It looks like we would pretty much agree with you on all things covered in this episode. We love a trip to "the white board" and nice ticker tape👍. I'm sure you noticed that for about a year and a half we pretty much did nothing but 10spd. The one thing you didn't hit on while talking about 10 speed groupsets is the value aspect. I believe you can get the best bang for buck in the 10 speed groups as well as just the cassette. Great episode Chris H and Crew👍
You always did like the whiteboard! The way i do the 10 speed its no cheaper. 10 speed Deore gropsets come with the 4100 series derailleur which im not as happy with as the 5100 , so always buy seperate parts. But ,yeah, if you buy a groupset it is less expensive, and in some aplications, i think better!
If it only "shifts better" for 2 rides, then it doesn't shift better. Deore is bullet proof and definitely my choice. Sram is only better when it comes to top of the line electronic drivetrains.
I agree the shimano's definitely better I can run a Shimano derailleur through mud for 6 months and never have to touch it and it does what it's supposed to do. I guess all I was saying is while it's set up perfect it does shift a little bit better but overall I would take the Shimano over to SRAM any day
Actually, if you look at the video where I was doing a review of the Michelin front tire at the end of the video there's a clip where I'm about ready to remove my SRAM GX derailleur with a rock. All my bikes and all the bikes I maintain right now have a Shimano derailleur except for one that has a sunrace 9-speed on it
I like the 10s vs 11s discussion, definitely makes sense for the type of riding we do. Also, I clearly need to upgrade my derailleur because I get crazy chain slap just going off a curb lol
5:57 Keep in mind Shimano has an adjustable clutch, you can adjust it so stiff you can't shift, or adjust it to off, I just have it in stock adjustment, the Deore has a proper cover, but SLX, XT, XTR have a cover with a hole with a rubber plug, but I had XT M8000 before the plug stretched at the hook it, and hte plug it self popped open, I lost the plug, got a new but then it too fell off on one of the first rides, it's hopeless it seems, so I prefer the cover of Deore., and open take it off if I need to adjust the clutch. I had to cover the hole on the XT with thick grease to prevent water ingress. Sometimes the clutches can be adjusted differently from factory, I had that on 10 speed SLX before, one was firm other was perfectly adjusted, but those did not have a hex bolt with regular hex head., now all have that.
2:36 Steel freehubs last longer, but also there are hubs with freehubs that have steel inserts so you can change the inserts. Onyx is one brand that comes to mind.
I like the cross compatibility of SRAM but tend to go Shimano due to ease of set up and I have all the correct tools. I'm also part of the 10 speed club but use a short range cassette just because I like the smooth gear changes.
@@theshedMTB it's an alignment tool it clips onto the cassette and when you turn the wheel there is a screw on the derailleur. If this screw is not aligned with the tool the shifting will not be good.
@@underbikedoverconfident1142 never heard of it! Ill have to look into it, but if nothing else, my GX derailleur shifts good, but ill look it up. If you have a linc to one send it to me czracecars@hotmail.com
2:36 This is why it's important to file down the splines from time to time, using a smooth file, and make sure to file all the splines and whole spline not just the effected area, you need to do this to assure good alignment of each cog, and for the cassette to not get stuck. some files have a abrasive side, so don't use that side against the cassette, as you don't want to make the freehub thinner, only file the splines. also file the top of the spline to avoid any thing sticking out, making the cassette stuck. I had to hammer a cassette off once, so doing this avoids that.
@@mtbboy1993 the one you saw in the video from my wifes bike is about a year old. The Buckloss wheel on the bench had no grooves at all, about the same age but the hub itself is steel so the freehub might also be steel
HA!, Your right! I went back and watched it and you're absolutely right, I left out the 28! Nobody, including myself, caught that before -you deserve some kind of award!
If i were to use the RD-M5100 with a 10spd cassette, is would there be any reason to consider other 10spd shifters other than the m4100? E.g. cost, features, value? I've watching your videos and I like the idea of using the m5100 as a 10spd.
@@taumax I usually use KMC chains, but as long as it's 10 speed it really shouldn't matter. I had a bad experience with a Shimano chain (that may have been my fault for ordering the wrong part number) but since then I'm afraid to buy them!
which cassette you need depend on the riding you do and how you ride. I use all gears on 11-50T Garbaruk, and did so on 11-51T M5100 too. I ride a lot of up and down. but I might be fine with 10 spd, not tried any 11-50T 10 spd. nor tried 12 spd.
Absolutely agree! I did say i was just giving my opinion based on where i ride, just giving something to think about rather than a all encompassing rule!
I never did a 12 speed on a 135mm hub(whch the Cascade uses) but the 11 speed Deore stuff works great. The 11 and 12 speed uses the same freehub so it should be no problem, but i cant say for sure becase I've never done it myself
I'm not sure which derailleur you're talking about, but if your talking about a 6 speed derailleur it wont work. First of all, 10 speed, 11 speed and 12 speed Sram derailleur use there own shifters. But also a 6 speed derailleur wouldnt have eouugh travel to work with anything larger than 7speed
@@zencro-bs9506 oh, ok! I know nothing about that! See iif the pull ratios are the same, if there listed somewhere. I do all budget stuff, i dont have any experience with newer parts!
@@theshedMTB But both 5100 and 6100 are 12 speed, both do 11-51T. I am not sure if there actually are any differences apart from the M6100 having only Deore on it, and M5100 having Shimano Deore on it, but M5100 is meant to be 11 speed, but I don't know if there is any real difference, have you tried both? But Shimano RDs usually can shift one extra gear than they actually are meant for. I have the M6100 SGS, SGS refers to long cage, so it can do 11-51T on a full suspension bike. I have mine setup with 11-50T 11 speed Garbaruk HG cassette, 32T oval on a 29er. Garbaruk is not cheap, but it's their 12 speed cs is cheaper and lighter than XX1 and XTR. I have the 11 spd version. but the Microspline and XD drive version is 52T. yes it works with 11 speed of course, I use it with Archer D1X Trail with the paddle remote. It works well. I've not tried the current 12 speed Shimano shifters. I've tried M6100 SGS RD with M5100 cassette, it worked well, smooth shifting. but did only test the CS for 3 rides on my enduro bike, and only 2 times to the dentist on the other bike it is on.
@@mtbboy1993 im struggling to get the middle gears to shift . The first 3 will work perfect and the last 3 work perfect but the middle gears dont shift right away when i shift. I really havnt messed around with it much,
@@mtbboy1993 i use the 5100 for 10 and 11 speed. My 12 speed is 6100 whjch i dont have any experiance with, first one ive owned. The 4100 which usually comes with 10 speed groupset is the one that needs a extension link to work with 50t. I never really said it but thats what i was comparing it to. Sorry not a pro at this video stuff!
It looks like we would pretty much agree with you on all things covered in this episode. We love a trip to "the white board" and nice ticker tape👍. I'm sure you noticed that for about a year and a half we pretty much did nothing but 10spd. The one thing you didn't hit on while talking about 10 speed groupsets is the value aspect. I believe you can get the best bang for buck in the 10 speed groups as well as just the cassette. Great episode Chris H and Crew👍
You always did like the whiteboard! The way i do the 10 speed its no cheaper. 10 speed Deore gropsets come with the 4100 series derailleur which im not as happy with as the 5100 , so always buy seperate parts. But ,yeah, if you buy a groupset it is less expensive, and in some aplications, i think better!
If it only "shifts better" for 2 rides, then it doesn't shift better. Deore is bullet proof and definitely my choice.
Sram is only better when it comes to top of the line electronic drivetrains.
I agree the shimano's definitely better I can run a Shimano derailleur through mud for 6 months and never have to touch it and it does what it's supposed to do. I guess all I was saying is while it's set up perfect it does shift a little bit better but overall I would take the Shimano over to SRAM any day
Actually, if you look at the video where I was doing a review of the Michelin front tire at the end of the video there's a clip where I'm about ready to remove my SRAM GX derailleur with a rock. All my bikes and all the bikes I maintain right now have a Shimano derailleur except for one that has a sunrace 9-speed on it
I like the 10s vs 11s discussion, definitely makes sense for the type of riding we do. Also, I clearly need to upgrade my derailleur because I get crazy chain slap just going off a curb lol
Yeah, i think the 10 speed makes sense. I may try one if i ever get in shape!
5:57 Keep in mind Shimano has an adjustable clutch, you can adjust it so stiff you can't shift, or adjust it to off, I just have it in stock adjustment, the Deore has a proper cover, but SLX, XT, XTR have a cover with a hole with a rubber plug, but I had XT M8000 before the plug stretched at the hook it, and hte plug it self popped open, I lost the plug, got a new but then it too fell off on one of the first rides, it's hopeless it seems, so I prefer the cover of Deore., and open take it off if I need to adjust the clutch.
I had to cover the hole on the XT with thick grease to prevent water ingress.
Sometimes the clutches can be adjusted differently from factory, I had that on 10 speed SLX before, one was firm other was perfectly adjusted, but those did not have a hex bolt with regular hex head., now all have that.
2:36 Steel freehubs last longer, but also there are hubs with freehubs that have steel inserts so you can change the inserts. Onyx is one brand that comes to mind.
Sounds heavy! Right now its not enough of a issue to worry about for me.
@@theshedMTB some brands offer it as an option. Hope is one of them. But the Onyx style is light, but the steel inserts won't add much weight.
I run the 5100 11-speed, with an 11-50T cassette. So far, so good. For the cost, the Shimano is hard to beat.
I agree, i think the GX shifts alittle better but at double the cost
I still like using 8-9 speed they are using cheaper and have a stronger chain .. it is nice to have more selection with the 10-11 speed
8&9 speed are definite options, my son runs a 8 speed acolyte derailleur with a 11-42 cassete and he loves it!
I like the cross compatibility of SRAM but tend to go Shimano due to ease of set up and I have all the correct tools. I'm also part of the 10 speed club but use a short range cassette just because I like the smooth gear changes.
Im in the Shimano club too, the GX does shift better, but like you said, Shimano is easier to set up
@@theshedMTB Do you have that special plastic tool you need to put on the cassette for SRAM when you set it up?
Didnt know there was one, what does it do?
@@theshedMTB it's an alignment tool it clips onto the cassette and when you turn the wheel there is a screw on the derailleur. If this screw is not aligned with the tool the shifting will not be good.
@@underbikedoverconfident1142 never heard of it! Ill have to look into it, but if nothing else, my GX derailleur shifts good, but ill look it up. If you have a linc to one send it to me czracecars@hotmail.com
2:36 This is why it's important to file down the splines from time to time, using a smooth file, and make sure to file all the splines and whole spline not just the effected area, you need to do this to assure good alignment of each cog, and for the cassette to not get stuck. some files have a abrasive side, so don't use that side against the cassette, as you don't want to make the freehub thinner, only file the splines.
also file the top of the spline to avoid any thing sticking out, making the cassette stuck. I had to hammer a cassette off once, so doing this avoids that.
Thats a good point. I get them freehubs for Zitto and Koozer hubs for like $20 so when they start bothering me ill just change them
@@theshedMTB How are those hubs doing?
@@mtbboy1993 the one you saw in the video from my wifes bike is about a year old. The Buckloss wheel on the bench had no grooves at all, about the same age but the hub itself is steel so the freehub might also be steel
@@theshedMTB That must be a heavy hub.
@@mtbboy1993 yes, it is! Its not on a bike right now because of that, but it is tough!
You missing a gear on that 10-speed? I only count 9, is there a 28 tooth in there?
HA!, Your right! I went back and watched it and you're absolutely right, I left out the 28! Nobody, including myself, caught that before -you deserve some kind of award!
If i were to use the RD-M5100 with a 10spd cassette, is would there be any reason to consider other 10spd shifters other than the m4100? E.g. cost, features, value?
I've watching your videos and I like the idea of using the m5100 as a 10spd.
When i do a 5100 derailleur as a 10speed I use the m4100 shfter. I actually like the Shimano shfters!
@@theshedMTB do you use the shimano 10spd chain? Or it doesn't matter?
@@taumax I usually use KMC chains, but as long as it's 10 speed it really shouldn't matter. I had a bad experience with a Shimano chain (that may have been my fault for ordering the wrong part number) but since then I'm afraid to buy them!
which cassette you need depend on the riding you do and how you ride.
I use all gears on 11-50T Garbaruk, and did so on 11-51T M5100 too. I ride a lot of up and down. but I might be fine with 10 spd, not tried any 11-50T 10 spd.
nor tried 12 spd.
Absolutely agree! I did say i was just giving my opinion based on where i ride, just giving something to think about rather than a all encompassing rule!
Hello, I have a cascade 4 2023 and I would like to upgrade the drive train to a shimano deore 1x12, do you think that is possible?
I never did a 12 speed on a 135mm hub(whch the Cascade uses) but the 11 speed Deore stuff works great. The 11 and 12 speed uses the same freehub so it should be no problem, but i cant say for sure becase I've never done it myself
Thank you for taking the time to answer my question 🙏🙏
@@reinaldomiranda3119 yor welcome, if you need any other info feel free to ask!
🙏🙏
Hello, can I put a slx derallieur with a SRAM NX 12 speed Cassette and GX shifter? Hopefully I can get an answer. Thanks
I'm not sure which derailleur you're talking about, but if your talking about a 6 speed derailleur it wont work. First of all, 10 speed, 11 speed and 12 speed Sram derailleur use there own shifters. But also a 6 speed derailleur wouldnt have eouugh travel to work with anything larger than 7speed
@@theshedMTB im talking about slx new 12 speed shifter
@@zencro-bs9506 oh, ok! I know nothing about that! See iif the pull ratios are the same, if there listed somewhere. I do all budget stuff, i dont have any experience with newer parts!
@@theshedMTB Ok, Thanks!
I'm a Sram guy myself. Tried the newer shimano 12 speed, and I'm not impressed.
Im actually struggling to get my 12 speed working right! 5100 derailleur just work though
@@theshedMTB But both 5100 and 6100 are 12 speed, both do 11-51T. I am not sure if there actually are any differences apart from the M6100 having only Deore on it, and M5100 having Shimano Deore on it, but M5100 is meant to be 11 speed, but I don't know if there is any real difference, have you tried both? But Shimano RDs usually can shift one extra gear than they actually are meant for.
I have the M6100 SGS, SGS refers to long cage, so it can do 11-51T on a full suspension bike.
I have mine setup with 11-50T 11 speed Garbaruk HG cassette, 32T oval on a 29er.
Garbaruk is not cheap, but it's their 12 speed cs is cheaper and lighter than XX1 and XTR. I have the 11 spd version. but the Microspline and XD drive version is 52T.
yes it works with 11 speed of course, I use it with Archer D1X Trail with the paddle remote. It works well. I've not tried the current 12 speed Shimano shifters.
I've tried M6100 SGS RD with M5100 cassette, it worked well, smooth shifting. but did only test the CS for 3 rides on my enduro bike, and only 2 times to the dentist on the other bike it is on.
@@theshedMTB what is the issue? what does it struggle with? Mine works well, I have two.
@@mtbboy1993 im struggling to get the middle gears to shift . The first 3 will work perfect and the last 3 work perfect but the middle gears dont shift right away when i shift. I really havnt messed around with it much,
@@mtbboy1993 i use the 5100 for 10 and 11 speed. My 12 speed is 6100 whjch i dont have any experiance with, first one ive owned. The 4100 which usually comes with 10 speed groupset is the one that needs a extension link to work with 50t. I never really said it but thats what i was comparing it to. Sorry not a pro at this video stuff!
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Ii dont know what to say to this, sorry you didnt liike it!