Nice work! An alternative, instead of using unsealed tapered bearings, use sealed angular contact ball bearings. FAG makes some quality precision ones, but they're a bit pricey. I found a set for $160. I had tapered bearings for a while, which I greased once in a while. Not fun. But the runout was around 0.06mm, which was ok for some things, but I wanted tighter tolerances. I know, I know it's a mini lathe! Ha!
That's really good to know. I'm gonig to pin your comment so others see it first and maybe it'll give a quicker direction to take for bearing upgrade. When I did mine, I couldn't find angular contact bearings the right size for the inboard side, I think, it's been a while, but I didn't look too hard because of the price.
I love this upgrade. I went with tapered roller bearings and had to replace the grease after about 6 months. Always interesting to see how other people go about mini lathe upgrades. Cheers
I've just posted a video about fitting a brace of Austrian-made SKF 7206BE RSZP sealed angular bearings for £55 (about $70) for the pair. As of a day ago, they're showing under 0.01mm (0.4 thou) runout, which I'm happy with. I love the idea of running them in an oil bath though - this is definitely a mod I'll be considering, especially as I only have the single-speed head to deal with. Great video, I'm pleased to have found your channel. Subbed!
Love your creativity. New subscriber. I would dump the motor oil and add non detergent. Motor oil is designed to lift and float debris to be caught in the filter. Non detergent allows any debris to settle to the bottom to be harmless. Just my 2 cents. Looking forward to catching up on your videos!!
Wow, another very professional video. I bet anyone doing this modification will use this video as an step by step instruction video. I really enjoyed this video. Thanks for sharing.
This is nice work. Thanks for showing. Since I'm a pre beginner and have no mill also, it's not within my capability to do as you did. I plan to upgrade the spindle bearings, but as I have found that sealed angular or tapered roller bearrings are available, and one of the other bloggers, possibly Artisan Makes, found that even with medium to heavy use his unsealed roller spindle bearings were still lubricated after 6 months so I believe I'll go this route of occasionally disassembling to lubricate. Much appreciation for you showing an advanced upgrade.
If you haven't already done something else for the vent, I have a idea. Take the top plug and mill/drill a hole in the center, then drill a small hole into on of the drain plug flats towards the center hole. You can do this on a angle or straight. Put a fine screen in the center hole and ta da, you now have a vented plug. I think this will work, great video.
So many thanks @Robert A., for your outstanding work / mini.late upgrade, as well as your awsome video / editing on it. (I'm FAR from being an experienced machinist. Just an ER / ICU MD, but also a 'machining.things' aficionado). I'd dare suggest adding some air venting thru the upper / filling plug screw + a piece of felt and / or metal wire mesh to it + some kind of 'magnetic trap' in the drain plug, to catch any ferrous shavings. (I'd suggest boring a hole in the lower plug screw, just about same size of a small Neodimium magnet you can affix to it with a little JB Weld). Of course I subbed, and will share this interesting video, (And others too..). 😌🇺🇲💪🙏🙏🙏🙏
Really cool project, only thing I would say about the oil is that the default for machine tools is a non detergent gear oil. Hydraulic oil works really well. Motor oils are designed to emulsify contaminants and metal particles so they can be removed by passing pressurized oil through the filter. In machine tools, we want that stuff to all settle at the bottom of the gear case. Now, in this application, I’m sure it’s 100% fine but it’s all good trivia.
Good call on the non-detergent oil. Over time the detergent oils make a slurry of contaminants that will do a pretty good job of grinding the gears down. The interesting thing would be the plastic gears. Not sure how the slurry effect of the detergent oil would work with them. They may actually "trap" particles to keep the oil "clean" but not actually change them other than increasing the friction. Just an amateur here so I am not sure.
Get's me thinking a higher viscosity oil and most likely grease packed box might be an easier route and most likely a better quality solution... still... thanks for the inspiration. Great production! Concise and easy to understand.
Excelent video. Robert, you inspired me to do this upgrade to mine mini lathe, thank you. May I ask about rear oil seal on the main shaft? You used spacer so that a rear oil seal does have someting to ride on. But - this spacer does have one more purpose - to tension the bearings - so it must be loose fit on a main shaft. Does the oil seep out between that spacer and a main shaft? Cheers, R.
Nice job. If I were to replace the head stock bearings l would just use wheel bearing grease. I wouldn't have put the time and money in that lathe. As far as creating UA-cam content that's a different story. I've never seen this project before. Thanks for your great video.
no need all coz 7206 2rs is the same size as original bearing and is angled, easy upgrade no need to reinvent the wheel just to install some tapper bearing on a chinese minilathe
I'm going about mine slightly different. I am drilling a tiny oil drip hole at the top of the spindle races on top of my headstock. I will then have some small valves to turn the oil on and off as it drains down onto the bearings, it will go into the bottom of my headstock to lubricate the gears. I planned on using one of the ground screws as an oil return system. I plan on driving the whole thing with a cam operated pump powered off of my lead screw.
That's a good idea. Most of my older machines have oil cups fitted with felt inside to hold oil. Might be a good way to get oil in without having to continually fill it.
Excellent upgrade. I wish I had the milling machine and dividing head to be able to do this. After watching it perform after the upgrade, I'm beginning to wonder - do you think a vent is necessary??? Otherwise, once the oil heats up from extended use, do you think any pressure build up could try to push the oil past the seals?? Thanks!
Think this could have been called “ how to make a silk purse out of a sow’s ear” just joking, nice work Robert, had one of these lathes many moons ago and did the normal upgrades, since gone and now have a Boxford lathe. 👍👴🏻
Very nice job I have implemented a similar design using the 2 oil seals with tapered needle roller bearings. The oil seal I am using is 40x55x7 mm and 48x58x8 mm
@@RobertAdairWorkshop do you mean how do u keep seal in place? If that is the question, i machine my own aluminium retainer and make the holes 55mm and 58 mm respectively. Its a tight fit so i need to hammer seal to get it in. I will share a video soon with the drawings. I am in the process to run just single speed, pulley 60t/15t (4:1 ratio) htd5m belt.i just got pulleys today. It will give me about 1193 rpm max. I need torque as mini lathe motor is not too strong.most of the time spindle rpm bet 500-800 rpm is adequate
Hi Robert loving the upgrade, really clever the way you have done it all and over comes the problem with lubricating the headstock bearings. One question do you find the pressure builds in the headstock ? Or have you fitted a breather ? Just realised that was 2 questions 😂
Good observation. The pressure does build. I actually just leave the fill plug a little loose and that works, though, it does push oil out and I do have to wipe that up. I have a plan to make a breather for it, or maybe fit a sintered breather, but I haven't done so yet.
I never got around to adding one. I’d planned on drilling a vent hole in the fill cap or making a sintered plug for it. But ended up just leaving the fill plug loose to vent. You are right. You should make a vented cap or drill a vent hole in the body, or similar. It will build pressure.
Absolutely. I was thinking of making a sintered breather for it but for no, I just back off the bolt a bit and let it breathe. It does leak out the fill plug when I do that, though. But spot on!
Mike from mo here, i really like this vidio! I just purchased a mx 210 laythe...i didnt look on utube until after my purchase,,when i inspected the brgs. In this thing i found 1 taiper setup and...1seald ball set up😑,,,anyway im fixing with taper setups..i plan to box in seal up an run oil...i wanted to ask your opinion on oil level,,,i dont have gears for slinging the oil,,,i was thinking if it filld to bot. Of spindel shaft? Thanks for the article! keep up the good job! Mike t.
Hi Mike. I think you’re right in keeping the oil level such that the bearing rolls through it. You might consider going a bit higher though just because when the spindle rotates, some of the oil will surround and cling to it ,drawing your level down a bit.
If you don’t have the 2-speed headstock, you ought to be able to make the mods just using your lathe. I did them on the mill since I had the lathe torn apart. My mill, by the way, is just a drill press with some simple mods. I have a video on it if that piques your interest.
@@RobertAdairWorkshop thanks. I do have the 2 speed lathe. It seems as though I would need to make seals. I have 3d printers, you think I could make any of these things with 3d print materials?
@@cfnaround1585 I think you could do the seal retainers out of ABS. The headstock doesn't get too hot and I don't think oil would affect ABS. Not a bad idea.
@@RobertAdairWorkshop I changed the plastic gears to metal in my Central Machine lathe and wish I had not. More backlash and more gear noise. Just like your ability to be creative.👍
Never use engine oil in a gearbox. Its made to suspend metal and debre in it. Its so that it carries it to a filter. Meanwhile gearbox oil is made to let stuff setle in the bottom of the sump.
This is motorcycle oil. It's designed for use in engines with gearboxes since motorcycles use the same oil for both (except those with separate transmissions). It has a gear rating. I saw the same Blondie video where she says the same thing, almost word for word. Honestly, does it really matter? I'm not going to have this lathe forever and after a year of use, there wasn't anything in the oil, there wasn't any bearing or gear wear. Do I really need to add the additional drag of a heavy gear oil?
@RobertAdairWorkshop That's interesting about the motorcycle oil; I wasn't aware of that, so thank you for the heads up. Then again, I guess I wouldn't as I prefer four wheels; no desire to be an organ done any earlier than I have to! 😂 One thing you missed though was that the angular contact bearings most people use to replace the standard installed deep groove ball bearings actually have rubber seals (thus the RS in the part number) and so are pretty much maintenance free (they last long enough for most people).
It's unbranded. I got it on eBay. 7x14 mini lathe with 2-speed headstock. This is the same lathe. It looks like they moved the speed controls to the front instead of on top, but it's the same machine. www.ebay.com/itm/255011035221
@@RobertAdairWorkshop I was thinking about oiling when I purchased the metal gears. They were so bad that the lathe would shake from the improper tooth geometry. Glad you managed to get a good set.
@@RobertAdairWorkshopTo be fair, the later versions of the mini-lathe models have brushless motors with more torque over most of the motor's range of RPM and don't need the hi/low gearbox and the manufacturers have simply deleted the gearbox, using a direct drive to the spindle. In that case it really is only the bearings that need changing. Your video is interesting to me as I've recently had to replace my headstock casting on my brushless motor/no hi-lo gearbox mini lathe due to an unfortunate accident with a hydraulic press when replacing the bearings and it was quicker and no more expensive to buy a complete headstock assembly replacement that does have the hi-lo gearbox. I've noticed the 'hi' gear doesn't seems to gear down any more than the direct drive so I'm toying with the idea of keeping the gearbox and seeing if I can get more torque from the brushless motor with the 'lo' gear setting. I've ordered the older style smaller belt as the pulley it will go to is on the gear shaft which is closer to the motor. Eh we'll see but the upshot of this ramble is that your video is interesting. 😉
Tapered Roller bearings are not a preferred choice for a machine as angular contact bearings were designed for Machine tool use, Tapered Roller bearings have their place but not so much in precision tooling systems. Tapered rollers have high load carrying capacity but have to be correctly preloaded for maximum life and sometimes that does not play well with machine tool characteristics hence why the Angular contact bearings were developed, Tapered rollers are great as wheel bearing in vehicles while being correctly maintained and lubricated and preloaded can last Millions of Miles, Think about that. Bridgeport for instance with their Milling Machines sized individually each quill to custom honed bearings on a hand fitted scenario with well trained professional toolmakers doing the fitting, Not a normal manufacturing process in the modern era and a potential nightmare for servicing years down the track. High precision Machine tools are often turned on hours before use to bring the machine up to temperature for precision results not really an option in the home workshop scenario, Full size precision tooling as you have done runs either an oil bath system as you have developed or a pressure feed system. As for sealing castings especially when running an Oil Bath some of the Industrial variants of Glyptal should do the job perfectly, Nothing to do with them but I have used their products with success in the past and as not that many may be aware of them I have linked the company below so you can do your own research to see if they are useful to your needs. www.glyptal.com/glyptal_products.html
This particular lathe was designed for standard ball bearings. Not roller or tapered. It's also not a precision tooling system. It's a cheap chinese lathe and built to a very low pricepoint by skilled labor overseas. Regardless, all of the large lathes I've owned have had tapered roller bearings in their headstocks. My current Atlas Commercial uses SKF.
"Tapered Roller bearings are not a preferred choice for a machine " Guess somebody forgot to tell Timken then - they did a really nice book on how to design taper bearing installations for machine tools.
@@pieterveenders9793 Thats BS. "TheBrits" do not "predominantly" use metric, we use Both Imperial AND metric, but we only use metric because we were FORCED to by the f%^&(*g EU. Also, BSP is still VERY common in a number of industries.
The oil should definitely not be motor oil... It keeps shit in suspension, that is its design, its made for a pressure fed filtered system to remove the suspended gunk... You should use any other oil that is detergent free... Any non suspending oil will do, be it gearbox oil, regular detergent free hydraulic oil, lightweight way oil or similar... Just for the love of god dont use motor oil on an unfiltered system... You are literally doing it more harm than good... Also, the fill plug should be modified into a vent cap... As the spindle works and the gears inside churn the oil, its generates heat, which in turn increases the air pressure in the headstock, which increases pressure acting upon the surface of the oil and thus attempts to force it out of the seals... You can find a nice design for a similar plug for Emco FB2 mill on one of the machinist forums... You wont be able to miss it if you google it... Its a simple spring and ball check valve vent geometry integrated into the top plug... Other than that, i would go with milling out the headstock on the bottom square, replicating the shape undersize with a square o-ring groove around and would have fitted that to the headstock from beneath... I just dont appreciate the sealant interfering with the precision surfaces... Oil bath is a great idea, but please, use shit designed for specific systems and intended purpose... Motor oil is intended for motors, or any other system that has a filter in a pressure fed oil circulation.... You could make the design such that you use an oil pump with filters and inject the oil at the bearings, allowing it to flow into the housing before being extracted by the pump, through the filter and back into the injectors at the bearings... That would allow you to run motor oil, but i assume it to be a worse option when compared to good old settle out oils... There the gravity acts as the filter, drawing all the shit to the bottom and theoretically keeping the oil above clean and fresh... You could also inset a few magnets into the bottom of the housing to drink up all the metallic particles from the oil that pass nearby... You could inset a magnet into the drain plug as a control and as an easily cleanable magnet... That improvement would work with both systems, be it detergent free oil or if you went the more complicated and theoretically worse system of filtered pressure fed system with motor oil... All the best!
This is motorcycle oil which is used to lubricate the engine and gearbox. It has a gear rating. Does it really, really matter on a cheap mini lathe that I won't own for the rest of my life?
@@wallyodom8254 They take the basic Chinese lathe that everyone makes and put their name on it. Quality control wise, the one I got was good and was quickly shipped to me. In my experience, they're just fine. The thing to keep an eye on is their packaging. You may have to deal with some freight damage but anything that large which comes through the mail will have some damage.
Nice work! An alternative, instead of using unsealed tapered bearings, use sealed angular contact ball bearings. FAG makes some quality precision ones, but they're a bit pricey. I found a set for $160. I had tapered bearings for a while, which I greased once in a while. Not fun. But the runout was around 0.06mm, which was ok for some things, but I wanted tighter tolerances. I know, I know it's a mini lathe! Ha!
That's really good to know. I'm gonig to pin your comment so others see it first and maybe it'll give a quicker direction to take for bearing upgrade. When I did mine, I couldn't find angular contact bearings the right size for the inboard side, I think, it's been a while, but I didn't look too hard because of the price.
I love this upgrade. I went with tapered roller bearings and had to replace the grease after about 6 months. Always interesting to see how other people go about mini lathe upgrades. Cheers
Thank you, Artisan Makes. I've been really happy with it.
What is the tapered bearing model?
I've just posted a video about fitting a brace of Austrian-made SKF 7206BE RSZP sealed angular bearings for £55 (about $70) for the pair. As of a day ago, they're showing under 0.01mm (0.4 thou) runout, which I'm happy with. I love the idea of running them in an oil bath though - this is definitely a mod I'll be considering, especially as I only have the single-speed head to deal with. Great video, I'm pleased to have found your channel. Subbed!
I'll check it out!
Love your creativity.
New subscriber.
I would dump the motor oil and add non detergent.
Motor oil is designed to lift and float debris to be caught in the filter. Non detergent allows any debris to settle to the bottom to be harmless.
Just my 2 cents.
Looking forward to catching up on your videos!!
Hey, Jeff. Thank you!
Wow, another very professional video. I bet anyone doing this modification will use this video as an step by step instruction video. I really enjoyed this video. Thanks for sharing.
This is nice work. Thanks for showing. Since I'm a pre
beginner and have no mill also, it's not within my capability to do as you did. I plan to upgrade the spindle bearings, but as I have found that sealed angular or tapered roller bearrings are available, and one of the other bloggers, possibly Artisan Makes, found that even with medium to heavy use his unsealed roller spindle bearings were still lubricated after 6 months so I believe I'll go this route of occasionally disassembling to lubricate. Much appreciation for you showing an advanced upgrade.
I just used sealed angular contact bearings and have had no problem.
You should make and sell these as kits as I would deffinatley purchase one
The "2RS" in angular contact bearing number 7206B-2RS means it has seals on both sides
Is that type of seal ok for retaining oil?
I had thought they were there to retain the bearing grease & stop dirt getting in?
If you haven't already done something else for the vent, I have a idea. Take the top plug and mill/drill a hole in the center, then drill a small hole into on of the drain plug flats towards the center hole. You can do this on a angle or straight. Put a fine screen in the center hole and ta da, you now have a vented plug. I think this will work, great video.
This is a great idea. Thank you Charles. Lathe is due for some maintenance so your timing couldn’t be better.
So many thanks @Robert A., for your outstanding work / mini.late upgrade, as well as your awsome video / editing on it. (I'm FAR from being an experienced machinist. Just an ER / ICU MD, but also a 'machining.things' aficionado).
I'd dare suggest adding some air venting thru the upper / filling plug screw + a piece of felt and / or metal wire mesh to it + some kind of 'magnetic trap' in the drain plug, to catch any ferrous shavings. (I'd suggest boring a hole in the lower plug screw, just about same size of a small Neodimium magnet you can affix to it with a little JB Weld). Of course I subbed, and will share this interesting video, (And others too..). 😌🇺🇲💪🙏🙏🙏🙏
Really cool project, only thing I would say about the oil is that the default for machine tools is a non detergent gear oil. Hydraulic oil works really well. Motor oils are designed to emulsify contaminants and metal particles so they can be removed by passing pressurized oil through the filter. In machine tools, we want that stuff to all settle at the bottom of the gear case. Now, in this application, I’m sure it’s 100% fine but it’s all good trivia.
Good call on the non-detergent oil. Over time the detergent oils make a slurry of contaminants that will do a pretty good job of grinding the gears down. The interesting thing would be the plastic gears. Not sure how the slurry effect of the detergent oil would work with them. They may actually "trap" particles to keep the oil "clean" but not actually change them other than increasing the friction. Just an amateur here so I am not sure.
@@KennyCrawford426 Wow such wisdom..
Wow such wisdom
Get's me thinking a higher viscosity oil and most likely grease packed box might be an easier route and most likely a better quality solution... still... thanks for the inspiration. Great production! Concise and easy to understand.
Appreciate it. Thank you.
Corn-head #00 grease?
Excelent video. Robert, you inspired me to do this upgrade to mine mini lathe, thank you.
May I ask about rear oil seal on the main shaft? You used spacer so that a rear oil seal does have someting to ride on. But - this spacer does have one more purpose - to tension the bearings - so it must be loose fit on a main shaft. Does the oil seep out between that spacer and a main shaft?
Cheers,
R.
Great job. Kudos to a job well done.
Thank you, Sky173!
Very good improvement. Regards
Thanks a lot
Nice job. If I were to replace the head stock bearings l would just use wheel bearing grease. I wouldn't have put the time and money in that lathe. As far as creating UA-cam content that's a different story. I've never seen this project before. Thanks for your great video.
no need all coz 7206 2rs is the same size as original bearing and is angled, easy upgrade no need to reinvent the wheel just to install some tapper bearing on a chinese minilathe
Great video Robert, really good info on this project and the graphics are top notch !!
Much appreciated! Thank you, Sir.
Very well done, particularly with the animations. I've pondered how to do this to mine, out of an interest in running faster after a motor upgrade.
I'm going about mine slightly different. I am drilling a tiny oil drip hole at the top of the spindle races on top of my headstock. I will then have some small valves to turn the oil on and off as it drains down onto the bearings, it will go into the bottom of my headstock to lubricate the gears. I planned on using one of the ground screws as an oil return system. I plan on driving the whole thing with a cam operated pump powered off of my lead screw.
That's a good idea. Most of my older machines have oil cups fitted with felt inside to hold oil. Might be a good way to get oil in without having to continually fill it.
@Robert Adair I hope this information helps you. Try using a 90 weight gl1 gear oil. You should be pleasantly pleased with the results.
Excellent upgrade. I wish I had the milling machine and dividing head to be able to do this.
After watching it perform after the upgrade, I'm beginning to wonder - do you think a vent is necessary??? Otherwise, once the oil heats up from extended use, do you think any pressure build up could try to push the oil past the seals?? Thanks!
It does bleed pressure and will leak past the intermediate shaft oil seals if not vented. I’m cracking the fill plug for now.
Think this could have been called “ how to make a silk purse out of a sow’s ear” just joking, nice work Robert, had one of these lathes many moons ago and did the normal upgrades, since gone and now have a Boxford lathe. 👍👴🏻
Ha, Terry! That's awesome.
It's still useful having a second lathe knocking around especially if it doesn't take up too much space.
Very nice job I have implemented a similar design using the 2 oil seals with tapered needle roller bearings. The oil seal I am using is 40x55x7 mm and 48x58x8 mm
Thanks for the tip. What did you use for seal retainers on your lathe?
@@RobertAdairWorkshop do you mean how do u keep seal in place? If that is the question, i machine my own aluminium retainer and make the holes 55mm and 58 mm respectively. Its a tight fit so i need to hammer seal to get it in. I will share a video soon with the drawings. I am in the process to run just single speed, pulley 60t/15t (4:1 ratio) htd5m belt.i just got pulleys today. It will give me about 1193 rpm max. I need torque as mini lathe motor is not too strong.most of the time spindle rpm bet 500-800 rpm is adequate
my video link
ua-cam.com/video/BLlTeDFIM50/v-deo.html
Amazing work sir
love the detailed steps ❤👍
Thank you, Mo Tari.
Hi Robert loving the upgrade, really clever the way you have done it all and over comes the problem with lubricating the headstock bearings. One question do you find the pressure builds in the headstock ? Or have you fitted a breather ? Just realised that was 2 questions 😂
Good observation. The pressure does build. I actually just leave the fill plug a little loose and that works, though, it does push oil out and I do have to wipe that up. I have a plan to make a breather for it, or maybe fit a sintered breather, but I haven't done so yet.
@@RobertAdairWorkshop for a quick fix you might be able to buy a gearbox breather with the same thread size and pitch. Still great work though.
Great idea!!!
Thank you.
Do you have a vent to relieve pressure in the oil bath as temperature go up and down?
I never got around to adding one. I’d planned on drilling a vent hole in the fill cap or making a sintered plug for it. But ended up just leaving the fill plug loose to vent. You are right. You should make a vented cap or drill a vent hole in the body, or similar. It will build pressure.
Good stuff. Although i would think that some sort of breather added would be beneficial...
Absolutely. I was thinking of making a sintered breather for it but for no, I just back off the bolt a bit and let it breathe. It does leak out the fill plug when I do that, though. But spot on!
Mike from mo here, i really like this vidio! I just purchased a mx 210 laythe...i didnt look on utube until after my purchase,,when i inspected the brgs. In this thing i found 1 taiper setup and...1seald ball set up😑,,,anyway im fixing with taper setups..i plan to box in seal up an run oil...i wanted to ask your opinion on oil level,,,i dont have gears for slinging the oil,,,i was thinking if it filld to bot. Of spindel shaft? Thanks for the article! keep up the good job! Mike t.
Hi Mike. I think you’re right in keeping the oil level such that the bearing rolls through it. You might consider going a bit higher though just because when the spindle rotates, some of the oil will surround and cling to it ,drawing your level down a bit.
Thank you! Sounds great!
One more thing, i just was wondering is venting..an issue?
I would love to do this to mine, but I have not way of altering the parts you made as I do t have a mill
If you don’t have the 2-speed headstock, you ought to be able to make the mods just using your lathe. I did them on the mill since I had the lathe torn apart. My mill, by the way, is just a drill press with some simple mods. I have a video on it if that piques your interest.
@@RobertAdairWorkshop thanks. I do have the 2 speed lathe. It seems as though I would need to make seals. I have 3d printers, you think I could make any of these things with 3d print materials?
@@cfnaround1585 I think you could do the seal retainers out of ABS. The headstock doesn't get too hot and I don't think oil would affect ABS. Not a bad idea.
What size chuck are you running since upgrading the motor?
@@cfnaround1585 It’s a 4” chuck. It’s what the lathe came with.
how did you close the bottom of the head stock ? ....
It is sealed to the bed directly with RTV. No bottom to the headstock itself.
I just used sealed angle contact bearings.
That's really a good way to do it. My big motivator was lubricating the metal gears to try and quiet them down. Which the oil bath seems to have done.
@@RobertAdairWorkshop I changed the plastic gears to metal in my Central Machine lathe and wish I had not. More backlash and more gear noise. Just like your ability to be creative.👍
Really easy to listen to. Great content.. looking forward to more of the same. Subbed here!
Appreciate it. Thank you, John Kelly.
Never use engine oil in a gearbox. Its made to suspend metal and debre in it. Its so that it carries it to a filter. Meanwhile gearbox oil is made to let stuff setle in the bottom of the sump.
This is motorcycle oil. It's designed for use in engines with gearboxes since motorcycles use the same oil for both (except those with separate transmissions). It has a gear rating. I saw the same Blondie video where she says the same thing, almost word for word. Honestly, does it really matter? I'm not going to have this lathe forever and after a year of use, there wasn't anything in the oil, there wasn't any bearing or gear wear. Do I really need to add the additional drag of a heavy gear oil?
@@RobertAdairWorkshop The Mini car engine of the 60's shared the oil in the engine and gearbox.
@RobertAdairWorkshop That's interesting about the motorcycle oil; I wasn't aware of that, so thank you for the heads up.
Then again, I guess I wouldn't as I prefer four wheels; no desire to be an organ done any earlier than I have to! 😂
One thing you missed though was that the angular contact bearings most people use to replace the standard installed deep groove ball bearings actually have rubber seals (thus the RS in the part number) and so are pretty much maintenance free (they last long enough for most people).
What model is this lathe?
It's unbranded. I got it on eBay. 7x14 mini lathe with 2-speed headstock.
This is the same lathe. It looks like they moved the speed controls to the front instead of on top, but it's the same machine.
www.ebay.com/itm/255011035221
what does the fuse button does on the lathe?
It's on the incoming 110V circuit. I think it pops if the lathe overloads or shorts.
Seems like a lot of work when all you have to do is install SEALED angular contact bearings like I did.......#37.50 each........MUCH easier.
Easier, sure, if you're doing it for the bearings. I did it for the two-speed gears to quiet them down. Works a treat for that.
@@RobertAdairWorkshop I was thinking about oiling when I purchased the metal gears. They were so bad that the lathe would shake from the improper tooth geometry. Glad you managed to get a good set.
@@RobertAdairWorkshopTo be fair, the later versions of the mini-lathe models have brushless motors with more torque over most of the motor's range of RPM and don't need the hi/low gearbox and the manufacturers have simply deleted the gearbox, using a direct drive to the spindle. In that case it really is only the bearings that need changing.
Your video is interesting to me as I've recently had to replace my headstock casting on my brushless motor/no hi-lo gearbox mini lathe due to an unfortunate accident with a hydraulic press when replacing the bearings and it was quicker and no more expensive to buy a complete headstock assembly replacement that does have the hi-lo gearbox.
I've noticed the 'hi' gear doesn't seems to gear down any more than the direct drive so I'm toying with the idea of keeping the gearbox and seeing if I can get more torque from the brushless motor with the 'lo' gear setting. I've ordered the older style smaller belt as the pulley it will go to is on the gear shaft which is closer to the motor.
Eh we'll see but the upshot of this ramble is that your video is interesting. 😉
I'm making a drink holder for my lathe....
Nice!
Tapered Roller bearings are not a preferred choice for a machine as angular contact bearings were designed for Machine tool use, Tapered Roller bearings have their place but not so much in precision tooling systems.
Tapered rollers have high load carrying capacity but have to be correctly preloaded for maximum life and sometimes that does not play well with machine tool characteristics hence why the Angular contact bearings were developed, Tapered rollers are great as wheel bearing in vehicles while being correctly maintained and lubricated and preloaded can last Millions of Miles, Think about that.
Bridgeport for instance with their Milling Machines sized individually each quill to custom honed bearings on a hand fitted scenario with well trained professional toolmakers doing the fitting, Not a normal manufacturing process in the modern era and a potential nightmare for servicing years down the track.
High precision Machine tools are often turned on hours before use to bring the machine up to temperature for precision results not really an option in the home workshop scenario, Full size precision tooling as you have done runs either an oil bath system as you have developed or a pressure feed system.
As for sealing castings especially when running an Oil Bath some of the Industrial variants of Glyptal should do the job perfectly, Nothing to do with them but I have used their products with success in the past and as not that many may be aware of them I have linked the company below so you can do your own research to see if they are useful to your needs.
www.glyptal.com/glyptal_products.html
This particular lathe was designed for standard ball bearings. Not roller or tapered. It's also not a precision tooling system. It's a cheap chinese lathe and built to a very low pricepoint by skilled labor overseas.
Regardless, all of the large lathes I've owned have had tapered roller bearings in their headstocks. My current Atlas Commercial uses SKF.
"Tapered Roller bearings are not a preferred choice for a machine "
Guess somebody forgot to tell Timken then - they did a really nice book on how to design taper bearing installations for machine tools.
THE PLUGS SHOULD BE BSP.
We don't commonly use BSP in the US. It'd be a special order tap and plug. But for others, good idea.
@@RobertAdairWorkshop Here in my home town Ludhiana India, we can get any goods or services for the shop within a few minutes drive from the home.
Metric is the gold standard, BSP isn't used by anyone really. Even the Brits predominantly use metric now.
@@pieterveenders9793 BSP is still common, but it is for pipes, not really necessary for a plug of this nature.
@@pieterveenders9793 Thats BS. "TheBrits" do not "predominantly" use metric, we use Both Imperial AND metric, but we only use metric because we were FORCED to by the f%^&(*g EU. Also, BSP is still VERY common in a number of industries.
Overkill, but hey, why not?
Nice animations! over enginnering at its finest
The oil should definitely not be motor oil... It keeps shit in suspension, that is its design, its made for a pressure fed filtered system to remove the suspended gunk... You should use any other oil that is detergent free... Any non suspending oil will do, be it gearbox oil, regular detergent free hydraulic oil, lightweight way oil or similar... Just for the love of god dont use motor oil on an unfiltered system... You are literally doing it more harm than good...
Also, the fill plug should be modified into a vent cap... As the spindle works and the gears inside churn the oil, its generates heat, which in turn increases the air pressure in the headstock, which increases pressure acting upon the surface of the oil and thus attempts to force it out of the seals... You can find a nice design for a similar plug for Emco FB2 mill on one of the machinist forums... You wont be able to miss it if you google it... Its a simple spring and ball check valve vent geometry integrated into the top plug...
Other than that, i would go with milling out the headstock on the bottom square, replicating the shape undersize with a square o-ring groove around and would have fitted that to the headstock from beneath... I just dont appreciate the sealant interfering with the precision surfaces...
Oil bath is a great idea, but please, use shit designed for specific systems and intended purpose... Motor oil is intended for motors, or any other system that has a filter in a pressure fed oil circulation.... You could make the design such that you use an oil pump with filters and inject the oil at the bearings, allowing it to flow into the housing before being extracted by the pump, through the filter and back into the injectors at the bearings... That would allow you to run motor oil, but i assume it to be a worse option when compared to good old settle out oils... There the gravity acts as the filter, drawing all the shit to the bottom and theoretically keeping the oil above clean and fresh... You could also inset a few magnets into the bottom of the housing to drink up all the metallic particles from the oil that pass nearby... You could inset a magnet into the drain plug as a control and as an easily cleanable magnet... That improvement would work with both systems, be it detergent free oil or if you went the more complicated and theoretically worse system of filtered pressure fed system with motor oil...
All the best!
You should not be using engine oil, engine oil needs be filtered. Use gear oil to prevent wear.
This is motorcycle oil which is used to lubricate the engine and gearbox. It has a gear rating. Does it really, really matter on a cheap mini lathe that I won't own for the rest of my life?
USE NON DETERGENT OIL SO DEBRIS SINKS TO THE BOTTOM!!!
I sold the Mini Lathe two years ago. You’ll have to shout that at the next guy.
7206 b 2rs bearing crying in a corner. why people dont love me? why?
I dunno.
What lathe is that?
Vevor 8x14 with the high/low headstock.
@RobertAdairWorkshop I have been looking at the 8x29 vevor...do they make good lathes?
@@wallyodom8254 They take the basic Chinese lathe that everyone makes and put their name on it. Quality control wise, the one I got was good and was quickly shipped to me. In my experience, they're just fine. The thing to keep an eye on is their packaging. You may have to deal with some freight damage but anything that large which comes through the mail will have some damage.
@RobertAdairWorkshop thank you for tge information I appreciate that