Songs that use 19/8 time
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- Опубліковано 6 чер 2024
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We are reaching the realistic peak of these odd time signature videos! And yet, despite the advance and unusual nature of 19/8 time, there are still ample examples of this very odd meter being put to great musical use.
SOURCES:
Danny Seraphine On Counting And Playing 19/8: • Danny Seraphine On Cou...
The Problem of Other Minds (Matt Garstka Drum Playthrough): • ANIMALS AS LEADERS - T...
And, an extra special thanks goes to Douglas Lind, Vidad Flowers, Ivan Pang, Waylon Fairbanks, Jon Dye, Austin Russell, Christopher Ryan, Toot & Paul Peijzel, the channel’s Patreon saints! 😇
This video was edited by David Hartley. Check out his UA-cam channel here: / davidhartley94
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0:00 Introduction
0:16 Chicago
1:57 Don Ellis
3:16 Pianote
4:13 Bruford
4:49 Animals As Leaders
5:13 Herbie Hancock
5:35 19/4
6:55 Piano piece in 19/8 time
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I love your 19/8 song at the end.
I think you just proved that everyone else was in error from not attempting this one sooner, as it works exceedingly well.
With the arpeggio that just skips a beat, unexpectedly on the fifth time round. It's a nice choice to subdivide that way, as it makes it not sound odd, even though it is. It's got that subtle "just feels a little bit off-kilter" but not obviously so. Just the right amount of "odd".
Can’t wait for Karnivools Goliath in the 27/4 Video. Great job.
When are we going to get “Songs That Use 4/4 Time”? I’ve been waiting this whole time and David has been avoiding it so hard that he did 19/8 😔
joking aside I'd actually be interested in 8/4 and 16/8.
Some songs are 8/4 because they either are grouped 3 + 3 + 2 or because they alternate between 7/8 and 8/8 so it's easier to count than going to 4/4. Also I've seen a couple of songs that folk call 16/8 just because the phrasings are 16 beats.
It would be interesting to see songs that both heavily play into 4/4, and also songs that disguise their 4/4 time. Or even just different ways to play the bass (or drum, but Bennett is a pianist), with 4/4 time, because a lot of small variations have been developed due to how popular it is. A common one off the top of my head is adding a flourish to beat 3.
but 99% of the time any exponent of 2 on the top people just write as 4/4. It needs a good reason to be written otherwise.
@@toblexson5020 "Disguising 4/4"? This isn't a good example, as it does not exactly disguise it's 4/4, but anyway this sprung to mind:
ua-cam.com/video/E3B4bnCm0Wo/v-deo.html
Tuomari Nurmio - "Kauas tahdon matkustaa" (Finland 1981) - highly critically acclaimed but quite idiosyncratic record. I remember reading somewhere that directions for the drummer were something like "Take the forwards driving force of 2 and 4 in a 4/4 beat, and put them in 1 and 3, so it's more like holding back"
@@toblexson5020 If you haven't already, listen to Bonnie the Cat by Porcupine Tree. Still hard to believe it's in 4/4 with no tuplets
I think Sungazer’s ‘Threshold’ is a really awesome example of 19/16. Not 19/8 I know, just a personal favourite 19 time signature
technically speaking, threshold is in 4/4 but every beat is a 19-tuplet. so in reality its basically 19/16
@@phonetyx I saw that in Adam Neely’s breakdown of the song (or Shawn Crowder’s, I’m not quite sure which one it was). Really interesting to think it was written in 4/4, I never would have expected that listening to it!
@@FinnFletcherWhite That was the whole point of the Perihelion album really, exploring musical ambiguity and uncanny valleys.
My favorite 19 time is 19/7.
And yes, my amp goes to 11.
🙄
Ever since they invented those, why would you buy an amp that only goes to 10?!
Who the heck has a favorite 19 time signature?! You must be a drummer, sure, but even then?!!! Holy smokes. I don't even want to click on your name. I'm scared.
@@unohu3047 absolutely, my favourite example of that would probably have to be Macchina
We gonna be getting songs in 23/32 at this rate 😭
74/209
New Millenium Cyanide Christ by Meshuggah is in 23/16. I think it loops 23/16 and 13/16 until it comes back around to 128/16, which divides down to 4/4. Crazy.
Scratch that 1264/1880
@@Fafa_Sauce a lot/good luck
@@lemonize30 lmaoo
We want a full version of this final piece. The unachieved aspect of the time signature is really fitting the ambiance.
Can't help but think the most important aspect of what determines a piece's meter is the phrase length e.g. in the last 19/4 example, to my ears, the phrase length is just four x 4 beat arpeggios followed by a three beat arpeggio. If you could come up with a musical phrase or melodic theme that breathes naturally over the entire span of a 19/4 measure then yes, your piece is in 19/4 otherwise it's just an arithmetical sleight of hand.
Unachieve the aspect of deez nutz
King Gizzard and the Lizard Wizard's song Shanghai melody is in 19/8 polymeter over 4/4 drums. Feels grouped as 4-4-4-4-3 to me. Love odd time!
I can't believe he didn't include Shanghai, the 19 beat riff over normal 4/4 drums are so interesting
But you can argue it's in 19/4 but still.
If you gotta make a time sig video better learn up on your Gizz, Tool and Genesis beforehand
The guitar solo on Zappa's "Keep It Greasy" from the famous Joe's Garage album is in 19/16 time, grouped as 7+5+7. Vinnie Colaiuta's performance is astonishing (as usual), fluid and grooving. The verse is in 21/16, while the chorus is in 4/4. it's very much worth checking out.
It's nice to see zappa getting appreciated
I got joes garage acts II &III for my birthday last week so I’m a bit disappointed not to actually see it in the video. This comment is still great tho
hell yeah joes garage!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The final song feels like a kind of grieving. Like, there is a rhythm, but then it is cut short, as like the loved one is just whisked away, completely sudden and unexpectedly
The eerie melancholy of your song is a perfect fit for rhythmic structure that feels like it’s missing a tiny piece here and there
Rusty Cage has always been one of my favourite Soundgarden songs and never realized it was in 19, additionally I never even knew that 19/8 was even a time signature since I've never heard anything in it before but it definitely sounds interesting. Great video as always, David
I didn't know it was either! Growing up, I mostly heard Soundgarden's singles, but a few years ago I heard some full albums and I didn't realize they played in different time signatures and styles! I hate the radio, MTV, and pop music. We miss out on all the best music!
Thanks for sharing this! Would have never figured that out on my own
It's interesting, because I always heard it as 2x 6/4 and 1x 7/4 (and I actually thought it was 9/4 + 10/4 the first time!) David hears is at 3x 3/4 with 2x 5/4, which is not something I considered and changes the feel for me, in a cool way.
Also @pongop, rusty cage was the first soundgarden song I ever heard, on radio! It was a killer single and introduced me to the rest of their catalogue.
That piece at the end is absolutely beautiful!!! Well done, sir!
I remember an interview with Bill Bruford where he was talking about fans telling him that he was one of the greatest rock/prog drummers.
His response was: "I thought we were playing Jazz". Perfect.
This vid has me thinking of writing a song in 21/12. Rush fans never sleep.
what does 21/12 even mean? 21 8th note triplets?
or rather 7 triplets or just something in 7/4
@@salty_3k506 It's a Rush joke.
@@wearetomorrowspast.5617 hm okay. i guess i get it actually because their album is called 2112. could have noticed that myself actually lol. i was just too perplexed by what 21/21 would actually be as a time signature to think about the album.
David Bennett’s composition in 19/8 is absolutely gorgeous.. best part of the video, emotionally speaking.. 👌🏻
I could make Dream Theater addendums to every one of these videos, but a few I'll mention here is the outro of Home (last several bars are in 19/16, essentially 4/4+3/16 feel), and Pale Blue Dot (which goes from 4+4+4+4+3 to 3+3+3+3+3+4 in the intro)
I tried to learn home on drums, and the whole thing is easy except for the last part; that would screw me up every time
I never even noticed that about Pale Blue Dot. Very cool
I love this series of videos. I agree with the Chicago guy- anyone can write in an unusual time signature, it’s making it feel natural that’s impressive
That's it exactly. It should appear completely natural rather than bolted on, like a Frankenstein monster, in order to appear clever. It should work as if the piece couldn't work any other way,
David, your original compositions after all of your recent odd time videos have been lovely. I do hope you’ll consider fleshing them out into full pieces one day and grouping them into an album!
I'd pay money for that.
His own version of Time Out lol
David, that piece you wrote is amazing!!!!
Lovely tune at the end. Filling it out in my mind, with a small string ensemble, languid extemporised fretless bass and suspended cymbals played with brushes. Sounds great as it is though, with a more minimal arrangement. Would love to hear this with a suite of other similar pieces.
Animal As Leaders as been cited FINALLY, they are so talented
The piano piece in 19/8 time at the end is so beautiful!
I like this signature actually. You can make it really frantic by building it out of 3-segments, or really chill by building it out of 4-segments. It's got an addictive sound, I'm just tapping out 3 3 3 3 7 and switching it occasionally to 3 3 3 5 5 and it sounds wild, but if I try 4 4 4 4 3 or 4 4 4 7 then it settles into a chill groove, like 16 with a very relaxed ending. 7 7 5 is weird but I can imagine a pop song using it, it has a dance kind of rhythm to it.
The way I learnt to count in 19/8 was Dream Theater's "Pale Blue Dot" the main riff is very clearly counted in 1, 2, 3, 4, 123
I see tosin I click
I wish he talked more about them 😭
A great example of 19/8 grouped 4, 4, 4, 4, 3 is Frank Zappa’s “Keep it greasy”. There are also many other great examples of esoteric music theory concepts in the song
I have been absolutely obsessed with Don Ellis recently. You could make an entire series dedicated to all of the weird time signatures he's used.
I had a friend in college who wrote a piece for harp called Rising, named in honour the Irish rebellion of 1916, in 19/16 time. If I remember right, she built it so that it felt like a reel (two sets of eight quavers) with a “missed step” three semiquavers rounding off every bar.
The outro of "Home" and the intro of "Pale Blue Dot", both by Dream Theater, are played in 19/16. In both cases they're essentially played as 4 4 4 4 3.
your composition at the end is hauntingly beautiful. i love the feel that the grouping you used provides.😀
Can you make an album with all your odd time signature piano pieces? They’re sick
Thank you for featuring Chicago. They became synonymous with simple ballads, but their earliest music is quite complex and satisfying.
Years ago I played with a Balkan / Klezmer band that wrote original music in addition to playing traditional and standards... We had a song called "559". You can probably guess what time signature that was in!
David, your piece at the end is remarkable! Please flesh out into a full production and release!
Totally hear that Don Ellis track as 6/8/ 5/8 and 4/4. The first part swings and then straightens up to my ears.
Absolutely gorgeous outro and whole material itself! Thanks a lot!
I always look forward to your original compositions that you include at the end of the video. Would love a compilation of those and the exercises that employ.
I absolutely love you videos. Keep Up The Great WORK!
Thank you!
Petition to make DAW's allow you to use numerators and in some cases denominators above 16.
I'm aware i can easily notate long TS's by notating the bars to whatever Time Signature i need by accenting them, but i'm a freak, i wan't to subvert the listener.
6:53 Although it's in 19/16 rather than 8 or 4, "Home" by Dream Theater is a good example of a song that uses the 4+4+4+4+3 subdivision.
So glad that Don Ellis is getting so much exposure! He's my favorite trumpeter and bandleader of all time.
Just seeing the title of this video made be smile. Why simple when it can be complicated? But well, great stuff analyzing these odd signatures! Beautiful piano piece at the end :)
There's a long bit in the intro of Rival Sons' Look Away which is in 19/8. Quite an underrated band.
Very nice work. Clear and easy to follow. Your end track is way kewl!
Great explanation! Also loved your piano piece at the end; very sad and beautiful.
The song at the end is beatiful ! Great job !
Excellent video, loved your composition at the end!
That piece you wrote there at the end is just beautiful, David. Thank you for a moment of sheer heaven. :)
Very nice piece at the end. Thanks for featuring Bruford.
I love your ending compositions, you are so consistently good man. Kudos.
Your example shows it well - I hear it as the arpeggiato is just "stepping forward" occasionally but its still a even number/4 So the "first beat" becomes later in the rising sequence.
Another great video, not to mention the beautiful piece in the end 👏🏻
Excellent explanation, and a nice tune at the end!
As always, very eye-opening video; that song at the end was very superb. Your deconstruction is a great way to get motivated to write!
😊 thank you!
My favourite use of 19 in music has got to be the intro riff to Mike Oldfield's "Amarok" which is in 19/16 and kicks absolute ass!
Hey the explainer videos are awesome to showcase who has used different patterns in music, but the music you have done at the end of the videos that I have seen are great songs.
Beautiful Music you made. Just beautiful.
Beautiful song you performed at the end.
Love your tune at the end. It would fit in well with some of the ambient music I listen to, but would also be a great basis for a slow, melancholy rock song that builds up to some power chords.
Wonderful video, with an interesting composition at the end. Thank you
Thank you 😊
Your song at the end is amazing!
Beatiful and nostalgic, I can see it as the score of a movie of lost and hope
Man, your composition at the end is so weird and syncopated feeling in the best way!
Great video. As soon as I saw the title, I thought to myself "Hell's bells", so I'm pleased that you covered that piece of music. In what time signature would you consider to be the second half of the original version of "Matty Groves" by Fairport Convention (it's a tune called 'Famous flower of serving men')? I once sequenced the tune/riff and it came out with 19 beats.
Loved the song you made at the end, had a very spooky forresty vibe to it.
I really love your videos and I would love to watch a video about songs that share the same structure
Such an amazing video David! I have one example from a band from Colombia that use traditional rythmes and Indian Taketina inspired theory, they have a song that holds many explanations of the use of rythm, but the interesting part of this, is that one of those explanations for the song, sais that they have a global mesure of 200/8. I know it sounds kind of crazy, but as I said, is just one of the many ways of explain the starting point in the strong pulse of rythm. So let me know if you are interested on this.
Great stuff, David! A reminder to try and mix it up a bit sometimes with different beats.
Great video again David!! Love your piano piece at the end!! Wonder what would happen if you placed the the group of 3 in between the the two groups of 4?? There would then have to be a strong accent to start the progression again.
Might be my favorite piece you've done for the end of one of these videos
The main riff of Dream Theater's "Pale Blue Dot" is in 19/16. I know, not technically 19/8, but still an example of 19 beats per measure.
David Bennett, your outro is beautiful, as always.
Thanks for the fascinating video
I cant believe there was no mention of “Undeviginti” by Simon Phillips. I mean the title is literally nineteen. Great work though, I love this series!
If you ever feel compelled to continue this series, an early section of 'Methuselah's Children' by Moon Safari has alternating measures of 11/8 and 12/8, which you could definitely choose to count as 23/8 if you wanted to ;)
Beautiful video as always. Please publish your piece in 19/8 on Spotify 🙏🏻
certain songs in odd time have a jolting sound in their music and I feel like a great musician can help soothe this jolt
Great vlog as always. This complex things pisses me off. Lol! I think I need a Campario. Keep up the good work. Look out for random left over notes…
I really love your outro piece. It sounds like it could belong on A Moon Shaped Pool.
Finally a David Bennett that features Animals as Leaders!!!! Been waiting for so long for you to mention them as their music is so complex
Hell's Bells is one of the catchiest riffs ever
BILL BRUFORD "Hell's Bells" from One of a Kind.
Fun lyric to go with the opening riff ||: Can you feel, can you feel, can you feel nineteen :||
6:53 "Keep It Greasey" by Frank Zappa and "Celestial Terrestrial Commuters" by Mahavishnu Orchestra use this subdivision.
Oh, thank you - Chicago Transit Authority is an amazing album… and I grew up playing Hell’s Bells - Bruford’s finest 😊
i’ve been waiting to see Tosin in one of these thumbnails for YEARS
A video on finding the 1 in some complex drums like Ginger Baker and Matt Cameron would be cool.
The Pale Blue Dot intro and the sitar section of Home by Dream Theater are in 19/16
I love the outro!
HOLY SHIT ANIMALS AS LEADERS!!! You're really stepping up your game, David!
@5:19 That's my jam. When I used to DJ Jazz and Funk I'd drop this tune at the end, just to see if anybody could dance to it. My girl, at the time, who was part of an avant garde dance troupe managed it, along with her friends from the company. 0ther people were less successful boogieing to it. Myself included ;) Wicked that a lickle yout like Bennett is carrying this goodness forward though. Good ears with a wide knowledge for one so young. Respect.
Hey man-love your videos and am a subscriber. I’m better than an intermediate guitarist and nearing a professional level. But I think I’m missing some theory that could take my playing to the next level. Would you recommend hook theory? And If so, which program should I do through them ?
Rainbow by Battles!! Always loved the 19 feel of that song, and almost the entire song is in it
the different piano emphases on the outro song js great. it reminds me a lot of the excellent silent hill 2 soundtrack
Your original piece at the end is really good, very cinematic. Put some strings on it and you've got a film score
Tool: "Pneuma". A total of 31/8, but everyone seems to hear the subdivisions different. A very interesting piece of music.
always wondered what the weird beat was in the middle of Rusty Cage, makes it feel very different from what you'd normally expect from a rock song
Damn, that piece you wrote is incredible. would love for you to properly release that
Hi David. I have been watching your videos for longer times and it helped to gain my serious interest in music. While thinking of studying music in the future, I wanted to ask if you have studied music in university and which subjects you had in centeral.
Wish you the best.
I’m really glad that you’ve found my videos helpful 😊 I studied music at University at a music college called BIMM. For me personally it was a great experience
It would be great if you could go into more detail on how these beats are implemented in the arrangement. Like what exactly makes it sound like 1231231212 instead of 1234121234 etc
Once again, David understood the assignment with his composition. Very beautiful.
Your song at the end made me cry.
The song 'Home' by Dream Theater has that grouping of four bars of 4/4 + one bar of 3/4, though it's so fast as to be more like 4/4+3/16
You have come up with a very cool melody. I would like to hear her in some movies)
... Complicated vs Simplifying makes perfect results in all studies like creative-skills including marketing brunches. Cool videos 😎, Dear David! :) ;)