Korg vs Yamaha vs Roland Showdown
Вставка
- Опубліковано 10 жов 2017
- Unscripted Opinion, Episode 01: a showdown between 3 popular MIDI synthesizers from the 90's. Korg NS5R vs Yamaha MU100 vs Roland SC-55 MK 2.
Last week's episode: • Korg NS5R/NX5R with Dr... - Фільми й анімація
Love the video, looking forward to next episodes !
I think it's kind of funny that people buy these to play 90's DOS soundtracks on instead of making ABSOLUTE CLUB BANGERZ!! 💪🏻
Thanks for the useful video. I actually ended up getting an SC-88. They were around the same price, so I figured it'd be more versatile to play around with while having a pretty good SC-55 compatibility mode for games. Considered the Korg too, but felt it would've been a bit redundant since I already have the N364.
I didn't get an SC88, because I have 2 Roland MC80 sequencers, both with SC88 Pro in as an expansion card. For Korg I just recently ordered Serdaco Yucatan wavetable. So instead of a Yamaha XG compatible platform, it'll become a Roland GS hybrid. Can't wait to try it out.
I only have a single Korg synth. My gear collection is predominantly Roland and everything in it has some form of SC55 emulation. Roland is great when it comes to backwards compatibility.
I loved your videos. My korg i3 is with the waverom defective and the sound is bad. but the processing part is ok and the Midi output works. Alternatively I wanted to connect the midi output from my korg i3 (arranger keyboard) to a dreamblaster x3, but before buying this board wanted to know if you can let me know if it will work. How to know if this keyboard will select the correct sounds.
I don't have experience with i3. In specs it lists wave table support, but I can't find schematics to see if it refers to an internal wavetable port or something non-removable that's built-in. If you get an external dreamblaster with a MIDI port, then you can use it with anything that outputs MIDI. It'll work as a standalone sound generator. On my NS5R I have it installed internally. When enabled, it bypasses all of the fancy Korg filters. It has reverb and chorus, but those respond to CC commands issued through MIDI input as oppose to setting from Korg's control panel. NS5R is a different device compared to an i3, so it's hard for me to judge which features of the wavetable it will be able to take advantage of.
Nice video, So do you when you connect it to the PC with the USB adaptor can you use a modern DAW or is there software needed?
It just works. Becomes a sound device that can be used with anything that supports Midi, like Winamp, Fruityloops etc. I use Edirol Midi to USB adapter and it woks without the need for drivers. Windows just picks it up. And it is easy to set up in DOSbox also. These boxes are still as capable as anything modern and fancy.
@@enilenis Sick, Thanks for the info. Might go with the cheapest MU version with a display screen I can find on Ebay.
Thanks for your comprasion.I finaly choose the yamaha.I really like yamaha's bright and 80s new wave liked sound
Lately I've been using Yamaha RM1x sequencer. It can work as a synthesizer and surpasses MU100 in terms of what it can do, but I haven't made any videos on it. I don't know it well enough to be teaching others about it.
i have an mc 50 mk2 and i tried your tutorial on drive upgrade and I let you know if ..i hope it will work..ill let you know my friend
Dude! Does the Wavetable extension in KORG changes everything? With wavetable I can have MT32, GS and XG right?
Yes. Any wavetable you can stick onto a soundcard card will go into Korg, since it's the exact same port. I only wish there was an easily accessible expansion bay, like on Roland's. With a wavetable you get none of Korg's fancy filters, but that's how they all work. A wavetable is like its own mini-soundcard.
Sir please choose one for me between
Korg ek50in vs Roland E09IN vs Roland BK-3 vs Roland E-X30 vs Casio 9000in vs Yamaha i500.
I am from India. I am an absolute beginner and do want to have the best tonal quality. The next big thing for me is the most number of useful external interfaces and build quality. Next comes most features and better specs.
Thank you.
Hi. to be honest, I haven't used any of keyboards mentioned. I have one Akai Max49 and one Casio Ht-700 keyboard and that's it. I can't say that I love either of them. Never used any Roland keyboards, so I don't know how good they are. I use external MIDI processors and sequencers, and prefer my keyboards to be as slim and light as possible, so I stay away from full size workstations and arrangers. I have a friend with a Yamaha, and to me the menu system is way too convoluted, but the sound is beautiful. Casio I would never recommend, unless it's a straight digital piano. Ones that I tried at music store felt cheaply made. I'm not an expert on keyboards, so I suggest asking someone who has the models that you mentioned in a video.
I've owned all three. Bought them in the 90's the Roland early 90's, Yamaha mid 90's, Korg, late 90's I still have the Roland and Korg. To me Roland and Korg are better built of the three Korg is most versatile and better sounding with more sounds
I mostly use Korg and hook it up to 3 Strymon Timeline, Mobius and Bigsky. With all 3 doing filtering I can get most amazing sounds. Roland I use for retro gaming, and Yamaha I hardly ever touch. Most of the time it sits on the shelf. Last synth I've got just 2 days ago is Roland MT-300s. Sound-wise it's on par with SC-55, but the format is more convenient. I've grown tired of patching cables endlessly. Sometimes I just want to sit down and play music. Korg's jog wheel is barely functioning. I'll have to do some maintenance on it soon. Hopefully it's just oxidation of contacts.
Question, the Yamaha mu module
I heard it has awm2, is that motif engine?
To be honest. I don't know. How do I check?
AWM2 is Yamaha's sample playback model engine. It has been used for many years, and is still used in the Motif line, but the quality of the sounds depends a lot on the sample database. This was quite small in the early models and has grown much bigger in more recent Motif models. So, to answer your question, yes, it's the same engine, but it won't sound as good as a more recent model.
Thanks for this comparison. I've been considering an NS5R, NX5R or N1R for music. So does the NX5R actually improve upon the CPU or display lag, or are the hardware and display driver, etc. absolutely identical (aside from the included daughterboard in the NX5R)? You kind of concerned me into also looking at the N1R, but it's bigger and from what I've read elsewhere most of the patches are completely different, though the base waveforms are the same.
N1R is superior and samples are 2x the bitrate, so if you don't mind a full rack form factor, go for it. I prefer half-size boxes. NX5R I only read about and haven't had a chance to test it myself. Getting it now would be redudnant. I've examined schematics and can see that they've done some minor cost-cutting on the later model, but whether they fixed the bugs or not, I'm not sure. I assume they didn't.
@@enilenis Thanks for the additional info. I agree with your assumption. I guess I'll leave it up to price because even if the N1R is superior I still love the look of NS/X5R, oversized rotary knob and all... :)
Very informative video 👍. I believe there is Yamaha MU100R module for professional use with all 1/4” input/output. Also, it’s standard U rack size.
I like small boxes, because I have no space to set up a full rack. I throw things onto the dinner table and put them away, when not working on music. I'm not an audiophile, so quality doesn't matter to me as much as sound signature itself. The sound of a brand. I haven't developed love for Yamaha, because Roland was the first thing I heard. And I listened to a lot of UK electronica, which was largely performed on Roland's. Old educational films with synth music in the background - Roland's. Early computer games - Roland's. Even though the sound is probably the thinnest amongst competition, that is what my brain is nostalgic for. Most of my retro gear is by Roland. Had a Yamaha electric guitar once. Other than that, the MU100 is pretty much it. I only use it if I am trying to recreate tracks from the 90's, and I know it were done on a Yamaha originally. Doesn't happen often.
@@enilenis same as you. All my gears are 80-90 (Korg 01/wfd, M1, Propechy, Triton, Yamaha ES, S80, MU50, Roland JV80...)
@@mdmusiz Besides SC-55 Mk2 and MT-32 in the clip, I've got a pair of MC-80's fully upgraded, which are as good as SC-88 Pro's. SD-35 which I had to buy twice, because the first one got stolen in the mail. It's like a non Mk2 SC-55. Then there is MT-300S, which is again, like SC-55... and then I've got external floppy SB-55 I think it's called and a bunch of other things. MC-300. Retro buried beneath other retro. If only I had the time to play with it all.
Interesting video! Here's my choice for each usage (retro gaming, hybrid, music creation).
For retro gaming I'd go with the SC-55/SC-55 MK2, period. 99% of MIDI game soundtracks were composed on Roland sound canvas so if you want your games to sound as intended this is the way to go. The XG support is only relevant for... 2 games: Final Fantasy VII and VIII. And the XG support for these two games can be easily covered through yamaha's soft synthesizers (S-YXG50). And sure you can use wave tables with the Korg but it will never really sound like a SC-55.
For a hybrid usage that will cover retro-gaming and music creation I agree with you, I'd go with a Yamaha MU100 or a Korg NS5R/NX5R. I'd also add another option: the Yamaha MU2000EX. It is 100% compatible with all the MIDI standards: GS, GM, GM2 and XG. It's very flexible, versatile and it sounds great. But it's an expensive module so if you want a more affordable solution then stick to the MU100 (the MU80 would do a decent job as well) or the Korg.
For purely music creation purpose... well I'd say that unless you're a 90 synthesizers nostalgic you'd be better off looking for more modern options (like more recent modules or software synthesizers) than these 3 old MIDI modules.
Agree with every point. I have 12GB of midi files that I've been collecting since the dawn of time. Many pop song covers among those, and 9/10 times they sound proper on Roland but will be off on the other two. You can tell when something was composed on a Roland. TV sitcoms were full of Roland soundtracks as well. You often get a 1:1 match, meaning that they didn't even bother to enhance music and just played it straight off a single device. On a TV schedule that sort of thing tends to happen a lot. Roland sound is very consistent throughout its line of products. I could've gone with an SC88 (which is built into my sequencer), but the reason to go with SC55 specifically is because of MT32 mapping. It's no replacement for the real thing, but better than nothing and a potential reason to sway a decision if one only had money to buy one or the other.
There are some MIDI's meant for Yamaha XG and the file will typically say that though some meta tag. The best way to play any song is on the same machine it was composed on. MU2000EX is great, but it's larger (approaching VCR dimensions). I tend to stick with machines that fit into a single 1U slot on a standard rack, because I shuffle electronics a lot. Like you said, there is no rational reason to go retro, now that there is plenty of modern alternatives and software emulation is up to par. This is purely for nostalgia and to get a feel of what it was like to make music in the past. Emulation options exist for everything and I'll come back to that topic in another video. Have an SC55 emulator review coming up later this year if the schedule works out.
I'll likely take a break and do non-music related videos as a I have a backlog of unedited material that will become irrelevant if I keep sitting on it (car repair, mathematics, graphics etc). Retro can wait, as like wine, it only gets better with age. Additionally, there is plenty of retro reviews elsewhere. If I search for a topic and someone has already covered it, I'm not going to do it, unless I have something to add.
Well for those who space is a concern you can go 100% software now. Munt for the MT-32/CM32L emulation, Sound Canvas VA for the SC-55 (it can also emulate the SC-88, SC-88pro and SC-8820), and the S-YXG50.dll for Yamaha XG. Roland's Sound Canvas VA is a bit expensive but it works much better than the old Edirol Virtual Sound Canvas and unlike the other emulators you can actually use it for music creation.
And 12GB of midis, that's huge given how light a midi file is!
Thanks for mentioning "Y-SXG50" option. I never tried it myself and going to, now that you brought it up.
The Yamaha soft synthesizers were windows 98 and XP only but some cool guys decided to make it compatible with more modern OS: veg.by/en/projects/syxg50/
Just this weekend I came across a PCI soundcard made by Trident of all companies with full native and official Yamaha XG support. www.enilenis.com/projects/thrift/trident_01.jpg It came with the official Yamaha drivers. I had no idea Trident manufactured sound chips. It's one I've never seen. I'm going to test it and if there's anything special about it, I'll do a video, though I'd much rather finish my Gravis Ultrasound review first. I have about 30 vintage sound cards and only drivers for half of them. Will have to hit Vogons forums at some point and ask around. Never thought retro hardware would begin outlasting software. I can also understand why boxed copies often demand a premium. Without manuals and drivers lots of those perfectly preserved peripherals are as good as trash. In addition to hardware collections we need a driver museum.
Hey, I'm working on a video about Yamaha PLG100-SG expansion and need some brief HD footage showing an MU100. Would you mind if I used a little bit of this video for that? You'll be credited both in the video and in a pinned comment with a link to this video. If that's not okay, I understand. Thank you!
Absolutely fine. I can check my source clips and provide footage without the watermark, or record additional material if you are looking for something specific. What type of shots are you looking for and when do you need this done by... as well as any additional information such as duration, compression codec etc. Being credited is fine. Always glad to help out fellow retro enthusiasts.
Thanks a bunch! I really appreciate the extra effort but I was able to grab the short bit of footage with a YT downloader.
I don't mind the watermark, it's not a problem at all.
Again, thank you so much! I'll give you a link to the video once it's finished
Thanks, friend. If you ever need anything else, just let me know.
Can do! I'm looking to cover more MIDI stuff in the future (I have a partially completed video on the 88 Pro and plan to talk about the MU1000EX and Korg NX5R at some point) so I may need your services later down the road :)
I have Roland MC-80, which contains 88-Pro inside. Was thinking of reviewing but it's too much work currently. Yes, if you ever require footage, let me know. I can mostly do it on weekends. Normal weeks are too busy.
There is a metric ton of MIDI gear I possess and haven't reviewed. All I need is a nice long vacation to go through the pile and finish restorations.
I've switched fully to Serdaco wavetables at this point. Despite wanting to have retro ones, it's just too expensive t to acquire, when even a 2MB Diamond one costs close to $100 being complete garbage in terms of quality. Anyways, good luck and stay in touch.
So maybe I am an edge case, but I happen to like eight to synthesis, are used to have a keyboard relative of the ns5r which is known as the N1. However, after 20 some odd years of use of the keyboard, I was the second owner, and got it when it was about 14 years old, The display went bad. I replaced it with a Kross 288 But that classic AI to synthesis sound just wasn’t there. Arguably the new synthesizer that I got has better sound than my previous keyboard, like some more realistic sounding pianos, organs, strings, at Cetera. But I don’t know, there is just something about that classic sound of the A to synthesis from the 90s. And I do not have the SC 55 synthesizer, but I do have a relative of it known as the SC 33, because again since I mainly use them to control from keyboards and not computers, I like that form factor of the sound canvas because it can actually sit on the side of my keyboard is top panel, and it is just like an extra set of controls right there so I don’t have to reach over to a rack module. I only have one Yamaha synthesizer, and it is an old one. It is the TX7. However, I have had some Roland synthesizers that have become problematic. My first ever keyboard was a Roland JV90. I loved programming it and the sounds it had, but it got to having all sorts of problems. And I also had a D1 10 module that had all sorts of problems as well. But I do have another Roland synthesizer that I am totally pleased with and will probably never get rid of it as long as it continues to work, and that is the good old JV 1080 synthesizer.
I'm limited on space, so I gather what's most portable - half rack units. JV 1080 I considered as there's plenty of them on craigslist and at thrift stores, but there is no "it" sound that makes me want to go for it. I've lately gathered some Strymon FX pedals and when passing NS5R through the sound is pure heaven. Almost like it adds resolution. I mostly play with that box nowdays.
On the subject of SC55 - there is a few devices that have it internally. SB-55 and SD-35. Sometimes they can be found for less.
I'm worried about some of my machines eventually dying of old age, so instead of broadening the collection I now go for spare parts and ability to service what I have. Did a restoration of Yamaha RM1x recently. That thing is an absolute 90's beast. Runs on floppies. I thought about putting a gotek in, but I kinda like the old workflow. Half of my MIDI stuff uses them and I have enough diskettes to last me to the end of time.
I have two of these and you're right my friend ... i sub
Thanks and welcome. The videos are here are all over the place. Next one will likely be on programming. I don't really have a plan or a schedule here on the channel. It's all over the place and spare time is always in short supply. I think to myself: "Another weekend coming up! I can finish the next episode, but then household chores eat up every second of spare time and by the time I sit in front of the computer Sunday evening, the day's already gone."
All three of these are way out of date. But I agree with Kathleen, the previous poster. If you want to play music, the Korg is easily the best. The 1/4" jacks are convenient for amps and PAs, and the sound selection with the big knob is intuitive and easy. You might be better off with an N1R, TR-Rack or Triton rack, though, as all of these are cheap now and more capable. The Roland is Ok if you are a retro gamer and want sound support from old games. For a playing musician, it is not so good, although Roland does have VST versions now. I'm not very familiar with the Yamaha, but it's hard to imagine what it's good for now. For music, Yamaha has many better options (such as the Motif line) and for games, Roland is better supported.
Oh, and for music with a Roland, the JV or XV lines would be better choices.
Completely agree. These aren't superior devices by any means. Even from the same release years there were plenty of other devices with better sound. Triton series is an excellent pick when it comes to Korg. I went for these 3 because I have a sweet spot for the form factor. They produce the sounds I grew up with. So it's mostly nostalgia driven, and nostalgia is often irrational. With these boxes I don't have to shuffle a rack. I don't have to re-arrange my apartment to make a quick tune, or to clear my entire computer desk to hook something up just to play a retro game. Before I used to process MIDI's on full size keyboards and it was too much hassle. Now those sit in storage and I only keep small boxes nearby. Modern "boutique" equipment doesn't appeal to me. My personal favorite, when it comes to sound is Roland Integra-7. For the review, however, I only selected 3 devices that were most similar. There'd be no point comparing apples to oranges.
The video is primarily directed at retro gamers who may not be familiar with external MIDI synthesizers at all. They might look on e-bay and get lost in the variety. When it comes to musicians, they typically know enough about this stuff already.
I actually understand this. I'm a musician, not a gamer, but I used a Korg 0/5RW for many years and the compact form factor was very convenient. Now I have a full rack, though, so I prefer a standard rack size. I also have an Integra 7 and it's a great box--20 years of Roland history in 2U. But I have a lot of expansion cards for the JV-2080, so I still play that too sometimes. I don't use the SC-88 Pro at all though, that's in my closet at the moment.
That Roland MC-80 on the left has SC-88 Pro internally as an expansion, and even I don't use it much. I run it as a vanilla sequencer. 0/5RW - I remember hearing the saxophone on that one for the first time and being completely blown away. Strangely, the sample on the NS5R sounds different to my ears. I don't know if it's just my rose-colored nostalgia googles (I mean headphones), or if they actually updated the sample between releases. Korg and Roland stay very consistent throughout the years and don't throw any unexpected surprises, unlike Yamaha. I think they have more device variations than customers. Roland - the one thing that I never liked about their expansion card strategy was that you had to pick just one card and go with it. I'd love to have combinations of sounds/effects from various expansions, but that requires swapping. They simply have too many cards with differences that are too subtle, and pulling those out isn't as easy as on... Casio's. Sockets are too delicate and easily ruined if mishandled.
It's definitely true that Roland spread out their sounds among the expansion cards so that you had to buy a bunch of them. But the JV-2080 has 8 slots, so that isn't a big problem. I loved the sounds on the 0/5RW--surprisingly as it has no filter resonance. The N1R that I use now has almost all of the sounds that were on it, but it was a great module.
Nerds unite
Man, Korg devices always have nice sounds, but this NS5R seems to have some very strange design choices.
I agree. I'd be in favor of simpler Korg 05R/W if it wasn't for the wavetable thing. Sound is unique, but everything about the physical design of NS5R screams planned obsolescence. Then again, they probably weren't releasing these boxes with 30-year lifespans in mind. Too bad the LCD which will die at some point, has no 3rd party substitutes and the only way to salvage parts is to extract them from machines that are equally old. 05R/W is more robust and the display is primitive, so it's much easier to service. Sounds are quite similar. The saxophone alone is to die for.
i have a SFR1M44FU MODEL FLOPPY DRIVE I DONT KNOW IF THIS WORKS..
1M44 means 1.44MB. It won't work. You need a 720K version.
thank you for your reply my friend ..i will buy a 720k ver ...
For Roland MC-50 and pretty much all Roland devices prior to 1992 that used 720K diskettes you need SFRM72-FU-DL. Between 1992 and 1999 they switched to 1.44MB diskettes, so for those SFR1M44-U100K is the right option. They should be available for about $35.
thanks for the tip my friend
Did you grab your glasses from a shooting range? They look rediculous!
They're video glasses. I use them to record my voice, instead of a lapel microphone. Quite convenient, as the audio levels stay consistent, regardless of which way my head is facing. You'll only see me wear them in clips where I speak.
So it's just blah blah video...?!
You are bah-blah-blah. Do you have some more interesting thing to say? Show us what you have!