Notice this video doesn’t have any sponsors? Yup… I didn’t wanna sell out to rubbish sponsors, and a lot of the big players don’t want to be associated with such a niche and potentially dangerous topic. If you wanna help fund these projects ( we’ve got loads in the pipeline! ), then feel free to drop a donation as a gift in comments, or become a channel member and get perks too! ❤
Search “topbms High voltage” They do a BMS that has 16s slave units (you can add as many as you like), so you can easily get up to 400v and the added bonus is it will talk to the solax. The only down side is the price, looking at about £750-£1000 for the full BMS kit. I do have one with 2 slave BMS units ;)
Another irritating UA-camr who thinks the word; 'SOMETHING' is spelled with a 'K' at the end !!! Grow up !!! There is no such word as "SOMETHINK" !!!!!!!!!!!!
Yessss! Glad to see a real world demo of this in the UK. I'm about to get started on an install using Dala's Emulator too. Can get 77kWh kia ev6 battery for £2k, ipace 90kWh for £4k, kia 64kWh for £3k, tesla 55kWh lfp for £4k, tesla 77kWh NMC/NCA for £4k also.....its a whole new world of storage. This is what we should be promoting.
@corymac over the last few years I've been discussing 2nd life EV battery utilisation with a specialist EV engineering firm locally to me. They have a relationship with JLR and have a warehouse of ipace batteries like these, plus original development batteries that have never been in cars etc. They developed plug and play external battery monitoring solutions for the OEMs in service and recycling scenarios and they know these batteries inside out. Do you fancy having a chat with them and I about how we offer these commercially for customers with suitable risk management etc?
I've also got a consortium of farmers in Wales interested in using the Dala Emulator and 2nd life EV batteries for rural agricultural energy storage. If we can get a group of engaged installers in a room to take this challenge on together, I think we can build some momentum and a market for this in the UK! It's exciting. Thanks for all your hard work Dala, and your awesome community.
One word is not enough to describe your determination to solve this puzzle! Tenacious, persevering, determined, resolute, purposeful, dogged, single-minded, tireless, indefatigable, patient, unflagging, untiring, insistent, importunate, unrelenting describe you better! Well done for not giving up. Hope someone who knows the intricacies of the particular program developed for the Jaguar car battery can divulge what you need to know. Good luck!
It’s refreshing to see a spark taking an active interest in the deep dive side of things, but importantly staying humble about the fundamental differences between electrics and electronics without implying that it’s the same thing to those that don’t know any better - well done and best of luck getting this to work 👍
@@corymac fair play to you you - it's a diverse field - I am an EE but don't do it as my day job so there's swathes of stuff I find interesting but have little expertise in - everyday's a learning day as the saying goes! A bit like a GP attempting to do brain surgery by qualification and watching a few videos 😆 - I did an entire module on CAN but really despise software and coding, though I can scrape by if I really need to (e.g. using Arduino for Open Energy Monitor) - it's also a case of not re-inventing the wheel so you'll be breaking ground with this for the benefit of others by reverse engineering it 🙂
Best clip ever on this channel! Why? Because this is far beyond the usual small talk content and it shows what power we can unleash in so many ways. First a lot of brain power is needed, then lots of battery power and energy is unleashed and after all it's for the renewable power of the sun. Keep going! Cheers from a HV battery and solar system builder in Germany.
On some cars, the battery does a handshake with another ECU in the car, which includes car-specific info like the VIN, so replaying the data from the car may not work on that battery.
You should be able to speak to some EV recycle people about the feasibility of swapping these Jag batteries and what it involves. If you can do a straight swap, then that implies VIN/coding information between donors and cars is not relevant.
As the battery is comprised of smaller packs rather than individual cells, I'd be tempted to disassemble the pack from it's protective outer shell and repurpose the individual packs. Which may well prove a lot easier than stripping the Tesla-style packs containing thousands of individual cells, also eliminating their nasty communications issues. Just a thought. 👍
On some EVs there is a so-called continuity wire that runs parallel to the main high voltage/ high power conductors. That continuity wire must show that all connectors are, indeed, connected. I took apart a NIssan Leaf in 2014 and the only way to get the motor to run again was to connect every part of the original car (motor/batter/charger/dashboard etc) - then the VCU decided it was OK to flick the internal contactors on. LMK if you want a link to that video.
@@Zodliness You are right. I think they will spend a lot of time going nowhere. My biggest fear is that they will assume that they can put 400+V in to the solar inverter. Maybe they've already thought about this but if they haven't it's real important to know that the impedance of a solar array outputting 400 or 500 volts is NOT the same as a battery outputting 400+ volts.
Have you thought about the interlock loop? (The 2 little pins on the big orange connector) These 2 little pins need to be shorted to make EV-systems or the battery work. Its a safety feature, if a module breaks or the car is in a crash then those 2 little pins wont be shorted and disables all the high-voltage systems! Including the big contactors inside the battery!
Love to see you solving difficult problems. Don't normally make donations but this was so good. Putting a battery like this into a boat, such as a cannal boat or something sexier would be cool project I'm incapable of but would love to see.
Louis Rossman is all about the right to repair and stopping the companies from locking you out of seeing the analytic's they are collecting from you without your permission with their rapist mentality!
The spirit of Jehugarcia or Will Prowse they have been doing this for years. Jehu has been driving a 60's VW van on recycled tesla batteries for 11 years and DIY power walls for 6 yrs everyone should have one to recharge their EV with., Also watch Rich rebuilds for recycling EVs
WOW, what a vid, what a topic, what a fantastic idea. if ALL car manufacturers made a simple unit (or 3rd parties) to go from a old under performance battery, so it can be used like this with ANY inverter, what a way to recycle and reuse. I was hooked from the first few seconds till the end.... bring on part 2 asap.
Add it to the list of things I wish happened, that will probably never happen. But we can try and help the open source community crack it without manufacturers! 🤩👍🏼
@@corymac Well depends if OEMs move more to a model of doing stuff themselves it would be a easy option todo. I'll do my part and will try to get our battery team to make this possible.
Some third-party manufacturers already do. I spoke with a cousin working at a car recycling facility and a lot of EV batteries from scraped cars are sold for second-life purposes such as hooked up to a solar array.
Cory being a geek is cool as a 70 year old retired electrician/ maintenance engineer I have solved many problems thinking outside of the box . Good old UA-camrs like you still inspired me in retirement .I have leant basic electronics and knew about needing a 60 ohm resistance on the can bus . Can't wait for the follow up video great project
The BMS ECU will go to sleep because it's not seeing activity on the CAN bus. You'll need to record a log from the iPace and play it back through SavvyCAN in a loop. Then turn off the IDs one by one until you find the network management frame it's looking for to keep it awake. I don't have any experience with the iPace CAN, but I've done extensive reverse-engineering on Teslas systems, and this is how they work.
@@corymac Well, I missed the part where you explained this then, You seemed to spend a lot o f time trying to figure out why the BMS only spit out CAN for a short period on power up. I also never saw you isolate the CAN frame ID needed to keep the BMS awake (the network management frame).
Most people will strip the battery and put the modules into 24v or 48v (as close as possible). Then just use standard solar electronics. What can you do in 400v form? Electrocute yourself? If your dog bites the 400v cable, it's brain will fry.
@@joeberginc7415 400v is substantially more efficient. If you aren't qualified to handle 400v, you probably aren't qualified to open the battery in any event, and even a tiny 48v pack can still burn your house down! I have a fully intact Tesla Model S pack that I am using this exact way, and it works great and is safe. By keeping the pack in it's original envelope, ts also safely contained in case something goes wrong. Using the original BMS instead of some hacked in thing is also much safer.
@@corymac Automotive Pyro fuses are not necessarily obvious in appearance. To all intents they can look like a solenoid or a relay, the connection is hidden inside - the pyro bit blows out the connection and you may not be able to see that it's blown. The clue might be heavy duty terminals either side/end and test it for continuity. Location in the contactor bank?
Looks like good progress so far. One note on the relays when you open the doors, that's probably the pre-charge relay getting the vehicle HV system ready for key on by the time the driver is in the seat. The BMS will, most likely, enforce a maximum duty cycle on this relay so once you get it to close the BMS won't let you re-close it until the resistor or PTC element used for pre-charging has cooled off enough. If you're looking at CAN frames on the network to the battery you might want to take a particular interest in frames with the ID 0x10A, 0x10B and 0x10C.
We are missing an ignition on signal, Also we would like to understand if 0x012 has any interesting signals for the BECM. If you reckon you could help - info@oyelectrical.com. An email would be awesome 🙌
Someone pointed out the coolant loops and other connectors. See if that pile of bits has the connectors and if they have sense resistors in them, the battery ecu might be booting and checking presence of all its ports before it will take a ‘close contractors’ message. If it’s JLR they aren’t big on securing messages across components, so should take a raw message and just execute it.
Good spot Ian. We’ve managed to nab Dala, him combined with Chris is proving quite a lethal combo. There are HVIL loops I’ve since discovered too on the connections.
Remember it’s all thrown together quick in the factory and serviced by parts swappers, so the code will have checks in it to make sure everything is nominal before it will take the commands that ‘do’ things. All of this needs to be inside the domain of that battery ecu. Also if it’s anything like Tesla, it will keep the contractors engaged for like 15-30 mins after you put it in park. Let’s it dc-dc the 12v back up to a decent voltage for standby, and watch UA-cam while your Chinese is being made. The pyro fuse will have been commanded to blow in the crash, have you located it? Hope it’s not on the bottom of the pack?
Troubleshooting is so much fun. It’s like you hit a roadblock after a roadblock, frustration to no end and then, bam, it starts working and you end up with that happy face like when you guys managed to get the contactors to engage. It’s so satisfying.
"Troubleshooting fucking sucks ass." there fixed your typo It’s like you hit a roadblock after a roadblock, frustration to no end you know you're on the right track ask google for help and nobody seems to have the faintes idea what you're talking about, nobody in human history has ever faced this problem... and then, bam you get it, and then it is so much fun! I get your original comment, but good god how I wish I could avoid trouble shooting... yet... I don't? since I learn more when things don't work rather then "it just works" 😅
Every HV plug will have a HV interlock that will need to be shorted ( it is a loop that connects all the plugs together. Also remember this is a car, when a car crashes and the airbags deploy the RCM module will send a CAN message to open contactors, additional to this legislation requires that there is a separate wire from the RCM that carries a square wave signal to give the all clear!
I have fad Jaguar and Landrover cars for thirty years, and I had an Aquaintance that programmed the ECU's. The Eproms are separetley programmed by different people, and put together on the motherboard. The system has both a high speed and low speed Can Bus. When you open the car, the ecu starts to talk to the modules and pressing the start button sets another handshake in operation. The front left hand footwell fusebox is programmed to the dashboard. the front ecu is connected to the rear spare wheel fuseboc by fibre optics, Orange cable. Cambus are white cables. The system needs 13.2 volts to work properly, nine volts throughs a wobbly on start up. The rear seat footwell fuse boxes double up from the front fuse box. The Ecu's have Optical fuses on the inputs. One needs to follow the staring sequence to fault find the system.
The easiest solution is to strip the existing BMS as it is looking at too many things, and install One that only looks at temperature and maybe module voltage, to cut out when short circuit, then it is easy to reset not that CAN none sense, simplicity is the key, once you have the simplified contractor control it is easy to connect to the inverter
Inspiring! The thousands of CAN messages are more than likely communication errors, caused by the HPCM trying to communicate with every other control unit that is missing on the car i.e ABS, BCM, and especially immobiliser.
Hands down the BEST video from your channel and about car battery reuse overall. I support Dala's EV repair long term on Patreon, but there was never such a great video as this one. Thanks for the work. You have the best hobby from my perspective!
Modern cars have a pyro fuse to prevent the car from turning over after a crash and the airbags going off. Maybe one of those fuses you pointed out need replacing? Love the concept Cory boy
I will also look into this " pyro fuse" safety lock. Sometimes it's an electronic safety lock if the car was in a bigger accident. Mostly if more airbags are deployed.
Hi Cory, I am a high voltage technician with Audi. I would say that you are missing the control unit for the battery, on Audi its called J840. Battery management ECU, this communicates directly to the battery. Great video by the way mate.
This leaves me wondering if disassembling the main pack and repurposing the individual cells packs would be easier in the long run. You'd be able to optimise the packs final output stage voltages to requirements, simultaneously eliminating those three complex vehicle cam bus modifications in the process. It might also allow you to weed out any potentially deficient/defective cells in an otherwise reusable pack. When being used for lower charge/discharge applications like solar storage, there's little requirement for an integrated liquid cooling system. Thanks for sharing. 👍 This is my opinion, I could be wrong. 😉
I much prefer the battery packs their design as their rebust and had a quality control. You cant recreate the same level on your own what you see here.
I can't really tell from the video if you did. But in all Power plug diodes there is a H VIL circuit. it runs around all 400V plugs and must be unbroken.
@@corymac I have on a Nissan battery had to send a "wake up" bit before an ok can be sent on the canbus. so it is not certain that it is enough to send "ok" and "switch on contactor".
Just a query, so when u put it on the wall will this effect the loop for the water as its use to being flat and would be putting adverse pressure on the pump?
An EV UA-camr I watch has did this. He’s Glyn Hudson, he also added his own ASHP and converted his env200 to an EV camper. Knows about bms/cambus requirements etc. Think he used a Leaf battery for his home. He’s also a Fully Charged friend!
It's unbelievable what you're trying to do. RESPECT! I think this will be the future for many older EVs. My question is, wouldn't it be easier to mechanically disconnect the battery from the controller and add all those KWh to an existing home battery?
Excellent work, inspirational and very interesting. Thanks for the great commentary Cory and the team. Make it work! Will keep an eye out for number 2.
People like you are leading the way to a perfect reuse of large battery packs. Plz push on and consider making kits at the end of your adventure for others to reuse large batterys as well.
@@joshuaspires9252plug and play would mean any faults would land back at Cory's door and I doubt he'd like that, not to mention the liability he'd be taking on. Much better to release it openly so that the learning-pains element is gone, folk just need to get a competent & LOCAL electronics engineer in to implement it.
AMAZING...!!!!!!!!!!!!!EOL,s solder,error messages . Loved it all. I wonder if its reading that the battery is mounted vertically rather than horozontally that its reading an error?. Crack on Cory.
11:17 Those "shunts" are HRC fuses. The symbol on the body shows a fuse in series with a diode which is a bit misleading as there is no semiconductor within the fuse. Instead that symbol means this is a high speed fuse which is designed to rupture rapidly enough to protect the high power semiconductors that the battery is connected to in the event of short circuit. They are not polarised, they won't block charging current and you should keep them in circuit.
@Jimages_uk I've no idea what the percentage is, to be honest, but it's obviously not 100%. At this point in time, "all" batteries going on to a "second life" is probably not feasible as it depends on so many factors, like demand, etc. But yes, "second life" is clearly something that should and undoubtedly will be expanded.
Great video and explanations with price of EVs dropping compared to domestic batteries would it be easier if space available to leave car whole and take power from motor connection ? Regards Colin
This is a legendary endeavor and an amazing look into trying to tap into an electric vehicle Controller Area Network. Awesome video guys, really impressive.
VIN Number of the car is coded in every single ECU and module. Swapping part will probably prevent the car to start, and it is easy to discover from the can BUS.
Every high voltage connector has a Interlock on it what is just there make sure every connector is plugged in befor the hv relay close. Maybe the top connector of the battery is internally wired into the bms? If you jump al the connector wires to the car you should be able to communicate with the battery through obd, when that works, you can eliminate wire for wire and see what kinda codes it gives and make a workaround as you go. Car diagnostic specialist here with a love for ev's
Hi Cory, there is a company called Connected Energy doing exactly this, using second life car batteries racked up in shipping containers to provide grid storage. Ps - great video!
Have you check the other connectors on the top? There is also the interlock loop inside. There must be a reason, the battery shut down after 5 sesonds. Something is failed to check while bootup. It could be the battery expected a massage from other ecu's in a time window (maybe every 5 sec )?
Very interesting project. I was thinking, an EV's 400V battery and the EV's motor-inverter should be able to create a nice 3-phase 400VAC at 50Hz. Or a single phase 230VAC at 50Hz, when hacked correctly. All needed power-electronics are there. The biggest problem would be that car manufacturers will go to great lengths to prevent the end user from tinkering with their product. I hope you'll succeed. I'd probably disassemble that battery, discard all electronics, assemble in a configuration that would work for me, and put in a BMS system, charge controller and inverter I can trust. But yea, would be super cool if you can re-use the car's BMS. Good luck. I'm looking forward to the next part.
Absolutely awesome, I take my hat off to you guys. And to whoever your end client is, thanks to them for supporting the experiment - like you say, it's got to be the way forwards in terms of recycling and reuse. And as for the Tesla joke... 😂
just a thought - ignition key??? does your battery have to talk to the coded ignition key that was originally used to enter/ immobilise /start the car before it became a wall mount?
Great stuff Cory, and well done for not digging yourself into a hole with that working I-Pace, the opportunities for blow ups are high on this one. In the past ive always used OEM CAN interfaces but im going to get one of those £25.00 amazon ones and have a go with SavvyCAN that I did not know about. Re the wiring/connector a pair of green 10 way rising clamp headers plug/socket may work well for you rather than committing to hard wiring! Looking forward to part two.
@@corymac had the same can bus reader just no luck with getting it to communicate yet think his is going to be a bit of a diy approach. wouldn't recommend as you know the voltage is in excess of 400+ V DC
I have so many of your videos to catch up on. This was honestly so interesting, I hope that you can find the answers and get this working, awesome video Cory!
This is brilliant, in Japan they have been doing this with prius batteries to power grocery stores. The market for this type of solution is in its infancy but will explode in time. Looking forward to the next video.
You will definitely need to plug in all the HVIL contacts of the battery. The big connectors at the top are more than likely to have those and the battery will definitely avoid electrocuting someone if it sees those connectors are unplugged.
Great idea. ❤ I live in the desert of Baja Mexico totally off grid. I took the batteries out of 4 SMART cars. Each was 53V nominal. I connected them all in in parallel and hooked them to a 48V Schneider Inverter/charger. Been running 5 buildings and AC for 8 years. Have 28 solar panels. Since I went parallel I do not use BMS.
First video I have watched on the channel and loved it. When transmitting the CAN signal to close the contactors have you considered the sequence in which they close. You want to ensure the pre-charge contactor is first closed to prevent arcing and premature failure of the contactor. Would it be easier to use the BMS purely for voltage and temperature sampling while hardwiring connections on to the 400V poles straight into an inverter? This way, you can have control on the 230V AC side instead. The terminating resistors you are measuring are actually two 120ohm resistors wired in parallel to give you your 60 ohms. You may want to ensure these are present on the network you are using or you will have to adapt the bus.
@corymac the BMS or “BECM” might not be satisfied because of an open HVIL. HVIL monitors all the HV Connections and shuts off the contactor if it’s sees open circuit. Try looping pin 7 and 15 at the connector you’ve soldered and you will also need to loop the HVIL pins in the centre of the three orange connections on the battery.
There should be an interlock connection on all of the battery connections for motor and charge port etc I would assume these would all need to be shorted out. The interlock shuts down the battery if and cable is broken discounted for safety
Great work! I foolishly bought an IDbuzz thinking you could plug it in and use the vehicle battery to power my home. Turns out you can but nobody actually makes a charger that allows you to plug in and do this. One is in development but it’s going to have a chadamo plug on it which renders it useless for my application. Keep up the good work.
Check out point guard energy. They are working on a V2X CCS (US) based bidirectional DC home charger... I don't think it works with any vehicles yet, but at least something is happening in the space.
This is an excellent video I can't wait for the next update. Hope once all this is figured out can share with the community how this was done. Excellent challenge to take up.
I'm a Brit living in Romania, I came across an interesting company here repurposing used EV batteries. They make systems of all sizes, from small systems for off grid to large containerised systems for 3 phase commercial use.
I used to do this in testing chambers. We'd use the batteries for the thermal mass to test heat pump systems on while charging and discharging the battery in road load simulations. We used manufacturer provided DBC files that decoded the can bits and a logic controller that tricked it into thinking the car was there. All privided by the manufacturer
I think it has been mentioned already, but that battery needs to think it is talking to the ECU/ BCM with a matching VIN. and that ecu / bcm might also need to have the "airbag / seatbelt charges blown" codes cleared so the battery thinks it is safe again.. along with a new high voltage pyro fuse. You might be better served seeing if you can get the battery to accept a charge first as that requires less things to be correct on the canbus. As you demonstrated in the working car, the contactors would not engage until all the doors were closed, your foot was on the brake, and you hit the start button - as well as the car sensing the key - none of which the battery on the wall will see. None of this is required for the battery to accept charge however. Getting the system to accept charge would eliminate some of the potential causes for it to not engage the contactors - giving you a smaller set of variables to work with.
You are where the future is .... I can't wait until someone gives such projects the traction needed to make this a business. ( Octopus??) Octopus do support VTG but the cars and charges are very limited. Their tariff is called Power pack is currently compatible with: Nissan Leaf Nissan e-NV200 Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV. The chargers needed are Wallbox Quasar 1 (it's worth noting that the Wallbox Quasar 1 is no longer for sale in the UK, so you'd have to have it already installed). Octopus say they are working hard on more integrations! Total respect to you guys for doing this - lets hope someone gets in touch to give you what is needed
Hey Cory, just wondering, are you aware of the recall for the Jag I-Pace for the battery pack causing several thermal runaway events and burning several properties down? Also, they had a recall for the recall, where they tried to “fix” their physical fault with the battery cell at a manufacturing level, where some still failed even after the software “update”. I've only just started watching, so maybe you cover it. Please make sure you have some really good working smoke and CO detectors throughout the property and have them interconnected for the safest detection and alarm if something were to happen.
cool to see those in the industry looking towards these kind of upcycling projects. some of those all in one solutions are eye wartering expensive. have you had a look at those DIY LFP battery backup systems? like the Seplos Mason, seems like a good option for those that want a cost effective soltuion & the safety of LFP cells, also a lot less reverse engineering.
Your comfort around 400vdc is rather worrying 😂 I would 100% use some opto isolators in line to those CAN interfaces. The last thing you want is any ground loops. In terms of the battery not responding it may be worth checking that a serial number for the main ECU is not expected by the BMS. That is just the kind of thing the manufacturers would do so you have to pay a dealer to change the battery. To help it would be a good idea to put the CAN messages on a Live / Google drive so we can see them. Some type of lockout or security code may be why the battery BMS is just going back to sleep.
@@corymac Your a lot more relaxed than me, I used to work on submarine DC power systems and have seen what 400+vdc can do. It's not pretty. I didn't know there was another isolator elsewhere on the pack as the switches are normally in the module. Your braver than me, I would have insulated those pins just to be safe. DC at that potential makes phase to phase AC contact look wimpy ! 🤯 Thanks... will have a look at the data. I didn't see a link to it, will have another look. Thanks for the interesting video 👍 I'm sure it can be done. It's a shame Jack from EVTV isn't about anymore as he would have been your man as far as proprietary can bus and protocols went.
Of course we're all trained in HV & electrical safety. I used to work on 50+ kV HV systems. A friend of mine I used to work with had his wedding ring finger blown off due to a charged capacitor...! So although we're relaxed, it's not because we're blaze !
@@obbardc Blew his finger off ??? Wow .. reminds me of my early college years when whe used to charge up a big electrolytic capacitor with a mega and throw it to someone telling them to catch 😅 I think over 30 years I have the best memories back on the tools and out on site. It becomes a lot less fun when your stuck driving desks !
I am no expert on EV's, but I am a qualified mechanic, you were right when you explained that a canbus is a network connected with different addresses, why don't you hook up the original wiring to the battery and try to control it through the gateway? I don't know how many gateways that vehicle have but you can probably research that. normally your gateway would be in your engine control module or your cluster or your body control module. The gateway is the system that speaks to all the other control modules, so all messages travel through the gateway to communicate with each other. If you can mimic all the signals that you need for the vehicle to think it is safe for the battery to switch on through the gateway but then it bought probably switch on, for instance if you take the wires from the break switch and you put it onto a normal flip switch that would be like an unoff switch or a safety onoff switch, and so on and so forth.
This is a great idea. If I knew that I could take a failed battery from my EV when I had to buy a new expensive one, I would have little hesitation to buy an EV. This should be a standard option you can buy for all EV batteries. Reuse is better than recycle.
So you've got the following from CAN: Door closed, foot on brake, Start/Stop button pressed. Maybe you need information form the driver seat sensor too? (e.g. In a Volvo C40 Recharge, if you lift your butt off the drivers seat, the car doesn't like it) What about charging the battery? Would you need to record a different sequence from CAN? 'Car in Park, Handbrake on' is about the only thing I can think of. This is a fascinating project!
Notice this video doesn’t have any sponsors? Yup… I didn’t wanna sell out to rubbish sponsors, and a lot of the big players don’t want to be associated with such a niche and potentially dangerous topic. If you wanna help fund these projects ( we’ve got loads in the pipeline! ), then feel free to drop a donation as a gift in comments, or become a channel member and get perks too! ❤
i don't mind watching a nordvpn shout out for grabbing the wire diagram in the US of A
A really UA-camr
Have you considered Patreon? I think the cut is better!
Search “topbms High voltage”
They do a BMS that has 16s slave units (you can add as many as you like), so you can easily get up to 400v and the added bonus is it will talk to the solax. The only down side is the price, looking at about £750-£1000 for the full BMS kit. I do have one with 2 slave BMS units ;)
Another irritating UA-camr who thinks the word; 'SOMETHING' is spelled with a 'K' at the end !!! Grow up !!! There is no such word as "SOMETHINK" !!!!!!!!!!!!
"Your comfort zone is a beautiful place, but nothings ever gonna grow there" would make a great t shirt
😅👍🏼
Yes! It's so true, and a wonderful way of putting it.
EU should legislate that all EV batteries be capable of reuse as a home battery with standard controllers, connectors, protocols etc.
I wish 🤤
They won't have to....this project will have decoded them all by then! Lol😂
I would like to have a standard interface for helping handicapped people. Can't use the indicator lights? No problem, just wire it up to a keypad.
I am sure we can make it work Cory! Let's work on it a bit together!🙌
Absolutely we can! Thanks for your help so far, and I look forwards to the collab on part 2!
Dala helped me get my 55kwh Tesla battery going, a true gentleman!
Yessss! Glad to see a real world demo of this in the UK.
I'm about to get started on an install using Dala's Emulator too.
Can get 77kWh kia ev6 battery for £2k, ipace 90kWh for £4k, kia 64kWh for £3k, tesla 55kWh lfp for £4k, tesla 77kWh NMC/NCA for £4k also.....its a whole new world of storage.
This is what we should be promoting.
@corymac over the last few years I've been discussing 2nd life EV battery utilisation with a specialist EV engineering firm locally to me. They have a relationship with JLR and have a warehouse of ipace batteries like these, plus original development batteries that have never been in cars etc.
They developed plug and play external battery monitoring solutions for the OEMs in service and recycling scenarios and they know these batteries inside out.
Do you fancy having a chat with them and I about how we offer these commercially for customers with suitable risk management etc?
I've also got a consortium of farmers in Wales interested in using the Dala Emulator and 2nd life EV batteries for rural agricultural energy storage.
If we can get a group of engaged installers in a room to take this challenge on together, I think we can build some momentum and a market for this in the UK! It's exciting.
Thanks for all your hard work Dala, and your awesome community.
I love these quietly spoken electronics engineers, unassuming geniuses...
One word is not enough to describe your determination to solve this puzzle! Tenacious, persevering, determined, resolute, purposeful, dogged, single-minded, tireless, indefatigable, patient, unflagging, untiring, insistent, importunate, unrelenting describe you better! Well done for not giving up. Hope someone who knows the intricacies of the particular program developed for the Jaguar car battery can divulge what you need to know. Good luck!
Thanks Bryan! We’ve since cracked the code! I’ll tell you about it soon! 😁👍🏼👍🏼
It’s refreshing to see a spark taking an active interest in the deep dive side of things, but importantly staying humble about the fundamental differences between electrics and electronics without implying that it’s the same thing to those that don’t know any better - well done and best of luck getting this to work 👍
Thanks mate! I did a course in electronics, and have delved into some basics, I know enough to know, that I don’t know it!
@@corymac fair play to you you - it's a diverse field - I am an EE but don't do it as my day job so there's swathes of stuff I find interesting but have little expertise in - everyday's a learning day as the saying goes! A bit like a GP attempting to do brain surgery by qualification and watching a few videos 😆 - I did an entire module on CAN but really despise software and coding, though I can scrape by if I really need to (e.g. using Arduino for Open Energy Monitor) - it's also a case of not re-inventing the wheel so you'll be breaking ground with this for the benefit of others by reverse engineering it 🙂
@@corymac The more you learn, the more you realise how much you don't know
Cory..you're my kind of sparky. Love your approach to things, and the fact you're not afraid to experiment and learn new things. Top-man.
Thanks, Steve!
Best clip ever on this channel! Why? Because this is far beyond the usual small talk content and it shows what power we can unleash in so many ways. First a lot of brain power is needed, then lots of battery power and energy is unleashed and after all it's for the renewable power of the sun. Keep going! Cheers from a HV battery and solar system builder in Germany.
Thanks man. Much appreciated, next year I have a few very interesting out of the box projects coming up. Just planning and saving up time and money
For me it's your best video so far , awesome content mate.
On some cars, the battery does a handshake with another ECU in the car, which includes car-specific info like the VIN, so replaying the data from the car may not work on that battery.
Interesting, thanks Mike!
You should be able to speak to some EV recycle people about the feasibility of swapping these Jag batteries and what it involves. If you can do a straight swap, then that implies VIN/coding information between donors and cars is not relevant.
As the battery is comprised of smaller packs rather than individual cells, I'd be tempted to disassemble the pack from it's protective outer shell and repurpose the individual packs. Which may well prove a lot easier than stripping the Tesla-style packs containing thousands of individual cells, also eliminating their nasty communications issues.
Just a thought. 👍
On some EVs there is a so-called continuity wire that runs parallel to the main high voltage/ high power conductors. That continuity wire must show that all connectors are, indeed, connected. I took apart a NIssan Leaf in 2014 and the only way to get the motor to run again was to connect every part of the original car (motor/batter/charger/dashboard etc) - then the VCU decided it was OK to flick the internal contactors on. LMK if you want a link to that video.
@@Zodliness You are right. I think they will spend a lot of time going nowhere. My biggest fear is that they will assume that they can put 400+V in to the solar inverter. Maybe they've already thought about this but if they haven't it's real important to know that the impedance of a solar array outputting 400 or 500 volts is NOT the same as a battery outputting 400+ volts.
Have you thought about the interlock loop? (The 2 little pins on the big orange connector)
These 2 little pins need to be shorted to make EV-systems or the battery work.
Its a safety feature, if a module breaks or the car is in a crash then those 2 little pins wont be shorted and disables all the high-voltage systems! Including the big contactors inside the battery!
You probably know more about the Ipace than the average Jaguar tech after this video... can't wait for Pt 2.
Love to see you solving difficult problems. Don't normally make donations but this was so good. Putting a battery like this into a boat, such as a cannal boat or something sexier would be cool project I'm incapable of but would love to see.
Thanks so much Keith, that’s really appreciated! 🤩
The spirit of Louis Rossman in action is a joy to behold, hack on! You crazy kids!
The Rossmann would be proud!
Yes indeed
Louis Rossman is all about the right to repair and stopping the companies from locking you out of seeing the analytic's they are collecting from you without your permission with their rapist mentality!
The spirit of Jehugarcia or Will Prowse they have been doing this for years. Jehu has been driving a 60's VW van on recycled tesla batteries for 11 years and DIY power walls for 6 yrs everyone should have one to recharge their EV with., Also watch Rich rebuilds for recycling EVs
@@crzy11000 Thanks for the tip! I'll take a look.
WOW, what a vid, what a topic, what a fantastic idea. if ALL car manufacturers made a simple unit (or 3rd parties) to go from a old under performance battery, so it can be used like this with ANY inverter, what a way to recycle and reuse. I was hooked from the first few seconds till the end.... bring on part 2 asap.
Add it to the list of things I wish happened, that will probably never happen. But we can try and help the open source community crack it without manufacturers! 🤩👍🏼
@@corymac Well depends if OEMs move more to a model of doing stuff themselves it would be a easy option todo.
I'll do my part and will try to get our battery team to make this possible.
Some third-party manufacturers already do. I spoke with a cousin working at a car recycling facility and a lot of EV batteries from scraped cars are sold for second-life purposes such as hooked up to a solar array.
Cory being a geek is cool as a 70 year old retired electrician/ maintenance engineer I have solved many problems thinking outside of the box . Good old UA-camrs like you still inspired me in retirement .I have leant basic electronics and knew about needing a 60 ohm resistance on the can bus . Can't wait for the follow up video great project
Thanks Alan! 🤓👍🏼
The BMS ECU will go to sleep because it's not seeing activity on the CAN bus. You'll need to record a log from the iPace and play it back through SavvyCAN in a loop. Then turn off the IDs one by one until you find the network management frame it's looking for to keep it awake. I don't have any experience with the iPace CAN, but I've done extensive reverse-engineering on Teslas systems, and this is how they work.
That’s exactly what we’re doing in the video 😎👍🏼
@@corymac Well, I missed the part where you explained this then, You seemed to spend a lot o f time trying to figure out why the BMS only spit out CAN for a short period on power up. I also never saw you isolate the CAN frame ID needed to keep the BMS awake (the network management frame).
Wow Phil, Good to see you here on this side of the Atlantic.
Most people will strip the battery and put the modules into 24v or 48v (as close as possible). Then just use standard solar electronics.
What can you do in 400v form?
Electrocute yourself?
If your dog bites the 400v cable, it's brain will fry.
@@joeberginc7415 400v is substantially more efficient. If you aren't qualified to handle 400v, you probably aren't qualified to open the battery in any event, and even a tiny 48v pack can still burn your house down! I have a fully intact Tesla Model S pack that I am using this exact way, and it works great and is safe. By keeping the pack in it's original envelope, ts also safely contained in case something goes wrong. Using the original BMS instead of some hacked in thing is also much safer.
not familiar with the jag battery, has i got a pyrofuse in the contactor bank? could be blown and bms not seeing a total battery voltage
All the fuses we could see were in tact, but it’s worth another check!
@@corymac Automotive Pyro fuses are not necessarily obvious in appearance. To all intents they can look like a solenoid or a relay, the connection is hidden inside - the pyro bit blows out the connection and you may not be able to see that it's blown. The clue might be heavy duty terminals either side/end and test it for continuity. Location in the contactor bank?
Looks like good progress so far. One note on the relays when you open the doors, that's probably the pre-charge relay getting the vehicle HV system ready for key on by the time the driver is in the seat. The BMS will, most likely, enforce a maximum duty cycle on this relay so once you get it to close the BMS won't let you re-close it until the resistor or PTC element used for pre-charging has cooled off enough.
If you're looking at CAN frames on the network to the battery you might want to take a particular interest in frames with the ID 0x10A, 0x10B and 0x10C.
Thanks mate! Will investigate
We are missing an ignition on signal, Also we would like to understand if 0x012 has any interesting signals for the BECM. If you reckon you could help - info@oyelectrical.com. An email would be awesome 🙌
Someone pointed out the coolant loops and other connectors. See if that pile of bits has the connectors and if they have sense resistors in them, the battery ecu might be booting and checking presence of all its ports before it will take a ‘close contractors’ message. If it’s JLR they aren’t big on securing messages across components, so should take a raw message and just execute it.
Good spot Ian. We’ve managed to nab Dala, him combined with Chris is proving quite a lethal combo. There are HVIL loops I’ve since discovered too on the connections.
Remember it’s all thrown together quick in the factory and serviced by parts swappers, so the code will have checks in it to make sure everything is nominal before it will take the commands that ‘do’ things. All of this needs to be inside the domain of that battery ecu. Also if it’s anything like Tesla, it will keep the contractors engaged for like 15-30 mins after you put it in park. Let’s it dc-dc the 12v back up to a decent voltage for standby, and watch UA-cam while your Chinese is being made. The pyro fuse will have been commanded to blow in the crash, have you located it? Hope it’s not on the bottom of the pack?
@@corymacit will also be doing IR tests internally as well?
@@IanFarquharson2 Actually that's a good point, the battery was from a crashed car!
@@IanFarquharson2But he's measuring 400VDC. I didn't think that could happen if the pyro fuse is gone. Essentially splits the battery in half.
Troubleshooting is so much fun. It’s like you hit a roadblock after a roadblock, frustration to no end and then, bam, it starts working and you end up with that happy face like when you guys managed to get the contactors to engage. It’s so satisfying.
Exactly!
"Troubleshooting fucking sucks ass."
there fixed your typo
It’s like you hit a roadblock after a roadblock, frustration to no end you know you're on the right track ask google for help and nobody seems to have the faintes idea what you're talking about, nobody in human history has ever faced this problem... and then, bam you get it, and then it is so much fun!
I get your original comment, but good god how I wish I could avoid trouble shooting...
yet... I don't?
since I learn more when things don't work rather then "it just works" 😅
Are you certain you’re not plugged into the CAN’T port? 😂👊
10/10 comment
Nice 1 indeed.
Every HV plug will have a HV interlock that will need to be shorted ( it is a loop that connects all the plugs together. Also remember this is a car, when a car crashes and the airbags deploy the RCM module will send a CAN message to open contactors, additional to this legislation requires that there is a separate wire from the RCM that carries a square wave signal to give the all clear!
I have fad Jaguar and Landrover cars for thirty years, and I had an Aquaintance that programmed the ECU's. The Eproms are separetley programmed by different people, and put together on the motherboard. The system has both a high speed and low speed Can Bus. When you open the car, the ecu starts to talk to the modules and pressing the start button sets another handshake in operation. The front left hand footwell fusebox is programmed to the dashboard. the front ecu is connected to the rear spare wheel fuseboc by fibre optics, Orange cable. Cambus are white cables. The system needs 13.2 volts to work properly, nine volts throughs a wobbly on start up. The rear seat footwell fuse boxes double up from the front fuse box. The Ecu's have Optical fuses on the inputs. One needs to follow the staring sequence to fault find the system.
Thanks mate! I’ll pass it along to the gang
This is the best video for Cory so far, I just love this geeky stuff
Thanks Dave!
The easiest solution is to strip the existing BMS as it is looking at too many things, and install
One that only looks at temperature and maybe module voltage, to cut out when short circuit, then it is easy to reset not that CAN none sense, simplicity is the key, once you have the simplified contractor control it is easy to connect to the inverter
I agree! More of this please.
Inspiring! The thousands of CAN messages are more than likely communication errors, caused by the HPCM trying to communicate with every other control unit that is missing on the car i.e ABS, BCM, and especially immobiliser.
Thanks Tim!
Hands down the BEST video from your channel and about car battery reuse overall. I support Dala's EV repair long term on Patreon, but there was never such a great video as this one. Thanks for the work. You have the best hobby from my perspective!
Wow, thank you! Much appreciated 🤩🔋🌲
Modern cars have a pyro fuse to prevent the car from turning over after a crash and the airbags going off. Maybe one of those fuses you pointed out need replacing? Love the concept Cory boy
We will be checking this amongst a list of great suggestions we’ve had. Thanks mate 😁😁
can bus has nothing to do with HV bus in that sense
Would it be affected by the battery hanging on the wall? Should it be flat?
I will also look into this " pyro fuse" safety lock. Sometimes it's an electronic safety lock if the car was in a bigger accident. Mostly if more airbags are deployed.
Hi Cory, I am a high voltage technician with Audi. I would say that you are missing the control unit for the battery, on Audi its called J840. Battery management ECU, this communicates directly to the battery. Great video by the way mate.
Thanks mate, I’ll take that on board! 😁👍🏼
This leaves me wondering if disassembling the main pack and repurposing the individual cells packs would be easier in the long run. You'd be able to optimise the packs final output stage voltages to requirements, simultaneously eliminating those three complex vehicle cam bus modifications in the process. It might also allow you to weed out any potentially deficient/defective cells in an otherwise reusable pack. When being used for lower charge/discharge applications like solar storage, there's little requirement for an integrated liquid cooling system. Thanks for sharing. 👍
This is my opinion, I could be wrong. 😉
I much prefer the battery packs their design as their rebust and had a quality control.
You cant recreate the same level on your own what you see here.
What he said 👆😁
Can't wait to see part two!
I'm wanting to do the same, but with a Polestar battery and a FoxESS inverter.
Keep up the good work
Sounds cool! 👌
I can’t believe there are already polestar batteries piling up 🤯
@@corymac you can find pretty much anything!
The main issue is like you've found, doing the integration is a difficult step.
I can't really tell from the video if you did. But in all Power plug diodes there is a H VIL circuit. it runs around all 400V plugs and must be unbroken.
We found that, still no luck 😁
@@corymac I have on a Nissan battery had to send a "wake up" bit before an ok can be sent on the canbus. so it is not certain that it is enough to send "ok" and "switch on contactor".
is there any tilt sensors in the pattery pack, there might be fail safes in the battery ppack that need resetting after the crash
this video is great !!! everyone wants to do this .... and why not, im still waiting for the ev charger that uses the car battery to run the house...
Me too!!! Thanks mate
Specific models of the Tesla Cybertruck can already be used to power a house
Ford f150 lightning does this.
If you search for Vehicle to Load (V2L) you'll find a bunch of EVs which can function as a portable "generator" in the event of a power cut.
Ambition strikes used an F150 for cheaper than a solar battery bank on their off grid house.ua-cam.com/video/chyGAlFTxVo/v-deo.htmlsi=gFA09hZH7dKUOivs
Just a query, so when u put it on the wall will this effect the loop for the water as its use to being flat and would be putting adverse pressure on the pump?
Awesome content Cory. Raw, warts and all - soooo refreshing to see real world content. 🤓👍🏻
Glad you enjoyed it!
An EV UA-camr I watch has did this. He’s Glyn Hudson, he also added his own ASHP and converted his env200 to an EV camper. Knows about bms/cambus requirements etc. Think he used a Leaf battery for his home. He’s also a Fully Charged friend!
Thanks! 🤩
And one of the founders of Open Energy Monitor 👍
Glyn is a wiz, but Dala is your man for this as he started it. I can see he's already made contact. You'll have this cracked in no time.
It's unbelievable what you're trying to do. RESPECT! I think this will be the future for many older EVs. My question is, wouldn't it be easier to mechanically disconnect the battery from the controller and add all those KWh to an existing home battery?
The new video is out now!
Been waiting for this one to drop, awesome thanks Cory… 😍❤️
My pleasure!! More to come soon
Excellent work, inspirational and very interesting. Thanks for the great commentary Cory and the team. Make it work! Will keep an eye out for number 2.
Much appreciated!
People like you are leading the way to a perfect reuse of large battery packs. Plz push on and consider making kits at the end of your adventure for others to reuse large batterys as well.
I’m publishing my findings and code for free online 😃👍🏼
@@corymac great start,, but code i fall apart so hard on code, my thought was a sellable for you and a plug and play for the viewer of yours.
@@joshuaspires9252plug and play would mean any faults would land back at Cory's door and I doubt he'd like that, not to mention the liability he'd be taking on. Much better to release it openly so that the learning-pains element is gone, folk just need to get a competent & LOCAL electronics engineer in to implement it.
kudos man! this content is just amazing, can not wait for part 2!
AMAZING...!!!!!!!!!!!!!EOL,s solder,error messages . Loved it all. I wonder if its reading that the battery is mounted vertically rather than horozontally that its reading an error?. Crack on Cory.
Thanks mate!!! As far as we can tell, that’s not built into the battery
11:17 Those "shunts" are HRC fuses. The symbol on the body shows a fuse in series with a diode which is a bit misleading as there is no semiconductor within the fuse. Instead that symbol means this is a high speed fuse which is designed to rupture rapidly enough to protect the high power semiconductors that the battery is connected to in the event of short circuit. They are not polarised, they won't block charging current and you should keep them in circuit.
I figured that out with testing them, thanks mate! I think my head a bit scrambled with the puzzle made me mis step the basics 🤣👍🏼
This should be the first option for any EV battery once the car has finished with it, alternatively, being used for grid balancing.
Couldn’t agree more, unlikely to happen though
Err.... "second life" batteries are already a thing. Been done for quite a while.
Probably the first option is replacing dead packs in existing ipace’s.
@@martinw245 But not with ALL batteries, which was my point 🙂
@Jimages_uk
I've no idea what the percentage is, to be honest, but it's obviously not 100%. At this point in time, "all" batteries going on to a "second life" is probably not feasible as it depends on so many factors, like demand, etc.
But yes, "second life" is clearly something that should and undoubtedly will be expanded.
Great video and explanations with price of EVs dropping compared to domestic batteries would it be easier if space available to leave car whole and take power from motor connection ? Regards Colin
Can’t wait to see this. This is the content I’m after nice 👌🏾
Thanks man!
Glad to have you
Oh man feels so close can’t wait for part Duo!
Can't get enough of this kind of thing Cory. Keep it coming!!!
Thanks so much! Coming soon!
its on the wall wrong position not level protected maybe
This is a legendary endeavor and an amazing look into trying to tap into an electric vehicle Controller Area Network. Awesome video guys, really impressive.
I really enjoyed this video.
I'm so glad! Thanks for watching and commenting 👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼
Dont give up Cory you all can and will solve this!! Top man.
Thanks!! 🤩
Swap the battery pack with the one in the car. Then take the car to jaguar and have it repaired under warranty.
🤣🤣🤣
VIN Number of the car is coded in every single ECU and module. Swapping part will probably prevent the car to start, and it is easy to discover from the can BUS.
Every high voltage connector has a Interlock on it what is just there make sure every connector is plugged in befor the hv relay close. Maybe the top connector of the battery is internally wired into the bms? If you jump al the connector wires to the car you should be able to communicate with the battery through obd, when that works, you can eliminate wire for wire and see what kinda codes it gives and make a workaround as you go. Car diagnostic specialist here with a love for ev's
We’ve linked all the HVIL’s, I think it’s more of a software issue 😁👍🏼
Hi Cory, there is a company called Connected Energy doing exactly this, using second life car batteries racked up in shipping containers to provide grid storage.
Ps - great video!
I will check them out, thanks Nik!
Have you check the other connectors on the top? There is also the interlock loop inside. There must be a reason, the battery shut down after 5 sesonds. Something is failed to check while bootup. It could be the battery expected a massage from other ecu's in a time window (maybe every 5 sec )?
We’ve linked the HVIL’s but still was throwing a hissy!
Very interesting project. I was thinking, an EV's 400V battery and the EV's motor-inverter should be able to create a nice 3-phase 400VAC at 50Hz. Or a single phase 230VAC at 50Hz, when hacked correctly. All needed power-electronics are there. The biggest problem would be that car manufacturers will go to great lengths to prevent the end user from tinkering with their product. I hope you'll succeed.
I'd probably disassemble that battery, discard all electronics, assemble in a configuration that would work for me, and put in a BMS system, charge controller and inverter I can trust. But yea, would be super cool if you can re-use the car's BMS. Good luck. I'm looking forward to the next part.
Absolutely awesome, I take my hat off to you guys. And to whoever your end client is, thanks to them for supporting the experiment - like you say, it's got to be the way forwards in terms of recycling and reuse. And as for the Tesla joke... 😂
CANBUS is a real pain in the butt
*a pain in the back end 😉
just a thought - ignition key??? does your battery have to talk to the coded ignition key that was originally used to enter/ immobilise /start the car before it became a wall mount?
Unless someone's already figured out the CAN part of that problem wouldn't it be cheaper to just salvage the cells instead?
The trouble is, there are so many,
I’d need a new BMS to balance them all, as the sub packs also are covered with CAN
Great stuff Cory, and well done for not digging yourself into a hole with that working I-Pace, the opportunities for blow ups are high on this one. In the past ive always used OEM CAN interfaces but im going to get one of those £25.00 amazon ones and have a go with SavvyCAN that I did not know about. Re the wiring/connector a pair of green 10 way rising clamp headers plug/socket may work well for you rather than committing to hard wiring! Looking forward to part two.
It worked so well!! For the money it’s definitely worth having!
Always good to see you here Michael!
@@corymac I like been educated and entertained at the same time
second video today ive seen of someone trying to do this the one before was out of a tesla model 3
Interesting! How did they get on?
I would defo go with a Tesla Model 3 battery 😂😂
@@corymache in the thread 😁
@@corymac had the same can bus reader just no luck with getting it to communicate yet think his is going to be a bit of a diy approach. wouldn't recommend as you know the voltage is in excess of 400+ V DC
Brilliant to watch Cory, I am sure you will get it going soon.
Why would you choose the battery from a car that is prone to catching fire (IPace).
It was freeeeeee 😅
I have so many of your videos to catch up on. This was honestly so interesting, I hope that you can find the answers and get this working, awesome video Cory!
Thanks Richie!! We appreciate the support!
Get that Stag out of the garage before it becomes consumed by the fire!
Promptly done 🤣👍🏼
This is brilliant, in Japan they have been doing this with prius batteries to power grocery stores. The market for this type of solution is in its infancy but will explode in time. Looking forward to the next video.
I’d expect nothing less from the country that issued a formal apology for the bullet train running 35 seconds late 🤣
Seriously loving this was hoping you would have more on this and about the code involved. Loving the detail
The new video is out now!
Analysing three CAN Busses is a hard work. This is a good work. Is this really a secret only the car producer knows how to activate the battery?
I watch part 2, out now 😁👍🏼
@@corymac , I watch part 1 after part 2. I hope we can see part 3
Juast a thought is there aa tilt switch in the battery which sets it in Tow Mode that might be tripping ?
Possibly a battery orientation interlock. The battery is vertical and could be a battery shut off for rollover events? Like a MEMS gyro?
You will definitely need to plug in all the HVIL contacts of the battery. The big connectors at the top are more than likely to have those and the battery will definitely avoid electrocuting someone if it sees those connectors are unplugged.
The battery is designed to lay flat and not to be in a vertical position. It might be dangerous in the long run.
Good work, I was waiting for someone to realise the potential of the battery array from used EVs.
This is the future that everyone talks of, but it’s the first time I’ve seen it being attempted to be done.
Good on ye fella.
Great idea. ❤ I live in the desert of Baja Mexico totally off grid. I took the batteries out of 4 SMART cars. Each was 53V nominal. I connected them all in in parallel and hooked them to a 48V Schneider Inverter/charger. Been running 5 buildings and AC for 8 years. Have 28 solar panels. Since I went parallel I do not use BMS.
Oh wow! That’s awesome mate 😁 - I’d love to see it!
Looking forward to part 2 Cory. Great Video as always 👍
The new video is out now!
@corymac Thanks Cory 😊
This is a sick project! I hope more people try things like this
First video I have watched on the channel and loved it. When transmitting the CAN signal to close the contactors have you considered the sequence in which they close. You want to ensure the pre-charge contactor is first closed to prevent arcing and premature failure of the contactor. Would it be easier to use the BMS purely for voltage and temperature sampling while hardwiring connections on to the 400V poles straight into an inverter? This way, you can have control on the 230V AC side instead. The terminating resistors you are measuring are actually two 120ohm resistors wired in parallel to give you your 60 ohms. You may want to ensure these are present on the network you are using or you will have to adapt the bus.
@corymac the BMS or “BECM” might not be satisfied because of an open HVIL. HVIL monitors all the HV Connections and shuts off the contactor if it’s sees open circuit. Try looping pin 7 and 15 at the connector you’ve soldered and you will also need to loop the HVIL pins in the centre of the three orange connections on the battery.
The new video is out now!
There should be an interlock connection on all of the battery connections for motor and charge port etc I would assume these would all need to be shorted out. The interlock shuts down the battery if and cable is broken discounted for safety
Good observation! We’ve since found the HVIL loops on the contacts, that and a few other issues! Part 2 coming soon 😁👍🏼
Great work! I foolishly bought an IDbuzz thinking you could plug it in and use the vehicle battery to power my home. Turns out you can but nobody actually makes a charger that allows you to plug in and do this. One is in development but it’s going to have a chadamo plug on it which renders it useless for my application. Keep up the good work.
Check out point guard energy. They are working on a V2X CCS (US) based bidirectional DC home charger... I don't think it works with any vehicles yet, but at least something is happening in the space.
I have heard similar before, manufacturers aren’t rushing on it for some reason 🤔
I imagine whoever does it first will sell like crazy
Looking forward to this project completed. This was quite interesting.
Coming this weekend!
This is an excellent video I can't wait for the next update. Hope once all this is figured out can share with the community how this was done.
Excellent challenge to take up.
I hope so too! Thanks mate 😁👍🏼
I'm a Brit living in Romania,
I came across an interesting company here repurposing used EV batteries.
They make systems of all sizes, from small systems for off grid to large containerised systems for 3 phase commercial use.
I used to do this in testing chambers. We'd use the batteries for the thermal mass to test heat pump systems on while charging and discharging the battery in road load simulations. We used manufacturer provided DBC files that decoded the can bits and a logic controller that tricked it into thinking the car was there. All privided by the manufacturer
I think it has been mentioned already, but that battery needs to think it is talking to the ECU/ BCM with a matching VIN. and that ecu / bcm might also need to have the "airbag / seatbelt charges blown" codes cleared so the battery thinks it is safe again.. along with a new high voltage pyro fuse.
You might be better served seeing if you can get the battery to accept a charge first as that requires less things to be correct on the canbus. As you demonstrated in the working car, the contactors would not engage until all the doors were closed, your foot was on the brake, and you hit the start button - as well as the car sensing the key - none of which the battery on the wall will see. None of this is required for the battery to accept charge however. Getting the system to accept charge would eliminate some of the potential causes for it to not engage the contactors - giving you a smaller set of variables to work with.
You are where the future is .... I can't wait until someone gives such projects the traction needed to make this a business. ( Octopus??) Octopus do support VTG but the cars and charges are very limited. Their tariff is called Power pack is currently compatible with:
Nissan Leaf
Nissan e-NV200
Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV.
The chargers needed are Wallbox Quasar 1 (it's worth noting that the Wallbox Quasar 1 is no longer for sale in the UK, so you'd have to have it already installed).
Octopus say they are working hard on more integrations!
Total respect to you guys for doing this - lets hope someone gets in touch to give you what is needed
We’ve had some big wigs see the video, and come along to help! Stay tuned 😁👍🏼
there is already a large market for used ev batteries which you may not be aware of. Prices of second hand cells are quite high due to the high demand
Also can't wait for the next video on this awesome project!!💪💫
Coming soon! Thanks Chris
Hey Cory, just wondering, are you aware of the recall for the Jag I-Pace for the battery pack causing several thermal runaway events and burning several properties down?
Also, they had a recall for the recall, where they tried to “fix” their physical fault with the battery cell at a manufacturing level, where some still failed even after the software “update”.
I've only just started watching, so maybe you cover it.
Please make sure you have some really good working smoke and CO detectors throughout the property and have them interconnected for the safest detection and alarm if something were to happen.
How are you going to map inverter to throttle position for battery output?
cool to see those in the industry looking towards these kind of upcycling projects. some of those all in one solutions are eye wartering expensive. have you had a look at those DIY LFP battery backup systems? like the Seplos Mason, seems like a good option for those that want a cost effective soltuion & the safety of LFP cells, also a lot less reverse engineering.
Thanks mate! We’re trying out best
Your comfort around 400vdc is rather worrying 😂 I would 100% use some opto isolators in line to those CAN interfaces. The last thing you want is any ground loops. In terms of the battery not responding it may be worth checking that a serial number for the main ECU is not expected by the BMS. That is just the kind of thing the manufacturers would do so you have to pay a dealer to change the battery. To help it would be a good idea to put the CAN messages on a Live / Google drive so we can see them. Some type of lockout or security code may be why the battery BMS is just going back to sleep.
It is isolated every time we’re working near it, there is a master fireman’s switch which is a kill all 😁👍🏼
I’ve been sharing the data and findings on Dala The Creators Discord & GitHub 😁👍🏼
@@corymac Your a lot more relaxed than me, I used to work on submarine DC power systems and have seen what 400+vdc can do. It's not pretty. I didn't know there was another isolator elsewhere on the pack as the switches are normally in the module. Your braver than me, I would have insulated those pins just to be safe. DC at that potential makes phase to phase AC contact look wimpy ! 🤯
Thanks... will have a look at the data. I didn't see a link to it, will have another look.
Thanks for the interesting video 👍 I'm sure it can be done. It's a shame Jack from EVTV isn't about anymore as he would have been your man as far as proprietary can bus and protocols went.
Of course we're all trained in HV & electrical safety. I used to work on 50+ kV HV systems. A friend of mine I used to work with had his wedding ring finger blown off due to a charged capacitor...! So although we're relaxed, it's not because we're blaze !
@@obbardc Blew his finger off ??? Wow .. reminds me of my early college years when whe used to charge up a big electrolytic capacitor with a mega and throw it to someone telling them to catch 😅 I think over 30 years I have the best memories back on the tools and out on site. It becomes a lot less fun when your stuck driving desks !
I am no expert on EV's, but I am a qualified mechanic, you were right when you explained that a canbus is a network connected with different addresses, why don't you hook up the original wiring to the battery and try to control it through the gateway? I don't know how many gateways that vehicle have but you can probably research that. normally your gateway would be in your engine control module or your cluster or your body control module. The gateway is the system that speaks to all the other control modules, so all messages travel through the gateway to communicate with each other. If you can mimic all the signals that you need for the vehicle to think it is safe for the battery to switch on through the gateway but then it bought probably switch on, for instance if you take the wires from the break switch and you put it onto a normal flip switch that would be like an unoff switch or a safety onoff switch, and so on and so forth.
This is a great idea. If I knew that I could take a failed battery from my EV when I had to buy a new expensive one, I would have little hesitation to buy an EV. This should be a standard option you can buy for all EV batteries. Reuse is better than recycle.
'Had a Tesla but it was stolen. I guess that makes it an Edison now.' Hilarious!!!!
So you've got the following from CAN: Door closed, foot on brake, Start/Stop button pressed. Maybe you need information form the driver seat sensor too? (e.g. In a Volvo C40 Recharge, if you lift your butt off the drivers seat, the car doesn't like it)
What about charging the battery? Would you need to record a different sequence from CAN? 'Car in Park, Handbrake on' is about the only thing I can think of.
This is a fascinating project!
We have all the can recorded that was necessary to start the working I pace 😁
Does the battery have any sensors that prevent it working when vertical?