A lot of buyers guides but have not seen a lot of discussion about avoid having buyers remorse which was an interesting thing that I could not get out of my head, so I hope you find the topic interesting. If you experienced buyers remorse in the game then let me know in the comments
Unfortunately I've experienced this with Razbam modules. The quality from other modules is just significantly better so I regret not spending the money on buying my friends their modules
Can't agree more, really good topic and some deep insights. While I don't regret it, I switched from flying the Gazelle for ages (waiting for the KW), to the F-15E. I did it together with my wingman who was then my pilot in the 15E, but he didn't enjoy the module (and the new squadron) as much as I did, switched back to helos, flying the AH-64. I never wanted to fly the 64 because I'm a scout guy.. but after a while, I trialed the 64, flew some with my buddy in the CPG seat, and now I'm fully back to rotaries and don't regret it a second. The module is pretty good although I still can't wait for the OH-58D.. but just flying together with him again more than makes up for the shortcomings of the aircraft.
@@BobinificationWell yeah, true.. but I'd rather trial for a whole week as many hours as I'd like than 2h and a minute after that you're f*cked, especially given how long it takes to get to grips with most modules.
I have a lot of modules that I haven’t flown much, I know the basics and how to fly and stuff, but I haven’t had much time to use them all or get in the game in general. Though it’s like man I spent a lot of money with no play return. But I love planes and I know I’ll get to them eventually so that’s the only reason I’ve avoided buyers remorse. I’m not picky either so I’ve enjoyed them all for the little time I’ve flown them
I am on the same boat, it is kinda funny (or maybe not) that whenever I get some spare time where I plan to sit down and really play DCS, life and work kicks me in the rear end. And that kick hits hardest when I click the Buy button for a module I really want to get.
I’m the same, it’s more the time than the cost; I bought the Strike Eagle on release but I’ve hopped into it maybe 3 times - I actually forgot I had it until reading comments on here. But I don’t regret buying it because £60 or whatever it cost isn’t that much, really - and I’m sure I will eventually get around to it, by which point it’ll be nearer completion anyway. Plus I don’t mind supporting Razbam as I’ve always been a huge fan of the Mirage 2000, and I want the Flogger sooner 😅
@@Bullet4MyEnemy yeah it’s that, I put money into the game so I’m satisfied with just supporting the game knowing that when I’m in the mood and have time I can hop into any of the many modules I have lol
I'm glad I bought it when I did and on sale. Was one of my first modules when I had no idea what I was doing and my expectations were extrmeely low. Also bought it on sale so I didn't lose much money on it.
Over the years I bought a module or two every sale, and stayed home a couple times instead of going out to essentially pay for the new toys. The Yak-52 I've spent 2 hours in? The $20 would have just been a few beers and a burger instead. That also makes early access easy to deal with - I already paid, I get to decide if I want to invest serious time in a new plane or wait until certain features are finished.
The "what level of completion and standards means early access vs. full release?" is an interesting question. Overall DCS does suffer a lot from ED's lack of ability or interest in setting up some basic standards. Related is the lack of standardization overall. It's insane there isn't some fairly well developed standard radar sim that devs (including ED) can tweak/ use while they perfect a specific model.
I want to clarify my 2nd point regarding Early Access because on watching this a second time, I feel like I did not 'land the plane' on the point entirely. The point of this video is not to dissuade people but rather to just inform people that the increase in choice can be immediately perceived as a good thing but it can make you feel like you did not make the best choice when you select a thing to purchase. EA is one of these hot topics where people can feel burned, as it may take a long time to finish so I thought it was prudent to mention as people should feel good about what they buy and in the end, it may just really be a reflection of how expansive the game is getting in terms of module selection
It is not expencive if you buy a module or map on sale and take your time to learn it ans use it properly ...... folks are buyng a bulk of jets and choppers only to find out they cannot gain knowledge on all those in short period of time and than get frustrated about it .... I know folks with 10-15+ modules that only fly like 2-3 and the rest are just there....... Folks cannot understand the complexity of it and why you need one module to focus on before moving into the next one
I think there is two categories or even more. You have the newby first timers wanting to try a flight sim for the first time, there are those that had done flight sims years ago and want to get back into it, and there's those avid simmers who hang on every word/promise about upcoming modules as they seek to satisfy their love of the game.
Standards, to include a feature roadmap, would significantly help in this regard. The F1 is one of my favorites, but the lack of communication on RADAR modeling and the M variant has made me wish I had waited a bit longer.
@NOTJustANomad I'm in agreement 2000% percent. I fly only in VR and it happens to me all the time. Not intentionally, but because in VR it's a manual work out and you are twisting and turning like you would in real life and not having that restriction is a real immersion killer. The 2D boys don't understand it because you don't have to turn your head at all hardly to check your 6
I sit in a racing seat so i cant do that. If i should do pvp it would be better for me to use trackir but since i will only fly vr pvp is not an option for me.
NOOOOO do not do this! or if they do it needs to be togglable, I fly vertical reference in helicopters on dcs and it is only possible because I'm able to go outside of the cockpit.
From personal Experince the chart with the F-14, F-18 and F-16 is in correct in regards to the hornet. All the red items for the hornet were available at the release of the F-16, although no telling how many times ED has changed the logic and in game use of them. They only Item on the list for the F-18 that is not "complete" (using that real loosely) is the CM's the flare count has been off since day one and Matt, Norm, BN etc have all acknowledged it but changing the number of digitally coded things another digitally coded thing is apparently up there with moving mountains and world peace.
This is such a great topic! Thanks for looking into it. My tip to avoiding buyers regret is to avoid buying anything until you have a PC that can handle the ecosystem to a level you are satisfied with! I have stopped buying anything for the moment (or even flying) until this criterion is satisfied. This is not sour grapes just a practical observation.
Sorry for the wall of text. TL:DR, had an instant regret moment with some mods, changed my mind a few days later I purchased a set of FC3 aircraft, particularly Su-27, MiG-29 and F-15 while on discount. A year later, FC3 as a package got a 50% discount, so I got the upgrade. This subsequent purchase got me the case of buyers remorse at the beginning, since the package jumbled up my missions, the planes did not come with adequate training materials, some of the stuff I got used to, like MiG-29 wallpaper disappeared, and my controls got defaulted. This all happened after I started getting into the A-4E-C and T-45 mods, so I just felt angry at myself for "wasting money". But a few days later I landed my Su-33 on the Admiral Kuznetsov and changed my mind. Now, although I don't understand the mechanism behind buyers' remorse, I do understand that sometimes your hobby won't instantly give you the satisfaction you're looking to squeeze out of it. EDIT: I'm running my game on an obsolete PC, so MP is out of the question. The rig has troubles running full fidelity mods at a satisfactory framerate even in solo missions. I mostly fly just for the love of flying and aerobatics.
You can try to launch missions from multiplayer server. Not sure if it is still a thing, but launching a dedicated server was improving frame rates for me. However, now that I wrote this: I think it was pre multi-threading implementation. Maybe now it will not do anything good?
video summary: 1. buy a module based on who you can fly it with. at least take it into account. 2. be careful with early access/pre-orders. 3. buy on sale. to me personally I will always trial a module, sometimes even twice to give myself time to consider if it's worth it. by having a 6 month period, you get to re-visit the idea of purchasing multiple times. and each time it will make you consider more aspects of the module and learn more about it + what you are likely going to do with it. Out of all the modules I have, the only thing I bought without a trial was the Mi-24P because I know I love its quirks and it has a decent reputation amongst its fliers. the two modules on my current considering-to-buy list are the JF-17 and the Gazelle. so far I haven't had much of buyers remorse, if at all, with the modules I have bought: Viggen, MiG-21bis, Mi-24P, Su-27, F-15C, Su-25, Supercarrier, Syria, Persian Gulf. If I have to name two modules that I haven't got the chance to use much, it is the Supercarrier and Persian Gulf. The former due to me having neither the Tomcat nor the Hornet. The latter due to the lack of good servers running PG.
+1 for the Jeff, I love it. It’s basically the F-20 that we’ll never get, but more modern and Eastern. IMO Deka’s done a solid job with it and I’m looking forward to their J-8II.
@@ilovetomcats contrary to popular belief, the JF-17 is more of a western plane in the inside. Deka even wrote it word to word in their manual: "Although you may have expected the JF-17 to be a so-called "red" aircraft, the fact is that this aircraft is an out-and-out "blue" aircraft from design concept to operation. If you want to experience the real "socialist flavor", look forward to our second module." on page 297 in the HOTAS section.
I got the hardest buyers remorse from the f-15e and thats the only one. Smth abt it. Like I had the f-18, f-16, and a-10. But I wanted a rly good dedicated heavy strike deep pen aircraft, only to find it was arguably more fun to do that with the hornet. Only time I’ve had fun with it was flying two ship where we both had WSOs. That was SUPER fun, like f-14 multicrew on steroids, but other than that, it’s been boring.
Ways that I have found to avoid buyers remorse: Use the 2 week free trials. Sure, they aren't available for all modules, but it has kept me from buying things I didn't love. Watch a bunch of videos on UA-cam of people flying the aircraft. Gives you an idea of how niche the module is, how difficult the controls are, etc. Only buy modules that are on sale. If things don't hit the sale, it's likely because they are new and not fleshed out anyhow. Lastly, only buy modules that get you excited. If you're excited to fly the module, it helps get you motivated to get good with it. It does make me a little salty that the F1CE doesn't have a radar missile in ecw, since I prefer to fly the f1 over the mig21
I love that of all the DCS UA-cam content creators yours is the most thought provoking and I'm an avid follower despite being 99.8% single player. I disagree slightly with point #1, I'd narrow it down slightly to what type module do your friends who like *flying the same mission types* like. My friends who I fly with love the Viggen and Mud Hen; they love deep strikes, but I love self-escort air assaults in the Hind. And sadly none of my friends love the L-39 the way I do. You're an arts guy, so I would say individual module preference is like musical tastes--you and your girlfriend or best friends might mesh really well with values and temperament, but might have radically different musical tastes. I can get better music/module advice from a stranger on the Internet than the people I love spending the most time with. For ragrets, I'd say the South Atlantic map. Not because of the (lagging but improving) quality, but lack of content. I decided not to buy any more maps until there is a server or single player content (eg campaign or Pretense or Variable style mission) that requires it. OTOH I kinda want Sinai after seeing the street level detail in your video. Keep up the great work, Ligma!
You really nailed the multiplayer point. I played for about 1 year solo before jumping into multiplayer. My learning rate accelerated dramatically as did my enjoyment of flying in DCS. I learned more in 2 months of flying multiplayer with experienced sim pilots (and even some real pilots!) than I did in the previous year learning on my own. Community makes it so much better.
One way to avoid buyer's remorse would be to make sure you enjoy picking up what DCS is putting down. By default, DCS comes with a non-clicking combat aircraft in the Su-25T, and a clickable non-combat aircraft in the TF-51. The free mod A-4 Skyhawk, being a clickable combat craft, fills in the blank quite nicely, and you can use it to tell if DCS' loop for using obscure and novel systems to get warheads on foreheads works for you or not, before you take the plunge into other modules. (Though admittedly I started with the Huey because I liked flying helicopters in ARMA, the Skyhawk was my first clickable plane, because I bounced off the Su-25T.) I only wish the Skyhawk had integrated training missions, although I suppose if a player doesn't like using, say, DCS Sport's Skyhawk tutorials or the kneeboard/manual to get a handle on the systems, they won't find the other planes very fun, and they'll find that out before *buying* the other planes.
Certainly there are some modules and maps that I don’t frequent too much but I wouldn’t say buyers remorse. It’s always good to have options. The way I look at it is that I’m encouraging these companies to support the hobby that I enjoy so much.
hey, I have buyers remorse mostly when I buy and realise I don't have time to fly it, or the instruction/training videos are unfinished or buggy, which further impacts my time to fly.
I keep going back to the classic Russian aircraft. Mi-8, MiG-15, MiG-19, MiG-21. They are just so very 'hands-on' and not sterile like the Hornet for example (i love the Hornet but a bit too much 'iPhone' factor). F-4 is currently an FPS slideshow for me, but I think I will like her too (she sure is a beauty)
Good video and some very good points, more light definitely needs to be shined on the lack of a real "standard" for modules. I personally have felt some buyers regret when i got the harrier, when it first came out, its a lot better now but it definitely burned me.
Just trial any module before you buy, if not sure, wait 6 months trial again. The only module i have a Slight remorse from buying is the KA-50 but considering it was my first module and i didnt have rudder pedals at the time, I did fly it a lot back then, but now 80% of my time is MF1 and Gazelle, As long as you Trial before buy, its very unlikely remorse will be a thing. Also Steam has 2 hours refund policy for any DLC that includes DCS so that was how I "trialed" the MF1, I loved it after 50min, but if i didn't the refund was an option.
As a new player I got the C-101 because I thought it had pretty cool capabilities with the Sea Eagle anti-ship missile. Little did I know that its use is non-existent on MP and is not expected to be updated any time soon. What a waste.
I felt burned by the MiG-21 back in 2013. The standard just wasn't there with the Ka-50 and A-10C (still isn't). But I've grown attached to it. On the topic of early access and standards, something funny I noticed is that between the modules listed on the main menu, there are about 7 different permutations of "Early Access": EA, WIP, Beta, beta, etc.
For me, I somewhat regret buying the Apache and the F15E, not bad modules just I don’t find them particularly fun and find myself gravitating back to the Hind or the F14/F1.
F16 is the only module I fly since day one, I bought it on the day it was released in early access. Maybe because I fell in love with Falcon 4.0 back in 1998. That gave me patience to wait for it do develop fully. No regret there. I was flying and enjoying it even when my ass was kicked in dogfights because of Vipers massive underperformance back then. It seems like now everything works fine. I like to buy maps though, it's fun to fly in different parts of the world. Waiting for sales and using standalone trials is a great idea. Thank you for the video.
Honestly, I have buyers remorse for every module not featured on ECW. I play other servers too to play those modules, but I don't enjoy them as much whenever you just have 1-2 hours of free time. I want to love the AH64, but I don't enjoy it in a fox1 setting every server has where it is allowed. Same for M2000. I love it, but wish I could do fox 2 and gun fights with her. I have 100% remorse of the F18 and F16. 50% remorse for F14, M2000 25% remorse for the Ah64 (still hoping I'll find a place to enjoy her) And there is the normandy +WW2 asset etc. WW2 is fun but not worth all that money in the current DCS WW2 setting
@@NOTJustANomad It is tied to the rest of my comment. I don't like fox1 settings and hate fox 3 settings. The F14 is a cool aircraft to fly but I don't like the jetplay on the servers she in on in MP (Fox1/Fox3). The most fun I've had with her is in practice Fox2+guns dogfights with friends. Also, I hate jester to the core. The times he misidentifies my locked target as 'friendly' while it is enemy, getting me killed, are just too often. I understand he should not be perfect, but as a player in the back the IFF takes 1 second and is 100% accurate. No need for jester to take 5 sec and misidentify
Finally I've found proof the audience my hypothetical server built around modern jets but only heaters and guns for air to air combat, and dumb bombs/rockets for air to ground, exists.
@@Why485you'd have to balance the Redfor heaters (basically better than fox 1) and 9X can't be part of it either. Rear and side aspect only like the 9P3 as best
My buyer's regret over DCS is pretty minor, and I think it's because I've asked around in discord servers before actually getting my hands on modules. The modules that I own but have played the least are: the F-18, which I used to learn a lot about the core of DCS, and taught me that full modern wasn't something I liked. The F-16, which I used as another shot at full modern (probably a bit of buyer's remorse on that one). The Hip, because I usually just fly the Hind, but I know is a lot of fun and will be turning more attention to soon. The F-5, that I bought to understand a bit more but never planned on maining. The Viggen, which I got because a friend of mine loved it and never really took the time to fly. I think I regret very little of my many DCS purchases because each and every one of them has been fuelled by passion. I just really like DCS, and i've made a lot of good friends over it. Also, Electronic Arts and Ubisoft did me a solid when I was 12-13 by releasing games that really dissapointed me and vaccinated me from preordering. Now, I tend to buy soon after release (backing myself with whatever feedback I can get) rather than preorder.
Love that you made a spreadsheet showing the sales! If there is a new module coming out for an icon plane I love I'll buy it. Otherwise I just wait until a sale. But frankly I have a backlog of modules I need to learn
Got a few too many modules myself, the only regret I have is the HAWK as it was dropped and abandoned... basically turned into money out the window. The rest, even if I don't frequently fly, I do enjoy. (A10 and KA50 are on the HAWK's list slightly, as they are greedily trying to rip off more money for an update on the module, but at least I can still access their older versions if I so choose to do so.
To this day, I have not paid full price for any module. And I have most of them. My biggest remorse comes from the F-16 - I just don't care for it. The Mirage F-1 - I just don't like flying it. It feels underwhelming in both AA and AG. And the Apache - The Apache is just so good at what it does, it doesn't even feel like a challenge. "Hey George, see that? Make it dead.... cool." Honestly, the most hours and fun I've had are in the Mig-21, it is finished, it is surprisingly good, and it just makes me smile. The Hind AND Hip are just too much fun. I have to flip a coin to decide which to fly. If you don't care about the guided missiles, go with the Hip. You can carry troops and many MANY explosion inducing items. It's a great multi use workhorse in ECW. The Hornet/Tomcat are just great. They can both give you fun carrier ops, air to air, and air to ground, and the Hornet radar actually works now. And lastly.... The F-86 Sabre. Yes, the Sabre. Is it useful? No. Not really. But, my God, does it feel great when you do get a kill in ECW. You go in knowing you're outmatched, even against helicopters. So it's a fun challenge to just try. Lastly, if you like AG stuff, the A-10C. SEAD/DEAD missions are a hair raising blast. You can do a lot of damage because you carry so much more ordinance than anyone else. But... it's slow. So keep that in mind.
My buyers regret is found with the South Atlantic map. I chalk it up to early access and not be to the standard found in other maps. It also seems to be a map that people bought and seldom play within my circle of gameplay. Too much water and not enough quality airfields with enough parking for larger server play seems another issue. I wish I never spent the money with the South Atlantic. Early access is a real problem and one that creates the most buyers remorse for me.
All your points are valid. Some modules have frustrating shortcomings, but I actually have no buyer's remorse for any aircraft. I buy only on sale, and I think the price for such a realistic simulation of a military aircraft is very fair in all cases. The F1 radar does look worrying though... The thing I do have some buyer's remorse over are maps. I don't get how they can be as or more expensive as the planes. A lot of them don't even look that good, and most buildings and static assets look like poop. The moment you go down low, you are teleported from 2024 to 2005. You are forced to buy them to play many campaigns and to have MP options. Normandy is the only map I think looks great and is worth the price. WWII asset pack should also just be free and come with DCS world. It was a pain to buy both a map, an asset pack, and a plane to get into WWII.
I have almost every module and buy everything via Steam for personal reasons. I don't try to learn everyone like the back of my hand, but like to at least be able to operate it enough to be effective.
For me I look at buying modules like buying something else on the menu at your favorite restaurant. Because of the quality of the establishment you know the quality will likely be there but you are not always sure if it will appeal to your palette, only after sampling different menu items do you know where your tastes really lie. There are some new menu items I may hold off on until I feel they have the quality ironed out and others I should have probably read the Yelp reviews( I ordered the Gazelle in 2022) before ordering but by and large I don't regret my decisions.
In reguards to Steam, alot of Steam users think that they will lose all their purchases if they move to Standalone. ED should communicate this alot better on their front page that you can move your purchases from Steam to standalone.
Buyer's guide, buy fc3, look after red or blue coalition which u like more, then naturally pick cold war plane just to play it on enigma's cold war. And also pick it with ur hear, i like the viggen, my pick is viggen
Funny enough, I haven't had buyer's remorse but I have wondered why I bought it and that's Persian gulf map. I bought it on sale and then half a year later looked at it and realized I hadn't flown it once. I eventually did realize though that i bought it because it's the only map with a modern city with skyscrapers and fighting between those skyscrapers is a wholly different experience!
I love Enigma, having the real discussions in DCS. I regret a lot of my DCS purchases but always lied to myself that I was supporting the devs by buying things even if I didnt fully intend flying it.
The Harrier got me, I was so excited for it and started learning it as soon as it released. I was getting pretty good and then we got a major update and everything changed, turns out all the avionics where wrong on release and everything I had learnt wasn't how it worked anymore. I haven't played it in years because of that wasted time investment. If you are going to release a module with incomplete avionics that's fine, just don't change how they fundamentally work. The F/A-18 is a good example of it done right, no major changes just blank pages being populated with updates.
Actually, what happened to the DCS Harrier is not unrealistic. I think real life Harrier at one point got a better targeting pod but the software of the MFD had not been updated. So the button descriptions were wrong on top of the changes to the pilot's muscle memory. But I understand the pain. I got back to the Harrier after reading some books about it.
Honestly, I don't regret buying any of the modules or maps that I own. Now, there are ones that I fly more often than others, I do not regret buying the ones that I don't fly much. My lowest one is probably the Fw-190A8 but I don't regret buying it. I own all the helicopters but fly mostly the UH-1, Ka-50 III, and the AH-64D but I don't regret the Mi-8, Mi-24, and the Gazelle. As for those that don't like the Sinai map are they that don't know history very well. That map should be a GOD send for Cold War era combat as there was more warfare there in that time period than anywhere else in the world, and you can start off with WWII aircraft, move to Korean War era jets, then to Vietnam Era and finally all the way up to 1991 when the wall came down and beyond to modern times. It and the Syria map are the two most diverse maps that are currently out there. I don't do much WWII stuff and don't own any of the maps, but I do own the Fw-190A8, P-47, and Me-109 and the WWII Assests Pack but rarely use any of them. The only WWII plane I have not liked, and thus not bought, is the Mossie. I got it to trial, and I have disliked it each time, so I haven't pulled the trigger on it. As for the future, I am looking forward to the CH-47, C-130, Bo-105, PC-9, and the A-1, I'm just not into any of the jets that are coming up, including the much-vaunted F-4.
My Buyers Remorse story for DCS is 2 fold. for one i have way to many modules and i cant keep up with all of them. I generaly just fly the same 3 or 4 modules and rarely if ever touch the others so forget procedures and dont want to relearn those modules. Secondly Dumb decissions to buy modules i was never fully invested in, without testing them first (2 week trial could be a life safer there). I wish they would bring Module trading back because i would instantly get rid of 2 or 3 aircraft i never fly. For now they are collecting dust in the hangar. Another issue i have is when you get a early acces module and they add or revamp procedures while i am taking a break from said module. It changes so much that it feels like i dont know the jet i previously knew inside out anymore.
I only regret keeping buy modules. That seem will never be fully complete if they keep piling on more not complete modules. Super carrier is a perfect example of this. Super carrier has no flight model. But in development for what 5 years? New features added to modules have yet to get updated training missions. Which is why I will take a pause on buy products until I see things being wrapped up.
I actually have a higher tolerance for early access missing features than what I have for “finished” modules that carry known bugs for 8 years (many of the warbirds have these) to favor new modules with new money injection. ED favors grabbing new purchases while pissing off existing customers by neglecting older modules.
Guessing you're not a helicopter guy because you didn't mention the Gazelle. It took 6 years to get a realistic flight model leaving many, many people disappointed. Not me though.
I have almost literally every jet plane in DCS (the P-51, the Yak-52, the Ka-50, the UH-1 and Mi-8 are outliers I have purchased - and though I've barely used them , helos especially, I do no regret purchasing them)... I also have almost all the maps. I'm not a helo guy, so aside from the ones I mentioned above I don't buy helos. Obviously, I don't have time to fly all of the modules I own - so I generally choose one for a period of time to focus on. Sometimes my focus changes quickly, other times it does not. For example, I've been focusing on the Mirage F1 since it more or less came out, continuing today. In that same period of time, the F-15E came out - I pre-ordered it even. Yet I have not even sat in the cockpit and bound the controls for it yet... The F-4 is due to release in EA shortly... I may switch to the Phantom from the Mirage F1 when that occurs - further pushing back my attention toward the F-15E. Add to that the fact that SEAD is my preferred mission profile (and the F-16 is my preferred platform for that mission). The only real way to avoid "buyer's remorse" is not to ask the community what they think is the best - and get the plane you like, based on what's available. You also don't need to be every module (including maps). Some servers may require you to have certain modules, true, but unless you really REALLY want to be on that server - those purchases are optional. Every plane you buy in DCS, you must WANT to buy - because YOU want to buy it, not because someone you don't know online told you to.
Remorse: FC3... I've only ever used the F15 and A10A. Early Access: There should be a progress list actively updated and communicated on. Grinnelli should be the standard in this area. I think we all understand programing delays and that timelines can slide but look at Grinnelli's list of completed items and know what you are getting!
As someone who mainly plays singleplayer because I don't have the time to learn the planes enough to be competitive in multiplayer, it really feels like DCS is missing things to do. I buy all these modules because they look cool and fun, I fly them around a little in free flights, and then I don't really know what to do after that. Campaigns are a good start, but there's too few of them, their quality can be questionable, and they are rarely updated. The dynamic campaign will hopefully solve this problem but for now, I think a lot of buyer's remorse stems from the fact that there's not a whole lot to do with these beautifully modeled aircraft.
I’d recommend just sending it and hopping on to a server anyways. I used to also just fly only singleplayer, but I recently started playing on MP (mostly ECW & TBF) and I finally got a friend to also start flying with me and it’s been the most fun I’ve had in the game. It can be frustrating going up and feel like you’re not even a challenge for the opposing side (or AI…), but I try to frame it as a learning experience. I’ve really found my place flying rotary wing, something I wasn’t really interested in until I was flying NOE doing troop drops, dodging AAA, coordinating A-G strikes, and killing Hinds on ECW.
You have all the YT tutorials avail as well as Chuck's guides to properly learn a module .... looking cool is not what you want from an aircraft only but also the be able to extract the most out of it ... DCS is orientated towards humans interacting and there are many training servers to learn with others insted of the silly freef light option :)
You should hone any skill at least once a week to maintain your skill level. Twice a week to improve. And three times a week to improve fast. It is just natural that module number 3+ will feel much worse value.
Whatever. I have been flying ED sims since 1995, exclusively. Been in mp scene for really long time and now having three kids I just quit. All that is being mentioned how incomplete mp always is especially regarding missiles and unfinished products... Omg we can write a history book about that. NOT ONLY ED. How long F-14 is now in EA? I fly a lot of payable campaigns and fun missions of my own design, because I can pause or stop at anytime and help in the house. I have completed campaigns on nearly every module. Can't wait for Save Game feature to return to ED sim. We used to have it back in the 90ties.
The only regret I had was my first purchase, I was really passionate about the Mig-21 but people told me it would be too hard for a beginner to try, I was convinced to try the Mirage 2000C instead. While it had some cool things I HATED that plane, it drove me crazy and funny enough, free trials came out like a couple weeks later, tried the MiG-21 and it was so lovely. I uninstalled the M2K and never looked back.
as for the 'market analysis' at the grocery store at the start: whenever I see some of them with their 'samples' trying to sell their stuff i always cringe inside. the employee that has to do that is dying inside having demeaned him/herself to this. and it always shines through in their bubbly 'THIS IS FINE' overly friendly fake approach. I die a little inside and so does the employee that has to do it.
All great insights. Here’s what I do. I keep my expectations low, that way I’m not disappointed. Early access means, incomplete and unfortunately that can be at different levels, so brace. Good point about standards, there should be a standard on how incomplete a module can be before it should be released. Finally, I can remember when games where always shipped complete. Then we got what was called buggy games that had to be patched. Then to early access, beta and even alpha versions being released for a fee. It’s been a decline to say the least. As for flight simulation, you either love it or you don’t. It’s like buying a Jeep Wrangler, a person knows they want it without test driving it, because they are different. I feel most flight simmers fit in that category. However, we are very technical and like perfection and that is the rub with half finished modules.
I've never flown anything other than the free mod A-4 Skyhawk, but with games I never preorder. I thought about writing a long bit about preorders and the issues with it, but the long and short of it is; be informed about your purchases. If you preorder, you can't be informed. I've never seen any preorder bonus or sell worth giving up the ability to make a informed purchase.
Difficult to tell, but other than the Hawk (Which was at least seriously on sale) maybe the Strike Eagle. I really like air to ground stuff but I find the loadouts a little restrictive; also I haven't had a huge amount of time for DCS lately so I haven't been able to put much time on it. Super deep computer button pushing is getting less fun for me now. I get it'll be really useful for some deep penetration strikes you don't have ARMs and stuff. honestly unless you need to kill planes or fly a million miles the harrier just works better for me. I suspect een the F-4 is going to be more fun for me tbh.
I have most modules, and the only ones I truly regret are the two FW190s - the Dora and the Anton. The L-39 is another one - I practically never fly it and find no use for it in single or multiplayer mode. There are also planes that I rarely fly, but don't really regret purchasing - The Mirage M2000, the Yak-52, the JF-17 and the P-47. They are all fun to fly, quirky enough to keep me interested but, with so many other modules, they are all on the back-burner (actually I do have quite a few hours in the Jeff).
I bought the South Atlantic map when I first started DCS only to find out it basically unsupported by and module except the F1. I’d rather not fly over desert maps all the time was my rationale but was too new to understand how DCS works. A campaign mode is severely needed. Also, the few campaigns I’ve bought do not function correctly and it kind of kills them from being playable. At least everything I’ve ever purchased has been on “sale”.
A lot of folks do something crazy like watching DCS on youtube for an year and than go ahead and but modules , maps and stuff for 300-500 buckd only to find out it is not WarThunder and each module requires months of learning and practice before you can be good enough to use it properly ...... Many will buy those expencive ones and will watch only vids onlite of how to fire some of the weapons and than will fly like complete idions hoping to score in the big PVP servers with no in dept knowledge of DCS or the module and get frustrated fast about it and about the money spent.......... So you buy a jet ..... than learn the damn thing befor buying another and enjoy it ...........
Good to be laser focused on the F-16 but I am looking forward to the F-4E. With BMS hard to have buyers remorse with less than $10. No need to learn a dozen planes. I do need the RWR on the DCS to F-16 to get fixed ASAP.
It is a good module but keep in mind that IMHO that plane is most famous for the R530 and we can't use it in any meaningful way on the most era appropriate server because the radar is still not done. The controls already got reset on it once. I will just wait until the radar is done and I will jump in with both feet. It's not a bad module it's just not done yet. For me it's a question of time. I want to learn it once and then play with it and not have to relearn things. Any time I sink into it now only to be vanished by a future patch, is just time I could have spent on getting better at something else like the Mi-8 or Viggen.
@@Enigma89I agree with your view on the F1, it's a great module and lots of fun to fly but the radar simulation is nowhere near the standard of the other modules. I've parked it until they fix it and bring it up to standard.
@@TarkaChops what pushes you away exactly about the radar not being nowhere to standard? i love using it imo one of the best radars on the server other then the 14 its quite simple and just works. I dont find it overpowering either.
@@descentmvm it's a late 60s/early 70s pulse radar so should have lots of ground returns when pointed down. Not simulated in the slightest. It should struggle with look down capability too. Very few of it's functions are simulated, again because of how minimal their simulation is and finally I really hate the "static" video loop that has no bearing on what it is pointing at. I enjoy flying the F1 but not using it as a weapons platform.
@@TarkaChops ah i see and yea they are working on it they said they are in the process of developing it better and more realistically actually really soon might be next update. I get it though makes sense.
I woke up this orning thinking I like the true freedom of choice in DCS's sandbox, and the stiff prices keep out riffraff, but could burn new plaers who choose unwisely. I've found the most fun in planes that personally interest me; the SU-27 and I am sooo looking into the F-4.
The stiff prices help noone, but it's less effort needed to charge high prices and deliver a shitty product in the short term than a timely delivery of a good one A very maidenless take, I have to say, DCS has pretty bad UX and most people who end up dishing out the money end up not actually playing much because the 'riffraff' isn't willing to waste time when there's games that are much more accessible that they could be playing Also, speaking of freedom of choice... There's really not much of it due to just how disjointed the focus of the game is? We have multiple different eras depicted and individually there are massive gaps for either side in each as a rule of thumb. The lack of a post cold war redfor jet (unless you count the JF-17 which is essentially like half using NATO standards) really springs to mind
@@domaxltv Depends what you're looking for: the A-10C II doesn't need a RedFor jet; neither does the Apache. The rest of the early 21st century stuff is probably best played PvE anyway, because nothing of note competed with BluFor jets in that time period -- they're facing air defenses. The classification limits aren't going to change for RedFor any time soon. PvP? Cold War is excellent for that already.
I just love flying planes, combat or not. Even if I don't fly some of them often, I like that I have them for when I'm in the mood. At least the free trials help you avoid buyer's remorse (and yes, it is misspelled in the title). 😉
That's why I never buy anything just when it comes out, the thing with the technology is that it has to "mature" to a point it makes it good enough to buy.
I never buy dcs modules unless they're on sale personally. I agree completely about the F1 also. My biggest regret in dcs so far has been the Dora. I like it and all. However, it is bug infested. It's an old model too and it's a warbird. Warbirds are a niche within a niche game. So, I wonder when or even if the plane will be fixed. Some of the problems aren't even bugs. It's like they didn't bother to finish the plane.
I have all the modules bar the Yak, pretty much all of them bought during sales, and the only one that I regret buying is the Christian Eagle because it's gash and pointless on DCS. Some planes I won't fly for months, but I don't regret buying them as it's always nice to go back to them occasionally
I avoid buyer remorse by accepting every penny I give helps development lol. I've bought modules I could care less about . Of the 13 I've bought I use 4.
I own most modules and I spend way too little time in DCS - at best I half-remember the controls of two of the easier modules. I regret nothing though, and hope to improve over time. Or go all-in on the F-4E once released, who knows...
The last EA I bought was the F/A-18, now I only buy modules when they are on at least 50% discount! I want ED to know how much I detest EA, and the lack of standards and requirements for moving these modules to a finished state. I bought the AH-64 last year for 50% off! There you go ED!
my biggest buyers regret so far was the gazelle. It doesnt really have a realistic flight model, weak a2g armament(which i knew, but went with it anyway), broken auto-hover, also it doesnt have the ability to carry missiles and a gun at the same time for some reason? it should be able to carry the 20mm Gun and 2 mistrals, or 20mm gun and 2 Hot-3 missiles, or 2 mistrals 2 hot, but for some reason it forces you to equip symmetric loadout for some reason when it comes to guided weaponary. other then the stuff i mentioned, it would be a really great module. EDIT: Also what i find kinda lacking in gazelle, and forgor to include, is a lot missing weaponary loadouts, such as (for the L gazelle only) 6 Hot loadout and numerous of rocket pods etc.
I've really been trying to fly it lately and it just feels so unnatural still after all the changes that they've done. They've done good work on the exterior and the tablet stuff, but it's just not fun to fly.
Thanks! I was just looking at that mod and debating whether to get it. I tried it a few years ago and felt the FM was not realistic. I was hoping they've improved things, but I guess not... Thanks for the heads-up.
I’m really hoping that the Kiowa is good. I know they’re a small team (2-3 guys), but damn has the Gazelle been the most seemingly troubled surviving module.
@@Doc_3908 the best thing about the gazelle is the open-cockpit feel, especially in VR. The view is great. The flight model kinda arcadey but I still find it fun to fly. The mistrals are too good to be true. The rockets extremely inacurate and guns more like a peashooter. Huey all the way for me. The only place where gazelle could shine is to provide cover support from jets with the mistrals.
I kind have that remorse feeling on the Apache. It is too realistic. If I compare back to the good old days of Jane's simulations: Longbow 2 or Enemy engaged (EECH) had all the relevant features (including fire zones etc), and a decent flight model, but the cockpit user interface was greatly simplified. You could focus on flying and applying tactics, rather than memorizing hundreds of keybindings. For the DCS Apache you would need ideally 3 Joysticks. Plus I miss the campaigns of EECH. I love most of the high fidelity modules, and it is great to see the differences between e.g. Mig-21 and F/A-18 or F-16. E.g. Mig-21 requires several buttons to be flipped to switch from IR to radar missiles versus one switch for the modern fighters. Dumbing this down would make the difference between these generations too small. But certain modules are just too complicated for me. E.g. Apache with regards to almost everything (though George is a great help to me), Mi-8 with regards to starting. Maybe the issue is just having too many modules: when they become too realistic and complex you could not master them any longer. Which is kind of realistic. That said, I am looking forward to the F-4, but I am not sure if I will really enjoy it. There is a reason why it required a GIB. I think I would enjoy the Starfighter much more.
I've had to catch myself from buying more modules because I know I won't spend the time to learn them and I honestly have a better time rotating through the ones I already own
Though I may not yet have a dog in the fight, I'd suspect any DCS purchase can be validated...think of it like Jane's back in the day...USNF, ATF, USNF97, F18, F15, WWII Fighters at an avg of 60.00ea which plane do you fly the most? I fell in love with USNF97 for the carrier and later WWII Fighters for the multiplayer...DCS gives you access to multiplayer community as well as an immersing environment. That said, would I "collect" every map and plane they have and will release...doubtful...why? Bc I know my hobby/ niche...a F-14, a carrier and a body of water...add some manned a/c of anytype, proper H.O.T.A.S w/ Rudders and a VR rig and the investment is sound and validated. Now to answer the "what's it all for" question...online contests/ competitions hosted by ex-military that actually understand the reasoning of why DCS has a community to begin with. Call it price/cost of admission but if you buy more than what you intend to fly, I suspect buyers remorse could be a thing...for the collectors it's a thing I suppose but for the ones that Know what they want, Why they want it then got out and get it. I haven't seen many disappointing factors other than internet bottle-necking that increases lag and decreases FPS. I wouldn't necessarily blame the simulator as much as detail settings, net connection and how many are in a particular server. Nothing says ya cannot have a LAN party. I only wish a F14 driver could pass along the module to prevent having to buy the module again to allow a human RIO to participate (in a LAN environment anyway) not everyone wants to drive and not everyone has wicked rigs but I'd say That is an investment one must weigh before pulling the trigger on any simulator purchase. Cheers!!
I bought every module and I regret half of them. Notably, the WW2 and early cold war planes. I only fly either helos or ultra modern planes. Thankfully, we have the trial system now, but we always have to wait months to get it
I really feel like a dynamic campain would help solve a lot of the boredom with most of the modules. We would still have the early access problem, but i would feel a lot more comfortable.
My regret with DCS is that it is so buggy it is unusable. I was quite happy with the initial purchase, but various problems began to arise that eventually degenerated its operation to a point where I would no sooner fix a problem than another one would arise. So DCS sits on my hard drive taking up space and collecting stray electrons. I put out thousands of dollars for a dedicated, top of the line VR gaming system, with several thousand dollars added in for HMDs and control peripherals. For the money spent I want to fly, not troubleshoot hardware and software issues. I was paid to do that for more than twenty years. Thus I find no end to the irony that I now have to pay DCS and other sims, not to mention the flight control manufactures, that have the same problem. I purchased a thousand dollars worth of flight sticks but had to send both back to the manufactures to repair issues with button operation due to poor design of the connectors, but not until I had spent several weeks troubleshooting, diagnosing and communicating the nature of the problem with technicians. I bought the second stick as replacement while I was waiting for the first one to be repaired. I had doubts about how good the repair might be anyway, so I figured I would have a backup in the event of another failure. While the first stick took a while before malfunctioning, the the second stick, purchased as a replacement, malfunctioned out of the box. The the first stick was repaired and returned before the second one was even repaired. The process took months of lost stick time that I put to use with my flawless yoke flying multimotor aircraft, but at least I now have two fully functional flight sticks. As an added bonus, I like the second stick better. The fact is dysfunctionality is one of the design features modern gaming sims. It not plug and play, it's plug and pray.
@@christiannielsen8733 The thing about an official manual is accountability: This is what the developer says about how the aircraft should function, so now you know if there's a bug. It also demonstrates that they're capable of putting a whole package together, not just stringing some code out on a shoelace budget. The Harrier looks fun (for example). I'm not sold on it when there's been no official manual for years. I need to know what it's supposed to do, not a third-party description of what it does.
Well i own almost all of the dcs modules and the JF-17 is on the top of my most liked modules. I don't think i have read one of the developers manuals cause i dont need to when you got chucks and youtube.
I regret everything I’ve bought in DCS except for the F-14. Especially the Super Carrier. 98% of the time, I’m flying Caucuses in the Tomcat. And If I’m very lucky, its in a server with the Forestal running Air Boss. Every thing else, planes, scenery, etc. never gets used. Or it gets used once for an event then never touched again. Looking at you online groups that demand x # of owned modules….
i have stand alone but buy with steam manly because the US makes it so expensive to buy anything of them so i don' .The price for me standalone is sticker price then add sales tax with steam it just sticker price because of reginal pricing
F15E still has unrealistic energy tied to it, like it's basically still a delta wing like the F-15C. It also STILL cannot go vertical and keep it's speed. and for 64.99, they should have atleast fixed those, but no, of course not. I was between the choice of the JF17, and the F15E. Which one would you have chose, and if you chose one, give me your opinion on the one you have! (or both)
F15E since it has more bombs, fuel, then jeff and is faster. but the jf17 can do all roles were as f15 main does ground stuff and air air. both planes are Easy to start. will say jf-17 is a finish plane.
I'm not sure I have "buyers Regret" with anything - except maybe disappointment with the Super Carrier. I'm glad I bought it, but disappointed they are making snails progress with the features they promise.That said, the most popular module in DCS is the F-18c and it's been 5 years since launch and it's still in early release and they still put it on sale at 30% off. I think there should be some kind of explanation for that. I suggest there be rules set for module early release, like what features are clearly present at release - a percentage or a specific list to customers, and then a time limit where they MUST have all promised features done. Right now, it's like contractors, they promise you they'll do great work, but it is done at their leisure leaving you waiting and waiting as they start new projects and have you on the hook.
@@Topper_Harley68I agree, they need to split their operations into four groups (if they haven't already done so), - Fast movers, WW2, Helicopters, and core features and improvements.
Just discovered that at least for me I cannot get the 2FA to work so cannot trial any items. But there is no 2FA on a purchase! What! I really wanted to try a few modules and test the cold war era to maybe fly on your server. I got the F5 and it seems fun. But why make it so difficult .grrrr
I bought all my modules on sales, I see no shame in that. DCS offers them quite often. And also, I'll buy some modules I barely/rarely use (both maps and planes). I'm happy I bought my stuff for a good price and even if I don't use it (yet, hopefully), I supported DCS/ED/3rd party devs. No remorse. Not for money at least. My remores is mostly bugs related.
A lot of buyers guides but have not seen a lot of discussion about avoid having buyers remorse which was an interesting thing that I could not get out of my head, so I hope you find the topic interesting. If you experienced buyers remorse in the game then let me know in the comments
Unfortunately I've experienced this with Razbam modules. The quality from other modules is just significantly better so I regret not spending the money on buying my friends their modules
Can't agree more, really good topic and some deep insights. While I don't regret it, I switched from flying the Gazelle for ages (waiting for the KW), to the F-15E. I did it together with my wingman who was then my pilot in the 15E, but he didn't enjoy the module (and the new squadron) as much as I did, switched back to helos, flying the AH-64. I never wanted to fly the 64 because I'm a scout guy.. but after a while, I trialed the 64, flew some with my buddy in the CPG seat, and now I'm fully back to rotaries and don't regret it a second. The module is pretty good although I still can't wait for the OH-58D.. but just flying together with him again more than makes up for the shortcomings of the aircraft.
Yet you failed to mention that on Steam, you can try and get full refund for the first 2 hours/2 weeks.
@@BobinificationWell yeah, true.. but I'd rather trial for a whole week as many hours as I'd like than 2h and a minute after that you're f*cked, especially given how long it takes to get to grips with most modules.
at my beginning of playing dcs i made some smart choices… F18, Supercarrier and basic hotas. now i own 20 modules and mainly play the A-4 Skyhawk
I have a lot of modules that I haven’t flown much, I know the basics and how to fly and stuff, but I haven’t had much time to use them all or get in the game in general. Though it’s like man I spent a lot of money with no play return. But I love planes and I know I’ll get to them eventually so that’s the only reason I’ve avoided buyers remorse. I’m not picky either so I’ve enjoyed them all for the little time I’ve flown them
I am on the same boat, it is kinda funny (or maybe not) that whenever I get some spare time where I plan to sit down and really play DCS, life and work kicks me in the rear end. And that kick hits hardest when I click the Buy button for a module I really want to get.
Same here. One day I'm going to find a reason to want to learn this plane. I have no regrets. So far!
@@MrHrannsi so true imma get the F-4 my favorite plane and still not have enough time to learn both seats for my friend
I’m the same, it’s more the time than the cost; I bought the Strike Eagle on release but I’ve hopped into it maybe 3 times - I actually forgot I had it until reading comments on here.
But I don’t regret buying it because £60 or whatever it cost isn’t that much, really - and I’m sure I will eventually get around to it, by which point it’ll be nearer completion anyway.
Plus I don’t mind supporting Razbam as I’ve always been a huge fan of the Mirage 2000, and I want the Flogger sooner 😅
@@Bullet4MyEnemy yeah it’s that, I put money into the game so I’m satisfied with just supporting the game knowing that when I’m in the mood and have time I can hop into any of the many modules I have lol
I bought the Hawk T1 as my first module. Nuff Said
oof
I'm glad I bought it when I did and on sale. Was one of my first modules when I had no idea what I was doing and my expectations were extrmeely low. Also bought it on sale so I didn't lose much money on it.
I got it not long before it got removed lol.
Over the years I bought a module or two every sale, and stayed home a couple times instead of going out to essentially pay for the new toys. The Yak-52 I've spent 2 hours in? The $20 would have just been a few beers and a burger instead. That also makes early access easy to deal with - I already paid, I get to decide if I want to invest serious time in a new plane or wait until certain features are finished.
The "what level of completion and standards means early access vs. full release?" is an interesting question.
Overall DCS does suffer a lot from ED's lack of ability or interest in setting up some basic standards.
Related is the lack of standardization overall. It's insane there isn't some fairly well developed standard radar sim that devs (including ED) can tweak/ use while they perfect a specific model.
I want to clarify my 2nd point regarding Early Access because on watching this a second time, I feel like I did not 'land the plane' on the point entirely. The point of this video is not to dissuade people but rather to just inform people that the increase in choice can be immediately perceived as a good thing but it can make you feel like you did not make the best choice when you select a thing to purchase. EA is one of these hot topics where people can feel burned, as it may take a long time to finish so I thought it was prudent to mention as people should feel good about what they buy and in the end, it may just really be a reflection of how expansive the game is getting in terms of module selection
It is not expencive if you buy a module or map on sale and take your time to learn it ans use it properly ...... folks are buyng a bulk of jets and choppers only to find out they cannot gain knowledge on all those in short period of time and than get frustrated about it .... I know folks with 10-15+ modules that only fly like 2-3 and the rest are just there....... Folks cannot understand the complexity of it and why you need one module to focus on before moving into the next one
I think there is two categories or even more. You have the newby first timers wanting to try a flight sim for the first time, there are those that had done flight sims years ago and want to get back into it, and there's those avid simmers who hang on every word/promise about upcoming modules as they seek to satisfy their love of the game.
I think the essence of that point got across.
@@conan670431Also, they forget real pilots only fly one and they spend a lot of time training with just the one.
After the ED/Razbam debacle, no more pre order or launch buys for me. Only when the module is mature enough, I'll buy another one.
Standards, to include a feature roadmap, would significantly help in this regard. The F1 is one of my favorites, but the lack of communication on RADAR modeling and the M variant has made me wish I had waited a bit longer.
I just wish ED would fix the ability to lean your head outside the cockpit when canopy is closed, especially in VR.
not "especially in VR". it's a VR-only problem. and it is both immersion breaking as well as unfair for competitive dogfights.
@NOTJustANomad I'm in agreement 2000% percent. I fly only in VR and it happens to me all the time. Not intentionally, but because in VR it's a manual work out and you are twisting and turning like you would in real life and not having that restriction is a real immersion killer. The 2D boys don't understand it because you don't have to turn your head at all hardly to check your 6
RIO cockpit in the 14 is terrible for this.
I sit in a racing seat so i cant do that. If i should do pvp it would be better for me to use trackir but since i will only fly vr pvp is not an option for me.
NOOOOO do not do this! or if they do it needs to be togglable, I fly vertical reference in helicopters on dcs and it is only possible because I'm able to go outside of the cockpit.
Avoid buyers remorse by buying the Hip and joining HipGang. Shrimple.
#UH-1My1AndOnly
haha man you are the biggest HIPPY-lover! :s
@@ilovetomcats have you tried the Hip?
@@NOTJustANomad it’s a really fun module especially on Enigma’s server!
Hip hip hooray!
From personal Experince the chart with the F-14, F-18 and F-16 is in correct in regards to the hornet. All the red items for the hornet were available at the release of the F-16, although no telling how many times ED has changed the logic and in game use of them. They only Item on the list for the F-18 that is not "complete" (using that real loosely) is the CM's the flare count has been off since day one and Matt, Norm, BN etc have all acknowledged it but changing the number of digitally coded things another digitally coded thing is apparently up there with moving mountains and world peace.
I regret buying "Modern Romance" by Aziz Ansari.
lol
This is such a great topic! Thanks for looking into it.
My tip to avoiding buyers regret is to avoid buying anything until you have a PC that can handle the ecosystem to a level you are satisfied with! I have stopped buying anything for the moment (or even flying) until this criterion is satisfied.
This is not sour grapes just a practical observation.
Sorry for the wall of text. TL:DR, had an instant regret moment with some mods, changed my mind a few days later
I purchased a set of FC3 aircraft, particularly Su-27, MiG-29 and F-15 while on discount. A year later, FC3 as a package got a 50% discount, so I got the upgrade. This subsequent purchase got me the case of buyers remorse at the beginning, since the package jumbled up my missions, the planes did not come with adequate training materials, some of the stuff I got used to, like MiG-29 wallpaper disappeared, and my controls got defaulted. This all happened after I started getting into the A-4E-C and T-45 mods, so I just felt angry at myself for "wasting money".
But a few days later I landed my Su-33 on the Admiral Kuznetsov and changed my mind. Now, although I don't understand the mechanism behind buyers' remorse, I do understand that sometimes your hobby won't instantly give you the satisfaction you're looking to squeeze out of it.
EDIT: I'm running my game on an obsolete PC, so MP is out of the question. The rig has troubles running full fidelity mods at a satisfactory framerate even in solo missions. I mostly fly just for the love of flying and aerobatics.
You can try to launch missions from multiplayer server. Not sure if it is still a thing, but launching a dedicated server was improving frame rates for me.
However, now that I wrote this: I think it was pre multi-threading implementation. Maybe now it will not do anything good?
@@slowhornet4802 It won't hurt to try. Thanks for the heads-up! o7
video summary:
1. buy a module based on who you can fly it with. at least take it into account.
2. be careful with early access/pre-orders.
3. buy on sale.
to me personally I will always trial a module, sometimes even twice to give myself time to consider if it's worth it. by having a 6 month period, you get to re-visit the idea of purchasing multiple times. and each time it will make you consider more aspects of the module and learn more about it + what you are likely going to do with it.
Out of all the modules I have, the only thing I bought without a trial was the Mi-24P because I know I love its quirks and it has a decent reputation amongst its fliers. the two modules on my current considering-to-buy list are the JF-17 and the Gazelle.
so far I haven't had much of buyers remorse, if at all, with the modules I have bought: Viggen, MiG-21bis, Mi-24P, Su-27, F-15C, Su-25, Supercarrier, Syria, Persian Gulf. If I have to name two modules that I haven't got the chance to use much, it is the Supercarrier and Persian Gulf. The former due to me having neither the Tomcat nor the Hornet. The latter due to the lack of good servers running PG.
+1 for the Jeff, I love it. It’s basically the F-20 that we’ll never get, but more modern and Eastern. IMO Deka’s done a solid job with it and I’m looking forward to their J-8II.
@@ilovetomcats contrary to popular belief, the JF-17 is more of a western plane in the inside. Deka even wrote it word to word in their manual: "Although you may have expected the JF-17 to be a so-called "red" aircraft, the fact is that this aircraft is an out-and-out "blue" aircraft from design concept to operation. If you want to experience the real "socialist flavor", look forward to our second module." on page 297 in the HOTAS section.
I got the hardest buyers remorse from the f-15e and thats the only one. Smth abt it. Like I had the f-18, f-16, and a-10. But I wanted a rly good dedicated heavy strike deep pen aircraft, only to find it was arguably more fun to do that with the hornet. Only time I’ve had fun with it was flying two ship where we both had WSOs. That was SUPER fun, like f-14 multicrew on steroids, but other than that, it’s been boring.
Ways that I have found to avoid buyers remorse:
Use the 2 week free trials. Sure, they aren't available for all modules, but it has kept me from buying things I didn't love.
Watch a bunch of videos on UA-cam of people flying the aircraft. Gives you an idea of how niche the module is, how difficult the controls are, etc.
Only buy modules that are on sale. If things don't hit the sale, it's likely because they are new and not fleshed out anyhow.
Lastly, only buy modules that get you excited. If you're excited to fly the module, it helps get you motivated to get good with it.
It does make me a little salty that the F1CE doesn't have a radar missile in ecw, since I prefer to fly the f1 over the mig21
This wasn't always a thing... I bought 80% of my modules without being able to try them first
I love that of all the DCS UA-cam content creators yours is the most thought provoking and I'm an avid follower despite being 99.8% single player. I disagree slightly with point #1, I'd narrow it down slightly to what type module do your friends who like *flying the same mission types* like. My friends who I fly with love the Viggen and Mud Hen; they love deep strikes, but I love self-escort air assaults in the Hind. And sadly none of my friends love the L-39 the way I do. You're an arts guy, so I would say individual module preference is like musical tastes--you and your girlfriend or best friends might mesh really well with values and temperament, but might have radically different musical tastes. I can get better music/module advice from a stranger on the Internet than the people I love spending the most time with.
For ragrets, I'd say the South Atlantic map. Not because of the (lagging but improving) quality, but lack of content. I decided not to buy any more maps until there is a server or single player content (eg campaign or Pretense or Variable style mission) that requires it. OTOH I kinda want Sinai after seeing the street level detail in your video.
Keep up the great work, Ligma!
Thank you for the thoughtful and kind response
Sinai is a super nice map... that no server uses.
You really nailed the multiplayer point. I played for about 1 year solo before jumping into multiplayer. My learning rate accelerated dramatically as did my enjoyment of flying in DCS. I learned more in 2 months of flying multiplayer with experienced sim pilots (and even some real pilots!) than I did in the previous year learning on my own. Community makes it so much better.
One way to avoid buyer's remorse would be to make sure you enjoy picking up what DCS is putting down. By default, DCS comes with a non-clicking combat aircraft in the Su-25T, and a clickable non-combat aircraft in the TF-51. The free mod A-4 Skyhawk, being a clickable combat craft, fills in the blank quite nicely, and you can use it to tell if DCS' loop for using obscure and novel systems to get warheads on foreheads works for you or not, before you take the plunge into other modules. (Though admittedly I started with the Huey because I liked flying helicopters in ARMA, the Skyhawk was my first clickable plane, because I bounced off the Su-25T.) I only wish the Skyhawk had integrated training missions, although I suppose if a player doesn't like using, say, DCS Sport's Skyhawk tutorials or the kneeboard/manual to get a handle on the systems, they won't find the other planes very fun, and they'll find that out before *buying* the other planes.
Certainly there are some modules and maps that I don’t frequent too much but I wouldn’t say buyers remorse. It’s always good to have options. The way I look at it is that I’m encouraging these companies to support the hobby that I enjoy so much.
hey, I have buyers remorse mostly when I buy and realise I don't have time to fly it, or the instruction/training videos are unfinished or buggy, which further impacts my time to fly.
I keep going back to the classic Russian aircraft. Mi-8, MiG-15, MiG-19, MiG-21. They are just so very 'hands-on' and not sterile like the Hornet for example (i love the Hornet but a bit too much 'iPhone' factor). F-4 is currently an FPS slideshow for me, but I think I will like her too (she sure is a beauty)
Dear Sir, this is a very useful and well researched video. Spot on. Many thanks as always for your support: Kind regards, Nick
Good video and some very good points, more light definitely needs to be shined on the lack of a real "standard" for modules. I personally have felt some buyers regret when i got the harrier, when it first came out, its a lot better now but it definitely burned me.
Just trial any module before you buy, if not sure, wait 6 months trial again. The only module i have a Slight remorse from buying is the KA-50 but considering it was my first module and i didnt have rudder pedals at the time, I did fly it a lot back then, but now 80% of my time is MF1 and Gazelle, As long as you Trial before buy, its very unlikely remorse will be a thing. Also Steam has 2 hours refund policy for any DLC that includes DCS so that was how I "trialed" the MF1, I loved it after 50min, but if i didn't the refund was an option.
As a new player I got the C-101 because I thought it had pretty cool capabilities with the Sea Eagle anti-ship missile. Little did I know that its use is non-existent on MP and is not expected to be updated any time soon. What a waste.
I felt burned by the MiG-21 back in 2013. The standard just wasn't there with the Ka-50 and A-10C (still isn't). But I've grown attached to it.
On the topic of early access and standards, something funny I noticed is that between the modules listed on the main menu, there are about 7 different permutations of "Early Access": EA, WIP, Beta, beta, etc.
For me, I somewhat regret buying the Apache and the F15E, not bad modules just I don’t find them particularly fun and find myself gravitating back to the Hind or the F14/F1.
F16 is the only module I fly since day one, I bought it on the day it was released in early access. Maybe because I fell in love with Falcon 4.0 back in 1998. That gave me patience to wait for it do develop fully. No regret there. I was flying and enjoying it even when my ass was kicked in dogfights because of Vipers massive underperformance back then. It seems like now everything works fine. I like to buy maps though, it's fun to fly in different parts of the world. Waiting for sales and using standalone trials is a great idea. Thank you for the video.
Honestly, I have buyers remorse for every module not featured on ECW. I play other servers too to play those modules, but I don't enjoy them as much whenever you just have 1-2 hours of free time. I want to love the AH64, but I don't enjoy it in a fox1 setting every server has where it is allowed.
Same for M2000. I love it, but wish I could do fox 2 and gun fights with her.
I have 100% remorse of the F18 and F16.
50% remorse for F14, M2000
25% remorse for the Ah64 (still hoping I'll find a place to enjoy her)
And there is the normandy +WW2 asset etc. WW2 is fun but not worth all that money in the current DCS WW2 setting
50% for the F-14? why? (genuine curious question. I am planning on getting the Tomcat. wanna know your experience with it.)
@@NOTJustANomad It is tied to the rest of my comment. I don't like fox1 settings and hate fox 3 settings. The F14 is a cool aircraft to fly but I don't like the jetplay on the servers she in on in MP (Fox1/Fox3). The most fun I've had with her is in practice Fox2+guns dogfights with friends.
Also, I hate jester to the core. The times he misidentifies my locked target as 'friendly' while it is enemy, getting me killed, are just too often. I understand he should not be perfect, but as a player in the back the IFF takes 1 second and is 100% accurate. No need for jester to take 5 sec and misidentify
same here hate modern pushbutton remote-viewing combat. The real fun is in close combat!
Finally I've found proof the audience my hypothetical server built around modern jets but only heaters and guns for air to air combat, and dumb bombs/rockets for air to ground, exists.
@@Why485you'd have to balance the Redfor heaters (basically better than fox 1) and 9X can't be part of it either. Rear and side aspect only like the 9P3 as best
My buyer's regret over DCS is pretty minor, and I think it's because I've asked around in discord servers before actually getting my hands on modules.
The modules that I own but have played the least are: the F-18, which I used to learn a lot about the core of DCS, and taught me that full modern wasn't something I liked. The F-16, which I used as another shot at full modern (probably a bit of buyer's remorse on that one). The Hip, because I usually just fly the Hind, but I know is a lot of fun and will be turning more attention to soon. The F-5, that I bought to understand a bit more but never planned on maining. The Viggen, which I got because a friend of mine loved it and never really took the time to fly.
I think I regret very little of my many DCS purchases because each and every one of them has been fuelled by passion. I just really like DCS, and i've made a lot of good friends over it.
Also, Electronic Arts and Ubisoft did me a solid when I was 12-13 by releasing games that really dissapointed me and vaccinated me from preordering. Now, I tend to buy soon after release (backing myself with whatever feedback I can get) rather than preorder.
Love that you made a spreadsheet showing the sales!
If there is a new module coming out for an icon plane I love I'll buy it.
Otherwise I just wait until a sale.
But frankly I have a backlog of modules I need to learn
Got a few too many modules myself, the only regret I have is the HAWK as it was dropped and abandoned... basically turned into money out the window. The rest, even if I don't frequently fly, I do enjoy. (A10 and KA50 are on the HAWK's list slightly, as they are greedily trying to rip off more money for an update on the module, but at least I can still access their older versions if I so choose to do so.
To this day, I have not paid full price for any module. And I have most of them. My biggest remorse comes from the F-16 - I just don't care for it. The Mirage F-1 - I just don't like flying it. It feels underwhelming in both AA and AG. And the Apache - The Apache is just so good at what it does, it doesn't even feel like a challenge. "Hey George, see that? Make it dead.... cool."
Honestly, the most hours and fun I've had are in the Mig-21, it is finished, it is surprisingly good, and it just makes me smile. The Hind AND Hip are just too much fun. I have to flip a coin to decide which to fly. If you don't care about the guided missiles, go with the Hip. You can carry troops and many MANY explosion inducing items. It's a great multi use workhorse in ECW. The Hornet/Tomcat are just great. They can both give you fun carrier ops, air to air, and air to ground, and the Hornet radar actually works now. And lastly.... The F-86 Sabre. Yes, the Sabre. Is it useful? No. Not really. But, my God, does it feel great when you do get a kill in ECW. You go in knowing you're outmatched, even against helicopters. So it's a fun challenge to just try. Lastly, if you like AG stuff, the A-10C. SEAD/DEAD missions are a hair raising blast. You can do a lot of damage because you carry so much more ordinance than anyone else. But... it's slow. So keep that in mind.
My buyers regret is found with the South Atlantic map. I chalk it up to early access and not be to the standard found in other maps. It also seems to be a map that people bought and seldom play within my circle of gameplay. Too much water and not enough quality airfields with enough parking for larger server play seems another issue. I wish I never spent the money with the South Atlantic. Early access is a real problem and one that creates the most buyers remorse for me.
All your points are valid. Some modules have frustrating shortcomings, but I actually have no buyer's remorse for any aircraft. I buy only on sale, and I think the price for such a realistic simulation of a military aircraft is very fair in all cases. The F1 radar does look worrying though...
The thing I do have some buyer's remorse over are maps. I don't get how they can be as or more expensive as the planes. A lot of them don't even look that good, and most buildings and static assets look like poop. The moment you go down low, you are teleported from 2024 to 2005. You are forced to buy them to play many campaigns and to have MP options. Normandy is the only map I think looks great and is worth the price.
WWII asset pack should also just be free and come with DCS world. It was a pain to buy both a map, an asset pack, and a plane to get into WWII.
I have almost every module and buy everything via Steam for personal reasons. I don't try to learn everyone like the back of my hand, but like to at least be able to operate it enough to be effective.
For me I look at buying modules like buying something else on the menu at your favorite restaurant. Because of the quality of the establishment you know the quality will likely be there but you are not always sure if it will appeal to your palette, only after sampling different menu items do you know where your tastes really lie. There are some new menu items I may hold off on until I feel they have the quality ironed out and others I should have probably read the Yelp reviews( I ordered the Gazelle in 2022) before ordering but by and large I don't regret my decisions.
In reguards to Steam, alot of Steam users think that they will lose all their purchases if they move to Standalone. ED should communicate this alot better on their front page that you can move your purchases from Steam to standalone.
Buyer's guide, buy fc3, look after red or blue coalition which u like more, then naturally pick cold war plane just to play it on enigma's cold war. And also pick it with ur hear, i like the viggen, my pick is viggen
If you buy every single module then you can’t feel like you made the wrong choice. Problem solved.
Funny enough, I haven't had buyer's remorse but I have wondered why I bought it and that's Persian gulf map. I bought it on sale and then half a year later looked at it and realized I hadn't flown it once. I eventually did realize though that i bought it because it's the only map with a modern city with skyscrapers and fighting between those skyscrapers is a wholly different experience!
I love Enigma, having the real discussions in DCS. I regret a lot of my DCS purchases but always lied to myself that I was supporting the devs by buying things even if I didnt fully intend flying it.
The Harrier got me, I was so excited for it and started learning it as soon as it released. I was getting pretty good and then we got a major update and everything changed, turns out all the avionics where wrong on release and everything I had learnt wasn't how it worked anymore.
I haven't played it in years because of that wasted time investment.
If you are going to release a module with incomplete avionics that's fine, just don't change how they fundamentally work. The F/A-18 is a good example of it done right, no major changes just blank pages being populated with updates.
Actually, what happened to the DCS Harrier is not unrealistic. I think real life Harrier at one point got a better targeting pod but the software of the MFD had not been updated. So the button descriptions were wrong on top of the changes to the pilot's muscle memory. But I understand the pain. I got back to the Harrier after reading some books about it.
Honestly, I don't regret buying any of the modules or maps that I own. Now, there are ones that I fly more often than others, I do not regret buying the ones that I don't fly much. My lowest one is probably the Fw-190A8 but I don't regret buying it. I own all the helicopters but fly mostly the UH-1, Ka-50 III, and the AH-64D but I don't regret the Mi-8, Mi-24, and the Gazelle. As for those that don't like the Sinai map are they that don't know history very well. That map should be a GOD send for Cold War era combat as there was more warfare there in that time period than anywhere else in the world, and you can start off with WWII aircraft, move to Korean War era jets, then to Vietnam Era and finally all the way up to 1991 when the wall came down and beyond to modern times. It and the Syria map are the two most diverse maps that are currently out there. I don't do much WWII stuff and don't own any of the maps, but I do own the Fw-190A8, P-47, and Me-109 and the WWII Assests Pack but rarely use any of them. The only WWII plane I have not liked, and thus not bought, is the Mossie. I got it to trial, and I have disliked it each time, so I haven't pulled the trigger on it. As for the future, I am looking forward to the CH-47, C-130, Bo-105, PC-9, and the A-1, I'm just not into any of the jets that are coming up, including the much-vaunted F-4.
My Buyers Remorse story for DCS is 2 fold.
for one i have way to many modules and i cant keep up with all of them. I generaly just fly the same 3 or 4 modules and rarely if ever touch the others so forget procedures and dont want to relearn those modules.
Secondly Dumb decissions to buy modules i was never fully invested in, without testing them first (2 week trial could be a life safer there).
I wish they would bring Module trading back because i would instantly get rid of 2 or 3 aircraft i never fly. For now they are collecting dust in the hangar.
Another issue i have is when you get a early acces module and they add or revamp procedures while i am taking a break from said module. It changes so much that it feels like i dont know the jet i previously knew inside out anymore.
I only regret keeping buy modules. That seem will never be fully complete if they keep piling on more not complete modules. Super carrier is a perfect example of this. Super carrier has no flight model. But in development for what 5 years? New features added to modules have yet to get updated training missions. Which is why I will take a pause on buy products until I see things being wrapped up.
I forgot about super carrier😳that could have been a good example for the video
@@Enigma89a lot of people including ED have forgotten about the Super Carrier. 😂
@parab225 😳
@@Enigma89Super Carrier is the absolute worst offender behind Combined Arms.
I actually have a higher tolerance for early access missing features than what I have for “finished” modules that carry known bugs for 8 years (many of the warbirds have these) to favor new modules with new money injection. ED favors grabbing new purchases while pissing off existing customers by neglecting older modules.
Guessing you're not a helicopter guy because you didn't mention the Gazelle. It took 6 years to get a realistic flight model leaving many, many people disappointed. Not me though.
I have almost literally every jet plane in DCS (the P-51, the Yak-52, the Ka-50, the UH-1 and Mi-8 are outliers I have purchased - and though I've barely used them , helos especially, I do no regret purchasing them)... I also have almost all the maps. I'm not a helo guy, so aside from the ones I mentioned above I don't buy helos. Obviously, I don't have time to fly all of the modules I own - so I generally choose one for a period of time to focus on. Sometimes my focus changes quickly, other times it does not.
For example, I've been focusing on the Mirage F1 since it more or less came out, continuing today. In that same period of time, the F-15E came out - I pre-ordered it even. Yet I have not even sat in the cockpit and bound the controls for it yet... The F-4 is due to release in EA shortly... I may switch to the Phantom from the Mirage F1 when that occurs - further pushing back my attention toward the F-15E. Add to that the fact that SEAD is my preferred mission profile (and the F-16 is my preferred platform for that mission).
The only real way to avoid "buyer's remorse" is not to ask the community what they think is the best - and get the plane you like, based on what's available. You also don't need to be every module (including maps). Some servers may require you to have certain modules, true, but unless you really REALLY want to be on that server - those purchases are optional.
Every plane you buy in DCS, you must WANT to buy - because YOU want to buy it, not because someone you don't know online told you to.
Remorse: FC3... I've only ever used the F15 and A10A.
Early Access: There should be a progress list actively updated and communicated on. Grinnelli should be the standard in this area. I think we all understand programing delays and that timelines can slide but look at Grinnelli's list of completed items and know what you are getting!
As someone who mainly plays singleplayer because I don't have the time to learn the planes enough to be competitive in multiplayer, it really feels like DCS is missing things to do. I buy all these modules because they look cool and fun, I fly them around a little in free flights, and then I don't really know what to do after that. Campaigns are a good start, but there's too few of them, their quality can be questionable, and they are rarely updated. The dynamic campaign will hopefully solve this problem but for now, I think a lot of buyer's remorse stems from the fact that there's not a whole lot to do with these beautifully modeled aircraft.
I’d recommend just sending it and hopping on to a server anyways. I used to also just fly only singleplayer, but I recently started playing on MP (mostly ECW & TBF) and I finally got a friend to also start flying with me and it’s been the most fun I’ve had in the game. It can be frustrating going up and feel like you’re not even a challenge for the opposing side (or AI…), but I try to frame it as a learning experience. I’ve really found my place flying rotary wing, something I wasn’t really interested in until I was flying NOE doing troop drops, dodging AAA, coordinating A-G strikes, and killing Hinds on ECW.
You have all the YT tutorials avail as well as Chuck's guides to properly learn a module .... looking cool is not what you want from an aircraft only but also the be able to extract the most out of it ... DCS is orientated towards humans interacting and there are many training servers to learn with others insted of the silly freef light option :)
Bro, check out the Pretense dynamic campaigns, especially the Syria Cold War edition.
You should hone any skill at least once a week to maintain your skill level. Twice a week to improve. And three times a week to improve fast.
It is just natural that module number 3+ will feel much worse value.
Whatever. I have been flying ED sims since 1995, exclusively. Been in mp scene for really long time and now having three kids I just quit. All that is being mentioned how incomplete mp always is especially regarding missiles and unfinished products... Omg we can write a history book about that. NOT ONLY ED. How long F-14 is now in EA? I fly a lot of payable campaigns and fun missions of my own design, because I can pause or stop at anytime and help in the house. I have completed campaigns on nearly every module. Can't wait for Save Game feature to return to ED sim. We used to have it back in the 90ties.
The only regret I had was my first purchase, I was really passionate about the Mig-21 but people told me it would be too hard for a beginner to try, I was convinced to try the Mirage 2000C instead. While it had some cool things I HATED that plane, it drove me crazy and funny enough, free trials came out like a couple weeks later, tried the MiG-21 and it was so lovely. I uninstalled the M2K and never looked back.
as for the 'market analysis' at the grocery store at the start: whenever I see some of them with their 'samples' trying to sell their stuff i always cringe inside. the employee that has to do that is dying inside having demeaned him/herself to this. and it always shines through in their bubbly 'THIS IS FINE' overly friendly fake approach. I die a little inside and so does the employee that has to do it.
I could go on about stuff I regret buying, but instead I'll just say, I absolutely do NOT regret buying the Hind, even when its frustrating its fun.
All great insights. Here’s what I do. I keep my expectations low, that way I’m not disappointed. Early access means, incomplete and unfortunately that can be at different levels, so brace. Good point about standards, there should be a standard on how incomplete a module can be before it should be released. Finally, I can remember when games where always shipped complete. Then we got what was called buggy games that had to be patched. Then to early access, beta and even alpha versions being released for a fee. It’s been a decline to say the least. As for flight simulation, you either love it or you don’t. It’s like buying a Jeep Wrangler, a person knows they want it without test driving it, because they are different. I feel most flight simmers fit in that category. However, we are very technical and like perfection and that is the rub with half finished modules.
I've never flown anything other than the free mod A-4 Skyhawk, but with games I never preorder. I thought about writing a long bit about preorders and the issues with it, but the long and short of it is; be informed about your purchases. If you preorder, you can't be informed. I've never seen any preorder bonus or sell worth giving up the ability to make a informed purchase.
Quite an insightful and interesting expose. Keep up the good work 👍
Difficult to tell, but other than the Hawk (Which was at least seriously on sale) maybe the Strike Eagle. I really like air to ground stuff but I find the loadouts a little restrictive; also I haven't had a huge amount of time for DCS lately so I haven't been able to put much time on it. Super deep computer button pushing is getting less fun for me now. I get it'll be really useful for some deep penetration strikes you don't have ARMs and stuff. honestly unless you need to kill planes or fly a million miles the harrier just works better for me.
I suspect een the F-4 is going to be more fun for me tbh.
Hawk is the only one I've ever regretted purchasing now that the Gazelle has been fixed/improved.
I have most modules, and the only ones I truly regret are the two FW190s - the Dora and the Anton. The L-39 is another one - I practically never fly it and find no use for it in single or multiplayer mode. There are also planes that I rarely fly, but don't really regret purchasing - The Mirage M2000, the Yak-52, the JF-17 and the P-47. They are all fun to fly, quirky enough to keep me interested but, with so many other modules, they are all on the back-burner (actually I do have quite a few hours in the Jeff).
Why the FW regret? Because it sucks compared to the competition? Or is the modelling bad in itself?
What do you think about heatblur selling the naval and Air Force F4 module separately. While the F1 gives you multiple variants for the price of one.
Have they said they’re doing this?
Ew... They're really doing that?
I bought the South Atlantic map when I first started DCS only to find out it basically unsupported by and module except the F1. I’d rather not fly over desert maps all the time was my rationale but was too new to understand how DCS works. A campaign mode is severely needed. Also, the few campaigns I’ve bought do not function correctly and it kind of kills them from being playable. At least everything I’ve ever purchased has been on “sale”.
A lot of folks do something crazy like watching DCS on youtube for an year and than go ahead and but modules , maps and stuff for 300-500 buckd only to find out it is not WarThunder and each module requires months of learning and practice before you can be good enough to use it properly ...... Many will buy those expencive ones and will watch only vids onlite of how to fire some of the weapons and than will fly like complete idions hoping to score in the big PVP servers with no in dept knowledge of DCS or the module and get frustrated fast about it and about the money spent.......... So you buy a jet ..... than learn the damn thing befor buying another and enjoy it ...........
Good to be laser focused on the F-16 but I am looking forward to the F-4E. With BMS hard to have buyers remorse with less than $10. No need to learn a dozen planes. I do need the RWR on the DCS to F-16 to get fixed ASAP.
As a Mirage F1 user, I AM ABSOLUTELY FLABBERGASTED
It is a good module but keep in mind that IMHO that plane is most famous for the R530 and we can't use it in any meaningful way on the most era appropriate server because the radar is still not done. The controls already got reset on it once. I will just wait until the radar is done and I will jump in with both feet. It's not a bad module it's just not done yet. For me it's a question of time. I want to learn it once and then play with it and not have to relearn things. Any time I sink into it now only to be vanished by a future patch, is just time I could have spent on getting better at something else like the Mi-8 or Viggen.
@@Enigma89I agree with your view on the F1, it's a great module and lots of fun to fly but the radar simulation is nowhere near the standard of the other modules. I've parked it until they fix it and bring it up to standard.
@@TarkaChops what pushes you away exactly about the radar not being nowhere to standard? i love using it imo one of the best radars on the server other then the 14 its quite simple and just works. I dont find it overpowering either.
@@descentmvm it's a late 60s/early 70s pulse radar so should have lots of ground returns when pointed down. Not simulated in the slightest. It should struggle with look down capability too. Very few of it's functions are simulated, again because of how minimal their simulation is and finally I really hate the "static" video loop that has no bearing on what it is pointing at. I enjoy flying the F1 but not using it as a weapons platform.
@@TarkaChops ah i see and yea they are working on it they said they are in the process of developing it better and more realistically actually really soon might be next update. I get it though makes sense.
I woke up this orning thinking I like the true freedom of choice in DCS's sandbox, and the stiff prices keep out riffraff, but could burn new plaers who choose unwisely.
I've found the most fun in planes that personally interest me; the SU-27 and I am sooo looking into the F-4.
The stiff prices help noone, but it's less effort needed to charge high prices and deliver a shitty product in the short term than a timely delivery of a good one
A very maidenless take, I have to say, DCS has pretty bad UX and most people who end up dishing out the money end up not actually playing much because the 'riffraff' isn't willing to waste time when there's games that are much more accessible that they could be playing
Also, speaking of freedom of choice... There's really not much of it due to just how disjointed the focus of the game is? We have multiple different eras depicted and individually there are massive gaps for either side in each as a rule of thumb. The lack of a post cold war redfor jet (unless you count the JF-17 which is essentially like half using NATO standards) really springs to mind
@@domaxltv Depends what you're looking for: the A-10C II doesn't need a RedFor jet; neither does the Apache. The rest of the early 21st century stuff is probably best played PvE anyway, because nothing of note competed with BluFor jets in that time period -- they're facing air defenses. The classification limits aren't going to change for RedFor any time soon.
PvP? Cold War is excellent for that already.
I just love flying planes, combat or not. Even if I don't fly some of them often, I like that I have them for when I'm in the mood.
At least the free trials help you avoid buyer's remorse (and yes, it is misspelled in the title). 😉
That's why I never buy anything just when it comes out, the thing with the technology is that it has to "mature" to a point it makes it good enough to buy.
Any Razbam module
i avoid giving money as long as they think it works as intended
So you play only the SU and trainer P-51 on Caucuses?
I never buy dcs modules unless they're on sale personally. I agree completely about the F1 also. My biggest regret in dcs so far has been the Dora. I like it and all. However, it is bug infested. It's an old model too and it's a warbird. Warbirds are a niche within a niche game. So, I wonder when or even if the plane will be fixed. Some of the problems aren't even bugs. It's like they didn't bother to finish the plane.
I have all the modules bar the Yak, pretty much all of them bought during sales, and the only one that I regret buying is the Christian Eagle because it's gash and pointless on DCS.
Some planes I won't fly for months, but I don't regret buying them as it's always nice to go back to them occasionally
I avoid buyer remorse by accepting every penny I give helps development lol.
I've bought modules I could care less about .
Of the 13 I've bought I use 4.
I hope that every other mod makers can match the delivery status of DIS. Especially RAZ
I own most modules and I spend way too little time in DCS - at best I half-remember the controls of two of the easier modules. I regret nothing though, and hope to improve over time. Or go all-in on the F-4E once released, who knows...
In reality, this applies to products in general, before thinking up to buy something, think how you would actually use it
The last EA I bought was the F/A-18, now I only buy modules when they are on at least 50% discount! I want ED to know how much I detest EA, and the lack of standards and requirements for moving these modules to a finished state. I bought the AH-64 last year for 50% off! There you go ED!
my biggest buyers regret so far was the gazelle. It doesnt really have a realistic flight model, weak a2g armament(which i knew, but went with it anyway), broken auto-hover, also it doesnt have the ability to carry missiles and a gun at the same time for some reason? it should be able to carry the 20mm Gun and 2 mistrals, or 20mm gun and 2 Hot-3 missiles, or 2 mistrals 2 hot, but for some reason it forces you to equip symmetric loadout for some reason when it comes to guided weaponary.
other then the stuff i mentioned, it would be a really great module.
EDIT:
Also what i find kinda lacking in gazelle, and forgor to include, is a lot missing weaponary loadouts, such as (for the L gazelle only) 6 Hot loadout and numerous of rocket pods etc.
I've really been trying to fly it lately and it just feels so unnatural still after all the changes that they've done.
They've done good work on the exterior and the tablet stuff, but it's just not fun to fly.
Thanks! I was just looking at that mod and debating whether to get it. I tried it a few years ago and felt the FM was not realistic. I was hoping they've improved things, but I guess not... Thanks for the heads-up.
I’m really hoping that the Kiowa is good. I know they’re a small team (2-3 guys), but damn has the Gazelle been the most seemingly troubled surviving module.
@@ilovetomcats I'm really hoping it'll be alright but trying to contain optimism
@@Doc_3908 the best thing about the gazelle is the open-cockpit feel, especially in VR. The view is great. The flight model kinda arcadey but I still find it fun to fly. The mistrals are too good to be true. The rockets extremely inacurate and guns more like a peashooter. Huey all the way for me. The only place where gazelle could shine is to provide cover support from jets with the mistrals.
I kind have that remorse feeling on the Apache. It is too realistic. If I compare back to the good old days of Jane's simulations: Longbow 2 or Enemy engaged (EECH) had all the relevant features (including fire zones etc), and a decent flight model, but the cockpit user interface was greatly simplified. You could focus on flying and applying tactics, rather than memorizing hundreds of keybindings. For the DCS Apache you would need ideally 3 Joysticks. Plus I miss the campaigns of EECH.
I love most of the high fidelity modules, and it is great to see the differences between e.g. Mig-21 and F/A-18 or F-16. E.g. Mig-21 requires several buttons to be flipped to switch from IR to radar missiles versus one switch for the modern fighters. Dumbing this down would make the difference between these generations too small. But certain modules are just too complicated for me. E.g. Apache with regards to almost everything (though George is a great help to me), Mi-8 with regards to starting.
Maybe the issue is just having too many modules: when they become too realistic and complex you could not master them any longer. Which is kind of realistic.
That said, I am looking forward to the F-4, but I am not sure if I will really enjoy it. There is a reason why it required a GIB.
I think I would enjoy the Starfighter much more.
Gayto NPC can't handle their best helicopter
I've had to catch myself from buying more modules because I know I won't spend the time to learn them and I honestly have a better time rotating through the ones I already own
Though I may not yet have a dog in the fight, I'd suspect any DCS purchase can be validated...think of it like Jane's back in the day...USNF, ATF, USNF97, F18, F15, WWII Fighters at an avg of 60.00ea which plane do you fly the most? I fell in love with USNF97 for the carrier and later WWII Fighters for the multiplayer...DCS gives you access to multiplayer community as well as an immersing environment. That said, would I "collect" every map and plane they have and will release...doubtful...why? Bc I know my hobby/ niche...a F-14, a carrier and a body of water...add some manned a/c of anytype, proper H.O.T.A.S w/ Rudders and a VR rig and the investment is sound and validated. Now to answer the "what's it all for" question...online contests/ competitions hosted by ex-military that actually understand the reasoning of why DCS has a community to begin with. Call it price/cost of admission but if you buy more than what you intend to fly, I suspect buyers remorse could be a thing...for the collectors it's a thing I suppose but for the ones that Know what they want, Why they want it then got out and get it. I haven't seen many disappointing factors other than internet bottle-necking that increases lag and decreases FPS. I wouldn't necessarily blame the simulator as much as detail settings, net connection and how many are in a particular server. Nothing says ya cannot have a LAN party. I only wish a F14 driver could pass along the module to prevent having to buy the module again to allow a human RIO to participate (in a LAN environment anyway) not everyone wants to drive and not everyone has wicked rigs but I'd say That is an investment one must weigh before pulling the trigger on any simulator purchase. Cheers!!
I bought every module and I regret half of them. Notably, the WW2 and early cold war planes.
I only fly either helos or ultra modern planes.
Thankfully, we have the trial system now, but we always have to wait months to get it
I really feel like a dynamic campain would help solve a lot of the boredom with most of the modules. We would still have the early access problem, but i would feel a lot more comfortable.
My regret with DCS is that it is so buggy it is unusable. I was quite happy with the initial purchase, but various problems began to arise that eventually degenerated its operation to a point where I would no sooner fix a problem than another one would arise. So DCS sits on my hard drive taking up space and collecting stray electrons.
I put out thousands of dollars for a dedicated, top of the line VR gaming system, with several thousand dollars added in for HMDs and control peripherals. For the money spent I want to fly, not troubleshoot hardware and software issues. I was paid to do that for more than twenty years. Thus I find no end to the irony that I now have to pay DCS and other sims, not to mention the flight control manufactures, that have the same problem.
I purchased a thousand dollars worth of flight sticks but had to send both back to the manufactures to repair issues with button operation due to poor design of the connectors, but not until I had spent several weeks troubleshooting, diagnosing and communicating the nature of the problem with technicians.
I bought the second stick as replacement while I was waiting for the first one to be repaired. I had doubts about how good the repair might be anyway, so I figured I would have a backup in the event of another failure. While the first stick took a while before malfunctioning, the the second stick, purchased as a replacement, malfunctioned out of the box.
The the first stick was repaired and returned before the second one was even repaired. The process took months of lost stick time that I put to use with my flawless yoke flying multimotor aircraft, but at least I now have two fully functional flight sticks. As an added bonus, I like the second stick better.
The fact is dysfunctionality is one of the design features modern gaming sims. It not plug and play, it's plug and pray.
I want the JF17, but until there is a proper finished manual for it, I am not buying. Why does ED allow planes to be sold so incomplete?.
@@christiannielsen8733 The thing about an official manual is accountability: This is what the developer says about how the aircraft should function, so now you know if there's a bug. It also demonstrates that they're capable of putting a whole package together, not just stringing some code out on a shoelace budget.
The Harrier looks fun (for example). I'm not sold on it when there's been no official manual for years. I need to know what it's supposed to do, not a third-party description of what it does.
Well i own almost all of the dcs modules and the JF-17 is on the top of my most liked modules. I don't think i have read one of the developers manuals cause i dont need to when you got chucks and youtube.
JF-17 is the best dogfighter in the game
I regret everything I’ve bought in DCS except for the F-14.
Especially the Super Carrier. 98% of the time, I’m flying Caucuses in the Tomcat. And If I’m very lucky, its in a server with the Forestal running Air Boss.
Every thing else, planes, scenery, etc. never gets used. Or it gets used once for an event then never touched again. Looking at you online groups that demand x # of owned modules….
Got to be AV-8, L-39 and MIG-21 and have not really touched them since. Happy with my helos
i have stand alone but buy with steam manly because the US makes it so expensive to buy anything of them so i don' .The price for me standalone is sticker price then add sales tax with steam it just sticker price because of reginal pricing
Only buyers remorse I have in DCS is the Nevada Map. Everything else is fantastic and fun.
Bought the f16 as my first module this sale and tbh i love it but sadly got no friends on dcs
Great video. spot on with the content
Much appreciated!
F15E still has unrealistic energy tied to it, like it's basically still a delta wing like the F-15C. It also STILL cannot go vertical and keep it's speed. and for 64.99, they should have atleast fixed those, but no, of course not. I was between the choice of the JF17, and the F15E. Which one would you have chose, and if you chose one, give me your opinion on the one you have! (or both)
JF-17
F15E since it has more bombs, fuel, then jeff and is faster. but the jf17 can do all roles were as f15 main does ground stuff and air air. both planes are Easy to start. will say jf-17 is a finish plane.
I got all the modules I wanted. I just regret buying the half-baked training aircraft. From all the announced modules I'll only buy Mig-23 and 29.
I'm not sure I have "buyers Regret" with anything - except maybe disappointment with the Super Carrier. I'm glad I bought it, but disappointed they are making snails progress with the features they promise.That said, the most popular module in DCS is the F-18c and it's been 5 years since launch and it's still in early release and they still put it on sale at 30% off. I think there should be some kind of explanation for that. I suggest there be rules set for module early release, like what features are clearly present at release - a percentage or a specific list to customers, and then a time limit where they MUST have all promised features done. Right now, it's like contractors, they promise you they'll do great work, but it is done at their leisure leaving you waiting and waiting as they start new projects and have you on the hook.
ED should focus on upgrading and fixing the core game before making new modules.
@@Topper_Harley68I agree, they need to split their operations into four groups (if they haven't already done so), - Fast movers, WW2, Helicopters, and core features and improvements.
Just discovered that at least for me I cannot get the 2FA to work so cannot trial any items. But there is no 2FA on a purchase! What! I really wanted to try a few modules and test the cold war era to maybe fly on your server. I got the F5 and it seems fun. But why make it so difficult .grrrr
You can email their support team, I had to reset my 2FA one time
I bought all my modules on sales, I see no shame in that. DCS offers them quite often. And also, I'll buy some modules I barely/rarely use (both maps and planes). I'm happy I bought my stuff for a good price and even if I don't use it (yet, hopefully), I supported DCS/ED/3rd party devs. No remorse. Not for money at least. My remores is mostly bugs related.