Phoenix was never really that bad. He was just outclassed by many agents but more specifically Kayo. He has 3 abilities that are like watered down version of Kayo and his wall is just like a Harbor/Neon wall but weaker. The reason his pickrate is so low is because those agents does the job better than him. If his wall actually got buffed to act more like a Harbor wall with a range maybe about half of Harbor's that he can also choose to deploy fast like a Neon wall(basically give him an option) and buff his options when it comes to flashing corners, like giving him the option to flash diagonally downwards or upwards, he might just carve enough of a niche for himself. A flashing duelist that can act as a secondary line-type controller.
You should be able to curve his Molly throw like a Jett smoke. You can curve his wall. His blind is literally called curveball. It’s on brand for him. It would be unique to the other mollies in the game, and it would be a slight buff to him.
I agree! Phoenix's ult is really good because it is every entry fragger's dream and especially its relatively cheap too. Having a insane mechanical aimer on a Phoenix that gets 1-2 kills, 1-2 orbs and dies every round in a map where ATK side gets free orb, gets his ult really really quick (like 2-3 rounds if nothing too crazy happen). The only thing making him bad is that he can't create space by himself without ult so he would often get paired with Astra, Kay/o, and a second entry player to compensate his weak phase.
In solo q I HATE playing vs phoenix. It’s relatively easy to make the flash near undodgeable, he gets heals, and a good phoenix will get ult every 2-3 rounds.
I do think there is an opportunity cost to farming both orbs on the map every round. You typically have to devote additional utility to taking the orb that could otherwise be used to take an objective. Plus it bleeds a significant amount of time off the clock, so there is also some risk. Which map you are playing makes a difference. So in the case of other characters that have more expensive ultimates, its possible pro teams have just decided the risk out ways the reward considering you have a 6 point ulimate up every 2-3 rounds potentially but a 7 or 8 costing ultimate probably averages 3-4 rounds employing the same strategy. If you use the same strat 3 times in a row vs 2 times in a row, you also have to assume the opponent will try and make the read and punish you for it. It starts to become perhaps a little too predictable. As for other 6 costing ultimates, I just don't think Cypher, Reyna and Skye ults have enough value in order to make it worth you while. However, this could definitely be possible on Yoru, and you could even cut the rotation time down significantly with a well placed TP point. You could also selectively employ the strat when you are close to someone elses ultimate which is something pro teams have done on any number of occasions in the past. I can't really test in pubs and ranked matches sadly. Its hard enough getting players on the same page just holding defaults. I just have to assume that various pros have tried it on other characters and decided that it doesn't work for other characters.
I'm loving the performances of a lot of European T2 teams, they're really creative and reminds me of how C9 yay said that European T2 teams are really good to scrim against. Also, hoping to see Enzo play again, he was wild in Fnatic last year and I was disappointed that he was dropped! Edit: correction
Saw the game and i think sova players should figure out lineups for the ult orb and behind the ramp. Cause if they get this down, it should get harder for teams to farm the orb
I’m a phoenix one trick currently and I find his wall to be very useful. I use it to peak a single angle at a time of to get to ratty places (like on B site pearl). I don’t think the ability is so bad if u know how to use it.
I think he means its bad compared to kayos knife, or if he doesnt mean that, its a good point for why phoenix isnt picked over kayo. Its like any other duelist util, maybe a bit underwhelming, fair, but it doesnt put him anywhere near kayo
7:34 Honestly, 100% agreed. In bothers me in ranked as well, I farm orbs as much as possible but sometimes I already have ult and I see teammates never go for the orb, even if we have full control of that spot. The only time I see people consistently take orb is we wait outside a site where the entrance is smoked and no one wants to push
Good points made on Phoenix OFFENSIVELY. But to add to the "Changing Meta of Pearl" and you're last video on the loss of Chamber, Yoru should be a solid pick to hold down B Long like before. Phoenix is good for Offense, while Yoru is good for Defense. He can play on B Long with Op and just TP out like Chamber.
i think itd be a great QOL buff for Phoenix's wall for it to actually be useful and not just to heal him is to make it longer (maybe half of harbors wall) and make it go through walls
Just make it not damage teammates so you dont have to worry about when you use it, it's not bad as an entry tool its just grief that it does team damage. Then it would be a weaker, but cheaper, neon wall
I always emphasize the importance of farming ult orbs on specific agents over others. Kay/O. Phoenix. KJ. Viper. Breach. Farming orbs on someone like Jett, Reyna, Raze, not entirely important in my opinion.
I think, in my experience playing against Phoenix'es. If you master Phoenix and have the capabilities to be him; you can outplay and frag very easily and get a kill per round. So in my opinion Phoenix isn't bad but isn't just a teamplay agent. And we all think that agents should help the team always, but sometimes you help to kill.
idk I just think they need to buff the wall so it's longer, if neon's wall can span half a map, why can't phoenix's me at least the length of a site? you just see how precise the wall needs to be placed and it still ends up with a gap at the end. if they make the wall longer I think it'll do good for phoenix' pickrate
Also Kayo's molly is probably better than Phoenix's. Yes, Phoenix can heal himself with his molly, but it has a limited distance. Therefore lineups are generally not as effective with his molly compared to Kayo's.
You can't call Blaze Wall useless, is anything but. It may not bring as much value as some other abilities, but it always brings consistent value on most maps. Zoning, flashing through it, you name it.
After watching this video I have no idea what is going to happen next. Is tomorrow’s video going to be titled ‘Why Reyna is the best agent on Fracture’?
I know how you can fix the Blaze wall make it a bit faster and give phoenix a little speed bost while he is touching the Fire like the stim speedboost😇
Why not buff his wall? Ex: make his wall disintegrate bullets: the weaker the bullet, the faster it disintegrates, meaning less damage when shooting through it with guns like frenzy and stinger compared to op, Odin, vandal. Or just make it disintegrate bullets entirely
Pheonix’s flashes are probably the strongest flashes in the game, but flashbangs from any agent are already good anyway, so the one of like two things he has going for him isn’t enough to redeem him As for his ult, just because the rest of his kit is so lackluster in general, I guess pros just decide that his ult is where value can be regularly gained, being pretty decent and costing 6. With such a cheap, accessible ult maybe it just feels more easier and sensible to farm orbs?
I think he's a great solo q agent. The thing I feel I don't see enough is you can force pop flashes in awkward place with your wall. also the wall last long enough to defuse which again you can flash out of if you hear them running up
I think he just tried to show that Phoenix can be decent if you play him alongside KAYO But I agree that this farming-2-ult-orbs-for-the-same-agent-in-the-same-round tactic would not work against a top tier team because they would contest these orbs in a much better way through utility battle, even if they only have sheriffs
I might be smoking crack but phoenix has the best flash in the game right now sure you will blind yourself and your team 70% of the time but like it's pretty much impossible to dodge and thars because you need good positioning to throw a good flash which is also a down side
Hello, I like your videos, just PLEASE: Could you watch the video on some other video player? Seeing the UA-cam interface when watching it via UA-cam is hella confusing. Thanks :)
When will tmv make a video on harbor? I just loved it when the devs said they didn’t want to buff harbor since we don’t know how to play him. Not even the pros are playing him lol. Such a bad new agent
@@anshmittal3098 yea I think I saw something about him playing harbor in a valorant ad. Can u tell me his channel name? Sad to see the new agent not being played at all
Will Valorant ever be good? No replay system, an RNG hit detection, still smurfs at large, shady ingame marketing startegies. Just to name a few. Guess it really hammers down the quote "If its free, you're the product."
I can't believe that the day has come where TMV praises Phoenix
It's not Reyna, the world is still in order
Next.... Reyna
Phoenix was never really that bad. He was just outclassed by many agents but more specifically Kayo.
He has 3 abilities that are like watered down version of Kayo and his wall is just like a Harbor/Neon wall but weaker. The reason his pickrate is so low is because those agents does the job better than him.
If his wall actually got buffed to act more like a Harbor wall with a range maybe about half of Harbor's that he can also choose to deploy fast like a Neon wall(basically give him an option) and buff his options when it comes to flashing corners, like giving him the option to flash diagonally downwards or upwards, he might just carve enough of a niche for himself.
A flashing duelist that can act as a secondary line-type controller.
@@thesilvanalyst6880 Reyna isn't that bad in icebox though. Since the chamber is no longer dominant, you can run a cheezy comp around reyna.
and the fact that phoemix wall lasts for the whole spike defuse is actually so underrated
You should be able to curve his Molly throw like a Jett smoke. You can curve his wall. His blind is literally called curveball. It’s on brand for him. It would be unique to the other mollies in the game, and it would be a slight buff to him.
riot hire this man
Phoenix would be the best post plant Molly agent lol. Lineup from anywhere
@@xxcridonxx7614 for a 4 second molly? I'm hedging my bets on Brimstone for that one.
@@xxcridonxx7614 it could keep the distance limit where it drops.
I agree! Phoenix's ult is really good because it is every entry fragger's dream and especially its relatively cheap too. Having a insane mechanical aimer on a Phoenix that gets 1-2 kills, 1-2 orbs and dies every round in a map where ATK side gets free orb, gets his ult really really quick (like 2-3 rounds if nothing too crazy happen). The only thing making him bad is that he can't create space by himself without ult so he would often get paired with Astra, Kay/o, and a second entry player to compensate his weak phase.
I always enjoy when he talks about the niche scenarios where yoru and phoneix get utilised in a interesting way in pro play hope to see more
Wow, Phoenix managed to get a better pickrate than Chamber, never thought i would see this happen
In solo q I HATE playing vs phoenix. It’s relatively easy to make the flash near undodgeable, he gets heals, and a good phoenix will get ult every 2-3 rounds.
Facts
Heals are kinda overrated. It's very rare for the health you regen to actually save you
I do think there is an opportunity cost to farming both orbs on the map every round. You typically have to devote additional utility to taking the orb that could otherwise be used to take an objective. Plus it bleeds a significant amount of time off the clock, so there is also some risk. Which map you are playing makes a difference. So in the case of other characters that have more expensive ultimates, its possible pro teams have just decided the risk out ways the reward considering you have a 6 point ulimate up every 2-3 rounds potentially but a 7 or 8 costing ultimate probably averages 3-4 rounds employing the same strategy. If you use the same strat 3 times in a row vs 2 times in a row, you also have to assume the opponent will try and make the read and punish you for it. It starts to become perhaps a little too predictable. As for other 6 costing ultimates, I just don't think Cypher, Reyna and Skye ults have enough value in order to make it worth you while. However, this could definitely be possible on Yoru, and you could even cut the rotation time down significantly with a well placed TP point. You could also selectively employ the strat when you are close to someone elses ultimate which is something pro teams have done on any number of occasions in the past.
I can't really test in pubs and ranked matches sadly. Its hard enough getting players on the same page just holding defaults. I just have to assume that various pros have tried it on other characters and decided that it doesn't work for other characters.
I'm loving the performances of a lot of European T2 teams, they're really creative and reminds me of how C9 yay said that European T2 teams are really good to scrim against. Also, hoping to see Enzo play again, he was wild in Fnatic last year and I was disappointed that he was dropped!
Edit: correction
Leo just joined Fnatic tho
Whaaat is he talking about
U mean enzo??
U mean Enzo or Mistic?
@@austinfull8941 corrected thanks
Phoenix on Lotus is goated fr I swear.
Are you going to do an "Introducing..." Series with NA VCT teams and go over their rosters, individual accolades, etc?
Even if he's much picked in Pro-play Phoenix is actually quite good in Ranked Play.
Saw the game and i think sova players should figure out lineups for the ult orb and behind the ramp. Cause if they get this down, it should get harder for teams to farm the orb
I’m a phoenix one trick currently and I find his wall to be very useful. I use it to peak a single angle at a time of to get to ratty places (like on B site pearl). I don’t think the ability is so bad if u know how to use it.
I think he means its bad compared to kayos knife, or if he doesnt mean that, its a good point for why phoenix isnt picked over kayo. Its like any other duelist util, maybe a bit underwhelming, fair, but it doesnt put him anywhere near kayo
@@bac0ntoast I see what ur saying. I just think the wall isn’t that bad. Def not the best but not the worst
7:34
Honestly, 100% agreed.
In bothers me in ranked as well, I farm orbs as much as possible but sometimes I already have ult and I see teammates never go for the orb, even if we have full control of that spot. The only time I see people consistently take orb is we wait outside a site where the entrance is smoked and no one wants to push
Good points made on Phoenix OFFENSIVELY. But to add to the "Changing Meta of Pearl" and you're last video on the loss of Chamber, Yoru should be a solid pick to hold down B Long like before. Phoenix is good for Offense, while Yoru is good for Defense. He can play on B Long with Op and just TP out like Chamber.
It’s definitely not a bad idea but the fact that he can’t tp instantly makes it very different to how chamber held down the site
i think itd be a great QOL buff for Phoenix's wall for it to actually be useful and not just to heal him is to make it longer (maybe half of harbors wall) and make it go through walls
Harbor is already bad enough and u want to butcher him more 💀
Just make it not damage teammates so you dont have to worry about when you use it, it's not bad as an entry tool its just grief that it does team damage. Then it would be a weaker, but cheaper, neon wall
STOP, you're enabling the pheonix mains that flash me in comp!!
Remember: if your Phoenix's gets an orb, a kill and dies each round. He will ult SIX TIMES in a half.
Spike plant
it would be four, cause if he gets a kill (1), an orb (2), and dies (3), if he does the same thing next round he gets ult, but is also dead.
@@NotShockX Bro if your Phoenix is the one planting you have a problem
I always emphasize the importance of farming ult orbs on specific agents over others. Kay/O. Phoenix. KJ. Viper. Breach. Farming orbs on someone like Jett, Reyna, Raze, not entirely important in my opinion.
I think, in my experience playing against Phoenix'es. If you master Phoenix and have the capabilities to be him; you can outplay and frag very easily and get a kill per round. So in my opinion Phoenix isn't bad but isn't just a teamplay agent. And we all think that agents should help the team always, but sometimes you help to kill.
I think that his Molly should have the controlled down that a fade eye/ web can do
Bro I saw that wall with phoenix potential as soon as the map came out.
idk I just think they need to buff the wall so it's longer, if neon's wall can span half a map, why can't phoenix's me at least the length of a site?
you just see how precise the wall needs to be placed and it still ends up with a gap at the end.
if they make the wall longer I think it'll do good for phoenix' pickrate
i love how the 'bonus' round has 10 vandals in it
(3:14)
Also Kayo's molly is probably better than Phoenix's. Yes, Phoenix can heal himself with his molly, but it has a limited distance. Therefore lineups are generally not as effective with his molly compared to Kayo's.
TMV You need to do a Top 20 of 2022 It would be great!
Pro's should start watching tmv
he is an analyst for acend so i’m sure pros are aware of him, they also have their own analysts and coaches
You can't call Blaze Wall useless, is anything but. It may not bring as much value as some other abilities, but it always brings consistent value on most maps. Zoning, flashing through it, you name it.
it’s not that useful in pro scene
Make phoenix wall and Molly come out on cast(remove pullout time)
Reyna has a higher pick rate than chamber but my friends still try to convince me he’s good, even tho I was the one who played chamber pre patch
If they allow phoenix to get out of his ult whenever he wants like yoru, he will be way better already ngl
Being a Phoenix main myself.. wish he would get another buff
After watching this video I have no idea what is going to happen next. Is tomorrow’s video going to be titled ‘Why Reyna is the best agent on Fracture’?
Phoenix is very pog
Do you think chamber needs a buff TMV?
I know how you can fix the Blaze wall make it a bit faster and give phoenix a little speed bost while he is touching the Fire like the stim speedboost😇
Why not buff his wall? Ex: make his wall disintegrate bullets: the weaker the bullet, the faster it disintegrates, meaning less damage when shooting through it with guns like frenzy and stinger compared to op, Odin, vandal. Or just make it disintegrate bullets entirely
Pheonix’s flashes are probably the strongest flashes in the game, but flashbangs from any agent are already good anyway, so the one of like two things he has going for him isn’t enough to redeem him
As for his ult, just because the rest of his kit is so lackluster in general, I guess pros just decide that his ult is where value can be regularly gained, being pretty decent and costing 6. With such a cheap, accessible ult maybe it just feels more easier and sensible to farm orbs?
pheonix wall should do some debuff to enemy because theu just swing th wall with little to no damage.
At least they take damage unlike what they did to Neon's wall...
phoenix to the top
phoenix is such a good agent hello 🤣
Apeks look really good already
He's good
I think he's a great solo q agent. The thing I feel I don't see enough is you can force pop flashes in awkward place with your wall. also the wall last long enough to defuse which again you can flash out of if you hear them running up
This is more of a video saying the apeks is just better.
I think he just tried to show that Phoenix can be decent if you play him alongside KAYO
But I agree that this farming-2-ult-orbs-for-the-same-agent-in-the-same-round tactic would not work against a top tier team because they would contest these orbs in a much better way through utility battle, even if they only have sheriffs
going out of this video's focused caracter, how the fuck is reyna having a slight better pickrate than chamber these days?
Poor pheonix 😔
I might be smoking crack but phoenix has the best flash in the game right now sure you will blind yourself and your team 70% of the time but like it's pretty much impossible to dodge and thars because you need good positioning to throw a good flash which is also a down side
"You know" Counter: 38
You said "You know" once every 16,47 seconds.
Hello, I like your videos, just PLEASE: Could you watch the video on some other video player? Seeing the UA-cam interface when watching it via UA-cam is hella confusing. Thanks :)
Waiting for him to praise Reyna
In short Phoenix is power crept by better agents
When will tmv make a video on harbor? I just loved it when the devs said they didn’t want to buff harbor since we don’t know how to play him. Not even the pros are playing him lol. Such a bad new agent
Their is one yt who is playing him as main
Ludilue is his name
He use harbour abilities i very interesting manner
@@anshmittal3098 yea I think I saw something about him playing harbor in a valorant ad. Can u tell me his channel name? Sad to see the new agent not being played at all
u really put the fireboy under water and he is good?
Phoenix needs 2 walls imo
Yo that’s a really good idea.
But yoru is bad?
#123Fokus , wp from apeks
Just give him 2 walls lol
first
First! 😼😼
Will Valorant ever be good? No replay system, an RNG hit detection, still smurfs at large, shady ingame marketing startegies. Just to name a few. Guess it really hammers down the quote "If its free, you're the product."
valorant and league will never be great but here i am addicted to both