Yaesu FT 710 vs Icom IC 7300 Internal Antenna Tuners, which radio tunes higher SWR
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- Опубліковано 3 лип 2024
- Yaesu FT 710 vs Icom IC 7300 Internal Antenna Tuners, which radio tunes higher SWR I am testing internal antenna tuners for a high SWR on the Yaesu FT 710 and the Icom IC 7300 . Both the Yaesu FT 710 and the Icom IC 7300 are great radios. Both the Yaesu FT 710 and the Icom IC 7300 have internal antenna tuners.
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Thanks Rich; have my 710 for a few weeks now and this really helps. 73 from VA2KDJ
Thank you for watching my video!
What do you think of this reply I received this morning. It does make some sense.Yes but do remember the antenna still has a true SWR of 3:1, so completely mismatched to the radio. What the ATU has done is effectively fooled the radio into believing it is “seeing” a resonant 50 ohm match. As Randall says, you’d be far better spending the time to improve the antenna than fooling the system. There is no substitute for a resonant antenna, and in an “ideal” world you should not need to use the ATU at all, and “ideal” really does exist.
Incidentally the ATU should be called an antenna matching unit (AMU) as they don’t tune the antenna they merely match it - aka fool the radio into believing something is what it isn’t. But, good luck with your radio. Improve the antenna and you will definitely improve your enjoyment.
Hi Muskrat, Yes, I could build 1 antenna that matches pretty close. I have a multiband full wave loop. 80-10 meters. I cut the loop to have the best performance for all bands mainly 80,40, 20, 15 and 10. I cut my loop to the CW portion of the 80 meter band at 3.588 the SWR is 1.3. If I go to the SSB portion of the band say 3.980 MHz the SWR shoots to about 7, why? Because there is about 4 KHz higher in frequency and the antenna is resonant at 3.588. It is simple math. Let say if I just cut a dipole for CW at 3.580 MHz Math tells us the total length would be 130.73 ft total. Then say you want to work 75 meters SSB and the frequency you want to work is 3.980 MHz Do you think your antenna you cut to the CW portion of the band will be flat SWR on that SSB frequency? No! Because the frequency range is so much your SWR would be high, and you would need most likely an antenna matcher. Your total length would be 117.6 ft total or about 13 feet shorter. So that is why you have to have an antenna matcher. Here are my results for my 80 loop without a matcher for the lowest portion of the bands.
3.588 --- 1.3
7.161. --- 1.9
14.269 --- 3.3 I am not sure why SWR on 20 meters is so high?
21.290 --- 2.0
28.010 --- 2.5
Just probably worth remembering that the limits of a tuner isn’t really based on the SWR (a 3:1, 5:1 or 10:1 ratio cap), but rather the limits are based on the minimum and maximum of both capacitance and inductance that the tuner can produce as to cancel out those mismatches in the antenna system. So it’s hard to generalize what the limits are. The good news is that my finding is consistent with yours for the ftDx10, in that it can successfully match SWR mismatches in excess of 3:1. I just don’t think that it will match every conceivable 5:1 mismatch.
This is true! How do you like your Ftdx10? What did you have before the 10?
@@RichRodgersOnline I am quite happy with the ftDx10, though it took a lot of tweaking and experimentation to get the transmit audio set how I wanted it! The other radio I have is the Xiegu G90-it has a really impressive internal tuner, but the AGC on it is not great, so that combined with the lack of DSP makes it so noisy to listen to compared to the Yaesu. I got a BHI mk4 noise canceling speaker, which does definitely help, but will static crash a little after transmit as it reacclimates to the characteristics of the noise. .. my primary complaint about the Yaesu radio (versus the icom or Xiegu) is the meter, which does not allow you to see things like SWR, Power Out, AGC and the like at the same time. Seems silly.
That is interesting. Do you use your contour filter on your Yaesu? If so, what do you have it set to?
Appreciate the your testing and Yeasu FT-710 Tuner seems to show results . But I request you to to test with dummy loads using 50 Ohms and 250 ohms pure resistors. Anyhow thank you once again . My FT-710 will be delivered shortly . So your video helps me . (VU2RMU)
Thank you for watching my video
I sold the 710 to my brother in law.
The only thing I don't like about the 710 is the waterfall isn't as smooth as the 7300. I know that's dumb but seems like something they could get right.
You might email them. They may just fix it with an update.
"Antenna'lyzer"........hmm that's a clever accident, you should trademark that. K7KS
LOL Oklahoma accent
What it tells you is that the tuner in the 7300 is better as it will protect your radio better than the 710. If your SWR is that high then every effort should be to look at the antenna system/coax in the first instance.
Hi there, let's first look at my antenna. It's about 273 feet long. It's cut for 80 meter CW portion of the band. At 3.505 MHz, I don't need a tuner. But if I go up 450 KHz on th SSB, My SWR will go up because my antenna resonate frequency is not cut for that frequency. And if I am using the same antenna for other bands. I will need a tuner to bring the SWR down as well. The IC 7300 antenna tuner only tunes to as high as a 3 to 1 SWR. Where the 710 can tune up to 5 to 1 SWR. I try to have an antenna with good SWR when I change bands the SWR of my antenna changes. Thus an antenna tuner.
@@RichRodgersOnline Rich, I would be inclined to use an external ATU in that instance rather than putting pressure on your radio. The internal tuners are really only designed to sweeten out a nearly resonant antenna so for something like your antenna, something outside of your rig would be a smart move.
I have an LGD auto tuner.
Makes no sense whatsoever
Is that it tells you?
I don't understand when you push the tune button. It should put the transmitter into low power and then restore the power back to a hundred watts when done tuning
I know, I was surprised! But set on low power, the 7300 would tune on higher SWR. I don't understand either
@@RichRodgersOnline Icom folds back power to prevent damage
Does the 710 have a 10:1 emergancy tuner mode like the 7300?
No 'emergency mode' that lets you tune up to 10:1,
@@RichRodgersOnline in EMERGENCY MODE, it will tune up to 10:1 SWR, but limits power to 50 watts power. To enable emergency tuner mode, you can:
Go to Menu
Select Set
Select Other
Select Emergency
Select Tune
Click OK
Click That
The radio will restart
The emergency mode is documented in the IC-7300's advanced manual.
Turn your power down to 50 watts on the 710 and you have emergency mode. It's a gimmick on the 7300. At 50 watts a 10:1 becomes @ 3:1 reflection.
@@AlpineWarren 3:1 tuner vs 10:1 tuner. I'll take 50 watts on a non-resonant WARC band over nothing at all.
@@AlpineWarren The Icom will not TX with a 10:1 unless you enable the feature. This forces user to acknowledge the condition and radio won't have a 100 watt oops. Sure you can turn the Yaesu down to 50 watts - and forget, then burn up your radio when you go back and crank it back to 100 without correcting the swr issue. Maybe you see that as a gimmick, I see it as a good idea that Yaesu could have incorporated into their software at little to no cost, but that won't sell more radios so....
Isn’t the scale to the right of 3:1 logarithmic?
I really don't know!
@@RichRodgersOnline check the manual. If it’s log then what you are thinking is 5:1 may be closer to 15:1….
NO, 5:1 is 5:1 on the FT-710 meter.
What is a good tuner for the 710?
The 710 has a great tuner built in. However, Palomar, LDG and MFJ are some which I think of..
@goinghomesomeday1 probably so, but my LDG AT- 1000 Pro II does a pretty good job!
I use a MAT-30...works great.
if you get the correct anttena set up you don`t need a tuner or matcher.
I am using a full wave loop for 80 Meter full wave loop. It works 80 through 10 meters with a tuner.
That statement has been around the block a few times....but it's as wrong now as it was when someone in the dark first said it. If all you do is talk on one frequency ( Say in 11 meters where that statement originates) you are correct....set antenna resonance at the lowest SWR for that frequency...no tuner required....but as soon as you have a multi band antenna...that is no longer possible and a tuner is required !
My tuner won't even make a noise on my end fed lol
I used to have a end fed. It worked great. Now I have a 80 Full wave loop it has a little better gain. But then I have to use a tuner in some areas.
@@RichRodgersOnline wow loop covers 10-80
@@KE8ODY-WV-Ares-Ham-Dad-3O4 ua-cam.com/video/TqE_W_0Le0k/v-deo.html
Early in video, the Icom didn't show the 5 swr because the Icom folds back power in the case of high swr - @ 100 watts it isn't 100 watts either, it is folding back power to prevent damage to radio. Too bad the Yaesu doesn't do that. Next, you tuned the Yaesu @ 10 watts then took it up to 100, but in the Yaesu you tuned it with 10 watts then raised it to 100. Your video is not consistent. Tune the 5 swr on the Icom with 10 watts then raise power the same way you did the Yaesu before declaring a winner - - you can't do it different ways for each radio and make a fair assessment.
Where did you get this info, that the FT-710 does not fold back power when tuning??? I just checked mine, watching the watt meter with the rig set on 100 watts as the antenna tuner is tuning it folds back to around 2 watts. Also I checked the rig and it has swr protection, without the tuner in line with a high swr the rig folds back power!
@@johnwofford2708 I said the ICOM folds back power (read again above) so you are saying that I said something I did NOT say - I did SEE in video the Yaesu keyed and shows an SWR 5 where the Icom shows 3 - because the Icom folds back is what I said - again, see above. Don't take what I say and twist it around to be something other. The ICOM won't show that 5 swr because it is folding back power. The Yaesu SHOULD BE also folding back power to not be showing over a 3 to protect itself. Anything thing you'd like to add Jim! ? Is the yaesu not keying, in video, to show a 5 swr, in TX mode?? Let's see YOUR video Jim with same conditions of your Yaesu not letting swr go over 3, how's that... I'll wait.
Maybe I mis-understood but here is what you said "Early in video, the Icom didn't show the 5 swr because the Icom folds back power in the case of high swr - @ 100 watts it isn't 100 watts either, it is folding back power to prevent damage to radio. Too bad the Yaesu doesn't do that" It sure sounds like you said the Yaesu is not folding back power to prevent damage. Sorry if I did not understand you correctly
For The 10 watt test the tuner was on.probably had a partial or previous tune in memory. That is why you didn’t get an SWr of 5