@@coreybean9704 yeah agreed it's like. We know that's our job. Or if theres a slightly wild pitch and you jump to catch it and the umpire says "thanks for catching that it would've took my head off"
@@pOOL_pANTS 99% of the time, and that increases the lower the level. In 500+ games I've only had a spectator actually correct me once on a base award issue. (It was for a pitcher who made a pickoff throw that went out of play. I mistakenly awarded two bases when it should have been only one.)
Actually they do matter because without them there would not be a game. Parents can take their kids out of the game anytime they want to because they are the parent not the coach and not the umpire. I recently heard the parent of a school soccer team say the coach was keeping the kids too late after practice so the parent showed at the time the practice was over and picked up their kid and told the coach that he better not punish their child for leaving because she is the parent and she make decisions for her child. She was right. The coach was wrong.
@@hrearden6993 There absolutely would be a game, and it would run smoothly, without interruption or tension injected by people who more often than not don't understand the game. And the lower the level, the worse the parents behave. I just did a game yesterday where I had to call runner's interference, and the parents were livid, and on my ass the rest of the game. They believed with all their hearts that the runner can do whatever he wants if he is in the base path. They were convinced that a ball that bounced in the dirt in the other batter's box was a strike. They didn't know that if a batter swings at a pitch that hits him, it is a swinging strike, but a dead ball. They don't know that a bounced pitch that strikes the batter is still a hit by pitch. They can't tell you the difference between a foul tip and a foul ball. They don't know that an infield fly can be called a ball that carries an infielder onto the outfield grass, or that an outfielder can actually be the one to field it. And God help you if the fielder misses the catch and tries to get force a force on any of the runners who would normally be forced to advance. They couldn't tell you the first thing about a balk. "Yes, if your little Johnny drops the ball while on the mound -- even if on accident -- it is a balk." They will ride me all game because of their ignorance, and it's not worth it for me to waste a nice afternoon being hassled because I'm trying to ensure the kids 1) get to play a game; and 2) that they are learning the ins and outs of that game. *Good* parents and spectators make a game much more fun. And in all truth, I have more games with them than with the other kind. But when you get the obnoxious, rude, ignorant kind, they have an effect many times greater than the good parents. I've only ever ejected three people in my time as an umpire, and all have been spectators. It should be more than that, but some days I just don't have the energy to put up with their garbage.
Steve Miller .....you’re right, he should’ve went by the book and ejected him. Millions of young men and women know how to bat safely, without endangering others, and yet you want to defend the one kid that just can’t seem to learn.
@@MJHBaseball What ruleset? You cannot just make up rules because you think the batter should be punished. That's either calling him out, or ejecting. with a runner coming home.
I was umpiring a freshman girls fast pitch game. (HS ball, Ohio) this poor girl (first year playing fast pitch) kept doing on almost every swing. I tried to calm her down and explained how dangerous it was. Finally asked the coach to pull her before she hurt someone and I didn’t have to eject her. The coach was cool about it and pulled her. That’s not the end... After the game, I offered both teams a quick and informative batting lesson. I had the young girl who couldn’t hold the bat demonstrate everything I told them. After 1/2 hour the demo was done and that young girl? She went on and played all 4 years on the team and ended up with a full scholarship for softball. 👍
Just ump and then go home . They have coaches. No one needs a know it all that demands attention for 1/2 hr after a game. KNOW YOUR ROLL SON! What are you looking for? A cookie or a pat on the back? Atta boy! Happy now?
As a kid, I was coached to not throw the bat, but instead, take a step or two towards first base before DROPPING the bat. That did two things: 1) Eliminated the risk of hitting the catcher or umpire with the bat. 2) Eliminated the possibility of a runner tripping over the bat while trying to score. I was also a catcher, so that may have something to do with the fact that I was mindful of not tossing the bat carelessly.
Having been a catcher for many years, I would not call those real bad. My worst fear was the hard swingers that almost brought the bat a full circle of 360 degrees and hit you in the back of your catcher’s helmet or your neck.
Its never OK to let a kid get hit by a bat over and over again even if its unintentional. Good call by umpire. You want a conpetitive game but you have to make sure you did your best to protect each kid on that field.
@John Daley ... it would not be obstruction on the catcher as the batter has swung and missed or hit the ball and the bat continues in a circular arch with the right hand leaving the bat (assuming a right handed batter) as the bat continues its arch and then hits catcher in the back of the head or neck.
I almost got hit in the neck once, but luckily I ducked and it hit me in the cage of the helmet, but the guy got ejected. And the game was forfeit cus the other team didn’t have enough players
@@teriyaki_9inety9ine27 if you think these were “good calls”, the last one in particular, then you never played the game in any serious capacity. This catcher was only hit with the bat once and it wasn’t flagrant. The first time wasn’t even deserving of a warning and the third time the bat landed directly behind the batters box. I was also a catcher for many years and fortunate enough that it paid for my college education. I understand the need to protect catchers. With that said, there’s no way as an ump you take any hit, much less a two run double late in a tight game, away from a kid because of that.
It's the mothers who don't know the rules who bug me. I umpired a 12U game. Batter hit a can of corn straight up and over foul territory. The catcher only had to move a few feet to get under it. Again, THE BALL WAS OVER FOUL TERRITORY. The catcher went to make the grab, but it hit his glove and he failed to catch it. The ball bounced off his glove and rolled into fair territory. Ball touched by a player in foul territory = immediate dead ball. I called the foul, and some mother (probably the hitter's mommy) kept yelling "IT ROLLED FAIR!" for TWO AND A HALF INNINGS!!!!
@@mac2894 Ugh. I did a 12U with something similar. Runner on first, pop up to F4 that carries him into the baseline, R1 brushes F4 on his way by, I call interference. Runner's dad goes berserk, gets up on the fence behind me and yells, "What's he supposed to do? Run into the outfield?" The guy had been a jackass all game, and this one pissed me off to the point that I did a no-no and yelled back, "Yeah, if that's what it takes to avoid the fielder!" The rest of the game he's sitting there "talking to his neighbor" about how stupid the call was, etc. I actually prefer being heckled about my zone over being yelled at by some dork who doesn't know the rules.
As a former catcher throughout my school team of 7-12 grades, I can appreciate an Umpire taking care of the catcher. Nor only do bats get thrown at us, we get "dusted" on, batter will stand rear in box to hit our helmet or glove when swinging, ticked ball hits us in face mask, and batter deliberately get I way to block our throw when runner tries to steal base. A lot of shit happens to a catcher that A LOT of people never realize.
I had this same problem too. I was so excited to get a hit, I didn’t even think about what I was doing with the bat. I was mad when I got called out, but it is the right thing to do for the safety of everyone.
Honestly not sure of the best way. One idea would be to actually run after getting hits during batting practice and actually focus on what you do with the bat after. You could create a habit of not throwing the bat. You don't need to run all the way down the line, just start running.
I used to have this habit of flinging the bat during the follow through when I got a hit. Never hit a catcher, but the on deck kid always had to pay attention if he liked having healthy ankles.🤣 A lot of it had to do with me being so thin and having to use bats a little too heavy for me. We were too poor to buy a bat, so I used whatever bat was available. Hell I was lucky enough to have a glove...
It’s incorrect to be called out. It’s absolutely correct to have the safety of the players in mind- I agree. But you’re to be warned along with your team, and the next offender ejected. 👍
I have no skin in the game: I don't coach, play, ump, administrate -- none of it. I enjoy the informative nature of your videos, how instructive they are. Thanks for applying your craft in a way that helps others improve their craft.
I only caught once in HS (I was primarily a SS/P). It was the first game of a double header and had a batter attempt to intentionally hit my glove on the swing. I let him know I had a problem with it so he decided to have a huge back swing and nailed me right above the left elbow. His OBP was pretty good the rest of the day.
@@patersonplankrd There has to be the possibility of a play for interference. As the ball is on it's way tot he outfield there is no play so no interference.
@@gmerrill5362 If the batter unintentionally strikes the cather with a backswing the play is ruled dead. All runners return to previous bases and batter returns to bat. If he releases the bat and it strikes tha catcher ha can be called out for throwing the bat at the umpire discretion.
@@tomstevens7452 You need to clarify somewhat. If you refer to backswing like a golf swing then it is catchers interference as he interfered with the swing. If you mean the follow through then your statement of it being an automatic dead ball is not correct. Look at the first time when the throw was the most egregious. The play was allowed to continue and the warning came after the play was dead. After that he called a dead ball based off of his warning.
I remember playing in little league and had a kid throw the bat at me when I was catching. I told my coach and he informed the home plate umpire. Next at bat, he did it again. Ump called time and ejected him. We played the same team the following weekend with the same umpire. Umpire warned the player before game start and explained the danger. First at bat, he throws the bat, and clipped the umpire who immediately threw him out.
I appreciate the coaches on the offensive team as their reactions are educational to the players. With that said, I think the ump overreacted to the third incident. The bat does not appear to be thrown but dropped in the swinging motion and does not appear to make any contact with the catcher. The catcher seem to embellish the incident thus getting the call.
If that were the first incident then I think you would be correct. However, once the umpire warns, then there's very little room for judgment. If the bat is slung or the bat is thrown against the catcher, he's already boxed himself in and has to call it. Otherwise if an injury does occur due to a thrown bat, he becomes partly liable.
@@MJHBaseball we can agree to disagree. My point was that it doesn't appear the batter threw the bat so i can see the ejection for throwing the bat. I know you said you played this team several times prior to this so my guess is that the catcher worked the thrown bat angle. I'm no tg blaming the umpire or the catcher but if I were behind the plate I wouldn't have made this call.
@@christophermchale2971 you are correct, the bat is not flung at all, and if the bat even touches the catcher, I can;t see it! The batter has a minor problem with an elongated follow through after swinging, but that can easily be corrected. It seems that the umpire and the catcher had become hyper-sensitive to the kid's bat release and this really should've been a no call............play ball!
There is a place to safely "drop the bat", and that is on the way to 1B. I am not digging for the rules, just stating logic and good habits. THAT is a dropped bat, off the field of play, not in the way of action between 3B and Home. And that bat is DROPPED, not flung, pitched, thrown, nor laid down. Just dropped safely out of play. Teach your kids that; don't argue the razor's edge of depositing the bat wherever your style and absence of mind determine as part of the swinging motion. Safety, folks. Good habits. Why not just make it clear and a non-call and avoid the judgement? I wonder if that coach drives after a "safe" beer or three?
I have been a soccer youth referee for twenty years. Thank you for explaining this situation and I am glad to Ump warned the player and handled it beautifully. I am also amazed how the coaches responded, with class.
Yeah, it's not nearly as clear because it was on the left side of the catcher and the umpire who was blocking us off from seeing it. I think that the catcher was begging as well. However, this coach should have took this kid, AFTER HE WAS WARNED, and COACHED him to not just let go of the bat at the end of the swing. Maintain control of the bat all the way THROUGH the swing and drop it on the plate.
Both of the last two seemed to hit the catcher. When I was learning I nailed the catcher in the head and now I have very little tolerance for bat throwing.
They looked dropped cuz the catcher ended up taking them to the body lol. May not have been as egregious but it’s not really that hard to take a step or two up the first base line and drop it there. No need to let it go the way he was still in a swinging motion. Especially after being warned once, called out the second time and still did it the third time. It was handled appropriately
I feel like the last two were not thrown bats the first time was throwing the bat and I never got the catcher the other times the catcher stood forward and tried the make contact with the bat
When I was in little league the rule we had was you had to step out of the batters box before dropping your bat. It ensured that it is a controlled release. I think we did 1 practice drill of hit 3 steps drop.
I appreciate how this ump cares for the catcher. As a catcher myself, my job, aside from making plays and receiving pitches, is to protect the ump and ensure he can make the best calls. I don’t like those umps who pretend like we don’t exist or have feelings. It was fair of the ump to call the batter out, even if the last one was a “close call”. He is looking out for the safety of the catcher, AND breaking that bad habit that the batter has of throwing the bat too close to the catcher/too close to home plate.
Dylan Cordeiro that’s part of our training. It’s just part of the game. You’ve got to do what you’ve got to do to get the batter out. Pitching is a very stressful position, so we try to do our best to make their pitches look good. It’s not like we are framing balls that are WAY out of the strike zone, just the ones that are right outside. Also, sometimes the ball moves the mitt after receiving the pitch, so moving the mitt to the original position where it was when the ball first hit the mitt is also part of the reason why we frame.
In high school rules they should get warned than ejected. I dont use MLB rules, so im not sure what their rule is but that is why LL sucks, they use mlb rules and not HS rules
Former catcher myself now 15 year umpire veteran myself. I’ve had this in younger travel/fed ball (10-12U pre high school). My peripheral has this in frame but it won’t catch my attention until usually it’s whipped or slips out and becomes obvious. The first one I would have quietly gone over and said something either to the batter and/or HC-especially if it’s early, we don’t want to set that type of tone off the start. Any contact the first time is an automatic out. I think there are two sides and IMO, the umpire didn’t want an ejection to decide the outcome of a game. If that was Varsity HS and he made contact a second time, I mean the NFHS is very strict on enforcing the proper penalty based on our judgment. For a kids league, I think this was the right decision as it allows the league and coaches the opportunity to do their part and teach/train the player. In the later scenario, HS varsity, we are not going to be as fortunate as we are expected to enforce ALL penalties as listed and are rated/graded as so.
I think it was more that he let go of the bat and it made contact with the catcher as he did not that he threw it hard like the first time since he stated that he hit the catcher with it
I slowed down the playbacks on the 2nd and 3rd ones as slow as I could go on here and he didn’t throw the bat. He dropped it after following through. There’s a subtle pause between his follow through and his drop. The 3rd one is especially fine. Nothing was wrong
I saw the same thing. This ump needs to quit drinking the overreaction kool-aid of the catcher. That catcher should go play soccer if he is going to make a mountain out of a mole hill like that. Also, that messes with a players head to think about not doing something that wasn't incorrect in the first damn place. UMP was wrong, I appreciate the coaches being civil but the ump was dead wrong on the 2nd and 3rd at bats.
As a coach we policed our team on thrown bats. Safety is more important than an unimportant game. We dealt with parents to make sure they knew we don't tolerate or allow parents to address umpires in a negative manner. We also didn't allow parents to address umpires in a negative way. Take the call away from the umpire by teaching and enforcing behavior you won't tolerate. The boy in the video didn't just start doing this at this game. The coaches allowed it.
GOOD JOB by the umpire. He first WARNED the team then, when it happened a second and third time, HE TOOK ACTION. Also, great communication skills by calling "TIME!" loudly and repeatedly. ⚾️
@@NaruSanavai He "dropped it" back at the Catcher and Umpire though, with force, when there are 75 degrees of space all around the player he could "drop it" and never have to worry about that GOOD CALL ever again instead of being a dangerous player that could injure another player through negligence. Considering the 1st concern of the Umpire is the SAFETY of CHILDREN it is clearly YOU that is "trippin'" and there is video evidence to prove it.
The point is that you should not be dropping the bat behind you and potentially hitting the catcher or umpire. Everyone who has ever played baseball knows you're not supposed to do that. You're taught from a very young age to drop it on your way to first out of play, you can't just drop it behind you or God forbid fling it willy-nilly. This kid is an idiot quite frankly for not understanding this after a warning and an out!
Leading to the batter learning to drop the bat directly down in front of the catcher creating another dangerous situation for the catcher, umpire and any runner that may be coming home. I have seen this happen !
Always teach your players to take two steps before the let go of the bat. Do it on every batting practice until it is habit. This will ensure that this never happens to your team.
100% agree with protecting the catchers from carelessly thrown bats, but that wasn't thrown. It looked like he just dropped it, and the end of happened to hit the catcher's foot. I think this one was a bad call.
I’m an umpire and I have seen my fair share of kids throwing the bat. I actually give each player one warning since its normally 1 player. I tell him what he did and he is allowed to continue on the bases. After that warning he normally drops the bat or if he throws the bat he takes a second to throw it where the catcher does not get hit by it or the player in the on deck circle. I have never called someone out for throwing the bat where there was no one. I actually seen a kid take a few steps down the first base line and throw the bat at the fenced dugout so no one gets hurt from the thrown bat.
I appreciate your videos! First of all it should be a delayed dead ball. If it is a first occurrence it is just a warning and the umpire should only eject a player if is deemed INTENTIONAL. The last play the hitter did not throw his bat and it should not have been called.
I have always explained to parents that the hitter is responsible for his equipment until the end of the play. Anything that the player has control over (minus a broken wood bat or similar) that may impede the play or have the opportunity to hurt another player is grounds for an out and or possible ejection.
The last one didn't seem worth calling anything over. He finishes his swing with the bat behind him and releases it fairly gently. If it had velocity (or had been flipped), then it was worth noting, but that's a very reasonable drop of a bat from anyone. The first 2 seemed much more likely to be a bad habit that needed to be broken. The kid obviously got the message.
@@David-lz1rk did you watch this video on a 1 inch screen? he clearly just dropped it the last 2 times. the bat is not being thrown at all. It did land on his foot but that is not a reason to call him out for
Player definitely needed a talk / warning after the first one but the second and third at bat looks like he dropped it the same way virtually all batters do. Wish there was a better angle but it looked like he dropped the bat and the catcher pointed at for no reason. Wonder if he was doing it just to bait the ump into making the wrong call.
I know this video is a couple years old, but after working a game this weekend and having this issue come up in one of the games i worked the plate i wanted to see what was on video in this situation. I had a kid in a 12u game first time up hit a ball let go of the bat and not only went to the backstop it went over my left shoulder to the backstop. The player grounded out in this case for the 3rd out of the inning. During the change over i spoke to the coach and told him what happened and warned him if this happened again it could result in the player being removed from the game. I know he talked to the kid as i witnessed and heard him ( even told the kid to carry the bat along the line and drop after a few steps ) well next at bat he hit a fly ball and i can't tell you if it was caught or not but i called him out and ejected him after i got up from the ground. When he let go of the bat it hit me in the left ear hole of my helmet so hard it cracked my helmet as well. I hate to think would have happened if i had a regular mask on. This cost me the rest of the weekend since the medics on site refused to let me go back on the field. I'm not worried about the money ( they paid me regardless for remaining games I was scheduled ) I just love being on the field. The coach was in agreement that his player should be ejected from the game, and i have to give this coach the utmost respect because he took this kid after the game was over into a batting cage and had him hitting pitches and dropping the bat this was a first for me to witness something like this in 36 years.
Who here played baseball and had a bad habit of throwing and tossing the bat after making some good contact? I used to be that way when I used to play. I accidentally nailed the catcher twice. But after that incident, I just adapted to just drop the bat after hitting the ball to avoid serious injury to not just the opposing catcher but to the other players as well.
As an umpire, you first warn the player and the coach and let them know that if they throw the bat unintentionally they will be called out. Some umpires I know would have first warned the player then would have tossed them because it became a safety issue. What happens if that player tossed the bat and broke the catcher’s finger? As far as I’m concerned, the umpire did everything right.
@@RyanRobbins007 no code necessary to throw some one out after an ump tells a player to stop something he seems dangerous. Umps can throw a parent out of the stands or in mlb umps can throw fans who ever they want. The only thing that could be argued is not being suspended the next game which I believe they say happens if a player is tossed.
In 13U I had a buddy who went a solid month of letting the bat fly out of his hands. He wasn’t sure why he was doing it, as he never had before. He the became very self conscious about it and hit a small slump. Well it came tournament time and he knew we needed him to preform well. This one game he was crushing the ball but kept throwing the bat. The ump warned him that if he does it again he’s gone. Well, he hit an absolute bomb, but threw the bat. The ump let it go, said absolutely last warning. He then got ejected next at bat. And same thing happened the next game. Then all of the sudden it stopped. He wasn’t sure if his batting gloves were bad, or what the heck was going on! He’s an honest guy, definitely wasn’t intentional. Just kept slipping out of his hands.
There is no rule in OBR about penalties for throwing a bat--even if it hits the batter. Unless it interferes with the catcher making a play. That said many youth leagues have in house rules about this, but that is something that has to be discusses at the pre-game.
@@direcorbie No, he really didn't. You can't drop the bat and hit the catcher with it. How are you guys not getting this? It doesn't have to be a full on throw of the bat. He drops it behind him and hits the catcher. It's really that simple.
Hello folks as a umpire,a few years back I happen to check on the thrown bat rule,came across a little league non rule but suggestions that the batter who throws the bat will be benched if he does it again no out but he is skipped over, I have done it and it seems to work as a fair solution, coaches teaching your batter by him shadow batting swing drop the bat,swing drop the bat hope they learn...
It is easy to see a player that understands and has been taught the game properly will lose his bat down the 1st base line, or just in front of the plate for a rh hitter. Two great examples are Trout (RHH) and Rizzo (LHH).
I've watched all your videos; your team plays a high level of baseball. I'm shocked that throwing the bat is still a thing. The first throw was bad, but the others were weak calls. We don't have a throwing the bat rule in my league. If I were umping, I'd warn both coaches, then call the him out on the 2nd offense, and eject on the third.
I caught. I learned I can say a lot to the home plate ump as long as I don’t turn around. As a coach I also learned when I call time to visit my pitcher, I can wait for the ump to come to the mound and make comments to him while facing my players. Never drop the f-bomb or say “you” and you will be OK; maybe.
Good work by the umpire. The bat throwing, from this player, has more to do with the type of swing than anything else. It does not seem intentional. However, if the bat strikes the catcher, the batter is not only out, but ejected. I give this ump credit, for not throwing him out of the game, but discussing why he was called out. Give the kids a chance to learn. Back in my day (70's), I once threw my bat at a pitcher who had beaned me. Hey, if Bert Campaneris could do it, why not me. Thankfully, I didn't get thrown out of the game, but got a stern speaking to by the ump. A year later, he was behind the plate, when I got beaned again. First words out of his mouth? "Do not throw that bat!" I didn't, but I sure wanted to. Thanks for sharing this video. It is very good, as all your vids are, and helped me remember some fond memories.
Just like a hockey player is responsible for their stick, a batter is responsible for the bat. Especially in a child's game, safety should be first and safety is no accident.
When I was in school I was always slow switching from one movement to another. I used to carry the bat in both hands a few steps toward 1st base before I let go of it. To break that habit, I loosened my grip, resulting in my throwing the bat. I think I finally had to get it right by simply not starting to run until I'd dropped the bat.
I had my wrist broken playing little league when i was catching over a thrown bat. The first time should be a warning and the second time an ejection. If another player does it from the same team the team should be disqualified from play
I developed a habit of throwing the bat in 13U when we stepped up to the 90' diamonds. Not intentional; just trying to get to 1st as fast as possible on those infield grounders. I got yelled at by the ump and warned, and the next practice the coach had me running halfway down the basepath holding my bat after every hit. Cured me fast. Lol.
With 25 years of being a certified official, and doing a ton of this age group games, the ump was top shelf. He made the warning. The coach understood this is a flaw in the batters swing that has to be corrected. He warned, then called and called again. First, after the warning, at this age group, I would have followed the same path. Call him out and punish the unintentional act. Behind the plate at this age group, the last thing you want to do is to change the game. The second time he did it, I would have still make the same call. It was unintentional and did not cause any injury (that would be a different situation). Fans that yell at the ump are the people that know the least about the game. Most are just fools that scream at every call that goes against their team. Behind the plate, I knew that one side of the stands will be yelling at me on a close call or the other side will be yelling at me. Ha. I'm proud of the way the coaches handled this. Top shelf coaches that are teaching the game and sportsmanship. Those guys kept me behind the plate, running lead down the court or chasing down the play in the back field. . Fans have to know that I've never met a ref that made a bad call on purpose. Not on the field, court or grid. Never. We make mistakes but that happens. Fans/parents, over 90 feet away can see the play clearly when the ref, 4 feet away, cant. I just did HS and these games. Never for the money because there ain't none. But during the last couple of years I was getting ran to death because the younger guys just didn't want to put up with the crazy parents and the superintendents that would not remove fans because they were afraid of getting fired (trust me that's true). I always told young guys that they are paid to take the heat. Let it fall off of you like rain. Tried to teach them to what you do to control the pace and how to not hear the crowd (BTW...that bs, we hear it all). Just the violent screaming of the parents (mothers are the worst followed by Dads that maybe played the game). I finally had enough. The association I was with was calling me every day begging me to call this game or that because they had no one or needed to fill out a crew where one has quit. No new guys were coming up. This is was me doing a full day at work and leaving from my job and driving a couple of hours to call. It was that bad then and worse now. All the umps were my age, old, and no young guys coming up so that knowledge of the game and rules are lost. I say all of this so you can appreciate not only the outstanding way the plate acted and called but also how well the coaches handled it. Well done. This is why we play the game and this is why us old guys put on the gear. The game and the kids
dont think its a rule BUT 9.01 c covers that !! blue can rule on anything not specifically in the rule book certainly unsafe for the catcher and umpire
I have called it a couple of times using that rule as my basis and backing it up with "player safety". I've had a few coaches "BARK'" at me for doing it, but most of them do understand that their batter could hurt someone with a bat like that. One of my favorite umpire stories is about ME getting it with a bat on a batters backswing. High school game, 1992 or so, Kathleen High School vs. Lake Wales High School in Central Florida. Kathleen had a great big black boy who was an outstanding catcher. He came up to bat and I noticed that, when he swung at the ball, he had a very long looping swing that came pretty close to hitting the catcher in the back. I didn't say anything to him, probably should have. About the third or fourth inning, he comes up to bat with runners on second and third. The pitcher threw a pitch that had "meatball" all over it. About waist high, right over the heart of the plate. This kid hit a ROCKET to dead center field. Or at least that is what was told to me. When he hit it, the backswing came all the way around and hit me square in the middle of my back!! WHAM! It hit me so hard, I fell over on the catcher. I didn't see what happened, but my partner saw that it went over the fence and he saw that I was down. As he followed this kid around the bases, he was working his way toward me. As the kid rounded third base, I am just now getting up off the catcher who is laying on the plate. The kid just runs on by, touches the plate and heads to the dugout. The coach had come to me from third base and ask if I was okay. I wasn't hurt too bad, but I had a big bruise in the middle of my back the next day and was sore for 3 or 4 days. I didn't call him out or anything, but I did tell the coach that he really needed to coach that kid about controlling his bat. I was just glad that it hadn't hit me in the back of my head. Coach said that he had a bad habit with doing that and that he had tried to coach it out of him. The kid came out to catch and told me he was very sorry. No problem, we finished the game and I went home to put some ice on it. But, it was a very unforgettable experience because I remember seeing that kid again a few years later. I remembered his name because he was not only an outstanding baseball player, but a great football player who had made All State at linebacker. His name? Ray Lewis, who played for Miami in college and the Baltimore Ravens.
There is a rule that covers a thrown bat so 9.01c cannot be used. 6.05g covers interference for a thrown bat and lists the penalty. 9.01c can only be used if there is no rule that covers a specific point. In this case the rulebooks only recourse for throwing the bat is when it interferes with the fielder or catchers ability to make a play. Too many umpires use 9.01c incorrectly. It is not the magic rule that allow umpires to add to or remove from the rulebook. If even the most minute rule mentions a particular play 9.01c can no longer be used. Since rule 6.05g exists 9.01c cannot be used here.
@@maxbosoxfan171 I agree, it doesn't cover enough of the same circumstances as the OP's post did. I think that 9.01c would be the best rule that would hold up in a protest.
@@maxbosoxfan171 By including this rule in the book they have said what is considered an illegal act. The rulebook is mostly a list of things you cant do. Since they said you cant throw a bat to interfere, they also indirectly said that if the thrown bat doesnt interfere with play that it is not an illegal act nor is there a penalty for doing so. The purpose of 9.01c is for some way out there off the wall occurance. The rules instruction manual put out by little league explicitly says that 9.01c cannot be used to make up rules for the sake of "safety." It also explicitly says that if the bat is thrown and it is not interference the only recourse the umpire can take is they can warn the player, the team, and the manager. After that you can suggest a substitution but the manager is not obligated nor can we eject the player. 9.01def cover what are ejectable offenses and throwing the bat is not one of them.
I was a catcher and as a hitter I was always taught to put the bat down outside baseline on the way to first night in front of the catcher they could hinder the play at home and someone could trip over the bat
Calling that kid out any time was ridiculous. The third time was especially ridiculous - he laid the bat down. If the guy making this video is typical of the adults who are in charge of youth baseball, then baseball is in trouble.
Also, my junior year of high school we were playing a cocky team. This one player in particular thought he was Gods gift to baseball (he honestly was not very good). We kept getting him out and out of anger, he hit a ball and carried the bat about a quarter of the way down the line, then flung it at our dugout. The dugout was probably a good 30 feet from the baseline, he absolutely chucked it at us. Still not sure what that was all about.
Each league adopts their own by-laws concerning this ordeal for the sake of safety. A little warning to the batter is all that is warranted, unless it was intentional. No need to go overboard with reactions and kids being called or tossed out by an over-zealous umpire. The umpire will receive a lot of praise and respect from the coaches, players and parents. And if the umpire has any aspirations to umpire in divisional, sectional, regional and/or LL World Series, this is the kind of character they look for. This umpire, if I was a coach, would not umpire anymore of my games. He thinks he's bigger than the game.
Not sure why this popped up in my recommendations, but I think the umpire handled this as well as any could. He did the right thing and gave the warning and spoke to both the player and coach. After that warning, it's on the player to control the bat. Well done by this umpire and the coaching staff for keeping things in line and not losing it on the umpire.
There is NO rule that says the “batter is out when he throws the bat.” It’s a safety issue, and ejection is the only remedy. I did once have a case where the batter bunted and used both hands to chuck the bat into the catcher. I judged interference. That was obvious! Intent was there! But most of the time is warn then eject.
I have multiple observations on the situation(s) 1) smart catcher who slyly notices the opportunity to stifle an opposing star player. 2) a hitter who leaves the batters box correctly, most likely avoiding another infraction of stepping on the plate. 3) an umpire who cares, but needs to identify intentional impediment of the catcher. 4) coaches that respect complex situations. 5) a catcher that needs to learn how to protect himself by implementing better footwork(barring intent) 6) more inquiry of both coaches by the umpire between incidents 7) cordial players 8) surprisingly calm parents(could be much worse) 9) a batter that needs to over exaggerate instructions I thought the calls needed more justification, and I would’ve handled it similarly yet different.
Thanks for the reply. 1. Probably correct on that one. 2. A hitter is only out when he steps on the plate at the time he makes contact with the ball (not all rule sets read the same here.) But stepping on the plate while running to first is not an infraction. 3. The umpire didn't call interference, as it wasn't. He called the batter out for failing to release the bat under control. Dropping it behind him onto the catcher is not "under control". 4. Yes 5. Not sure what that one means. 6. Might have helped, but we all knew what he was doing. 7. Yes, a team coached well makes a huge difference in this respect. 8. Yes, again, coaches attitude during a whole season rubs off on player and spectators. 9. Well, yes, but all 19 other batters in the game didn't have an issue with dropping the bat under control, but over exaggerating will help fix the muscle memory of doing it wrong for sure. I would have, and have, handled it differently. Technically an out is not allowed here. In many rules sets, an ejection is all that is going to work if the player stays in the lineup and does the same thing a second time. (And the ejection doesn't remove the hit, just the player after the play is dead.) Had this umpire ejected, they would have lost that game as this was their best player and starting pitcher.
Dear MJH-Baseball I have been for a catch for many years starting at little league and now on my school's junior high team this happened to me once in liitle league but was a bit more severe the kid threw the bat after the he hit the ball and hit in the mask causing some damage to my mask and giving me ringing the ears. The umpire stop the game as soon as I went down(due to the hit) and threw the kid out of the game. I just thought you should know my story and how I feel about this topic
Did the kid do it intentionally? If not, I would have just told the batter to be more careful. Just like one would do if a pitcher throws a high and tight one to a batter. In your situation, now you know why catchers gear is called "the tools of ignorance." I use to catch, too, and got beat up behind that plate all the time. I just considered it part of playing the position.
@@davidhall2197 Sorry I should have given some more details. I had also pitched in that game(because all of our good pitchers were resting) and pitched 4 no hit innings. It probably didn't help that the umpire had made some questional calls which just angered the opposing team's coaches which in return angered the umpire. The kid and his father were known for having a bad temper when things were not going their way. So here we are bottom of the 6th my team is up 14-0 with one out the kid was up to bat and I believe the count was 1-2 next pitch he hit the ball then flung the bat and the umpire stopped the game and kicked him out finally we strike out thw last batter. And the game was over.
@@cjn.8968 Did he do it intentionally? Is he known for being a "dirty player"? These are the things I look at from an umpire's POV. I've seen it before in the 25+ years I have coached, managed and umpired, from T-ball all the way up to Adult hardball leagues. So many times I've defused a situation by keeping a level and low key profile. Even to the point that more than a few times, when trying to be respectful to a belligerent coach or manager, if I finally had to ask to to leave the field, the parents of that same team would applaud me. I wasn't looking for the applause, I just wanted the kids to stay calm and keep their heads in the game and have fun.
@@davidhall2197 Personal I don't believe he did it intentionally. But yes he was known for being a dirty player he was also a pitcher and he was known for hitting you intentionally if you got a really good hit the previous at bat
The umpire properly went by the book and did what he should've done. If anything, the coaches need to teach their players how to drop the bats safely after hitting the ball. That's a learning experience for both the coaches and players. I certainly commend the coaches for not screaming and going crazy at the umpire, the other team or the parents. They did exactly what they should've done, which was calmly discuss this among each other and calm the crowd. I would LOVE to have my kid(s) play baseball in this league if I lived there. If you've been warned to not throw your bat, then you best not throw your bat. There's VERY good reason to not do that. I was a catcher in little league back in the day, so I know what they're talking about. I may not have been a great hitter, but I did respect the other team's catcher by not throwing my bat when I swung. Thankfully, I didn't get hit by the other teams either. I did dread the possibility of getting hit. But fortunately, it never happened.
Umpiring softball was my first job. We were trained to warn both teams after the first thrown bat, and the following ones are always outs, no matter the team. I think I only had to call one girl out out of dozens of warnings given.
The first ‘throw’ wasn’t in the direction of a player. No safety concern. Just a kid hustling to first. Ump just has an issue with thrown bats. And let it be known. Second one wasn’t even thrown. He has a one handed follow through and the bat was laid on the catchers foot. Catcher looking for the out they couldn’t make points it out to the ump he knows is looking to make the call. If he would’ve whacked the catcher in the glove arm while holding on to the bat on his one hand finish, would he still be out? Bat wasn’t thrown... I hate thrown bats and wish it was an out when the catcher is hit but this ain’t ‘it’
As a former umpire I usually gave a batter a warning as well as letting the coach also know his player has been warn. If it happens again I would call any player out who through the bat. I would have told both coaches to coach up their players and warn them that the third time a member of either team slings the bat will be thrown out of the game. I understand at times it was simply an accident but whether it was or not it is a dangerous situation for other players, coaches, and of course the Umpire.
perhaps the way i was taught ball when i was growing up was a bit more strict than these days... they were very strict about what a batter did with the bat... a thrown bat was an automatic out, or an ejection if done in anger, a thrown bat that hit a player was an automatic ejection
When I young my sister was hit by a bat that was thrown. She was sent to the hospital where she need surgery, she was hit in the head and almost died. Its my opinion this is a seriously bad habit and needs to be addressed no matter how unintentional it may be, It is a sport and we need to make it safe for all young players. Be safe and have fun.
2nd and 3rd times were not "thrown bats". Geeze. He has a one handed follow through and literally drops the bat straight to the ground after his swing....and the kid playing catcher was sure quick to point out hey the bat is here he should be out. Bad umping IMO...and kinda bad sportsmanship from the catcher.
The catcher was hit by the bat. That's all that matters. It's unbelievable how many people are watching baseball videos who know nothing about the sport. You can't drop your bat on the catcher. It doesn't matter whether or not he threw it. Get your head out of your ass.
I played youth baseball for 9 years , shortstop and pitcher and was among the best hitters. Nobody threw bats, like they must of been taught that once they get contact with the ball to follow threw and release the bat for an extra second to get to base. It’s not hard it hit the ball and then just drop the bat , might cost you a half a second , they’re coach had to teach them make contact , follow threw And release snd run so they can run immediately.
I was a catcher in the semifinals of a tournament when I was 9. We were winning by 4 in the 4th inning (of 5), 2 outs. Batter hit a dribbler a few feet in front of the plate. I hop up to get it, batter carried the bat down the line with him for about 10 feet, then threw it back. It broke the index finger on my throwing hand causing me to exit the game. Batter was not called out and we ended up losing by 3.
Thats ridiculous. "My" catcher is the only thing keeping the ball from hitting me. He is protecting me, so you better dam well believe Im going to protect him. Same goes for the other teams catcher. You will understand the first time you dont protect them and they "accidently let a throat high fast ball go right by and nail you.
I umpired adults down to kids for 17 years. Yes, the kids would throw the bat. And I did what this ump did, warning (I would call the coach out onto the field so they heard me as well) then called a dead ball out on the second offense. If someone ever asked me, where in the rule book does it give that rule, I would tell them 9.01(c). Go look it up!
This is not "throwing the bat". Absolutely ridiculous. He laid the bat down on the last two at bats? He consciously modified his post swing actions after the ump warned him on the first.
One thing this umpire in the first clip did, is to stop the play he called he called time instead of "DEAD BALL". He also technically did go by the rulebook, Rule 9.01(c) Allows umpires to adress a situation that is not written in the rulebook. I love how to coaches handled it though.
As a Softball catcher it is scary when batters throw the bat . I love umpires that talk when some one hits well even if it is the other team. Or jokes around a little while my pitcher is warming up.
It seemed to me like the batter couldn't make a full swing without hitting the catcher. Notice no marked batters box. Another angle we might see it different.
The umpire was fooled by catcher's acting...good on the catcher if you can get the best player on the other team thrown out, the batter does have a long follow through and the catcher just steps into it and then whines to the umpire again pretty smart if you call goes your way. One the first one I would have definitely given the warning.
I’m an umpire and the ruling for this is the 1st time they throw the bat is a warning for the team, and the 2nd time the batter is called out, and if it’s a hit on the 2nd time they throw it all runners most go back to there bases
As a catcher, friendly and talkative umpires make the whole game more fun for myself
Same here its alot more fun
But the overly friendly ones make it worse. Like when there’s a passed ball and he says something like “your job is to stop the ball”
@@coreybean9704 yeah agreed it's like. We know that's our job. Or if theres a slightly wild pitch and you jump to catch it and the umpire says "thanks for catching that it would've took my head off"
It really does
BoB Bobson fax. And I have had umps be like “nice frame dude. You stole that one”
3:07 "So you hear the spectators -- who, frankly, do not matter..." Ne'er a truer phrase spoken.
except when they're right, then they do matter. in this case though, they do not matter.
spectators aren't ALWAYs wrong are they?
@@pOOL_pANTS 99% of the time, and that increases the lower the level. In 500+ games I've only had a spectator actually correct me once on a base award issue.
(It was for a pitcher who made a pickoff throw that went out of play. I mistakenly awarded two bases when it should have been only one.)
Actually they do matter because without them there would not be a game. Parents can take their kids out of the game anytime they want to because they are the parent not the coach and not the umpire. I recently heard the parent of a school soccer team say the coach was keeping the kids too late after practice so the parent showed at the time the practice was over and picked up their kid and told the coach that he better not punish their child for leaving because she is the parent and she make decisions for her child. She was right. The coach was wrong.
@@hrearden6993 There absolutely would be a game, and it would run smoothly, without interruption or tension injected by people who more often than not don't understand the game. And the lower the level, the worse the parents behave.
I just did a game yesterday where I had to call runner's interference, and the parents were livid, and on my ass the rest of the game. They believed with all their hearts that the runner can do whatever he wants if he is in the base path.
They were convinced that a ball that bounced in the dirt in the other batter's box was a strike.
They didn't know that if a batter swings at a pitch that hits him, it is a swinging strike, but a dead ball.
They don't know that a bounced pitch that strikes the batter is still a hit by pitch.
They can't tell you the difference between a foul tip and a foul ball.
They don't know that an infield fly can be called a ball that carries an infielder onto the outfield grass, or that an outfielder can actually be the one to field it. And God help you if the fielder misses the catch and tries to get force a force on any of the runners who would normally be forced to advance.
They couldn't tell you the first thing about a balk. "Yes, if your little Johnny drops the ball while on the mound -- even if on accident -- it is a balk."
They will ride me all game because of their ignorance, and it's not worth it for me to waste a nice afternoon being hassled because I'm trying to ensure the kids 1) get to play a game; and 2) that they are learning the ins and outs of that game.
*Good* parents and spectators make a game much more fun. And in all truth, I have more games with them than with the other kind. But when you get the obnoxious, rude, ignorant kind, they have an effect many times greater than the good parents. I've only ever ejected three people in my time as an umpire, and all have been spectators. It should be more than that, but some days I just don't have the energy to put up with their garbage.
If I'm that kid and was warned and called out for throwing my bat, I'm damn sure gonna lay that bat down gently on my third hit.
What does this dumbass ump want the kid to do? Lay it down, tuck it in, then read it a story?
Steve Miller .....you’re right, he should’ve went by the book and ejected him. Millions of young men and women know how to bat safely, without endangering others, and yet you want to defend the one kid that just can’t seem to learn.
How about he drop the bat like the other 23 hitters in this game?
@@MJHBaseball What ruleset? You cannot just make up rules because you think the batter should be punished. That's either calling him out, or ejecting. with a runner coming home.
And yes, I truly understand the value of the umpire-catcher relationship.
I was umpiring a freshman girls fast pitch game. (HS ball, Ohio) this poor girl (first year playing fast pitch) kept doing on almost every swing. I tried to calm her down and explained how dangerous it was.
Finally asked the coach to pull her before she hurt someone and I didn’t have to eject her. The coach was cool about it and pulled her.
That’s not the end...
After the game, I offered both teams a quick and informative batting lesson. I had the young girl who couldn’t hold the bat demonstrate everything I told them. After 1/2 hour the demo was done and that young girl? She went on and played all 4 years on the team and ended up with a full scholarship for softball. 👍
Joe Richards aww, that’s amazing thank you for sharing!!
Here we go with.
Let me tell you with.....
What happened to me one time...
possible use a lighter bat an apply pine tar.
Just ump and then go home . They have coaches. No one needs a know it all that demands attention for 1/2 hr after a game. KNOW YOUR ROLL SON! What are you looking for? A cookie or a pat on the back? Atta boy! Happy now?
@@coachtodd1373 Maybe he's just passionate about the game. Like you're passionate about being a troll.
As a kid, I was coached to not throw the bat, but instead, take a step or two towards first base before DROPPING the bat. That did two things:
1) Eliminated the risk of hitting the catcher or umpire with the bat.
2) Eliminated the possibility of a runner tripping over the bat while trying to score.
I was also a catcher, so that may have something to do with the fact that I was mindful of not tossing the bat carelessly.
Having been a catcher for many years, I would not call those real bad. My worst fear was the hard swingers that almost brought the bat a full circle of 360 degrees and hit you in the back of your catcher’s helmet or your neck.
Its never OK to let a kid get hit by a bat over and over again even if its unintentional. Good call by umpire. You want a conpetitive game but you have to make sure you did your best to protect each kid on that field.
you know in that case its follow thru obstruction
@John Daley ... it would not be obstruction on the catcher as the batter has swung and missed or hit the ball and the bat continues in a circular arch with the right hand leaving the bat (assuming a right handed batter) as the bat continues its arch and then hits catcher in the back of the head or neck.
I almost got hit in the neck once, but luckily I ducked and it hit me in the cage of the helmet, but the guy got ejected. And the game was forfeit cus the other team didn’t have enough players
@@teriyaki_9inety9ine27 if you think these were “good calls”, the last one in particular, then you never played the game in any serious capacity. This catcher was only hit with the bat once and it wasn’t flagrant. The first time wasn’t even deserving of a warning and the third time the bat landed directly behind the batters box. I was also a catcher for many years and fortunate enough that it paid for my college education. I understand the need to protect catchers. With that said, there’s no way as an ump you take any hit, much less a two run double late in a tight game, away from a kid because of that.
" HE DROPPED THE BAT BLUE !!" I think that SAME GUY is at EVERY LL, Cal Ripkin, Babe Ruth, Travel, and High School game in the nation.
It's the mothers who don't know the rules who bug me. I umpired a 12U game. Batter hit a can of corn straight up and over foul territory. The catcher only had to move a few feet to get under it. Again, THE BALL WAS OVER FOUL TERRITORY. The catcher went to make the grab, but it hit his glove and he failed to catch it. The ball bounced off his glove and rolled into fair territory. Ball touched by a player in foul territory = immediate dead ball. I called the foul, and some mother (probably the hitter's mommy) kept yelling "IT ROLLED FAIR!" for TWO AND A HALF INNINGS!!!!
@James McCollum Do NOT engage people through the fence. I spoke with the coach and asked him to handle it. That is the correct way.
@@mac2894 Ugh. I did a 12U with something similar. Runner on first, pop up to F4 that carries him into the baseline, R1 brushes F4 on his way by, I call interference. Runner's dad goes berserk, gets up on the fence behind me and yells, "What's he supposed to do? Run into the outfield?" The guy had been a jackass all game, and this one pissed me off to the point that I did a no-no and yelled back, "Yeah, if that's what it takes to avoid the fielder!" The rest of the game he's sitting there "talking to his neighbor" about how stupid the call was, etc. I actually prefer being heckled about my zone over being yelled at by some dork who doesn't know the rules.
And on EVERY PGA green..."Get In The Hole...!"
I play ripkin and he is not the umpire at my games and I'm catchers
As a former catcher throughout my school team of 7-12 grades, I can appreciate an Umpire taking care of the catcher. Nor only do bats get thrown at us, we get "dusted" on, batter will stand rear in box to hit our helmet or glove when swinging, ticked ball hits us in face mask, and batter deliberately get I way to block our throw when runner tries to steal base. A lot of shit happens to a catcher that A LOT of people never realize.
The umpire is supposed to take care of ALL the players, without bias towards or against any.
as a former catcher i agree. i have had my bell rung many times by a bat to the back of the head.
You play to close to batter if you get hit by a dropped bat
@@lcpeterbilt379...I had my glove arm slammed so hard once I could barely finish the game. No subs, and nobody else would catch.
when i was younger i played catcher, and also had a habit of throwing my bat and i got hit by a bat and hit a catcher with a bat in the same game 🤣
I had this same problem too. I was so excited to get a hit, I didn’t even think about what I was doing with the bat. I was mad when I got called out, but it is the right thing to do for the safety of everyone.
I have the same problem how do I break my habit?
Honestly not sure of the best way. One idea would be to actually run after getting hits during batting practice and actually focus on what you do with the bat after. You could create a habit of not throwing the bat. You don't need to run all the way down the line, just start running.
@@Devan-he4kr ok thabks
I used to have this habit of flinging the bat during the follow through when I got a hit. Never hit a catcher, but the on deck kid always had to pay attention if he liked having healthy ankles.🤣
A lot of it had to do with me being so thin and having to use bats a little too heavy for me. We were too poor to buy a bat, so I used whatever bat was available. Hell I was lucky enough to have a glove...
It’s incorrect to be called out. It’s absolutely correct to have the safety of the players in mind- I agree. But you’re to be warned along with your team, and the next offender ejected. 👍
I have no skin in the game: I don't coach, play, ump, administrate -- none of it. I enjoy the informative nature of your videos, how instructive they are. Thanks for applying your craft in a way that helps others improve their craft.
I love talking with the kids when I ump games. you can tell it helps relax the nervous ones and makes it more fun for them.
I only caught once in HS (I was primarily a SS/P). It was the first game of a double header and had a batter attempt to intentionally hit my glove on the swing. I let him know I had a problem with it so he decided to have a huge back swing and nailed me right above the left elbow. His OBP was pretty good the rest of the day.
lol
The second and third looks like he just drops the bat to me
Tha bat struck the catcher. Which is in and of itself deemed 'interference'.
@@patersonplankrd There has to be the possibility of a play for interference. As the ball is on it's way tot he outfield there is no play so no interference.
@@gmerrill5362 If the batter unintentionally strikes the cather with a backswing the play is ruled dead. All runners return to previous bases and batter returns to bat. If he releases the bat and it strikes tha catcher ha can be called out for throwing the bat at the umpire discretion.
Of all the places he could've dropped it, on the catcher was one of the worst. There's no excuse for this.
@@tomstevens7452 You need to clarify somewhat. If you refer to backswing like a golf swing then it is catchers interference as he interfered with the swing. If you mean the follow through then your statement of it being an automatic dead ball is not correct. Look at the first time when the throw was the most egregious. The play was allowed to continue and the warning came after the play was dead. After that he called a dead ball based off of his warning.
I remember playing in little league and had a kid throw the bat at me when I was catching. I told my coach and he informed the home plate umpire. Next at bat, he did it again. Ump called time and ejected him. We played the same team the following weekend with the same umpire. Umpire warned the player before game start and explained the danger. First at bat, he throws the bat, and clipped the umpire who immediately threw him out.
talk about a tough learner xD
I appreciate the coaches on the offensive team as their reactions are educational to the players. With that said, I think the ump overreacted to the third incident. The bat does not appear to be thrown but dropped in the swinging motion and does not appear to make any contact with the catcher. The catcher seem to embellish the incident thus getting the call.
If that were the first incident then I think you would be correct. However, once the umpire warns, then there's very little room for judgment. If the bat is slung or the bat is thrown against the catcher, he's already boxed himself in and has to call it. Otherwise if an injury does occur due to a thrown bat, he becomes partly liable.
@@MJHBaseball we can agree to disagree. My point was that it doesn't appear the batter threw the bat so i can see the ejection for throwing the bat. I know you said you played this team several times prior to this so my guess is that the catcher worked the thrown bat angle. I'm no tg blaming the umpire or the catcher but if I were behind the plate I wouldn't have made this call.
I agree. The umpire is reacting to the what the catcher is saying in the last two plays, not to what he is seeing himself.
@@christophermchale2971 you are correct, the bat is not flung at all, and if the bat even touches the catcher, I can;t see it! The batter has a minor problem with an elongated follow through after swinging, but that can easily be corrected. It seems that the umpire and the catcher had become hyper-sensitive to the kid's bat release and this really should've been a no call............play ball!
There is a place to safely "drop the bat", and that is on the way to 1B. I am not digging for the rules, just stating logic and good habits. THAT is a dropped bat, off the field of play, not in the way of action between 3B and Home. And that bat is DROPPED, not flung, pitched, thrown, nor laid down. Just dropped safely out of play. Teach your kids that; don't argue the razor's edge of depositing the bat wherever your style and absence of mind determine as part of the swinging motion. Safety, folks. Good habits. Why not just make it clear and a non-call and avoid the judgement? I wonder if that coach drives after a "safe" beer or three?
I have been a soccer youth referee for twenty years. Thank you for explaining this situation and I am glad to Ump warned the player and handled it beautifully. I am also amazed how the coaches responded, with class.
Except that the umpire had no business calling the kid out.
Boy that brings back memories. I was my teams catcher and had to dodge bats all the time. Wish our umps did more about it.
This first at bat was a thrown bat. The other two appeared to be how most bats are dropped after a hit. I don't agree with the last two calls.
Yeah, it's not nearly as clear because it was on the left side of the catcher and the umpire who was blocking us off from seeing it. I think that the catcher was begging as well. However, this coach should have took this kid, AFTER HE WAS WARNED, and COACHED him to not just let go of the bat at the end of the swing. Maintain control of the bat all the way THROUGH the swing and drop it on the plate.
The last one wasn’t a throw but he let go of the bat while still in motion.
Both of the last two seemed to hit the catcher. When I was learning I nailed the catcher in the head and now I have very little tolerance for bat throwing.
They looked dropped cuz the catcher ended up taking them to the body lol. May not have been as egregious but it’s not really that hard to take a step or two up the first base line and drop it there. No need to let it go the way he was still in a swinging motion. Especially after being warned once, called out the second time and still did it the third time. It was handled appropriately
I feel like the last two were not thrown bats the first time was throwing the bat and I never got the catcher the other times the catcher stood forward and tried the make contact with the bat
When I was in little league the rule we had was you had to step out of the batters box before dropping your bat. It ensured that it is a controlled release. I think we did 1 practice drill of hit 3 steps drop.
I appreciate how this ump cares for the catcher. As a catcher myself, my job, aside from making plays and receiving pitches, is to protect the ump and ensure he can make the best calls. I don’t like those umps who pretend like we don’t exist or have feelings. It was fair of the ump to call the batter out, even if the last one was a “close call”. He is looking out for the safety of the catcher, AND breaking that bad habit that the batter has of throwing the bat too close to the catcher/too close to home plate.
Lmao except for the fact that you're trying to decieve the ump the entire game by framing pitches.
Dylan Cordeiro that’s part of our training. It’s just part of the game. You’ve got to do what you’ve got to do to get the batter out. Pitching is a very stressful position, so we try to do our best to make their pitches look good. It’s not like we are framing balls that are WAY out of the strike zone, just the ones that are right outside. Also, sometimes the ball moves the mitt after receiving the pitch, so moving the mitt to the original position where it was when the ball first hit the mitt is also part of the reason why we frame.
@@soundactivated7467 ik that im a catcher lol
The umpire is supposed to care about ALL the players, without bias towards or against any.
I always get hit by a bat while catching. They only get punished with a strike
In high school rules they should get warned than ejected. I dont use MLB rules, so im not sure what their rule is but that is why LL sucks, they use mlb rules and not HS rules
I do too, but nothing happens, the umpire and I make sure we are good
me too
Always?
Bryce Heflin i am an umpire ive been hit in the neck with a bat trust me they would have got more than a strike
Former catcher myself now 15 year umpire veteran myself. I’ve had this in younger travel/fed ball (10-12U pre high school). My peripheral has this in frame but it won’t catch my attention until usually it’s whipped or slips out and becomes obvious. The first one I would have quietly gone over and said something either to the batter and/or HC-especially if it’s early, we don’t want to set that type of tone off the start. Any contact the first time is an automatic out. I think there are two sides and IMO, the umpire didn’t want an ejection to decide the outcome of a game. If that was Varsity HS and he made contact a second time, I mean the NFHS is very strict on enforcing the proper penalty based on our judgment. For a kids league, I think this was the right decision as it allows the league and coaches the opportunity to do their part and teach/train the player. In the later scenario, HS varsity, we are not going to be as fortunate as we are expected to enforce ALL penalties as listed and are rated/graded as so.
He definitely did not throw his bat the second at bat!!
I think it was more that he let go of the bat and it made contact with the catcher as he did not that he threw it hard like the first time since he stated that he hit the catcher with it
bat hit the catcher..NO EXCUSE FOR THAT
I slowed down the playbacks on the 2nd and 3rd ones as slow as I could go on here and he didn’t throw the bat. He dropped it after following through. There’s a subtle pause between his follow through and his drop. The 3rd one is especially fine. Nothing was wrong
thank you! i was like what's the big deal here
I saw the same thing. This ump needs to quit drinking the overreaction kool-aid of the catcher. That catcher should go play soccer if he is going to make a mountain out of a mole hill like that.
Also, that messes with a players head to think about not doing something that wasn't incorrect in the first damn place.
UMP was wrong, I appreciate the coaches being civil but the ump was dead wrong on the 2nd and 3rd at bats.
@@brandonb.288 💯 % accurate 🏆
As a coach we policed our team on thrown bats. Safety is more important than an unimportant game. We dealt with parents to make sure they knew we don't tolerate or allow parents to address umpires in a negative manner. We also didn't allow parents to address umpires in a negative way. Take the call away from the umpire by teaching and enforcing behavior you won't tolerate. The boy in the video didn't just start doing this at this game. The coaches allowed it.
GOOD JOB by the umpire.
He first WARNED the team then, when it happened a second and third time, HE TOOK ACTION.
Also, great communication skills by calling "TIME!" loudly and repeatedly. ⚾️
It didn't happen a third time, though. Third at-bat, the kid just dropped it. Ump was trippin', by then.
@@NaruSanavai He "dropped it" back at the Catcher and Umpire though, with force, when there are 75 degrees of space all around the player he could "drop it" and never have to worry about that GOOD CALL ever again instead of being a dangerous player that could injure another player through negligence.
Considering the 1st concern of the Umpire is the SAFETY of CHILDREN it is clearly YOU that is "trippin'" and there is video evidence to prove it.
Overly protective calls on the 2 and 3 bats by this player. He clearly swings through and drops the bat. Umpire was making a point to make a point.
No, the bat clearly makes contact with the catcher
The point is that you should not be dropping the bat behind you and potentially hitting the catcher or umpire. Everyone who has ever played baseball knows you're not supposed to do that. You're taught from a very young age to drop it on your way to first out of play, you can't just drop it behind you or God forbid fling it willy-nilly. This kid is an idiot quite frankly for not understanding this after a warning and an out!
Leading to the batter learning to drop the bat directly down in front of the catcher creating another dangerous
situation for the catcher, umpire and any runner that may be coming home. I have seen this happen !
A catcher can then kick the bat out of the way though...
Catchers are taught to kick the bat out of their playing area. Simple.
Always teach your players to take two steps before the let go of the bat. Do it on every batting practice until it is habit. This will ensure that this never happens to your team.
100% agree with protecting the catchers from carelessly thrown bats, but that wasn't thrown. It looked like he just dropped it, and the end of happened to hit the catcher's foot. I think this one was a bad call.
I’m an umpire and I have seen my fair share of kids throwing the bat. I actually give each player one warning since its normally 1 player. I tell him what he did and he is allowed to continue on the bases. After that warning he normally drops the bat or if he throws the bat he takes a second to throw it where the catcher does not get hit by it or the player in the on deck circle. I have never called someone out for throwing the bat where there was no one. I actually seen a kid take a few steps down the first base line and throw the bat at the fenced dugout so no one gets hurt from the thrown bat.
I appreciate your videos! First of all it should be a delayed dead ball. If it is a first occurrence it is just a warning and the umpire should only eject a player if is deemed INTENTIONAL. The last play the hitter did not throw his bat and it should not have been called.
It was an automatic out when my son played. They learned young.
I have always explained to parents that the hitter is responsible for his equipment until the end of the play. Anything that the player has control over (minus a broken wood bat or similar) that may impede the play or have the opportunity to hurt another player is grounds for an out and or possible ejection.
The last one didn't seem worth calling anything over. He finishes his swing with the bat behind him and releases it fairly gently. If it had velocity (or had been flipped), then it was worth noting, but that's a very reasonable drop of a bat from anyone. The first 2 seemed much more likely to be a bad habit that needed to be broken. The kid obviously got the message.
The bat didnt fly anywhere because it hit the catcher and lost momentum.
@@David-lz1rk did you watch this video on a 1 inch screen? he clearly just dropped it the last 2 times. the bat is not being thrown at all. It did land on his foot but that is not a reason to call him out for
Player definitely needed a talk / warning after the first one but the second and third at bat looks like he dropped it the same way virtually all batters do. Wish there was a better angle but it looked like he dropped the bat and the catcher pointed at for no reason. Wonder if he was doing it just to bait the ump into making the wrong call.
I started throwing my hat at the catchers out of nowhere. I don’t know how I started doing it but every time I did it, I would be called out
I had the same problem. It was like being so locked in after getting a hit, I would forget about everything else.
When I was playing, throwing equipment was an ejection but it was up to the discretion of the umpire what constituted "throwing".
BTW, no such thing as a 2nd warning. If warned for an issue and done again, player or coach is ejected from the game.
I know this video is a couple years old, but after working a game this weekend and having this issue come up in one of the games i worked the plate i wanted to see what was on video in this situation. I had a kid in a 12u game first time up hit a ball let go of the bat and not only went to the backstop it went over my left shoulder to the backstop. The player grounded out in this case for the 3rd out of the inning. During the change over i spoke to the coach and told him what happened and warned him if this happened again it could result in the player being removed from the game. I know he talked to the kid as i witnessed and heard him ( even told the kid to carry the bat along the line and drop after a few steps ) well next at bat he hit a fly ball and i can't tell you if it was caught or not but i called him out and ejected him after i got up from the ground. When he let go of the bat it hit me in the left ear hole of my helmet so hard it cracked my helmet as well. I hate to think would have happened if i had a regular mask on. This cost me the rest of the weekend since the medics on site refused to let me go back on the field. I'm not worried about the money ( they paid me regardless for remaining games I was scheduled ) I just love being on the field. The coach was in agreement that his player should be ejected from the game, and i have to give this coach the utmost respect because he took this kid after the game was over into a batting cage and had him hitting pitches and dropping the bat this was a first for me to witness something like this in 36 years.
He ended with the bat in his left hand then drops it
Who here played baseball and had a bad habit of throwing and tossing the bat after making some good contact? I used to be that way when I used to play. I accidentally nailed the catcher twice. But after that incident, I just adapted to just drop the bat after hitting the ball to avoid serious injury to not just the opposing catcher but to the other players as well.
Yup, had the same problem. It’s hard to adapt because you are so distracted when you get the hit, but it’s important for everyone’s safety.
The second two battings where not thrown, the catcher stepped in and needs to give some room. Nonsense call.
Thank you so much for making a video the doesn't immediately bash the umpire and addressing all points!
I used to throw my bat like that as a kid. It wasnt intentional. Its just the excitement of hitting the ball.
I had the same problem. Got mad about being called out. I know it was the right call now.
We have had umps like that, highly respected and equally ruled both teams. Have to say, at the last at bat it looked like a clean drop to me........
As an umpire, you first warn the player and the coach and let them know that if they throw the bat unintentionally they will be called out. Some umpires I know would have first warned the player then would have tossed them because it became a safety issue. What happens if that player tossed the bat and broke the catcher’s finger? As far as I’m concerned, the umpire did everything right.
No code allows for calling an out.
@@alexanderplumb447 You can't call an out. There is no support in the rules to do that. We are not allowed to make things up.
@@RyanRobbins007 OK... Eject the batter for dangerous play, after the first warning!
@@RyanRobbins007 no code necessary to throw some one out after an ump tells a player to stop something he seems dangerous. Umps can throw a parent out of the stands or in mlb umps can throw fans who ever they want. The only thing that could be argued is not being suspended the next game which I believe they say happens if a player is tossed.
In 13U I had a buddy who went a solid month of letting the bat fly out of his hands. He wasn’t sure why he was doing it, as he never had before. He the became very self conscious about it and hit a small slump. Well it came tournament time and he knew we needed him to preform well. This one game he was crushing the ball but kept throwing the bat. The ump warned him that if he does it again he’s gone. Well, he hit an absolute bomb, but threw the bat. The ump let it go, said absolutely last warning. He then got ejected next at bat. And same thing happened the next game. Then all of the sudden it stopped. He wasn’t sure if his batting gloves were bad, or what the heck was going on! He’s an honest guy, definitely wasn’t intentional. Just kept slipping out of his hands.
The third time he just dropped it. He didn’t hit the catcher. I would like to see some of the other batters and see how they get rid of the bats.
There is no rule in OBR about penalties for throwing a bat--even if it hits the batter.
Unless it interferes with the catcher making a play.
That said many youth leagues have in house rules about this, but that is something that has to be discusses at the pre-game.
the first one was thrown but the next times you can tell he made a conscious effort not to throw it and he is like 12 i will let that go.
So because of age they shouldn't learn how to follow rules? Glad you're not that umpire.
@@Icewarrior101 On the last 2 at bats the batter DID follow the rules, and dropped the bat. The out calls were ridiculous.
Corby Gilmore fr
@@direcorbie No, he really didn't. You can't drop the bat and hit the catcher with it. How are you guys not getting this? It doesn't have to be a full on throw of the bat. He drops it behind him and hits the catcher. It's really that simple.
I played little league circa 1979-80 and I used to throw the bat but then I grew out of it after a couple of games. Really miss my childhood!! 😞😞
The second and third was just a drop
Hello folks as a umpire,a few years back I happen to check on the thrown bat rule,came across a little league non rule but suggestions that the batter who throws the bat will be benched if he does it again no out but he is skipped over, I have done it and it seems to work as a fair solution, coaches teaching your batter by him shadow batting swing drop the bat,swing drop the bat hope they learn...
I used to throw the bat, and it was always on accident. Let the kids learn
I as umpire bring the player and coach on the first and warn. Safety issue any other time batter is out
It is easy to see a player that understands and has been taught the game properly will lose his bat down the 1st base line, or just in front of the plate for a rh hitter. Two great examples are Trout (RHH) and Rizzo (LHH).
I've watched all your videos; your team plays a high level of baseball. I'm shocked that throwing the bat is still a thing. The first throw was bad, but the others were weak calls.
We don't have a throwing the bat rule in my league. If I were umping, I'd warn both coaches, then call the him out on the 2nd offense, and eject on the third.
What rule do you have that supports you calling him out?
@@juanbustos1052 there isn't. But the Umpire can enforce for safety of the game.
@@Erikpaul which would be an ejection not an out.
I caught. I learned I can say a lot to the home plate ump as long as I don’t turn around. As a coach I also learned when I call time to visit my pitcher, I can wait for the ump to come to the mound and make comments to him while facing my players. Never drop the f-bomb or say “you” and you will be OK; maybe.
10000% right call. Should’ve tossed the kid after the 2nd time, at least according to the rules that my league plays under.
Good work by the umpire. The bat throwing, from this player, has more to do with the type of swing than anything else. It does not seem intentional. However, if the bat strikes the catcher, the batter is not only out, but ejected. I give this ump credit, for not throwing him out of the game, but discussing why he was called out. Give the kids a chance to learn.
Back in my day (70's), I once threw my bat at a pitcher who had beaned me. Hey, if Bert Campaneris could do it, why not me. Thankfully, I didn't get thrown out of the game, but got a stern speaking to by the ump. A year later, he was behind the plate, when I got beaned again. First words out of his mouth? "Do not throw that bat!" I didn't, but I sure wanted to. Thanks for sharing this video. It is very good, as all your vids are, and helped me remember some fond memories.
That was a BS call from my point of view. The batter clearly didn't throw or attempt to hit the catcher at any point during that at bat.
Just like a hockey player is responsible for their stick, a batter is responsible for the bat. Especially in a child's game, safety should be first and safety is no accident.
By rule any contact, including the bat, constitutes battery interference.
When I was in school I was always slow switching from one movement to another. I used to carry the bat in both hands a few steps toward 1st base before I let go of it. To break that habit, I loosened my grip, resulting in my throwing the bat. I think I finally had to get it right by simply not starting to run until I'd dropped the bat.
I had my wrist broken playing little league when i was catching over a thrown bat. The first time should be a warning and the second time an ejection. If another player does it from the same team the team should be disqualified from play
I developed a habit of throwing the bat in 13U when we stepped up to the 90' diamonds. Not intentional; just trying to get to 1st as fast as possible on those infield grounders. I got yelled at by the ump and warned, and the next practice the coach had me running halfway down the basepath holding my bat after every hit. Cured me fast. Lol.
You do that twice in my league and you get ejected 😂
With 25 years of being a certified official, and doing a ton of this age group games, the ump was top shelf. He made the warning. The coach understood this is a flaw in the batters swing that has to be corrected. He warned, then called and called again. First, after the warning, at this age group, I would have followed the same path. Call him out and punish the unintentional act. Behind the plate at this age group, the last thing you want to do is to change the game. The second time he did it, I would have still make the same call. It was unintentional and did not cause any injury (that would be a different situation).
Fans that yell at the ump are the people that know the least about the game. Most are just fools that scream at every call that goes against their team. Behind the plate, I knew that one side of the stands will be yelling at me on a close call or the other side will be yelling at me. Ha.
I'm proud of the way the coaches handled this. Top shelf coaches that are teaching the game and sportsmanship. Those guys kept me behind the plate, running lead down the court or chasing down the play in the back field. .
Fans have to know that I've never met a ref that made a bad call on purpose. Not on the field, court or grid. Never. We make mistakes but that happens. Fans/parents, over 90 feet away can see the play clearly when the ref, 4 feet away, cant.
I just did HS and these games. Never for the money because there ain't none. But during the last couple of years I was getting ran to death because the younger guys just didn't want to put up with the crazy parents and the superintendents that would not remove fans because they were afraid of getting fired (trust me that's true).
I always told young guys that they are paid to take the heat. Let it fall off of you like rain. Tried to teach them to what you do to control the pace and how to not hear the crowd (BTW...that bs, we hear it all). Just the violent screaming of the parents (mothers are the worst followed by Dads that maybe played the game). I finally had enough. The association I was with was calling me every day begging me to call this game or that because they had no one or needed to fill out a crew where one has quit. No new guys were coming up. This is was me doing a full day at work and leaving from my job and driving a couple of hours to call. It was that bad then and worse now. All the umps were my age, old, and no young guys coming up so that knowledge of the game and rules are lost.
I say all of this so you can appreciate not only the outstanding way the plate acted and called but also how well the coaches handled it. Well done.
This is why we play the game and this is why us old guys put on the gear. The game and the kids
dont think its a rule BUT 9.01 c covers that !! blue can rule on anything not specifically in the rule book certainly unsafe for the catcher and umpire
I have called it a couple of times using that rule as my basis and backing it up with "player safety". I've had a few coaches "BARK'" at me for doing it, but most of them do understand that their batter could hurt someone with a bat like that.
One of my favorite umpire stories is about ME getting it with a bat on a batters backswing. High school game, 1992 or so, Kathleen High School vs. Lake Wales High School in Central Florida. Kathleen had a great big black boy who was an outstanding catcher. He came up to bat and I noticed that, when he swung at the ball, he had a very long looping swing that came pretty close to hitting the catcher in the back. I didn't say anything to him, probably should have. About the third or fourth inning, he comes up to bat with runners on second and third. The pitcher threw a pitch that had "meatball" all over it. About waist high, right over the heart of the plate. This kid hit a ROCKET to dead center field. Or at least that is what was told to me. When he hit it, the backswing came all the way around and hit me square in the middle of my back!! WHAM! It hit me so hard, I fell over on the catcher. I didn't see what happened, but my partner saw that it went over the fence and he saw that I was down. As he followed this kid around the bases, he was working his way toward me. As the kid rounded third base, I am just now getting up off the catcher who is laying on the plate. The kid just runs on by, touches the plate and heads to the dugout. The coach had come to me from third base and ask if I was okay. I wasn't hurt too bad, but I had a big bruise in the middle of my back the next day and was sore for 3 or 4 days. I didn't call him out or anything, but I did tell the coach that he really needed to coach that kid about controlling his bat. I was just glad that it hadn't hit me in the back of my head. Coach said that he had a bad habit with doing that and that he had tried to coach it out of him. The kid came out to catch and told me he was very sorry. No problem, we finished the game and I went home to put some ice on it. But, it was a very unforgettable experience because I remember seeing that kid again a few years later. I remembered his name because he was not only an outstanding baseball player, but a great football player who had made All State at linebacker. His name? Ray Lewis, who played for Miami in college and the Baltimore Ravens.
There is a rule that covers a thrown bat so 9.01c cannot be used. 6.05g covers interference for a thrown bat and lists the penalty. 9.01c can only be used if there is no rule that covers a specific point. In this case the rulebooks only recourse for throwing the bat is when it interferes with the fielder or catchers ability to make a play. Too many umpires use 9.01c incorrectly. It is not the magic rule that allow umpires to add to or remove from the rulebook. If even the most minute rule mentions a particular play 9.01c can no longer be used. Since rule 6.05g exists 9.01c cannot be used here.
dont think 6.o5 is clear enough for this issue
@@maxbosoxfan171 I agree, it doesn't cover enough of the same circumstances as the OP's post did. I think that 9.01c would be the best rule that would hold up in a protest.
@@maxbosoxfan171 By including this rule in the book they have said what is considered an illegal act. The rulebook is mostly a list of things you cant do. Since they said you cant throw a bat to interfere, they also indirectly said that if the thrown bat doesnt interfere with play that it is not an illegal act nor is there a penalty for doing so. The purpose of 9.01c is for some way out there off the wall occurance. The rules instruction manual put out by little league explicitly says that 9.01c cannot be used to make up rules for the sake of "safety." It also explicitly says that if the bat is thrown and it is not interference the only recourse the umpire can take is they can warn the player, the team, and the manager. After that you can suggest a substitution but the manager is not obligated nor can we eject the player. 9.01def cover what are ejectable offenses and throwing the bat is not one of them.
The first time he threw the bat, the other two he dropped the bat.
The first time yes he threw it 2-3 were clean especially number three
I was a catcher and as a hitter I was always taught to put the bat down outside baseline on the way to first night in front of the catcher they could hinder the play at home and someone could trip over the bat
Calling that kid out any time was ridiculous. The third time was especially ridiculous - he laid the bat down. If the guy making this video is typical of the adults who are in charge of youth baseball, then baseball is in trouble.
Also, my junior year of high school we were playing a cocky team. This one player in particular thought he was Gods gift to baseball (he honestly was not very good). We kept getting him out and out of anger, he hit a ball and carried the bat about a quarter of the way down the line, then flung it at our dugout. The dugout was probably a good 30 feet from the baseline, he absolutely chucked it at us. Still not sure what that was all about.
Each league adopts their own by-laws concerning this ordeal for the sake of safety. A little warning to the batter is all that is warranted, unless it was intentional. No need to go overboard with reactions and kids being called or tossed out by an over-zealous umpire. The umpire will receive a lot of praise and respect from the coaches, players and parents. And if the umpire has any aspirations to umpire in divisional, sectional, regional and/or LL World Series, this is the kind of character they look for.
This umpire, if I was a coach, would not umpire anymore of my games. He thinks he's bigger than the game.
Not sure why this popped up in my recommendations, but I think the umpire handled this as well as any could. He did the right thing and gave the warning and spoke to both the player and coach. After that warning, it's on the player to control the bat. Well done by this umpire and the coaching staff for keeping things in line and not losing it on the umpire.
There is NO rule that says the “batter is out when he throws the bat.” It’s a safety issue, and ejection is the only remedy. I did once have a case where the batter bunted and used both hands to chuck the bat into the catcher. I judged interference. That was obvious! Intent was there! But most of the time is warn then eject.
I have multiple observations on the situation(s)
1) smart catcher who slyly notices the opportunity to stifle an opposing star player.
2) a hitter who leaves the batters box correctly, most likely avoiding another infraction of stepping on the plate.
3) an umpire who cares, but needs to identify intentional impediment of the catcher.
4) coaches that respect complex situations.
5) a catcher that needs to learn how to protect himself by implementing better footwork(barring intent)
6) more inquiry of both coaches by the umpire between incidents
7) cordial players
8) surprisingly calm parents(could be much worse)
9) a batter that needs to over exaggerate instructions
I thought the calls needed more justification, and I would’ve handled it similarly yet different.
Thanks for the reply.
1. Probably correct on that one.
2. A hitter is only out when he steps on the plate at the time he makes contact with the ball (not all rule sets read the same here.) But stepping on the plate while running to first is not an infraction.
3. The umpire didn't call interference, as it wasn't. He called the batter out for failing to release the bat under control. Dropping it behind him onto the catcher is not "under control".
4. Yes
5. Not sure what that one means.
6. Might have helped, but we all knew what he was doing.
7. Yes, a team coached well makes a huge difference in this respect.
8. Yes, again, coaches attitude during a whole season rubs off on player and spectators.
9. Well, yes, but all 19 other batters in the game didn't have an issue with dropping the bat under control, but over exaggerating will help fix the muscle memory of doing it wrong for sure.
I would have, and have, handled it differently. Technically an out is not allowed here. In many rules sets, an ejection is all that is going to work if the player stays in the lineup and does the same thing a second time. (And the ejection doesn't remove the hit, just the player after the play is dead.) Had this umpire ejected, they would have lost that game as this was their best player and starting pitcher.
Dear MJH-Baseball I have been for a catch for many years starting at little league and now on my school's junior high team this happened to me once in liitle league but was a bit more severe the kid threw the bat after the he hit the ball and hit in the mask causing some damage to my mask and giving me ringing the ears. The umpire stop the game as soon as I went down(due to the hit) and threw the kid out of the game. I just thought you should know my story and how I feel about this topic
Did the kid do it intentionally? If not, I would have just told the batter to be more careful. Just like one would do if a pitcher throws a high and tight one to a batter. In your situation, now you know why catchers gear is called "the tools of ignorance." I use to catch, too, and got beat up behind that plate all the time. I just considered it part of playing the position.
@@davidhall2197 Sorry I should have given some more details. I had also pitched in that game(because all of our good pitchers were resting) and pitched 4 no hit innings. It probably didn't help that the umpire had made some questional calls which just angered the opposing team's coaches which in return angered the umpire. The kid and his father were known for having a bad temper when things were not going their way. So here we are bottom of the 6th my team is up 14-0 with one out the kid was up to bat and I believe the count was 1-2 next pitch he hit the ball then flung the bat and the umpire stopped the game and kicked him out finally we strike out thw last batter. And the game was over.
@@cjn.8968 Did he do it intentionally? Is he known for being a "dirty player"? These are the things I look at from an umpire's POV. I've seen it before in the 25+ years I have coached, managed and umpired, from T-ball all the way up to Adult hardball leagues. So many times I've defused a situation by keeping a level and low key profile. Even to the point that more than a few times, when trying to be respectful to a belligerent coach or manager, if I finally had to ask to to leave the field, the parents of that same team would applaud me. I wasn't looking for the applause, I just wanted the kids to stay calm and keep their heads in the game and have fun.
@@davidhall2197 Personal I don't believe he did it intentionally. But yes he was known for being a dirty player he was also a pitcher and he was known for hitting you intentionally if you got a really good hit the previous at bat
@@cjn.8968 Well, with that in mind, I would have tossed him....and his dad if he was the manager.
The umpire properly went by the book and did what he should've done. If anything, the coaches need to teach their players how to drop the bats safely after hitting the ball. That's a learning experience for both the coaches and players. I certainly commend the coaches for not screaming and going crazy at the umpire, the other team or the parents. They did exactly what they should've done, which was calmly discuss this among each other and calm the crowd. I would LOVE to have my kid(s) play baseball in this league if I lived there. If you've been warned to not throw your bat, then you best not throw your bat. There's VERY good reason to not do that. I was a catcher in little league back in the day, so I know what they're talking about. I may not have been a great hitter, but I did respect the other team's catcher by not throwing my bat when I swung. Thankfully, I didn't get hit by the other teams either. I did dread the possibility of getting hit. But fortunately, it never happened.
Warning for throwing the bat first time, then ejected.
Umpiring softball was my first job. We were trained to warn both teams after the first thrown bat, and the following ones are always outs, no matter the team. I think I only had to call one girl out out of dozens of warnings given.
The first ‘throw’ wasn’t in the direction of a player. No safety concern. Just a kid hustling to first. Ump just has an issue with thrown bats. And let it be known.
Second one wasn’t even thrown. He has a one handed follow through and the bat was laid on the catchers foot. Catcher looking for the out they couldn’t make points it out to the ump he knows is looking to make the call.
If he would’ve whacked the catcher in the glove arm while holding on to the bat on his one hand finish, would he still be out? Bat wasn’t thrown...
I hate thrown bats and wish it was an out when the catcher is hit but this ain’t ‘it’
You don't wait until he hits someone to issue a warning
As a former umpire I usually gave a batter a warning as well as letting the coach also know his player has been warn. If it happens again I would call any player out who through the bat. I would have told both coaches to coach up their players and warn them that the third time a member of either team slings the bat will be thrown out of the game. I understand at times it was simply an accident but whether it was or not it is a dangerous situation for other players, coaches, and of course the Umpire.
I love getting ejected for a normal backswing
perhaps the way i was taught ball when i was growing up was a bit more strict than these days...
they were very strict about what a batter did with the bat...
a thrown bat was an automatic out, or an ejection if done in anger, a thrown bat that hit a player was an automatic ejection
I don’t understand your fondness for this umpire. He doesn’t know the rules. That is not a rule in any rule book. He is not a good umpire.
He is a good ump you just never read the rule book
When I young my sister was hit by a bat that was thrown. She was sent to the hospital where she need surgery, she was hit in the head and almost died. Its my opinion this is a seriously bad habit and needs to be addressed no matter how unintentional it may be, It is a sport and we need to make it safe for all young players. Be safe and have fun.
2nd and 3rd times were not "thrown bats". Geeze. He has a one handed follow through and literally drops the bat straight to the ground after his swing....and the kid playing catcher was sure quick to point out hey the bat is here he should be out. Bad umping IMO...and kinda bad sportsmanship from the catcher.
yep
The catcher was hit by the bat. That's all that matters. It's unbelievable how many people are watching baseball videos who know nothing about the sport. You can't drop your bat on the catcher. It doesn't matter whether or not he threw it. Get your head out of your ass.
I played youth baseball for 9 years , shortstop and pitcher and was among the best hitters. Nobody threw bats, like they must of been taught that once they get contact with the ball to follow threw and release the bat for an extra second to get to base. It’s not hard it hit the ball and then just drop the bat , might cost you a half a second , they’re coach had to teach them make contact , follow threw And release snd run so they can run immediately.
Rule,. Throw it then next one ejected. NFHS
I was a catcher in the semifinals of a tournament when I was 9. We were winning by 4 in the 4th inning (of 5), 2 outs. Batter hit a dribbler a few feet in front of the plate. I hop up to get it, batter carried the bat down the line with him for about 10 feet, then threw it back. It broke the index finger on my throwing hand causing me to exit the game. Batter was not called out and we ended up losing by 3.
"My" catcher indicates bias. It's not a good thing.
Thats ridiculous. "My" catcher is the only thing keeping the ball from hitting me. He is protecting me, so you better dam well believe Im going to protect him. Same goes for the other teams catcher. You will understand the first time you dont protect them and they "accidently let a throat high fast ball go right by and nail you.
The catcher on both teams is "my" catcher. Pretty common for umpires to speak that way.
I umpired adults down to kids for 17 years. Yes, the kids would throw the bat. And I did what this ump did, warning (I would call the coach out onto the field so they heard me as well) then called a dead ball out on the second offense. If someone ever asked me, where in the rule book does it give that rule, I would tell them 9.01(c). Go look it up!
9.01(c) allows you to rule on matters not covered by the rule book. Most rule codes have a specific provision for a thrown bat.
Im not trying to brag but i got informed that i got picked top 10 in state and top 50 in country. That is as a catcher
Well, seems you ARE trying to brag. Take a nap.
This is not "throwing the bat". Absolutely ridiculous. He laid the bat down on the last two at bats? He consciously modified his post swing actions after the ump warned him on the first.
The last two calls were BS.
One thing this umpire in the first clip did, is to stop the play he called he called time instead of "DEAD BALL". He also technically did go by the rulebook, Rule 9.01(c) Allows umpires to adress a situation that is not written in the rulebook. I love how to coaches handled it though.
As a Softball catcher it is scary when batters throw the bat . I love umpires that talk when some one hits well even if it is the other team. Or jokes around a little while my pitcher is warming up.
It seemed to me like the batter couldn't make a full swing without hitting the catcher. Notice no marked batters box. Another angle we might see it different.
The umpire was fooled by catcher's acting...good on the catcher if you can get the best player on the other team thrown out, the batter does have a long follow through and the catcher just steps into it and then whines to the umpire again pretty smart if you call goes your way. One the first one I would have definitely given the warning.
I’m an umpire and the ruling for this is the 1st time they throw the bat is a warning for the team, and the 2nd time the batter is called out, and if it’s a hit on the 2nd time they throw it all runners most go back to there bases
Under what rulebook? Not LL, NFHS, or ORB...