I remember when they came out. I thought it was just another fad. Then I was asked to pick up one for my niece for this Christmas. I was like, "They still *_make_* those?" 🤔
Finally, I can comment on this subject. Generally, I don't know what he is talking about, but find his voice and presentation very soothing. I'm an old(80) codger, and know nothing about electronics. However, in this case, I used to have an ionizer that we used in a bedroom. It was enclosed in a fake wood box and had a fan which blew out the ionized air into the room. It seemed to clear the air, but it was a bear to clean. The cleaning process was long and tedious, but never seemed to work. It finally became so covered in dust and grime, that it stopped working. So, finally, the village idiot can make a comment, even though I still don't have a clue what Clive is talking about. This is a red letter day in the Romine household!
Ha ha lovely, sir. I also have no idea about the electronics but I like his voice and comments! "One moment please" "oh my" "overengineered!" "well that's dangerous" etc. 🥰
@@philsmith5449 I especially like it when he says "be careful, the light is coming back on"". I am greatful that I'm not the only one who is lost throughout the whole video. Now I know there at least two of us. Maybe we should form a fan club.(wear same blazers, have a secrete handshake etc. We could use that tester thing he uses as the club emblem.)😆 Have a HAPPY NEW YEARS
Ionizers are facinating! I love it when I see another ionizer video from you! Keep 'em coming! Thanks for all you share, helps me keep more things going and out of the landfill! 🤓
When I see these ionisers, I always think back to school in the mid 90's, in the metal and welding workshop we had a very expensive central fume extraction with a flexible arm on each workbench with an air valve. This air valve only opened as soon as welding was started, and worked with a current clamp around the mass cable of the welding station. This fume extractor also had air recirculation to reduce heat loss in winter, and had 4 or 5 mega-sized (approx 60 by 60cm) electrostatic filters stacked on top of each other, each filter look like the construction of a electric fly swatter. Several times a week these filters had attracted so much fine dust that arcing occurred, and with every spark (clearly audible) a cloud of dust was released (including the smell) and this was blown into the workshop. Often had a headache afterwards, but then always thought that this was from the welding smell, while it must have been more likely from the ozone, which was blown into the workshop at high volume.
🫢⚠️ - that should have been permanently vented to the outside with heat recovery for the make-up air. Sounded dangerous with it arcing and spewing dust back into the workshop 😶🌫️😷, now those have HEPA + carbon filters that are regularly replaced
@@samuelfellows6923 , yeah, everytime we hear it sparking , a cloud of brown dust was blew out. These filters where made that they lost there static charge and the dust was collected at the bottom in the central fume extractor during the maitenance mode, but they lost there charge dus massive dust buildup during working mode. A real design flaw, while this was a installation that costed 5 digits back in those days.
If Clive doesn't make videos on the topic he likes so much, making videos does him less joy in general. Which isn't good for us, the viewers. Also, one *has to appreciate* ionizers, they are very interesting and important in our life.
Wow, didn't know that this concept's that old! But it gives me hope, since this is another run of the mill technology, that won't change too much once I learn it now! 😊
I actually don't mind the ionizer videos. I watch you to learn about reverse engineering circuits, at which you seem to be very good at doing. So keep on doing what you're doing, I'll still watch.
I'm still hoping he will get to ionizing hair dryers. These are now in the third generation and the manufacturers now not just claim to reduce electric charges in the hair but they claim to transfer water ions into the hair to prevent overdrying.
I wonder how much a 240v rated toggle push button switch would cost? Possibly more than the BOM on the control side of that circuit. A sheet of paper with a hole cut in it, placed around the socket and blue-tacked to the back of the ionizer will catch most of the crud and save your wall.
The black ioniser has been around for a long while (or, rather, a similar casing design). Bought one of those from a Help the Aged shop in the late 70's to help deal with an "odour problem" in the rather ghastly student accommodation in which I was living. Very much pre carbon-fibre emitters - mine had ordinary sharp-point needle emitters, and worked "reasonably well" if left running continuously.
@@Eduardo_Espinoza Ozone's a potent oxidiser - it'll oxidise most smaller organic molecules (and they were probably the cause!) This is the reason for ozone generators being used to remove the pong when someone has an unwitnessed death - they are VERY good for that purpose (and same goes for Mortuaries too!)
6:58 You can recover these carbon wires also from (old) sparkplug cables. In sparkplug cables are these carbon fibers used as a resistor for EMI suppression to the onboard radio and electronics in the vehicle.
The high voltage diode with blue chevrons on one end (I assume, can't see it too well in the video) is very likely a 2CL77 20 kV 5 mA diode, it's one of the most common HV low current diodes you'll find today, I did a video a year ago crossing sectioning one to take a look at the silicon junction to find out how they get such a high breakdown voltage.
That reminds one of the old whiskey distiller's trick. Many different labels on the outside of the bottle, but the same whiskey on the inside. Some people will swear up and down that one label, from the same distiller, is better than another.
Double sided board is simple, cheapest board at a PCB house, as it is the most common board, and plated vias are free as it was likely made as part of a shared panel, using otherwise unused space on the larger panel. Worth it cost wise if you are willing to wait for delivery and you have a good stock of bare boards, but want the extra stock in a week or three ahead of production.
Nah Clive, if you wanna do ionizer videos, you do ionizer videos. I wish you'd bring back the blowing up small components videos that got me watching you so many years ago, but your channel has evolved and here I still am. I can't speak for your entire audience, but I'm here for the vibe, not the devices.
One reason for using a double-sided board even where all the tracks could go on one side is vibration resistance. With single-sided, vibration of components can cause lands to lift and lead to fractured tracks. With double-sided solder wicks up the plated through holes and the resultant fillet of solder stops the component moving down. Obviously this was designed for people whose mains sockets vibrate.
10:07 I think that flyback diode is there because you never know at what point in the cycle will the unit be turned OFF. It might be the case that the NPN is turned OFF when a fair amount of current is flowing in the inductor and the voltage is still not enough to trigger the SIDAC Thyristor.
you can smell ozone heavily after a storm in the air. Its also created heavily in forests during certain times of year. Here in my area when I bike through the woods in may and oct it will fill the air so much its like I was running an ozonator lol. Most probably dont even know what that smell is but since I own ozonators I knew right away. Natures way of purifying the area.
Indeed! I went to the woods the other day and hung my jacket to the wardrobe when I came home; hours later I passed it and could still smell the ozone near the jacket!
I wonder if it was actually ozone you were smelling. That said, ozone is created in nature by rain and foliage movement, and does seem to be more prominent when the air is loaded with pollen, spores and natural plant oils. It seems to be how nature keeps the air quality in check.
@@bigclivedotcom I have no way of knowing, could be OH-radicals?! It smells much like the ozone produced by my angry germicidal lamp (25W) that I bought because of your videos on the topic =) So cheers and a happy 2023!
I'm so glad I stumbled on your channel, my dad was an electrician (underground mine) and was all about things that ran on bitty motors, he would have really enjoyed watching you. I subbed to try and learn something from your expertise plus, the accent is badass. Peace.
The XO4 smd part comes out of the SMD finder as a 30v Zenner in a SOD-323 package, these things can be a bit hit and miss though....Happy New Year !....cheers.
Ionizers were all the rage when I started work in the 70s. We made many Cockcroft Walton units, using sharp Stellite cable-form nails as electrodes. I recall that the points became blunt quite quickly. The units certainly made a black mess on a wall.
I'm sure I've heard of people in the model railway scene using these but modified as static grass applicators. The branded ones are very expensive and these little Ionisers make an inexpensive substitute.
Another one with quite some "compromises" on safety. Something like JST-size connector for mains, 1M smd resistor for isolation etc. (smd resistors often have breakdown voltage of say 200V or so, a far cry from making it safe to touch). Especially if you ground the other end (say by a person), there are kilovolts on 1M resistor to help breakdown and after that is can stay more conductive. If that was neutral side it could be more safe but in a non-polarized plug it can be live as well.
To measure the voltage you could use the high voltage fluke 80k-40 probe for DMMs or the Chinese clones, those probes have an input resistance of 1GOhm.
Years ago there was for sale pyramid shaped ionizers, probably going for the "Ultimate Crossover". Hey look folks " Ions & a Pyramid " its gotta be extra good.
I was thinking... What if you had a big grounded plate around the ionizer's output? Would that collect dust only on the plate instead of other things around it? Then you could just have something like a paper cover that you could remove and replace instead of needing to wipe up dirt...
Unfortunately lots of people (more every day it seems) can't deal with anything that's not either "good" or "bad" (or left or right or red or blue...) That ozone is beneficial in small amounts and harmful in large amounts is a concept that's just too complex for them to comprehend.
The printing shop I used to work at many years ago bought a bunch of fairly large ionizers to help with plant air quality. They also hacked furnace type air filters on the intake side because the filthy air was caking onto the ionizing plates in a day or two. Even when new, you could not tell the ionizers were doing anything, the air was so nasty in there. I was usually the one to take the filthy plate modules out of all the units and use compressed air to blow them off in the parking lot. Wasn't my job, but anything to get the air somewhat cleaner. OSHA safety rules would not allow the company to vent bad air outside to improve indoor air because the air was too filthy and chemically enhanced to vent safely. (Might poison the locals.) But those inside? Let them suffer.
I am very lucky. You take apart all the stuff that I am interested in. If anyone is not interested in LEDs and High voltage, they are not interesting people.
The microntroller thing makes me wonder if they have a quota of how many they have to use in products, or if they just have so many in backstop they have to use them any way they can. Either way, there must be ways to repurpose them in meaningful uses. Determining pinouts and how to program them would be challenging though. Not that I have any ideas on reusing them but it seems such a waste.
@@chaos.corner Yes, the cheapest are one time programmable but offer various timers, ADC and DAC etc . But not much more (10c or under) are reprogrammable , even offering multi-threading
@@prk55 True. But they're shaving pennies so probably best not to expect too much for this application. Also, it can be hard to get hold of the programming tools as Dave from the aforementioned eevblog found out.
A 10 cent PIC clone from Fremont Micro Devices could be justified if that transistor is also chopping current to stimulate the tank circuit. That might explain the extra spice, the small transformer, and the SMPS-like transformer primary network. Perhaps Clive might stick a scope on the base and see if there's a bit more going on than meets the eye.
I doubt the white connector is rated for mains use with all the expected transients and surges. Also there's no slot between PCB pads, even though it looks like it's required for creepage distance, and no input fuse.
The odd design of the double sided circuit board is most likely because it was computer generated. As long as it works in the footprint they require they don't really care if it's odd or not. If this is getting made cheaply, in bulk, sold to multiple companies, and they did it at EXACTLY the right time to get huge adoption in cheap chineezy products, that's a successful design to a Chinese businessman. Timing is everything - they know if it's very successful it will get copied ad nauseum, so there's no time to make hay like when the sun is shining. Kudos to that businessman for employing an EE who actually knew what he was doing rather than cobbling together some PD design that only kind of works, or just potting a capacitor in resin and calling it "good".
Oh, I don't know, Clive, I find these Ionisers quite interesting. I have no idea why, I just do, so don't worry about making more videos about them. I don't pretend to know exactly how these things work, but I do see similarities between them, and vintage TV line output circuits - cruder, but similar, and they didn't half extract the crap out of the air, especially in the days when homes we heated by coal fires. I remember seeing wads of soot in the back of some sets, so much so that it was often difficult to see the actual line output transformer. I can still remember that familiar smell of ozone that we used to get, especially on damp days, or if mum was cooking in the kitchen, or on washing days when everything felt just a bit damp. Just a bit ironic really, that we do away with existing devices that generate ozone, and ionise the air as a byproduct, and then go out and buy electronic devices to specifically replicate that byproduct.
It would be funny if they'd used the same flashlight/torch program in the microcontroller so some combination of long presses on the button could let it flash or SOS the ionizer circuit.
Put nine 10-meg half-watt resistors in series with your +VE multi-meter probe (assuming your multi-meter is 10 megohm) and set your multi-meter to the 200 voltage range. Now you have a 100 Meg Impedance multi-meter to measure high impedance, high voltage low current voltage sources. You just multiply the multi-meter reading by 10 to get the true high voltage reading, measuring up to 2000 volts. Add more resistors and change the multiplication factor for higher voltage readings.
I heard that a certain coffee grinder includes an ionizer to help prevent the grounds from flying up and sticking to everything. I wonder about the efficacy of adding something like this to my existing coffee grinder...
I ended up going down a rabbit hole some time ago on the broad subject of Soviet medicine and hospital equipment after finding out about a fascinating machine called the Hunter Metatron device. Whilst going down this rabbit hole I discovered what I would describe as a sort of ionising chandelier that were hung at strategic points in hospitals. The thought behind them being that they would stop airborne bacteria from spreading from area to area. According to their (probably somewhat leant on) experts of the day, they did have a positive effect but, I'd like to see some more modern unbiased test results on such things... I also have a lot of time on my hands 😆
@@bigclivedotcom aha, now that rings a bell. Yes. Or, perhaps да. I just watched the video in the link suggested by another channel user and that is an absolutely fantastic project. I home educate my 2 children and I'm just introducing them to electronics so I'd love to build something like that with them. Thank you for all the knowledge you share, it's invaluable. Especially for those of us trying to impart knowledge to young ones
The high voltage diode might explain some components I bought a long time ago I've been unable to identify. Unfortunately, the markings are unreadable. They didn't test as a diode though so I'm not sure.
@@bigclivedotcom That would make sense. I believe I bought them as part of a timed short-exposure photography project (bullets in flight and such) that I never got around to.
They thought the smell was ozone, but it turns out it may just have been the smell of organic matter in the water. But I would have thought that crashing waves could generate electrostatic effects.
It forms after an electrical discharge from a storm. I used ozone in my research and used to generate it that way. Breathed it once yes smells like the beach I ended up in the student health center.
Do you think something like this would be good inside an HVAC intake vent or perhaps in an outlet directly under the main intake? Our main HVAC is on a ceiling but there is an outlet in the corner small hallway. I've also heard just cheapo filters for HVAC are better for your system than the "super duper 90 day ionized filter designed for pets dust allergens and the illness of the day" because more air goes thru them but the trade off is you have to change them on a strict schedule. There is a pretty significant price difference so I'm tempted to try the lesser ones. I usually wait for the vent to start showing signs of dust bunnies collecting on the vent before cleaning and changing it.
Question? There would need to be some modification of course, but could that be hacked into an electrolier for hydrogen production? Where would you place the return lead?
@@bigclivedotcom Pump it up. Hack it. Just curious, some electroliers exploit the H2O bent molecular configuration and cause the separation process solely using field effect. Love your channel sir. You have taught me so much. Thank you.
I'm on team "more ionizer" I have that exact kind and mucked around with it and without the case they are a lot more powerful. I guess some of the fibers are shorted to the case
Very nice video. I'm interested in these ionizers; not sure what to get. It seems like you said, in previous videos, not get very much, or very powerful, or you *make the air worse*
You say that a 100n debounce capacitor on the button is "a bit brutal on the contacts"... well, as I've done exactly that in a recent circuit, could you comment on what could be done to be less brutal on the contacts. My contacts are vintage so I'd like to be as kind to them as I possibly can.
@@mattquinn-caledoniantelevi2522 I just checked and I bought the Very retro "Japanese" air purifier. Which is indeed an ozone generator, thanks for the tip ...I may get an Ionizer and give it a try. N
the connector is pretty much inacceptable for 240VAC. Spacing/Clearance between the pins - and more so btween the pads - is inappropriate for that voltage. They could have used that style of connector if they had used one at least one position larger but then with an omitted center not populated. contact (or even two omitted contacts, so you have pin - x - x - pin on the board, giving a sufficient insulation
Stick with things you find fascinating. We don't want videos about things that bore you.
I'm still hoping he will look into these ionizing hair dryers. The claims of the manufacturers are getting wild.
I remember when they came out. I thought it was just another fad. Then I was asked to pick up one for my niece for this Christmas. I was like, "They still *_make_* those?" 🤔
Here here
@@youdontknowme5969 Search for "Panasonic nanoe". Their claims are pretty weird.
Well said 👍
Finally, I can comment on this subject. Generally, I don't know what he is talking about, but find his voice and presentation very soothing. I'm an old(80) codger, and know nothing about electronics.
However, in this case, I used to have an ionizer that we used in a bedroom. It was enclosed in a fake wood box and had a fan which blew out the ionized air into the room. It seemed to clear the air, but it was a bear to clean. The cleaning process was long and tedious, but never seemed to work. It finally became so covered in dust and grime, that it stopped working. So, finally, the village idiot can make a comment, even though I still don't have a clue what Clive is talking about. This is a red letter day in the Romine household!
Ha ha lovely, sir. I also have no idea about the electronics but I like his voice and comments! "One moment please" "oh my" "overengineered!" "well that's dangerous" etc. 🥰
@@philsmith5449 I especially like it when he says "be careful, the light is coming back on"". I am greatful that I'm not the only one who is lost throughout the whole video. Now I know there at least two of us. Maybe we should form a fan club.(wear same blazers, have a secrete handshake etc. We could use that tester thing he uses as the club emblem.)😆 Have a HAPPY NEW YEARS
@@philsmith5449 I love his voice, and especially, "one moment please." as well.
Ionizers are facinating! I love it when I see another ionizer video from you! Keep 'em coming! Thanks for all you share, helps me keep more things going and out of the landfill! 🤓
Agreed! They're like CRT scopes & vacuum tubes, that are still being used in the modern day! 😊
Multiple Research papers show it stops the ko-vid virus spreading by making it sticky. Also hospital experiment showed zero cross infections.
When I see these ionisers, I always think back to school in the mid 90's, in the metal and welding workshop we had a very expensive central fume extraction with a flexible arm on each workbench with an air valve. This air valve only opened as soon as welding was started, and worked with a current clamp around the mass cable of the welding station. This fume extractor also had air recirculation to reduce heat loss in winter, and had 4 or 5 mega-sized (approx 60 by 60cm) electrostatic filters stacked on top of each other, each filter look like the construction of a electric fly swatter. Several times a week these filters had attracted so much fine dust that arcing occurred, and with every spark (clearly audible) a cloud of dust was released (including the smell) and this was blown into the workshop. Often had a headache afterwards, but then always thought that this was from the welding smell, while it must have been more likely from the ozone, which was blown into the workshop at high volume.
🫢⚠️ - that should have been permanently vented to the outside with heat recovery for the make-up air. Sounded dangerous with it arcing and spewing dust back into the workshop 😶🌫️😷, now those have HEPA + carbon filters that are regularly replaced
@@samuelfellows6923 , yeah, everytime we hear it sparking , a cloud of brown dust was blew out. These filters where made that they lost there static charge and the dust was collected at the bottom in the central fume extractor during the maitenance mode, but they lost there charge dus massive dust buildup during working mode. A real design flaw, while this was a installation that costed 5 digits back in those days.
If Clive doesn't make videos on the topic he likes so much, making videos does him less joy in general. Which isn't good for us, the viewers.
Also, one *has to appreciate* ionizers, they are very interesting and important in our life.
Dust precipitor was the name given in my mid 40's copy of manufacturing tools. Great book. Its all wartime production.
Wow, didn't know that this concept's that old! But it gives me hope, since this is another run of the mill technology, that won't change too much once I learn it now! 😊
What's the name of the book? Is it available online on archive.org?
I actually don't mind the ionizer videos. I watch you to learn about reverse engineering circuits, at which you seem to be very good at doing. So keep on doing what you're doing, I'll still watch.
I'm still hoping he will get to ionizing hair dryers. These are now in the third generation and the manufacturers now not just claim to reduce electric charges in the hair but they claim to transfer water ions into the hair to prevent overdrying.
Interesting, so your head gets bombarded with hydronium and hydroxide? Sounds great for a long metal mane ;)
@@alnicospeaker Look up "Panasonic nanoe" for what I mean
@@MetalheadAndNerd we could watch Clive dry his beard with it before he takes it to bits...
I wonder how much a 240v rated toggle push button switch would cost? Possibly more than the BOM on the control side of that circuit.
A sheet of paper with a hole cut in it, placed around the socket and blue-tacked to the back of the ionizer will catch most of the crud and save your wall.
The paper trick is very smart! i like it 🙂
The black ioniser has been around for a long while (or, rather, a similar casing design). Bought one of those from a Help the Aged shop in the late 70's to help deal with an "odour problem" in the rather ghastly student accommodation in which I was living. Very much pre carbon-fibre emitters - mine had ordinary sharp-point needle emitters, and worked "reasonably well" if left running continuously.
So it can ground the odor particles?
@@Eduardo_Espinoza Ozone's a potent oxidiser - it'll oxidise most smaller organic molecules (and they were probably the cause!) This is the reason for ozone generators being used to remove the pong when someone has an unwitnessed death - they are VERY good for that purpose (and same goes for Mortuaries too!)
@@phils4634 very insightful comment! Thank you for sharing this! 😊
@Pat Luxor particularly unpleasant odor
@Pat Luxor death
6:58 You can recover these carbon wires also from (old) sparkplug cables. In sparkplug cables are these carbon fibers used as a resistor for EMI suppression to the onboard radio and electronics in the vehicle.
The high voltage diode with blue chevrons on one end (I assume, can't see it too well in the video) is very likely a 2CL77 20 kV 5 mA diode, it's one of the most common HV low current diodes you'll find today, I did a video a year ago crossing sectioning one to take a look at the silicon junction to find out how they get such a high breakdown voltage.
Interesting!
Does it build up the voltage until* the diode let's it pass?
@@Eduardo_Espinoza no! That's what the diac/sidac are for.
@@AnnaVannieuwenhuyse thank you! 😊 I don't know much about this field.
@@Eduardo_Espinoza a little goes a long way ✌️
De-Schmoozed. I could listen to these all day.
That reminds one of the old whiskey distiller's trick. Many different labels on the outside of the bottle, but the same whiskey on the inside. Some people will swear up and down that one label, from the same distiller, is better than another.
Well, of course we all know its really the coopers who make the magic of whiskey.
Yes, years of hotel work, and as long as its the right label the contents isnt here or there.
Thanks!
Double sided board is simple, cheapest board at a PCB house, as it is the most common board, and plated vias are free as it was likely made as part of a shared panel, using otherwise unused space on the larger panel. Worth it cost wise if you are willing to wait for delivery and you have a good stock of bare boards, but want the extra stock in a week or three ahead of production.
clive checking capacitor discharge with his finger will never stop being amusing
Nah Clive, if you wanna do ionizer videos, you do ionizer videos. I wish you'd bring back the blowing up small components videos that got me watching you so many years ago, but your channel has evolved and here I still am. I can't speak for your entire audience, but I'm here for the vibe, not the devices.
One reason for using a double-sided board even where all the tracks could go on one side is vibration resistance. With single-sided, vibration of components can cause lands to lift and lead to fractured tracks. With double-sided solder wicks up the plated through holes and the resultant fillet of solder stops the component moving down.
Obviously this was designed for people whose mains sockets vibrate.
10:07 I think that flyback diode is there because you never know at what point in the cycle will the unit be turned OFF. It might be the case that the NPN is turned OFF when a fair amount of current is flowing in the inductor and the voltage is still not enough to trigger the SIDAC Thyristor.
you can smell ozone heavily after a storm in the air. Its also created heavily in forests during certain times of year. Here in my area when I bike through the woods in may and oct it will fill the air so much its like I was running an ozonator lol. Most probably dont even know what that smell is but since I own ozonators I knew right away. Natures way of purifying the area.
Indeed! I went to the woods the other day and hung my jacket to the wardrobe when I came home; hours later I passed it and could still smell the ozone near the jacket!
I wonder if it was actually ozone you were smelling. That said, ozone is created in nature by rain and foliage movement, and does seem to be more prominent when the air is loaded with pollen, spores and natural plant oils. It seems to be how nature keeps the air quality in check.
@@bigclivedotcom I have no way of knowing, could be OH-radicals?! It smells much like the ozone produced by my angry germicidal lamp (25W) that I bought because of your videos on the topic =) So cheers and a happy 2023!
Clive, what is weird, one appears to be flesh-colored and seems to fit comfortably in the hand.
The same principle is used to remove dust from coal fired power station flue gasses but on a much larger scale.
and they have been in use for a loong loooong time (electrostatic precipitator)
When I read your titles with "schematic", I hear your voice say it the way you do! Haha, get out of my head Clive! Love your vids, keep it up.
Ionizer videos are like cowbell: we need more!
cows need bells because their horns do not work.
I gotta have more coronal discharge!
@@ebnertra0004 I cleared up my debilitating " coronal discharge" with a three months course of antibiotics from my GP.😏
I'm so glad I stumbled on your channel, my dad was an electrician (underground mine) and was all about things that ran on bitty motors, he would have really enjoyed watching you.
I subbed to try and learn something from your expertise plus, the accent is badass. Peace.
The XO4 smd part comes out of the SMD finder as a 30v Zenner in a SOD-323 package, these things can be a bit hit and miss though....Happy New Year !....cheers.
A lot more spice in this video than the usual fare. I like it!
Are you saying the ionizer videos polarize people?
They do. Some leave positive comments and some negative.
ignore every one who doesn't like the content, we just love you clive!
This!
Ionizers were all the rage when I started work in the 70s. We made many Cockcroft Walton units, using sharp Stellite cable-form nails as electrodes. I recall that the points became blunt quite quickly. The units certainly made a black mess on a wall.
I don't know why anyone wouldn't like ionizer videos. what's not to love about extreme high voltage in consumer electronics?
@@voltare2amstereo I'm positive you did that on purpose.
I'm sure I've heard of people in the model railway scene using these but modified as static grass applicators. The branded ones are very expensive and these little Ionisers make an inexpensive substitute.
Adam Savage (Tested) recently(?) did a video of him doing this at WETA Workshop
Those probes look like the ones you can get on Rossmann's store. They're quite nice, and very stabby.
Didn't know that, but makes sense since he works on very small components! 😊
@@Okurka. exactly, the are like reguler china cheapos ones,those basic needle ones
@@grindererrofficial3755 those regular cheapos one work great after degreasing the tips with some IPA.
@@BjornV78thanks for mentioning this for others who don't know thsi protip :)
@@Okurka. And 1/10th the quality.🤔
Heck yes, I LOVE your Ionizer videos! Keep it up mate.
Happy New Year Clive. Love you, love your content and wishing you the best for next year 💓
Happy New Year to you and yours Clive....
Also i adore ionizers. High voltage circuits on a tiny scale. I love it
I love the ionizer videos
I would personally love a guide in choosing a good one.
Happy new year from downunder.
Another one with quite some "compromises" on safety. Something like JST-size connector for mains, 1M smd resistor for isolation etc. (smd resistors often have breakdown voltage of say 200V or so, a far cry from making it safe to touch). Especially if you ground the other end (say by a person), there are kilovolts on 1M resistor to help breakdown and after that is can stay more conductive.
If that was neutral side it could be more safe but in a non-polarized plug it can be live as well.
To measure the voltage you could use the high voltage fluke 80k-40 probe for DMMs or the Chinese clones, those probes have an input resistance of 1GOhm.
❤️I like it, it's always interesting. ❤️👏👋👋
Years ago there was for sale pyramid shaped ionizers, probably going for the "Ultimate Crossover". Hey look folks " Ions & a Pyramid " its gotta be extra good.
Hah! And if you leave a razor blade under the pyramid overnight, it's magically sharpened itself by morning!
Ah, the amazing power of pyramids!
@White Sapphire "what razor blade companies don't want you to know!" vibes 🤣
I get what you mean. But it sounds advantageous for airflow and keeping distance from the housing.
Inside a Dezac pyramid ioniser.
ua-cam.com/video/ZeTfYK651U0/v-deo.html
Happy new year Clive💻
I was wondering if you could please place all of your ionizer videos in a public Playlist... Thanks!
I was thinking... What if you had a big grounded plate around the ionizer's output? Would that collect dust only on the plate instead of other things around it? Then you could just have something like a paper cover that you could remove and replace instead of needing to wipe up dirt...
Some units have a dust collection mat with a slight positive charge.
@@bigclivedotcom I’m going to look for those! Very interested in cleaning my dusty house air…
Thanks for the vid big man.
Happy new year’s to you and the wee man Ralph ..
Hope your Christmas was a good one.👍
Unrelated, but cute kitty!
Nice. The high resistance in line with the output kinda reassures me - I was thinking it'd be yet another die-o-nizer.
Nice and spicy just how I like it, do videos on whatever you like Clive thanks and happy new year 🥳
10:07 A diode to protect the sidac from damage due to a large back EMF spike perhaps?? 🤔
Unfortunately lots of people (more every day it seems) can't deal with anything that's not either "good" or "bad" (or left or right or red or blue...) That ozone is beneficial in small amounts and harmful in large amounts is a concept that's just too complex for them to comprehend.
The printing shop I used to work at many years ago bought a bunch of fairly large ionizers to help with plant air quality. They also hacked furnace type air filters on the intake side because the filthy air was caking onto the ionizing plates in a day or two. Even when new, you could not tell the ionizers were doing anything, the air was so nasty in there. I was usually the one to take the filthy plate modules out of all the units and use compressed air to blow them off in the parking lot. Wasn't my job, but anything to get the air somewhat cleaner. OSHA safety rules would not allow the company to vent bad air outside to improve indoor air because the air was too filthy and chemically enhanced to vent safely. (Might poison the locals.) But those inside? Let them suffer.
So much genius on the iom
Busy guy big cli.
Do the crimbo light's in g Square this year?
"Blunt and long." Any conversation I ever had with my Dad.
I am very lucky.
You take apart all the stuff that I am interested in.
If anyone is not interested in LEDs and High voltage, they are not interesting people.
The microntroller thing makes me wonder if they have a quota of how many they have to use in products, or if they just have so many in backstop they have to use them any way they can.
Either way, there must be ways to repurpose them in meaningful uses. Determining pinouts and how to program them would be challenging though. Not that I have any ideas on reusing them but it seems such a waste.
They are really cheap (see eevblog's channel - I think he got some for 3c) and are probably not reprogrammable (since that adds expense).
@@chaos.corner Yes, the cheapest are one time programmable but offer various timers, ADC and DAC etc . But not much more (10c or under) are reprogrammable , even offering multi-threading
@@prk55 True. But they're shaving pennies so probably best not to expect too much for this application. Also, it can be hard to get hold of the programming tools as Dave from the aforementioned eevblog found out.
A 10 cent PIC clone from Fremont Micro Devices could be justified if that transistor is also chopping current to stimulate the tank circuit. That might explain the extra spice, the small transformer, and the SMPS-like transformer primary network. Perhaps Clive might stick a scope on the base and see if there's a bit more going on than meets the eye.
@@abitofabitofabit4404 Any excuse to get Clive to break out the sillyscope is a good one. He's way too stingy with it.
I doubt the white connector is rated for mains use with all the expected transients and surges. Also there's no slot between PCB pads, even though it looks like it's required for creepage distance, and no input fuse.
I'm firmly in the latter camp and just as fascinated by this content as you are, those in the former are lame and their opinions need not be heeded.
Oiii... I resemble that remark 🤔🤣
The odd design of the double sided circuit board is most likely because it was computer generated. As long as it works in the footprint they require they don't really care if it's odd or not. If this is getting made cheaply, in bulk, sold to multiple companies, and they did it at EXACTLY the right time to get huge adoption in cheap chineezy products, that's a successful design to a Chinese businessman. Timing is everything - they know if it's very successful it will get copied ad nauseum, so there's no time to make hay like when the sun is shining.
Kudos to that businessman for employing an EE who actually knew what he was doing rather than cobbling together some PD design that only kind of works, or just potting a capacitor in resin and calling it "good".
I don’t mind what kind of videos you post. So long as you post.
"post", yes Clive's video's are always first class !!.😏
i love how most stuff you buy is in pink but its even more weird that they offer all these electronics in pink
Hey Fran , he's at it again !
”Tingle ???: No Tingle" !!!🤣🤣🤣
The "Spicy" makes it fun! :)
Oh, I don't know, Clive, I find these Ionisers quite interesting. I have no idea why, I just do, so don't worry about making more videos about them.
I don't pretend to know exactly how these things work, but I do see similarities between them, and vintage TV line output circuits - cruder, but similar, and they didn't half extract the crap out of the air, especially in the days when homes we heated by coal fires. I remember seeing wads of soot in the back of some sets, so much so that it was often difficult to see the actual line output transformer. I can still remember that familiar smell of ozone that we used to get, especially on damp days, or if mum was cooking in the kitchen, or on washing days when everything felt just a bit damp.
Just a bit ironic really, that we do away with existing devices that generate ozone, and ionise the air as a byproduct, and then go out and buy electronic devices to specifically replicate that byproduct.
Same, this is like magic, it also reminds me of CRT TVs, & vacuum tubes! 😊 I can see why the other unit was made with black plastic now.
The 1 meg doesn't go to ground due to it being a shock hazard because of the HV capacitor You want isolation between the primary to secondary
It would be funny if they'd used the same flashlight/torch program in the microcontroller so some combination of long presses on the button could let it flash or SOS the ionizer circuit.
Put nine 10-meg half-watt resistors in series with your +VE multi-meter probe (assuming your multi-meter is 10 megohm) and set your multi-meter to the 200 voltage range.
Now you have a 100 Meg Impedance multi-meter to measure high impedance, high voltage low current voltage sources. You just multiply the multi-meter reading by 10 to get the true high voltage reading, measuring up to 2000 volts.
Add more resistors and change the multiplication factor for higher voltage readings.
I'm starting to think they manufacture these weird circuits just for you, Clive.
I wonder why the end was covered with that schmoo?
I heard that a certain coffee grinder includes an ionizer to help prevent the grounds from flying up and sticking to everything. I wonder about the efficacy of adding something like this to my existing coffee grinder...
That's an interesting use.
Yum ozone. Must be safe considering how much there is in the London underground. Even my local trams are quite ozony.
I ended up going down a rabbit hole some time ago on the broad subject of Soviet medicine and hospital equipment after finding out about a fascinating machine called the Hunter Metatron device.
Whilst going down this rabbit hole I discovered what I would describe as a sort of ionising chandelier that were hung at strategic points in hospitals. The thought behind them being that they would stop airborne bacteria from spreading from area to area.
According to their (probably somewhat leant on) experts of the day, they did have a positive effect but, I'd like to see some more modern unbiased test results on such things... I also have a lot of time on my hands 😆
Chizhevsky ion generator PSU full build
ua-cam.com/video/ZLB2UUQ35J0/v-deo.html
The chandeliers sound like Chizhevsky chandeliers.
@@bigclivedotcom aha, now that rings a bell. Yes. Or, perhaps да. I just watched the video in the link suggested by another channel user and that is an absolutely fantastic project.
I home educate my 2 children and I'm just introducing them to electronics so I'd love to build something like that with them. Thank you for all the knowledge you share, it's invaluable. Especially for those of us trying to impart knowledge to young ones
Old fashion valve tv's and radios were very good at sucking dirt out of the air.
The high voltage diode might explain some components I bought a long time ago I've been unable to identify. Unfortunately, the markings are unreadable. They didn't test as a diode though so I'm not sure.
High voltage diodes are usually a stack of diode junctions, so they won't test as a simple diode. They have quite a high voltage drop.
@@bigclivedotcom That would make sense. I believe I bought them as part of a timed short-exposure photography project (bullets in flight and such) that I never got around to.
yea idk why they bother with a button. most people are just gonna plug it in and leave it there, only to touch it when it inevitably makes a mess
Sea air is alleged to be healthy and also contain relatively high ozone. Are these true ?
They thought the smell was ozone, but it turns out it may just have been the smell of organic matter in the water. But I would have thought that crashing waves could generate electrostatic effects.
It forms after an electrical discharge from a storm. I used ozone in my research and used to generate it that way. Breathed it once yes smells like the beach I ended up in the student health center.
Have a great new year ✨️
If ever you do make a book I sure would like a copy
I'm here especially for the ionizer videos. ❤️
Same!
It's been a good 20 minutes since you last showed an ioniser 🤣
I love ions of all kinds
I enjoy these fascinating topic
Do you think something like this would be good inside an HVAC intake vent or perhaps in an outlet directly under the main intake? Our main HVAC is on a ceiling but there is an outlet in the corner small hallway. I've also heard just cheapo filters for HVAC are better for your system than the "super duper 90 day ionized filter designed for pets dust allergens and the illness of the day" because more air goes thru them but the trade off is you have to change them on a strict schedule. There is a pretty significant price difference so I'm tempted to try the lesser ones. I usually wait for the vent to start showing signs of dust bunnies collecting on the vent before cleaning and changing it.
There's a lot of hype surrounding things like filters. You do get ioniser modules specifically designed for HVAC systems.
I do HEPA filter media research and anything MERV 12-15 is more than enough for a residential home unless you have very bad allergies or the like.
HV induced spark approx 1mm per 1KV
Question? There would need to be some modification of course, but could that be hacked into an electrolier for hydrogen production? Where would you place the return lead?
That requires higher DC current.
@@bigclivedotcom Pump it up. Hack it. Just curious, some electroliers exploit the H2O bent molecular configuration and cause the separation process solely using field effect. Love your channel sir. You have taught me so much. Thank you.
Presumably their circuit-board supplier charges the same for a double-sided board as a single-sided board, so…
Just guessing.
¡Muy picante! 🌶
Happy new year. Alan
I'm on team "more ionizer"
I have that exact kind and mucked around with it and without the case they are a lot more powerful. I guess some of the fibers are shorted to the case
Very nice video. I'm interested in these ionizers; not sure what to get. It seems like you said, in previous videos, not get very much, or very powerful, or you *make the air worse*
It's not a PIC12. A PIC12 would need a PULL-UP resistor on pin 4, not a pull-down.
It is odd, but the pin can be assigned as an input and MCLR disabled in the configuration file.
You without ionizer or ozone videos, would be like Britain without Fish & Chips.
You say that a 100n debounce capacitor on the button is "a bit brutal on the contacts"... well, as I've done exactly that in a recent circuit, could you comment on what could be done to be less brutal on the contacts. My contacts are vintage so I'd like to be as kind to them as I possibly can.
A smaller capacitor or series resistor in line with the capacitor can reduce peak contact current.
You have to show that's the transformer is iron core otherwise the viewer will assume it's a air core which wouldn't work in that circuit
They generally have a tiny ferrite core.
Ionizers make me ill with my lung problem.
A real ionizer shouldn't. But a high output ozone generator might exacerbate issues.
@@mattquinn-caledoniantelevi2522
I just checked and I bought the
Very retro "Japanese" air purifier.
Which is indeed an ozone generator, thanks for the tip ...I may get an Ionizer and give it a try. N
I have a 90W Tesla coil that's pretty spicy. Dischrges several inches. Purple to orange discharge so I assume it makes nitrogen oxides
just out of curiosity. would it be possible to convert these things into stungun's just wondering if that was the original use/plan for them
Not at such low output current - unless you wanted to stun an atom sized person.
No. Way too low output.
the connector is pretty much inacceptable for 240VAC.
Spacing/Clearance between the pins - and more so btween the pads - is inappropriate for that voltage. They could have used that style of connector if they had used one at least one position larger but then with an omitted center not populated. contact (or even two omitted contacts, so you have pin - x - x - pin on the board, giving a sufficient insulation
Just the one lung?
if ya like