THIS is what SURVIVORS of narcissistic relationships CRAVE
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- Опубліковано 16 чер 2024
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DISCLAIMER: THIS INFORMATION IS FOR EDUCATIONAL PURPOSES ONLY AND IS NOT INTENDED TO BE A SUBSTITUTE FOR CLINICAL CARE. PLEASE CONSULT A HEALTH CARE PROVIDER FOR GUIDANCE SPECIFIC TO YOUR CASE. THIS VIDEO DISCUSSES NARCISSISM IN GENERAL.
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As a survivor of narcisstic abuse, all I crave right now is peace and quiet. What I've wanted most is the day where I can open the door to my own place and no one is there, just peacefulness. No one to tell me that I can't have this, or can't have that, can't do this or can't do that, and I don't have to sneak stuff I bought for myself into the house for fear of being questioned about it or punished for it like I'm still 10 years old. Normal can also be the freedom to simply enjoy your life in peace without having to pay the narcissist's toll.
It was always my narc mom saying that all she wants is peace but it was she who craved and created drama
Same here, I mostly just want to be left alone.
I can relate to this. I hope things improve for you.
I completely resonate with what you're saying! I feel the exact same way!
Ooooh, I feel this. Thanks for putting it into words.
As a survivor I crave:
Honesty. Sincere apology. Sincere forgiveness. A sense of belonging. Loyalty. Exchange of ideas. The list continues.
May I add to your list, appreciation of one’s hobbies (I was forced to stop photography)
Adding bodily autonomy to the list; freedom to dress how I want & have my hair how I want (he cut it himself into the Uma Thurman in Pulp Fiction asymmetrical bob & liked it dyed black, & liked me in t-shirts & jeans.. I'm a natural blonde & I like my hair long, & I like to wear dresses left to my own devices-)
It's kinda sad that this isn't a thing for every person. Honesty should be the most important thing ever. Yes, of course we can be not honest as well, but for them it really seems fake. It doesn't seem like a normal lie. It kinda feels like the lies aren't even true, because they are so good at manipulating and hiding their lies! After the relationship my number one thing I am looking for in a partner is honesty, right after being truly themself! I would have never thought this should be so important to think about but it is!!
Yes, and authentic dialogue. Remember all the times you tried to reason with them and were faced with circular arguments. Crazy making
Absolutely
With my now ex narcissist I eventually realized I wasn’t asking too much. I was just asking the wrong person.
Good point.
"I wasn't asking much. I was just asking the wrong people." Nice
Preach
@@annabanzon313 Now comes the hard part. Getting all of his negative words out of my mind. I started a UA-cam channel and about 40 times a day I hear his voice saying, “don’t do a UA-cam channel, that is so stupid!“ I wish it were as easy to get those words out of my mind as it was for him to put them there in the first place! But watching the Doc’s videos daily as if it were medicine, has helped more than words can ever explain. I hope she know this. ❤️
@TurtleTimeVoiceOvers yes its called detoxing. I actually had a cousin like this and a mom of course. My sons dad was extremely narcissistic but luckily he abandoned me and married someone else. I gotta say, my hubby now isn't perfect but he sure isn't a narcissistic, I'll give him that! I'm in my 40s now and I can see now that Iwe experience trauma twice. Once as the victim and then second as the paranoid observer who is terrified of becoming a narc myself.
A narcissist doesn't believe in apologies or forgiveness no matter how abusive and wrong they are.
They’ll say it for appearance, but they won’t mean it, and nothing will change.
Only if it has an agenda that's serves them. As the comment said above, " they won't mean it ".
Agreed
As a child (I'm 60+ now), my family group was dominated by a father who worked 80+ per week, and a mother with 4 kids; where slapping and beating were the only forms of discipline used. Sharing feelings was mocked, as was being at all vulnerable. It took too much work for mom to nurture everyone, I guess. Gluttony was encouraged as a panacea. I was in fear, powerless, never encouraged to take controlled risks... Not allowed to do anything but sit still and stay quiet. What normal kid is a statue? It was torture. Even now, my sole remaining relative (the youngest sister, and clone of the mother that beat me, hit me, and kneed me in the nuts) says I'm having a "Pity Party" when I demand my rights which she's trampled on. Later in life, I turned into an alcoholic over the resentments.Thank God, I hope I'm over that now (ten years next July). Is this group the right group for me?
Right. A police charge, a medical report & photos..... not only no apology but he "didn't do anything".
After being around narcissists, you may just crave a normal relationship that is calm, peaceful and understanding. But that also makes you a target for more narcissists to come in. So be careful.
Definitely true!!
They ain't gettin in again...I SWEAR IT. lousy dogs. I'll double and triple check on every word they say until I'm damn well good and ready to trust...and if they question it...I'M OUT! Only people with something to hide are "offended" when you ask questions....well, I'm askin, sucker...from now on!! They suck. You're awesome. Keep goin, I'm cheering you on, in Jesus' name, Amen. :)
This is true.
I grew up with a (very likely) narcissist mother and after learning what narcissism is, I started to notice a patter in some people and to be cautious.
I think victims might develop the ability to differ the love bombing situation to a genuine respect and intrest.
the real tragedy is even after you break free and feel ready to trust again and lower your guard, you get hit again.
“It’s not normal to stay quiet out of fear of being gaslighted.” I needed to hear this today Dr. R. Thank you❤
same! i'm typing this from my locked bedroom which is where i spend most of the day avoiding mistreatment.
This comment makes me cry because as a survivor of a psychopaths abuse it is so true.
It was refreshing to hear that part because I’ve thought it myself but then would even second-guess that thought!
…having to deal with the gaslighting.
That was a good moment! The words kind of echoed for a minute. To be clear, there are plenty of folks who claim to be victims of gaslighting when they may be just victims of being around people how don't just accept everything someone else says. I have been accused of gaslighting, which itself, was a gaslight, by someone unready to have an honest/uncomfortable conversation. True gaslighting, in my opinion, is both amazingly childish (once you can spot it) but also shockingly sophisticated, and effective on folk just trying to find some truth. Bottom line: Keep talking, keep trying, sometimes you need to move on from the person, not the topic but keep an open mind.
I crave validation, apologies, forgiveness, empathy, understanding, and NOT “feeling like I shouldn’t feel the way I do”
Unfortunately it’s more common than you think. Gotta make your own path man.
I felt that ❤
I can't give this enough thumbs up!!!!! ❤
I want to NOT feel like I'm standing on an island by myself screaming for help but think deep down that I won't get it and don't deserve it.
I feel you. The only one who can give you validation is yourself.
As soon as I saw the title of the video, my response was: "Peace." I crave peace. I just want PEACE.
When first entering into the narcissistic relationship, we thought we had everything we wanted in a relationship. Until we realized we were just in the love bombing phase and never really had any of it in the first place.
YES! I have figured this out as well. Precisely!
Yes our dream man turns into a nightmare! A nightmare we can’t wake up from or fully recover from either after we manage to physically free ourselves from them!
Making love out of nothing at all. Ex dedicated this song to me at separation.
Why are you saying we?😊
Wer ist denn WIR? War es ein Dreier?
I would have said "peace," never living again in an environment where you hate to come home, never having to walk on eggshells to avoid an eruption that has nothing to do with you, never allowing another person to decide when and if you're allowed to be happy or even content...and never becoming like the tormentor merely to survive.
exactly! that's what i said. i'm living in a narc family system and i can't even function anymore. just want out and i want peace
Beautiful, thank you for sharing. :)
My exact same situation
Yes, thank you for sharing-same thing.
Love & Peace to all of you.❤ Merry Christmas!
As a survivor I crave...to be left alone in my own space and not have to go through the day dreading the moment a person is going to walk through that door and my time is up.
Yes! Took me a year to not automatically start feeling anxiety around 4 ish every day. Over my life I dealt with a narc father, sister, husband and son. Finally have peace. No more of that crap. Friends who never understood, fell for the fake personas of the 4 of them. I'll be moving on from them all. Life is too short, CYA
❤
I really hate being someone's roommate. It's not my house; I notice I do feel on edge in the common room and would so rather have a space besides my bedroom where I can close the door and have my energy all to myself.
As a survivor of multiple narcissists, all I want to be left alone in peace and quiet. No more relationships of any kind ever again. Period.
Yep, I’m done believing in humans- just want PEACE!
I hear that!! Then you tell people that and they say, "oh now..... one day you'll meet someone better".....blah blah blah..... and they truly dont understand the damage that was done and years of your life which were lost. No way I'm ever gambling again with more years of my life. Never trusting another person again ever.
Sending you hugs, I can completely relate to how you feel after my life has been ruined by a v malig narc, ex narc friends. Our daughter, bless her is only now learning what "normal" is..... PEACE is worth soo much. Being with "normal" people can bring a lot of grief, please take care. 🥰
I feel you, on this one
Yes totally agree, just want peace!
I feel this immense grief when I see friends who genuinely love each other, and connect on a deeper level, especially best friends, because it's what I so desperately crave after a decade of abuse from people who held that role for me. I just want a best friend again.. a real one.
I hear you!!
I am the same. All my life I have wanted a best friend.
I have anxiety around people I don't know. I think they could be like narcissists. Are they going to be nice one minute then flying off the handle later.
This is JUST what I’ve been thinking the last months. I truly crave normal. I crave a relationship where my body feels calm. Where there is a space for boring. Where there is a sense of tranquility. Where I can sense my breath again because there is a stillness. I crave a mundane rainy Tuesday coming home from work, talking about what to eat for dinner, and watching a series. I crave talking about normal and boring stuff. I crave routine.
That is what I crave too.
“…where my body feels calm.” YES. This. ☺️
After 7 months of living alone, I feel so much more relaxed… and my nervous system continues to detox a little more each day.
Indeed 👍
Every word you wrote exactly to a tee !
Sounds lovely❤😊
It took me a very long time to realize that you don't have to set yourself on fire to keep everybody else warm.
I crave respect for my boundaries. I crave a simple conversation that goes 2-ways instead of 1. I crave an honest discussion. I crave positivity. I crave words being spoken at a suitable volume. I crave calmness. I crave the ability to laugh it off. I crave inner peace. I crave a hug.
I am almost 60 years old and needed to be seen and heard. It would have been nice to say something and not be dismissed or demeaned. I have come to radically accept that unhealthy communication is the norm. I am snuggled by three birds in my bed as I drink coffee and listen to this. Where there’s love there’s hope. We must keep the flame burning.
Me too ,gertrudewest !
Your thoughts,opinions,and feelings do not matter, and their dismissiveness and demeaning attitude proves it. They will never let you be seen or heard. You’re not alone.
So right my first thought was 'love.' We grew up without love.
I went into show business due my narc mom. I got what I needed on the stage.
Enjoy your coffee, you are not alone. Sending you lots of love and positive energy all the way from New Zealand 💚
I’ve always craved being part of a team, an equal partnership, in my marriage. Not being treated as a lesser being and having my ideas dismissed and my attempts to improve our relationship derided. For years I’ve been living in a war zone, endlessly fighting battles that I didn’t start and never wanted to participate in. I want a peaceful, co-operative life where I’m not constantly worrying about the next emotional blow landing unexpectedly. It’s exhausting 😢
Thank you for your perfectly worded comment. You've expressed my exact thoughts!
Amen,well stated for me as well.Peaceful Co-existence at least now after 30 plus years.
Absolutely! Sending you love! Me too! 💕 💕
@foxglove589 Your comment nails it for me! I was married for over 40 years with the majority of those years I thought I was the problem. I discovered through the years my husband at the time was not normal. I started noticing he definitely was not a team player. That’s what I craved. I finally filed for divorce in 2018 and at this point struggle with forgiving myself for all the lost years and wonder what it is really like being married and having a normal relationship.
I hope things go well and you find better relationships in the future. I’m so sorry for what has happened to you. It’s not easy. ❤🥺
I remember being in high school and telling friends that my family was not normal. I would say those exact words..."They are not normal.' Friends wouldn't take that seriously and then I would feel bad because it seemed that nobody understood. I was serious. To this day and at the age of 51, I still CRAVE!!! a 'normal' family!
After all these years, I NOW feel validated from watching this video. I can't thank you enough, Dr. Ramani.
I remember saying the same thing about my family back then..And there wasn't the knowledge about narcissism like today.
I knew at four years old my family wasn’t right. I’m 56 now. I don’t talk to most of them.
After watching the movie "Young Frankenstein" which was a comedy, where I sat waiting for the horror movie to start and after being told the next day that it was a comedy, I then laughed at all of the funny parts, I have always called myself "Abinormall" because that is what I thought of myself. 😂 One of my quirks I have been left with is taking hours to catch up with jokes. In fact, I have embraced being a bit abnormal.
I was one of those friends in high school that couldn't believe that someone's mother was a witch with a B. I married him and it took me almost 30 years of marriage to understand he was 100% right. Because of my own trauma of losing my mother at a young age and narcissism being completely foreign to me, I could never understand his family dynamics or his point of view. Until our daughter told me her grandmother, his mother, is a narcissist. EVERYTHING clicks into place now. I rely on comments like yours to be able to imagine a small bit of what he went through. Thank you for sharing. Have a great day!
My friends told me my parents weren't normal
During the pandemic one Christmas, I spent it alone for the very first time. Eating chinese, drinking wine and watching the snow fall at night. It was the most peaceful tranquil Christmas of my life. It was the first holiday where my body was given rest. Now that the pandemic is over, and when I go down to visit my narcissistic family members for the holidays I become physically ill and bed ridden. Being able to take a break from visiting family for the holidays for several years forced me to see how much of a toll they were really taking on me when I did go down. Now I can finally tell them I'm not coming down, laying down some boundaries. Just at a physical level some of them would take everything out of me, pure exhaustion. Eating chinese, being lazy and watching the snow have become all I ever wanted. We all deserve peace.
Preach it!!!! I feel guilty for NOT wanting to go to my once a year family get together. But I absolutely LOVE the idea of not going to those get togethers in trade for Chinese food and bad movies! Lol
Did same this Christmas, New Years. For the first time. And it was bliss. Peaceful, calm. I did what I wanted and when. No drama. And same when I am around narcs in the family I get physically ill. Finally understand why. Keep up the good work. Keep being you. Keep to your personal boundaries. Those that matter won't mind. Those that it bothers, aren't worth it anyways.
@@GaretShananunderstand. Same. But try to not put guilt on yourself for doing what you need and want with your life. Good luck.
@@mattmarrin8457 thanks man you too! It sucks not feeling like you're safe with your family and you're better alone. But I bet it sucks to have to decide to cut your arm off to save your own life too so I suppose it's a matter of what's best for us as individuals.... Good luck and stay strong!
@@GaretShanan yeah it's hard and shitty. But your, or any individuals health, safety, peace, confidence, freed is def worth it. I'd be dead a few times over if I didn't pull away. And the narcs never learn or change and want more. Like monsters and vamps with our loved ones faces on. I still love them in my own way. But from far, safe distance. Keep up what works for you. Every new thing feels weird at first. Then one day you'll look back you'll be happy for what you've accomplished, survived and thrived.
Be the person who breaks the cycle. If you were judged, choose understanding. If you were rejected, choose acceptance. If you were shamed, choose compassion. Be the person you needed when you were hurting, not the person who hurt you. Vow to be better than what broke you-to heal instead of becoming bitter so you can act from your heart, not your pain.
amen
Excellent reminder , thank you .
Wise words
THIS!
These words are so true,I have suffered so much,but now it's about me,myself and I.
We crave justice . And closure. And exposure of the narc.And our lives back.And the person we used to be.None of which we will ever get. And understanding of what we have suffered instead of being blamed dismissed and abused by enablers and narcs.
Well said ❤
Well said, you summed it up perfectly.
yes justice! absolutely
This!!! Right should win over wrong. Truth should win over lies.
I crave peace, safety, and understanding from others that our families are not all the same. I also crave being alone because ironically, that is when I feel the least lonely.
😻😻♥️
I genuinely want to be alone. I like interacting with people in public settings, but I like the normal that I create alone because I don’t believe I’ll ever find someone I can be normal with.
Same here. I quit dating 20 years ago, and life got much more peaceful. My last act of self-care will be to establish boundaries with my mother. And then, I think, I will finally feel free.
As a survivor I crave just to live my life.. don't need anything from anybody. Live and let live..
Distance from the narcisist is key.
Sending you hugs, I can relate to what you say🥰
I think I all that I wanted in 20 years of marriage to a narc was to be heard, and appreciated for all that I did for him. He would never be aware of his children talking about their school day. He would never ask how his mentally challenged son managed throughout the day, he never offered time with his children or playtime. He never offered me the time of day, but expected me to always be there for him and help him and whatever project there was. I got nothing in return no matter what it was.
Except that it was 17 years of marriage, I could have written this word for word. I hope you have found peace.
I was around 10 y/o when I realized something wasn’t right about my family..specifically my Mum. When I was at my best friends (Twins) home, I couldn’t help but noticed that their Mum was different. She was always kind, compassionate, soft spoken, loving etc. I felt like I could breath in their home and not always be thinking, “Am I doing anything wrong?” Their home (and others) was a sanctuary for me when I was growing up.
I spent as much time at two friends’ homes between 10-17yrs old as possible (surely too much). You could breathe. No one waiting to pick a daily fight. The contrast when I returned home was stark. I learned a lot of good behavior from those other families. My parenting is role modeled on a combo of my friends’ parents.
But how was your mother when you had friends around? My mother was like Jekyll and Hyde - in front of my friends she was how you describe your friends' mother - but totally different when they weren't there and I didn't understand why, and felt guilty about, feeling uncomfortable about, and confused by, this nice behaviour in front of others. I too had a friend whose home was a sanctuary for me. On the day I passed my driving test, all I got from my mother was "Very nice. Have you done the potatoes". I waited, and waited for some sort of congratulations (from either parent) and when none came, I took the bottle of fizz I'd bought, around to said friend's where I got the enthusiastic congratulations totally absent in my own home. Needless to say, parents went ballistic "we weren't good enough" blah, blah, well frankly, they weren't.
Same here. Why do they not congratulate or commend us for our awesome actions? I was the oldest, my sister and brother were her world, I was always feeling like I had a jealous mother but never really knew or thought that could be a thing. She was also one of those who “made” me sick.. the verbal and emotional abuse alone is wild.
Thats tuff Im sorry. I can kinda relate to this tremendously.
@@shirleyswaine4701Gave my dad a THOUGHTFUL GIFT FOR XMAS AND GOT MADE FUN OF AND DEVOID OF ANY THANKS WHAT SO EVER. NEAT STUFF- DICK!
Narcissist: "Why can't you just let it go and stop living in the past. It's only hurting you to hold a grudge. Holding anger in your heart towards others is like drinking poison and expecting the other person to suffer."
Translation: "Why can't you just stop trying to hold me accountable for my shamefully deplorable acts of sadism and cruel torment? I'm really scared you're onto me and on the verge of exposing me which is a threat to my fragile sense of false identity I built a fake reputation off of and without that facade everyone will see through my hero victim narrative to the slimy lying predator I am underneath. So either get with the program and let me control the narrative and play the mean entitled needy loser role I've assigned to you in order to soothe my inferiority complex or I will make your life even more of a living hell than it already is and turn everyone against you. Your anger towards me means I'm losing control over you. Your indifference towards me means that I must destroy you or act like you never existed as punishment for narcissistically injuring me with your critical thinking skills and challenging too many of my logical fallacies."
Beautifully stated 💖
Wow, that is literally word for word what I have heard repeatedly after discovering lies and betrayal that have been occurring throughout my entire marriage. Instead of true remorse or understanding of the pain I was experiencing due to the betrayal, everything became about my reaction, my “hard heart”, my anger, my inability to forgive and forget, etc.
Brilliant explanation of the narcs speech. Agree with narc to let it go by letting them go too
Your description spot on! the Narcissists said these to me so many times. If only I had understood what was going on then Maybe the self doubt and self blame would have been minimized. Maybe.
Narcs shirk accountability to God Himself. No way they are ever going to tolerate our request for honesty and accountability for their actions. That’s why they gather so many to their side with deception. The flying monkeys don’t require accountability of the narc, and in fact, set about helping them evade it.
As a narcissistic abuse survivor I need to forgive myself and I crave the freedom to allow myself to be vulnerable. I’m not there yet
You'll get there. Be patient, kind and gentle with yourself 💜
Totally get that
I a survivor not a dr, but one aspect I deal with is over sharing and you are being vulnerable by saying something.
My issue is sometimes deep thoughts can embarrass me, but some love bombing prompts over sharing to attack you with.
I’m just saying we do things but assume we are wrong or unsuccessful when we do GREAT and the next part is for ANOTHER person to empathize and share.
As evidence unless you have an idea to go to, I would like say I’m proud of you for speaking your mind.
But never being validated might leave you waiting for the other shoe to drop or kudos.
My unattainable goals were always out of reach because of my parents mood and it was never safe because I was a burden.
The reactive bullshit is mirroring crazy people and the extra steps get in the way of living.
So much feels dualistic and my advice is finding the middle or third path that feels right to you.
You decide. you’re enough. get used to it, be kind to yourself.
Live long and prosper
Forgiveness has been the hardest part for me. Praying that you fid that freedom. ❤
Here is a trick….Meditate, and see yourself during the ages you want to heal/apologize. And…say everything that you wish you could say to that child/teen/etc…
And you won’t forgive yourself the first, second or even third time. But eventually it will take and you will notice huge changes in how you react to others and stressful situations.
I hope this helps❤
Evil people always create chaos and confusion in their wake. Normal arguments and discussions just aren’t possible with them because there is no compromise. It’s scarring. I know I just want my feelings and thoughts heard, considered and validated and have my needs not always be secondary
What I want at this time is my sense of self back...to feel confident and worthy again.
I want peace, just not having to walk checking for emotional mines in every conversation. Just being able to say I don't agree with something, and not feeling I am going to be verbally attack. No gaslighting. No excessive emotional response and love bombing. Not feeling like opening up can be use against me.
ughh. me too! i completely agree!
I crave the ability to play video games with a long distance friend on a Saturday morning without having to beg and provide reasons why I should be allowed, and without a tantrum if it takes too long
Ye😮emotional mines in every conversation yet other timesI can sit with my mum and enjoy heart to heart.
@@MEWtifulwoow! sad that I can totally relate,
My narcissistic sisters prefer estrangement to apology for repeatedly violating my boundaries.
Unintentionally, their removal from my life has been a great boon.
Wishing everyone in recovery a lovely, peaceful holiday.
I feel this identically. I’ve exiled 1 sister and 8 nieces and nephews. It was bothersome for a while. But after 20 years of narc abuse I’d rather be quiet, alone and unstressed. I need to heal. The more I heal, the further away so many people I’d met in the framework of that relationship go. I’ve shut them down, moved on, deleted them, blocked them and walked away. Oddly, I’m not lonely. I’m at peace. Healing.
That's great! Don't tell them that you enjoy their absence though 😄 they might try to get into your life again
You too, Merry Christmas.
@@CrystalCountessme too. Three sisters who did nothing but bully me all my life. I’d rather be lonely but I’m not. Very peaceful without the drama.
💯%💯%👍
Narcissists are just what they are dealing with a very disturbed mentally ill person. I sacrificed my own happiness. It was so confusing and heartbreaking every day.
Validation isn't always ego. Sometimes wanting validation is seeking scraps for self worth and justification of existance.
As a SURVIVOR I just wanted everyone who knew him to know how narcissistic he was but I quickly realized that wasn’t the route to take because HATE in your ❤ truly consumes you TOO & honestly they end up no matter how long it takes exposing themselves anyway!
Read that again because it is that good to think that way.
I totally understand the way you were invalidated, my reality denied, not being heard, my opinion not respected. I can't wait for the time he will be exposed!! When people will see the Truth and not sit in judgement. 33yrs of marriage....
I don't wish a Covert narc on my worst enemy. They rob you of your youth, and vitality, such the life out of you and then move on to the next victim they can control....
10000% all of this! My spouse, in one of his anger moments, where I was being blamed for all the things going wrong in the relationship, asked 'WHAT DO YOU WANT?!' I paused to think about it... my response was that I wanted "Normal. Calm. Consistency."
Dysfunctional families/relationships are riddled with misunderstandings, confusion, hurt feelings, sarcasm, cutting remarks, embarrassment, secrets, dread, etc… if you’re in one, get away and save yourself. You’ll be shocked how quickly things change 🤓
The hardest part of "recovery" with PTSD is the ability to visualize a future. It's difficult to imagine other people leading normal lives, and it seems like everyone else is struggling and hoping for the same things.
Sometimes I don't know what haunts me more. The memories of her or the happy person I used to be.
You are growing . No road maps . Right now , I like you .
Normal is peace and not dreading the sun setting because the narcissist is now ready to transform
You don't realize how much you crave normal until you spend some time with families who aren't weighed down by narcissism. For me, it's my sister, her husband, their children and grandchildren. They spend so much time hanging out at their lake home having fun together. The love and support they give each other is beautiful! I wish my children and I had experienced that type of family dynamic, instead of walking on eggshells all the time to avoid the wrath of my narcissistic spouse.
Having survived a narcissistic mother, sister and husband, I have no concept of what it would be like to have a normal relationship, nor do I believe that I have the ability to even contribute to that kind of a relationship. What I wanted was 'peace', and the only way that I could have that was alone with my animals.
I am trying to not to expect normal from the past, but create a healthy normal moving forward
Sometimes I watch people in “normal” relationships and just stand there in wonder thinking, “is that real? what’s it like to have that?” I grew up with a BPD parent and didn’t realize how not normal it was until I was a young adult. It primed me for a marriage to a narcissistic partner. Again it took me 20 years to come to understand that it wasn’t normal. An actual normal relationship is a dream I’m too scared to chase. I settle for peace in my life. But wanting “normal”…that really is the crux of it. Thank you Dr. R for validating that normal and self care are reasonable and not asking for too much. Your words continue to help me heal…
I also feel the same. 😢 and feels terrible to not have normal relationships . I am like ' how is it even possible. How lucky are those who have normal people and normal relationships in their lives '
This is the moment my 70 year old mother walked out and cut contact: I told her "I feel like when I disagree with you on something you always get mad, like I'm supposed to just agree with you no matter what I think or feel." Said this as calmly and as evenly as I could and brased for the explosion. Thankfully she just walked out and two months later I couldn't be more greatful.
What a great moment, well done!!
Two things I've always said all my life, 1. I just want to be allowed to be myself. 2. I just want to be normal / have a normal life
So simple yet so true!!!
It's SO irritating when people justify their crappiness as being blunt or street or whatever. Being blunt and being kind are NOT mutually exclusive. Just ask any doctor who's ever had to deliver bad news.
In my experience, many people who are proud of being blunt, direct, etc., are also the most sensitive about others' words, i.e. more likely to emphasize negative meanings, or insist on seeing negativity where there isn't any. Basically: you have to take their "honesty," while they constantly accuse you of being rude, selfish, failing to read their mind, etc. Anyone else here see this pattern?
@@jaminavestajugo3456 yep, and I try to steer as clear of people like that as humanly possible.
@@jaminavestajugo3456Absolutely. My father was/is entitled to express his full range of of emotions, all too often rage, criticism, and spiteful impatience, while my mother, sister, and I had/have to express any anger we have calmly or suppress it completely, and never make him anxious or upset, while he can disturb our equilibrium and peace of mind at will.
When I met my boyfriend I remember having a conversation with him and after speaking I looked at him and he was looking at me... paying attention... caring about what I was saying. That was a huge shock to me. I just started crying. I didn't even know I had been lacking it. He was a huge wake up call. When you grow up in dysfunction it's all you can expect.
I was “rushed” into a narcissistic relationship because of an imminent major medical need that was lied about (the need had been ongoing and under treatment for years, but I was the health insurance gravy train). The basic “normal” need I have is to be able to trust my partner - I latch on now to anyone who is simply honest.
Since I was a teenager I always wanted to meet someone, fall in love and raise a family. To me there's nothing complicated about it. I realize there's going to be disagreements. But when two people really love each other, you'll always find a compromise.
Normal to me:
All I want is a calm, relaxed, peaceful environment. And for people to be willing and able to dialog calmly, quietly, without interruption, aggression or passion.
My adult siblings are unwilling to sit still and quietly, calmly discuss anything. They are like out of control frieght trains that refuse to stop for anyone.
Good friends listen to each other and seek to understand each other.
This was literally my "normal" until this year at the age of 32 realizing I had the narcissistic parents, I was in a cult and got married to a grandiose narcissist. When I realized this I had the most hellish year of my life, still struggling as I think I'm the guilty one and had to proceed with divorce etc. I cannot explain to anyone how bad this pain is. How long it takes to get out of that unnormal mindset to the normal one. I still struggle to believe that normal healthy relationships can exist.
My heart goes out for you!❤ You are strong and brave to act upon your convictions in spite of the consequences you had to face! Stay safe!
The normal presently accepted in society is toxic as normal. I'm really pulling back these days and glad that I've developed the awareness enough to have the confidence to do so without thinking I'm a bad person. I'm sad for the necessity of it
Yep. Everyone seems to be either a toxic overt narcissist, or a victimized covert narcissist.
I can’t tell you how many time i sat and cried alone and said outloud “I just want normal”. Once getting to know his family I also thought and even told him “this isn’t what family is like! Family is loving and safe”.
I'm so glad that you were able to see that, and I hope that seeing that helped you do the things you needed to to make yourself safe. For those of us who grow up in a family that is not safe, but experience that as our everyday reality, it can take awhile to equate "safe" with "normal."
Any time I have been with "normal" people with "normal" families, it makes me greatly uncomfortable; I'm always on the look out for what that nice person wants from me. I'm not sure if that's something I can get over.
You can. I did, takes time and the belief we can be loved by good people out there. They do exist
When you're raised with hatred and abuse and someone with a genuine soft loving voice speaks to you, it makes you want to cry. 😢
Wow, this really struck a chord with me. I was raised in a family where we had to pretend that everything was normal - both to the outside world and to each other. We were not allowed to express “negative” feelings and we were dismissed when we tried to express our true selves. The girls were taught that it was our job to make everyone else happy, no matter the cost to ourselves, while our brother was taught that he comes first and isn’t responsible for making others happy. My sister and I both ended up marrying narcissists - and are both now divorced. I very much struggle with self care and honestly am not entirely sure what that even means. I’m working on that, to get a better understanding of what I need and how I best take care of myself.
Thank you, Dr. Ramani, for your amazing insight and for sharing your knowledge, empathy and gift of understanding! I’ve had so many aha moments over the past 5 years thanks to you!
Me too!!! Sorry:(
God bless, I know your pain.
My family is exactly the same.
Survivors Of Narcissistic Abuse Often Leads To People Pleasing Behavior
Constant Reassurance. Pushing Your Needs And Wants To The Side To Please The Narcissits .This Is My Experience With Emotional Abuse By A Malignant Narcissist….
Thank you🙏🏽💜👍🏽👏🏾for this, I truly hate that our society has normalized dysfunctional behaviors
Western society, as competitive and fixated on material gain as it is, is dysfunctional in many respects, and frequently rewards people whose behavior damages others, so long as they “produce.”
We crave silence.
A space where nobody is abusing us.
Daughter of NF here. When I see families with healthy relationships, I'm totally fascinated! I almost cannot rip my eyes away watching simple, relaxed chit-chat. I am amazed that a person can ask a question and just get an answer!
Agreeee😢
Haven't even finished watching abd the answer is validation! So much validation. Anytime anything goes wrong and other people witness it, I'm filled with relief, "you saw it too! I'm not crazy". It makes me unreasonably happy to not be crazy.
Yup !
I get this and I can't even be sure people are seeing what I'm seeing. I just get a sense of "ha! Clearly they noticed SOMETHING, this is like the 5th time, and the way (other people) responded... like they know, right? Even if they dont have the same name for it, and i cant prove it, but, it's unmissable at this point... surely..."
The isolation is terrible even after you have left when you've been there so long, and the narcissist has also taught your adult children that treating you like a non-person is normal, you have no confidence to even seek out others, so the loneliness, which was never a thing before the narcissist because then you were fine on your own and because you had so many friends, is a cancer in itself, eating even more of you away.
You have little in common with normal happy people and feel you have so little to offer and are so needy that you isolate out of shame instead of reaching out. when you are an older woman it’s even worse because you are already invisible.
It's a horrible state. Therapy is badly needed, but to find a good therapist now? It's so hard.
Wow, you just summed up exactly where I am. Wow. Somebody out there gets it. Just know that I do too. I hear you, I completely understand. Especially the isolation part, and the invisibility.
Isolation is the worst. I don't trust anymore, so I want nothing to do with anyone. I feel stupid for not being normal. Yet another reason to avoid others. I can't relate to normal and, I too have reached that age where I am invisible ( while sometimes it is awesome to not have to live up to society views of appearances . .. . Still a bit sad about it). The loneliness is killer. I am self-employed and rarely interact with anyone else. It just makes it worse. There had to be a way to break free and feel okay with ourselves. I don't want the narcissistic relationships I have survived to be the definition of who I am.
Add me to the list. Invisible to others and lonely.
It’s hard to put into words the longing and shame I feel when I see a video of a healthy family reunion online. Thank you so much for this channel.
It may sound strange, but watching The Adams Family is healing for me. They are all oddballs, but they found and love each other unconditionally. I’m starting to have that in my life now💜
Or all the Christmas adverts where people can't wait to see their family and have a lovely time together. I can't watch those.
Damn I really needed to hear this today ❤
I remember my narcissistic ex-fiance talking about empathy with me constantly, but it was never about mutual empathy. It was always about what she needed from me. The more I gave, the more she took.
Yes, my ex bf would say how I lack empathy and I don't validate them enough.
@@karabrodsky2852 ♥️
@@karabrodsky2852My verbally abusive father says that to my kind, gentle, but intimidated mother a lot.
For me, the "normal" ship sailed a long long time ago and I've accepted it for awhile now. In trying to care for my elderly narcissistic mom, I'm at the stage of no f*cks left to give and I don't bother much trying to cover it up around other people anymore. But I can't help the feeling that people are judging me because our family dynamic is so outside of normal there is no way they can understand. But occasionally I get feedback from others indicating they do understand and that I have their sympathy. It gives me a reality check of how messed up things are in my family and how my perception of normal is still warped.
I cared for my narcissistic Mother as well. I feel like sharing with you that I made it through and will never regret the time I spent with her. I loved her very much. At the end of her life I ended up
feeling loved by her. Hug's. ❤
Those who came from normal families cannot comprehend what it is like being raised by narcissists! I'm done trying to explain to people who don't have the capacity to understand, and I'm done putting up with being judged. They don't understand that there's no reasoning with a narc, there's no "working things out". This is the sad fact we have had to learn and accept.
I understand you, and you have my sympathy and empathy! 🤗
Same. Got raged on twice today taking my 74 year old Mother who screamed once she got home that “I should just “….” myself!!” I gave no response & kindly left. SMH
I feel the same way. No f*cks left and I can't help but show it. I feel bitter and angry toward my narc and I know others are seeing my anger. Don't even care. Just wish I could experience a normal relationship. I so crave conversations. Normal conversations where people listen and respond with care.
@@angelh4212 I'm right there with you! I'm at the point in my recovery journey that I won't put up with anyone acting abusive with me anymore. I'm learning how to have my boundaries, and that I don't "owe" anyone anything. Not even family! I'd rather be alone (and I am) than put up with bs.
I do crave normal, honest, caring conversations, and relationships. Hopefully I can someday find it!
I just want love and be loved. I guess that's too much.
I don't know about "normal" but I want peace, warmth, love and kindness in a family / relationship. Respect and care for each other.
That's me, even as a child and a teen. There were families of my friends, in school...when I went there, I would feel totally out of place. Because everything felt so safe, and I'd be so scared to speak to the parents, or be noticed in any way...I never liked to invite friends home, and I never liked going to friends' houses...when I brought them home, it would feel like a show was being put on for them...and when I was in healthy families, I was overwhelmed with a feeling of inability and shame. Now I can name this. Back then, I couldn't.
My mom asked me more than once when a kid if I thought our family was normal. I said yes and she would chuckle. I became aware of the messed up stuff later. I'm embarrassed by them. Abusive fakes
That's so wrong of her. I hope you can heal from what you've been through.
They don't matter anymore. Let them be on the past where they belong with all the fake masks
This made me cry so hard... I thought I finally had myself under control. 😭
Thank you so much for being here for us, Dr. Ramani. ❤️🩹
Same here
Yes, observing interpersonal interactions, even disagreements, in a normal healthy relationship was revelatory and surprising to me. No pushback, no disrespect, no angry raised voices but instead calm and respectful back-and-forth of ideas and differing opinions. I'd never experienced this in my family growing up nor in my marriage. The first few times I observed this, I was shocked that such an exchange could occur.
So on point. I just want normal and to be my normal authentic self.
I hear other people talk about their parents, and tell me that “oh yeah - I know for a FACT that my parents love me. I know- that even if I have nobody else- I’ll always have them, and they’ve always had my back”
Honestly my heart shatters and collapses every time I think of it.
I have never. Ever ever ever not once never have had a parent that I felt had my back.
Felt like they ever loved me.
I never get to feel that sense of safety that they got to grow up with, and still get to feel.
They didn’t have to exist in a world - a life, where you completely lacked those feelings of love, safety, care, and presence all the way from your parents/guardians, since I was five.
I was so utterly emotionally neglected and abused, to the point where - genuinely feeling loved, knowing with certainty that they love me, or ..feeling like they were there for me -
like… those all feel completely alien to my experience. Like 😳 what does that even feel like?? That level of certainty?
I so desperately want to know what kind of safety they get to feel while just - existing, as opposed to my complete lack of ability to feel fully safe.
This is what shatters my heart, as well. Neither of my parents loved me, or had my back. Indeed, they were the ones I needed protection FROM, but there was no one to rescue me. My mother wouldn't even bat an eye if I dropped dead today. In fact, I'm pretty sure she would have a smirk of satisfaction on her face.
It brings me no pleasure to say this about my mother, but it is the truth. A truth I have had to face, to be able to start to heal and move forward.
I grew up with my mother telling me Every Day how much she Hated me. Everything in her life that was bad was because of me. She made me go over everything she thought I did wrong Every night and then pray to God for forgiveness for each terrible thing I did as a 4, 5, 6 year old.... ongoing. She hated me and told me so as she physically assaulted me daily, telling my brothers to kick me daily and push me down the stairs. It was endless. My father was diagnosed psychopath, I won't even go there with him, she was diagnosed sociopath. She died alone. Not one of the 7 kids claimed her body. There was no funeral, no tears just relief she could not damage another soul.
I'm glad she's gone. If no one has ever told you sorry...please hear...I am so sorry for every time you were hurt. what they did, all of them, was very wrong...and as far as praying, I guarantee she had no idea who Jesus is...if she had ever had ONE moment in true worship, there is NO WAY she would have been able to hurt you. I'm glad she can't hurt you anymore, or anyone else. Take care.@@1FantasticDreamBird
Wow... that is horrible. But I am so glad that she is out of your life. So heartbreaking.@@1FantasticDreamBird
I hear you, I am an orphan and both of my parents are living. It’s sad, but I’ve also had to harden my heart for them, so I can move on and live my best life💜
Very well explained by Dr.Ramani, as usual. "Normal is feeling safe, normal is respect, normal is empathy, normal is being able to say what you need and not being shut down and called you are selfish or greedy for wanting something basic." Can't agree more. Thank you so much for sharing this video.🌷🙏🏻
I cried half way listening to this video. I only wanted normal and I was being called abnormal, crazy and psycho. my Ex told me I want the world to revolve around me. I requested him to walk beside me and rather than walking 10 meters ahead when we are going to a tourist location, I requested him to pick me up from the airport from his hotel room which was literally 5 minutes away from airport, I requested and suggested to plan atleast a event or two when we are meeting rather than spending all the time in a shopping mall shopping for HIM.
Not only he wasn't able to provide normal, he devalued me for even asking and expecting it.
Survivors of narcissistic relationships crave normal, but unfortunately they cannot recognize it when it is given. When someone is coming off a narcissistically abusive relationship, if you offer normal they get riddled with anxiety and run into the arms of the familiar: someone with narcissistic tendencies. It is painful to always witness this pattern, yet it is seemingly inevitable.
I hear you. But when you are so used to the shoes constantly falling, you expect that next shoe to fall and when it doesn't, it can take a long time to accept that this is normal. Also when your family of origin is the abusive one, you grow up being hypervigilant waiting for the next shoe to fall, even in safe environment s.
Noooo, not me!
I don’t crave abuse, and will never tolerate gaslighting 🤮
Wanted: Mutual respect and support, even when our opnions and viewpoints differ. The ability to express one’s own thoughts without being brutally attacked and shamed. Constructive criticism, not degradation. Healthy disagreement and the ability to talk through it. Tthese days I don’t know if this could even be considered normal, but it’s certainly not okay.
Well done and very true. My therapist concluded every session of ours with "take care of yourself" so much that now it's a component of my mentality and always include music, reading, silence, prayer, meditation, stretching, and hot soaks.
Let's put it like this: self-care is so significant that I have no toxic people in my life regardless if that means family or individuals I have known for double digit years.
Thank you and take care.
My mom would say she just wanted a “nice family” knowing damn well she’s the cause of the vitriol & disfunction for her “supply.” No wonder I have brain damage from her abuse
Me too!❤
Self care and in-depth learning about NPD have helped me understand my family members' behavior. Sometimes it requires a time of distancing one's self.
I've found that being a continent away from them is super helpful.
This just reawakens my grief.Grief is usually for something/someone you have lost but this type of grief is different,its grief for what you never had (growing up in a narcissistic family) & grief for what I wanted for my children, for them to grow up in a 'normal' loving family.Unfortunately they never had that either as their Father is I believe a covert narc.This grief is particularly felt at this time of year - Christmas - a time for families. Then there's the enormous guilt you carry as a Mother, if I'd known better & hadnt fell under their Fathers spell they & I could have had a much more 'normal' life, just an ordinary life, nothing special just narc free.
Yup, you miss what you thought it was. Not what you realized it was.
❤️
I just learned a few weeks ago through these two videos it is called Ambiguous Grief. Definitely fits.
ua-cam.com/users/shortsBs8WWpOLbHU
ua-cam.com/video/wHi726FuClM/v-deo.html
Yup, you are right on.
When I finally got divorced I had two teenagers to raise. I did not have time or the energy for a relationship for myself. Then when they went to college I dipped my toe in the dating scene.
Wow! Unlike my younger years physical appearance, sexual attractiveness and all those things were way down on the list. I wanted to find someone who was kind and had a soft heart.
It took a while and many uncomfortable dates but eventually found one. She came with woundings of her own but she was kind and had a heart of gold. We have been married for 17 years and those years have been so enjoyable for both of us.
We both agree we would not have appreciated one another's heart or the goodness of our marriage had we not gone thru our terrible first marriages.
I wouldn't want to go thru my first marriage again for anything but if there is a benefit from it it was being able to recognize and fully appreciate "normal."
It's telling when the only thing that can make me cry anymore is genuine acts of kindness and love.
What a kind, loving, and empathetic video. Thank you so much for speaking to us right from your heart and helping us heal.
The hardest part is figuring out your emotions and healthy behaviors toward the narcissist parent because of the parts of that parent that ARE normal. That's where all the positive emotion you have for them and the guilt resides entangled. That's wherefrom I become confused on the "right thing to do" as pertains to that parent.
It is really confusing when they're good, and even wonderful in some ways, and then horribly mean and demeaning to us in others. I hear ya on that.
I've been dealing with these feelings my entire
We have to take care of ourselves first
My narc mother never cared about my feelings or my love of others or animals that I loved.
She got rid of anything or anyone I loved.
Take care of you
My father seemed to have dual personalities, the relatively normal side, when he was in a good mood, and the narcissist, and would oscillate between the two both predictably and unpredictably.
the mention of "grief of survivors " caught my attention. what is this? ..... I think I may have experienced it last year that some family friends were kind enough to take me in for three weeks, no questions asked, just allowed me to live in their home, be part of the family for that time period. They were so kind and so nice I just nearly couldn't believe it. at one point, and this has never in my life happened before, but they took me to a beautiful baroque concert and it was just the best thing (I'm a flute enthusiast) of the whole year for me.... well, after the concert I jsut had this overwhelming sadness .... after the best evening of many many years, I couldn't help the tears and then the guilt of being so seemingly ungrateful at their kindness. it was crazy but even then they showed me grace. people have told me that they were only being nice because i was a guest. to this day i'm still sometimes lean towards this belief but my heart wants to believe it was real. they have problems like any other family but there is so much love and respect , a foundation, in that home. i am now so shy to visit them again, i don't feel "worthy" to pay them a visit again, especially since I would really like to stay for a few days but feel it may be an imposition.
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Thank you for this one. I've had to struggle with the thought that I was asking for too much for so long that it was really making me question my own memory, and sanity.
The hardest thing to do, is say what you mean and mean what you say.
I guess I would expect that, yet I guess it's too difficult for Narcissists.
The spiritual part is the hardest. I wanted love. I wanted to make a connection to God. I wanted to understand why I had phychic experiences . I was a prommising artist with a creative imagination. I was just beginning to be able to see auric fields. I was just beginning to experience astral projection. This is what she reflected back to me. She cut into my soul in the most manipulative ways. I knew something was wrong. I had many red flags. But all I constantly heard was I love you I love you. Then she tried to bring a beautiful redhead to bed with us. I said no. And she was spending time with some law students who lived a few doors away from her. I didn't like it, something was wrong. I was suddenly devalued. And she was suddenly with one of those students. When she said we were thru I said you've been cheating on me and she got mad. Later I got hoover'd. She was using me to cheat on him! Her ability to lie reached its breaking point. I saw a confused narcissist collapse. Her eyes were like those of a zombie. It was all horrible. This narcissism is a horrible mental illness. There is no soul connection. The tactics cause a weird euphoria in the victim. You can't think straight. It's beyond painful to experience. And you are addicted.
I’m with you. I had a similar experience when it comes to the spiritual dimension of narc abuse. There’s nothing more hurtful that could ever be done to me. It cut so deep, to my core, in to the very seat of my soul. I am lost for words trying to describe it. All my love to you.
My Mother will not apologize for anything! She’s a right fighter in all situations. She controlled everything in the household along with what we all would think , say and do. I always lived in fear of being wrong and was told I was wrong on a regular basis. She could never say anything she’s proud of that I did. I was always put down and to this day I have PTSD. FUNNY THING IS now that’s she’s 88 and needs a place to live I was her best choice but for once in my life I got to make the choice and it was a big double HELL NO! Life has a way of coming back around to bite ya in the ass…doesn’t it now?
This punched me right in the heart. Really explains why I loved being part of my ex-boyfriend's family gatherings, and still miss them years later.
Yes! Thank you. Thank you so much for normalizing this desire for normal. It's not asking for too much or having unrealistic expectations to want decency, civility, reciprocity, belonging, maturity and acceptance. These are basics that yes, we all have momentary fails in, but chronically having the opposite is an unhealthy, dare I say toxic, environment and our bodies crave the basic human needs.
Yes, normal...Give and take..for the narc to say "I'm sorry. I was wrong".
Even when they do say it, they're lying and manipulating you.
Normal - true! And peace. As a victim of narcissistic abuse, I want to be free of having to walk on eggshells, to not be blamed for every family problem. Even now, years later, a peaceful day alone is a blessing.
Once again, you hit the nail on the head. I'm so tired of being shamed (even by therapists) for just wanting the actual bare minimum.
It seems "normal" is abnormal.
I spend sooooo much of my time dodging narcissists. Maybe I just can't see it yet
Another word for normal might be... non-disregulating. ... And that can mean somewhat different things depending on where someone is at in the healing process. Similar to how a cat or dog that has been abused often needs time to re-learn that being touched can be a good thing.
Thank you.This is exactly what I got a taste of with my second late husband. Eight magnificent years. I'm 70. I want more. After my parents and my first 24-year marriage, my second husband was heaven for me. And he grew up in chaos, too. We made a safe place for each other.