I never heard about this manufacturer so I checked it's website: the hirony is that it isn't far from my home and I had to learn about it from a review from the other side of the wolrd! Thank you so much Steve!
What a cool dac. Can practically hear how delicious it must be from just looking at those internals. Got to get that Carlos Cipa 11 pianos recording. I’ve got well-recorded Keith Jarrett and others, but this ould be altogether different. Hard to find well recorded piano(s) performed on an expert level...never encountered anything like that, thank you for making us aware of yet another unique project supporting great artists, as all the other great recordings you bring to us that we would not find on our own. 🙏🏼
The sound of the Sabre system is completely dependent on the implementation. We had a discussion on this on DIYaudio this week. With proper power and filters it can be as natural as a well done R2R but with the detail that Sabre is famous for. Looks like these guys took some time to get it right given the number of transformers.
You're spot on about how a dac is implemented and it will sound. My cheap little Topping D50s uses 2 Sabre dacs and it sounds nice with none of the so-called Sabre glare.
Zero Uno? Oh, I get it! I always use a tube buffer with my dacs, even the DSPeaker room correction DAC. Doric string quartet Hayden sounding magical right now:-) I'll check out the Cosmo Sheldon birds at sunrise ;-) Thanks Steve!
Nice to hear that you've discorverd Cosmo Sheldrake! His stuff is definitly available on vinyl record (It's right in front of me). While I find the first LP Album somewhat overproduced and exhausting - I love the EP "Pelicans We". And it sounds brilliant. So good.
Hi Steve. Would love to have your take on the Chord Hugo TT2 - both without (less $ than CanEVER) and in conjunction with the Chord Upscaler unit (more $). The Chord kit fills a very similar set of functions - with style and also with unique technology. I really think that it would be your thing... if you gave it a listen. Greetings to one and all.
Hi Steve, Several months ago I tried to Unsubscribe to your show, but was unsuccessful. I'm glad I didn't, I enjoyed the last few reviews (term + & LS 28SE) I like the passion that you bring to your reviews and the obscure products that you present 👍
Another great review and I enjoy hearing about your music selections very much. I saw Lucinda at the Troubadour a couple of years ago and she’s got one of the best bands I’ve ever heard live and I’m not that familiar with her music. A great sounding cd you might want to listen to is Martina McBride’s Timeless even if you’re not a fan(it’s the only recording of her I own). It was recorded with all tubes including the mikes using vintage instruments. All classic songs and it sounds great. My favorite singer in that genre is Patty Loveless. Her ‘Sleepless Nights’ is another must have cd of standards with a vintage feel. There’s something about the singers from that part of the country(Kentucky). Not a fan of modern popular country in the least though.
With a good Mic setup, and some public domain music, you could most definitely be doing LIVE auditions of the products you review. Mind you a good set of cans are needed to get an accurate listen on our side here. At the very least, it be a cool thing to try!
Too much success Bro, we now have your flow/interrupted by the foes/advertising, merchandizing, mesmerizing/want my other dose, could even like Bose. Want the man in plain, and Steve is the name.
i don't need a headphone amp or pre-amp. my NAD D1050 still gets me through the night. and it cost $400! i am not sure if DACS have improved that much in 7 years?
Steve, I’m an old analogue guy and while I understand that a DAC is literally a digital to analogue converter, I struggle with how DACs are optimally employed in every day use. For people like me who either listen to Pandora or have a bunch of albums we bought on iTunes over the years, all of which we listen to via our phone, what will a DAC add? I have an audio engine Bluetooth receiver for my home system (which I realize contains a DAC), but I look at these large, expensive DAC components and think I must be missing something. Would be great if you could do a DACs for Dummies video to bring old guys like me into the present.
@@victorsixtythree thank you I did see that and I appreciate you pouting it out. I’m afraid I need an even more basic starting point. I’ll probably stop by my local store and just badger the salespeople with my dumb questions.
@@edd2771 As a person who has tried a couple of inexpensive DACs for headphone listening, I can tell you that at its most basic, using a DAC is (to me) similar to using a magnifying glass for your music. Not in the sense of volume, although it can seem a bit louder, and not in the sense of scale; but in the sense of having 'more' of what you've already got. Bass goes deeper, midrange sounds clearer, instruments sound more separated from each other. Lyrics are easier to make out. If you're listening to something that is layered or dense, it's easier to hear everything that's going on, and pick out individual instruments and voices. Put more simply, as Steve says, it sounds more like you're there in the room with the musicians or singer(s). It just sounds better. Edit: As in all things audiophilia, your mileage may vary. If you're listening to low quality mp3 files from itunes, over a bluetooth speaker, then don't worry about what you're missing. If you're passionate about wanting to hear the resonance of the sound decay of the body of a guitar after the strings have been played, and you may be a little obsessive (that actually helps in this hobby), then you won't mind going out of your way to find the best encoder to optimise the sound of your carefully curated music files, played over a device specially made to give you the best sound quality, through speakers made to reproduce high definition sound into a room carefully arranged to optimize your listening experience. The difference in how music is experienced between those two extreme examples is vast. Like the difference between a child's homemade cardboard car and a Rolls Royce.
@@edd2771 You'll be pretty limited as far as quality playback goes with Bluetooth, it wasn't really designed for high quality playback. Also lossy formats like Pandora & iTunes will limit quality. There are advantages to an external DAC such as noise isolation and overall better implementation than the DAC that's in your BT receiver, but you might have to go to a wired connection, lossless file formats and a better quality audio player to realize those advantages. In other words, it sounds like there are other weaknesses to your system that would reap more benefit from an upgrade before a decent DAC would deliver a noticeable difference.
I've tried 3 DAC's (MODI3, SMSL and Dayton) with my 2019 MacBook Pro and they all sound the same (DSSL lost USB connection randomly). I've put them up against a "high quality" headphone to RCA output and can not hear a difference running it through my Yamaha R-S300. I've also run the same DAC's through my iPhone 11 and a friends MacPro tower. All devices running the latest software. The only DAC type device that has sounded a bit better is the dragonfly device. I've returned them all and stuck with the Y cable. What am I missing here???
I’m curious, what headphones were you using? Also to be clear, you were comparing the dacs out of your laptop into the receiver and then to the phones? So no difference listening with phones or loudspeakers? What loudspeakers btw? Are you also saying the dacs were no better than the audio straight out of headphone jack of the MacBook?
@@howmit6361 I wasn’t using headphones at all. The DAC was being used to bring signal from laptop to DAC to Yamaha amp then to speakers. And yes it seemed I was getting a better signal from laptop to amp through the headphone port. I may try a Dayton DAC/amp and see how that sounds. I was surprised after reading and watching reviews that I wasn’t getting the sound quality as reported.
BTW, Could you get a hand on the RME ADI-2 DAC FS. Seems like a good bargain if you want a good headphone combo, with professional features for mastering. Thxs
who would buy a 6k Dac today when you can get great sound for under a grand. by in the 80's you could make this argument but not today. digital has come a long way. i do not think is advancing as rapidly as it did in the 80's and 90's. i have a NAD D1050 that is over 7 years old and it sounds very good. if i could find a better DAC for under a grand i would buy it.
Another quality designed Audiophile product from Italy (Europe). No HiFi manufacturers in Africa or South America? You never review any products from this part of our planet. Are these countries considered too poor to support the top end HiFi market or the Arts which thrive in North America, Europe and Asia?
I use the RME ADI-2 with a Project Sunrise tube headphone amp, lets me instantly switch between "extremely clean" and "very tubey" just by moving my headphone cable a few inches, love the combo!
Beauty is, of course, in the eyes of the beholder but to this beholder that is a really ugly looking piece of kit. I love Italian design, where form and function tend to be married to elegance. Pathos, Unison Research, Gold Note, Sonus Faber, Zingali all make beautiful products which perform well. This looks like it was cobbled together in someone's garage from left over bits. And the logo looks cheap. The insides, however, do betray the quality of the product and I am sure it sounds lovely. But the looks ? I guess it is what the English would call a Marmite product (Marmite is an especially foul yeast spread). You either love it or you hate it. Perhaps it is one of those things which look crap in pictures but great in person. A bit like me. Actually, no, I look pretty rough in both...
These AIO units always make me nervous... Most of these companies are good to great at one thing and poor to moderate at another. Hegel makes great amps but their DACs in the integrated are Meh. Burson does a pretty good job for and AIO on the conductor but their standalone products are always better.
Just got a Conductor 3XP and have to say the implementation of the Sabre DAC in it is excellent. I do like the headphone amp as well and that allowed me to sell my Musical Fidelity amp to help fund the change. The DAC was the main driver for upgrading however, and I am absolutely satisfied. I do tend to agree, nonetheless, where practical single purpose units are often the better choice.
I never heard about this manufacturer so I checked it's website: the hirony is that it isn't far from my home and I had to learn about it from a review from the other side of the wolrd! Thank you so much Steve!
What a cool dac. Can practically hear how delicious it must be from just looking at those internals. Got to get that Carlos Cipa 11 pianos recording. I’ve got well-recorded Keith Jarrett and others, but this ould be altogether different. Hard to find well recorded piano(s) performed on an expert level...never encountered anything like that, thank you for making us aware of yet another unique project supporting great artists, as all the other great recordings you bring to us that we would not find on our own. 🙏🏼
Dang Steve that’s a lot of headphones, which are your favorites. You should do a Hall of Fame like good ol Tyll used to do. Man I miss Tyll.
The sound of the Sabre system is completely dependent on the implementation. We had a discussion on this on DIYaudio this week. With proper power and filters it can be as natural as a well done R2R but with the detail that Sabre is famous for. Looks like these guys took some time to get it right given the number of transformers.
You're spot on about how a dac is implemented and it will sound. My cheap little Topping D50s uses 2 Sabre dacs and it sounds nice with none of the so-called Sabre glare.
Steve is a UA-camr with the most infectious looking smile I've ever seen!
Zero Uno?
Oh, I get it!
I always use a tube buffer with my dacs, even the DSPeaker room correction DAC. Doric string quartet Hayden sounding magical right now:-)
I'll check out the Cosmo Sheldon birds at sunrise ;-)
Thanks Steve!
Cosmo Sheldrake!
Nice to hear that you've discorverd Cosmo Sheldrake!
His stuff is definitly available on vinyl record (It's right in front of me).
While I find the first LP Album somewhat overproduced and exhausting -
I love the EP "Pelicans We". And it sounds brilliant.
So good.
Hi Steve. Would love to have your take on the Chord Hugo TT2 - both without (less $ than CanEVER) and in conjunction with the Chord Upscaler unit (more $). The Chord kit fills a very similar set of functions - with style and also with unique technology. I really think that it would be your thing... if you gave it a listen. Greetings to one and all.
Hi Steve,
Several months ago I tried to Unsubscribe to your show, but was unsuccessful. I'm glad I didn't, I enjoyed the last few reviews (term + & LS 28SE) I like the passion that you bring to your reviews and the obscure products that you present 👍
Wait until these hit Ebay if you must have one. Straight to DVD, as they would say.
Another great review and I enjoy hearing about your music selections very much. I saw Lucinda at the Troubadour a couple of years ago and she’s got one of the best bands I’ve ever heard live and I’m not that familiar with her music. A great sounding cd you might want to listen to is Martina McBride’s Timeless even if you’re not a fan(it’s the only recording of her I own). It was recorded with all tubes including the mikes using vintage instruments. All classic songs and it sounds great. My favorite singer in that genre is Patty Loveless. Her ‘Sleepless Nights’ is another must have cd of standards with a vintage feel. There’s something about the singers from that part of the country(Kentucky). Not a fan of modern popular country in the least though.
With a good Mic setup, and some public domain music, you could most definitely be doing LIVE auditions of the products you review. Mind you a good set of cans are needed to get an accurate listen on our side here. At the very least, it be a cool thing to try!
Too much success Bro, we now have your flow/interrupted by the foes/advertising, merchandizing, mesmerizing/want my other dose, could even like Bose. Want the man in plain, and Steve is the name.
Hi I own the Zero uno Pure dac and it’s worth every euro I’ve spent to buy it
Cool review. The canEVER reminds me of MHDT DACs: R2R, NOS, no op amps, with a tube buffer.
i don't need a headphone amp or pre-amp. my NAD D1050 still gets me through the night. and it cost $400! i am not sure if DACS have improved that much in 7 years?
Steve, I’m an old analogue guy and while I understand that a DAC is literally a digital to analogue converter, I struggle with how DACs are optimally employed in every day use. For people like me who either listen to Pandora or have a bunch of albums we bought on iTunes over the years, all of which we listen to via our phone, what will a DAC add? I have an audio engine Bluetooth receiver for my home system (which I realize contains a DAC), but I look at these large, expensive DAC components and think I must be missing something. Would be great if you could do a DACs for Dummies video to bring old guys like me into the present.
John Darko did a pretty good "Intro to DAC's" video several months ago: ua-cam.com/video/Dhrv-O9sivI/v-deo.html
@@victorsixtythree thank you I did see that and I appreciate you pouting it out. I’m afraid I need an even more basic starting point. I’ll probably stop by my local store and just badger the salespeople with my dumb questions.
@@victorsixtythree
Darko is running his cheap Rega P2 turntable into DACs these days for DSP...
Whatever next? :-D
@@edd2771
As a person who has tried a couple of inexpensive DACs for headphone listening, I can tell you that at its most basic, using a DAC is (to me) similar to using a magnifying glass for your music.
Not in the sense of volume, although it can seem a bit louder, and not in the sense of scale; but in the sense of having 'more' of what you've already got. Bass goes deeper, midrange sounds clearer, instruments sound more separated from each other.
Lyrics are easier to make out. If you're listening to something that is layered or dense, it's easier to hear everything that's going on, and pick out individual instruments and voices.
Put more simply, as Steve says, it sounds more like you're there in the room with the musicians or singer(s).
It just sounds better.
Edit: As in all things audiophilia, your mileage may vary.
If you're listening to low quality mp3 files from itunes, over a bluetooth speaker, then don't worry about what you're missing.
If you're passionate about wanting to hear the resonance of the sound decay of the body of a guitar after the strings have been played, and you may be a little obsessive (that actually helps in this hobby), then you won't mind going out of your way to find the best encoder to optimise the sound of your carefully curated music files, played over a device specially made to give you the best sound quality, through speakers made to reproduce high definition sound into a room carefully arranged to optimize your listening experience.
The difference in how music is experienced between those two extreme examples is vast. Like the difference between a child's homemade cardboard car and a Rolls Royce.
@@edd2771 You'll be pretty limited as far as quality playback goes with Bluetooth, it wasn't really designed for high quality playback. Also lossy formats like Pandora & iTunes will limit quality. There are advantages to an external DAC such as noise isolation and overall better implementation than the DAC that's in your BT receiver, but you might have to go to a wired connection, lossless file formats and a better quality audio player to realize those advantages. In other words, it sounds like there are other weaknesses to your system that would reap more benefit from an upgrade before a decent DAC would deliver a noticeable difference.
I've tried 3 DAC's (MODI3, SMSL and Dayton) with my 2019 MacBook Pro and they all sound the same (DSSL lost USB connection randomly). I've put them up against a "high quality" headphone to RCA output and can not hear a difference running it through my Yamaha R-S300. I've also run the same DAC's through my iPhone 11 and a friends MacPro tower. All devices running the latest software. The only DAC type device that has sounded a bit better is the dragonfly device. I've returned them all and stuck with the Y cable. What am I missing here???
I’m curious, what headphones were you using? Also to be clear, you were comparing the dacs out of your laptop into the receiver and then to the phones? So no difference listening with phones or loudspeakers? What loudspeakers btw? Are you also saying the dacs were no better than the audio straight out of headphone jack of the MacBook?
@@howmit6361 I wasn’t using headphones at all. The DAC was being used to bring signal from laptop to DAC to Yamaha amp then to speakers. And yes it seemed I was getting a better signal from laptop to amp through the headphone port. I may try a Dayton DAC/amp and see how that sounds. I was surprised after reading and watching reviews that I wasn’t getting the sound quality as reported.
Steve, if you have not already done so, can you pull some strings and get the Audio Research Dac 9, which has tubes in it, in for review.
I would love to see a review on that tube dac,, I build tube amps and pre amps. Id like to run that through my 300B.
The Sara K. Chesky album is on Qobuz for those who would like to check it out. Hope this is to be a trend.
BTW, Could you get a hand on the RME ADI-2 DAC FS. Seems like a good bargain if you want a good headphone combo, with professional features for mastering. Thxs
Lucinda Williams = National Treasure
Cosmo Sheldrake is totally his real name. He's amazing in concert. Check out this live performance of "Moss" ua-cam.com/video/QxZ0gN66xLs/v-deo.html
LOVE THAT SHIRT, KUDOS TO YOUR WIFE!
Why does it always take FOREVER for Steve to get to the price?
Sounds like tubey means it's not accurate and colorized?
Yes, that’s what I meant. If you want accurate get the benchmark dac
Steve Guttenberg Audiophiliac
Steve great info. Thanks. Can you recommend any other solid state DACs or AMPS that sound tubey? Thanks.
How about as a preamp? How good is it?
Price?? Did he say?
Did Steve start to roll his eyes when he told us the price?
Omg you were young once ! 😁
It's a good looking piece of equipment however their website is ...............different.
who would buy a 6k Dac today when you can get great sound for under a grand. by in the 80's you could make this argument but not today. digital has come a long way. i do not think is advancing as rapidly as it did in the 80's and 90's. i have a NAD D1050 that is over 7 years old and it sounds very good. if i could find a better DAC for under a grand i would buy it.
They make better DACs then yours for under $100 now. Never mind under $1000.
@@amb3cog Yeah, any Schiit DAC (except Yggy)
Just buy a topping e30 and the l30 and your done.
@@amb3cog thanks
@@r423sdex Ha! No one in this hobby is ever "done"!
Cosmo Sheldrake? Wasn’t that Kramer’s real name on Seinfeld?
Yes it was
Is there anybody else other than tidal doing mqa ? I thought it is something unique to tidal...
Another quality designed Audiophile product from Italy (Europe). No HiFi manufacturers in Africa or South America? You never review any products from this part of our planet. Are these countries considered too poor to support the top end HiFi market or the Arts which thrive in North America, Europe and Asia?
If this type of product appeals, try RME ADI- 2 FS DAC ($1200). Precision , German engineered device: transparent, neutral.
These 2 pieces of equipment don't seem anything alike!
I use the RME ADI-2 with a Project Sunrise tube headphone amp, lets me instantly switch between "extremely clean" and "very tubey" just by moving my headphone cable a few inches, love the combo!
Beauty is, of course, in the eyes of the beholder but to this beholder that is a really ugly looking piece of kit. I love Italian design, where form and function tend to be married to elegance. Pathos, Unison Research, Gold Note, Sonus Faber, Zingali all make beautiful products which perform well. This looks like it was cobbled together in someone's garage from left over bits. And the logo looks cheap.
The insides, however, do betray the quality of the product and I am sure it sounds lovely.
But the looks ? I guess it is what the English would call a Marmite product (Marmite is an especially foul yeast spread). You either love it or you hate it. Perhaps it is one of those things which look crap in pictures but great in person. A bit like me. Actually, no, I look pretty rough in both...
indeed it's zero not uno regarding industrial design. many small companies struggle to bring form and function together...
These AIO units always make me nervous... Most of these companies are good to great at one thing and poor to moderate at another. Hegel makes great amps but their DACs in the integrated are Meh. Burson does a pretty good job for and AIO on the conductor but their standalone products are always better.
Just got a Conductor 3XP and have to say the implementation of the Sabre DAC in it is excellent. I do like the headphone amp as well and that allowed me to sell my Musical Fidelity amp to help fund the change. The DAC was the main driver for upgrading however, and I am absolutely satisfied. I do tend to agree, nonetheless, where practical single purpose units are often the better choice.
$6500 !!! Or a SMSL M8A for $200
♥️♥️♥️♥️♥️♥️♥️♥️♥️♥️♥️