yeah I like the simplicity of the design though
I wonder if you hooked it up to the LAB inputs or the NORMAL RCA inputs. To my knowledge (ie: as per ASR, that is), the two imputs differ in how they operate - with the NORMAL inputs having both a high-pass and low-pass filters at each end of the amp's FR plots, while the LAB inputs bypass the hi-pass and low-pass filters and are slightly quieter as a consequence......
Great video. Please bear in mind that the watts rating your amp dyno gives is has to be more than the rated specs, NAD always uses 20hz to 20 khz or full range not at just 1khz. 20hz to 20khz will always be a ton tougher..... furthermore, NAD states the THD at 0.03% not letting it rise to 1% THD. With those factors included i would imagine it would get real close to its stated output. Keep up the great videos!
Yessir, I like to see amps perform well and this one did for sure
It sure did. My home system is ALL NAD, Been in love with NAD products since i was 18 back in 1988. Keep up the great videos.
Paired with Klipsch Forte'...
That was my childhood!!!
Too much of everything is just enough.
Why is the polarity on the right channel wired in reverse? Red from amp goes to black (-) on Dyno?
Are you for real?
I've got two NAD's, a Siverline S200 and the THX 218 They both rock :)
+satanclaw happy to hear you have both of your NADS 😂
Great vid just wish I understood all that stuff, anyway I was wondering if perhaps possible if you could perform the same test with a NAD 2400 Envelope power Amp, do you thing the results will be same?
Maybe in the future
I have this amp (restored) feeding a sub plus the PE 2700TXH powering some Infinity QB's off of a Marantz head unit...sound is fantastic and I'm definitely not hurting for power.
How does is the sound quality compared to other amps?
@@benbryson6598 I can't say for sure as I haven't tested it against other amps in a comparable situation/test. The music I listen to is mainly rock, so I like it loud and in my face...I have viewed posts (on Audiokarma) about modifications you can perform to make is sound "better", but frankly it's really in the ear of the beholder ;)
I have a 2200 that I had rebuilt (repaired rectifier and filter caps and basic upgrade: relays, caps, pcb soldering) I have a pair of Definitive bi pole speakers. I can't turn the volume more than halfway- the volume doesn't get any louder past the halfway mark. It sounds like it's at its max point. Any reason for this?
@Dave Micolichek Clipping is indeed on.
@Dave Micolichek Even when it's turned off, the red light on the clipping blinks. Still can't turn it more than half way.
I was a NAD dealer in the 90’s
In the lit they said that for a sales technique to sharpen each end of a pencil and hook the + & - of one channel to each end of pencil.
While one channel plays music beautifully the pencil will burst into flame. 🔥
Never tried it though...
Now that would be a cool demo!!
That top amp is awesome, but that one on the bottom with the vu meters is beautiful.
+MeatPopsycle the Proton D1200 is a thing of beauty!! Sight and sound!!
NICE VIDEO!
Using car subs to test vintage audio amps. I use 4 ohm car speakers to run in the old amps I restore, mostly NAD amps.
I have a pair of old Crunch V600 and V6004 amps, I wonder how they dyno?
Hi, you restore old NAD amps? i have a working 3080, one toggle sw and one pushbutton need covers, the preamp section is not useable in its current state because of all the scratchy noize. (i only use it as an amp paired with a mini nak compact reciever). And the meter lights are out too.
i could probably take the front end off the chassi and send it to you for a refurb.
Great review, thank you
Thanks for watching and commenting!
Curios why you did 1% distortion vs the spec sheet of oh probably 0.03 or 02% thd? Is it at 1% because of the ihf 202 certified test rating?
No because my equipment measures to 1% and that’s become accepted as a new standard.
Omg that's epic!! Anychance you could see how a sansui 9090db receiver does long shot I know but I feel this monster has got to put out more than the 125wpc rating
The Sansui would be cool to try. Those are incredibly rare at this point
How exactly does that do on work? You have to provide a separate source for the amplifier? You are using an Alpine deck? Do you just run a test tone on a CD or something? Are they 4v preamp signals? Sorry for the last of questions.
+MeatPopsycle see my older video on the Alpine 9815 head unit here: ua-cam.com/video/Fza-1zludTA/v-deo.html I use a CD of test tones, mainly 40Hz and 1kHz. I'll do an update video showing the components I use for testing.
Looking forward for the D1200 dyno test!
+Pedro Mededeiros me too! I sure hope it survives the test!!
To anyone that could guide me here. I've had a NAD 314 and loved the sound of it. I am now moving to a pre-amp/power amplifier set up as I bought a turntable and an integrated amp is not enough anymore.
I've got a pair of Paradigms v7 mini monitor. The speakers are rated at 50 watts, so a power amplifier than can deliver 100 watts per channel is more than enough I think.
However, looking at this video and the description, I now think it could be too much to handle for the speakers and they could get blown.
Are they going to be ok with this amplifier driving them?
Thanks in advance
Could you do one for the nad d3020?
I saw a 3020 demo at the Detroit audio show when these things were new, one 20 watt amp driving four pairs of speakers including a pair of low impedance Heils to quite hella volume.
+Brad Scott they are the "cheater amps" of home audio for sure
Exceptional performance!
+Dennis Mathews I agree. Makes me happy when I get good results
I still wonder how much the legendary 208 THX would do on the dyno. That was NAD's largest power amp from the 90's
According to the manuals, it could do 2x 1000w dynamically in 4 ohms bridged
I don’t doubt it
I have two of them , but never have used the second one... :)
Can I request to bench the 2600 Power Envelope amp as well? I had one of those once and I really never tapped into it's power, but I know the reserve is massive at somewhere around 4db bursts.
Thanks for the suggestion 👌
can you do this with some of the nelson pass adcoms? gfa-535/545/555 - i'd love to see how much headroom they have, they're all supposed to be conservatively rated (60/100/200wpc)
@Dave Micolichek that's the one I have :D going to do a recap soon
@Dave Micolichek thanks for the advice!
very cool, thank you.
Big D, I have the 2001 Harmon Kardon avr 8000. it weighs about 60lbs and retailed I believe for over 2k. What are your thoughts on it ,if any?
+Scott Miller those are BEASTS!!
Have you ever heard of the amp philips pa 1200b
Thanks for your your very informative video, I have a nad 3155 amplifier, I noticed your banana plugs, what banana plugs are they, thanks.
+anthony2010707 I think they are Stinger brand, made for car audio. They are very nice
anthony2010707: I have the 3155 myself. It still works fine, after 35 years. As you know, it is rated at 50 WPC. I bought a 2200 PE in about 1986. Funny thing is, the 3155 is almost as powerful as the 2200. The 1980's NAD's, integrated, as well as power amps,
are real gems. I had one spot of trouble with the 2200, had to replace the output relays.
Still running fine. I use the 3155 as a preamp.
I just bought the NAD 2200….preamp NAD 3020 series 20. Looking for speaker recognition. Currently have Infiniti Alpha 50 and Infiniti subwoofer. One Tweeter burned out when I tested…no load no high volume…I guess just unlucky…new one is $100…so considering new better for my amps combo fit. Thank you!
These amps are 30 plus years old, may need to be serviced
Cool video as always 😊
Og you get the chance please test a NAD 218 THX, would be great to know how much power my trusty amp does 😃
+Ostebulen thanks! I'll most likely move onto other MFG's for now, but you never know what I'll come across to test next 😬
Looking for a power amp saw one on my local CL for $300. Thinking it will be a good purchase for that price.
Yes, but these amps are old and may require some maintenance. There's always a risk with older amps but yeah these are pretty awesome and $300 is a great price if it's in good working and physical condition. I believe these sell for 2x that on eBay.
I love this amp. I have a 2100 as well which sounds more musical to me even though it doesn’t have the power of the 2200. Didn’t know the proton 1200 was the sister amp. Great insight.
Super impressed WOW
Thanks Big D
Thanks for watching and commenting!
Big D can u please test a American Bass amp? I will send u one. Thank you for all u do!!!
One thing to keep in mind when dealing with this type of equipment, is power only goes so far when judging an amp like this. Sound quality is everything. Its easy to make an amp that has a lot of power, but its very expensive (and difficult) to make a powerful amp that sounds good. A good home speaker is far more demanding and less forgiving, than a good car speaker.
NAD has been, and will probably always be a top performer for the money, but its still considered an entry level product (not including the M series. M is better than entry level but it costs a lot more). In reality, I have a 40 watt/ch at 8ohm's stereo amp that will easily outperform this amp in all areas.
The only reason I bring this up, is not to say anything bad about NAD. For the right application I have no problem recommending them. High end home audio is my life's work since I was 18, and the biggest mistake people make, is they make purchases based on specs. You must also listen to any product before you buy it. And you should really try it in your own system. Actually, buying on specs is a tie with underestimating how important the preamp is in your system.
Samtab Galaxy so true since my dad took his klipsch forte iii to Mexico the front speakers that we have now can perform the way those forte could.
Also we also use to own Celestion a4c
And with the klipsch front and added with celestion a4c the system didn't require subs those three could easily perform well but we actually did had the subwoofer but turn low for better punch we used velodyne sub
A good amplifier shouldnt havw a sound it should be neutral. However that is not the case in the industry. And it can be tested to show if an amp is neutral or not. It is not about cost really. More a design aspect.
"A good amplifier shouldnt havw a sound it should be neutral."
There is no such thing. Every amp has a sound of its own. You can have 2 amps with the same specs on paper sound completely different from each other. Not only that, the same exact amp in different systems can sound different as well.
If you want to pick a good amp, you need to look at the specs and listen to it as well. And its not 50/50. Listening to an amp is way more important. A lot of what you hear can't be measured.
That said, you'll see a lot of controversy on this topic. What usually happens, is someone new to audio reads a bunch of reviews, and then goes out and buys some expensive components. They set it all up and it sounds like crap. At that point, it becomes a rip off. Its like going out and buying a race car that's difficult to drive, and expect to do well because you know how to drive a regular car.
Generally speaking, its much more difficult to put together a 25k system than a 5k system. The upside is, the more you know, the less you have to spend.
For anyone that's interested in learning more about audio, go to this web site. You'll see a list of about 15 journals that can be downloaded for free. Audio has been my life's work since I was 16. These journals are the best reference on audio I've ever seen. By far. Start with issue 1, and I bet you won't be able to put it down.
vandersteen.com/audio-perfectionist-journal
Thanks for sharing 🤙